Survival Preparation - #3 in a series: When SHTF

5) Security - Personal and Base

If you're going to bother with having a chemical suit at the ready, I would suggest getting something with the greatest exposure time, which is 480 minutes. The suit may tolerate exposure longer, but are not rated beyond regulations. Even from Dupont alone, there is a huge difference between a Tyvek suit and a Tychem suit.

Agree completely, thanks OP. I will be looking forward to the rest of your info. I have been preping for about two years now, Food,Weapons and power. The rest of my family is not sold on the idea that we are heading for drastic times. My wife is letting me get what I think we will need and doesn't give me a hard time or roll her eyes. From the start of our preps she was behind me maybe 25%, now that several of her friends and coworkers are starting to gather supplies and food, she has come on board I feel about 75% now. I still feel she is like alot of people that need to see something really drastic before she is totally convinced. I'm already there and have been for quite awhile.I really think for most people when it does get really bad it will be too late for them, if they haven't done anything up till now. Thanks again for the info and if I can pass anything along I surely will.

That's always a concern when I hear someone asking about gas masks and chem. suits. With a mask, I have seen that they tend to give a false sense of security. Issues can be compounded if you don't know how to use them properly. I can just see someone running around in ill fitting NBC gear with twenty year old filters that they bought on eBay or at the local Army Navy store. They'd be doing the funky chicken on the front lawn by the time they took four steps out the door.

The filter for the mask must be rated for NBC, many (mainly on surplus market) are being marketed that are only good for N95 particulate or are so out of date that the carbon inside has become saturated with moisture. NEVER buy a filter that has been opened or unsealed!

Alternatives to the suits would be a decent poncho or raincoat - much more easier to decontaminate using a garden hose/sprayer. Plus, unpacking your NBC suit is a PIA especially when seconds count - many of the suits have charcoal in them and also can be saturated by moisture/smells that eventually make them ineffective. It's far easier to throw on a disposable poncho/Tyvek/Tychem - if it's raining acid or a liquid toxin - you should be staying inside!

Here are some good questions and a great link:

Do you know how to put that mask on quickly and effectively?

Do you know how to seal it?

Do you know how to PMCS it?

What exactly are you going to do for decon?

Are you just going to wear the suit for the rest of your life?

Have you ever had a fit test? One size does not fit all..
Do you wear glasses? Does your mask fit AND SEAL over them?

Different filters are used for agents, do you know which are which? and which ones you are getting?

How long is the filter life and how will you change it and dispose of the contaminated filter?

What detectors will you be using to detect said agent/chemical and how will you calibrate them?

Are you aware that an NBC suit is not a hazmat suit? While the suits are designed to protect against a range of chemical agents, industrial grade chemicals are not the same as those used in chemical weapons...if it’s a terror attack and military grade CW are used, well…

While I will not rip on anyone for having these in their kit, because I have them due to living near to two large plants and railroad yard that often contain hazmat materials. I've found the biggest downfall of them is that they need to be within arm’s reach at all times to be effective. That's why I've regulated them to my home kit - its part of the evacuation kit and the shelter in place kit if we're at home and something happens.

Just a reminder -- MOPP level 4 NBC protection is not the same as Level A SCBA full environment suit hazmat protection. There are some really nasty industrial chemicals out there that MOPP gear does not protect against.

You should get a copy of the USDOT Emergency Response Guidebook, which has plenty of information about toxic Industrial chemicals. This book is available at most any truck stop and runs approx $6-8. It helps you to learn the minimum safety zone in the event of a release (for some it is several miles) and the protective measures that you should take. When in doubt, run!

Another good book to have handy is the NIOSH pocket guide to chemical hazards....

These are some things you might want to think about...

Here is a good link:
[link to approvedgasmasks.com]

Please remember I am NOT an expert! I am simply referring to information that has been taught to me, and certain training I have had. Ignore or Use at your own risk

Awesome! Thanks!

I can tell you what the new gold is, the new currency, when all fails and civilization is brought to a standstill.

It is SEEDS. If you want to survive in the post apocalyptic world, have a secret shed, full of SEEDS.

I run an open pollination, heirloom garden myself. I never have to buy seeds. I always have 100 times more than I can plant.

I only save the seeds from the largest, healthiest plants, then from that plant only the largest and healthiest fruit or vegetable. (Old world genetic engineering)

You are the new Rockefeller.

Hey Yep, here's an ebay link to some masks I bought a few months ago. I ordered two on Thursday evening and had them Wednesday. The cheapest I could find them elsewhere was almost 100 bucks. This is the same guy I purchased mine from and got combined shipping.
[link to cgi.ebay.com]

KUTGW, I follow you every chance I get.

By the way, those masks are new, with a 2023 expiration NBC filter.

Very nice!

Thanks....noted.

Going to add a few of these to my provisions.

That "little" inaccuracy is actually a BIG FAULT in that whole program.
They could have "play dead" people like the military does...but they don't.

Reality is.... defensively...those 6 being reasonably well prepared from being attacked could kill most, if not ALL of those 30 if their lives depended on it.

....and in a TOTAL SHTF....TEOTWAWKI situation....well....this would be the TRUE outcome....



Last Edited by Useless Cookie Eater on 09/08/2010 04:52 AM

This is a copy of some information that I recently sent to a GLP'er at their request. It, in retrospect, makes a great UPDATE to this thread, so I am including the main portions here.
----------------
I have decided to approach this in steps, otherwise it can seem a daunting task. The old question “how do you eat an entire elephant?” pertains to survival prepping as well…one bite at a time.

Throughout this message, I may be giving you examples of what I have done to prepare myself for a temporary/extended disaster.

In my mind, and for purposes of this exercise a ‘disaster’ can be anything from a power outage, to a man-made/nature related displacement (flood, fire, wind, earthquake) Political insurrection (riot, gang violence, terrorist activity) all the way up to some type of the end of the world as we know it (TEOTWAWKI) event.

If you have unlimited funds and time there isn’t much you can’t prep for. Unfortunately, that’s an exception not a rule! Work with what you have.

Be honest with yourself, and set small goals and timelines. I believe that work expands to fit the time allotted to a job, so when you are goal setting, please be realistic in your assessment. If you have an end goal to lose fifty pounds and to be able to run with a loaded pack uphill for ten miles, but you have never EVER worn a pack, or run, and can’t walk a mile empty handed, chances are you not make your goal in three weeks. Remember...BABY STEPS, KEEP MOVING FORWARD!

As always, if your assessment includes Phys Ed, please consider talking with your doctor first! Show them your physical goals and get a doctors blessing on your meal plan- workout routine and timeline. If funds are available, join a club and hire a trainer. That will pay off in spades!

Another way to more easily accomplish your physical goals is to have a friend or friends to work out with that have similar goals. Accountability is key…Otherwise it’s easy to cheat! I have a track nearby, 24h fitness clubs (two actually) and a set of p90x DVD’s. I have found three people that want to train, and they have other gear and we take turns leading a work out. It works for me!

In addition, as I have the luxury and curse of being able to work from home, I found out a long time ago that its easy to fall into the snack habit. So, if I am at my desk writing, or if I am watching tv at the end of the day I have a rule: If I get up and walk past the stairs leading to the top level of my home, I have to do 20 push ups. If I am down in my family room at night and get up for any reason, I have to either do 20 sit ups and/or 20 crunches (I do them during commercials). This simple rule has added 100 pushups a day to my exercise routine and anywhere from 60 to 100 crunches. All roads lead to Rome, and every little bit helps!

If you aren’t already walking, please add this to your routine. In time, add your pack and see how you fair. I will ALWAYS tell you to train with your gear. In the chaos of a disaster, even a short term one, that is NOT the time to figure out that your gear does not work as intended, or now you have to hold a flashlight and read directions or instructions because you never opened the box of gear.

Once, I took three self described survivalist on an overnight. One couldn’t erect her shelter because she never did it before, ones food was spoiled by insects and the other guys batteries were all dead. So, at the end of the exercise, one was cold and wet (it was raining all night) one was VERY hungry and the last was covered in scrapes and bumps from stumbling around in the dark!
The moral of this story is that being prepared means being realistic, and being smart! “Prepping” and being a ‘survivalist’ isn’t always about machine guns vs zombie hordes. It can be as simple as having a black out kit (candles, hand crank-battery back up radio, flashlights, matches and lighters and a cheap set of FRS radios) all the way up to creating a shelter to go to in case of a extended disaster.
 

SO, with that wordy preamble out of the way, here is the first thing I want you to know:
10 key Points to Ponder- The Core Philosophy

Let’s take a closer look at my philosophy about being prepared, life style planning, self sufficiency and energy independence.
They (the ‘PtP’ points to ponder) can be summed up with in the following 10 core values:
•1. Everything you do to “prepare” for emergencies, disasters or economic turmoil should be blended into your life in a way that improves your life even if nothing disastrous ever occurs.
•2. Debt is financial cancer! Minimize it, pay it off early and stay away from credit cards. Take action to remove it…get help if you need to reach this goal!
•3. Growing your own food is for everyone not just people that want “organic” fruit and vegetables. To produce your own food, even as little as 10% of what you use reduces your dependence on “the system”. If nothing else gardening is good for your emotional and physical health and increases the value of any property. The barter system works! Trade with others. If they are able to can and preserve, but can’t grow, it’s a great trade off!
•4. Tax is theft, the best way to combat it is to understand every legal deduction you can take or create. In general I think “the system” is bad but when it comes to taxation either learn the system or hire a damn good accountant to work it for you. Every dollar you keep can be used to improve your self sufficiency, every dollar taken from you can be used to make your dependence on the government stronger.
•5. Food stored is an exceptional investment. Food is increasing in cost faster than just about any investment right now and certainly faster than the rate of inflation. You simply can’t lose by storing additional food that you use on a regular basis. Remember~ Store what you eat – eat what you store
•6. Plan for disaster in the following order of priority – Personal-Localized-Regional-State-National-Global. Despite the real possibility of a true economic melt down or catastrophic terrorist attack or some other major global disaster the most probable “disaster” for any individual is personal. Loss of a job, loss of a family member, a fire or localized weather event are the most probable threats to impact any individual. So plan and prepare for those first, then continue to build going forward. Perform a RISK and THREAT ASESSMENT!
•7. Renewable energy is great if you do it in a way that saves you money (short or long term) but your solar panels are not going to save the planet. I truly believe that man made global warming is a scam designed to force the U.S. into a global taxation system. If you want to promote solar, wind, hydro, etc. the best way is to develop it in a more cost effective manner. Fuel efficient vehicles are also great. I know someone that drives a Jetta TDI diesel that puts many hybrids to shame at 44 MPG! That’s doing 80MPH on average by the way. He bought it because it was affordable, well built and incredibly engineered and costs him a lot less to run even with diesel being a lot more expensive than gas. The lesson is that the best way to promote “green energy” is via economics.
•8. Owning land is true wealth. That does not meant monetary wealth! I advise people to strive to own land in the country where taxes are low and restrictions are limited. Even if you live in the city- finding, buying and improving land within 3-5 hours of your primary residence makes a lot of sense. If you can use it to get out of the city at some point so much the better.
•9. In addition to food, water and other common survival stores use common sense methods of hedging against “disaster”. Pragmatic things like, cash emergency funds, good insurance and secondary income streams are not just for people in “the system”. These types of protection can make you life a lot less miserable when something goes wrong. Make them part of your planning.
•10. Your personal philosophy is more important for you than mine! You are the master of your own life and if you don’t agree with my views, great! Define, understand and implement your own. The biggest thing you can do is understand that you are in control of your life and that what you do matters. Those two factors have the greatest impact on individual survival across every demographic you can imagine.

I will refer to these key PtP (Points to Ponder) from time to time throughout follow up messages.(assuming you actually want follow up messages!)

The very first step is RISK ASESSMENT, and we will be focusing today on that single key point.

Performing an RA (Risk Assessment) is vital to your ability to properly prepare! What good does it do you if you have a ‘perfectly loaded’ bug out bag (BoB) and can’t lift it, or walk with it more than a half mile? What good is it if you live in a Flood Plain and you don’t have any rain or water control gear?

Look at PtP #6…then assess your physical health. If you are in poor shape, and aren’t so physically limited that you can begin a work-out routine of ANY type, you have little to no excuse. Like the Nike ad…Just DO it!
Now look at where you live: are you in a flood plain, Earth quake zone, Tornado or Hurricane area? Gang violence is consistently in your area? The basics for your kits may be the same, but your RA will help you detail and dial in specifics that work for you.

Where I live, we have rolling black outs, weather related power and communication black-outs, and several active faults that supply us with the fun of an earthquake joy ride……never any warning! To top it off there are also two petrochemical plants that vent from time-to time creating a shelter-in-place scenario. Imagine if two or three of these things occurred at once? Now you see why proper planning and prepping is not just smart, it can be critical… literally life or death in worse case scenarios.

People that think I am blowing this out of proportion need to be reminded of the Loma Prieta earthquake where the quake killed 62 people throughout northern California, injured 3,757 and left some 3,000-12,000 people homeless. All with NO WARNING! I had food, water, energy and lights, as well as personal security. I was prepared, but still affected. Many others weren’t so lucky.

Here is a good link to learn how this quake affected the area: [link to www.answers.com]
 
Use threat probability as your guide when building a plan to deal with potential disasters.
Many in the survivalist community like to focus on “Hollywood Disasters”...2012, Asteroids and aliens. This includes things like a total economic collapse, an unstoppable virus, a biological weapons attack or perhaps a complete shutdown of the electrical grid. Now please do not misunderstand me, each of these threats is possible and honestly could happen. My question to you is how likely are any of them to occur in the next 30 days, how about the next 10 years?

Now answer these questions for yourself…
• What is more likely to happen tomorrow morning, you lose your job or we all face a complete collapse of the U.S. economy?
• Is it more likely that a person living near a large metropolitan area will have to deal with localized riots over a local issue or that a global pandemic will cause the death of 50% of the planet’s population?
• Will a California resident be more likely to be effected by an earthquake or a global nuclear war?
• In the next six weeks are we more likely to face a domestic trucker’s strike that disrupts the food supply or a global climate shift that destroys 50% of the world’s agriculture?
The reality is there is the potential for each of the above and countless other factors to radically effect our lives, yet if you are honest and don’t buy into sensationalism answering the above four questions is very easy to do. With that in mind I created what I call the Threat Probability Matrix when I formulated my survival philosophy, the Points to Ponder. The rules of the matrix are quite simple, the less people effected by an event the more likely it is to occur to an individual. That statement may seem counterintuitive but it really isn’t, just consider the following line from the PtP #6

Individual – Localized – Small Region – Large Region – National – Global

Now think of one disaster for each of these and ask yourself how likely you are to actually experience this event in the next year or next ten years. You can think of any disaster and then just assign it to one of the six categories and you will quickly see that in most instances the larger the effected area, the lower the probability that it will actually happen. Here are some examples…
• Individual – Job Loss
• Localized – Damage From Strong Storms
• Small Region – City Riots Spreading To The Suburbs
• Large Region – Large Scale Hurricane Damage To A Coastal Region
• National – A Well Organized Terrorist Attack on Major U.S. Cities
• Global – A Rapid Climate Shift Brings On An Ice Age

Again I just plugged in some common disaster scenarios; you can plug in any that you can think of, assign them to an area of effected individuals and like clockwork, as you move from Individual to Global the honest probability of occurrence will decline as the affected area grows.

Why is this so important? Why does it even matter? Simply because if you want to properly prepare for potential disasters there is simply so much to do that it is very easy to become quickly overwhelmed. Due to this many people begin to start preparing but end up “falling out” simply because they come to the conclusion that, really being ready is just not possible. There is just “too much for anyone to do without spending a fortune”, is a common statement I hear.

It doesn’t have to be this way, by considering the probably and preparing for the most likely first and proceeding from there, plans, preps and actions naturally fall into place as you develop your plan. As you progress through you own Risk Assessments and disaster preparation plans you will start to realize that by the time you prepare for individual, neighborhood and small regional disasters you are very well along your way to being as prepared as is honestly possible for just about anything

So, what I would like to see you do first, is perform a Risk Asessmant, and personal health and skill set analasys and we will go forward from there.

Last Edited by yep...itsme on 09/10/2010 01:09 PM

wow....thank you so much for actually caring about others well being to do all this work! question though would our own military harm citizens? I think so but wonder your opinion, thanks OP.

I thought I would add some mature wisdom to this discussion from a guy who has been prepping for over 40 years.

First, which doom do you prep for?

ALL OF 'EM.

Wars have happened before; they will happen again.

Financial crashes have happened before; they will happen again.

Pandemics have happened before; they will happen again.

You can bug out if you wish, but I recommend bugging in and becoming part of the solution.

EMP, for example.


Prep by keeping radios, old cell phones, old computers, etc. in a faraday cage. I buy used 55 gal steel drums with bolt-on tops for $12. Wrap your electronics in aluminum foil, then paper (insulator), and then into the drum. Voila! A Faraday cage.

One of the overlooked preps is cheap walkie talkie radios. Buy a few with rechargeable batteries and a solar charger. Even with the cell towers fried, you can relay messages. You guys are not old enough to remember when neighbors came over to use the party line phone to call Papa with the grocery list.

EMP just means surviving on less at a lower standard of living. People will adjust quickly if given the chance.

For example, if only a few trucks survive EMP, those few will carry critical goods like food and meds.

My biggest worry is the GD guvmint thinking they can run things better than the free market. If that happens, the People will be furious and rightly so.

This is such a fantastic and useful post! Thank you for all the info!
One subject you might have touched on a bit, indirectly, I believe, needs more expansion and that is..psychological survival.

You can have all the best gear in the world and know how to use it but if you suddenly discover that part of your family has been decimated by whatever catastrophic event happened, everything you know and care about is gone, and the world will never be what it was, some of us would adjust one way or the other but some would find it so difficult that they can't think straight for two seconds in a row let alone do what's necessary to survive. They go into shock and never come out.

Any tips on how to prepare to survive psychologically/emotionally?
Thanks for any info you can give. :-)