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Thread for Atheists & Christians - STFU
Ms Sans Serif
In accordance with industry accepted best practices we ask that users limit their copy / paste of copyrighted material to the relevant portions of the article you wish to discuss and no more than 50% of the source material, provide a link back to the original article and provide your original comments / criticism in your post with the article.
[quote:Don'tBeAfraid:MV8yMTI2NzkzXzM1OTE2ODI5Xzg3MjAzMTEw] [quote:PENG:MV8yMTI2NzkzXzM1OTE2NTQyXzRFNzBEQzRE] I think that's pretty much it right there ^^^. Simple fact is Christians and the like don't know for an absolute fact, and scientists don't know for as absolute fact. Christians can use the bible and history as their proof of existence, then bank on faith, which is what I chose to do. Scientists can state that something comes fom nothing and it didn't take a God to create nothing, it just happened. I think the two have more in common then one would think. Scientists and Christians spend ther whole lives searching for the meaning of life, or existence. Each have their own reality. Scientists hold just as much evidence as Christians do. They can't prove there isn't a god. That's just silly. Christians can't prove there is, even with the evidence. It's not absolute. If there is a god, he isn't going to come down and have a cup of tea. Really, why would he? We've been here for thousands of years and what makes anyone think the end of the world is coming in our lifetime? The end of the world is the proof we are begging for as to the existence of god. So for Christians, the only way to proved god really exists is for god himself to make a visit, a REAL visit! And for scientists to prove there is no god, they need to find out where nothing comes from, find the begining, before nothing. Lol. They're even confused. For me personally, there's definety something beyond and I would say a God created the whole thing. I feel it in my soul. A deep seeded feeling that my brain doesn't comprehend. ;) Maybe because I need it to be so? Well, what difference does it make to anyone else? If its my own little fantasy, then so be it. I would much rather discuss it, than argue about it. I find great comfort believing that we exist after this life. I just don't know what that soul transforms into... Which freaks me out. I don't like thinking that this is the end. The children I love so much, to think there is an inevitable end one day to all of it, hurts my heart. I agree with OP And for me, there isn't one verse in the bible, nor one atom the universe that beyond a doubt proves the existence, or non existence of God. Guess we just keep praying for a physical visit and keep researching the "nothing". ;) :hf: [/quote] Because of the Law of Free Will, God cannot come down and dwell among us. Not again at least, for God did come to do that as Jesus the Christ (probably named Yeshua or Yehoshua in the Hebrew). God came once to prove it all and offer a perfect sacrifice for the sins of the whole world and for all time: past, present, and future. It was sufficient. If God were to come down and dwell among us, then it break the Law of Free Will, for then seeing the miracle of God on a daily basis 24/7 then there is no belief by Faith only belief by objective observation. God desires to be believed by Faith, and possibly by derived Reason, but not by empirical evidence. Those who wait for the latter will wait until they take their last breath in all actuality, for seldom in history do miracles happen. And despite miracles happening on a daily basis, and your life is one of them, then people still don't believe. [/quote]
Let's get right to it.
No one can prove that "God" or any variation thereof the concept is real.
No one can prove that "God" or any variation thereof the concept is NOT real.
All arguments are moot without assuming a "given".
How can I say all this with certainty?
BECAUSE NO ONE CAN PROVE THAT THEY'RE NOT DREAMING RIGHT NOW, with fabricated memories and all.
No matter what, FAITH is required just to participate in whatever you think is reality.
Both atheists and God-believers base their beliefs on FAITH in experiential data.
A true atheist "lacks a belief" and that is a perfectly honest position to hold. However, the rabid atheists who argue endlessly that "there is no God" are taking the same leap of faith that the proselytizing Christians are.
SO--is there a GOD?
My experiential data (a near-death experience that was seemingly as "real" as anything else I've experienced) says YES.
That's why I believe in God.
But I'd be a liar if I said that my NDE provides "proof"--even to myself. After all, my dreams are as "real" as anything even when I'm walking on the ceiling and lightsaber fighting and flying a MIG--all with a head full of outlandish memories.
So...all of you know-it-alls arguing FOR or AGAINST the concept of "God" need to
because your arguments ARE DEMONSTRABLY FLAWED.
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