Notes from an "alternate universe". Introduction to a new way of thinking. | |
Chaol User ID: 16649194 Thailand 11/07/2012 01:12 AM Report Abusive Post Report Copyright Violation | I'm up for this, too, however Quoting: Marshwiggle I don't think we should use a key as a symbol - any key has meaning for us already we each need to MAKE a NEW symbol - maybe all the same? or maybe different, not sure - but a symbol that has no meaning attached for us The key is like the base object in the creation of the symbol. No matter what the symbol is it must be compromised of something we already have a pre attached meaning to. So, lets take a key, wrap it in aluminum foil until you've made a square like object, then wrap that in tape. You will have to leave a opening where the key hole is to insert string for the necklace. How does that sound? It's better for there to be little pre-existing value in the symbol. Just create something new and you'll be fine. You can each use a different symbol for the same 'goal'. (It may even be better this way, as each has a different perspective.) Last Edited by Chaol on 11/07/2012 01:14 AM |
Chaol User ID: 16649194 Thailand 11/07/2012 01:18 AM Report Abusive Post Report Copyright Violation | [snips] Quoting: Anonymous Coward 918001 I actually had not thought of how I'd get to Vegas, just that Vegas is where the Bellagio is. [snips] Sometimes it is not in Vegas ;) (it depends on your perspective) To clarify, "Bellagio" may relate more to a book in your library than "Vegas". This is a bit more advanced, so I'll stop here. |
Chaol User ID: 16649194 Thailand 11/07/2012 01:31 AM Report Abusive Post Report Copyright Violation | Major Man, look above at the bold. Chaol says it's better to have a key shape so our perspective is specific. We just need to modify the key. Quoting: Unit3 We seem to often mis-quote, so I will provide some clarity here. It does not matter what the symbol is, as long as it's unique to your perspective. Of course it cannot be entirely unique, as it is relative to something else. Just make sure it has a little pre-assigned value as possible. It can be a key or anything else. It doesn't matter. As long as it's somehow unique. |
curve User ID: 18215937 Australia 11/07/2012 01:40 AM Report Abusive Post Report Copyright Violation | Now lets come up with a name for our symbol using neuronicons. Lets say the sound of +S I +L +P Quoting: (MaJorMan) According to Ec logic that string would read : +S'I, +P'+L oo'dua : oodua, Can I ask your reasoning for this string? And how this relates to the Genius explanation below. Also, do you have a definition for the word you have created? (Might as well make some new words to add to the Ec-English dictionary while we are at it). 'How do these different parts of the process come together to change your experience? By adding structure to your representation you attract potential energy and enable the right kind of interactions, from which new representations are born with bring you even closer to (or completely fulfill) our desire. The time required to see it in your perspective depends on how relative these things are with your current perspective. As in, "how logical would it be to jump there from where I am standing?" It's not that you're creating the new car out of thin air, but shifting your perspective. The steps above should provide the necessary intent to your "subconscious" to make that shift happen.' Ecsys.org link: [link to ecsys.org] If the purpose of the Genius is to change our perspective, in this case to: make personal wealth( relevant to our perspectives 'sooner' (basically by reprogramming our "subconscious", or, tweaking our current Logic, or, breaking some rules, or, 'unstructuring' the perspectives which are no longer useful/relevant to us) then my thoughts on an Ec string would be something along the lines of this: -I+P'+LL, +S+P'IL, -P+L, -I+P'-P+P, +S+I'SI, -PL'L+L, -S+L'-SP, PL'IL', -PL'-P+L, S-L'SP'-I+P', IP'P-P great, wealth, continuously, flow(s/ing), [to]me, [in]increasing, quantities, via, multiple, sources, with-ease. j'alu, ea'y, booba, j'unu, oo'i, kata'alu, s(z)'h, naru'y, kata'ta, f'o'j, air'wu. [(Perspective shifts result in...)optional?] great wealth continuously flowing to me[other-me, my-other] in increasing quantities via multiple sources, with ease. (Here I have paraphrased and added to a mantra suggested on a 'thinking wealthy' video which someone posted earlier on this thread, sorry, I forget who posted it, and from which page it can be found). If my understanding is correct, Chaos enables the impetus for change, the more chaotic a situation, the more interactions involved between symbols, then, the more possibilities exist for deconstruction/change/creation. |
Unit3 User ID: 9834739 United States 11/07/2012 01:47 AM Report Abusive Post Report Copyright Violation | Now lets come up with a name for our symbol using neuronicons. Lets say the sound of +S I +L +P Quoting: (MaJorMan) According to Ec logic that string would read : +S'I, +P'+L oo'dua : oodua, Can I ask your reasoning for this string? And how this relates to the Genius explanation below. Also, do you have a definition for the word you have created? (Might as well make some new words to add to the Ec-English dictionary while we are at it). 'How do these different parts of the process come together to change your experience? By adding structure to your representation you attract potential energy and enable the right kind of interactions, from which new representations are born with bring you even closer to (or completely fulfill) our desire. The time required to see it in your perspective depends on how relative these things are with your current perspective. As in, "how logical would it be to jump there from where I am standing?" It's not that you're creating the new car out of thin air, but shifting your perspective. The steps above should provide the necessary intent to your "subconscious" to make that shift happen.' Ecsys.org link: [link to ecsys.org] If the purpose of the Genius is to change our perspective, in this case to: make personal wealth( relevant to our perspectives 'sooner' (basically by reprogramming our "subconscious", or, tweaking our current Logic, or, breaking some rules, or, 'unstructuring' the perspectives which are no longer useful/relevant to us) then my thoughts on an Ec string would be something along the lines of this: -I+P'+LL, +S+P'IL, -P+L, -I+P'-P+P, +S+I'SI, -PL'L+L, -S+L'-SP, PL'IL', -PL'-P+L, S-L'SP'-I+P', IP'P-P great, wealth, continuously, flow(s/ing), [to]me, [in]increasing, quantities, via, multiple, sources, with-ease. j'alu, ea'y, booba, j'unu, oo'i, kata'alu, s(z)'h, naru'y, kata'ta, f'o'j, air'wu. [(Perspective shifts result in...)optional?] great wealth continuously flowing to me[other-me, my-other] in increasing quantities via multiple sources, with ease. (Here I have paraphrased and added to a mantra suggested on a 'thinking wealthy' video which someone posted earlier on this thread, sorry, I forget who posted it, and from which page it can be found). If my understanding is correct, Chaos enables the impetus for change, the more chaotic a situation, the more interactions involved between symbols, then, the more possibilities exist for deconstruction/change/creation. LeKing posted it and here's the video. [link to youtu.be] "We are the music makers. And we are the dreamers of dreams." Willy Wonka |
Unit3 User ID: 9834739 United States 11/07/2012 01:50 AM Report Abusive Post Report Copyright Violation | Major Man, look above at the bold. Chaol says it's better to have a key shape so our perspective is specific. We just need to modify the key. Quoting: Unit3 We seem to often mis-quote, so I will provide some clarity here. It does not matter what the symbol is, as long as it's unique to your perspective. Of course it cannot be entirely unique, as it is relative to something else. Just make sure it has a little pre-assigned value as possible. It can be a key or anything else. It doesn't matter. As long as it's somehow unique. Thank you for noticing. I realize I'm forgetting things as this drags out. I guess that's how I learn! ;o( Your patience is appreciated. Last Edited by ERE3 on 11/07/2012 01:52 AM "We are the music makers. And we are the dreamers of dreams." Willy Wonka |
curve User ID: 18215937 Australia 11/07/2012 01:55 AM Report Abusive Post Report Copyright Violation | I'm in! The only question is, what is our logic for going from current bank account balances to $50 million? Don't we need to provide that idea to our subconscious? Quoting: Unit3 The logic for these increased bank balances, aka $50 million each, is whatever logic / rules we all decide to assign to our Geniuses If you had $50 million in your account(s), what is the story behind it? How would you make sense of how it came to be? How logical would it be to experience from your current perspective? oooh...create a logical narrative from one perspective to the next, make our own '6 degrees of separation' style story of how we ended up with $50 million in the bank. |
curve User ID: 18215937 Australia 11/07/2012 01:56 AM Report Abusive Post Report Copyright Violation | |
Unit3 User ID: 9834739 United States 11/07/2012 02:09 AM Report Abusive Post Report Copyright Violation | I'm in! The only question is, what is our logic for going from current bank account balances to $50 million? Don't we need to provide that idea to our subconscious? Quoting: Unit3 The logic for these increased bank balances, aka $50 million each, is whatever logic / rules we all decide to assign to our Geniuses If you had $50 million in your account(s), what is the story behind it? How would you make sense of how it came to be? How logical would it be to experience from your current perspective? oooh...create a logical narrative from one perspective to the next, make our own '6 degrees of separation' style story of how we ended up with $50 million in the bank. Yes, that's how it makes sense. It's how we go from current perspective to the next. When we started this group project, I suggested the logic be that we are starting a consciousness research institute. This is logical to me for $50 million. Edit: I'm sort of getting lost into how to do this as a group project. Last Edited by ERE3 on 11/07/2012 02:54 AM "We are the music makers. And we are the dreamers of dreams." Willy Wonka |
Unit3 User ID: 9834739 United States 11/07/2012 02:10 AM Report Abusive Post Report Copyright Violation | Sure. Thanks for your string. I haven't even tried to get the language, yet. Last Edited by ERE3 on 11/07/2012 02:48 AM "We are the music makers. And we are the dreamers of dreams." Willy Wonka |
Anonymous Coward User ID: 23635979 Netherlands 11/07/2012 03:26 AM Report Abusive Post Report Copyright Violation | Talked to my dad, mother, wife and father in law... and they all strongly advise against getting this car. Quoting: tuuuuur If it's my car, I'll apparently get there by rowing against the stream... It does not mean that the destination has changed :) I would even say that it clarifies the map a bit more. Now you have a better idea of the possibilities that would make their advice irrelevant. For example, the car being gifted to you. Thanks for the heads up! That would be a possibility indeed. Just for fun, here's a pic of the toy car with the color of the moon that almost fits in one's hand: [link to farm9.staticflickr.com] And here is the real car, as we saw it last friday. The front is not attached, just there for an indication what it would look like: [link to farm8.staticflickr.com] |
curve User ID: 18215937 Australia 11/07/2012 04:30 AM Report Abusive Post Report Copyright Violation | Talked to my dad, mother, wife and father in law... and they all strongly advise against getting this car. Quoting: tuuuuur If it's my car, I'll apparently get there by rowing against the stream... It does not mean that the destination has changed :) I would even say that it clarifies the map a bit more. Now you have a better idea of the possibilities that would make their advice irrelevant. For example, the car being gifted to you. Thanks for the heads up! That would be a possibility indeed. Just for fun, here's a pic of the toy car with the color of the moon that almost fits in one's hand: [link to farm9.staticflickr.com] And here is the real car, as we saw it last friday. The front is not attached, just there for an indication what it would look like: [link to farm8.staticflickr.com] Both are very cool, sounds like you have a pleasant 'surprise' coming your way tuuuuur, congrats! Thanks for sharing. |
Anonymous Coward User ID: 918001 United States 11/07/2012 06:40 AM Report Abusive Post Report Copyright Violation | [snips] Quoting: Anonymous Coward 918001 I actually had not thought of how I'd get to Vegas, just that Vegas is where the Bellagio is. [snips] Sometimes it is not in Vegas ;) (it depends on your perspective) To clarify, "Bellagio" may relate more to a book in your library than "Vegas". This is a bit more advanced, so I'll stop here. Dig :) |
Chaol User ID: 25826477 Italy 11/07/2012 06:41 AM Report Abusive Post Report Copyright Violation | It sounds weird but the symbol could be a bag of sand that is used to bring about a perspective of an abundance of water. The logic is in the rules you make not the symbol itself. Quoting: (MaJorMan) I'd like to see how that would work :) Last Edited by Chaol on 11/07/2012 11:37 AM |
Chaol User ID: 25826477 Italy 11/07/2012 06:42 AM Report Abusive Post Report Copyright Violation | And even the rules don't have to have anything to do with the outcome I don't think. As long as your symbol is interacting with your environment and you have rules and structure around it, subconsciously you will lead yourself to where u "want" to be. Quoting: (MaJorMan) For rules the crazier, the better. It should not be something obvious to your conscious mind. The more obvious the symbol and rules the less effective it would probably be. |
Chaol User ID: 25826477 Italy 11/07/2012 06:51 AM Report Abusive Post Report Copyright Violation | |
Chaol User ID: 25826477 Italy 11/07/2012 07:04 AM Report Abusive Post Report Copyright Violation | I agree about the rules. I also remember reading in one of the threads how opposite results sometimes happen. Quoting: Unit3 Are you doing anything to interact with the Nov. 17th nexus? Hi. This has been taken out of context a bit... The results are predictable and can be calculated, as they exist now. However, this is an advanced function of Ecsys. However, if a symbol that already has more than a little value in your perspective is used then the result is unpredictable. That's why I recommend using a symbol that has little to no value. hope this helps |
Chaol User ID: 25826477 Italy 11/07/2012 07:06 AM Report Abusive Post Report Copyright Violation | Now you know why I interacted with dogs, LOL! Quoting: Unit3 I think it's important though to interact with others. That's why I was trying to keep to the key shape. OK, let me think because I want to do this. I need to make a symbol that represents $50 million that I can interact with others and without feeling like a complete dork, heh! Allow the symbol to interact with the things you want it to have an effect on and things that surround those things. |
Chaol User ID: 25826477 Italy 11/07/2012 07:27 AM Report Abusive Post Report Copyright Violation | [snippy-snips] Quoting: curve [(Perspective shifts result in...)optional?] great wealth continuously flowing to me[other-me, my-other] in increasing quantities via multiple sources, with ease. (Here I have paraphrased and added to a mantra suggested on a 'thinking wealthy' video which someone posted earlier on this thread, sorry, I forget who posted it, and from which page it can be found). Nice. But what is the specific source of this wealth? How do you define it? When you define it you uncover it's value and begin to introduce it into your perspective. [snippy-snips] Quoting: curve If my understanding is correct, Chaos enables the impetus for change, the more chaotic a situation, the more interactions involved between symbols, then, the more possibilities exist for deconstruction/change/creation. Chaos, in the classical sense, is simply an order or logic we do not (yet) understand. When we do understand it (that is, when it is more relative to us) it is known as interaction. The impetus for change comes from interacting with new symbols. The "new" is born out of possibility and perceive because of logic. [For bonus points "Possibility" is a representation of Nothing. The unused fifth element, number 4, is this pervasive Nothing and, when used, is represented as number 2, the element of possibility. Possibility allows us the illusion to relate one with an other, and thus seem to exist in a reality. So really the impetus for change comes from Nothing, and implies that there is no change but only the illusion of change. Which is exactly why neuronics works, because it is the same illusion as reality itself.] |
Chaol User ID: 25826477 Italy 11/07/2012 07:30 AM Report Abusive Post Report Copyright Violation | |
Chaol User ID: 25826477 Italy 11/07/2012 07:38 AM Report Abusive Post Report Copyright Violation | oooh...create a logical narrative from one perspective to the next, make our own '6 degrees of separation' style story of how we ended up with $50 million in the bank. Quoting: curve Sure.. if you want to call it that :) Start with something you have a try to draw a path from there to a perspective where $50MM in the bank is a given. But don't think of the $50MM directly... think of what having that entails. For example, you are tired of getting interest statements every 2 weeks. So your goal would be to "...receive annoying interest statements every 2 weeks telling me I have an additional $12,234 in my account" For example, before I purchased my new Bentley (with cash) all I had to do was create a Genius formula for a perspective that included receiving a quotation for 2 scratched chrome Bentley tires. The logical narrative is filled in automatically. For example, "In order for Chaol to receive the quotation he first needs the car. Here ya go! Now it's more logical, and he's ready to receive the quotation." And so on... |
Chaol User ID: 25826477 Italy 11/07/2012 07:42 AM Report Abusive Post Report Copyright Violation | Yes, that's how it makes sense. It's how we go from current perspective to the next. Quoting: Unit3 When we started this group project, I suggested the logic be that we are starting a consciousness research institute. This is logical to me for $50 million. Edit: I'm sort of getting lost into how to do this as a group project. If the goal is for each participant to have $50MM each in their account perhaps the most logical from this perspective (from my guess) is to champion the "next big idea" of one person and have the participants work on it. If there are 10 participants then the company is worth north of $500MM. For the money to 'just appear' in the account would not be logical, unless we were in a magical universe. There needs to be a logical narrative to go along with it, otherwise it is highly, highly unlikely to be experienced. Neuronics is not magic, it's 'science' The Genius shows you the map of how to get there from where you're standing. |
Jesse Sovoda User ID: 16964923 United States 11/07/2012 07:43 AM Report Abusive Post Report Copyright Violation | Chaol, do I understand this correctly?? For the "Genius" to have the intended results the Symbol: must be physically represented in the least relative way possible. Logic: the rules must be set in the least relative way possible. Interaction: must be as often as possible in the way most relative to intent. Possibility: must be within a space with high uncertainty. A shoe used as a hat wouldn't be a great symbol for mastering ecsys because a shoe and hat are both articles of clothing. Or am i further confusing my perspective? Consider the possibility that you order yourself into being from chaos... You do this, always, in all ways. This "ordering" has resulted in the possibilities you're experiencing, here, now. In each experience you've ever had, more and more of "this" reality is generated logically from your previous experience. Your observation of this unfolding of order and chaos is reality. |
Chaol User ID: 25826477 Italy 11/07/2012 07:45 AM Report Abusive Post Report Copyright Violation | Talked to my dad, mother, wife and father in law... and they all strongly advise against getting this car. Quoting: tuuuuur If it's my car, I'll apparently get there by rowing against the stream... It does not mean that the destination has changed :) I would even say that it clarifies the map a bit more. Now you have a better idea of the possibilities that would make their advice irrelevant. For example, the car being gifted to you. Thanks for the heads up! That would be a possibility indeed. Just for fun, here's a pic of the toy car with the color of the moon that almost fits in one's hand: [link to farm9.staticflickr.com] And here is the real car, as we saw it last friday. The front is not attached, just there for an indication what it would look like: [link to farm8.staticflickr.com] That's exactly how I saw it. Though for some reason it is upside down. Now you know why I said "color of the moon". I can almost see the lunar craters lol I was hoping you would get it before you went, but there's still a possibility. Do you think the most logical way is for it to be gifted to you? (If you took this car, it would have been. The owner would have just given it to you. I don't think it would work now, though.) Last Edited by Chaol on 11/07/2012 07:49 AM |
Anonymous Coward User ID: 23635979 Netherlands 11/07/2012 08:12 AM Report Abusive Post Report Copyright Violation | Talked to my dad, mother, wife and father in law... and they all strongly advise against getting this car. Quoting: tuuuuur If it's my car, I'll apparently get there by rowing against the stream... It does not mean that the destination has changed :) I would even say that it clarifies the map a bit more. Now you have a better idea of the possibilities that would make their advice irrelevant. For example, the car being gifted to you. Thanks for the heads up! That would be a possibility indeed. Just for fun, here's a pic of the toy car with the color of the moon that almost fits in one's hand: [link to farm9.staticflickr.com] And here is the real car, as we saw it last friday. The front is not attached, just there for an indication what it would look like: [link to farm8.staticflickr.com] That's exactly how I saw it. Though for some reason it is upside down. Now you know why I said "color of the moon". I can almost see the lunar craters lol I was hoping you would get it before you went, but there's still a possibility. Do you think the most logical way is for it to be gifted to you? (If you took this car, it would have been. The owner would have just given it to you. I don't think it would work now, though.) You see the toy car upside down because today it's lying upside down on my desk... ;-) The rear wheels were off, I am taking it with me to the model builders club I'm at to glue them on using stronger glue then I have at home. We'll see what happens. I plan to call the seller Friday as I promised him to let him know what we decide. Do I think the most logical way is for it to be given to me? Well, stranger things have happened... I do not have the amount of money asked, nor do I have stuff (that I can actually miss) of equal value to trade; so at the moment buying is out of the question. I think you mean that, if I want that to happen, I got to bring my perspective to a point where it is the most logical thing to happen... |
Unit3 User ID: 9834739 United States 11/07/2012 08:44 AM Report Abusive Post Report Copyright Violation | Talked to my dad, mother, wife and father in law... and they all strongly advise against getting this car. Quoting: tuuuuur If it's my car, I'll apparently get there by rowing against the stream... It does not mean that the destination has changed :) I would even say that it clarifies the map a bit more. Now you have a better idea of the possibilities that would make their advice irrelevant. For example, the car being gifted to you. Thanks for the heads up! That would be a possibility indeed. Just for fun, here's a pic of the toy car with the color of the moon that almost fits in one's hand: [link to farm9.staticflickr.com] And here is the real car, as we saw it last friday. The front is not attached, just there for an indication what it would look like: [link to farm8.staticflickr.com] Just to interact......you have shown us a lot of the process. I thank you for that. Edit: Btw, cool car! Last Edited by ERE3 on 11/07/2012 09:17 AM "We are the music makers. And we are the dreamers of dreams." Willy Wonka |
Unit3 User ID: 9834739 United States 11/07/2012 08:46 AM Report Abusive Post Report Copyright Violation | And even the rules don't have to have anything to do with the outcome I don't think. As long as your symbol is interacting with your environment and you have rules and structure around it, subconsciously you will lead yourself to where u "want" to be. Quoting: (MaJorMan) For rules the crazier, the better. It should not be something obvious to your conscious mind. The more obvious the symbol and rules the less effective it would probably be. Wow! So only the logic from current perspective to new perspective is needed. "We are the music makers. And we are the dreamers of dreams." Willy Wonka |
Unit3 User ID: 9834739 United States 11/07/2012 09:00 AM Report Abusive Post Report Copyright Violation | I agree about the rules. I also remember reading in one of the threads how opposite results sometimes happen. Quoting: Unit3 Are you doing anything to interact with the Nov. 17th nexus? Hi. This has been taken out of context a bit... The results are predictable and can be calculated, as they exist now. However, this is an advanced function of Ecsys. However, if a symbol that already has more than a little value in your perspective is used then the result is unpredictable. That's why I recommend using a symbol that has little to no value. hope this helps Aha! Yes, this helps. I would like to discuss with you regarding a symbol that has little to no value, though. Every symbol I can think of to use, seems to have some value. I hang onto things that might be used in a creative project. They may be thrown into a box and never used, but there is a value or I wouldn't hang onto it. I consider this something of little value. About the only way I can see to use something that has no value is to make something from scratch. And even those materials have some value. I am just re-assigning their value. The modified key for our group project comes to mind here. Does either example represent "little to no value"? And can you say more about something that has no value? Thank you. "We are the music makers. And we are the dreamers of dreams." Willy Wonka |
miqq User ID: 26539501 Argentina 11/07/2012 09:20 AM Report Abusive Post Report Copyright Violation | ... Quoting: Chaol It does not mean that the destination has changed :) I would even say that it clarifies the map a bit more. Now you have a better idea of the possibilities that would make their advice irrelevant. For example, the car being gifted to you. Thanks for the heads up! That would be a possibility indeed. Just for fun, here's a pic of the toy car with the color of the moon that almost fits in one's hand: [link to farm9.staticflickr.com] And here is the real car, as we saw it last friday. The front is not attached, just there for an indication what it would look like: [link to farm8.staticflickr.com] That's exactly how I saw it. Though for some reason it is upside down. Now you know why I said "color of the moon". I can almost see the lunar craters lol I was hoping you would get it before you went, but there's still a possibility. Do you think the most logical way is for it to be gifted to you? (If you took this car, it would have been. The owner would have just given it to you. I don't think it would work now, though.) You see the toy car upside down because today it's lying upside down on my desk... ;-) The rear wheels were off, I am taking it with me to the model builders club I'm at to glue them on using stronger glue then I have at home. We'll see what happens. I plan to call the seller Friday as I promised him to let him know what we decide. Do I think the most logical way is for it to be given to me? Well, stranger things have happened... I do not have the amount of money asked, nor do I have stuff (that I can actually miss) of equal value to trade; so at the moment buying is out of the question. I think you mean that, if I want that to happen, I got to bring my perspective to a point where it is the most logical thing to happen... Don't you have a car? If so, why don't you sell it and buy that old (sorry, vintage)one? As the old one is more 'rare', you can always get a common (current) car again. I'm sorry if I'm not clear it's difficult for me to express in english Just giving you ideas... |
(MaJorMan) User ID: 4593265 United States 11/07/2012 09:36 AM Report Abusive Post Report Copyright Violation | Thanks Chaol, will take head to your suggestions and make the proper modifications. This is why I wanted it to be a group effort so everyone can learn and adjust at the same pace towards this common goal. The research institute narrative is a great idea and in a way what we are beginning to do now. Thanks again Chaol and everyone participating. It's becoming more and more clear how to implement the system. MaJorMan |