105 dead after crash in libya!!

Not getting what this is a big deal... planes crash,cars wreak. oil rigs blow up.

Just a thought: "Unbreakable", with Bruce Willis.

That was the first accident caused by the Iceland volcano ash.
SO IT BEGINS!!!!!!

oh i see.. hmmmm

Why do you say this kind of thing when the BBC reported the skies were clear and sunny at the time of the crash.

You are talking out of your ass.

That's what my ass has to say:
The ash clouds are made of very tiny particles and are not visible to human eyes.
This was the first air accident caused by the volcanic ash and certainly won't be the last! As a matter of fact, there will be many air accidents in the following months if the airlines insist on flying in the region affected by the volcanic ash.

LOOK at about 1:44 on this video......doesn't it look like a car or some sort of vehicle lodged in the tree.....they never mentioned that the plane hit a car.....hmmmmmmm doesn't someine think this is weird?

Just after news of the crash hit here at GLP I looked at where the ash plume was.

[link to www.die.net]
(you cant really see the ash plume now)

It was a very visible stream coming off of Eyja and south down the Atlantic and then it turned and went right across northern Libya. Also you should note that the intensity of the eruption at Eyja picked up considerably yesterday as noted by many of us and several therads here.

... It doesnt absolutely mean the ash caused the crash, but the ash definately WAS going over Libya.

Better Jolie than the Octomom!.

The investigation white wash : pilot error

plane was an A300, delivered in 2009, so right now all the right people are being massaged by lobbies to move to the pilot error. You know they need to do this as it can never be that the plane has something wrong with it.

now this looks like a plane crash site.. bits n pieces everywhere.. 1 survivor..

looking at this.. now i really believe those polish people were murdered after they survived that crash

There are different kinds of airplane crashes... just like there're different kinds of car crashes. Some car crashes are catastrophic and leave the automobile sheered into unrecognizable pieces. Some aren't so destuctive. People still die in each case. Same for aircraft.

Depending on the cause of the plane crash (this could be a bomb, we still don't know), how fast it was going, how high it was, what "direction" it was going when it hit the ground, ect....ALL these things are major factors. Which I don't think are known...yet.

I'm just saying these incidents are complicated. Lets not judge them improperly.

Long live the Dutch boy!!

just what I was thinking

i just don't give a nats ass.. libya?? who the hell cares???
0bama???

[link to www.news.com.au]

Boy, 8, sole survivor in plane crash
From correspondents in Tripoli From: AFP May 13, 2010
4:46AM

A LIBYAN airliner arriving from South Africa disintegrated on landing at Tripoli airport yesterday, killing 103 people but leaving an eight-year-old boy as the sole miracle survivor, officials said.

Libyan Transport Minister Mohammed Ali Zidan said the dead included nationals of nine countries but that 61 came from the Netherlands, which ordered flags on government buildings flown at half-mast as a mark of respect.

Mr Zidan said the boy who survived was also Dutch but the foreign ministry in The Hague was unable to confirm his nationality.

Some nine hours after the 6am local time crash, the child underwent surgery at a Tripoli hospital where medical staff said his condition was not life-threatening.

"The boy suffered broken legs and was injured in the head," a hospital official said after the child came out of the operating theatre.

Dutch broadcaster NOS, which interrupted normal programming to follow the crash developments, showed footage of the survivor with facial bruises in his hospital bed.


Last June, a 12-year-old girl was the sole survivor of a Yemeni plane crash off the Comoros.

The Libyan transport minister said the rest of the dead included two Germans as well as passengers from Britain, France, Finland, the Philippines, South Africa and Zimbabwe, although he could not give a breakdown of their numbers.

He said the 11-strong crew were all Libyan.

In London, the Foreign Office confirmed that at least one Briton had been on board the ill-fated flight, while in Dublin, Foreign Minister Micheal Martin said an Irishwoman was among the dead. It was unclear if she was a dual national.

Mr Zidan said an inquiry was under way into what caused the Afriqiyah Airways Airbus A330 to break up massively as it was landing, but he ruled out terrorism.

He said that both black boxes had been recovered and that four investigators from Airbus and three from France were on their way to Tripoli to join the inquiry.

Witnesses spoke of the aircraft inexplicably breaking up as it came in to land in clear weather.

"It exploded on landing and totally disintegrated," one security official said, speaking on condition of anonymity. Another official said the plane had burst into flames just before landing.

Libyan television showed teams of emergency workers wearing face masks sifting through the wreckage, which was scattered in a wide arc across the landing area.

Dutch Foreign Minister Maxime Verhagen said it was just possible that fewer than 61 nationals died as that figure was based on booking lists provided by travel agencies, not on a manifest of those who actually boarded.

A plane with Dutch forensic experts and consular staff would depart for Tripoli today to help identify the dead and provide support on the ground, Mr Verhagen said.

Dutch Prime Minister Jan Peter Balkenende reacted with "shock" to the loss of life while Queen Beatrix's press office said she was "horrified".

The Libyan transport minister said that the plane was new and had only been acquired by the airline last September.

He said it had received its last mechanical check from German airline Lufthansa in Milan on March 5 and had since flown only 1586 hours.

The crash was the deadliest air accident in Libya since December 22, 1992 when a Libyan Arab Airlines plane crashed near Tripoli airport killing 157 people.

Twenty-two people were killed in an oil company plane crash in January 2000.

In other major accidents, 79 people were killed when a Korean Air plane crashed in Tripoli in July 1989. And 59 people died in a Balkan Bulgarian Airlines crash near Benghazi in December 1977.

Afriqiyah started operations with five leased aircraft and signed a contract with Airbus at an exhibition in Paris in 2007 for the purchase of 11 new planes.

It was founded in April 2001 and at first was fully owned by the Libyan state. The company's capital was later divided into shares to be managed by the Libya-Africa Investment Portfolio.

Last Edited by Aquarius 7 on 05/12/2010 06:09 PM

planes are not natural, therefore will fall on occasion.

this from the above story I just posted:

"It exploded on landing and totally disintegrated," one security official said, speaking on condition of anonymity. Another official said the plane had burst into flames just before landing.


Why would it have burst into flames before landing?


.

Another Airbus?

Mental note: don't fly on one of those.

so what then they crash n burn.thats on them.

My guess: a bomb.

. .

A distinct possibility.

It will be interesting to see what the "official" stories say ...

.

You work for Boeing, right.....??

:roll:

This might be interesting to someone:

NOTAM's have all be in force for the last few months.

Airport HLLT - TIP - TRIPOLI INTL:

A0033/10 NOTAMR A0032/10
Q) HLLL/QNVLF/IV/BO/AE/000/999/
A) HLLT B) 1002211047 C) 1005151030
E) TRIPOLI VOR TPI FREQ 114.5 MHZ INTERFERENCE FROM SIGNAL BEING
EXPERIENCED DURING CURRENT AIRPORT DEVELOPMENT WORK (VOR SHOULD BE
USED WITH CAUTION)

A0046/10 NOTAMN
Q) HLLL/QFALC/IV/B/A/000/999/
A) HLLT B) 1003302100 C) 1010260400
D) MAR 30-OCT 26 2100-0400
E) AD CLOSED

A0061/10 NOTAMN
Q) HLLL/QMPLC/IV/BO/A/000/999/
A) HLLT B) 1003300710 C) PERM
E) STAND 14 CLOSED DUE TO WIP.

A69/09 NOTAMN
Q) HLLL/QMXLC/IV/M/A/0/999/
A) HLLT B) 0906101219 C) PERM
E) TWY(Y)CLOSED

A115/09 NOTAMN
Q) HLLL/QOBCE/IV/M/A/0/999/
A) HLLT B) 0910081014 C) PERM
E) DUE TO WIP NORTH MIDDLE OF RWY 09/27 CRANES ARE ERECTED AS THE FLW:
CRANE COORD HIGT/MSL
TC1 324011.30274N0130857.95222E 129.113M
TC2 324014.06655N0130858.55325E 120.897M
TC3 324010.70549N0130854.71021E 124.799M
TC4 324013.19879N0130855.63737E 135.300M
TC5 324015.96004N0130856.23092E 129.400M
TC6 324012.59968N0130852.39289E 129.700M
TC7 324015.09433N0130853.31757E 121.600M
TCT 324002.99146N0130919.33498E 167.070M


ATC on several occasions have tried to clear people for a VOR APP even though their needle is swinging all over the place - every time the crane moves!.

As of last week the VASI was apparently not working on RW09 and there were several outages (not NOTAM'd) of all of the NDB stations which form the RW09 approach.

Apparently the Lybian DGCA hadn't given their authorisation to the "managed NPA". Understandably. That means that they flew either a "selected" approach or a "normal" / raw data locator let-down (this time, possibly on manual)...or they were on a visual final (also on manual)...

HLLT has no platform ALT to start from, no DME check ALT's only timings once you fly over the beacon by which time you are only at 1350' QNH, and to add to the mix the descent angle (FPA on the Airbus) changes to become steeper once you fly over the beacon.

A reasonable picture of what seems to be emerging (no intention to speculate on WHY):

* Weather at the time and for 45mins after was below minima.
* A preceding aircraft went around (alitalia) and probably diverted to Malta.
* The crew reported on ATC to another aircraft that they could not see the runway.
* Approach was made at dawn, straight towards the rising sun (sea level sunrise 6:11LT)
* Conditions were hazy, reported visibility on ground ~5000m (however in sun-lit haze no more than ~2000m or less)
* Depending on actual time of accident (6:00-6:10LT) the aircraft made some or all of the approach in sunlight, possibly descending into earth shadow shortly before hiting the ground.
* Wreckage field slightly right of centerline, in line with far end of approach lights, short of runway 09.
* The crew 'may' have called ahead indicating they had a 'technical problem' and that ambulances and full emergency response be on hand at landing. (from uncontrolled/unverified sources).
* TV footage of the CVR and FDR being 'mishandled' by people on the scene.
* Number of roads, close to the airport with an easterly direction.
* 3 pilots were on board were well qualified and had their A330 CCQ by AIRBUS Industry in TOULOUS/ FRANCE and has been released by AIRBUS TRI/TRE.

Airbus also may have had an OEB in effect:

OEB 188/2
One Operator reported a case where the flight crew initiated a Go Around slightly below the Minimum Descent Altitude (MDA), and the aircraft did not pitch up as expected. The flight crew performed a non precision approach (a VORDME approach) using the FINAL APP managed guidance mode with the AP1 (Autopilot) engaged during the final approach. This OEB is issued to provide flight crews with an operational procedure to avoid such aircraft behavior. The operational procedure provided in this OEB applies to all Non Precision Approaches, for both conventional approaches and RNAV approaches, flown in FINAL APP managed guidance mode.

But that condition could occur only with a fully automatic non-precision approach. However apparently this is not SOP at Afriqiyah.

RW27 is preferred at HLLT. RW09 is a dual locator approach, yet most new Airbuses only have one ADF receiver.
99% of the time a visual approach without any problems, but if on that 1% you also get RWY09 with visibility at minima, then it can becomes a death trap.

Images:
[link to www.news24.com]