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Drunvalo channeling LUCIFER etcetc.. and JIRKA RYSAVY..

 
Ex cerpt from Stan Tene
08/12/2005 09:58 PM
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Drunvalo channeling LUCIFER etcetc.. and JIRKA RYSAVY..
If I had known something about theology - if I had heard about Satanism, Lucifer, the "dark side", angelology, messianism, prophecy, miracles, and the like, I might not have been taken by surprise by Mr. Melchizedek´s wild response when I telephoned him.  "All hell broke loose", so to speak, when I asked Mr. Melchizedek to help to rein in Mr. Winter as he had promised, and as he wrote in his April 1992 letter to Mr. Winter.

Because I was not well educated in Judaism (which puts no emphasis on these things) and because I was not educated at all about Christianity or Islam (which apparently take Satan and the "dark side" more seriously than does Judaism), I was not at all prepared for Mr. Melchizedek´s weird theological arguments.  I was certainly not prepared for Mr. Melchizedek´s threats and his intervention to prevent Meru Foundation from defending the integrity (and usefulness) of our original work from Mr. Winter and his abuses and misrepresentations of it.

I was not at all prepared when Mr. Melchizedek told me that he would not rein in Mr. Winter unless I joined with him and his multi-millionaire benefactor, Jirka Rysavy in "channeling Lucifer."  I had previously heard that Mr. Winter was involved in satanism, but I had not taken it seriously or tried to confirm this.  (Mr. Rysavy was then CEO of Corporate Express and Transecon in Broomfield, Colorado, and he is now CEO of Gaiam, the health food and exercise equipment mega-corporation that is currently taking over numerous independent businesses.  As we know from the transcript of Mr. Winter´s first "confession" (posted at < [link to www.danwinter.com] >) Mr. Winter later worked for Transecon, under a "front" company, set up by Mr. Rysavy, until Mr. Rysavy fired him for refusing to end his plagiarism of my work.)

What followed was like a grade "B" horror or gangster movie.  Mr. Melchizedek not only told me that he and Mr. Rysavy were channeling Lucifer, but that now that he had told me this, if I did not go alone with him and if I did not turn my work over to Mr. Winter, "they (I assume he and/or his Lucifer-channeling friends) would ´get´ me."

I was taken completely by surprise.  I expected Mr. Melchizedek to be reasonable and caring and to help me to rein in Mr. Winter.  Instead I was told about something really sick and dangerous, and I was told if I did not acquiesce, he and/or the others involved with him in channeling Lucifer would actively try to destroy my work and my credibility, and see to it that Mr. Winter got the credit - and that they would support Mr. Winter´s wildly untrue version of events.

At this point, completely blind-sided, I lost it and I got angry.  I wish I had a recording of what I actually said, because that would put the lie to what Mr. Melchizedek went on to claim I said - but I don´t.  (It was incidents such as this that later prompted us to videotape Mr. Winter´s first confession.)  I am sure I told him "to go to hell."  I am sure I yelled something to the effect that it would be more effective to hire someone to get him and Mr. Winter than to use the courts.  I was really angry.

But, it never occurred to me (and obviously it could not be true) that Mr. Melchizedek, on hearing me tell him to "go to hell", actually, somehow, thought I had the power to make this so.

Mr. Melchizedek then went on to fulfill his threat to harm me.  This takes us to Mr. Melchizedek´s letter to Mr. Winter and Mr. Winter´s attorney, Stephen Salai, Esq., and to Meru Foundation´s attorney, Brian Coyne, Esq.

If anyone has questions or comments, or would like to see more evidence or whatever, please send your email to documentation@danwinter.com.

Yours truly,
Stan Tenen
Director of Research,
Meru Foundation
the link
12/08/2005 10:08 AM
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Re: Drunvalo channeling LUCIFER etcetc.. and JIRKA RYSAVY..
[link to www.danwinter.com]
Anonymous Coward
12/08/2005 10:08 AM
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What a soap opera.

stars
Anonymous Coward
12/08/2005 10:08 AM
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Re: Drunvalo channeling LUCIFER etcetc.. and JIRKA RYSAVY..
I had heard this, I have seen Stan speak, I have also seen Drunvalo speak. If I had to choose who I believe, I would back Drunvalo, He seems to be more Loved filled.

Stan seems to be more technical and not as "enlightened"
Pine Eel
12/08/2005 10:08 AM
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alien11alien11alien11alien11
ROBOTdanceROBOTdanceROBOTdance

Isn´t it Stan Tennen?
WIO
12/08/2005 10:08 AM
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68...Drunvalo tries to come across as with GREAT HUMILITY.. until you catch him in one of his lies.

.( his real name is Bernard Parona.. and he said in his bio he took the body of a student in physics at UCBERKELEY...oh, i forgot to say.. out of the kindness of his snakey heart@)

which i have.. etc.. i suggest if you get close to him.. go up and give him a hug.. i did .. it was as though i was hugging a pole.. without substance.. soul.. etc.....his facilitator Dawn said the same thing to me.. and said she thought it was odd.. but didnt know what to think.. i do.. cold SNAKE!

ah ho WIO
Lucifer would never talk to hi
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03/22/2008 01:26 AM
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Re: Drunvalo channeling LUCIFER etcetc.. and JIRKA RYSAVY..
What a soap opera.

stars
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 0



Drunvalo is not good enough for Lucifer
Anonymous Coward
User ID: 397360
United States
03/22/2008 01:29 AM
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Re: Drunvalo channeling LUCIFER etcetc.. and JIRKA RYSAVY..
68...Drunvalo tries to come across as with GREAT HUMILITY.. until you catch him in one of his lies.

.( his real name is Bernard Parona.. and he said in his bio he took the body of a student in physics at UCBERKELEY...oh, i forgot to say.. out of the kindness of his snakey heart@)

which i have.. etc.. i suggest if you get close to him.. go up and give him a hug.. i did .. it was as though i was hugging a pole.. without substance.. soul.. etc.....his facilitator Dawn said the same thing to me.. and said she thought it was odd.. but didnt know what to think.. i do.. cold SNAKE!

ah ho WIO
 Quoting: WIO 0


Who ever you are you are great and so very right.

Also his partners are too / and his wife
Anonymous Coward
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03/22/2008 01:32 AM
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Darkness entombing the minds of men.
Anonymous Coward
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03/22/2008 01:32 AM
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I know and have produced media for Drunvalo and have found him to be a loving, honest and just man. I cannot speak to any other experience.

Peace with you all.
Your brain wash or getting mon
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03/22/2008 01:35 AM
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Re: Drunvalo channeling LUCIFER etcetc.. and JIRKA RYSAVY..
I had heard this, I have seen Stan speak, I have also seen Drunvalo speak. If I had to choose who I believe, I would back Drunvalo, He seems to be more Loved filled.

Stan seems to be more technical and not as "enlightened"
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 0


Is this the brain washing Drunvalo taught you . This is true !

Look at what he doing to Anna Haynes now . What did he not get a piece of the pie . He about money and pushing Zion agenda .

Is this Chris Meyer who push Drunvalo down everyone throat . Then makes sly comment or the bull shit that talks about being
what enlightened or unenlightened . No one enlightened would follow him or Zion
Stean is telling the truth you
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03/22/2008 01:38 AM
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Re: Drunvalo channeling LUCIFER etcetc.. and JIRKA RYSAVY..
I know and have produced media for Drunvalo and have found him to be a loving, honest and just man. I cannot speak to any other experience.

Peace with you all.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 392006



Of course you have you made money from him. This man is telling the truth but you brain washed follows of Drunvalo lies , would not what enlightened means
Anonymous Coward
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03/22/2008 01:46 AM
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Re: Drunvalo channeling LUCIFER etcetc.. and JIRKA RYSAVY..
Well, well , well!

How the flower has opened!
Flower of life no not realy ju
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03/22/2008 01:51 AM
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[

THE WINTER-MELCHIZEDEK CONNECTION
Explanatory Notes by Stan Tenen, written 21 November 2002
Explanatory Notes by Stan Tenen Continued, written 2 December 2002

During the period starting in the late 1980's, when Mr. Winter was freely plagiarizing, bastardizing, and misrepresenting my work, I learned that he had been successful in getting Mr. Drunvalo Melchizedek (a.k.a. Akbar, a.k.a. Bernard Perona) to include these misrepresented and bastardized copies of my work in some of his stage and video performances.

I was assured by nearly everyone who knew Mr. Melchizedek at that time that he was a caring and honest person.

I went to considerable trouble to explain the details of what Mr. Winter had done to Mr. Melchizedek, and Mr. Melchizedek then wrote the following letter to Mr. Winter, and sent me a copy.

The entire letter from Mr. Melchizedek, dated April 21, 1992, is reproduced as an exact photocopy, below. Please continue to read below this reproduction of Mr. Melchizedek's letter for the remainder of my explanatory notes.

What Mr. Melchizedek wrote at that time seemed to me to be straightforward and fair. I relied upon what Mr. Melchizedek wrote, because I was told that Mr. Melchizedek was an honest person. But as it turned out, even though Mr. Melchizedek makes the statements above (which I am going to comment on below), he never removed the misrepresenting, plagiarized materials produced by Mr. Winter from his videotapes, and he continued to perform on the same stage alongside Mr. Winter. But I didn't know this at the time.

As you can see from the letter, Mr. Melchizedek is addressing Mr. Winter personally, and he makes it clear that:

1) "Stan is right." --First paragraph, from Mr. Melchizedek's April 1992 letter, above.

2) Mr. Melchizedek makes it clear that the offending work is in Mr. Winter's now-prohibited "The Alphabet of the H)EART(H", and that it includes plagiarism of Mr. Melchizedek's work as well. --Second paragraph, from Mr. Melchizedek's April 1992 letter, above.

3) Mr. Melchizedek makes it clear that he would not have protested if the situation were not continuing.

Mr. Melchizedek tells Mr. Winter to stop referring to him and his work as well. --Third paragraph, from Mr. Melchizedek's April 1992 letter, above.

4) Mr. Melchizedek clearly states that he is aware that Mr. Winter claims that he does not believe in copyright laws.

Mr. Melchizedek says, "...Copyrighted works belong to the owners of those works. If you take them, you can not only hurt people, you are stealing."

Mr. Melchizedek states that "The end does not justify the means." And, he advises Mr. Winter that "giving full credit to other people is a great example of unity." --Fourth paragraph from Mr. Melchizedek's April 1992 letter, above.

5) Mr. Melchizedek personally signs his letter to Mr. Winter, "In love and service," and sends the original to Mr. Winter and a copy to Stan Tenen.


If Mr. Melchizedek had stood by what he wrote here, there would have been no further problem. I had no way of knowing that Mr. Melchizedek did not intend to honor what he wrote here, and that in fact he was acting exactly the opposite to what he wrote.

The fact is that Mr. Melchizedek, as it turns out, did not act according to what he wrote, and that he continued to support Mr. Winter, and perform alongside of Mr. Winter. So, while I believed that Mr. Melchizedek was acting responsibly, as he had written, behind my back Mr. Melchizedek and Mr. Winter were having a good laugh at my expense -- and making a good deal of money, and gaining a good deal of credit for work they had never done.

About three years later, when all attempts to reach an understanding with Mr. Winter with regard to his plagiarism and disparagement had failed and we found ourselves in United States Federal District Court, I made an effort to contact Mr. Melchizedek and engage his assistance in reining in Mr. Winter so as to avoid having to use the court system.

The results of this attempt to make things better were disastrous. It turned out that Mr. Melchizedek had never kept his word, and when I pressed him, the situation became ugly.

Here are excerpts from Mr. Winter's first "confession," his sworn Deposition held on 25 May 1998 in Rochester, New York. They are self-explanatory. (Additional excerpts from Mr. Winter's 25 May 1998 deposition, covering other topics, are posted at www.danwinter.com/DWDepXcrpt.html.)

DEPOSITION OF DANIEL E. WINTER, 25 May, 1998
Rochester, New York, USA

Excerpts Taken 21 November 2002

This is an accurate and true copy. A few minor spelling errors have been corrected.

[NOTE: "Q" indicates a question by Mr. Coyne, the attorney for the Plaintiffs. "A" indicates an answer by Mr. Winter.]

Page 50 line 5 -- page 53 line 5

Q. What relationship did you have with Drunvalo Melchizedek?

A. I've known him for a long time.

Q. Well --

A. I know what letter he's referring to.

MR. TENEN: Why don't you identify it?

Q. I'll hand you a one-page document. Do you recognize that?

A. Yes.

Q. Is that a letter of April 21, 1992?

A. Right.

Q. Is that from Drunvalo Melchizedek to yourself?

A. Yes.

Q. Do you remember that letter?

A. Yes, very well.

Q. If I may have it for a minute. In this letter is Mr. Drunvalo Melchizedek telling you he wants you to stop using his work?

A. He's saying he believed I made a mistake in using alphabet letter forms that were related to Stan's work. That's basically what --

Q. How did you take the sentence --

MR. TENEN: Just read the letter. Did you receive that letter?

MR. WINTER: Yes.

MR. TENEN: Did you honor it?

MR. WINTER: I guess I'm honoring it now.

Q. Didn't he point out what he considered an infraction of his work and then said, “If this was the only infraction of my work I probably would never say anything; but given the degree that this plagiarism seems to be occurring between myself, Stan Tenen, and others, I feel I must ask you to stop using any reference to my work or my name."
Did he say that?

A. Yes.

Q. Nevertheless, after that you had a business relationship with him, didn't you?

A. Well, they invited me to come there and share on several occasions.

Q. Where is “there”?

A. In Arizona. On those occasions I was very careful not to show alphabet --

MR. TENEN: Are you aware of ever receiving funding from the same source that you received funding, ultimately from Transecon?

MR. WINTER: There was a connection. I'm not sure --

MR. TENEN: Do you know how much money they were given?

MR. WINTER: (No response.)

MR. TENEN: Well, this is people you'd been working with.

MR. WINTER: Do I know how much money --

MR. TENEN: Did you receive compensation from them?

MR. WINTER: From Flower of Life?

MR. TENEN: Or Ron Holt or Drunvalo Melchizedek or Hummingbird, or someone funding both jointly with you as part of it.

MR. WINTER: Okay, well, let's try to be real specific here. When I gave the talk out there in Arizona, I received about $300 to give the talk, and I made sure -- I'm pretty sure I was very careful not to show any alphabet letter forms. Do I know how much money Transecon gave to Drunvalo? I don't know. I do know there was a business relationship that had to do with the center they purchased and that it was a very considerable --

MR. TENEN: Mr. Melchizedek wrote that and signed it as working for Hummingbird. What about Hummingbird?

MR. WINTER: Hummingbird is a name Drunvalo Melchizedek has used for a long time. I'm not sure -- I know he still uses that word sometimes as his E-mail addresses.

[END OF EXCERPT]

Mr. Winter identifies, acknowledges, and verifies the authenticity of Mr. Melchizedek's April 21, 1992 letter to him, exactly as posted above.

While admitting as little as possible, and greatly minimizing the funds involved, Mr. Winter tells us that he continued to perform with and for Mr. Melchizedek, and the Flower of Life. When Mr. Winter says he was "very careful not to show any alphabet letter forms," he is lying by leaving the misimpression that he did not show my sculpture(s). Mr. Winter did show my copyright sculpture(s). The alphabet, and/or letters, are not the issue, and Mr. Winter later admitted this overly clever self-serving misdirection in his second "confession".

I would like people to consider the situation step by step, in chronological order, so I will continue to present documents written by Mr. Melchizedek in later postings.

If anyone has questions or comments, or would like to see more evidence or whatever, please send your email to documentation@danwinter.com.

Yours truly,
Stan Tenen
Director of Research,
Meru Foundation


THE WINTER-MELCHIZEDEK CONNECTION - CONTINUED: Mr. Melchizedek's Second Letter
Explanatory Notes by Stan Tenen, written 2 December 2002

I think it would be helpful to fill in some background information, before presenting Mr. Melchizedek's second letter.

Mr. Winter has tried to excuse his thievery and abuse of my work by claiming that he was only "sharing" information that I was trying to keep secret, because I was some sort of selfish and fanatically religious "Jewish priest keeping the secrets of immortality for the Jews alone." (Several of Mr. Winter's outraged and naive followers have self-righteously and innocently screamed this insanity at me personally on the phone.) It serves Mr. Winter when people think I am a fanatically religious Jew. Actually this has never been true.

It is true that I was first motivated to want to help to solve the Palestinian-Israeli conflict when I was in Jerusalem for the first time, and saw for myself that the situation was serious. I did not plan to be in Jerusalem. I was there on a fluke, because a friend had invited me to visit (in part to visit the world famous Bahai Shrine in Haifa) and because my work situation provided an opportunity for the first vacation I had had in 3-years. I also stopped in London and Paris - this was a vacation. - It was not some lunatic scene from the annals of a deluded person visiting Jerusalem and coming down with the well-known mental condition known as "the Jerusalem syndrome." (I was offered a job in an optical-electronics start-up in Haifa, but I didn't take it.)

Until Mr. Winter stole and bastardized my work, it didn't occur to me that I was researching teachings that had been preserved by the dedicated efforts of people of faith and people of science for thousands of years - without myself giving them adequate credit.

Until Mr. Winter stole from me, it never occurred to me that I had a responsibility to respect the sensibilities and feelings of the communities of faith and science that had preserved the raw data I was working from.

In other words, I'm not a particularly good Jew (and I am not a Jewish priest, as Mr. Winter admitted in his Corrective Notice, even he knew this was untrue), but - because of the Golden Rule - and because Mr. Winter was stealing from me, I decided to "give credit where credit is due." I decided - in the words of Jesse Jackson - to not just "talk the talk", but to also "walk the walk." And I decided to do this by honoring my family's religion (which I previously paid no attention to) by not working on Saturdays and by eating (almost completely) vegetarian (so I would be honoring the kosher laws and eating healthy at the same time.)

This is the extent of my fanaticism: I take off one day a week and I eat healthy vegetarian food. Many millions of other normal, non-fanatic, believers and unbelievers, saints, sinners, infidels, scientists, agnostics, etc. etc. do the same thing.

I must admit that as a careful and skeptical scientist I am strict with the truth and integrity of my data and findings. It is just not possible to do good science that has real value in the world without telling the truth and standing up for the truth. All religions teach truthfulness, but this is not my reason for sticking to the truth, providing full and honest findings in context (that is the whole truth), and standing up for it. In science, misrepresentation and sloppiness with regard to the truth destroys credibility.

Because I went to the New York City public schools and did not have a religious education, I never paid much attention to religion and I knew nothing about theology. I studied just enough of the Hebrew alphabet to be able to read at my Bar Mitzvah, and then I had no other connection to anything religious - and I never looked back - until Mr. Winter's thievery reminded me to "give credit where credit is due."

There were more Native Americans from the Mohawk Nation and religious Catholics (who left school early on Wednesdays so they could go to parochial school) in my classes, than there were religious Jews.

Interestingly, Mr. Winter's only education was in theology and psychology. Mr. Winter had a full religious education (and little other education.) Mr. Winter attended Catholic parochial schools and got his B.A. in Psychology - his only credential - at the Catholic University of Detroit. (Mr. Winter admitted under oath that he was lying when he claimed he did graduate work for Prof. Al Ax at U. Detroit, and he confessed that he did not do any other undergraduate or graduate work either.)

In contrast, I was educated to be a honest skeptic, I had no exposure to theology, and I had no training in the use of psychological techniques and pseudo-scientific jargon like the sort of clever double-talk that Mr. Winter (and Mr. Melchizedek) use to get people to believe. I have a B.S. in Physics (minor in Mathematics) from the decidedly non-religious, mechanistic, techno-nerd, Polytechnic Institute of Brooklyn (now the Polytechnic University of New York in Brooklyn.) My work is published in peer-reviewed science and consciousness journals, and I serve on the editorial advisory board of the Science and the Primacy of Consciousness series, along with highly respected "name brand" scholars and scientists with more Ph.D.s than I have fingers and toes.

If I had known something about theology - if I had heard about Satanism, Lucifer, the "dark side", angelology, messianism, prophecy, miracles, and the like, I might not have been taken by surprise by Mr. Melchizedek's wild response when I telephoned him. "All hell broke loose", so to speak, when I asked Mr. Melchizedek to help to rein in Mr. Winter as he had promised, and as he wrote in his April 1992 letter to Mr. Winter.

Because I was not well educated in Judaism (which puts no emphasis on these things) and because I was not educated at all about Christianity or Islam (which apparently take Satan and the "dark side" more seriously than does Judaism), I was not at all prepared for Mr. Melchizedek's weird theological arguments. I was certainly not prepared for Mr. Melchizedek's threats and his intervention to prevent Meru Foundation from defending the integrity (and usefulness) of our original work from Mr. Winter and his abuses and misrepresentations of it.

I was not at all prepared when Mr. Melchizedek told me that he would not rein in Mr. Winter unless I joined with him and his multi-millionaire benefactor, Jirka Rysavy in "channeling Lucifer." I had previously heard that Mr. Winter was involved in satanism, but I had not taken it seriously or tried to confirm this. (Mr. Rysavy was then CEO of Corporate Express and Transecon in Broomfield, Colorado, and he is now CEO of Gaiam, the health food and exercise equipment mega-corporation that is currently taking over numerous independent businesses. As we know from the transcript of Mr. Winter's first "confession" (posted at < [link to www.danwinter.com] Mr. Winter later worked for Transecon, under a "front" company, set up by Mr. Rysavy, until Mr. Rysavy fired him for refusing to end his plagiarism of my work.)

What followed was like a grade "B" horror or gangster movie. Mr. Melchizedek not only told me that he and Mr. Rysavy were channeling Lucifer, but that now that he had told me this, if I did not go alone with him and if I did not turn my work over to Mr. Winter, "they (I assume he and/or his Lucifer-channeling friends) would 'get' me."

I was taken completely by surprise. I expected Mr. Melchizedek to be reasonable and caring and to help me to rein in Mr. Winter. Instead I was told about something really sick and dangerous, and I was told if I did not acquiesce, he and/or the others involved with him in channeling Lucifer would actively try to destroy my work and my credibility, and see to it that Mr. Winter got the credit - and that they would support Mr. Winter's wildly untrue version of events.

At this point, completely blind-sided, I lost it and I got angry. I wish I had a recording of what I actually said, because that would put the lie to what Mr. Melchizedek went on to claim I said - but I don't. (It was incidents such as this that later prompted us to videotape Mr. Winter's first confession.) I am sure I told him "to go to hell." I am sure I yelled something to the effect that it would be more effective to hire someone to get him and Mr. Winter than to use the courts. I was really angry.

But, it never occurred to me (and obviously it could not be true) that Mr. Melchizedek, on hearing me tell him to "go to hell", actually, somehow, thought I had the power to make this so.

Mr. Melchizedek then went on to fulfill his threat to harm me. This takes us to Mr. Melchizedek's letter to Mr. Winter and Mr. Winter's attorney, Stephen Salai, Esq., and to Meru Foundation's attorney, Brian Coyne, Esq.

If anyone has questions or comments, or would like to see more evidence or whatever, please send your email to documentation@danwinter.com.

Yours truly,
Stan Tenen
Director of Research,
Meru Foundation



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quote:Ex cerpt from Stan Tene 0]
If I had known something about theology - if I had heard about Satanism, Lucifer, the "dark side", angelology, messianism, prophecy, miracles, and the like, I might not have been taken by surprise by Mr. Melchizedek´s wild response when I telephoned him. "All hell broke loose", so to speak, when I asked Mr. Melchizedek to help to rein in Mr. Winter as he had promised, and as he wrote in his April 1992 letter to Mr. Winter.

Because I was not well educated in Judaism (which puts no emphasis on these things) and because I was not educated at all about Christianity or Islam (which apparently take Satan and the "dark side" more seriously than does Judaism), I was not at all prepared for Mr. Melchizedek´s weird theological arguments. I was certainly not prepared for Mr. Melchizedek´s threats and his intervention to prevent Meru Foundation from defending the integrity (and usefulness) of our original work from Mr. Winter and his abuses and misrepresentations of it.

I was not at all prepared when Mr. Melchizedek told me that he would not rein in Mr. Winter unless I joined with him and his multi-millionaire benefactor, Jirka Rysavy in "channeling Lucifer." I had previously heard that Mr. Winter was involved in satanism, but I had not taken it seriously or tried to confirm this. (Mr. Rysavy was then CEO of Corporate Express and Transecon in Broomfield, Colorado, and he is now CEO of Gaiam, the health food and exercise equipment mega-corporation that is currently taking over numerous independent businesses. As we know from the transcript of Mr. Winter´s first "confession" (posted at < [link to www.danwinter.com] Mr. Winter later worked for Transecon, under a "front" company, set up by Mr. Rysavy, until Mr. Rysavy fired him for refusing to end his plagiarism of my work.)

What followed was like a grade "B" horror or gangster movie. Mr. Melchizedek not only told me that he and Mr. Rysavy were channeling Lucifer, but that now that he had told me this, if I did not go alone with him and if I did not turn my work over to Mr. Winter, "they (I assume he and/or his Lucifer-channeling friends) would ´get´ me."

I was taken completely by surprise. I expected Mr. Melchizedek to be reasonable and caring and to help me to rein in Mr. Winter. Instead I was told about something really sick and dangerous, and I was told if I did not acquiesce, he and/or the others involved with him in channeling Lucifer would actively try to destroy my work and my credibility, and see to it that Mr. Winter got the credit - and that they would support Mr. Winter´s wildly untrue version of events.

At this point, completely blind-sided, I lost it and I got angry. I wish I had a recording of what I actually said, because that would put the lie to what Mr. Melchizedek went on to claim I said - but I don´t. (It was incidents such as this that later prompted us to videotape Mr. Winter´s first confession.) I am sure I told him "to go to hell." I am sure I yelled something to the effect that it would be more effective to hire someone to get him and Mr. Winter than to use the courts. I was really angry.

But, it never occurred to me (and obviously it could not be true) that Mr. Melchizedek, on hearing me tell him to "go to hell", actually, somehow, thought I had the power to make this so.

Mr. Melchizedek then went on to fulfill his threat to harm me. This takes us to Mr. Melchizedek´s letter to Mr. Winter and Mr. Winter´s attorney, Stephen Salai, Esq., and to Meru Foundation´s attorney, Brian Coyne, Esq.

If anyone has questions or comments, or would like to see more evidence or whatever, please send your email to documentation@danwinter.com.

Yours truly,
Stan Tenen
Director of Research,
Meru Foundation
Flower of life no not realy ju
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[

THE WINTER-MELCHIZEDEK CONNECTION
Explanatory Notes by Stan Tenen, written 21 November 2002
Explanatory Notes by Stan Tenen Continued, written 2 December 2002

During the period starting in the late 1980's, when Mr. Winter was freely plagiarizing, bastardizing, and misrepresenting my work, I learned that he had been successful in getting Mr. Drunvalo Melchizedek (a.k.a. Akbar, a.k.a. Bernard Perona) to include these misrepresented and bastardized copies of my work in some of his stage and video performances.

I was assured by nearly everyone who knew Mr. Melchizedek at that time that he was a caring and honest person.

I went to considerable trouble to explain the details of what Mr. Winter had done to Mr. Melchizedek, and Mr. Melchizedek then wrote the following letter to Mr. Winter, and sent me a copy.

The entire letter from Mr. Melchizedek, dated April 21, 1992, is reproduced as an exact photocopy, below. Please continue to read below this reproduction of Mr. Melchizedek's letter for the remainder of my explanatory notes.

What Mr. Melchizedek wrote at that time seemed to me to be straightforward and fair. I relied upon what Mr. Melchizedek wrote, because I was told that Mr. Melchizedek was an honest person. But as it turned out, even though Mr. Melchizedek makes the statements above (which I am going to comment on below), he never removed the misrepresenting, plagiarized materials produced by Mr. Winter from his videotapes, and he continued to perform on the same stage alongside Mr. Winter. But I didn't know this at the time.

As you can see from the letter, Mr. Melchizedek is addressing Mr. Winter personally, and he makes it clear that:

1) "Stan is right." --First paragraph, from Mr. Melchizedek's April 1992 letter, above.

2) Mr. Melchizedek makes it clear that the offending work is in Mr. Winter's now-prohibited "The Alphabet of the H)EART(H", and that it includes plagiarism of Mr. Melchizedek's work as well. --Second paragraph, from Mr. Melchizedek's April 1992 letter, above.

3) Mr. Melchizedek makes it clear that he would not have protested if the situation were not continuing.

Mr. Melchizedek tells Mr. Winter to stop referring to him and his work as well. --Third paragraph, from Mr. Melchizedek's April 1992 letter, above.

4) Mr. Melchizedek clearly states that he is aware that Mr. Winter claims that he does not believe in copyright laws.

Mr. Melchizedek says, "...Copyrighted works belong to the owners of those works. If you take them, you can not only hurt people, you are stealing."

Mr. Melchizedek states that "The end does not justify the means." And, he advises Mr. Winter that "giving full credit to other people is a great example of unity." --Fourth paragraph from Mr. Melchizedek's April 1992 letter, above.

5) Mr. Melchizedek personally signs his letter to Mr. Winter, "In love and service," and sends the original to Mr. Winter and a copy to Stan Tenen.


If Mr. Melchizedek had stood by what he wrote here, there would have been no further problem. I had no way of knowing that Mr. Melchizedek did not intend to honor what he wrote here, and that in fact he was acting exactly the opposite to what he wrote.

The fact is that Mr. Melchizedek, as it turns out, did not act according to what he wrote, and that he continued to support Mr. Winter, and perform alongside of Mr. Winter. So, while I believed that Mr. Melchizedek was acting responsibly, as he had written, behind my back Mr. Melchizedek and Mr. Winter were having a good laugh at my expense -- and making a good deal of money, and gaining a good deal of credit for work they had never done.

About three years later, when all attempts to reach an understanding with Mr. Winter with regard to his plagiarism and disparagement had failed and we found ourselves in United States Federal District Court, I made an effort to contact Mr. Melchizedek and engage his assistance in reining in Mr. Winter so as to avoid having to use the court system.

The results of this attempt to make things better were disastrous. It turned out that Mr. Melchizedek had never kept his word, and when I pressed him, the situation became ugly.

Here are excerpts from Mr. Winter's first "confession," his sworn Deposition held on 25 May 1998 in Rochester, New York. They are self-explanatory. (Additional excerpts from Mr. Winter's 25 May 1998 deposition, covering other topics, are posted at www.danwinter.com/DWDepXcrpt.html.)

DEPOSITION OF DANIEL E. WINTER, 25 May, 1998
Rochester, New York, USA

Excerpts Taken 21 November 2002

This is an accurate and true copy. A few minor spelling errors have been corrected.

[NOTE: "Q" indicates a question by Mr. Coyne, the attorney for the Plaintiffs. "A" indicates an answer by Mr. Winter.]

Page 50 line 5 -- page 53 line 5

Q. What relationship did you have with Drunvalo Melchizedek?

A. I've known him for a long time.

Q. Well --

A. I know what letter he's referring to.

MR. TENEN: Why don't you identify it?

Q. I'll hand you a one-page document. Do you recognize that?

A. Yes.

Q. Is that a letter of April 21, 1992?

A. Right.

Q. Is that from Drunvalo Melchizedek to yourself?

A. Yes.

Q. Do you remember that letter?

A. Yes, very well.

Q. If I may have it for a minute. In this letter is Mr. Drunvalo Melchizedek telling you he wants you to stop using his work?

A. He's saying he believed I made a mistake in using alphabet letter forms that were related to Stan's work. That's basically what --

Q. How did you take the sentence --

MR. TENEN: Just read the letter. Did you receive that letter?

MR. WINTER: Yes.

MR. TENEN: Did you honor it?

MR. WINTER: I guess I'm honoring it now.

Q. Didn't he point out what he considered an infraction of his work and then said, “If this was the only infraction of my work I probably would never say anything; but given the degree that this plagiarism seems to be occurring between myself, Stan Tenen, and others, I feel I must ask you to stop using any reference to my work or my name."
Did he say that?

A. Yes.

Q. Nevertheless, after that you had a business relationship with him, didn't you?

A. Well, they invited me to come there and share on several occasions.

Q. Where is “there”?

A. In Arizona. On those occasions I was very careful not to show alphabet --

MR. TENEN: Are you aware of ever receiving funding from the same source that you received funding, ultimately from Transecon?

MR. WINTER: There was a connection. I'm not sure --

MR. TENEN: Do you know how much money they were given?

MR. WINTER: (No response.)

MR. TENEN: Well, this is people you'd been working with.

MR. WINTER: Do I know how much money --

MR. TENEN: Did you receive compensation from them?

MR. WINTER: From Flower of Life?

MR. TENEN: Or Ron Holt or Drunvalo Melchizedek or Hummingbird, or someone funding both jointly with you as part of it.

MR. WINTER: Okay, well, let's try to be real specific here. When I gave the talk out there in Arizona, I received about $300 to give the talk, and I made sure -- I'm pretty sure I was very careful not to show any alphabet letter forms. Do I know how much money Transecon gave to Drunvalo? I don't know. I do know there was a business relationship that had to do with the center they purchased and that it was a very considerable --

MR. TENEN: Mr. Melchizedek wrote that and signed it as working for Hummingbird. What about Hummingbird?

MR. WINTER: Hummingbird is a name Drunvalo Melchizedek has used for a long time. I'm not sure -- I know he still uses that word sometimes as his E-mail addresses.

[END OF EXCERPT]

Mr. Winter identifies, acknowledges, and verifies the authenticity of Mr. Melchizedek's April 21, 1992 letter to him, exactly as posted above.

While admitting as little as possible, and greatly minimizing the funds involved, Mr. Winter tells us that he continued to perform with and for Mr. Melchizedek, and the Flower of Life. When Mr. Winter says he was "very careful not to show any alphabet letter forms," he is lying by leaving the misimpression that he did not show my sculpture(s). Mr. Winter did show my copyright sculpture(s). The alphabet, and/or letters, are not the issue, and Mr. Winter later admitted this overly clever self-serving misdirection in his second "confession".

I would like people to consider the situation step by step, in chronological order, so I will continue to present documents written by Mr. Melchizedek in later postings.

If anyone has questions or comments, or would like to see more evidence or whatever, please send your email to documentation@danwinter.com.

Yours truly,
Stan Tenen
Director of Research,
Meru Foundation


THE WINTER-MELCHIZEDEK CONNECTION - CONTINUED: Mr. Melchizedek's Second Letter
Explanatory Notes by Stan Tenen, written 2 December 2002

I think it would be helpful to fill in some background information, before presenting Mr. Melchizedek's second letter.

Mr. Winter has tried to excuse his thievery and abuse of my work by claiming that he was only "sharing" information that I was trying to keep secret, because I was some sort of selfish and fanatically religious "Jewish priest keeping the secrets of immortality for the Jews alone." (Several of Mr. Winter's outraged and naive followers have self-righteously and innocently screamed this insanity at me personally on the phone.) It serves Mr. Winter when people think I am a fanatically religious Jew. Actually this has never been true.

It is true that I was first motivated to want to help to solve the Palestinian-Israeli conflict when I was in Jerusalem for the first time, and saw for myself that the situation was serious. I did not plan to be in Jerusalem. I was there on a fluke, because a friend had invited me to visit (in part to visit the world famous Bahai Shrine in Haifa) and because my work situation provided an opportunity for the first vacation I had had in 3-years. I also stopped in London and Paris - this was a vacation. - It was not some lunatic scene from the annals of a deluded person visiting Jerusalem and coming down with the well-known mental condition known as "the Jerusalem syndrome." (I was offered a job in an optical-electronics start-up in Haifa, but I didn't take it.)

Until Mr. Winter stole and bastardized my work, it didn't occur to me that I was researching teachings that had been preserved by the dedicated efforts of people of faith and people of science for thousands of years - without myself giving them adequate credit.

Until Mr. Winter stole from me, it never occurred to me that I had a responsibility to respect the sensibilities and feelings of the communities of faith and science that had preserved the raw data I was working from.

In other words, I'm not a particularly good Jew (and I am not a Jewish priest, as Mr. Winter admitted in his Corrective Notice, even he knew this was untrue), but - because of the Golden Rule - and because Mr. Winter was stealing from me, I decided to "give credit where credit is due." I decided - in the words of Jesse Jackson - to not just "talk the talk", but to also "walk the walk." And I decided to do this by honoring my family's religion (which I previously paid no attention to) by not working on Saturdays and by eating (almost completely) vegetarian (so I would be honoring the kosher laws and eating healthy at the same time.)

This is the extent of my fanaticism: I take off one day a week and I eat healthy vegetarian food. Many millions of other normal, non-fanatic, believers and unbelievers, saints, sinners, infidels, scientists, agnostics, etc. etc. do the same thing.

I must admit that as a careful and skeptical scientist I am strict with the truth and integrity of my data and findings. It is just not possible to do good science that has real value in the world without telling the truth and standing up for the truth. All religions teach truthfulness, but this is not my reason for sticking to the truth, providing full and honest findings in context (that is the whole truth), and standing up for it. In science, misrepresentation and sloppiness with regard to the truth destroys credibility.

Because I went to the New York City public schools and did not have a religious education, I never paid much attention to religion and I knew nothing about theology. I studied just enough of the Hebrew alphabet to be able to read at my Bar Mitzvah, and then I had no other connection to anything religious - and I never looked back - until Mr. Winter's thievery reminded me to "give credit where credit is due."

There were more Native Americans from the Mohawk Nation and religious Catholics (who left school early on Wednesdays so they could go to parochial school) in my classes, than there were religious Jews.

Interestingly, Mr. Winter's only education was in theology and psychology. Mr. Winter had a full religious education (and little other education.) Mr. Winter attended Catholic parochial schools and got his B.A. in Psychology - his only credential - at the Catholic University of Detroit. (Mr. Winter admitted under oath that he was lying when he claimed he did graduate work for Prof. Al Ax at U. Detroit, and he confessed that he did not do any other undergraduate or graduate work either.)

In contrast, I was educated to be a honest skeptic, I had no exposure to theology, and I had no training in the use of psychological techniques and pseudo-scientific jargon like the sort of clever double-talk that Mr. Winter (and Mr. Melchizedek) use to get people to believe. I have a B.S. in Physics (minor in Mathematics) from the decidedly non-religious, mechanistic, techno-nerd, Polytechnic Institute of Brooklyn (now the Polytechnic University of New York in Brooklyn.) My work is published in peer-reviewed science and consciousness journals, and I serve on the editorial advisory board of the Science and the Primacy of Consciousness series, along with highly respected "name brand" scholars and scientists with more Ph.D.s than I have fingers and toes.

If I had known something about theology - if I had heard about Satanism, Lucifer, the "dark side", angelology, messianism, prophecy, miracles, and the like, I might not have been taken by surprise by Mr. Melchizedek's wild response when I telephoned him. "All hell broke loose", so to speak, when I asked Mr. Melchizedek to help to rein in Mr. Winter as he had promised, and as he wrote in his April 1992 letter to Mr. Winter.

Because I was not well educated in Judaism (which puts no emphasis on these things) and because I was not educated at all about Christianity or Islam (which apparently take Satan and the "dark side" more seriously than does Judaism), I was not at all prepared for Mr. Melchizedek's weird theological arguments. I was certainly not prepared for Mr. Melchizedek's threats and his intervention to prevent Meru Foundation from defending the integrity (and usefulness) of our original work from Mr. Winter and his abuses and misrepresentations of it.

I was not at all prepared when Mr. Melchizedek told me that he would not rein in Mr. Winter unless I joined with him and his multi-millionaire benefactor, Jirka Rysavy in "channeling Lucifer." I had previously heard that Mr. Winter was involved in satanism, but I had not taken it seriously or tried to confirm this. (Mr. Rysavy was then CEO of Corporate Express and Transecon in Broomfield, Colorado, and he is now CEO of Gaiam, the health food and exercise equipment mega-corporation that is currently taking over numerous independent businesses. As we know from the transcript of Mr. Winter's first "confession" (posted at < [link to www.danwinter.com] Mr. Winter later worked for Transecon, under a "front" company, set up by Mr. Rysavy, until Mr. Rysavy fired him for refusing to end his plagiarism of my work.)

What followed was like a grade "B" horror or gangster movie. Mr. Melchizedek not only told me that he and Mr. Rysavy were channeling Lucifer, but that now that he had told me this, if I did not go alone with him and if I did not turn my work over to Mr. Winter, "they (I assume he and/or his Lucifer-channeling friends) would 'get' me."

I was taken completely by surprise. I expected Mr. Melchizedek to be reasonable and caring and to help me to rein in Mr. Winter. Instead I was told about something really sick and dangerous, and I was told if I did not acquiesce, he and/or the others involved with him in channeling Lucifer would actively try to destroy my work and my credibility, and see to it that Mr. Winter got the credit - and that they would support Mr. Winter's wildly untrue version of events.

At this point, completely blind-sided, I lost it and I got angry. I wish I had a recording of what I actually said, because that would put the lie to what Mr. Melchizedek went on to claim I said - but I don't. (It was incidents such as this that later prompted us to videotape Mr. Winter's first confession.) I am sure I told him "to go to hell." I am sure I yelled something to the effect that it would be more effective to hire someone to get him and Mr. Winter than to use the courts. I was really angry.

But, it never occurred to me (and obviously it could not be true) that Mr. Melchizedek, on hearing me tell him to "go to hell", actually, somehow, thought I had the power to make this so.

Mr. Melchizedek then went on to fulfill his threat to harm me. This takes us to Mr. Melchizedek's letter to Mr. Winter and Mr. Winter's attorney, Stephen Salai, Esq., and to Meru Foundation's attorney, Brian Coyne, Esq.

If anyone has questions or comments, or would like to see more evidence or whatever, please send your email to documentation@danwinter.com.

Yours truly,
Stan Tenen
Director of Research,
Meru Foundation



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quote:Ex cerpt from Stan Tene 0]
If I had known something about theology - if I had heard about Satanism, Lucifer, the "dark side", angelology, messianism, prophecy, miracles, and the like, I might not have been taken by surprise by Mr. Melchizedek´s wild response when I telephoned him. "All hell broke loose", so to speak, when I asked Mr. Melchizedek to help to rein in Mr. Winter as he had promised, and as he wrote in his April 1992 letter to Mr. Winter.

Because I was not well educated in Judaism (which puts no emphasis on these things) and because I was not educated at all about Christianity or Islam (which apparently take Satan and the "dark side" more seriously than does Judaism), I was not at all prepared for Mr. Melchizedek´s weird theological arguments. I was certainly not prepared for Mr. Melchizedek´s threats and his intervention to prevent Meru Foundation from defending the integrity (and usefulness) of our original work from Mr. Winter and his abuses and misrepresentations of it.

I was not at all prepared when Mr. Melchizedek told me that he would not rein in Mr. Winter unless I joined with him and his multi-millionaire benefactor, Jirka Rysavy in "channeling Lucifer." I had previously heard that Mr. Winter was involved in satanism, but I had not taken it seriously or tried to confirm this. (Mr. Rysavy was then CEO of Corporate Express and Transecon in Broomfield, Colorado, and he is now CEO of Gaiam, the health food and exercise equipment mega-corporation that is currently taking over numerous independent businesses. As we know from the transcript of Mr. Winter´s first "confession" (posted at < [link to www.danwinter.com] Mr. Winter later worked for Transecon, under a "front" company, set up by Mr. Rysavy, until Mr. Rysavy fired him for refusing to end his plagiarism of my work.)

What followed was like a grade "B" horror or gangster movie. Mr. Melchizedek not only told me that he and Mr. Rysavy were channeling Lucifer, but that now that he had told me this, if I did not go alone with him and if I did not turn my work over to Mr. Winter, "they (I assume he and/or his Lucifer-channeling friends) would ´get´ me."

I was taken completely by surprise. I expected Mr. Melchizedek to be reasonable and caring and to help me to rein in Mr. Winter. Instead I was told about something really sick and dangerous, and I was told if I did not acquiesce, he and/or the others involved with him in channeling Lucifer would actively try to destroy my work and my credibility, and see to it that Mr. Winter got the credit - and that they would support Mr. Winter´s wildly untrue version of events.

At this point, completely blind-sided, I lost it and I got angry. I wish I had a recording of what I actually said, because that would put the lie to what Mr. Melchizedek went on to claim I said - but I don´t. (It was incidents such as this that later prompted us to videotape Mr. Winter´s first confession.) I am sure I told him "to go to hell." I am sure I yelled something to the effect that it would be more effective to hire someone to get him and Mr. Winter than to use the courts. I was really angry.

But, it never occurred to me (and obviously it could not be true) that Mr. Melchizedek, on hearing me tell him to "go to hell", actually, somehow, thought I had the power to make this so.

Mr. Melchizedek then went on to fulfill his threat to harm me. This takes us to Mr. Melchizedek´s letter to Mr. Winter and Mr. Winter´s attorney, Stephen Salai, Esq., and to Meru Foundation´s attorney, Brian Coyne, Esq.

If anyone has questions or comments, or would like to see more evidence or whatever, please send your email to documentation@danwinter.com.

Yours truly,
Stan Tenen
Director of Research,
Meru Foundation
Anonymous Coward
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Re: Drunvalo channeling LUCIFER etcetc.. and JIRKA RYSAVY..
was not at all prepared when Mr. Melchizedek told me that he would not rein in Mr. Winter unless I joined with him and his multi-millionaire benefactor, Jirka Rysavy in "channeling Lucifer."


__________________________________________________

Can you prove that, or is this just heresay?
Anonymous Coward
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03/22/2008 02:00 AM
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Re: Drunvalo channeling LUCIFER etcetc.. and JIRKA RYSAVY..
Where is the love in this light in unity?

There is no original thought. Whomever wishes to copyright is protecting their own sense of individuality and all that it reaps. The information given to those sensitives is given freely with the understanding of its growth in mind.

Those materially affected by teachings remain attached to the illusions the teachings were given to be freed from.
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03/22/2008 02:03 AM
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Re: Drunvalo channeling LUCIFER etcetc.. and JIRKA RYSAVY..
was not at all prepared when Mr. Melchizedek told me that he would not rein in Mr. Winter unless I joined with him and his multi-millionaire benefactor, Jirka Rysavy in "channeling Lucifer."


__________________________________________________

Can you prove that, or is this just heresay?
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 397318



When I channel the great I AM, lucifer stands behind me projecting darkness to test me.
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Re: Drunvalo channeling LUCIFER etcetc.. and JIRKA RYSAVY..
The op speaks with great forked tongue. I personally know Drunvalo and I can assure all those reading the op's drivel that he is either full of it, or is trying to discredit Drunvalo because of Dan winters bull. Are you by chance the same jewish character who brought the law suit against Dan for some trivial bullshit? Anyway, either Drunvalo was putting on a show for his own entertainment or to get you off the phone. LOL! He describes "lucifer" as always, as a consciousness unit embedded in the mind of the creator which created a unique position for consciousness as we know it to expand. I seriously doubt that he would have said such a thing or "channeled" "lucifer" unless it was a joke put on for his own amusement or the most likely alternative, you are either lying your ass off or embellishing. Good night madam or sire!
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Re: Drunvalo channeling LUCIFER etcetc.. and JIRKA RYSAVY..
handara wrote (in response to 'The Devil's Advocate'):
> The story of Lucifer/Prometheus is described as the Olympian's attempts
> to keep light/fire from enslaved humanity. How have we done with fire?
Provocative points, Chandara! I'm provoked enough to bring up the version of the story brought to us by Drunvalo Melchizedek (as communicated via Thoth). The Lucifer Rebellion, Drunvalo says, is shorthand code for a series of different probability events whereby the Random Factor, Free Will, and Individualization entered into the field of evolutionary possibilities. In any case, the resultant sense of separation from Source led to a perpetual feeling of need or lack, hence the desire to control and manipulate reality through tool-making and warfaring - the rudiments of today's military-industrial complex! Acquire and Protect = Old Jehovian-Anunnaki-Illuminati Paradigm.

In effect, all of us incarnate on this dense planet at this time are part of the Lucifer Rebellion by dint of the fact that we are all Homo faber, tool-using humans - even if some of us, like our cetacean cousins, are evolving closer to Homo ludens, play-making humans - by relearning the magickal fusion of Mind (intelligence) and Will (intent) through the All-Embracing Heart (compassion, empathy). Attune and Harmonize = New Christ-conscious Ascended Earth Paradigm.
> It is tempting and easily assumed that if 'we' were to have power that
> the outcomes would play out differently. This is where a thorough and
> penetrating of history is required. I do not think that any one 'group' will
> accomplish anything different than their forbears. Many, many tens of
> thousands of generations have attempted and failed.
Are you saying it's all hopeless, Chandara? Is that what I'm hearing: meet the new paradigm, same as the old paradigm?

Q: What makes you think you're going to do better job than your ancestors?

A: Evolution! We live and learn - even if we must live again and again and again before we learn :-)


> The difference between Lucifer and Jesus is that Lucifer claims that
> bringing the 'fire' down to man will somehow free him from his 'benighted'
> humanity. Jesus said that man needed to be freed from such a burden
> entirely. As I have considered this, perhaps this tendency to become
> corrupted is something that we need to accept about ourselves. Hmmm.
> Why is this a bad thing? After all, all fruit turns rotten after awhile.

What I'm getting from your statement is this: the power that knowledge brings corrupts, therefore it's best to be ignorant and weak (after all, the meek shall inherit the earth, right?) Perhaps we can look at the picture another way: Lucifer is a Descended Master - he plummets from being God's Mainman to being the Universal Scapegoat, and there is reason to acknowledge that Lucifer CHOSE to experience Separation and the only way to achieve that was through rebellion against the Prevailing Order.

I recall reading Solara's take on the Lucifer scenario... perhaps I ought to quote her rather than paraphrase, since the book is right on my lap:

THE DESCENT INTO MATTER

When the Call was sent forth asking for volunteers upon the Earth to aid in the transformation of matter, we responded by offering our services. It was no longer necessary for us to remain here in our vast Angelic bodies of Light. What was required was for our Angelic Self to send a small fragment of itself, a tiny starseed of its Essence, down to Earth on a Golden Beam of Light. The starseed was to interlock into matter. Hence we needed a method of propulsion to imbed us into density. We had been thoroughly prepared for this process, at least as much as we could be, since it was beyond anything we had ever before experienced.

This is where Lucifer came in. Being the brightest of the Angels, he volunteered to take on the most difficult of tasks. This was the transmutation of the darkest energy, that which was the most separate from God.

FIRST, LUCIFER SERVED AS THE INSTRUMENT TO SEND OUR STARSEEDS DEEP WITHIN THE THIRD DIMENSIONAL DENSITY.

This was experienced by us as a lethal blow, like a leaden dagger to the back of the neck, quite unexpected by us. When this happened, it caused us to feel the emotions of shock, betrayal, abandonment, deep sorrow, anger and, finally, guilt, for the very first time. Then we simply forgot... We forgot our Divine Origin. We forgot our Higher Purpose. We forgot that we were not separate from God. Thus did we experience the illusion of separation. We were thus imprisoned in the limitations of matter...

THIS IS THE TIME KNOWN AS 'THE FALL.' THOUGH, IN TRUTH, WE FELL NOT. IT WAS MERELY PART OF THE PERFECTION OF THE DIVINE PLAN.

At the moment when we descended fully into matter, we directed much of our new negative energy towards Lucifer, for was he not the one who had caused us to suffer so! This, too, was part of the pefection of the Divine Plan, for our combined negative feelings served as the method of propulsion to thrust Lucifer into the very heart of the density. This is where he had volunteered to serve with his Heavenly Legions who are now referred to as the Fallen Angels.

[From 'The Star-Borne: A Remembrance for the Awakened Ones' - Solara, 1989]

Why do fruits rot? Just so their seeds will be exposed to the Light and hopefully be scattered far and wide where they can find new ground in which to germinate and propagate their unique qualities!

Thank you, Chandara, for stimulating "fruitful" discussion on what I deem to be a very cogent topic :-)

Your friend from somewhere-over-the-rainbow,
Antares
~^@^~


























If I had known something about theology - if I had heard about Satanism, Lucifer, the "dark side", angelology, messianism, prophecy, miracles, and the like, I might not have been taken by surprise by Mr. Melchizedek´s wild response when I telephoned him. "All hell broke loose", so to speak, when I asked Mr. Melchizedek to help to rein in Mr. Winter as he had promised, and as he wrote in his April 1992 letter to Mr. Winter.

Because I was not well educated in Judaism (which puts no emphasis on these things) and because I was not educated at all about Christianity or Islam (which apparently take Satan and the "dark side" more seriously than does Judaism), I was not at all prepared for Mr. Melchizedek´s weird theological arguments. I was certainly not prepared for Mr. Melchizedek´s threats and his intervention to prevent Meru Foundation from defending the integrity (and usefulness) of our original work from Mr. Winter and his abuses and misrepresentations of it.

I was not at all prepared when Mr. Melchizedek told me that he would not rein in Mr. Winter unless I joined with him and his multi-millionaire benefactor, Jirka Rysavy in "channeling Lucifer." I had previously heard that Mr. Winter was involved in satanism, but I had not taken it seriously or tried to confirm this. (Mr. Rysavy was then CEO of Corporate Express and Transecon in Broomfield, Colorado, and he is now CEO of Gaiam, the health food and exercise equipment mega-corporation that is currently taking over numerous independent businesses. As we know from the transcript of Mr. Winter´s first "confession" (posted at < [link to www.danwinter.com] Mr. Winter later worked for Transecon, under a "front" company, set up by Mr. Rysavy, until Mr. Rysavy fired him for refusing to end his plagiarism of my work.)

What followed was like a grade "B" horror or gangster movie. Mr. Melchizedek not only told me that he and Mr. Rysavy were channeling Lucifer, but that now that he had told me this, if I did not go alone with him and if I did not turn my work over to Mr. Winter, "they (I assume he and/or his Lucifer-channeling friends) would ´get´ me."

I was taken completely by surprise. I expected Mr. Melchizedek to be reasonable and caring and to help me to rein in Mr. Winter. Instead I was told about something really sick and dangerous, and I was told if I did not acquiesce, he and/or the others involved with him in channeling Lucifer would actively try to destroy my work and my credibility, and see to it that Mr. Winter got the credit - and that they would support Mr. Winter´s wildly untrue version of events.

At this point, completely blind-sided, I lost it and I got angry. I wish I had a recording of what I actually said, because that would put the lie to what Mr. Melchizedek went on to claim I said - but I don´t. (It was incidents such as this that later prompted us to videotape Mr. Winter´s first confession.) I am sure I told him "to go to hell." I am sure I yelled something to the effect that it would be more effective to hire someone to get him and Mr. Winter than to use the courts. I was really angry.

But, it never occurred to me (and obviously it could not be true) that Mr. Melchizedek, on hearing me tell him to "go to hell", actually, somehow, thought I had the power to make this so.

Mr. Melchizedek then went on to fulfill his threat to harm me. This takes us to Mr. Melchizedek´s letter to Mr. Winter and Mr. Winter´s attorney, Stephen Salai, Esq., and to Meru Foundation´s attorney, Brian Coyne, Esq.

If anyone has questions or comments, or would like to see more evidence or whatever, please send your email to documentation@danwinter.com.

Yours truly,
Stan Tenen
Director of Research,
Meru Foundation
 Quoting: Ex cerpt from Stan Tene 0
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Re: Drunvalo channeling LUCIFER etcetc.. and JIRKA RYSAVY..
[


the early 1800s, John Bell moved his family from North Carolina to the Red River bottomland in Robertson County, Tennessee, settling in a community that later became known as Adams. Bell purchased some land and a large log home for his family. The Bells quickly made many friends and gained prominence in the community. John Bell acquired additional land and cleared a number of fields over the next several years.

One day in 1817, John Bell was inspecting his corn field when he encountered a strange-looking animal sitting in the middle of a corn row. Shocked by the appearance of this animal, which had the body of a dog and the head of a rabbit, Bell shot several times to no avail. The animal vanished. Bell thought nothing more about the incident--at least not until after dinner. That evening, the Bells began hearing "beating" sounds on the outside walls of their house.

These mysterious sounds continued with increased force each night. Bell and his sons often hurried outside to catch the culprit but always returned empty-handed. The noises were soon followed by more problems. The Bell children began waking up frightened and complaining of sounds much like rats gnawing at their bedposts. It wasn't long until the children began complaining of more terrifying things--having their bed covers pulled and their pillows were tossed onto the floor by a seemingly invisible force.

As time went on, the Bells began to hear more strange noises. Only this time, they sounded like faint, whispering voices--too weak to understand--but sounded like a feeble old woman crying or singing hymns. The encounters escalated, and the Bells&#65533; youngest daughter, Betsy, began experiencing physically brutal encounters with the entity. It relentlessly pulled her hair and slapped her, often leaving visible prints on her face and body for days at a time. The evil disturbances escalated over the next year to the point it was time for John Bell to share his "family trouble" with his closest friend and neighbor, James Johnston.

Johnston and his wife spent the night at the Bell home, where they were subjected to the same terrifying disturbances that the Bells had been. After having his bedcovers repeatedly removed, and being slapped, Johnston sprang out of bed, asking, "I ask you in the name of the Lord God, who are you and what do you want?" There was no response of any type, but the remainder of the night was peaceful.

As word of the Bell disturbances spread throughout the community, so did the entity's antics. Over time, the its voice strengthened to the point it was loud and understandable. It sang hymns, quoted scripture, carried on intelligent conversation, and once quoted, word-for-word, two sermons that took place at the same time thirteen miles apart. During none of this time did anyone know who or what the entity was, or its purpose for tormenting the Red River Settlement.

Word eventually spread outside the settlement, even as far as Nashville, where one Andrew Jackson became interested.

John Bell, Jr. and Jesse Bell fought under General Andrew Jackson in the Battle of New Orleans, and had developed a good rapport with him. In 1819, Jackson got word of the disturbances at the Bell home and decided to pay a personal visit. Jackson and his entourage, consisting of several men and a large wagon, journeyed from Nashville to the Bell home. As the entourage approached the Bell property, the wagon suddenly stopped. The horses tried pulling but to no avail--the wagon simply would not move.

After several minutes of cursing and trying to get the wagon to move, Jackson exclaimed that it must have been the "witch." As soon as Jackson uttered these words, an unidentified female voice spoke, telling Jackson and his men that they could proceed, and that "she" would see them again later that evening. The men were finally allowed to continue.

Jackson and John Bell had a long discussion about the Indians and other topics while Jackson&#65533;s men patiently waited to see if the "spirit" was going to manifest itself. One of the men in Jackson&#65533;s entourage claimed to be a "witch tamer." After several uneventful hours, this man decided to "call" the "spirit." He pulled out a shiny pistol and made his intent to kill the "spirit" known to all that were present.

Almost immediately, the man began screaming and moving his body in many different directions. He said he was being stuck with pins and being severely beaten. The man quickly ran out the door, and the "spirit" announced that there was yet one more "fraud" in Jackson&#65533;s party, and that he would be identified on the following evening.

Terrified, Jackson&#65533;s men begged to leave the Bell farm. Jackson insisted on staying so that he could find out who the other "fraud" was. Jackson and his men eventually went out to the field to sleep in their tents, and the men continued to beg and plead with Jackson to leave.

Jackson maintained the position that he wanted to know whom the other "fraud" in his party was. However, by mid-day the next day, Jackson and his men had already left the Bell farm and were seen going through Springfield. Jackson, a hero in the Battle of New Orleans four years earlier, was quoted as later having said, "I&#65533;d rather fight the entire British Army than to deal with the Bell Witch." Jackson later became the President of the United States.

Over time, Betsy Bell became interested in Joshua Gardner, a young man who lived not far from her. With the blessings of their parents, they agreed to engagement. Nevertheless, despite their evident happiness, the "spirit" repeatedly told Betsy not to marry Joshua Gardner.

It is interesting to note that their schoolteacher, Richard Powell, was noticeably interested in Betsy and wanted to marry her when she became older. Powell was believed to have been a student of the occult, and had been secretly married to a woman in nearby Nashville for some time. Betsy and Joshua could not go to the river, the field, or the cave to play, without the "spirit" following along and persistently taunting them. Betsy and Joshua&#65533;s patience finally reached critical mass, and on Easter Monday of 1821, Betsy met Joshua at the river and broke off their engagement.

The encounters decreased after that heartbreaking Easter Monday, although the "spirit" continued to express its dislike for "ol Jack Bell," and relentlessly vowed to kill him. As Bell&#65533;s health grew worse, the "spirit" would torture him more severely, sometimes removing his shoes from his feet and relentlessly slapping his face while he was experiencing seizures.

On the morning of December 20, 1820, after a long battle with a crippling nervous system disorder, John Bell breathed his last breath. Immediately after Bell&#65533;s death, the family found a small vial of unidentified liquid that Bell had partaken of the evening before his death. John Bell, Jr. gave some of the liquid to the family&#65533;s cat, and the cat died almost instantly. The "spirit" suddenly spoke up exclaiming, "I gave Ol' Jack a big dose of that last night, and that fixed him." John, Jr. quickly threw the vial into the fireplace, where it shot up the chimney in the form of a bright, blue flame. As family and friends began to leave John Bell&#65533;s burial site, the "spirit" laughed loudly and sang a cheerful song about a bottle of brandy.

In April of 1821, the "spirit" visited Lucy Bell and told her that "it" would return in seven years for a visit. Seven years later, in 1828, the "spirit" returned as promised. Most of this visit centered around John Bell, Jr. The "spirit" discussed with him such things as the origin of life, Christianity, the need for a mass spiritual reawakening, and other in-depth topics. Of particular significance were the "spirit&#65533;s" predictions of the Civil War, World War I, the Great Depression, and World War II.

After three weeks, the "spirit" bade farewell, promising to visit John Bell&#65533;s most direct descendant in 107 years. The year would have been 1935, and the closest direct living descendant of John Bell was Charles Bailey Bell, a physician in Nashville. Charles Bailey Bell himself wrote a book about the "Bell Witch," but it had been published prior 1935. No follow-up was published, and Bell died a few years later in 1945.

Today, the "spirit" which haunted the Bell family nearly 200 years ago is believed by many to be the source of numerous manifestations in the area where the story took place. Some believe that when the "spirit" returned in 1935, it took residence in Adams, Tennessee, once a part of the Bell farm. The faint sounds of people talking and children playing can sometimes be heard in the area. It is also very difficult to take a good picture there.

Several years ago, one of John Bell&#65533;s descendants was rabbit hunting and shot a rabbit, which wandered into some dense brush. While searching, he felt a large rock underneath the brush where the rabbit had entered. The rock turned out to be a part of Joel Egbert Bell&#65533;s tombstone, and the rabbit was never found. In the mid 1990&#65533;s, a picture was taken of a girl sitting on a rock outside the cave&#65533;s entrance. When the picture was developed, there appeared to be a man standing behind her. Upon expert examination, it was determined that the man-like image was not a double-exposure, but an entirely separate entity. It has been said that if you visit the fields of the old Bell farm on dark, cold and rainy nights, you can sometimes see small lights gliding over the fields and dancing in the dell.

The cause of the Bells&#65533; torment nearly 200 years ago and today's horrid manifestations has remained a mystery. Numerous versions and theories that purportedly explain the cause of the disturbances abound, and vary from person to person. The only constant is that there was "something" wrong on the Bell farm in the early 1800s, and there is still "something" wrong at the old Bell farm today, nearly 200 years later. It happened to the John Bell family in 1817. Maybe next time it will happen to your family.
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quote:Ex cerpt from Stan Tene 0]
If I had known something about theology - if I had heard about Satanism, Lucifer, the "dark side", angelology, messianism, prophecy, miracles, and the like, I might not have been taken by surprise by Mr. Melchizedek´s wild response when I telephoned him. "All hell broke loose", so to speak, when I asked Mr. Melchizedek to help to rein in Mr. Winter as he had promised, and as he wrote in his April 1992 letter to Mr. Winter.

Because I was not well educated in Judaism (which puts no emphasis on these things) and because I was not educated at all about Christianity or Islam (which apparently take Satan and the "dark side" more seriously than does Judaism), I was not at all prepared for Mr. Melchizedek´s weird theological arguments. I was certainly not prepared for Mr. Melchizedek´s threats and his intervention to prevent Meru Foundation from defending the integrity (and usefulness) of our original work from Mr. Winter and his abuses and misrepresentations of it.

I was not at all prepared when Mr. Melchizedek told me that he would not rein in Mr. Winter unless I joined with him and his multi-millionaire benefactor, Jirka Rysavy in "channeling Lucifer." I had previously heard that Mr. Winter was involved in satanism, but I had not taken it seriously or tried to confirm this. (Mr. Rysavy was then CEO of Corporate Express and Transecon in Broomfield, Colorado, and he is now CEO of Gaiam, the health food and exercise equipment mega-corporation that is currently taking over numerous independent businesses. As we know from the transcript of Mr. Winter´s first "confession" (posted at < [link to www.danwinter.com] Mr. Winter later worked for Transecon, under a "front" company, set up by Mr. Rysavy, until Mr. Rysavy fired him for refusing to end his plagiarism of my work.)

What followed was like a grade "B" horror or gangster movie. Mr. Melchizedek not only told me that he and Mr. Rysavy were channeling Lucifer, but that now that he had told me this, if I did not go alone with him and if I did not turn my work over to Mr. Winter, "they (I assume he and/or his Lucifer-channeling friends) would ´get´ me."

I was taken completely by surprise. I expected Mr. Melchizedek to be reasonable and caring and to help me to rein in Mr. Winter. Instead I was told about something really sick and dangerous, and I was told if I did not acquiesce, he and/or the others involved with him in channeling Lucifer would actively try to destroy my work and my credibility, and see to it that Mr. Winter got the credit - and that they would support Mr. Winter´s wildly untrue version of events.

At this point, completely blind-sided, I lost it and I got angry. I wish I had a recording of what I actually said, because that would put the lie to what Mr. Melchizedek went on to claim I said - but I don´t. (It was incidents such as this that later prompted us to videotape Mr. Winter´s first confession.) I am sure I told him "to go to hell." I am sure I yelled something to the effect that it would be more effective to hire someone to get him and Mr. Winter than to use the courts. I was really angry.

But, it never occurred to me (and obviously it could not be true) that Mr. Melchizedek, on hearing me tell him to "go to hell", actually, somehow, thought I had the power to make this so.

Mr. Melchizedek then went on to fulfill his threat to harm me. This takes us to Mr. Melchizedek´s letter to Mr. Winter and Mr. Winter´s attorney, Stephen Salai, Esq., and to Meru Foundation´s attorney, Brian Coyne, Esq.

If anyone has questions or comments, or would like to see more evidence or whatever, please send your email to documentation@danwinter.com.

Yours truly,
Stan Tenen
Director of Research,
Meru Foundation
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Re: Drunvalo channeling LUCIFER etcetc.. and JIRKA RYSAVY..
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The Golden Age of Con Artists

I have always been a little too trusting. Fortunately I grew up with Nancy Drew, so eventually I do my research.

I love and believe in Jesus with all my heart. I believe in the inherent goodness of people and devoted my life to healing a few years ago. Whatever someone else believes is just fine with me-I respect that this is your life and you can have whatever experience you choose.

I’m writing this because I know how many sacrifices a person can make to follow a spiritual path, especially in healing where we often work two jobs or leave a secure one for a calling. On the material level, dedicating my life to service has been the hardest thing I’ve ever done. I don’t personally know anyone who works in natural healing that is close to feeling financially secure-not on their own anyway. I struggled to live on a ¼ salary of Corp America, but I never regretted finding my freedom from the rat race.

When we change our beliefs it often strains and even ends relationships. I lost friends- some thought I flipped my lid, others I had less and less in common with till we grew too far apart.

I’ve lost a lot of sleep and had a lot of fear. What have you sacrificed?

Looking back I see that when you go through so much struggle and fear of survival, it wears you down and you long for any relief. You become very vulnerable, which is not good or bad.

You become hungry for knowledge, so hungry for the promised golden age life becomes a dance of divine discontent; one foot on earth and the other apart of a Sci-Fi movie. The obvious solution is to find answers from the ones who know how to make it work.

But I am asking you to take a look with me at who really holds us back from the golden age.

If you are committed to doing God’s work do you feel that you take it seriously and hold that as sacred? Should you be entrusted with helping others if you are not careful enough to check out resources and apply simple tests of truth principles?

Is the true awakening realizing that we really don’t know how to turn within and know with certainty if our very teachers are genuine and truthful?

Do we need special, complicated methods as long as they say they come from their heart.
Can a child know and understand what they teach?

Honestly I don’t care to even involve money in this equation, because that is not the most important part of the lesson. Money is but one small component of what an exploiter takes from you. It is your precious life force energy.

I heard this over and over throughout the years but I never read too much of the new age movement genre so until revisiting Sacred Geometry I didn’t really research the integrity of the players. I guess my intuition was working! But it wasn’t fool proof yet.

I know that if you find someone to “consciously” work with, you come out with integrity and knowledge that “empowers you and others”. A conscious situation will strengthen your foundation. Conscious means you get what you are promised and each of the parties are completely upfront.

Would you be willing to spend your life force energy on learning from someone who lies? In this instance, you will learn a lesson as I did, but it won’t be the one he teaches. Because one big lie means you have to go back and discern the truth all over again. How could you possibly know which principles are true when you learn from a deliberate liar?

Each time you fall for another’s lie you get to understand how you “knew” something was off and this is one way to fine tune knowing the answer for yourself. At this point you don’t yet know how to look within and value yourself above others. Not your body or ego!! No, your connection to God, Jesus, higher self or whatever you decide to connect too.

Looking back I see what my real test was. Anyone exploring their spiritual nature must pass this test. Perhaps my journey will help you have a the same awakening.

If you don’t pass this “test” of looking within and discerning truth you certainly cannot ascend to the next level.

A false prophet cannot hold divine truth.

If you consciously and willingly follow an exploiter it is your life force energy to use as you please.
Our moment to moment life IS the reward or punishment. Our moment to moment life is JUDGEMENT day! Your time has already come because your guilt is already here! These are the seeds you have sown for tomorrow.

On this path you rob and steal so your punishment is guilt. Built in is that you cannot possibly enjoy the connection to divine that others so enjoy. You can meditate and preach living in the heart till the merkaba brings you home, but that home will always be the result of your lies.
I’m satisfied that is enough of a punishment for you and I feel empathy for you. While you think that your laughter at others foolishness is the same as joy- your deceit robs you from joy. Oh well, you’ve been around teaching how to get into your heart, maybe you should really try it sometime &#61514;

So where will you choose to look for your answers?

Am I suggesting that we live in a vacuum while we seek for everything within like Jesus advised us too? I don’t think he meant it that way. It’s okay to share and brainstorm and treat each other like EQUALS. But the end of the day we go within and do this one thing we say we do but don’t REALLY know how to do completely.

We make sure that after being beat up by life and while we’re feeling at our lowest, we somehow let ourselves know that we love and cherish our being. That even though it can suck and it be difficult, we will only start feeling better when we acknowledge to ourselves, that THE most important SACRED gift of creator we OWN. It doesn’t matter if your choices are right or wrong, in the moment you give yourself a break, treat yourself like a friend, you will experience relief and start connecting to something higher.

That is the step we so often overlook while we are in student teacher mode. That is why I like to have more peer or friend type of relationship with my clients giving them possibilities. Not like a special chosen one, teacher or guru with secret knowledge.

Finding purpose is the single most rewarding experience to enlighten all the tough times. And I don’t have money or dreams to waste, do you?

Healing has to be founded in truth. Thank God-ness that my belief structure has always been based on listening and valuing my intuition instead of other peoples systems! Otherwise my whole world would have been shaken up after I realized the absolute deceit resonating in the New Age world- I was floored but only for a day or two.

Now I’m coming out of a mind control game with a whole new level of awareness of the types of deceit and trickery occurring on the forefront of the New Age movement. All or not whom they profess to be.

I like spiritual knowledge as much as the next guy. I too believe we need faith, hope and love to make this world a better place. But we must remember to connect our brains to our hearts. People entrust their lives to us!

So this writing is out of my love and respect for humanity, that is all. I respect you and your right to choose your path.

A few years ago a visit to Egypt changed my life. I sought out knowledge to explain some of my extraordinary experiences and eventually came across The Ancient Secret of the Flower of Life by Drunvalo Melchizedek.

I was longing for insight and so impressed- this author could explain exactly why I had the experiences I did. I had to skip over a good portion of the book. No math or physics wiz here, it was the first time I heard of Sacred Geometry or the Flower of Life.

Looking back, I can see how my lack of knowledge and excitement made me vulnerable. What conditions allowed me to take Drunvalo at face value, assuming “everything” he had to say was correct? Back then I assumed that he was a successful published author and I never heard anything bad about him. Until recently I hadn’t lifted thoroughly researched him.

In retrospect I see how having an extraordinary experience, like I did in Egypt, means going outside our circle since it wouldn’t be so extraordinary if everyone we know had the same experience. So we’re required to seek out new people with an open mind and trust we’ll be led to the answer.

But just because someone says they’re spiritual doesn’t make it true. I realize that I’ve often extended trust to people just because they seemed spiritual. Do all spiritual people tend to believe people that others are inherently good? Of course they do! Especially when it looks like their work is spiritual and is all about coming from the heart!

Okay let’s get to how I fell in mystical love with the work of Drunvalo.

Fast forward to June 2009. I watched the 30 hours of Flower of Life Workshop videos from 1992 in 4-5 days so I’m taking in a lot of material in a short time just like a live student would. It was so much material, but I meditate and my guides tell me it is much better to watch it all now.

So I do. I cannot believe the stuff this guy knows! I am willingly under his spell and I LIKE it! When I meditate again and ask if I should take a break my guides, they say it would be better to get this all done now. I interpreted these words as confirmation that Drunvalo is who he says he is, basically a messiah.

I was so impressed with the shear amount of dialog this man can remember! His calm demeanor and unlimited patience is endearing. He talked about living with little or no money. Okay I’m thinking I really like this guy and he’s not in for money or ego, just to help people ascend.

He says he lived off the land in Canada, but that his first wife felt she was going crazy because of all the spiritual happenings. When he lost his wife and he said he gave her every penny. What an amazing guy. To me that meant that not only does he have blind faith, he is a confident manifester! Awesome. Check, check… I’m like him even more.

I’m calling a few friends, trying to come up with ways they can get the tapes in other states, even out of the country! Some of this stuff is pretty wild but what do I really know? This guy has credibility because he’s been around for years. When are his workshops, I simply have to meet him. My guidance feels in check. I am more excited than ever, and I cannot believe I haven’t done this sooner.

Oh my God, I watched 2012 and Drunvalo says the world here will end in 2012, it’s hard to sleep for a few nights while I try to assimilate what this really means. Thank God I have a good friend who believes me! We chat for several days assimilating this information.

My understanding of energy, vibrations and higher dimensions help me imagine what Drunvalo is talking about. We’re stepping into the next “heart” 4th dimension where your desires happen instantly. No more polarity. I can understand how we don’t need our 3D world anymore. I’ll be okay and if I need too I can help my friends and parents who probably won’t make it over because they are just no where near understanding this information.

Wow, having this knowledge now, ahead most of the WORLDs population is amazing. I feel blessed, cursed, alone. I go through a life review. I think about my friends, the ones I can tell, the ones who probably won’t understand.

I think about the places I longed to go. I’ll never have the money to do it now. Well in 3 years I’ll be able to go wherever I want. All that’s important is love and doing my daily merkaba meditation so I can make it through these earth changes vibrating in love and consciousness.

I think about my credit card bills and figure since there’s no need to worry about money in 3 years, why worry about getting caught up? All that really matters is love and consciousness and Drunvalo – I have to see him, be near him in the physical before that is never possible again!
Oh my God, He has come from the same dimension that Jesus was from. I love Jesus, I would give my life for him. Oh my god, I love Drunvalo and would do anything to assist him in the most important mission in the world!

I want to note here, that I am being honest, not facetious. This is how I actually felt. I am a naturally open and trusting person…

Pause here to ask you a question: When you affect other peoples lives do you want to be responsible for what you tell them and how you affect them?

Back to my process: I gotta have more of Drunvalo’s wisdom… I watch “Through the Eyes of a Child”. (I think Hmmm I wonder if he’s talking about me?)

I’m a little tired when I start watching this and a very interesting thing starts to occur. Drunvalo is heavy hitting fascinating subjects; the Bible Code, Psychic children, magic water from Turkey and I am blown away but am also noticing that he’s having a bit of a hard time keeping his train of thought. Something is off. I tune in. Hmmm. In this video it’s almost like he’s scheming. Could that be? Absolutely not, No way it’s me I’m tired.

Back to the tape, Drunvalo pauses, looks up and comes out with the hugest claim yet. “I was too busy to get to see this magic turkey water but finally I got a call that said you have to be there so like all the big guys at the CIA, government and Sirius A are there. This water can power a lamp for a long time, scientifically proven… Okay I believe you it’s been scientifically proven- you are so freaking amazing!

Drunvalo goes on to say how a few drops of the “mother water” is then put into pure oil…”Now pure oil is the absolute worst, it’s at the end of life….but this special water turns the pure oil to WATER!!! The best water in the world!”

OHMYGOD, I am so blown away now that I call my friend and get online to buy so…While I’m at it I Join a Bible Code group because the freaking free software is too hard to find my name/date of birth and the date I’m going to die.

Hmmm…What is this? The company that makes the turkey water is calling Drunvalo bad names and naming his work Flower of Lies???? What is up? This company hates Drunvalo.

Okay so something happened to cause bad blood, but since they can’t even spell or form a paragraph they’re probably crazy, Drunvalo is still my man!

But let me go to his website and see what it says….

Hmmm an open letter from Drunvalo stating that the water wasn’t what it was cracked up to be. That’s weird, was he too trusting? …taken in by a scientific team?

-Uh oh… What is this? Legal documents talking about Copy write issues with a guy whose own family is calling him a psychopath and predator? This is starting to look like a conspiracy against a good guy, figures.

Next I find another letter from Drunvalo to Dan Winter, telling him not to refer to him anymore… Hmmm Then documentation that would certainly be easy to prove… Drunvalo continue to conduct workshops with him after that date. Hmmm. Well, let’s see maybe he believed that saving the humanity was more important than some 3d copy write laws…

But I’m extremely bothered by the next comment that appears about Drunvalo channels Lucifer. The entire document is non-emotional and well written so why would he say that out of the blue. It actually really bothered me that if it was out of anger someone would say something so damaging.

Let me look up some of the other inventions Dru has raved about. Oh my God. Wait I’m confused why does this report say that all of the special sacred geometric contraptions he promoted never came to be because they failed when the important people got involved? His Living in the Heart book blamed the government, saying they don’t want to clean up pollution because it serves their agenda.

That bothers me.

Next, I learn that Drunvalo has an enormously wealthy benefactor.

It seems that Drunvalo no longer has relationships with many of the people he talked about whether they it’s products he promoted, teachers or students. It seems that when people get close to certain truths they become part of an open letter that discredits them. I call some people…and they tell me that there life has actually been threatened. I still don’t buy it----completely, but I’m not complete brainwashed dummy something is up.

If Drunvalo is truthful no one would have a problem with that. But wouldn’t you wonder about the company he keeps if in fact he isn’t deliberately truthful?

But other things weren’t adding up either:

In one video he talks about how people can have curses and hexes without their knowledge that can affect them, and well I don’t think that in the context he shares this was very conscious at all. But not to worry because using his “methods” merkabah meditation he said you’ll be okay in no time.

1) As far as I know it’s the “belief” that someone can curse you which “allows” it to happen. And since that has always been able to help the one or two people who had believed they were cursed I’d say it works. No one should be made to believe you need a certain method but I get that he’s promoting his method. My point is it doesn’t sound like something Jesus or an ascended master would ever say.

2) I have never heard of anyone receiving the first and last names along with complete phone numbers of teachers they were instructed to call by their higher self or guides. If I remember correctly Drunvalo said, sort of bragged it, that he did it about twenty times.

3) An extremely odd thing to me was when Drunvalo says that his guide “Thoth” learned how to keep his body immortal with much less time after Drunvalo taught him the FOL meditation. So Thoth, an akashic record scribe that has not only seen and had access to every Atlantean and Egyptian ritual, must have missed a day (sorry it takes Drunvalo 4-5 days to teach this so it probably would have taken Thoth who’s a little slower at least 7) at school when the Flower of Life meditation was taught? Ask yourself it it seems highly unusual that since the Flower of Life, according to Drunvalo, stems from every indigenous “sacred” spot on the earth, that Thoth missed the meditation that would made Aknahten and Nefertiti immortal? (Did I forget to mention that Drunvalo knows that Aknahten and Nefertiti’s remains have never found because they practice the FOL meditation beneath the sphinxes paws?)

4) and wrote about it yet it is Drunvalo who saves Thoth one or two hours a day when he tells Thoth how to do the 17 breath meditation.

5) Drunvalo talks about people like he knows them but I’ve heard many teachers and others say they’ve never worked with him. He said that Al Gore was aware that there was “nothing that could be done” but he says that Al (he’s on a first name basis and he knows this is a fact) is too afraid to say anything. What a travesty. How about all the people who are working on going green, on righting a wrong we have done to Mother Earth? Drunvalo says if it makes us feel better there is nothing wrong with that, but it won’t change whets coming 2012. Well, he caveats this by saying at least that’s the information he’s getting now.

6) I’m seeing a pattern here. People talking about coming from the future back in time, or people that remember their every moment at night when they sleep and visit with the ascended masters. (..did you know that you can talk to Jesus anytime?) Many teachers right now are using this and then come back and do workshops so they can tell us what is going on. Much of the information is given freely but then there is a long expensive workshop or program that takes a year to complete. Again, I think it’s great to study whatever you want, I just want you to see if you see a pattern with teachers saying they have information you need to go to the next dimension or to ascend with.

7) I am looking into the future and here’s what I see…Spiritual teachers have been saying right along that “their group” or work with the ascended masters has averted the past predicted disasters. So what do you think will happen in “2012”? They’ll be fighting over who saved the day.

8) What do you call the disorder where someone thinks they are bigger and mightier than Jesus, Thoth and Nostradamus?

In an interview [link to www.v-j-enterprises.com] he sums up exactly what I heard on one of his tapes: Q: How could you characterize Melchizedek consciousness relative to Christ consciousness? Drunvalo: The difference is that Melchizedek consciousness is formless in its original state. Christ consciousness was that aspect that began to integrate into the possibility of form and manifestation. While I was under his spell during the 30 hours of Flower of Life and other workshop videos I was thinking Holy Christ this guy is the Holy Christ!

He then goes onto ask whether we’ve noticed that Nostradamus was correct until 1972 (the year Drunvalo was a walk-in 4-10-1972) In 1972, an experiment was initiated on this planet (by several races external to this planet, headed primarily by the Sirians and another race of beings within our solar system) that began in the middle of February 1972. This experiment has escalated into a series of events that have led to this extraordinary situation we are in. In the beginning, the Earth was really just a speck of dust in the middle of nowhere. In this galaxy alone, at least 80,000 other worlds were, almost identical to the situation we were in prior to 1972. On Earth, the situation began to go into a totally new pathway never seen before. It began to attract that attention of people from everywhere, even at the center of the galaxy, because it was something brand new. All of life began to focus on Earth. That itself is incredible, because attention itself affects the way or outcome of events. The ascended masters, which are the cream of our particular evolutionary pattern who have gone ahead of us, who thought they understood exactly what was going on, began to act confused and didn't know what to do in many cases because every time they turned around they encountered a situation where there was no known memory pattern to deal with it. They think they know what they are doing now, but everybody is winging it.

Now, it appears to us that God, outside of this created experiment, is taking us to another level of existence beyond our imagination or what we can possibly dream of. It's a total recall. We are going home ... not just home, back to the original cycle of things, but back before this was ever created. Something real big is happening. Because of this, it requires a different viewpoint from the one we have held for a long time.


*4-10-72 which I believe was also the day the bullshit meter stopped working, now known as the “real” day out of time.

9) Drunvalo tells an interesting story about not finishing college at Berkeley because he didn’t need the diploma. Did he actually attend school at all, I wonder. By his own admission he has copied about everything-giving-credit from other people. But when he does come up with his own stuff that he says is based in science other professors and professionals don’t agree with him.
10) Drunvalo said a crystal, scientifically proven over and over with water and electricity running thru it will produce a living insect. Why has this never ever been documented?

Ask yourself: If a person was dishonest, where would they want to weave tall stories? In an industry of open minded or closed minded people? In a genre where people are looking for the etheric connection or not?

People have to make a stretch when they first get into healing and working with energy. It’s something that requires willingness beyond what you can see.

All a deceitful person has to do is form a foundation that gets you believing in their knowledge and more importantly “heart”. Think about this. In the beginning of a relationship most people are pay more attention to the nuances of statements and actions of the other. But there is this point you pass where you make a decision “to trust” them. Now they are given privileges they have “earned” from you.

So if someone wants to manipulate you to believe in what they are telling you in the new world I began to notice a pattern.

Like all good teachers, they earn your trust by making themselves out to be an expert in their field.

Now if you’ve been in the new age field awhile, ask yourself whether you have stopped
1) Checking sources or attempting to validate the information from anyone else
2) Obviously you don’t want to use people that are friends, students or peers
Let me point out that a very good friend who is an extremely trustworthy teacher of over 30 years in Reiki believed Drunvalo without checking into his past history or for accuracy in his statements that could have been verified thru physics, math and sacred geometry.

Answer this for yourself,

“If a new teacher convinced you of their intelligence would you be less likely to doubt statements that you had little or no knowledge of?”

I watched all of the 1992 Flower of Life videos and Drunvalo spends the first two days on telling you it’s going to be difficult but necessary to get through these first couple of days but it is necessary to put down the ground work.

Looking back I ask myself, What kind of teacher isn’t able to start from Point A and get to his point, without two days of background info? Okay I knew you might say that, so I will concede…I know nothing about Sacred Geometry so I needed a crash course.

The problem is I am fairly intelligent and I never really saw a spiritual or physical connection to what Drunvalo was saying. Ask yourself “if” someone was attempting to brainwash you, might they try and convince you to see the world in a different way than you ever saw it?

Once they get you over that hump most people stop using discrimination. True teachers EMPOWER YOU TO USE WHAT YOU ALREADY KNOW. A wise friend said to me that all my falling for Drunvalo’s knowledge of how the world was created based in me believing that meant something. Jesus or God doesn’t require us to know how the world was created in order to go home. It is simply our intention.

I don’t want to leave you cold and dry and shocked like Drunvalo left me. So I say this to you. God, Creator, Jesus, Buddha or whatever you desire to believe in, is yours for the asking. No one can ever take that away from you, unlike lies which we should want to shed.

If you are confused, “ASK the higher presence you believe in, to bring forth the truth in a way you can understand it.”

If Drunvalo is lying, which I believe 100%, that’s unconscious so ask that any untruths fall away from you or be uncovered. “That” is “your” God given right!

You are not alone, in the midst of trying to find hope, love and inspiration and mistrusting people like this we “are building” our dreams.

Don’t lose your dream or my writing has not empowered you. Rather, strip away the untruths that other told you was required for your dream. Your dream will shine brighter in Your heart, your life, and your future.

I am so sorry for the moments of shock and anger that we must go through when we find out we fell for something that was meant to exploit us. But it is a blink in your life, and the power you take back from false gods will resonate again in within you.

After my “Drunvalo” awakening I started thinking about all the people involved with him. WOW I thought to be at their levels they surely heard that Drunvalo started out broke in a school bus, cheated everyone out their portion of the proceeds from the beginnings of Nakkal Mystery school. Refused to pay taxes. Etc.

Do you care about the practices you use as a healer? Whether you hurt or help them?

Do you want to be separate from your loved ones based on a belief that was a lie?

What is really important to me?

So have I been gullible in my life, Oh yes! I believed a man who told me he lost his arm from a tiger who bit it off at a zoo. Some people find great pleasure in seeing what they can get you to believe. It is pure liquid power for them. But who is dumb or wrong, the person telling the lie or being lied to? That is a deep question isn’t it? One thing about me, I learned long ago never to fear the truth. I really learned how each and every time, if I faced the truth I was free. I value my freedom. I’m not a person who fears judgment, I have integrity and as long as I can tell you my truth, I honor myself and you.


Drunvalo’s past:
Why does Drunvalo’s nephew, another liar Ken Page say that Drunvalo died in 1971…Hmmm another lie, Drunvalo said it was April 1972….
Here is the bio from his nephew: (see full bio at the end)
1971. The story ended when he was poisoned and died. He held me in his steady gaze waiting to make sure that what he had told me had taken root. "Don is dead," he explained seriously. "I am Akbar now." I understood. Akbar was the being that had come in to inhabit his body after Don left. It was like a sublease. I understood subleases. My uncle didn't take his eyes off of me. "Akbar," I said experimentally, trying out the feel of it on my tongue. No problem. Instead of my ultracool Uncle Don I now had the wise and mysterious Uncle Akbar. Everybody should be so lucky. Uncle Don was Uncle Akbar for only a few years. Today he's widely known as Drunvalo Melchizedek.
After all of this I went to youtube and looked at a 1999 video of Gregg Braden (I have never been attracted to his books). It was as though Drunvalo was in the audience coaching him. Check it out for yourself…I realized there must be a template for new age con artists and this is a proven method, bla bla bla
Does it seem odd to you that everytime a person would mention a catastrophe-like an earthquake- he would look at the camera and try not too laugh? He is like testing the waters to thinking there is just no way they’ll buy this. I bet he looks at his bank statement scratching his head going they believe all this shit. The format of Gregg’s workshop is the Drunvalo all over again.
I started looking at all the people connected to Drunvalo and you know what it’s a lot. You know what else they owe it to their students and audience to answer why they are involved with people like Drunvalo. I called a friend with my new awareness and she said “Oh yeah I hear a lot like James Twyman’s secretary who found magic powder…I’m like what are you talking about having never read his books either, she says oh he made a million in the first week his spoon bending kits were out.
So I look him up and sure enough it’s one of the scam template websites that get you all pumped up, just send 39.95 but old James is using magic powder evidently for his demonstration.
The list of people connected with Drunvalo is deep.
Did I mention that I DID check other resources, I called people and got eyewitness info. I will not put there names here because they have been threatened and asked me not too. Drunvalo cheated people out of money, he lies about his ex-wives and says his abandoned children were by immaculate consent. I finally understood that his tactics, by his own admission, was to attract
Do you think Jesus would be restrained from seeing his own children? Do YOU?
The point is good people it is up to you to check your background info, don’t get mad at people who do and try to alert you. Check it out yourself, take responsibility -you have no one else to answer too.
I did – I did not want to believe it and then I felt like a FOOL for all the tall tales I fell for. But that was a mere blink and now I have my precious life to help people. I spent two days writing this to help you and a month going through Drunvalo’s lies.
But today is July 4th, 2009 and I am truly free. My love for humanities innate goodness blazes more brilliantly now than ever…
God Bless You,
signed, “A Child of God, Just Like You”

Here is the full bio from Ken Page,
Blue Lake
The haunting sound of the words "Blue Lake" chanted over and over that I had heard one night in my backyard at Clear Lake continued to echo in my mind long afterwards. A few months after I heard the chanting, in 1985, I felt compelled to write to the Taos Pueblo to ask permission to take my crystal to Blue Lake. I also felt compelled to enclose another crystal from my collection with the letter, as a kind of a token and as a way for them to experience my vibration. About six weeks later, I got a letter back from the Pueblo. The imposing letterhead read: War Council. The War Council, the letter said, had met to consider my request but for reasons that they were unable to share, they could not permit me to go to Blue Lake at this time. The crystal that I had sent them would be waiting at the pueblo offices anytime that I wanted to come and pick it up. I was disappointed. It seemed immensely important to me to bring the crystal to Blue Lake; I had felt sure that the wise old men of the pueblo would see the truth of this as well. I was weary of presiding over my bankrupt businesses and wanted to accomplish something that would give my life meaning again. When I looked for a silver lining in the cloud that had descended around me, I thought of my Uncle Donny. When I was four years old, my mother moved back to my grandparents' house in Oakland to regroup after her divorce. My grandfather was Donny's father. Donny was nine years old at the time, and I was a nuisance to him, but I followed him around like a puppy anyway. The essential nature of our relationship remained unchanged for many years. I would trail him around just as doggedly whenever our families co-mingled for the various holidays that held meaning for us. Finally, the war in Vietnam sundered us, as it sundered so many other families in the 1960's. Donny was called up early, in 1961, and I didn't know what happened to him afterwards other than that he stopped coming home to Oakland for Christmas. Our lives diverged from that point forward: unlike Donny, who was drafted, I enlisted in the National Guard and eighteen months later I was working my way up through the ranks of General Cable, on my way to becoming a millionaire. Donny's unexpected life after the war, was the fulfillment of a pattern that began when he was born nearly seventeen years after his closest sibling. You never knew what Donny was going to do, was all my grandfather would say. Donny sent them postcards from places like Afghanistan and Tibet, and only my mother, a lifelong Rosicrucian, seemed to have any idea what he was up to. For my part, when I thought of him I remembered his legendary chariots: the new black 1958 Chevy my grandfather bought him when he was 16 and the MG Midget he bought the year after. Washing Donny's MG when I was thirteen was one of my earliest religious experiences. Now, our paths were coming together again. I had an exciting new job running a hologram company, and my vision of creating a hologram of Jesus required me to travel to Santa Fe to oversee the creation of the detailed miniature sculpture that I planned to photograph with laser beams. I knew that Don was living in Taos, New Mexico, and I resolved to look him up. I knew next to nothing about crystals and something had told me that Don was the man that I needed to talk to. I pulled up outside of Don's place in my rented Lincoln Towne Car, nattily attired in one of the many dark three piece suits that I wore like uniforms in those days. He lived in a small one bedroom house, at the end of a long gravel road, next to a weathered converted school bus that he used as a guest house and office. Several cords of wood were stacked up under the eaves advertising the coming winter. The door swung open. A man stood in front of me who had shoulder-length hair and a beard like a hippie. The warm air drifting past him smelled of wood smoke and incense. Was this my uncle? I stuck out my hand. "Hi Don," I said. "It's Ken." Don studied me solemnly as he returned my handshake. "I knew that someone from my family was coming," he replied, "I just didn't know who." He looked at me some more and then I followed him inside. "I need to tell you a story," he said. I sat down and got ready to listen. I liked stories. Don told me about the year he spent living off of the land in British Columbia in 1971. The story ended when he was poisoned and died. He held me in his steady gaze waiting to make sure that what he had told me had taken root. "Don is dead," he explained seriously. "I am Akbar now." I understood. Akbar was the being that had come in to inhabit his body after Don left. It was like a sublease. I understood subleases. My uncle didn't take his eyes off of me. "Akbar," I said experimentally, trying out the feel of it on my tongue. No problem. Instead of my ultracool Uncle Don I now had the wise and mysterious Uncle Akbar. Everybody should be so lucky. Uncle Don was Uncle Akbar for only a few years. Today he's widely known as Drunvalo Melchizedek. Until I met Drunvalo I had thought that a walk-in was someone who showed up for a haircut without an appointment. A walk-in, I learned, was the name popularized by the writer Ruth Montgomery for a soul who enters a fully grown body without being inconvenienced by the birth process. In essence we are all walk-ins; ours is a fairly young universe and we all came here from somewhere else. I have since come to believe that a walk-in is almost always a higher aspect of the original birth soul, after I went through the process myself. People, I would find out, changed all the time. Once we got past the formalities, I found out that Drunvalo really did have a lot to tell me about crystals. The first thing that he told me was that they weren't just rocks: They were living beings, growing and changing all of the time. He showed me how to glean information from a crystal, by holding it to my forehead while mentally asking it a question. He also explained how crystals could hold immense amounts of energy, either positive or negative, and could thus be used either to hurt or heal people. They had even, he said, found out how to trap all of the energy of a nuclear explosion in a tiny crystal that you could hold in your hand. Now as in antiquity, crystals were still the ultimate weapon. The next day he introduced me to Katrina Raphael, who wrote the book Crystal Enlightenment, and two companion volumes. We spent the day hiking and she told me even more about crystals. By the end of the trip I couldn't think of any more questions to ask about them. On the evening before I left, Drunvalo made me a gift of a crystal he had been holding for a year and a half, and a book, Joy's Way by Brugh Joy. He touched the crystal. "I didn't know where it was supposed to go," he said, "but now I see that it belongs to you, Ken." I had to come back up to northern New Mexico a few weeks later and this time Drunvalo came with me when I went to the offices of the Taos Pueblo to retrieve the crystal that I had sent with my letter. A big barrel-chested man with smiling dark eyes called out to us as we stepped out the building. Drunvalo introduced me to Jimmy, an old friend of his who lived on the pueblo. He and Drunvalo knew each other very well, although there were long spaces in their friendship occasioned by Jimmy's bouts with alcohol. At the moment, Jimmy was on the wagon and bone dry. He nodded seriously when I told him about my failed attempt to get permission from the pueblo to go to Blue Lake. "I was there, man," he said. "They said no because they're worried about witchcraft going on up there. That place is too powerful. Can't take chances." In fact, as I later found out, they were careful enough to post armed guards over the trail most of the year. When I found out more about Blue Lake I was glad that they did. Not only was it a very powerful place, but it was linked energetically to other sacred sites all over the world. The Taos Tribe was right to protect it. I took out the crystal that the war council had returned to me unopened and handed it to Jimmy. It was beautiful, clear, and double-terminated. I knew right away that I had to give it to him, and so I did. Jimmy held it up to the light and admired it. A smile stole over his craggy features like the sun coming up over a mountain. "I'll take you there," he suddenly announced. My heart jumped like a fish after a fly. Drunvalo slapped me on the back and hooted. We were going to Blue Lake after all. A few weeks later, Jimmy called me in California. I rented a Towne Car again in Albuquerque and drove up to Taos. Jimmy lived in an old double-wide trailer that the wind ripped through like cheesecloth. We sat up and talked as the wind whistled all around us and the propane furnace roared ineffectually at it like an old bully. Jimmy told me about Perona, an old man of seventy-six, the Kiva Indian, who was in charge of the spiritual education of the young children on the pueblo. Perona was so knowledgeable that he could spend an entire month just teaching the children about the sun and the moon. Although Perona was Jimmy's uncle, they were as close as father and son, and so it was natural for Jimmy to tell the older man about our planned trip to Blue Lake. Perona was instantly very concerned about what we were doing. The night after he talked to Jimmy, he placed two crossed eagle feathers across his chest and asked for a medicine dream to show him the truth of what we were attempting. The dream brought good news for all of us. Perona told Jimmy that what we were doing would change the world, and he insisted on coming. By that point, we were all very excited. Neither of us thought for a moment that the journey we were attempting might possibly be dangerous. The only sign I had that anything was amiss was the unseasonably cold weather and the fact that Jimmy told me they were having trouble catching the horses. The next morning we drove up to Jimmy's "ranch" in his old pickup truck. His ranch was really just a lean-to and a corral on the land where he kept his animals. Perona was already waiting there for us with only two saddled horses. There were three of us. I looked over at Jimmy in shock. He shrugged. It was a famous shrug that many native people affected. The shrug contained the entire history of his people. It was a shrug that acknowledged the theft of everything they owned, the murders of their grandparents, the pain of seeing the daily rape of the earth by men who cared nothing for it. It was a shrug that put one missing horse in its proper perspective. Perona greeted me warmly, and made a few jokes about the weather. I could tell right away from looking at him why he knew so much about the sun and the moon: The three of them had obviously spent a lot of time together. His gray hair was pulled back in a braid, and had deep laugh lines around his mouth from a lifetime of smiling. It was plain that losing a horse meant even less to him than it did to Jimmy; they were both as tough as tempered steel and would have walked barefoot if they had to. Both of them were wearing just jeans, cowboy boots, and light plaid wool jackets, even though it had been raining since before dawn. I was completely charmed by their refusal to be ruffled by the most adverse of circumstances. It was shining evidence of their faith in the Creator. Being charmed didn't stop me from handing out the two rain ponchos that I'd stuffed in my pack at the last minute. Jimmy's girlfriend pulled the truck away in a cloud of blue smoke. I watched the heated cab and the taillights recede down the snow-covered road and wondered what I'd got myself into. A few moments later we were off, with me hanging grimly onto the saddle behind Perona like somebody in a western who had lost his horse in a poker game. Things didn't look too bad, at first. The rain gave way to huge wet flakes of snow that floated down slowly like cinders from a great fire somewhere beyond the clouds. The trail, which led to a picnic ground by the side of a river, was wide and well trodden, and a little ways down it a great snowy owl flew across the river in front of us, its majestic wings beating with hypnotic slowness. We exchanged knowing glances. We all knew that owls were powerful medicine animals. What I didn't know was that the Lakota, believe that the owl, which they call Hinhan, represents death, calling the name of those whose time it was to die. The owl spirit, Hinhan Nagi, guards the spirit road that leads to the milky way. Those travelers that weren't ready for the journey it hurled back down to earth to become wandering ghosts. Before the day was out, this story would acquire a kind of uncanny resonance for me. Once we passed the snow-blanketed abandoned picnic site, the trail all but disappeared. I looked between Jimmy and Perona for clues but they continued to impassively urge the horses forward. We were following a river up to Blue Lake rather than taking the usual trail because of the weather. Plainly, no one else had taken the river route in quite some time. The trail was blocked over and over by blown-down pines that had obviously been there since the previous winter. We had to cross and recross the river over and over to get around them, and each time we did it got harder and harder to pick up the trail again in the snow. My down jacket was turning into an expensive feather sponge and Perona's jeans were dark down to his knees from the melting snow. The banks of the narrow defile we were in rose up gray and foreboding on either side of us like the walls of a prison as the horses clattered from one side of the shallow river to the other. Finally, the trail seemed to completely disappear and we paused in the riverbed to confer like thwarted bloodhounds. The breath of the horses steamed faintly. I thought about the water that coursed around their ankles and how it was propelled upward by their energy and how it would fall again as rain and eventually find its way back to its mother the sea. My reverie abruptly ended as I felt the back legs of the horse buck hard underneath me. I peered upwards. The trail, it seemed, went straight up the embankment. I couldn't see Jimmy anywhere. I stared apprehensively around Perona's poncho, my knuckles white around the edge of the saddle. A ragged line of gray circles in the snow broadcast Jimmy's progress, longer streaks telegraphing where his horse had slipped on the slick wet rock beneath the snow. He had already gained the ridge over the river and was lost in a bend among the trees but our horse was balking. Jimmy's horse had slipped and it had carried a balanced load of only half our weight. Perona grunted and urged the horse forward with his legs. It trembled beneath us, drawing every muscle as taut as a bowstring in an effort to stop us all from sliding backwards as we jerked and lunged our way up the side of the embankment. I glanced nervously back at the dark outline of the river where it scissored through the snow thirty feet below. Perona spoke reassuringly to the horse, encouraging him forward again. Then all hell broke loose. The horse lunged desperately as it started to slide backwards. Perona hollered at it. The horse kicked backwards and then my head slammed into Perona's back as the horse's hooves flailed desperately at some unseen beast in the air in front of us. The next thing I knew the ground was a white blur rushing up at me and then I was rolling down the side of the defile. I fetched up hard against a stump. Still in one piece and anesthetized by adrenaline, I jumped quickly up to see if Perona was okay. He wasn't. I saw Perona twenty feet above me, bent low over the horse's neck as it trembled and shook beneath him. The slope beneath them was as steep and as slick as a wet slate roof. Perona clung to the horse's neck and whispered in its ear as it snorted and blew steam out of its nostrils. It jerked forward spasmodically like it was electrocuted and then started to slide backward in earnest, scrabbling helplessly against the black wet rocks beneath the snow until it slid backwards into the carcass of a big blown-down pine that we had crossed on the way up. They stayed there for a moment-the horse, the rider, and the tree-all balanced together like some improbable circus act. The dead tree creaked and shifted like an unruly sleeper. The horse panicked and reared up. I saw it teeter on its great trembling back legs like a movie stallion, and then horse, rider, and tree all parted ways. Perona flew backwards through the air like he was shot from a cannon, landed hard in the rocks, snow and gravel ten feet below me, and somersaulted out of view. The horse, twisting in midair like a leaping dolphin, landed on its side with a sickening thud and rolled, flailing helplessly down the embankment to finish up thrashing and screaming in the river. I heard a low rumble and the sound of splintering wood above me, and turned just in time to see a dark greasy slick in the snow like it had just been plowed and to feel the impact as the dead pine tree slid into the backs of my legs and pitched me forward. I saw myself throw my hands out just in time to stop me from opening my head up on the gray rock that jutted cruelly up in front of me like a shark's dorsal fin. I felt nothing. I had left my body to watch the whole thing from a safe perch far above the creek. I knew right away that I'd died here before at this very spot, on that very rock, in a past life and I had fled my body before I had to relive it a second time. I saw myself struggling. My foot was pinned behind the stump, leaving me hanging face-down over the side of the gorge with my leg at an impossible angle. Perona was on his hands and knees in the river, shaking his head while water streamed off of him. The horse had just struggled to its feet and was staggering around in shock like a foal that couldn't find its mother. I heard a muttered curse from Jimmy who had ridden back to see what all of the crashing and screaming was about and then I was right back in my body, suspended helplessly over that killer rock, trying to stem the pain in my leg by holding onto a dry branch over my head. Jimmy ran up to me and tried to shift the tree but it was hopeless. It was as long as a telephone pole and the roots were jammed down in the riverbed. Perona was on his knees in the water, holding onto his hips and grimacing with each breath. Jimmy slid down to the river to check on him and when Perona nodded something to him he splashed over in his cowboy boots to the scraggly root end of the tree that pinned me. He surveyed it for a moment and then dropped to his knees in the icy water to get his shoulder underneath a branch. He grabbed the tree under the water and put everything he had into lifting it. I felt the tree shift, not much, but just enough to work my foot out from behind the stump. I lowered myself gingerly from the branch that I was hanging onto. My foot hurt like hell but I could put my weight on it. I waved at Jimmy, who was already leading Perona out of the river. We looked like the survivors of a war, but we were alive. We regrouped on the other side of the river. Perona moved slowly, holding his side. The horse was still shaking. Exhilarated by what I saw as my triumph over death and numbed by the excitement, I was bruised all over but still ready to lead the charge to Blue Lake. I felt the energy from the crystal in my knapsack urging me on. It wasn't until we discovered that Perona had broken several of his ribs that I realized we'd been defeated. As the adrenaline wore off, the cold came stealing in. We rode back down the gorge for what seemed like hours until we came to a small clearing where we could build a fire. Perona collected moss from beneath the trees while Jimmy scouted around, breaking dry dead wood from the lower branches. Much to my surprise we soon had a roaring fire going and we sat steaming around it like baking potatoes, trading stories and tearing into the french bread and cheese I'd brought up from San Francisco, the only food we had. I was concerned that our accident was some kind of omen. Jimmy and Perona shook their heads at the same time. They saw resistance as a positive sign, like the spring in a sapling. What we were doing was very important, they asserted. Otherwise, why had the Creator seen fit to test our resolve in this way?
Perona walked most of the ten miles back to Jimmy's ranch, claiming that he was starting to stiffen up. When we got there at eight 'o clock it was raining and bitterly cold. There was no sign of Jimmy's girlfriend or his pickup truck. We turned the horses out and started out to walk the three miles back to the Pueblo. Jimmy's girlfriend skidded up in a cloud of blue smoke a mile later.
I packed up quickly back at the trailer, wary of getting snowed in at Taos, said good-bye, closed the big door of my rented Lincoln and then I was instantly back in the world that I had left behind, a world that Jimmy and Perona had never known. I drove through Taos listening to soft music on the radio, while the heater clicked and whirred, and the wipers chased the huge flakes of snow back and forth across the windshield.
I had no idea what had gone wrong with my mission, or why it had nearly cost us our lives. I still don't know today. Perhaps the owl spirit, Hinhan Nagi, had found us wanting and hurled us down the mountain for our impetuousness. Sioux men wore secret spiritual tattoos on their wrists which were said to secure Hinhan's blessing as they journeyed to the Milky Way. All that I had was my determination. I knew that I would return to Blue Lake, until the time came when I heard that owl call my name if I had to, and I was taking that crystal with me.
Out in Space

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07/04/2009 11:56 AM
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Re: Drunvalo channeling LUCIFER etcetc.. and JIRKA RYSAVY..
".........One thing about me, I learned long ago never to fear the truth. I really learned how each and every time, if I faced the truth I was free. I value my freedom. I’m not a person who fears judgment, I have integrity and as long as I can tell you my truth, I honor myself and you."

Thanks for the info.

Been down the same road, different names, different situations but still........the same road.

Namaste
Truth in its purest form can be considered the aristocracy of spirituality, and therefore must be sought out in all its dimensions.
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10/05/2009 03:24 PM
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Re: Drunvalo channeling LUCIFER etcetc.. and JIRKA RYSAVY..
...Looking back I see what my real test was. Anyone exploring their spiritual nature must pass this test. Perhaps my journey will help you have a the same awakening.

If you don’t pass this “test” of looking within and discerning truth you certainly cannot ascend to the next level.

A false prophet cannot hold divine truth.

 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 718017


Indeed, you have helped. Thank you for your insight. I, too, was greatly enamored with Drunvalo, but sensed something was not quite right. In my seeking, I was led to this post. My path, beliefs, and sacrifices sound very much like yours.

Namaste
religious meme
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10/20/2009 04:53 AM
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Re: Drunvalo channeling LUCIFER etcetc.. and JIRKA RYSAVY..
I had heard this, I have seen Stan speak, I have also seen Drunvalo speak. If I had to choose who I believe, I would back Drunvalo, He seems to be more Loved filled.

Stan seems to be more technical and not as "enlightened"
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 0




This pisses me the eff off that he said this, just bec you believe in science does not mean you disbelieve god, in fact newton devoted his life 2 understanding god, about 70% of his work, and 30% 2 science, but yet you would question his belief system. Sum of get into science 2 understand god better than being drone 2 a possible myth. I doubt my love and compassion i have for humanity and god can be surpassed a lot of spiritual people because trough science i learned 2 love more, care more.

Anonymous Coward is a great title 4 you
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Re: Drunvalo channeling LUCIFER etcetc.. and JIRKA RYSAVY..
adminpower gives wthread feedtroll cupofjoe
Jediwookie
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03/11/2010 01:50 PM
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Re: Drunvalo channeling LUCIFER etcetc.. and JIRKA RYSAVY..
yoda



So far, the only offenses that I see in regards to Dan Winter though, are the acts of teaching things that cross the teachings of another. Regardless of who came up with the associated ideas first, information is information. I do not understand why anyone wanting to pass on sacred knowledge would want to copyright that information. Stan Tenen no more owns the rights to the information that he shares, than does any man own the carbon he borrows to manifest in 3rd Density Reality. Information manifests in one way or another within humanity, and the messenger is not important. It is the message that matters. I have always been skeptical of Drunvalo, but I have no disputes with Dan Winter's work. Regardless of his background or history, I take him on his message and how it is affecting people's lives. I've been deeply dedicated to alternative information and views for a long time, and Dan has a more rounded picture of reality than most that I have ever encountered. Yes, at times he may seem overly confident in his work, but it is reflected by sound science and established from a theoretical approach to physics which is being proven by other brilliant minds and applied in a real-life way by Dan. This claim is not judgement upon Stan Tenen, but calls into question the attempt at claiming ownership of such ideas. It's sad that money and the concept of ownership gets in the way of fruitful learning, where we waste time (as I'm doing here now) to have discussions about who owns the rights to this or that idea. Ownership is an illusion, and it is only manufactured scarcity which makes us cling to that which provides for us with such force and vigor. I hope one day we can let go of such formalities at the behest of an abundant society, and live life in service to others and not ourselves as we are all guilty of this in some way.
gus.

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05/28/2010 05:03 AM

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Re: Drunvalo channeling LUCIFER etcetc.. and JIRKA RYSAVY..
Yes WIO and others. I'm also aware of Drunvalo's real agenda .


He just released a new video: Thread: NEW VIDEO! Drunvalo Melchizedek: "THE BIRTH OF A NEW HUMANITY" UPDATED NEW BETTER QUALITY

and it's full of disinformation. He's pushing the "we must save the planet" theory. He's assuming that humanity ascends as a whole. He is putting out that spiritual hierarchy crap of "ascended masters". He is assuming that everyone is at the same ordinary level of consciousness and that our destiny is to rise in a new spiritual world order of the ages under FEMALE RULE.

Drunvalo is all about ET agenda for humanity. That humans buy into collectivism and oneness doctrine and rise as a whole to the "4th dimension" to create a new spiritual order of the ages. This is the pseudo-spiritual version of the NWO, and with ET rule instead of an elite of people.

ET societies evolve as a hive-mind collective. This is what Luciferian consciousness represent: lack of free will for the individual. And this is what Drunvalo represents with his overall theme of alien (if aliens are demons, then make it "satanic" as well) spirituality. Or maybe it's something even more sinister. I definitely don't discard the reptilian theory about him. Look at him. OK maybe I'm being judgmental, but look at him. HE doesn't look like a very healthy individual to me. There is something behind that facade of "love and light".

Amazon review:

Drunvalo is great at telling stories of synchronistic adventures and avant-garde metaphysical info, including angelic guides and ETs who are shaping the destiny of our civilization. [gus: bling! bling!! New Age / ET AGENDA! alien spirituality! new age spiritual hierarchy bullshit!] In this new book Drunvalo describes how he was guided to participate in ceremonies at sacred sites using sacred objects to assist in the transition of the Earth's kundalini energy line from Tibet across to South America [gus: they are probably tampering with the energy grid to prepare alien takeover here or fuck with the ascending energies, though, of course, it is useless against those who are destined to graduate., and the shift from masculine to feminine energy dominance [gus: HAHAHHAHA FEMALE / REPTILIAN DOMINANCE -> NOTICE: "SERPENT" OF LIGHT] foreseen accompanying the end of the Mayan Calendar in 2012. Drunvalo has some remarkable stories to tell and meets a variety of native elders and shamans as he completes his journey [gus: read, agenda.].
 Quoting: [link to www.amazon.com]


Whats up with the merkaba studies? Do we need to learn how to aquire the merkaba? Is it for real? It is also to adjust our DNA. Could you comment on this? Have you read about Drunvalo or Anna Hayes? They work on the merkaba.

Stewart's Reply: Yes I am familiar with this information, or should I say, disinformation. The merkaba symbol is simply a star tetrahedron. The word, merkaba, comes from an old Hebrew word and means, Roman Chariot. It has nothing to do with what these people are saying. They work for organizations closely attached to the Illuminati. It is designed to weaken you. If you use the star tetrahedron in gold or violet, it acts as a protection device. Everyone must decide for themselves what is true. I can only tell you what I know when asked.
 Quoting: [link to www.expansions.com]



I believe Drunvalo falls into the category of those spiritual gurus teaching people to install astral blocks (the Mer-ka-ba seminars) disguised as astral protection and selling pseudo-spiritual beliefs that will get people as easy prey once they get there in the astral. Also, check out Drunvalo's last book "The serpent of light", about the new spiritual age and how women will rise to power. Lols, female dominance is reptilian agenda dude. Men hold the key for spirituality. Women hold the key for maintenance and perpetuation of physical life. The Orion reptilian empire is female dominated. And how about "serpent of light"??? Oh, I see, our "ascension" depends on DNA activation?? What about spiritual activation? DNA is PROGRAMMING. We don't need PROGRAMMING to ASCEND. This DNA activation stuff is alien spirituality.

12-strand DNA activation is disinformation:



Valdamar Valerian used to work with Drunvalo in the Matrix series of books. Well, Valerian has completely dismissed the first 4 books as "not containing any useful paradigm" and guess what: books 3 and 4 has a lot of drunvalo's material. Valerian was humble enough to dismiss his own work as outdated and useless, and that is when he went to work on Matrix 5 and 6.

On this planet we have diversity on all levels, INCLUDING diversity of levels of consciousness. There is no miracle ascension or change that will instantly enlighten Mr. Average Joe on the street. This is complete bullshit. What we have now is a possibility for change, a window for change and physical ascension (NOT SPIRITUAL ASCENSION) to 4th dimension for those WHO REALLY WANT IT AND HAVE PREPARED THEMSELVES FOR IT. Only those who desire change on a personal level and have been preparing themselves for it will experience overall positive things, because they will embrace the exterior changes. The others who live in inertia and are spiritually dead will be in denial as soon as the changes commence, and the possibility for enlightenment will be instead a nightmare for them.

Freedom from Drunvalo Blog:

[link to freddomfromsteriotype.blogspot.com]

Last Edited by gus. on 05/28/2010 07:21 PM
The Final Truth - A Theory of Practice
[link to www.conspiracybase.com]
Anonymous Coward
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11/05/2011 12:57 PM
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Re: Drunvalo channeling LUCIFER etcetc.. and JIRKA RYSAVY..
68...Drunvalo tries to come across as with GREAT HUMILITY.. until you catch him in one of his lies.

.( his real name is Bernard Parona.. and he said in his bio he took the body of a student in physics at UCBERKELEY...oh, i forgot to say.. out of the kindness of his snakey heart@)

which i have.. etc.. i suggest if you get close to him.. go up and give him a hug.. i did .. it was as though i was hugging a pole.. without substance.. soul.. etc.....his facilitator Dawn said the same thing to me.. and said she thought it was odd.. but didnt know what to think.. i do.. cold SNAKE!

ah ho WIO
 Quoting: WIO 0



I HAVE HAD THE SAME EXPERIENCE! HE IS A REPTILLIAN HOST.
Anonymous Coward
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12/05/2011 10:55 AM
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Re: Drunvalo channeling LUCIFER etcetc.. and JIRKA RYSAVY..
Yes WIO and others. I'm also aware of Drunvalo's real agenda .


He just released a new video: Thread: NEW VIDEO! Drunvalo Melchizedek: "THE BIRTH OF A NEW HUMANITY" UPDATED NEW BETTER QUALITY

and it's full of disinformation. He's pushing the "we must save the planet" theory. He's assuming that humanity ascends as a whole. He is putting out that spiritual hierarchy crap of "ascended masters". He is assuming that everyone is at the same ordinary level of consciousness and that our destiny is to rise in a new spiritual world order of the ages under FEMALE RULE.

Drunvalo is all about ET agenda for humanity. That humans buy into collectivism and oneness doctrine and rise as a whole to the "4th dimension" to create a new spiritual order of the ages. This is the pseudo-spiritual version of the NWO, and with ET rule instead of an elite of people.

ET societies evolve as a hive-mind collective. This is what Luciferian consciousness represent: lack of free will for the individual. And this is what Drunvalo represents with his overall theme of alien (if aliens are demons, then make it "satanic" as well) spirituality. Or maybe it's something even more sinister. I definitely don't discard the reptilian theory about him. Look at him. OK maybe I'm being judgmental, but look at him. HE doesn't look like a very healthy individual to me. There is something behind that facade of "love and light".

Amazon review:

Drunvalo is great at telling stories of synchronistic adventures and avant-garde metaphysical info, including angelic guides and ETs who are shaping the destiny of our civilization. [gus: bling! bling!! New Age / ET AGENDA! alien spirituality! new age spiritual hierarchy bullshit!] In this new book Drunvalo describes how he was guided to participate in ceremonies at sacred sites using sacred objects to assist in the transition of the Earth's kundalini energy line from Tibet across to South America [gus: they are probably tampering with the energy grid to prepare alien takeover here or fuck with the ascending energies, though, of course, it is useless against those who are destined to graduate., and the shift from masculine to feminine energy dominance [gus: HAHAHHAHA FEMALE / REPTILIAN DOMINANCE -> NOTICE: "SERPENT" OF LIGHT] foreseen accompanying the end of the Mayan Calendar in 2012. Drunvalo has some remarkable stories to tell and meets a variety of native elders and shamans as he completes his journey [gus: read, agenda.].
 Quoting: [link to www.amazon.com]


Whats up with the merkaba studies? Do we need to learn how to aquire the merkaba? Is it for real? It is also to adjust our DNA. Could you comment on this? Have you read about Drunvalo or Anna Hayes? They work on the merkaba.

Stewart's Reply: Yes I am familiar with this information, or should I say, disinformation. The merkaba symbol is simply a star tetrahedron. The word, merkaba, comes from an old Hebrew word and means, Roman Chariot. It has nothing to do with what these people are saying. They work for organizations closely attached to the Illuminati. It is designed to weaken you. If you use the star tetrahedron in gold or violet, it acts as a protection device. Everyone must decide for themselves what is true. I can only tell you what I know when asked.
 Quoting: [link to www.expansions.com]



I believe Drunvalo falls into the category of those spiritual gurus teaching people to install astral blocks (the Mer-ka-ba seminars) disguised as astral protection and selling pseudo-spiritual beliefs that will get people as easy prey once they get there in the astral. Also, check out Drunvalo's last book "The serpent of light", about the new spiritual age and how women will rise to power. Lols, female dominance is reptilian agenda dude. Men hold the key for spirituality. Women hold the key for maintenance and perpetuation of physical life. The Orion reptilian empire is female dominated. And how about "serpent of light"??? Oh, I see, our "ascension" depends on DNA activation?? What about spiritual activation? DNA is PROGRAMMING. We don't need PROGRAMMING to ASCEND. This DNA activation stuff is alien spirituality.

12-strand DNA activation is disinformation:



Valdamar Valerian used to work with Drunvalo in the Matrix series of books. Well, Valerian has completely dismissed the first 4 books as "not containing any useful paradigm" and guess what: books 3 and 4 has a lot of drunvalo's material. Valerian was humble enough to dismiss his own work as outdated and useless, and that is when he went to work on Matrix 5 and 6.

On this planet we have diversity on all levels, INCLUDING diversity of levels of consciousness. There is no miracle ascension or change that will instantly enlighten Mr. Average Joe on the street. This is complete bullshit. What we have now is a possibility for change, a window for change and physical ascension (NOT SPIRITUAL ASCENSION) to 4th dimension for those WHO REALLY WANT IT AND HAVE PREPARED THEMSELVES FOR IT. Only those who desire change on a personal level and have been preparing themselves for it will experience overall positive things, because they will embrace the exterior changes. The others who live in inertia and are spiritually dead will be in denial as soon as the changes commence, and the possibility for enlightenment will be instead a nightmare for them.

Freedom from Drunvalo Blog:

[link to freddomfromsteriotype.blogspot.com]
 Quoting: gus.


lol.... Stewart Swerdlow. Another one with solid black eyes. His wife too.

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