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Ummmmm...DOOM!!!!!!!!!!

 
Riker

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05/13/2010 03:07 PM
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cheers
You shall know the TRUTH, and the TRUTH shall set you free.
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Anonymous Coward (OP)
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05/13/2010 03:23 PM
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Re: Ummmmm...DOOM!!!!!!!!!!
BP oil spill response hits methane ice hitch
May 11, 11:07AM
Austin Science Policy Examiner
Steven Andrew

A little known substance caused a big problem for the BP oil spill clean up effort last weekend. And crystals of it are believed to have fouled the containment dome posing potentially greater risk:

The large containment dome did not work because it became clogged with methane hydrate crystals. There are like ice crystals but contain methane and water. These crystals are created when the methane gas comes into contact with water at the high pressure 5000 feet below the surface.

It's unfortunate that so many will first learn of this enigmatic substance through a disaster: the same slick stuff could one day help fuel the world and relieve demand on over strained oil supplies. But perhaps the catastrophic introduction is appropriate in another way; methane solids may have contributed to some of the worst extinction events in the fossil record.

At normal temperatures and pressures, methane is a colorless odorless gas and the primary constituent in natural gas (The odor of commercial natural gas is added to help alert residents of potentially flammable leaks). But deep below the ocean surface, under pressure and near the freezing point of water, bubbling methane gas gets trapped in a watery cage called a clathrate and, through the peculiar chemical properties of water, solidifies into a yellow tinged ice, with one big difference: it burns like an oily rag.

The picture right courtesy of Penn State University shows a deposit of methane hydrate. The little pinkish inclusions in the yellow meth ice are a type of annelid, nick-named meth worms or ice worms, that make a living eating a type of special bacteria that thrive in extreme environments.

It is unlikely that hydrates played any role in the accident itself. Sources in the offshore oil business have told the Examiner that the accident probably started with something going wrong with the cement plug way down the hole, allowing gas to escape up the drill pipe to the rig itself. Coming up the pipe, expanding as it rose, and catching fire at the surface, it would have shot out of the pipe like fire from a flame thrower. The end result was a tragic loss of life, a wrecked rig, and crumpled pipe spewing oil.

The solution BP tried, illustrated left via the Wikipedia, was to lower a container over the leaking pipe section, trap the rising oil, and pump it to a tanker on the surface. But methane ice reportedly formed on the underside of the dome causing two problems. One, it clogged the aperture leading to the pipe and the surface. No opening, no way to pump the leaking oil out of the water. Two, methane ice is buoyant, it floats.

A big enough build up of methane hydrate in the container would change the buoyancy of the 100 ton dome, making it more difficult to maneuver and possibly even destabilizing it. BP engineers are no doubt acutely aware that the combination of those two factors could potentially cause a surge of volatile methane gas up the containment pipe leading, perhaps, to a repeat of the original accident.

Scientists estimate there are vast stores of methane hydrate buried in the deep ocean and lots more methane compounds residing in polar permafrost. Enough that if a feasible method could be found to recover it, methane hydrate might become a lucrative energy source. But recovery issues aside, like all fossil fuels methane is a potent greenhouse gas. It has many times the heat trapping properties of carbon dioxide. And when burned, methane produces water vapor and CO2; it just turns into two more greenhouse gases.

Methane is such a powerful GHG that some scientists speculate it played a role in the greatest extinction event in the fossil record. Paleo-geologists believe that the Permian-Triassic mass extinction 250 million years ago was caused by catastrophic global warming. In some scenarios, this was the result of a double climate whammy: a giant flood basalt volcano in modern day Siberia with a caldera larger than Texas released prodigious quantities of greenhouses gases into the atmosphere raising global temperatures dramatically.

The heat from the newly warmed air worked deep into the permafrost and ocean, and eventually released methane from its icy, watery prison. The released methane amplified the ongoing greenhouse effect, adding perhaps another 5 - 10 degrees F to the already over heating world. Oceans acidified wrecking the marine food chain at the planktonic base, forests withered, soil turned to dust and blew away. About 9 in 10 species perished from the land and sea in the Great Dying, including many fascinating mammal-like reptiles. It took millions of years for the biosphere to recover its former glory. When it finally did, a new kind of creature had risen to dominance: the dinosaurs.

The good news is the disaster unfolding off the coast of Louisiana and Texas is not of that magnitude. Not even close. But for the families of those lost, and the owners of coastal property and businesses that may soon be destroyed by gooey black gold, this disaster is as big as it gets.
Anonymous Coward (OP)
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05/13/2010 04:22 PM
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Re: Ummmmm...DOOM!!!!!!!!!!
BP CEO Reveals Plan B and Beyond for Gulf Oil Spill Disaster


[link to www.foxnews.com]
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 969436


Plan B = bigger joke than Plan A
Anonymous Coward
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05/13/2010 04:25 PM
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bsflag
Anonymous Coward (OP)
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05/13/2010 04:33 PM
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bsflag
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 942000


Thank you for your scientific explanation..
Anonymous Coward
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05/13/2010 05:05 PM
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Re: Ummmmm...DOOM!!!!!!!!!!
Yeah, there is a massive table or shelf of methane ice in Siberia; if that melts Earth becomes Venus...
Anonymous Coward (OP)
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05/13/2010 05:18 PM
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Yeah, there is a massive table or shelf of methane ice in Siberia; if that melts Earth becomes Venus...
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 12252


There is also a massive field of methane in the Gulf of Mexico

[link to www.baylor.edu]

Baylor Researcher Finds Methane Hydrate in Gulf Using New Search Method
Feb. 1, 2010

A Baylor University researcher has used a new search method that he adapted for use on the seafloor to find a potentially massive source of hydrocarbon energy called methane hydrate, a frozen form of natural gas, in a portion of the Gulf of Mexico.

Dr. John Dunbar, associate professor of geology at Baylor, and his team used an electrical resistivity method to acquire geophysical data at the site, located roughly 50 miles off the Louisiana coast. The Baylor researchers were able to provide a detailed map of where the methane hydrate is located and how deep it extends underneath the seafloor.

Located in an area called the Mississippi Canyon, the site is about 3,000-feet-wide, 3,000-feet under water, and has both active and dormant gas vents. Scientists have been researching the site since 2001, but have not been able to ascertain where the hydrate is located nor how much is there until now.

"The conventional search methods have been fairly effective in certain situations, but the resistivity method is a totally different approach," Dunbar said. "The benefit to the resistivity method is it shows the near-bottom in greater detail, and that is where the methane hydrate is located in this case. This research shows the resistivity method works and is effective."

Dunbar and his research team injected a direct electrical current into the seafloor to measure the resistivity of the sediment beneath the sea floor. The measurement of resistivity - the ability of a material to resist conduction of electricity - showed the researchers where the methane hydrate is located. To do this, Dunbar and his team dragged a "sled" - a device with a nearly one-kilometer-long towed array - back and forth over the site, injecting the electrical current. Sediment containing methane hydrate within its pores showed higher resistivity, compared to sediment containing salt water. While the measurement of resistivity has been used for some time, the method has seldom been used at deep depths.

The new method showed researchers that the methane hydrate was located only in limited spots, usually occurring along faults under the sea floor. Dunbar said the method also showed the methane hydrate is not as abundant as previously thought at the site.

The U.S. Department of Energy has awarded Dunbar more than $115,000 to continue researching the site. Dunbar and his team will reconfigure the towed array and shorten the length of it to about 1,500 feet. They also will cluster sensors around certain areas on the array, which will give researchers a clearer picture of how deep the methane hydrate extends and will allow them to create a three-dimensional picture of the underwater site.

An ice-like solid, methane hydrate is found beneath the seafloor in many locations across the globe, usually at depths greater than 3,000 feet. The most common place to find gas hydrate mounds in the Gulf of Mexico are along the intersections of faults with the seafloor. According to the U.S Geological Survey, the nation's methane hydrate deposits are estimated to hold a vast 200 trillion cubic feet of natural gas. If just one percent of those deposits are commercially produced, it would more than double the country's natural gas reserves.
Anonymous Coward
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05/13/2010 06:39 PM
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Re: Ummmmm...DOOM!!!!!!!!!!
We're talking about a huge fuel/air explosive. Think about a daisycutter the size of the Gulf. That would cut the heads off a lot of daisies.


So it would just be a really quick flash explosion. How is that a big thing? What would be the consequences?
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 958499



Anonymous Coward (OP)
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05/13/2010 06:46 PM
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Re: Ummmmm...DOOM!!!!!!!!!!
We're talking about a huge fuel/air explosive. Think about a daisycutter the size of the Gulf. That would cut the heads off a lot of daisies.


So it would just be a really quick flash explosion. How is that a big thing? What would be the consequences?




 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 688490


Truly frightening stuff...

Thanks BP, thanks Obama, Bush, Cheney, McCain, Palin, Lieberman, Steele, Guliani and all the rest responsible for making horrible decisions and letting big oil buy out our oceans...

Drill, Baby, Drill
Anonymous Coward
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05/13/2010 06:56 PM
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Re: Ummmmm...DOOM!!!!!!!!!!
all the oceans will turn black

im happy about it
all you monkeys will die off soon
Anonymous Coward
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05/13/2010 06:57 PM
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Re: Ummmmm...DOOM!!!!!!!!!!
We're talking about a huge fuel/air explosive. Think about a daisycutter the size of the Gulf. That would cut the heads off a lot of daisies.


So it would just be a really quick flash explosion. How is that a big thing? What would be the consequences?






Truly frightening stuff...

Thanks BP, thanks Obama, Bush, Cheney, McCain, Palin, Lieberman, Steele, Guliani and all the rest responsible for making horrible decisions and letting big oil buy out our oceans...

Drill, Baby, Drill
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 942322

0bamanation is behind ALL of this evil.. HC is nothing but one more 0bama whore... No one thinks it's WEIRD how they come u with all this crap.. what? they just happen to have a documentary on this stuff from years before???
0bama is the son of SATAN!!
Anonymous Coward (OP)
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05/13/2010 08:57 PM
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Re: Ummmmm...DOOM!!!!!!!!!!
[link to www.npr.org]

The volume of oil pouring into the Gulf of Mexico from the Deepwater Horizon oil rig may be at least 10 times higher than previously estimated, NPR has learned.

The U.S. Coast Guard has estimated that oil was gushing from a broken pipe on the Gulf floor at the rate of 5,000 barrels a day.

But sophisticated scientific analysis of seafloor video made available Wednesday by the oil company BP shows that the true figure is closer to 70,000 barrels a day, NPR's Richard Harris reports.

That means the oil spilling into the Gulf has already far exceeded the equivalent of the 1989 Exxon Valdez tanker accident in Alaska, which spilled at least 250,000 barrels of oil.

The analysis was conducted by Steve Werely, an associate professor at Purdue University, using a technique called particle image velocimetry. Harris tells Michele Norris that the method is accurate to a degree of plus or minus 20 percent. That means the flow could range between 56,000 barrels a day and 84,000 barrels a day.

Another analysis by Eugene Chiang, a professor of astrophysics at the University of California, Berkeley, calculated the rate of flow to be between 20,000 barrels a day and 100,000 barrels a day.

Even the most conservative of those estimates is much higher than what the Coast Guard has so far said.

But the pipe is spewing both oil and gas and it's not clear in the BP video how much is oil and how much is gas.

BP disputes these results, and maintains there is no reliable way to calculate the flow of oil from a broken pipe.

But, Harris said, the uncertainty could be reduced if BP would share more information with the scientists.
Anonymous Coward
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05/13/2010 09:00 PM
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Re: Ummmmm...DOOM!!!!!!!!!!
How do y'all sleep at night worrying about this crap? The methane has been on the ocean floor for eons. The gulf spill is bringing out hydrocarbons from way under miles of rock and sand. The stuff on the sea floor is the stuff to worry about and there is NOTHING to worry about as long as it stays undisturbed.

The junk that stopped up the first containment is a common ocurrence and in no way related to the methane on the sea floor.

Worry about Katla or Yellowstone. Worry about global financial collapse. This oil leak is bad, but regional doom, not global.

cheers


Ummm hello...

It has been disturbed and is now leaking out of the sea floor in massive amounts..


It's leaking from the bore hole. From 18,000 feet below the sea floor. The stuff on the sea floor has not been disturbed in any significant area/quantity. Doom cancelled.

cheers



It is leaking from a hole 25,000 ft down, not 18,000 ft(do you work for BP?)

And you think this is just coming from just one little tiny pocket?

No it is coming from a FIELD 25,000 feet below...

Thread: 8,956 BILLION CUIC FEET OF GAS etimated to be in Mississippi Canyon Block 252!!!!!!!!!!!!


Found this PDF from the Minerals Management Service from 2005 which estimates the size of the reserve into which the Deepwater Horizon was drilling:

3,528 million barrels of oil (at 60 degrees F)
8,956 billion cubic feet of gas (at 60 derees F and 15.025 psia)

Page 16: [link to www.gomr.mms.gov]

That's a *lot* of freaking gas. I sure hope the reserve is partitioned...




The total depth may be 25K' but the reserviour is at 18,000 feet. And the gas isn't all methane like the stuff frozen on the sea floor. Methane is a junk gas and doesn't have a lot of heat value. Methane is the lightest of the gasses and does get use as a feed stock for other petroleum products.
 Quoting: Maguyver



It's annoying that you referenced that long complicated reference that basically has absolutely nothing to do with what you are claiming. I guess you figured people would just give up trying to figure it out and simply believe your claims without substantiation.

There is only ONE reference to the specific area where DeepHorizon was located and it says that there is a proved reserve of 3,528 million barrels of oil and 8,956 million barrels of gas in reserves. Nothing like what you are claiming because your figures are all taken from those for adifferent site, The Tiber Prospect. The Tiber Prospect was much further down than Deep Horizon and contained/s more oil. Things are bad enough, you don't have to fudge ffacts and figures to make it worse.
Anonymous Coward
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05/13/2010 09:34 PM
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Re: Ummmmm...DOOM!!!!!!!!!!
It would help if people really studied this stuff and then told the truth.

The Methane in the arctic is not melting because it is getting warmer but because it is snowing more up there.

Snow is like a blanket and it insulated the ground and allows the methane to escape.

The fact is if the planet suddenly did warn as that guy is saying and made the forests all burn which we have seen a lot of - this has the opposite effect of warming the planet, it in fact cools the planet because the Sun has the greatest effect on climate by far and if you put a haze in the sky and prevent even a fraction of that Sunlight reaching the Earth you will have cooling.

Look up global dimming and you will find this is our biggest problem and there is a significant amount of it going on. They are probably even managing to set off volcanoes to give them a huge helping hand.

Chem trails and deliberate forest fires are all designed to push this planet into an ice age. The elite are getting desperate now, they want you dead and on mass and nothing will kill you faster than a sudden cooling of the planet, they know this but are trying to prevent you noticing what they are up to.

.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 945308


The methane in the arctic is not melting because it boils at something around -270 Fahrenheit. So I would like to know how there were frozen natural gas crystals clogging the pipe when they put down the giant outhouse looking contraption last weekend.
Anonymous Coward (OP)
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05/13/2010 09:37 PM
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Re: Ummmmm...DOOM!!!!!!!!!!
It would help if people really studied this stuff and then told the truth.

The Methane in the arctic is not melting because it is getting warmer but because it is snowing more up there.

Snow is like a blanket and it insulated the ground and allows the methane to escape.

The fact is if the planet suddenly did warn as that guy is saying and made the forests all burn which we have seen a lot of - this has the opposite effect of warming the planet, it in fact cools the planet because the Sun has the greatest effect on climate by far and if you put a haze in the sky and prevent even a fraction of that Sunlight reaching the Earth you will have cooling.

Look up global dimming and you will find this is our biggest problem and there is a significant amount of it going on. They are probably even managing to set off volcanoes to give them a huge helping hand.

Chem trails and deliberate forest fires are all designed to push this planet into an ice age. The elite are getting desperate now, they want you dead and on mass and nothing will kill you faster than a sudden cooling of the planet, they know this but are trying to prevent you noticing what they are up to.

.


The methane in the arctic is not melting because it boils at something around -270 Fahrenheit. So I would like to know how there were frozen natural gas crystals clogging the pipe when they put down the giant outhouse looking contraption last weekend.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 767801


Because of the temperature of the water at 5000ft...

If thats even the real story...

It didnt work because there is a massive amount of gas and oil, both buoyant being forced out of there ...

The dome had 0 chance, either did the top hat, either does the junk shot...
Anonymous Coward
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05/13/2010 10:18 PM
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Im on dial up and cant see your video, but on the local SE Louisiana news tonight they showed a video, and it was just a Huge white cloud of stuff shooting out.

Did not look like oil at all!!!!

Yet noone says a word about it. Its just video of the oil leak.

Those Bastards!

Looked like Oil and Gas!
Coming out of a sideways pipe?
Wonder if thats the "main" pipe or one of the other breaks and they are not showing the BIG stuff?


Yeh that sounds like the same video.

You guys, Im soooo pissed off. This whole media pacifier that BP is dishing out, makes me want to PUKE!

Even the locals here in SE Louisiana are buying the shit! Our local news literally spends 5 minutes a newscast on the spill. WHICH IS A JOKE! Then I heard one of the local stations report the day before yesterday that the slick itself seems to actually be getting smaller. Like its all OK. Microbes and evaporation are taking care of the whole damn thing!!!

And I had to just scream at the TV. WHAT THE FUCK?????? ITS STEADY SHOOTING OUT OIL OR WTF EVER, AND IT SEEMS TO BE GETTING SMALLER!!!!!! DOES THIS NOT MAKE SINCE TO ANYONE BUT FUCKING ME????????????????????
 Quoting: SwampRatLost 969023



I'm in Pensacola and they make it sound the entire ass-end of your state is soon to be COVERED in OIL!!!!
Anonymous Coward (OP)
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05/13/2010 10:27 PM
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Im on dial up and cant see your video, but on the local SE Louisiana news tonight they showed a video, and it was just a Huge white cloud of stuff shooting out.

Did not look like oil at all!!!!

Yet noone says a word about it. Its just video of the oil leak.

Those Bastards!

Looked like Oil and Gas!
Coming out of a sideways pipe?
Wonder if thats the "main" pipe or one of the other breaks and they are not showing the BIG stuff?


Yeh that sounds like the same video.

You guys, Im soooo pissed off. This whole media pacifier that BP is dishing out, makes me want to PUKE!

Even the locals here in SE Louisiana are buying the shit! Our local news literally spends 5 minutes a newscast on the spill. WHICH IS A JOKE! Then I heard one of the local stations report the day before yesterday that the slick itself seems to actually be getting smaller. Like its all OK. Microbes and evaporation are taking care of the whole damn thing!!!

And I had to just scream at the TV. WHAT THE FUCK?????? ITS STEADY SHOOTING OUT OIL OR WTF EVER, AND IT SEEMS TO BE GETTING SMALLER!!!!!! DOES THIS NOT MAKE SINCE TO ANYONE BUT FUCKING ME????????????????????



I'm in Pensacola and they make it sound the entire ass-end of your state is soon to be COVERED in OIL!!!!
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 966372


Yours too...
methmama
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05/13/2010 11:48 PM
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Thread: ***UPDATE*** OIL SPILL IS EQUAL PARTS METHANE AND OIL *** OIL SPILL METHANE WILL TURN THE OCEANS TO ACID and could make the ATMOSPHERE IGNITE???? DOO

[link to www.youtube.com]


People, do not be blind to the methane issue in the Gulf Leak!!

It is bigger than the oil itself!
Anonymous Coward (OP)
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05/14/2010 12:30 AM
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 Quoting: methmama 966888


Its both

Both are horrible...

The methane has far worse implications though
Anonymous Coward (OP)
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05/14/2010 07:24 PM
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Re: Ummmmm...DOOM!!!!!!!!!!
We're talking about a huge fuel/air explosive. Think about a daisycutter the size of the Gulf. That would cut the heads off a lot of daisies.


So it would just be a really quick flash explosion. How is that a big thing? What would be the consequences?




 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 688490


After seeing the pinned video

This is all just becoming too real now...


Anonymous Coward
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05/14/2010 07:31 PM
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all the oceans will turn black

im happy about it
all you monkeys will die off soon
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 898845

yep.
anonYmous
User ID: 960188
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05/14/2010 07:32 PM
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Re: Ummmmm...DOOM!!!!!!!!!!
bottom line, this worlds majority is too stupid to live.
Anonymous Coward (OP)
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05/14/2010 07:54 PM
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bottom line, this worlds majority is too stupid to live.
 Quoting: anonYmous 960188


Yes we are...All of us, including you...

We have allowed these idiots to tear the insides of earth out for hundreds of years and we just suck it up like the greedy fucks we are...

What happens when you pull the insides out of any living thing...

It dies!
Anonymous Coward (OP)
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05/16/2010 10:01 AM
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Re: Ummmmm...DOOM!!!!!!!!!!
How do y'all sleep at night worrying about this crap? The methane has been on the ocean floor for eons. The gulf spill is bringing out hydrocarbons from way under miles of rock and sand. The stuff on the sea floor is the stuff to worry about and there is NOTHING to worry about as long as it stays undisturbed.

The junk that stopped up the first containment is a common ocurrence and in no way related to the methane on the sea floor.

Worry about Katla or Yellowstone. Worry about global financial collapse. This oil leak is bad, but regional doom, not global.

cheers


Ummm hello...

It has been disturbed and is now leaking out of the sea floor in massive amounts..


It's leaking from the bore hole. From 18,000 feet below the sea floor. The stuff on the sea floor has not been disturbed in any significant area/quantity. Doom cancelled.

cheers



It is leaking from a hole 25,000 ft down, not 18,000 ft(do you work for BP?)

And you think this is just coming from just one little tiny pocket?

No it is coming from a FIELD 25,000 feet below...

Thread: 8,956 BILLION CUIC FEET OF GAS etimated to be in Mississippi Canyon Block 252!!!!!!!!!!!!


Found this PDF from the Minerals Management Service from 2005 which estimates the size of the reserve into which the Deepwater Horizon was drilling:

3,528 million barrels of oil (at 60 degrees F)
8,956 billion cubic feet of gas (at 60 derees F and 15.025 psia)

Page 16: [link to www.gomr.mms.gov]

That's a *lot* of freaking gas. I sure hope the reserve is partitioned...




The total depth may be 25K' but the reserviour is at 18,000 feet. And the gas isn't all methane like the stuff frozen on the sea floor. Methane is a junk gas and doesn't have a lot of heat value. Methane is the lightest of the gasses and does get use as a feed stock for other petroleum products.



It's annoying that you referenced that long complicated reference that basically has absolutely nothing to do with what you are claiming. I guess you figured people would just give up trying to figure it out and simply believe your claims without substantiation.

There is only ONE reference to the specific area where DeepHorizon was located and it says that there is a proved reserve of 3,528 million barrels of oil and 8,956 million barrels of gas in reserves. Nothing like what you are claiming because your figures are all taken from those for adifferent site, The Tiber Prospect. The Tiber Prospect was much further down than Deep Horizon and contained/s more oil. Things are bad enough, you don't have to fudge ffacts and figures to make it worse.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 530536


For one I didnt fudge anything, that was someone elses post...

YOu are right though...Tiber is what everyone initially thought this was...

This is actually the Macondo Prospect Mississippi Block 252 and it was an exploratory drill..

Truth is they have no clue how much oil or gas are in there...
Anonymous Coward
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05/18/2010 07:52 PM
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Re: Ummmmm...DOOM!!!!!!!!!!
bump