More Questions about aliens.......

King of Cups
User ID: 1672
7/14/2005
1:52 pm EDT

Asked of me by AC:
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ac
User ID: 16674

Q:--"Sometimes when I read the Bible I become overwhelmed. Maybe it´s from the early church learning that wasn´t correct, maybe from all the conflicting things on the internet..don´t know..probably both and more. Sometimes it comes through so clearly."

King of cups attempt to answer:
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A:--I too was confused by the Bible, having come from a Pentacostal/holiness background. I studied it, inside/out, completed my library with various reference works such as Strongs, Vines, etc. However, I committed the supreme sacrilege--I started thinking outside of that box I had been told I could not leave and studied other sources. After a three-year long struggle against the truth that was staring me in the face, I finally had to conclude that "we´ve been screwed, spiritually, by all the organized religions." Once I saw the truth about how I and the rest of Christianity has been deceived, I realized that the whole thing was meant to keep us stunted spiritually.
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REPLY TO HIJACK ATTEMPT: Someone mentioned earlier that it was obvious you have experienced some pain in your life that causes you to lash out. You have without realizing it revealed the cause of your problems. You pentecostal background as you admit has caused your pain. Do not seek to blame God or all of Christianity for the MANY mistakes made in denominational DOGMA. Many have left the church totally because of such incidents. You can´t imagine what I suffered as an ordained minister within the church. I myself had to also come to grips with reality and not blame everyone for those denominatinal errors. All denominations have problems within them. The truth is though is that you can´t throw the baby out with the bath water. You must consider what happen at that pentecostal church you once attended, learn from it, move on if necessary to another church setting and continue to praise God. Don´t look, at the Minister, Deacons, leaders nor the MEMBERSHIP itself. Look to Jesus only! He will remove your pain but you must remove your eyes from others. I have suffered much at the hands of the ORGANIZATIONAL church; so did Jesus, Paul and others in the bible.

KING OF CUP CONTINUING ATTEMPT:
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I´d recommend you settle down to commit to a lengthy study of the whole thing---question everything and look for the answers from there. Check every source, research every author and don´t fall for the bashing that so many Christian "apologists" engage in. Their job is to slam anyone who questions the source of their bread and butter. Your job should be to think for yourself, use the mind God gave you,and come to a logical conclusion.

REPLY TO KOC´S CONTINUATION: Hear you are most correct and this should be heeded to the TEE.

KING OF CUP CONTINUING ATTEMPT:
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This life is one where we are supposed to learn. Christianity, and most other religions, hinder that learning experience by telling us that all we need is one book, be it the Bible, Koran, etc. Don´t let it happen to you.

REPLY TO KOC´S CONTINUING ATTEMPT: Satan has targeted you because of your desire to be sincere. He always does this. He causes your pain to draw you away from the church and then after he has ISOLATED you, he seeks to teach you a so called "better" way. A way without Jesus and the Bible. A way that looks good on the surface but on the inside laced with POISON of another Gospel, deadlier than ARSENIC! A way of "SELF HELP" so that you will trust yourself more than you trust God. A so called way of Spiritual Awakenig that is actually "SPIRITUAL BLINDNESS". Our time is short, I pray that you will allow the Holy Spirit to reveal to you the deceptions of Satan. I have BEEN where you are. But so have many others who are reading this and some are trully receiving an eye opener. I guarantee you that there are those reading here who are witnesses to this situation.

Thanks for commenting...........
Again a special thanks for shadowing.......

I agree with some of what you are saying, with exception of the Earth being the centre of things...

I agree that Jesus was real, and that God (Omnipotent Quantum Universe)courses thru all creations etc.

But, the difference is, I believe there is nothing special about our planet, as living planets go in the Universe, other than it is crowded and over abundant in life forms, which tends to use up the resources of the planet faster and puts stress on creatures sharing the world....which brings me to man. Too many people on this world. I think the governments of our world would have been much better served, spending the last 50 years developing planet farming technology to give millions the option of say, moving to Mars, or the Moon etc.

This, I believe, would´ve relieved much stress on this world, and along with it, carefully selected lifeforms to exist along side man on this new world.

I think that 6 billion ++ humans is far far too many on this world. Better it be a carefully monitored 1 billion people, and 1/3 of all life forms transported along with much plant life as well to this new world.

If we had set in motion a plan as a world united, and farmed our Moon or built cities underground/above ground, and the same for Mars, *(although both worlds are smaller than Earth)

I could at LEAST see another billion or two people occupying these worlds as well.

Problem is, they say the technology doesn´t exist yet....just ideas.

Seems to me, that it was also said that the Stealth fighters didn´t exist until their unveiling in the late nineties and in fact,was a done deal in 1973....

If our governments know what is required to farm a world, then the technology exists to do so. The argument always being it costs billions just for ONE trip...if you sent a THOUSAND ships on this mission, there isn´t enough money to do it.....again, I disagree...paper money nver has, and never will have value...it is just like an IOU with the bank and other financial institutions.....

The truth is, Governments and the persons running them are all greedy and selfish of course. They want and want, and their selfish, greedy, immature attitudes, reflect BACK on society as a whole, as the jones try to keep up with the jones.....

What we all want likely, and admire would be similar to Star Trek and their Federation. Although a Science Fiction program of great popularity, it serves, to me at least, as a shining example of what the human race are/is capable of on a grand scale.

I believe there are many technologies in existence that we, the commoners, not only are not aware of, but likely would have a difficult time comprehending, and this is truly sad.

Does it not strike many others as odd, that back in the 50´s, 60´s, and 70´s programs about the future...our CURRENT PRESENT indicated a much DIFFERENT looking 2000-2005? One that seemed more enlightened? More advanced?

The only "advancements" I´ve truly SEEN..(not counting small leaps in Medicine)***

Have been commercial or commercialized. How to take existing products, or systems, and make them better, faster, stronger, easier to use....

True or False?

I mean, the Governments that run our world for our benefit**(I use this term loosely)** have everyone so hood winked and trained that no one questions much at all, for our own good** and in fact, wouldn´t we be extremely surprised, if we found out that the truth was, we had faster than light transport technology, ships capable of reaching the Moon Mars, Venus etc. in a blink.....

Computer systems with artificial intelligence...capable of independent thought....

Robots that actually serve science fiction-like functions....

Technologies that could create new worlds when we wish where we wish.....

A cure for ALL diseases on this world, and the truth ABOUT diseases........

Weaponry that is capable of knocking our own SUN OUT of its orbit....

Technology to mass transport millions of individuals instantly, to different areas of our world, or to another world all together....

If there was in fact a REAL one world government bent on the betterment of our society *(what a dreamer hey..?) There really wouldn´t be any mention of the COST of doing this, since all technologies, all advancements, everything would be under one umbrella, equally across this world...and it is likely that the actual USE OF paper money would be unnecessary, hence the actual talk abut billions and trillions of dollars to pull this off, would also be a non-issue....it would just be a figure on a computer.

In some of these cases...I believe 100% without fail, nor without blinking an eye, that what I´ve posted here is true. I don´t need to see it to believe it. I simply BELIEVE IT because there are always signs, clues and HINTS around us...

I believe our "leaders" believe there are too many people on this world....too many undesireables, and too many idiots or dummies not worthy of the technology....the knowledge....the riches they know of...and I am sure to SOME degree this is true.

Hence war. We have many theories about it. Some suggest it is to stimulate our economy. Some say it is all controlled by the Illuminatti...

How about, it is an effect way to control poulation? Yes. That is what I think. Without totally destroying our world via radiation etc. Controlled conflicts everywhere.....kill many. Famine, kills many.....diseases everywhere kill many.....slowly.

The most desireable and elite? Likely have immunity from disease etc. They likely have been innoculated as well. They likely have contigency plans in case of larger wars and conflicts etc.

I believe there is a plan in place alright, but never that there will be a large nuclear exchange....too much risk there, and too many unknowns. Too much potential damage to the future society they have plans to put in place when all is said and done.

Yes, I am one of those who believes eveentually, our population will be reduced to a fraction of what it is, and this will be purely by design. Too much points to this.

King of Cups - "Satan is an invention of Christianity. It is a minority belief in the grand scheme of things. Simply because you live this confusion every day doesn’t mean the rest of us have to believe it."

Now please, this is ignorance and you should be ashamed. To engage in a debate about gods word and have no understanding of it is foolish, read the bible and you will find Satan was around long before Jesus gave his life for our sins.

This is but one tiny example of the the foolishness of your posts, Trained for This does not really need anyones help but i though you should know people see though such things without much trouble. "Those who profess themselves to be wise will be made fools." Please remember this, and yes, you have been trying to show eveyone how wise you are in the context of your posts.

This is an open forum so I don´t see how it´s possible to "hijack" this thread. It isn´t "your" thread so maybe you should try to understand that. I do try as much as possible to let you have first lick at a question unless it´s addressed by someone else or time has gone by since the original question. You´ve avoided my offer to discuss ISSUES regarding aliens, spirituality, etc. and continue to focus on personalities. This, to me, shows that you simply fear exposure.


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TFT said--"You have without realizing it revealed the cause of your problems. You pentecostal background as you admit has caused your pain. Do not seek to blame God or all of Christianity for the MANY mistakes made in denominational DOGMA."

King of Cups REPLY--You´ve misunderstood something critical here. You wrongly presume that, because I no longer believe as you, I have a problem or experience "pain." Nothing could be further from the truth. I am freer, more happy and contented spiritually now than I ever was while in Christianity. My purpose here is to try to counter dogma that drags down our spirit. My experience with the Pentacostal church was the best thing that could have happened to me because it led me to question not only their presumed authority but everything they and other Christian churches teach. Fortunately, I broke from the brainwashing and explored other religions and paradigms and concluded, happily after much struggle to free myself from the years of brainwashing, that there´s so much more to this life and the universe than the narrow concept of Christianity or any other religion.

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TFT said--"Satan has targeted you because of your desire to be sincere... He causes your pain to draw you away from the church and then after he has ISOLATED you, he seeks to teach you a so called "better" way."

King of Cups REPLY--"I don´t believe there is a "Satan" existing as a single entity, though I do believe there are evil, negative entities who appear if we call for them purposely. Neither your satan, nor any other entity has "targeted" me. Again, I am not in "pain" but am happier spiritually than ever before. A huge burden left when I rejected Chrisitanity.

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TFT said--"I pray that you will allow the Holy Spirit to reveal to you the deceptions of Satan. I have BEEN where you are. But so have many others who are reading this and some are trully receiving an eye opener. I guarantee you that there are those reading here who are witnesses to this situation."

King of Cups REPLY--And I pray that you will one day accept that this whole religion/Chrisitanity thing is a system of control and stunts our spiritual growth. I would recommend that you consider other websites such as:

www.truthbeknown.com (go to the links page)
www.lloydpye.com
www.jesusneverexisted.com

A good start would be to read "The Jesus Mysteries".

One more thing: I´ve asked

My post above

King of Cups (unlogged)
User ID: 1672
7/14/2005
3:29 pm EDT

Response to the AC below:
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Anonymous Coward
User ID: 90
7/14/2005
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"--TFT lies more than anyone on GLP I´ve seen, including debunkers and disinfo freaks. His "sharp" responses work only on dull-wits, not intellectually honest or searching people."

REPLY: Those "SHARP" responses you recognize should be credited to the Holy Spirit. I have not the ability. But also it is interesting you on your own accord say that what I have said are lies. In considering the scope and magnitude of this information that is a bold statement. Mainly because only God/Jesus, an Angel, a Watcher, Elijah (or other humans who have secretly been allowed to continiue in life)and Fallen Angels/demons can make such an asertion. Do you fall within those parameters? Remember, you can only believe, think, feel, etc, that I am lying. Are you willing to answer for the souls who could be lost becaue of your blatant asertions?

YOU: So, I certainly don´t "wanna be" someone like that--I´m here to counter the lies and ignorance.

REPLY: Since you are here to counter "the lies" you might be willing to list the lies I have presented along with your proof of those lies other than what you think, feel, believe? You know that would go a long way. It would stop the entire thread. There would be no need for me to continue. Certainly you would like that wouldn´t you?

Let me list the gist of what I say here:
1. ALL aliens are fallen angels/demons
2. There will soon be a public announcement
3. The announcement will introduce the aliens
4. The announcement will display their UFOS
5. The earth will have a full physical pole shift
6. The aliens will say they can save us
7. Aliens will present many gifts to mankind
8. Gifts will include cures for many diseases
9. Gifts will include new way of transport
10. Humanity will almost fully destroy itself
11. This destruction will be because of cloning
12. Genetic altering will also be involved
13. Humans will be mixed with metals and "chips"
14. The antichrist is a mixed human/alien clone
15. The antichrist was created by man and ALIENS jointly
16. The antichrist is a walking computer
17. The antichrist is a talking computer
18. The antichrist is a breathing computer
19. The mark of the Beast is a computer chip
20. The USA days are numbered (Babylon)
21. The USA is destroyed to make way for the NWO
22. Aliens are in full support of this action
23. Those humans involved in this destruction (TPTB) have been duped by fallen angels/aliens to help usher in the eventual leader of the ONE WORLD GOVERNMENT.....THE ANTICHRIST!

All infomation given through the Holy Spirit

Please prove the Holy Spirit has lied to me so I can close this thread. Prove any one of the items mentioned is a lie and I will close this thread, regardless if the rest is true. If you are going to call the Holy Spirit a liar, I don´t want to hear what you think, feel, imagine or believe, I want "PROOF".

Thanks for commenting..........
Special thanks for sticking.............

PS. You are more help than you can think or imagine.

No, TFT, you won´t successfully turn the tables here. Remember, I ASKED YOU FOR PROOF OF YOUR CONTENTIONS--first.

You are avoiding providing the proof I ASKED FOR FIRST, here, in this thread and in previous threads. I´ve asked from the start for you to give us a reason why we should believe you. Instead, you expect us to have faith in the veracity of your words.

As usual, you have tried to turn the issue around and attempt to force me to prove a negative, i.e. that what you say is a lie. You know the near impossibility of proving a negative. However, the basis of my statement that what you say, overall, is a lie, is based on much study outside of Christianity. I´ve provided elsewhere in this thread starting points, links and references for those honestly interested in exploring the basis of your (and Christianity´s) dogma. Once the study is complete, I believe an intellectually honest person would at least come away with serious doubt of your dogma. Here´s your list, which I will address below. My answers will be in all caps, only to distinguish my answers and avoid the "you said/I say" back and forth format:

Let me list the gist of what I say here:
1. ALL aliens are fallen angels/demons

I BELIVE THIS IS A LIE AND BASE THIS BELIEF ON THE MULTITUDE OF FIRST HAND ACCOUNTS AND THE LACK OF PROOF THAT THERE ARE IN FACT "FALLEN ANGELS" MASQUERADING AS ALIENS. PLEASE PROVE ALIENS ARE FALLEN ANGELS.

2. There will soon be a public announcement

MAYBE, MAYBE NOT. I LEAN HEAVILY TOWARD THERE NOT BEING ONE, IF ONLY TO MAINTAIN THE STATUS QUO. HOWEVER, IF TPTB FIND IT SERVES THEM TO MAKE SUCH AN ANNOUNCEMENT, THEY´LL DO SO, LIKELY CASTING ALIENS AS A THREAT.

3. The announcement will introduce the aliens

OBVIOUSLY, IF THERE´S AN ANNOUNCEMENT, THEY´LL INTRODUCE THEM. I THINK, THOUGH, THAT SUCH AN ANNOUNCEMENT WOULD COLOR ALIENS AS OUR ENEMY. TPTB WOULD NEED THIS TO SOLIDIFY THEIR GRIP ON HUMANITY.

4. The announcement will display their UFOS

IT WOULD.

5. The earth will have a full physical pole shift

THIS IS LIKELY AS WELL, BUT I KNOW YOU DIDN´T GET THIS FROM THE HOLY SPIRIT. THERE´S AMPLE SCIENTIFIC EVIDENCE THAT IT´S HAPPENED BEFORE AND IS MOVING TOWARD SUCH A STATE AT THIS MOMENT.

6. The aliens will say they can save us

BOGUS. IN FACT, THEY USUALLY SAY THAT, WHILE THEY´RE TECHNOLOGY ALLOWS THEM TO REVERSE THE DAMAGE WE´VE DONE TO OURSELVES, THEY WON´T INTERVENE IN OUR WORLD FOR VARIOUS REASONS. FEW, IF ANY THAT I CAN RECALL, HAVE STATED TO ABDUCTEES THAT THEY ARE HERE TO ACT AS OUR SAVIOUR.

7. Aliens will present many gifts to mankind

THEY´VE ALREADY DONE THIS, BUT WITH A PRICE.

8. Gifts will include cures for many diseases

CERTAINLY ALIENS ARE MORE ADVANCED AND HAVE BEEN ABLE TO CONQUER DISEASE. THAT DOESN´T MEAN THEY´RE DEMONIC.

9. Gifts will include new way of transport

SAME AS #8

10. Humanity will almost fully destroy itself

WE´RE POISED TO DO THAT WITHOUT THE HELP OF ALIENS.

11. This destruction will be because of cloning

AGAIN, PERVERTED HUMANS DON´T INDICATE THE DEMONIC NATURE OF ALIENS. CLONING IS A PERVERSION AND WOULD INDEED LEAD TO OUR DESTRUCTION, HOWEVER, THE SCIENCE BEHIND IT WOULD NOT NECESSARILY HAVE TO.

12. Genetic altering will also be involved

OUR GENES WERE SET UP FROM THE BEGINNING TO CAUSE DEGENERATION OF OUR BODIES. I DOUBT THE GLOBALISTS WOULD ALLOW US TO LIVE MUCH PAST OUR CURRENT AVERAGE AGE.

13. Humans will be mixed with metals and "chips"

AGREED

14. The antichrist is a mixed human/alien clone

THERE IS NOWHERE IN THE BIBLE WHICH SAYS THERE IS "THE" (INDICATING "ONE" OR A SINGLE...)ANTICHRIST.

15. The antichrist was created by man and ALIENS jointly

PROVE IT.

16. The antichrist is a walking computer

IF BY ANTICHRIST YOU MEAN EVIL, YES, I BELIEVE THE COMPUTER HAS BEEN TWISTED FOR THE PURPOSES OF EVIL.

17. The antichrist is a talking computer

PROVE IT.

18. The antichrist is a breathing computer

SAME AS ABOVE.

19. The mark of the Beast is a computer chip

20 YEARS AGO CHRISTIANS WERE SAYING THAT THE MARK OF THE BEAST WAS A TATOO. AMAZING HOW MYTHS ADAPT TO TECHNOLOGY.

20. The USA days are numbered (Babylon)

AGREED.

21. The USA is destroyed to make way for the NWO

AGREED.

22. Aliens are in full support of this action

I BELIEVE SOME ALIENS ARE PUSHING THE NWO AGENDA AND SOME ARE AGAINST.

23. Those humans involved in this destruction (TPTB) have been duped by fallen angels/aliens to help usher in the eventual leader of the ONE WORLD GOVERNMENT.....THE ANTICHRIST!

I CAN ONLY AGREE THAT OUR CURRENT LEADERS HAVE GIVEN IN TO EVIL (OR WERE BRED FOR IT) AND ARE COMPLETELY WILLING TO SACRIFICE ANY ONE OF US OR MILLIONS IF NECESSARY TO ACHIEVE A ONE WORLD GOVT.

AT LEAST WE BOTH SEEM TO BE AGAINST A NWO.

All infomation given through the Holy Spirit

IF THAT´S YOUR FAITH, GREAT.

If you are going to call the Holy Spirit a liar, I don´t want to hear what you think, feel, imagine or believe, I want "PROOF".

ONCE AGAIN, YOU´VE MADE THE CLAIM TO HAVE DIRECT CONTACT WITH THE HOLY SPIRIT AND THAT IT HAS PROVIDED YOU WITH KNOWLEDGE. PLEASE PROVE THE CONTENTIONS I´VE DISPUTED.

My point here is to alert others that you seek their faith--you want people to believe you without having to prove anything. Only God can expect that.

tft--PS. You are more help than you can think or imagine.

Glad to give you the attention you thrive on.

Greetings, TFT (second try at this posting)-

I´ve read all your postings and find them fascinating and encouraging. They have given me inspiration to study and seek the meat of the word. Praise the Lord.

Questions FOR TFT (not interested in any additional input from others at this time):

Having read a great amount of the Bible, studying with some extra care using Strongs and other translating tools and it has led me to this question?

What is really going on here on Earth?

Yahweh being who He is, which is everything (I am Alpha and Omega; the Word) then there´s something going on here far beyond what the Bible reveals, although it does provide some hints. Perhaps, it states "it" clearly and I just lack the spiritual developement or discernment to grasp it. But, clearly the struggle here on Earth has greater implications then those commonly known by believers and seems to go beyond it´s effect on Earth. Could you shed some like on this as the Spirit leads you? Or, am I way off base?

Thanks in advance. And, my the Lord continue his use of you.

W/E

Anonymous Coward
User ID: 1672
7/20/2005
3:39 pm EDT

No, TFT, you won´t successfully turn the tables here. Remember, I ASKED YOU FOR PROOF OF YOUR CONTENTIONS--first.

REPLY: Normally I don´t like to skip over other posts except on "rare" occasions. This is one of them.

My last post was designed to make you think. You CANNOT prove me wrong but I also cannot prove ANYTHING I have exposed here on this thread is true..... because it is also not necessary to PROVE anything here. Whe Elijah told Ahab it would not rain, he wasn´t expected to prove it. It proved itself by happening or not happening. Only an idiot would have asked Noah for proof that there was going to be a major flood. He could have never proved it but he could prepare himself for it. Even the fact he was building a large boat could not prove it. However the bottom line is that it RAINED! (Which was the last POLE SHIFT the earth experienced.) Noah had a message/warning. I have a message/warning. You or anyone else can choose to accept it, reject it or say "I´ll wait and see". If you postal worker delivered a bill to you from your local utilities, would you ask your postal worker to "PROVE IT". They can´t, they are just messengers. It is totally IDIOTIC to seek proof from the messenger. However, if God chooses to prove it to you, that would be up to Him.

You seem to think as you said earlier that my delivering this message is a CONTENTION. You are sadly mistaken. Which is why for the most part I deliver ANSWERS to Questions. No proof is EVER necessary for a warning. If the weather forcast says it is going to rain, you don´t debate it, you do what is necessary IN CASE IT DOES RAIN. If you decide it is incorrect then you are obviously willing to accept the fact that you will be wet if it rains. There is no need to CONTEND about this warning (maybe if you were a close relative and I was hurting for you I would). Would I like you to take heed? Yes! Would I be bothered if you don´t? NO! I would feel sorry for you for a very brief moment, but there are too many others who have made the SAME decision as you for me to be crying for each of you. I praise God though for the MANY who have read this thread and have understanding and have been snatched from the jaws of the devourer. That is how I will spend my time. I will not spend time worrying about the rejectors.... but I will spend MUCH time rejoicing ABOUT those who escaped and rejoicing WITH those who have escaped for an eternity! We are all like fish in the ocean.... God WANTS all of us, but He does not NEED any of us. So I will spend my time rejoicing...... not over your loss.... bout over the SALVATION of many. Therefore your loss will be drowned out by the REJOICING. When we lose loved ones today we don´t spend our lives sorrowing over their loss... WE MOVE ON. I surely hope you understand what I say here. I wish I had a million dollars, but I don´t; so I will rejoice over the $10 bill in my wallet!! No need for contention.

Let me say that what I detect in your actions is that you are miserable and you are hoping in your heart of hearts that I am wrong about what I know to be true. But to make it yourself feel better, you need someone else to take your side because misery loves company.

I notice you did not answer my question as to if you are willing pay the price for those you could hurt by calling this message a lie. I know you don´t want to answer that because it would be incrimminating.

You also for some strange reason believe I want people to have faith in ME. Do you have FAITH in your letter carriers because they deliver mail. I hope not. The faith needs to be in the message and not the messenger.

YOU: You are avoiding providing the proof I ASKED FOR FIRST, here, in this thread and in previous threads. I´ve asked from the start for you to give us a reason why we should believe you. Instead, you expect us to have faith in the veracity of your words.

REPLY: I think I have suffieicntly answered this one with my reponse above.

YOU: As usual, you have tried to turn the issue around and attempt to force me to prove a negative, i.e. that what you say is a lie. You know the near impossibility of proving a negative.

REPLY: So since you can´t prove it is a lie, why not just give daily living the chance to prove it? This is the only way the flood proved to be true.

YOU: However, the basis of my statement that what you say, overall, is a lie, is based on much study outside of Christianity.

REPLY: This is precisely where your problem is. You are not looking to God for answers. But you unintelligently contend over a warning like a mad man. Your lunacy is unfathomable.

Thanks for commenting.............
Again you assistance is appreciated..........
You are helping the eyes of many to become opened

TRAINED FOR THIS
User ID: 1280
7/20/2005

TFT--"I also cannot prove ANYTHING I have exposed here on this thread is true..... because it is also not necessary to PROVE anything here. ...If you postal worker delivered a bill to you from your local utilities, would you ask your postal worker to "PROVE IT". ...It is totally IDIOTIC to seek proof from the messenger. However, if God chooses to prove it to you, that would be up to Him.

King of Cups--It´s good to see you come clean, at least partially by admitting you can´t prove anything you´ve said. However, if a postal carrier delivers a piece of mail, I can quickly determine the source of the message or letter. You, on the other hand, obscure the source of your "knowledge" by claiming special communion with God. You´ve again used disparaging remarks to someone who is simply trying to ascertain your credentials. Not very Christian-like.

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TFT-"Let me say that what I detect in your actions is that you are miserable and you are hoping in your heart of hearts that I am wrong about what I know to be true. But to make it yourself feel better, you need someone else to take your side because misery loves company."

King of Cups--Actually, I am so happy at my spiritual condition and growth that I feel sorry for you and those like you. I was once like that and am soooooo glad I´ve become FREE!!!
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TFT--"I notice you did not answer my question as to if you are willing pay the price for those you could hurt by calling this message a lie. I know you don´t want to answer that because it would be incrimminating."

King of Cups--LOL!!! You´ve avoided legitimate questions for years since you began posting on GLP. To answer directly your question I didn´t see before this, this question is like "do you still beat your wife?" No, I honestly don´t believe anyone will be hurt by my statements, to the contrary, I´m pretty certain that many will look at this debate, if they aren´t already bored with this thread and the direction it´s taken, and study some of the references I´ve provided. You´ve provided no resources except a few Bible verses.
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TFT--"You also for some strange reason believe I want people to have faith in ME. Do you have FAITH in your letter carriers because they deliver mail. I hope not. The faith needs to be in the message and not the messenger."

King of Cups--You expect people to accept your "most special" revelation, without question, which in fact is NO REVELATION but a rehash of contemporary Christian dogma.
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TFT--You are not looking to God for answers. But you unintelligently contend over a warning like a mad man. Your lunacy is unfathomable.

King of Cups--Another LOL!!! Lunacy, idiocy, unintelligence...blah blah blah. What is unfathomable is your avoidance of the real issues by focusing on me instead. A convenient distraction for readers (if any are left), but a sad display of intellectual dishonesty as well. You´re good at insults but poor at answering simple requests for SUBSTANCE in backing your CONTENTIONS. Until proof is offered, I maintain they are simply expressions of your faith and nothing more.
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TFT--You are helping the eyes of many to become opened

King of Cups--I know that´s true, because I´ve given them starting points for thinking beyond your faith.

I´m posting a separate thread which should be devoid of personal allegations.

The Bible says to be ready to give an answer for the hope that is within you. Here´s your chance.

Watchful Eye
User ID: 7079
7/20/2005
3:59 pm EDT

Greetings, TFT (second try at this posting)-

I´ve read all your postings and find them fascinating and encouraging. They have given me inspiration to study and seek the meat of the word. Praise the Lord.

REPLY: Likewise I say God be praised!

YOU: Questions FOR TFT (not interested in any additional input from others at this time):

Having read a great amount of the Bible, studying with some extra care using Strongs and other translating tools and it has led me to this question?

What is really going on here on Earth?

Yahweh being who He is, which is everything (I am Alpha and Omega; the Word) then there´s something going on here far beyond what the Bible reveals, although it does provide some hints. Perhaps, it states "it" clearly and I just lack the spiritual developement or discernment to grasp it. But, clearly the struggle here on Earth has greater implications then those commonly known by believers and seems to go beyond it´s effect on Earth. Could you shed some like on this as the Spirit leads you? Or, am I way off base?

REPLY: You are correct that there is more going that meet the eye, however the bible does not devote much attention to all the details. The bible is designed to give you the information needed "on earth" to allow you to eventually SEE FOR YOURSELF the other finer details. The bible actually reveals it in simplistic ways but because we live in a world that expects some sort of mysticism in everything. It is however more of a mystery because it is not known by most.

The questions of mystery that most want to know are:

1. Who/what am I?
2. Why am I here?
3. What is the end of it all?

I will deal with each one in brevity.

WHO AM I?

The second of two being of highest intellilect created by God (first being angels)in the Universe. Unlike angels who were created to live mainly in the universe, we were created to live mainly on Planets. We were given abilites not given to angels for the more detail planetary living. We are the ONLY beings created with a soul in the universe. We are to have dominion on EVERY planet we reside upon. In the beginning of the EARTH, God created Adam and Eve as the bible states. Because of sin "on Earth" we are not allowed to freely roam the universe because is contagious. We are therefore quarantined until the disease is wiped out.

WHY AM I HERE?

We are here because we are all from the seed of Adam who was originialy created on Earth. We are alive because God wanted His own children which is why He created Adam. Simply because,,,,, He wanted children. Children to assist Him in the Universe on ALL the planets He was going to create (and still is creating). Of course we know sin came about because of Satan´s rebellion. Satan became distrubed when God began to create children ALL OVER the Universe. He became jealous and began to take liberties he should not have. Satan was allowed to assist God ALL OVER the Universe with the help of the other Angels. When Satan was confronted by God because of his dealings with His (God´s) children Satan was not repentent and sought to gain support from other angels ALL OVER the Universe over his reprimand. Some of the angels sided with Satan and God allowed it to determine which angels were loyal. After they expressed the loyalty to Satan they were cast out of heaven and CAST DOWN to the very planets they were assigned to work for. Because of this imprisonment (confinement, locked in chains)they are not allowed to go far from the planets they are confined to or in close proximity to. Therefore those who are bothering us on earth are actually in bondage and chained to this planet and this solar system. They are responsible for creating problems on those planets where they are confined to; which is what happened to Adam and Eve. They know that wherever they are that they are condemned and seeking to avoid that condemnation through the obtaining of a soul (which is why they abduct). Remember, only humans have a soul. Whenever a planets nears it endtimes when God is getting ready to "reap the harvest" of those who have trusted in Him, these Fallen Angels have set up the alien agenda to sway the understanding of God´s children away from the true and living God. They shower them with gifts and a promise of help from the natural catastrophes such as the PROGRAMMED pole shifts that occur periodically like clockwork.

WHAT IS THE END OF IT ALL?

It is God´s desire that all His children become again what He created Adam to be..... a "SON OF GOD". We have truly been given the POWER TO BECOME "sons of God", but it is up to us. If we follow the things outlined within the bible, we will be cured of our disease (sin). By His (Jesus) stripes we are healed and as "sons of God" we have eternal life. We are given a new body called "the Morning Star" promised to "he that overcometh". Our souls are placed in these new angel-like bodies. We will then be free to meet ALL our other brothers and sisters ALL OVER the Universe.

This is the condensed version. Of course Satan is doing all that he can ALL OVER the universe to hopefully see to it that God´s reaps only a small harvest for every planet ALL OVER the Universe. Earth is one of the many planets ALL OVER the Universe the fell to Satan and the disease called sin. God deals with each planet in His own time. Earth has just about reached that point and things are rapidly coming to a boil here. I caution you that if you don´t believe a word of what I have said about the Universe, please believe all I have said about Earth..... and then you will be able to see the rest for yourself. Keep your faith and trust in God and Jesus Christ and do not EVER trust the Aliens who are ALL fallen angels, demons and CLONES of the fallen angels.

Thanks for asking...........

King of Cups
User ID: 1672
7/20/2005
5:24 pm EDT

The Bible says to be ready to give an answer for the hope that is within you.

REPLY: Do you have a questions? Feel free to ask your question. And of course that would be here as I will not be giving you any opportunities to divert from this thread. Nice try though. I very rarlely comment on other threads; have you noticed?

Thanks for the invite.........
Thanks for your help...........

Satan = Physical Form as in human/fallen angel.

God = Eternal spirit/Soul which is pure love.

These war against each other continuously while incarnated. One will predominate over the other eventually through experience.

Balance is a challenge.

LOVE is the key.

This is a most serious thread but I want you guys to know that in real life I am quite a humerous guy. So on a lighter note allow me to answer a post with pictures for a little humor. Remember this is just to add a little humor.

King of Cups
User ID: 1672
7/20/2005
5:24 pm EDT

I´m posting a separate thread which should be devoid of personal allegations.

The Bible says to be ready to give an answer for the hope that is within you. Here´s your chance.

REPLY:

I , trying to help this guy.

As hard as I try, I can´t get him to understand.

And he comes back here that I am a liar.

Then I discover that he really wants .


Then he thnks I am enough to help him start a thread against me and give him more attention. I might have been born at night but not TONIGHT.

Thanks for laughing...........
Thanks for sticking............

King of Cups - "The Bible says to be ready to give an answer for the hope that is within you. Here´s your chance."


You are one person that should above all else stay away from using any bible reference. Your lack of understanding is quite sad to say the least, have you never heard that a little knowledge of the bible can be dangerous? you sir are a perfect example.

Dee
User ID: 15749
7/18/2005
3:12 pm EDT Re: More Questions about aliens.......

TFT

Forgive me if you have addressed this 100 times already...but could you explain from your specific training what you understand about the timing and the reality of the rapture..

REPLY: The timing of the rapture is as the bible has said, NO ONE knows the day or the hour. This is because God wants the best of the best and not people who may attempt to time their behavior based on knowledge of the rapture. I will say this though, that before the rapture their will be a period of suffering for believers unparalleled in the history of Christianity. This suffering period is known in the bible as the time when God will separate the "WHEAT FROM THE TARES".

The rapture is a reality. God uses it after much suffering to deliver the believers from the "wrath of Satan" but more importantly to prevent them from going through His (God´s) own wrath which will follow the rapture. God has NOT appointed true Christians to His wrath.

Thanks for asking...........

thank you

It is my pleasure Dee to answer your question. God be praised and thanks for all answers.

Thanks for asking..........

TFT be forewarned; you are giving false witness.

Everything that I have read from TFT in this thread resonants with my spirit as truth.

There is no falseness or misleading here what so ever.

We have a good man of God in Trained for This.
Little doubt why the attack.

Anonymous Coward
User ID: 885
7/20/2005

AC--"You are one person that should above all else stay away from using any bible reference. Your lack of understanding is quite sad to say the least, have you never heard that a little knowledge of the bible can be dangerous? you sir are a perfect example."

REPLY--Excuse me, but where does it say that only certain people may use the Bible as a reference? And, what right do you think you have to tell me I cannot utilize the Bible as a point of reference if I so choose? You state I "lack" understanding--please be specific and clarify exactly what it is that you think I don´t understand.

As far as knowledge of the Bible being dangerous, please note that before I rejected the "Jesus is saviour" belief, I studied the Bible for decades and know at least as much as any preacher.

Please take your arrogance elsewhere because I intend to quote the Bible, or any other resource, as often as I please.

You may be reading and quoting it but from all I can tell so far you aren´t understanding or applying it.

Dee
User ID: 15749
7/18/2005

Forgive me if you have addressed this 100 times already...but could you explain from your specific training what you understand about the timing and the reality of the rapture..

TFTs REPLY: The timing of the rapture is as the bible has said, NO ONE knows the day or the hour......The rapture is a reality. God uses it after much suffering to deliver the believers from the "wrath of Satan" but more importantly to prevent them from going through His (God´s) own wrath which will follow the rapture. God has NOT appointed true Christians to His wrath.

King of Cups RESPONSE--The evidence against a rapture is too solid to ignore. Here is an example from a Christian website which does not subscribe to the rapture teaching. It´s too long to paste all of it here, so I´ve included the link at the bottom:

I THESSALONIANS 4:16-17

"For the Lord Himself shall descend from heaven with a shout, with the voice of the archangel, and with the trump of God: and the dead in Christ shall rise first: Then we which are alive and remain shall be caught up together with them in the clouds, to meet the Lord in the air: and so shall we ever be with the Lord." (I Thes. 4:16-17).

When the above verses are read without understanding, it would appear Ribera, Lacunza, Darby, Irving, and Scofield were right in their teachings of the rapture. We know, however, this concept came from carnal minds dealing with things pertaining to the Spirit. Coupled with this teaching came the heavenly Jerusalem coming down to earth (Rev. 21:10), assuming it was speaking of a literal city. To get the true meaning of what is being said here, it is a must to see that it is speaking of SPIRITUAL things and not natural.

"In a SHOUT (verse 16) comes from the Greek word keleuma which means, "a cry of incitement," and it comes from the word keleuo which means, "to urge on; hail; to incite by word, i.e. order." (Strong´s Exh. Conc.). Therefore, a COMMAND TO BATTLE or A WAR CRY is what the Lord is appearing in. Let our minds be stirred at this time with a question: If we are escaping from the enemy by-way-of a massive air-lift, just before Satan´s wrath is turned loose on the world, then why would a war cry be given to us? When an army is incited to charge forward into battle they do not conquer by leaving the fury of the enemy, but they win by attacking and overcoming him with superior forces. The Holy Spirit of God tells us eight different times in the book of Revelation what the inheritance will be to the ones who OVERCOME...not to those who run! There is a war to be won, dear saints, and the battle fields are in the regions of our own souls. We might as well face it, until we are apprehended by our Lord and we trumpet the victory on every front, we will never possess the kingdom of the heavens or the earth."

The Greek word CAUGHT UP, as it is rendered in the King James version is harpazo, which means, TO SEIZE and is a derivative of haireomai and its meaning is TO TAKE FOR ONESELF. The following are the scriptures where this word HARPAZO is used: "...and the violent TAKE IT BY FORCE (SEIZES IT)." (Mt. 11:12). "...then cometh the wicked one, and CATCHETH AWAY (SEIZES) that which was sown in his heart." (Mt. 13:19). "...and the wolf CATCHETH (SEIZES) them, and scattereth the sheep." (Jn. 10:12). "...neither shall any man PLUCK (SEIZE) them out of my hand...and no man is able to PLUCK (SEIZE) them out of My Father´s hand." (Jn. 10:28 & 29). "...with fear, PULLING (SEIZING) them out of the fire. (Jude 23). "I knew a man in Christ above fourteen years ago, (whether in the body, I cannot tell; or whether out of the body, I cannot tell: God Knoweth:) such an one CAUGHT UP (SEIZED) to the third heaven." (II Cor. 12:3). "...and her child was CAUGHT UP (SEIZED) unto God...." (Rev. 12:5). And also, "Then we which are alive and remain shall be CAUGHT UP (SEIZED) together with them...." (I Thes. 4:17).

"Not only from the meaning of this word do we see that IT HAS NOTHING TO DO WITH DIRECTION, such as being caught UPWARDLY into the air, but by taking note of how the original writers of the New Testament used the word also gives us definition of the word. Therefore, seeing that the word simply is telling us of a particular STATE OF BEING one might find himself -- namely, in the disposition of being SEIZED, then it would be good for us to get our minds off of where we thought we might be GOING and on to WHAT WE ARE DEFINITELY BECOMING. What it boils down to, brethren, is this: When we hear the LOGOS OF GOD we will find ourselves so completely SEIZED OF OUR LORD, and with such resurrection power, that we will never fall to the pulling gravity of the flesh again."

"The Secret Rapture teaching was introduced into the United States and Canada in the 1860´s and 1870´s though there is some indication that it may have been taught as early as the 1840´s. Darby himself visited the United States six times. The new teaching was spreading. A Congregationalist preacher by the name of C.I. Scofield came under the influence of Darby and the Plymouth Brethren. The Scofield Reference Bible was destined to have a tremendous impact upon the beliefs of may, when, three million copies were published in the first 50 years. Through this Bible, Scofield carried the teaching of the Secret Rapture into the very heart of evangelism. Some ignorant souls look on the notes in this Bible as the Word of God itself. I do not doubt for one instant that many who read these lines have been influenced somewhere in their spiritual lives by the footnotes in the Scofield Bible.

"There is one final link in the chain of the development and spread of the rapture theory that should be mentioned in passing. I would draw your attention again to the source, the origin, of the rapture doctrine and the chain of contact by which it has been brought down to this day. It began as a Roman catholic invention. The Jesuit priest Ribera´s writings influenced the Jesuit priest Lacunza, Lacunza influenced Irving, Irving influenced Darby, Darby influenced Scofield, Scofield and Darby influenced D.L. Moody, and moody influenced the Pentecostal Movement. How? you ask. The Assemblies of God is today by far the largest Pentecostal denomination in the world. When the Pentecostal movement began at the turn of the century, and the Assemblies of God held their first general council in 1914 in Hot Springs, Arkansas, they were a small movement and didn´t have their own publishing house. They needed Sunday School and study materials for their churches so where do you suppose they got it? They bought it from Moody Press and had their own cover stitched on it! So what do you think the Assemblies of God people believed? They believed what Moody Bible Institute taught! This had its impact on Pentecostal theology, because in the early years there were practically no pre-millenialists in the Pentecostal movement. Most of the ministers in those early days came from Presbyterian, Methodist, or other historic denominations men who, being baptized in the Holy Spirit and leaving their denominations, joined themselves to the Assemblies of God or one of the other emerging Pentecostal denominations. That is how the Pentecostal movement became influenced and saturated with the "Secret Rapture" doctrine by a direct chain right back to THE ROMAN CHURCH." --End quote.

"The doctrine of the "PRE-TRIB RAPTURE" can also be credited to what began in Port Glasgow, Scotland in 1830. A young Scottish lass named Margaret MacDonald had a revelation of the coming of the Lord before the great tribulation. Several noted Bible teachers of that day picked up on this thought, but it was Edward Irving and John Darby who were responsible for it being popularized in Scotland and England. It is said of Darby that he borrowed from Margaret MacDonald´s revelation, modified her views, and then taught them under his own name without giving her credit. He visited the U.S. at least five times, and his dispensationalism became part of the Scofield Reference Bible (1909), as quoted above. It was the notes in Scofield´s Bible that caused this new teaching to find favor in this country."

"No Brethren, we will not be whisked off the earth and changed. There will be no bursting open of our graves some glad day beyond the ages that will produce the change. Neither will our change come as a result of simply believing the teachings of the rapture, or any other doctrine, for that matter. And when God gets ready, He will not be snapping His fingers and saying, "Be mature, transfigured sons of glory." There are, however, some verses that do tell us how this glorious change comes. One such verse is, "Be not conformed to this world, but be ye TRANSFORMED by the RENEWING of your mind." (Rom 12:2). The change comes, dear ones, due to the renewing of our minds, as we our attention is refocused!

The Laodicean church of today has acquired so many easy-way-out concepts and teachings that it will take a great shaking to ever get strength built back into its body. The rapture is only one of her weakening doctrines. Perhaps, we should all be reminded: When any teaching or belief is founded upon one or two scriptures alone, there is no spiritual stability to build upon. Anger is often generated when such beliefs are challenged, for this is commonly the only defense one would have when falsehoods are dearly embraced. Any true doctrine of God will be found throughout the entire Bible rather than in a few isolated areas that are sometimes vague. If the teachings are not consistent throughout the written word, it can be very dangerous and extremely painful for one to hold them too closely to oneself; for when they are touched and consumed by God´s flaming ministers and His words of fire, they will definitely get burned. There are a couple of other scripture passages that may seem to give strength to being physically raptured off the earth; however, after taking a closer look, one may have to reconsider what is truly the doctrine of Christ in this matter."

[link to www.godfire.net]

TFT-

Thank you for the reply to my question regarding "what´s really going on here"?

I know that this thread´s theme is about fallen angels and aliens, but thank you so much for answering my question.

And, if it´s okay, I have more discussion/questions along this same vein. If not, of course, just let me know!

Ok, if the Lord can see who will endure and who will choose to live by faith, then why is He making all to struggle? He already know what each of us is "made of"; and, whether or not we have what it takes. Why this process?

YIC,

W/E

Watchfull Eye - I too have thought this many times. Why put so many of us thru the misery that is going on in this world. What is the reason. God already knows us before we were born. Please help with this TFT.

Watchful Eye--Ok, if the Lord can see who will endure and who will choose to live by faith, then why is He making all to struggle? He already know what each of us is "made of"; and, whether or not we have what it takes. Why this process?

King of Cups--Unfortunately, I don’t believe Christianity can adequately answer this question. However, I believe that reincarnation, and its purpose, can explain much.

At one time, I did not believe reincarnation was a viable explanation for suffering and hardships we endure. I believed that the Bible’s statement that “It is appointed for a man once to die, then the judgment” said it all and that any questions must have an answer within that paradigm. Now, I see that was not correct, at least my interpretation of it. Think of it this way: the judgment, in this verse, isn’t what we’ve been taught to think of as judgment. Strong’s concordance offers various definitions: “opinion or decision given concerning esp. concerning justice and injustice, right or wrong.” It also provides another, alternate definition: “sentence of condemnation, damnatory judgment, condemnation and punishment.” If we read the verse as using the latter, we are all condemned to punishment. However, this runs contrary to the Christian belief that if we accept Jesus as our Lord and Saviour, we are free from His wrath and do not suffer the condemnation. So, we have to look to the first meaning for it to make sense, at least within the Christian belief system. If “judgment” here means opinion or decision, then we may conclude that God provides us, upon death of our physical body, a “report card” of sorts, telling us where we need to grow and what we’ve learned here in this incarnation. It’s akin to a student, at the end of the year receiving a report card, judging their progress throughout the previous school year. It doesn’t damn them, it only tells them where they are in their academic progress.

So it is with our lives here. We are here to grow, to learn about what God has created. He certainly doesn’t send us here for the express purpose of allowing us to suffer. He sends us here to learn character traits that will last for an eternity within His creation. He isn’t some gigantic kid with a magnifying glass, torturing those who can’t fight Him. The only way to learn lessons of humility, love, peace, creativity, etc. is to experience a world where those traits are in relatively short supply. He may send a poor person our way to challenge our ability to feel real compassion. Or, he may make us poor to teach us that the true worth of a person isn’t measured by their bank account. He knows what will make the lesson stick. And, prior to being born here, we agree to those lessons, believe it or not. It’s up to us to decipher this world and make it a better place as we learn. Nothing in our existence will come easy, particularly the best attributes of the Spirit mentioned above. To master those, we need many, many lifetimes to learn those attributes well enough to move on. We are not God, never will be, and must learn those things and make them a part of who and what we are.

King of cups,

Aren´t you aware that your puny, made up answers and not being asked for here? You have an emotional problem.