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NASA Caught Out Again With Confusing Statement Tyche - Nibiru

 
Azzy
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03/07/2011 06:26 AM
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NASA Caught Out Again With Confusing Statement Tyche - Nibiru
Continuing my last thread: Thread: 2012 Planet-X NASA Announcement Spring 2012 - FACT!

NASA Astrophysics Scientists have been confusing amateur astronomers and professionals alike over the last months with there data relating to the possible discovery of a new Gas Giant Planet or a Brown Dwarf Star.

NASA are known for making some amazing discoveries in space using fantastic technology that is available to them. But NASA executives are fast becoming renowned for back tracking and carefully announcing information that can be quite a concern for your average conspiracy theorist, and even astrophysics scientists alike.

[link to articlechase.com]

Seemingly NASA have been caught out again trying to confuse science, scientists and people with crazy logic and rebuttals.

Why are they trying to confuse people with putting Nibiru and Tyche in the same rhetoric, dismissing both as theory, but in the same breathe announcing discoveries and placing Nibiru in the same statement. I don't know it seems like they know something but are really confusing the issue.

Back to my last thread and the WISE discoveries to be announced, this is the WISE statement: the WISE team is busily preparing its data for two big public releases: one this April, and the final release in the spring of 2012.
[link to www.nasa.gov]

And now this from David Morrison Astrobiologist:

The mythical planet Nibiru, if you believe the stories about it, is on a 3600-year orbit that brings it into the inner solar system and is headed for an encounter with Earth two years from now. They could hardly be more different. Please use a little common sense. The name "Tyche" is not any more real than the object, and it is certainly not the "scientific name" for Nibiru.

Not only is he confusing logic and reason, but he debunks NASA's own theories in what he states.

So what is going on - this is getting very interesting.

Oh and ZackSavage :) Thanks for your comment last thread I appreciate it - yes I would like to say i am the former :)

cheers
Anonymous Coward
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03/07/2011 06:29 AM
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Re: NASA Caught Out Again With Confusing Statement Tyche - Nibiru
ahhhahhhahhh
Azzy (OP)

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03/07/2011 06:30 AM
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Re: NASA Caught Out Again With Confusing Statement Tyche - Nibiru
ahhhahhhahhh
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 1287065


LOL yes I know - this NASA Doom - No Doom is getting freaky!

hiding
Anonymous Coward
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03/07/2011 06:34 AM
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Re: NASA Caught Out Again With Confusing Statement Tyche - Nibiru
Should I kill myself before TSHTF
Anonymous Coward
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03/07/2011 06:36 AM
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Re: NASA Caught Out Again With Confusing Statement Tyche - Nibiru
Should I kill myself before TSHTF
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 1287065


no
Anonymous Coward
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Re: NASA Caught Out Again With Confusing Statement Tyche - Nibiru
I'm gonna die anyway, I've accepted god into my heart. Either that or i'll jump in front of a car, you're driven me insane. I can't do this, should I kill myself ?
Azzy (OP)

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03/07/2011 06:39 AM
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Re: NASA Caught Out Again With Confusing Statement Tyche - Nibiru
Should I kill myself before TSHTF
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 1287065


Definitely no - I think calm rationalization comes to mind. I personally think a great discovery and new age for mankind is around the corner.
Anonymous Coward
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03/07/2011 06:39 AM
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Re: NASA Caught Out Again With Confusing Statement Tyche - Nibiru
if youve accepted God, you wouldnt kill yourself, just hope for the best prepare for the worste.
Azzy (OP)

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03/07/2011 06:47 AM
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Re: NASA Caught Out Again With Confusing Statement Tyche - Nibiru
if youve accepted God, you wouldnt kill yourself, just hope for the best prepare for the worste.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 1275414


I'm not sure that anybody should be fearing the worst - this is just plainly giddy exciting times for humanity. And if God is around somewhere, I'm sure he would tell anybody that suicide is just not something that should be thought about.

For me I just want to put this puzzle together and get down to what is happening in our part of the Universe.
Anonymous Coward
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Re: NASA Caught Out Again With Confusing Statement Tyche - Nibiru
And now this from David Morrison Astrobiologist:

The mythical planet Nibiru, if you believe the stories about it, is on a 3600-year orbit that brings it into the inner solar system and is headed for an encounter with Earth two years from now.
 Quoting: Azzy


"2 years from now"

according to who?

Sitchin, the guy who coined the term Nibiru did not give that date. Lloyd Pye did not give that date

Anonymous Coward
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03/07/2011 06:54 AM
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Re: NASA Caught Out Again With Confusing Statement Tyche - Nibiru
if youve accepted God, you wouldnt kill yourself, just hope for the best prepare for the worste.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 1275414


I'm not sure that anybody should be fearing the worst - this is just plainly giddy exciting times for humanity. And if God is around somewhere, I'm sure he would tell anybody that suicide is just not something that should be thought about.

For me I just want to put this puzzle together and get down to what is happening in our part of the Universe.
 Quoting: Azzy


I'm not saying fear the worste.. just prepare, you should hope for the best, until SHTF, but kill yourself thats dumb as fuck..
Azzy (OP)

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03/07/2011 06:56 AM
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Re: NASA Caught Out Again With Confusing Statement Tyche - Nibiru
if youve accepted God, you wouldnt kill yourself, just hope for the best prepare for the worste.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 1275414


I'm not sure that anybody should be fearing the worst - this is just plainly giddy exciting times for humanity. And if God is around somewhere, I'm sure he would tell anybody that suicide is just not something that should be thought about.

For me I just want to put this puzzle together and get down to what is happening in our part of the Universe.
 Quoting: Azzy


I'm not saying fear the worste.. just prepare, you should hope for the best, until SHTF, but kill yourself thats dumb as fuck..
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 1275414


BIG +1 :)
Azzy (OP)

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03/07/2011 06:57 AM
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Re: NASA Caught Out Again With Confusing Statement Tyche - Nibiru
And now this from David Morrison Astrobiologist:

The mythical planet Nibiru, if you believe the stories about it, is on a 3600-year orbit that brings it into the inner solar system and is headed for an encounter with Earth two years from now.
 Quoting: Azzy


"2 years from now"

according to who?

Sitchin, the guy who coined the term Nibiru did not give that date. Lloyd Pye did not give that date


 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 959838


Ha ha you read into it too - that is a very powerful and thought provoking statement by Morrison.

Exactly who gives the 2-year date?
Anonymous Coward
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03/07/2011 07:12 AM
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Re: NASA Caught Out Again With Confusing Statement Tyche - Nibiru
It's always months or years away.... I checked out quite a bit about this, and this conspiracy is too much for me. I can't believe in planet x or any of it. There may be some cosmic doom, who knows, but I don't think it's nibirhu or whatever.
Gazmik

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Re: NASA Caught Out Again With Confusing Statement Tyche - Nibiru
Why are they trying to confuse people with putting Nibiru and Tyche in the same rhetoric, dismissing both as theory, but in the same breathe announcing discoveries and placing Nibiru in the same statement. I don't know it seems like they know something but are really confusing the issue.

Back to my last thread and the WISE discoveries to be announced, this is the WISE statement: the WISE team is busily preparing its data for two big public releases: one this April, and the final release in the spring of 2012.
[link to www.nasa.gov]

And now this from David Morrison Astrobiologist:

The mythical planet Nibiru, if you believe the stories about it, is on a 3600-year orbit that brings it into the inner solar system and is headed for an encounter with Earth two years from now. They could hardly be more different. Please use a little common sense. The name "Tyche" is not any more real than the object, and it is certainly not the "scientific name" for Nibiru.

Not only is he confusing logic and reason, but he debunks NASA's own theories in what he states.
 Quoting: Azzy

It's not NASA that's making the confusing statements. The WISE mission had nothing to do with the hypothetical "Tyche", or the imaginary "Nibiru". It's a couple of scientists in Louisiana that hypothesized that a planet exists that they are calling "Tyche". They are the ones that made the statements that they are excited that the proof that their hypothetical planet exists may be contained in the WISE data. not NASA.

WISE made over 2.7 million images of the entire sky. With thousands of objects in a single image, it's going to take a couple of years to analyze all the data.

As far as NASA is concerned, there is no "Nibiru", and there is no proof that planet "Tyche" hypothesized by a couple of scientists that are not a part of NASA exists, yet.
Azzy (OP)

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03/07/2011 07:30 AM
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Re: NASA Caught Out Again With Confusing Statement Tyche - Nibiru
It's always months or years away.... I checked out quite a bit about this, and this conspiracy is too much for me. I can't believe in planet x or any of it. There may be some cosmic doom, who knows, but I don't think it's nibirhu or whatever.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 737811


I here what you are saying - who knows what surprises are in store for us? there are so many revelations being made it is sometimes hard to keep track. maybe NASA are or are not trying to put us off finding out about a certain doom event.

There are so many options for doom just in our solar system, we have to listen closely to the channel and wires, even try to pull out information from cryptic sounding data.

But for sure the wires are are talking about the same thing - just in differing tones. It is how we decipher that information - GLP is always a great source of free thinking ideology - bring on cosmic sleuths, and bring on the data.

NASA can bamboozle our brains - but they will never hold back the truth - for sure if the GLP telescope happens, then there will be no room for hiding in this part of the solar system... just a feeling :)
Azzy (OP)

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03/07/2011 07:31 AM
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Re: NASA Caught Out Again With Confusing Statement Tyche - Nibiru
*I here what you are saying * OOPS - I hear!
Azzy (OP)

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03/07/2011 07:32 AM
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Re: NASA Caught Out Again With Confusing Statement Tyche - Nibiru
Why are they trying to confuse people with putting Nibiru and Tyche in the same rhetoric, dismissing both as theory, but in the same breathe announcing discoveries and placing Nibiru in the same statement. I don't know it seems like they know something but are really confusing the issue.

Back to my last thread and the WISE discoveries to be announced, this is the WISE statement: the WISE team is busily preparing its data for two big public releases: one this April, and the final release in the spring of 2012.
[link to www.nasa.gov]

And now this from David Morrison Astrobiologist:

The mythical planet Nibiru, if you believe the stories about it, is on a 3600-year orbit that brings it into the inner solar system and is headed for an encounter with Earth two years from now. They could hardly be more different. Please use a little common sense. The name "Tyche" is not any more real than the object, and it is certainly not the "scientific name" for Nibiru.

Not only is he confusing logic and reason, but he debunks NASA's own theories in what he states.
 Quoting: Azzy

It's not NASA that's making the confusing statements. The WISE mission had nothing to do with the hypothetical "Tyche", or the imaginary "Nibiru". It's a couple of scientists in Louisiana that hypothesized that a planet exists that they are calling "Tyche". They are the ones that made the statements that they are excited that the proof that their hypothetical planet exists may be contained in the WISE data. not NASA.

WISE made over 2.7 million images of the entire sky. With thousands of objects in a single image, it's going to take a couple of years to analyze all the data.

As far as NASA is concerned, there is no "Nibiru", and there is no proof that planet "Tyche" hypothesized by a couple of scientists that are not a part of NASA exists, yet.
 Quoting: Gazmik


It's called a riddle of logic *wink*
Azzy (OP)

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03/07/2011 07:52 AM
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Re: NASA Caught Out Again With Confusing Statement Tyche - Nibiru
Why are they trying to confuse people with putting Nibiru and Tyche in the same rhetoric, dismissing both as theory, but in the same breathe announcing discoveries and placing Nibiru in the same statement. I don't know it seems like they know something but are really confusing the issue.

Back to my last thread and the WISE discoveries to be announced, this is the WISE statement: the WISE team is busily preparing its data for two big public releases: one this April, and the final release in the spring of 2012.
[link to www.nasa.gov]

And now this from David Morrison Astrobiologist:

The mythical planet Nibiru, if you believe the stories about it, is on a 3600-year orbit that brings it into the inner solar system and is headed for an encounter with Earth two years from now. They could hardly be more different. Please use a little common sense. The name "Tyche" is not any more real than the object, and it is certainly not the "scientific name" for Nibiru.

Not only is he confusing logic and reason, but he debunks NASA's own theories in what he states.
 Quoting: Azzy

It's not NASA that's making the confusing statements. The WISE mission had nothing to do with the hypothetical "Tyche", or the imaginary "Nibiru". It's a couple of scientists in Louisiana that hypothesized that a planet exists that they are calling "Tyche". They are the ones that made the statements that they are excited that the proof that their hypothetical planet exists may be contained in the WISE data. not NASA.

WISE made over 2.7 million images of the entire sky. With thousands of objects in a single image, it's going to take a couple of years to analyze all the data.

As far as NASA is concerned, there is no "Nibiru", and there is no proof that planet "Tyche" hypothesized by a couple of scientists that are not a part of NASA exists, yet.
 Quoting: Gazmik


Yes but that is exactly what they are doing - WISE has a massive collection, no doubt about it - so how would one NASA scientist know for sure what is on those slides when the data is not in?

if he can state for sure... then isn't that data in already? just a thought for you.
Gazmik

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03/07/2011 07:59 AM
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Re: NASA Caught Out Again With Confusing Statement Tyche - Nibiru
It's called a riddle of logic *wink*
 Quoting: Azzy

It has nothing to do with "a riddle of logic". It's not NASA making confusing statements. It's the hype in the news about the statements made by a couple of scientists that have nothing to do with NASA that is confusing you.

As far as NASA, they admit that if the scientists' hypothetical planet "Tyche" does exits, it may be visible in the WISE data. But the hypothesis is not NASA's. There may be no planet "Tyche" there.
Gazmik

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03/07/2011 08:02 AM
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Re: NASA Caught Out Again With Confusing Statement Tyche - Nibiru
Yes but that is exactly what they are doing - WISE has a massive collection, no doubt about it - so how would one NASA scientist know for sure what is on those slides when the data is not in?

if he can state for sure... then isn't that data in already? just a thought for you.
 Quoting: Azzy

It's not NASA making statements like that. Why do people have a problem understanding that "hypothetical" is not a statement that something does exist? And the scientists in Louisiana are not NASA scientists.
Commutator

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03/07/2011 08:38 AM
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Re: NASA Caught Out Again With Confusing Statement Tyche - Nibiru
Continuing my last thread: Thread: 2012 Planet-X NASA Announcement Spring 2012 - FACT!

NASA Astrophysics Scientists have been confusing amateur astronomers and professionals alike over the last months with there data relating to the possible discovery of a new Gas Giant Planet or a Brown Dwarf Star.

NASA are known for making some amazing discoveries in space using fantastic technology that is available to them. But NASA executives are fast becoming renowned for back tracking and carefully announcing information that can be quite a concern for your average conspiracy theorist, and even astrophysics scientists alike.

[link to articlechase.com]

Seemingly NASA have been caught out again trying to confuse science, scientists and people with crazy logic and rebuttals.

Why are they trying to confuse people with putting Nibiru and Tyche in the same rhetoric, dismissing both as theory, but in the same breathe announcing discoveries and placing Nibiru in the same statement. I don't know it seems like they know something but are really confusing the issue.

Back to my last thread and the WISE discoveries to be announced, this is the WISE statement: the WISE team is busily preparing its data for two big public releases: one this April, and the final release in the spring of 2012.
[link to www.nasa.gov]

And now this from David Morrison Astrobiologist:

The mythical planet Nibiru, if you believe the stories about it, is on a 3600-year orbit that brings it into the inner solar system and is headed for an encounter with Earth two years from now. They could hardly be more different. Please use a little common sense. The name "Tyche" is not any more real than the object, and it is certainly not the "scientific name" for Nibiru.

Not only is he confusing logic and reason, but he debunks NASA's own theories in what he states.

So what is going on - this is getting very interesting.

Oh and ZackSavage :) Thanks for your comment last thread I appreciate it - yes I would like to say i am the former :)

 Quoting: Azzy




In the scientific community there is no confusion at all. First, Tyche is a name given to a hypothetical planet in the Oort cloud by two researchers John Matese and Daniel Whitmire both at the University of Louisiana at Lafayette. By studying the distribution of comet orbits they postulate that a planet exists in the Oort cloud at a distance of around 15,000 AU (15,000 times the Sun-Earth distance). They also look at two surveys that have been done IRAS and 2MASS. Since these surveys did not reveal any large object that puts a limit on the size of Tyche and that is between 1 and 4 times the mass of Jupiter. The eccentricity may be as high as 0.5 but even then, that orbit puts Tyche nowhere near Pluto let alone Earth. Matese and Whitmire go on to say that based on the sensitivity of the WISE instrument a planet as they describe should be visible in the WISE data. However, the WISE data is a large dataset and it will take a couple of years to search through all of the data to know if an object was found. Finally, even though Matese and Whitmire use NASA data they do not speak for NASA. Their paper can be read online:

[link to arxiv.org]

To dispel a recurrent myth regarding IRAS. In 1983 the Washington Post did print an article claiming the discovery of a tenth planet. The Washington Post article took a statement way out of context. The actual statement was that IRAS discovered 9 objects that were at the time unidentified and they could be anything from a distant planet to a galaxy because they didn’t have enough information. What the Washington Post did not later report is that these 9 objects were quickly identified but a follow-up story was never written. These are the papers describing the discovery and identification:

Unidentified point sources in the IRAS minisurvey, Houck et al. Astrophysical Journal, vol. 278, March 1, 1984, p. L63-L66

Unidentified IRAS sources - Ultrahigh-luminosity galaxies, Houck et al., Astrophysical Journal, vol. 290, March 1, 1985, p. L5-L8.

Optical counterparts of unidentified IRAS point sources Infrared luminous galaxies, Aaronson and Olszewski, Nature, vol. 309, May 31, 1984, p. 414-417.

This is a statement made by those involved with IRAS at the time stating that a tenth planet was not discovered:

[link to web.ipac.caltech.edu]

The second thing is Nibiru. The term Nibiru does appear in Sumerian texts and at times refers to the planet Jupiter but also means crossing or gateway. The Sumerian texts also refer to Nibiru as a deity or a star. What Sitchin did was to create a myth about a planet in a 3600 year orbit. Some say it will collide with Earth in 2012 and some say later. The main point is that there just is no observational evidence supporting a planet is a 3600 year orbit. Such an object would have been picked up in the IRAS and 2MASS surveys as well as many ground based surveys that have occured. Also, such an object would affect the motions of the planets. Since no anomalous motions of the planets are seen there is no evidence to support the existence of Nibiru.

[link to en.wikipedia.org]
[link to www.sitchiniswrong.com]
[link to www.sitchiniswrong.com]

Planet X is another term often used. Planet X is the name given to a planet that supposedly influences the obits of Uranus and Neptune to explain some anomalies in their orbits. However, when Voyager 2 passed by Neptune in 1993 a corrected mass of Neptune was determined and the “anomalies” of the orbits of Uranus and Neptune disappear when the corrected mass of Neptune is used. So the need for Planet X has gone away.

[link to articles.adsabs.harvard.edu]

Nemesis is another, even more distant object, on the order of 100,000 AU, considered to be a dwarf star or brown dwarf. Nemesis was a name given to a proposed star to explain the source of comets from the Oort cloud and a possible periodicity in extinction events:
Davis, Hut, and Muller, Extinction of species by periodic comet showers, Nature, vol 308, 19 April 1984, p715

However, Adrian Melott and Richard Bambach discuss the possibility of a star in the outer Oort cloud, such as Nemesis, causing the 27 million year periodic extinctions on Earth by sending comets into the inner solar system. They find that based on the closest approach of other nearby stars such an Oort cloud star could not maintain an orbit well enough to cause the 27 million year events. In short no Nemesis.

[link to lanl.arxiv.org]


David Morrison does work for NASA and has written on the non-existence of Nibiru:

[link to www.nasa.gov]

[link to www.csicop.org]

[link to news.discovery.com]

The “confusion” comes because people are relying on popular media, blogs, personal web sites, and books that are not scientifically reviewed until after printing. The scientific literature contains no confusion.

Last Edited by Commutator on 03/07/2011 08:42 AM
No fairer destiny could be allotted to any physical theory, than that it should of itself point out the way to the introduction of a more comprehensive theory, in which it lives on as a limiting case. - Albert Einstein
Azzy (OP)

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03/07/2011 08:59 AM
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Re: NASA Caught Out Again With Confusing Statement Tyche - Nibiru
Continuing my last thread: Thread: 2012 Planet-X NASA Announcement Spring 2012 - FACT!

NASA Astrophysics Scientists have been confusing amateur astronomers and professionals alike over the last months with there data relating to the possible discovery of a new Gas Giant Planet or a Brown Dwarf Star.

NASA are known for making some amazing discoveries in space using fantastic technology that is available to them. But NASA executives are fast becoming renowned for back tracking and carefully announcing information that can be quite a concern for your average conspiracy theorist, and even astrophysics scientists alike.

[link to articlechase.com]

Seemingly NASA have been caught out again trying to confuse science, scientists and people with crazy logic and rebuttals.

Why are they trying to confuse people with putting Nibiru and Tyche in the same rhetoric, dismissing both as theory, but in the same breathe announcing discoveries and placing Nibiru in the same statement. I don't know it seems like they know something but are really confusing the issue.

Back to my last thread and the WISE discoveries to be announced, this is the WISE statement: the WISE team is busily preparing its data for two big public releases: one this April, and the final release in the spring of 2012.
[link to www.nasa.gov]

And now this from David Morrison Astrobiologist:

The mythical planet Nibiru, if you believe the stories about it, is on a 3600-year orbit that brings it into the inner solar system and is headed for an encounter with Earth two years from now. They could hardly be more different. Please use a little common sense. The name "Tyche" is not any more real than the object, and it is certainly not the "scientific name" for Nibiru.

Not only is he confusing logic and reason, but he debunks NASA's own theories in what he states.

So what is going on - this is getting very interesting.

Oh and ZackSavage :) Thanks for your comment last thread I appreciate it - yes I would like to say i am the former :)

 Quoting: Azzy




In the scientific community there is no confusion at all. First, Tyche is a name given to a hypothetical planet in the Oort cloud by two researchers John Matese and Daniel Whitmire both at the University of Louisiana at Lafayette. By studying the distribution of comet orbits they postulate that a planet exists in the Oort cloud at a distance of around 15,000 AU (15,000 times the Sun-Earth distance). They also look at two surveys that have been done IRAS and 2MASS. Since these surveys did not reveal any large object that puts a limit on the size of Tyche and that is between 1 and 4 times the mass of Jupiter. The eccentricity may be as high as 0.5 but even then, that orbit puts Tyche nowhere near Pluto let alone Earth. Matese and Whitmire go on to say that based on the sensitivity of the WISE instrument a planet as they describe should be visible in the WISE data. However, the WISE data is a large dataset and it will take a couple of years to search through all of the data to know if an object was found. Finally, even though Matese and Whitmire use NASA data they do not speak for NASA. Their paper can be read online:

[link to arxiv.org]

To dispel a recurrent myth regarding IRAS. In 1983 the Washington Post did print an article claiming the discovery of a tenth planet. The Washington Post article took a statement way out of context. The actual statement was that IRAS discovered 9 objects that were at the time unidentified and they could be anything from a distant planet to a galaxy because they didn’t have enough information. What the Washington Post did not later report is that these 9 objects were quickly identified but a follow-up story was never written. These are the papers describing the discovery and identification:

Unidentified point sources in the IRAS minisurvey, Houck et al. Astrophysical Journal, vol. 278, March 1, 1984, p. L63-L66

Unidentified IRAS sources - Ultrahigh-luminosity galaxies, Houck et al., Astrophysical Journal, vol. 290, March 1, 1985, p. L5-L8.

Optical counterparts of unidentified IRAS point sources Infrared luminous galaxies, Aaronson and Olszewski, Nature, vol. 309, May 31, 1984, p. 414-417.

This is a statement made by those involved with IRAS at the time stating that a tenth planet was not discovered:

[link to web.ipac.caltech.edu]

The second thing is Nibiru. The term Nibiru does appear in Sumerian texts and at times refers to the planet Jupiter but also means crossing or gateway. The Sumerian texts also refer to Nibiru as a deity or a star. What Sitchin did was to create a myth about a planet in a 3600 year orbit. Some say it will collide with Earth in 2012 and some say later. The main point is that there just is no observational evidence supporting a planet is a 3600 year orbit. Such an object would have been picked up in the IRAS and 2MASS surveys as well as many ground based surveys that have occured. Also, such an object would affect the motions of the planets. Since no anomalous motions of the planets are seen there is no evidence to support the existence of Nibiru.

[link to en.wikipedia.org]
[link to www.sitchiniswrong.com]
[link to www.sitchiniswrong.com]

Planet X is another term often used. Planet X is the name given to a planet that supposedly influences the obits of Uranus and Neptune to explain some anomalies in their orbits. However, when Voyager 2 passed by Neptune in 1993 a corrected mass of Neptune was determined and the “anomalies” of the orbits of Uranus and Neptune disappear when the corrected mass of Neptune is used. So the need for Planet X has gone away.

[link to articles.adsabs.harvard.edu]

Nemesis is another, even more distant object, on the order of 100,000 AU, considered to be a dwarf star or brown dwarf. Nemesis was a name given to a proposed star to explain the source of comets from the Oort cloud and a possible periodicity in extinction events:
Davis, Hut, and Muller, Extinction of species by periodic comet showers, Nature, vol 308, 19 April 1984, p715

However, Adrian Melott and Richard Bambach discuss the possibility of a star in the outer Oort cloud, such as Nemesis, causing the 27 million year periodic extinctions on Earth by sending comets into the inner solar system. They find that based on the closest approach of other nearby stars such an Oort cloud star could not maintain an orbit well enough to cause the 27 million year events. In short no Nemesis.

[link to lanl.arxiv.org]


David Morrison does work for NASA and has written on the non-existence of Nibiru:

[link to www.nasa.gov]

[link to www.csicop.org]

[link to news.discovery.com]

The “confusion” comes because people are relying on popular media, blogs, personal web sites, and books that are not scientifically reviewed until after printing. The scientific literature contains no confusion.
 Quoting: Commutator


Well I had a good read there :) Thank you.

I don't take either side in this, but I do like to think that NASA are indeed hiding behind a curtain of bureaucracy.

I do think something is lurking--- I don't have a problem they theory at all - the word hypothetical also means a theoretical principle.

Now trying to be all clever and probably failing epically, I want to just prepare myself for some breakthrough in our understanding of the universe.

NASA need their secrets for whatever reason - and because it is human nature to speculate and theorize, we will always have questions and conspiracy.

There is nothing wrong with bringing to the table something different to digest.

So why can't we theorize on the cosmic doom?

At some point in the future it WILL happen, there is no point in hiding and never being prepared.

You can say cry wolf and the next time you won't be heard. I say cry wolf - and the wolf will one day appear. better to have that spear in hand ready in case nobody hears *wink*
Azzy (OP)

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03/07/2011 10:55 AM
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Re: NASA Caught Out Again With Confusing Statement Tyche - Nibiru
I notice in the forum tha Nibiru and Elenin are pretty hot topics today - what happened to create more interest today?
zacksavage
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03/07/2011 11:13 AM

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Re: NASA Caught Out Again With Confusing Statement Tyche - Nibiru
In the scientific community there is no confusion at all. First, Tyche is a name given to a hypothetical planet in the Oort cloud by two researchers John Matese and Daniel Whitmire both at the University of Louisiana at Lafayette. By studying the distribution of comet orbits they postulate that a planet exists in the Oort cloud at a distance of around 15,000 AU (15,000 times the Sun-Earth distance). They also look at two surveys that have been done IRAS and 2MASS. Since these surveys did not reveal any large object that puts a limit on the size of Tyche and that is between 1 and 4 times the mass of Jupiter. The eccentricity may be as high as 0.5 but even then, that orbit puts Tyche nowhere near Pluto let alone Earth. Matese and Whitmire go on to say that based on the sensitivity of the WISE instrument a planet as they describe should be visible in the WISE data. However, the WISE data is a large dataset and it will take a couple of years to search through all of the data to know if an object was found. Finally, even though Matese and Whitmire use NASA data they do not speak for NASA. Their paper can be read online:

[link to arxiv.org]

To dispel a recurrent myth regarding IRAS. In 1983 the Washington Post did print an article claiming the discovery of a tenth planet. The Washington Post article took a statement way out of context. The actual statement was that IRAS discovered 9 objects that were at the time unidentified and they could be anything from a distant planet to a galaxy because they didn’t have enough information. What the Washington Post did not later report is that these 9 objects were quickly identified but a follow-up story was never written. These are the papers describing the discovery and identification:

Unidentified point sources in the IRAS minisurvey, Houck et al. Astrophysical Journal, vol. 278, March 1, 1984, p. L63-L66

Unidentified IRAS sources - Ultrahigh-luminosity galaxies, Houck et al., Astrophysical Journal, vol. 290, March 1, 1985, p. L5-L8.

Optical counterparts of unidentified IRAS point sources Infrared luminous galaxies, Aaronson and Olszewski, Nature, vol. 309, May 31, 1984, p. 414-417.

This is a statement made by those involved with IRAS at the time stating that a tenth planet was not discovered:

[link to web.ipac.caltech.edu]

The second thing is Nibiru. The term Nibiru does appear in Sumerian texts and at times refers to the planet Jupiter but also means crossing or gateway. The Sumerian texts also refer to Nibiru as a deity or a star. What Sitchin did was to create a myth about a planet in a 3600 year orbit. Some say it will collide with Earth in 2012 and some say later. The main point is that there just is no observational evidence supporting a planet is a 3600 year orbit. Such an object would have been picked up in the IRAS and 2MASS surveys as well as many ground based surveys that have occured. Also, such an object would affect the motions of the planets. Since no anomalous motions of the planets are seen there is no evidence to support the existence of Nibiru.

[link to en.wikipedia.org]
[link to www.sitchiniswrong.com]
[link to www.sitchiniswrong.com]

Planet X is another term often used. Planet X is the name given to a planet that supposedly influences the obits of Uranus and Neptune to explain some anomalies in their orbits. However, when Voyager 2 passed by Neptune in 1993 a corrected mass of Neptune was determined and the “anomalies” of the orbits of Uranus and Neptune disappear when the corrected mass of Neptune is used. So the need for Planet X has gone away.

[link to articles.adsabs.harvard.edu]

Nemesis is another, even more distant object, on the order of 100,000 AU, considered to be a dwarf star or brown dwarf. Nemesis was a name given to a proposed star to explain the source of comets from the Oort cloud and a possible periodicity in extinction events:
Davis, Hut, and Muller, Extinction of species by periodic comet showers, Nature, vol 308, 19 April 1984, p715

However, Adrian Melott and Richard Bambach discuss the possibility of a star in the outer Oort cloud, such as Nemesis, causing the 27 million year periodic extinctions on Earth by sending comets into the inner solar system. They find that based on the closest approach of other nearby stars such an Oort cloud star could not maintain an orbit well enough to cause the 27 million year events. In short no Nemesis.

[link to lanl.arxiv.org]


David Morrison does work for NASA and has written on the non-existence of Nibiru:

[link to www.nasa.gov]

[link to www.csicop.org]

[link to news.discovery.com]

The “confusion” comes because people are relying on popular media, blogs, personal web sites, and books that are not scientifically reviewed until after printing. The scientific literature contains no confusion.
 Quoting: Commutator


Commutator do you think that NASA has ties to the military, and do you think that NASA is forthcoming with the general public in releasing all the information it has cataloged of outer space to the general public??

IOW,....do you think that NASA has classified secret information that the general public may not know? under any circumstances?


Hi Azzy!! Another thought provoking thread I see:)




Z
In time we hate that which we often fear.

--- William Shakespeare
Azzy (OP)

User ID: 1223265
United Kingdom
03/07/2011 11:38 AM
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Re: NASA Caught Out Again With Confusing Statement Tyche - Nibiru
In the scientific community there is no confusion at all. First, Tyche is a name given to a hypothetical planet in the Oort cloud by two researchers John Matese and Daniel Whitmire both at the University of Louisiana at Lafayette. By studying the distribution of comet orbits they postulate that a planet exists in the Oort cloud at a distance of around 15,000 AU (15,000 times the Sun-Earth distance). They also look at two surveys that have been done IRAS and 2MASS. Since these surveys did not reveal any large object that puts a limit on the size of Tyche and that is between 1 and 4 times the mass of Jupiter. The eccentricity may be as high as 0.5 but even then, that orbit puts Tyche nowhere near Pluto let alone Earth. Matese and Whitmire go on to say that based on the sensitivity of the WISE instrument a planet as they describe should be visible in the WISE data. However, the WISE data is a large dataset and it will take a couple of years to search through all of the data to know if an object was found. Finally, even though Matese and Whitmire use NASA data they do not speak for NASA. Their paper can be read online:

[link to arxiv.org]

To dispel a recurrent myth regarding IRAS. In 1983 the Washington Post did print an article claiming the discovery of a tenth planet. The Washington Post article took a statement way out of context. The actual statement was that IRAS discovered 9 objects that were at the time unidentified and they could be anything from a distant planet to a galaxy because they didn’t have enough information. What the Washington Post did not later report is that these 9 objects were quickly identified but a follow-up story was never written. These are the papers describing the discovery and identification:

Unidentified point sources in the IRAS minisurvey, Houck et al. Astrophysical Journal, vol. 278, March 1, 1984, p. L63-L66

Unidentified IRAS sources - Ultrahigh-luminosity galaxies, Houck et al., Astrophysical Journal, vol. 290, March 1, 1985, p. L5-L8.

Optical counterparts of unidentified IRAS point sources Infrared luminous galaxies, Aaronson and Olszewski, Nature, vol. 309, May 31, 1984, p. 414-417.

This is a statement made by those involved with IRAS at the time stating that a tenth planet was not discovered:

[link to web.ipac.caltech.edu]

The second thing is Nibiru. The term Nibiru does appear in Sumerian texts and at times refers to the planet Jupiter but also means crossing or gateway. The Sumerian texts also refer to Nibiru as a deity or a star. What Sitchin did was to create a myth about a planet in a 3600 year orbit. Some say it will collide with Earth in 2012 and some say later. The main point is that there just is no observational evidence supporting a planet is a 3600 year orbit. Such an object would have been picked up in the IRAS and 2MASS surveys as well as many ground based surveys that have occured. Also, such an object would affect the motions of the planets. Since no anomalous motions of the planets are seen there is no evidence to support the existence of Nibiru.

[link to en.wikipedia.org]
[link to www.sitchiniswrong.com]
[link to www.sitchiniswrong.com]

Planet X is another term often used. Planet X is the name given to a planet that supposedly influences the obits of Uranus and Neptune to explain some anomalies in their orbits. However, when Voyager 2 passed by Neptune in 1993 a corrected mass of Neptune was determined and the “anomalies” of the orbits of Uranus and Neptune disappear when the corrected mass of Neptune is used. So the need for Planet X has gone away.

[link to articles.adsabs.harvard.edu]

Nemesis is another, even more distant object, on the order of 100,000 AU, considered to be a dwarf star or brown dwarf. Nemesis was a name given to a proposed star to explain the source of comets from the Oort cloud and a possible periodicity in extinction events:
Davis, Hut, and Muller, Extinction of species by periodic comet showers, Nature, vol 308, 19 April 1984, p715

However, Adrian Melott and Richard Bambach discuss the possibility of a star in the outer Oort cloud, such as Nemesis, causing the 27 million year periodic extinctions on Earth by sending comets into the inner solar system. They find that based on the closest approach of other nearby stars such an Oort cloud star could not maintain an orbit well enough to cause the 27 million year events. In short no Nemesis.

[link to lanl.arxiv.org]


David Morrison does work for NASA and has written on the non-existence of Nibiru:

[link to www.nasa.gov]

[link to www.csicop.org]

[link to news.discovery.com]

The “confusion” comes because people are relying on popular media, blogs, personal web sites, and books that are not scientifically reviewed until after printing. The scientific literature contains no confusion.
 Quoting: Commutator


Commutator do you think that NASA has ties to the military, and do you think that NASA is forthcoming with the general public in releasing all the information it has cataloged of outer space to the general public??

IOW,....do you think that NASA has classified secret information that the general public may not know? under any circumstances?


Hi Azzy!! Another thought provoking thread I see:)




Z
 Quoting: zacksavage


Hi Z :)

Ahh it's got me has this one - there is a lot of depth as one has started to probe around and read the literature offered up - some with a lot of hidden meaning.

You have served up some good questions there Zach, I'm interested in what the answers will be :)

And thank :) I hope you are well today.
zacksavage
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User ID: 1222417
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03/07/2011 11:49 AM

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Re: NASA Caught Out Again With Confusing Statement Tyche - Nibiru
Hi Z :)

Ahh it's got me has this one - there is a lot of depth as one has started to probe around and read the literature offered up - some with a lot of hidden meaning.

You have served up some good questions there Zach, I'm interested in what the answers will be :)

And thank :) I hope you are well today.
 Quoting: Azzy


Yes, I do not see how anyone would not have their interest piqued at the synchronicity and mounting "coincidences" in this baffling mystery.

If any one portion of the story in true, even as to the "discovery" of Tyche and it's naming by the two discoverers,...

I find it paradigm shattering stuff worth further interest at the very least. I am in the excitement part of the spectrum myself.

It is a wonderful time to be alive and a bonus to be able to communicate with like minded fellows in foreign countries about the universe at large.


Z
In time we hate that which we often fear.

--- William Shakespeare
Azzy (OP)

User ID: 1223265
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03/07/2011 12:29 PM
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Re: NASA Caught Out Again With Confusing Statement Tyche - Nibiru
Yes, I do not see how anyone would not have their interest piqued at the synchronicity and mounting "coincidences" in this baffling mystery.

If any one portion of the story in true, even as to the "discovery" of Tyche and it's naming by the two discoverers,...

I find it paradigm shattering stuff worth further interest at the very least. I am in the excitement part of the spectrum myself.

It is a wonderful time to be alive and a bonus to be able to communicate with like minded fellows in foreign countries about the universe at large.


Z
 Quoting: zacksavage


The events are certainly becoming quite synchronized in the way they "on one hand" state a fact - then pander to unquantifiable synopsis.

Who are "they"?

They seem to be very clever in the way they word themselves, almost as if Sagan himself is in charge of literary authoring for NASA or the US Government.

I'm finding it very confusing though how one Astrobiologist can state that there has been no such discoveries of a Planet-X or Tyche - yet there are millions of images that have not been sifted through - but as I said on the other hand 2 major discoveries are there ready to be announced - it is obvious shilling of the highest standard.

But what can we make of such obviousness?

An innocent secret of discover or a sinister cover-up?

I too am happy to be able to communicate with like-minded individuals around the world and welcome a good debate with those who have a different spin on things - quite enlightening :)
Anonymous Coward
User ID: 1287390
Brazil
03/07/2011 03:59 PM
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Re: NASA Caught Out Again With Confusing Statement Tyche - Nibiru
Why are they trying to confuse people with putting Nibiru and Tyche in the same rhetoric, dismissing both as theory, but in the same breathe announcing discoveries and placing Nibiru in the same statement. I don't know it seems like they know something but are really confusing the issue.

Back to my last thread and the WISE discoveries to be announced, this is the WISE statement: the WISE team is busily preparing its data for two big public releases: one this April, and the final release in the spring of 2012.
[link to www.nasa.gov]

And now this from David Morrison Astrobiologist:

The mythical planet Nibiru, if you believe the stories about it, is on a 3600-year orbit that brings it into the inner solar system and is headed for an encounter with Earth two years from now. They could hardly be more different. Please use a little common sense. The name "Tyche" is not any more real than the object, and it is certainly not the "scientific name" for Nibiru.

Not only is he confusing logic and reason, but he debunks NASA's own theories in what he states.
 Quoting: Azzy

It's not NASA that's making the confusing statements. The WISE mission had nothing to do with the hypothetical "Tyche", or the imaginary "Nibiru". It's a couple of scientists in Louisiana that hypothesized that a planet exists that they are calling "Tyche". They are the ones that made the statements that they are excited that the proof that their hypothetical planet exists may be contained in the WISE data. not NASA.

WISE made over 2.7 million images of the entire sky. With thousands of objects in a single image, it's going to take a couple of years to analyze all the data.

As far as NASA is concerned, there is no "Nibiru", and there is no proof that planet "Tyche" hypothesized by a couple of scientists that are not a part of NASA exists, yet.
 Quoting: Gazmik


Thanks Commutator and Gazmik for clarifying.

But, then, the situation is more complicated for non NASA scientists working on Nibiru or other hypothesis (if any is doing it on public budget, wich would be odd), if they depend on NASA data. NASA couldwitheld data and/or portions of data in order to delay discovery of nibiru till the moment they want.
Commutator

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03/08/2011 07:46 AM
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Re: NASA Caught Out Again With Confusing Statement Tyche - Nibiru
Commutator do you think that NASA has ties to the military, and do you think that NASA is forthcoming with the general public in releasing all the information it has cataloged of outer space to the general public??

IOW,....do you think that NASA has classified secret information that the general public may not know? under any circumstances?

Hi Azzy!! Another thought provoking thread I see:)

Z
 Quoting: zacksavage


Thanks Commutator and Gazmik for clarifying.

But, then, the situation is more complicated for non NASA scientists working on Nibiru or other hypothesis (if any is doing it on public budget, wich would be odd), if they depend on NASA data. NASA couldwitheld data and/or portions of data in order to delay discovery of nibiru till the moment they want.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 1287390




You attribute far too much power to NASA. NASA does not control all of astronomy nor do all astronomers work for NASA. Most astronomers work for universities. Some get NASA funding but most do not. Funding comes from various branches of government, from the universities themselves, and many private funding sources. Also, not all astronomy is done in the US. There are many astronomers all over the world. So no, NASA is not hiding astronomical information and generally does not even know what is in the data. NASA has to wait for researchers to look at the data and tell them what is there. And no, NASA does not have to approve publications if you get NASA funding. After the fact, you do tell them what publications you have made with their funding and you put in the acknowledgements that the research was funded by NASA.

There clearly are many things that the general public does not know but not because it is "classified" but because it is rather obscure and the general public doesn't know where to look. The information is written is highly technical language in technical journals. These journals are available through university libraries. But unless you are familiar with differential and integral equations, tensors, electrodynamics, hydrodynamics, atomic and quantum physics, and then all of the astrophysical concepts you have to wait until the information is distilled down into understandable packets. But that runs the risk, as seen here on GLP, of errors and misunderstandings.

When you get right down to it, NASA is trying to make the data easier to access. It used to be a lot harder to access data. You use to have to pay to get a lot of NASA data and it could months. The cost wasn't much just having someone copy the data and ship it and the cost of the media. But now all that data is online and accessed for free. NASA has spent a lot of time setting up data repositories. Not just current data but old data too. Old data lets you look at trends that you cannot see if you look at just a day's, week's, or years' worth of data. The only problem I see is that the data are so accessible that people are looking at the data and have no concept what they are looking at. For some reason, people don't ask what does this mean. They would rather make up their own stories and most of the time, those stories are so far off the mark it is painful to read. But the data are really out there and not hidden.

Last Edited by Commutator on 03/08/2011 07:47 AM
No fairer destiny could be allotted to any physical theory, than that it should of itself point out the way to the introduction of a more comprehensive theory, in which it lives on as a limiting case. - Albert Einstein
Azzy (OP)

User ID: 1223265
United Kingdom
03/08/2011 09:23 AM
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Re: NASA Caught Out Again With Confusing Statement Tyche - Nibiru
Commutator do you think that NASA has ties to the military, and do you think that NASA is forthcoming with the general public in releasing all the information it has cataloged of outer space to the general public??

IOW,....do you think that NASA has classified secret information that the general public may not know? under any circumstances?

Hi Azzy!! Another thought provoking thread I see:)

Z
 Quoting: zacksavage


Thanks Commutator and Gazmik for clarifying.

But, then, the situation is more complicated for non NASA scientists working on Nibiru or other hypothesis (if any is doing it on public budget, wich would be odd), if they depend on NASA data. NASA couldwitheld data and/or portions of data in order to delay discovery of nibiru till the moment they want.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 1287390




You attribute far too much power to NASA. NASA does not control all of astronomy nor do all astronomers work for NASA. Most astronomers work for universities. Some get NASA funding but most do not. Funding comes from various branches of government, from the universities themselves, and many private funding sources. Also, not all astronomy is done in the US. There are many astronomers all over the world. So no, NASA is not hiding astronomical information and generally does not even know what is in the data. NASA has to wait for researchers to look at the data and tell them what is there. And no, NASA does not have to approve publications if you get NASA funding. After the fact, you do tell them what publications you have made with their funding and you put in the acknowledgements that the research was funded by NASA.

There clearly are many things that the general public does not know but not because it is "classified" but because it is rather obscure and the general public doesn't know where to look. The information is written is highly technical language in technical journals. These journals are available through university libraries. But unless you are familiar with differential and integral equations, tensors, electrodynamics, hydrodynamics, atomic and quantum physics, and then all of the astrophysical concepts you have to wait until the information is distilled down into understandable packets. But that runs the risk, as seen here on GLP, of errors and misunderstandings.

When you get right down to it, NASA is trying to make the data easier to access. It used to be a lot harder to access data. You use to have to pay to get a lot of NASA data and it could months. The cost wasn't much just having someone copy the data and ship it and the cost of the media. But now all that data is online and accessed for free. NASA has spent a lot of time setting up data repositories. Not just current data but old data too. Old data lets you look at trends that you cannot see if you look at just a day's, week's, or years' worth of data. The only problem I see is that the data are so accessible that people are looking at the data and have no concept what they are looking at. For some reason, people don't ask what does this mean. They would rather make up their own stories and most of the time, those stories are so far off the mark it is painful to read. But the data are really out there and not hidden.
 Quoting: Commutator


Hi Communicator :)

I read what you say with the utmost interest, but freely making data available does not stop NASA withholding data it does not wish to make public.

I agree NASA want people to know what discoveries are made - but they are held bang to rights on cosmic doom by the powers that be.

There are other institutions such as ESA, who have the exact same stance.

Data might be freely available, but it certainly is not going to contain something that would scare the world's populous into riots and crazy turmoil.