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REPLY TO THREAD
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Shared Dreaming, Fake and Real Shared Dreams.
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Original Message
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You all know that I am all into Beyond Dreaming stuff and I always try to be open minded. I believe to promote Lucid Dreaming and to advance our self in its capabilities we need to stop lying to our self. We need to look for facts, patterns of what seems to be coincidence, proofs and so on. Add to consideration anything that is suggested or proven by science, gather experience from all over the community and try to achieve something new, something that nobody has ever achieved yet.
There are a lot of experienced lucid dreamers on this community, I am sure you will understand me.
Fake Nightmare Shared Dreams and Why They Work?
I found several threads where people claim that they can invade others dreams and give them nightmares.
You all know how control of our dream works, our inner intentions and expectations are doing all the work. When those guys are offering you to get a nightmare, they ask you "what are you greatest fears?". You tell them your fears, at the same time you already image how would it look like, to make it even more intense, they will tell you their version of how it would look like. Intentionally or unintentionally you will think of it, you will imagine how would it look like. So you basically program you self to have a nightmare.
That's not all, when you go to sleep, somewhere deep inside you expect this to happen, even you you are a total disbeliever you will keep a slightest possibility that it might be true. It gets even worse when you are a believer, you fear of what will happen with you during next sleep, what you do is you create pure intention to get exactly that nightmare that you asked for or that nightmare that you'v been told about. Take SP as an example, you can see how powerful is fear and what kind of intentions it does create. Fear is something very hard to control, you might not realize it but you create a powerful intention by simply being scared of something. Inexperienced lucid dreamers get scared of a SP phenomena and by that they are bringing their biggest fear into life.
Then you see people getting nightmares and saying 'Woooah! He invaded my dreams and it was so scary' and so on... They do not understand what brought that nightmare and they think it was a shared dream. Why shared? Because you expected those people to give you a nightmare and intentionally or unintentionally you believe they did it.
If you come to a point where you get this nightmare and get very scared you will loose all control of your dream. Advanced lucid dreamers know this feeling, I believe everybody lost control of their dreams due to fear when they were new to lucid dreaming. In this cases you will be even more convinced that somebody invaded your dream.
Fake Shared Dream With a Person You Know
Boundary between real shared dream and fake shared dream might be very small here.
When two people who know each other, try to get a shared dream they might get it, but is it really a shared dream? In most cases no. Two people who know each other, often participate in similar conversations, they participate in same events and share some beliefs. If they don't know about shared dreaming, most probably they will simply consider it as another dream where they saw their friend. But give the a little idea of having a shared dream between each other and every time both of them dream of each other, they will consider it a shared dream, or a possibility of shared dream. Sometimes even conversations might match, because they used to talk to each other a lot. Often they do not recall complete text of conversations, when they start talking about it in real life, their mind fills the missing gaps with what they wish it to be. So in reality what many people consider a shared dream is simply a normal lucid dream about each other, dreaming of dream version of your friend.
I am talking about it from my experience and from experienced that I got in this community. I had a friend who was lucid dreamer too, both of us were lucid dreaming almost every night. At that time we already were pretty advanced and we often tried to have a shared dream. In the beginning it seems awesome, we thought it was that easy and we got so many shared dreams! But later we tried to prove that and failed all our attempts to do so. We had a plan to remember as many small details as possible, by comparing details we can know if it could the same dream. In every shared dream we found differences in some details, different hair styles, different color of clothes, different voices, different behavior, different details of decorations around us. We also tried to exchange information, we failed all attempts to do so as well.
I know you guys believe that numbers and text are hard to read, but don't you think that it might be a bias to think so. Both me and my friend learned lucid dreaming on our own, we got the idea of how to do it and that was it, the rest we learned our self. We did not have any prejudice thinking about problems with text or number so we never had those problems in our lucid dreams. I know sometimes it is hard to remember the exact text because our mind is thinking different in dreams, you can always wake up and repeat that word or a phrase couple of times in order to remember it exactly how it was. I believe that the reason why the majority of people believe that text and numbers are hard or impossible to read is that because it was mentioned in few famous books about lucid dreaming and then this belief transferred to most communities. Look at beliefs in Russian community, dreamhackers. Most of them read the same Russian books about lucid dreaming and they all believe that they dream in the same location, they all have some labyrinths, gates and levels and same monsters there, they do not even understand that they can create their realms and so on. That looks funny to us right? But they are sure that it is the only right version. I guess I went little out of topic.
What is Real Shared Dream and How Can We Prove One
This questions always stays open for me, I would suggest some kind of data exchange like text and numbers, or maybe replace it with something more symbolic?
Remembering small details and then sharing them to each other, but not with the way of chatting, we need to develop some way to exchange information at the same time. For example if two users suspect that they might had a shared dream, they could send each other a detailed descriptions of what they saw, what happened, how they looked, colors, sizes of objects around them, any possible details. If they could send those details to each other at the same time, they would not be able to complete the missing gaps with what their mind with what they want to.
I would suggest some kind of online room, where they come, write their text and then 3rd party member unlocks both descriptions for each other at the same time.
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