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Thread for Atheists & Christians - STFU
Ms Sans Serif
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[quote:simultaneous_final:MV8yMTI2NzkzXzM1ODkxNzI5X0VBODdENkYw] [quote:Angelic_Warrior:MV8yMTI2NzkzXzM1ODkxNDM0XzhGNkIyNTU1] [quote:simultaneous_final:MV8yMTI2NzkzXzM1ODkxMDU3XzQ3MzE3QkI1] [quote:Anonymous Coward 18225135:MV8yMTI2NzkzXzM1ODkxMDAwX0E0MjIxQTUz] Once again you people have no faith. No faith means you are not in God's grace. Faith without works is dead like a body without a spirit. Here is my work. Look around you. Is it not apparent that this Earth age is ending? How much more proof do you need than that? It is written in a book today called the Holy Bible, once a collection of scrolls. All these tomes witness to each other on these very things taking place today. What about the fact that numbers have meaning in the bible and consistently mean the same thing across all scripture, regions, languages, cultures, and centuries? This is proof of a divine influence. What about the figures of speech, patterns in language, that also span across all scripture, regions, languages, cultures, and centuries? More proof of divine influence. What about the FACT that Jesus Christ lived on earth for approximately 33 years and IS GOD in the flesh? Extra-biblical accounts are recorded by historians of that time. He preformed all the miracles accounted for in the Holy Scriptures and it was documented. What about all biblical archaeology? Is that not scientific proof of the Holy Scriptures? What more? So any that do not know the Son, do not know the Father. And HE does not and will not know you either. Any WICKED man that says God does not exist is wholly IGNORANT, and lacks knowledge and is accounted as an antichrist. We were warned of these types. To try and discredit something, you must first know everything about it. They surely have not read anything nor do they know anything. In the end, it does not matter. GOD IS IN CONTROL!!! This age is ending now. Get your ways straight and live in His Word. It is your choice. But regardless of what you choose, it does not affect any true Christ-man or Christ-woman because we are righteous and have the VICTORY through Christ Jesus in the end. All that persecuted us will be made subject unto us in the time to come. And I personally will make it a point to be a very, very, very strict teacher and ruler. [/quote] What you don't understand (probably because you didn't even read the original post) is that I DO have faith. I believe in God. I had an NDE and met God. It was as real to me as anything else I've experienced. But I can't PROVE it to anyone. It would be futile to try. So even though I trust my perception, I would be asking A LOT to expect others to trust something that is purely subjective. [/quote] If you could PROVE it.. it wouldn't require faith on anyone's part. If you KNOW .. you don't have to prove it to anyone. If you truly "met God" how could you possibly not share. To be met with persecution is an intrinsic part of the "faith" walk. [/quote] I've shard the experience with enough people. It was weird. It was similar to your basic NDE. It's not the point of this thread. Like I said in the original post, my experience gives me an "educated guess" but is NOT proof--even to me. [/quote]
Let's get right to it.
No one can prove that "God" or any variation thereof the concept is real.
No one can prove that "God" or any variation thereof the concept is NOT real.
All arguments are moot without assuming a "given".
How can I say all this with certainty?
BECAUSE NO ONE CAN PROVE THAT THEY'RE NOT DREAMING RIGHT NOW, with fabricated memories and all.
No matter what, FAITH is required just to participate in whatever you think is reality.
Both atheists and God-believers base their beliefs on FAITH in experiential data.
A true atheist "lacks a belief" and that is a perfectly honest position to hold. However, the rabid atheists who argue endlessly that "there is no God" are taking the same leap of faith that the proselytizing Christians are.
SO--is there a GOD?
My experiential data (a near-death experience that was seemingly as "real" as anything else I've experienced) says YES.
That's why I believe in God.
But I'd be a liar if I said that my NDE provides "proof"--even to myself. After all, my dreams are as "real" as anything even when I'm walking on the ceiling and lightsaber fighting and flying a MIG--all with a head full of outlandish memories.
So...all of you know-it-alls arguing FOR or AGAINST the concept of "God" need to
because your arguments ARE DEMONSTRABLY FLAWED.
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