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****Isn't the Messiah Suppose to Decend from King David?****

 
Motion & Rest
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****Isn't the Messiah Suppose to Decend from King David?****
Numbers 1:18
and they called the whole community together on the first day of the second month. The people indicated their ancestry by their clans and families, and the men twenty years old or more were listed by name, one by one

If Jesus came from a virgin mother, then how can his ancestry be in the line of David, if only men are listed?

So how can he be the one the prophets spoke of? He has a different father than the OT god.

PRAISE THE VIRGIN SPIRIT!!

Last Edited by Motion & Rest on 03/20/2011 03:12 AM
"If you bring forth what is within you, what you have will save you. If you do not have that within you, what you do not have within you [will] kill you."

"Whoever has come to know the world has discovered a carcass, and whoever has discovered a carcass, of that person the world is not worthy."

"Those who know all, but are lacking in themselves, are utterly lacking."
Da Purple Chicken

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03/20/2011 03:11 AM
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Re: ****Isn't the Messiah Suppose to Decend from King David?****
Yes - from David via Solomon

which is one of the many reasons why Jesus didn't qualify as the Hebrew Messiah.
“If we are peaceful, if we are happy, we can smile and blossom like a flower, and everyone in our family, our entire society, will benefit from our peace.”
Thich Nhat Hanh, Being Peace

"But ask the animals, and they will teach you,
or the birds in the sky, and they will tell you;
or speak to the earth, and it will teach you,
or let the fish in the sea inform you." - Job 12:7,8

"When the going gets weird, the weird turn pro." - Hunter S. Thompson

revstargazer (at) hotmail.com
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03/20/2011 03:17 AM
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Re: ****Isn't the Messiah Suppose to Decend from King David?****
Yes .... This is the most important subject when identifying the Messiah ... He has to be of the seed of David! All of the prophets confirm this :)
Anonymous Coward
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03/20/2011 03:18 AM
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Re: ****Isn't the Messiah Suppose to Decend from King David?****
Numbers 1:18
and they called the whole community together on the first day of the second month. The people indicated their ancestry by their clans and families, and the men twenty years old or more were listed by name, one by one

If Jesus came from a virgin mother, then how can his ancestry be in the line of David, if only men are listed?

So how can he be the one the prophets spoke of? He has a different father than the OT god.

PRAISE THE VIRGIN SPIRIT!!
 Quoting: Motion & Rest


Jesus' mother Mary was a direct descendent of the line of the House of David. It would have been a ggfather of hers that was listed.

Joseph, Jesus' earthly father, was also descended from the House of David, but his lineage was not as direct as Mary's.
Motion & Rest (OP)

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03/20/2011 03:19 AM

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Re: ****Isn't the Messiah Suppose to Decend from King David?****
Yes .... This is the most important subject when identifying the Messiah ... He has to be of the seed of David! All of the prophets confirm this :)
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 966064


His disciples said to him, "Twenty-four prophets have spoken in Israel, and they all spoke of you."

He said to them, "You have disregarded the living one who is in your presence, and have spoken of the dead."
"If you bring forth what is within you, what you have will save you. If you do not have that within you, what you do not have within you [will] kill you."

"Whoever has come to know the world has discovered a carcass, and whoever has discovered a carcass, of that person the world is not worthy."

"Those who know all, but are lacking in themselves, are utterly lacking."
Anonymous Coward
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03/20/2011 03:19 AM
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Re: ****Isn't the Messiah Suppose to Decend from King David?****
Mary was not a descendant of David. And if she was it would still not make the Messiah a LEGAL heir to the throne because the bloodline was through the males. He has to be born as a descendant of David at his 2nd coming. NOT HIS 1ST!
Anonymous Coward
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03/20/2011 03:20 AM
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Re: ****Isn't the Messiah Suppose to Decend from King David?****
Mary was not a descendant of David. And if she was it would still not make the Messiah a LEGAL heir to the throne because the bloodline was through the males. He has to be born as a descendant of David at his 2nd coming. NOT HIS 1ST!
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 966064


Yes, she was

And Jesus is the Messiah
TXGal4Truth

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03/20/2011 03:21 AM
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Re: ****Isn't the Messiah Suppose to Decend from King David?****
Yes - from David via Solomon

which is one of the many reasons why Jesus didn't qualify as the Hebrew Messiah.
 Quoting: Da Purple Chicken


Really? Mary was of the lineage of David.
So have I now become your enemy for telling you the TRUTH? Galatians 4:16
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You call me paranoid. I call you uninformed.

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Anonymous Coward
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03/20/2011 03:23 AM
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Re: ****Isn't the Messiah Suppose to Decend from King David?****
Genesis 49:10
2nd Samuel Chapter 7 "The entire chapter"
Isaiah Chapter 7
Isaiah Chapter 9
Isaiah Chapter 11
Isaiah Chapter 16:5
Jeremiah Chapter 23:5
Jeremiah Chapter 33:15 .... and so on!!! READ MY FRIEND BEFORE YOU SPEAK
Katarn - KYLE KATARN

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03/20/2011 03:23 AM
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Re: ****Isn't the Messiah Suppose to Decend from King David?****
Fools on GLP trying to debunk what scholars and theologians have known to be true for centuries. You know nothing of scripture
Motion & Rest (OP)

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03/20/2011 03:26 AM

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Re: ****Isn't the Messiah Suppose to Decend from King David?****
Fools on GLP trying to debunk what scholars and theologians have known to be true for centuries. You know nothing of scripture
 Quoting: Katarn - KYLE KATARN


What have they known to be true?
"If you bring forth what is within you, what you have will save you. If you do not have that within you, what you do not have within you [will] kill you."

"Whoever has come to know the world has discovered a carcass, and whoever has discovered a carcass, of that person the world is not worthy."

"Those who know all, but are lacking in themselves, are utterly lacking."
Anonymous Coward
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03/20/2011 03:28 AM
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Re: ****Isn't the Messiah Suppose to Decend from King David?****
Fools on GLP trying to debunk what scholars and theologians have known to be true for centuries. You know nothing of scripture
 Quoting: Katarn - KYLE KATARN


THE SCHOLARS YOU SPEAK OF ARE "CHRISTIAN" SCHOLARS .... THEY ARE NOT PROPHETS OR THE ORIGINAL APOSTLES ... PAUL EVEN QUOTES ROMAN 15:12 ... WHICH IS ISAIAH CHAPTER 11 THE ENTIRE CHAPTER!!! READ PSALMS 89 AND CHAPTER 132 AS WELL OH AND READ REVELATIONS CHAPTER 5:5

AND THEN THE MESSIAH IN HIS OWN WORDS SAYS IN REVELATION 22:16 ...."“I, יהושע, have sent My messenger to witness to you these matters in the assemblies. I am the Root and the Offspring of Dawiḏ,1 the Bright and Morning Star.” Footnote: 1Isa. 11:1 & 10, Rev. 5:5.
Da Purple Chicken

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03/20/2011 03:29 AM
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Re: ****Isn't the Messiah Suppose to Decend from King David?****
Yes - from David via Solomon

which is one of the many reasons why Jesus didn't qualify as the Hebrew Messiah.
 Quoting: Da Purple Chicken


Really? Mary was of the lineage of David.
 Quoting: TXGal4Truth


First of all, Mary's lineage wouldn't count for Kingship.

Second, we don't even know her lineage.

Both Matthew and Luke list Joseph's and yet neither agree.

In fact, Luke has him descending via Nathan rather than Solomon which disqualifies him right there.
“If we are peaceful, if we are happy, we can smile and blossom like a flower, and everyone in our family, our entire society, will benefit from our peace.”
Thich Nhat Hanh, Being Peace

"But ask the animals, and they will teach you,
or the birds in the sky, and they will tell you;
or speak to the earth, and it will teach you,
or let the fish in the sea inform you." - Job 12:7,8

"When the going gets weird, the weird turn pro." - Hunter S. Thompson

revstargazer (at) hotmail.com
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03/20/2011 03:33 AM
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Re: ****Isn't the Messiah Suppose to Decend from King David?****
Yes - from David via Solomon

which is one of the many reasons why Jesus didn't qualify as the Hebrew Messiah.
 Quoting: Da Purple Chicken


Really? Mary was of the lineage of David.
 Quoting: TXGal4Truth


First of all, Mary's lineage wouldn't count for Kingship.

Second, we don't even know her lineage.

Both Matthew and Luke list Joseph's and yet neither agree.

In fact, Luke has him descending via Nathan rather than Solomon which disqualifies him right there.
 Quoting: Da Purple Chicken



THANK YOU MY FRIEND!!! HONESTLY THE ENTIRE MYSTERY IS BASED AROUND HIS 2ND COMING ... BECAUSE THAT'S WHEN HE MUST FULFILL THE PROPHECIES THAT WERE WRITTEN CONCERNING HIS LINEAGE AS A DESCENDANT OF DAVID ..... REVEKATION CHAPTER 19:12 SAYS THAT HE HAD A NAME WRITTEN THAT ONLY HE HIMSELF KNEW ... END OF STORY
Anonymous Coward
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Re: ****Isn't the Messiah Suppose to Decend from King David?****
Mary was not a descendant of David. And if she was it would still not make the Messiah a LEGAL heir to the throne because the bloodline was through the males. He has to be born as a descendant of David at his 2nd coming. NOT HIS 1ST!
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 966064


Yes, she was

And Jesus is the Messiah
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 1217735


mary was a levite. besides jesus said it himself that this "son of man" is to come and not him. jesus is not the prophesied messiah.
Motion & Rest (OP)

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Re: ****Isn't the Messiah Suppose to Decend from King David?****
Yes - from David via Solomon

which is one of the many reasons why Jesus didn't qualify as the Hebrew Messiah.
 Quoting: Da Purple Chicken


Really? Mary was of the lineage of David.
 Quoting: TXGal4Truth


First of all, Mary's lineage wouldn't count for Kingship.

Second, we don't even know her lineage.

Both Matthew and Luke list Joseph's and yet neither agree.

In fact, Luke has him descending via Nathan rather than Solomon which disqualifies him right there.
 Quoting: Da Purple Chicken



THANK YOU MY FRIEND!!! HONESTLY THE ENTIRE MYSTERY IS BASED AROUND HIS 2ND COMING ... BECAUSE THAT'S WHEN HE MUST FULFILL THE PROPHECIES THAT WERE WRITTEN CONCERNING HIS LINEAGE AS A DESCENDANT OF DAVID ..... REVEKATION CHAPTER 19:12 SAYS THAT HE HAD A NAME WRITTEN THAT ONLY HE HIMSELF KNEW ... END OF STORY
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 966064


2) JESUS DID NOT EMBODY THE PERSONAL QUALIFICATIONS OF MESSIAH


(back)

A. MESSIAH AS PROPHET

Jesus was not a prophet. Prophecy can only exist in Israel when the land is inhabited by a majority of world Jewry. During the time of Ezra (circa 300 BCE), when the majority of Jews refused to move from Babylon to Israel, prophecy ended upon the death of the last prophets—Haggai, Zechariah and Malachi.

Jesus appeared on the scene approximately 350 years after prophecy had ended.

B. DESCENDENT OF DAVID

According to Jewish sources, the Messiah will be born of human parents and possess normal physical attributes like other people. He will not be a demi-god, (1) nor will he possess supernatural qualities.

The Messiah must be descended on his father’s side from King David (see Genesis 49:10 and Isaiah 11:1). According to the Christian claim that Jesus was the product of a virgin birth, he had no father—and thus could not have possibly fulfilled the messianic requirement of being descended on his father’s side from King David!
(2)
SEE THE CATHOLIC CHURCH’S RESPONSE TO THIS QUESTION

C. TORAH OBSERVANCE

The Messiah will lead the Jewish people to full Torah observance. The Torah states that all mitzvot (commandments) remain binding forever, and anyone coming to change the Torah is immediately identified as a false prophet. (Deut. 13:1-4)

Throughout the New Testament, Jesus contradicts the Torah and states that its commandments are no longer applicable. (see John 1:45 and 9:16, Acts 3:22 and 7:37) For example, John 9:14 records that Jesus made a paste in violation of Shabbat, which caused the Pharisees to say (verse 16), "He does not observe Shabbat!"
[link to www.simpletoremember.com]
"If you bring forth what is within you, what you have will save you. If you do not have that within you, what you do not have within you [will] kill you."

"Whoever has come to know the world has discovered a carcass, and whoever has discovered a carcass, of that person the world is not worthy."

"Those who know all, but are lacking in themselves, are utterly lacking."
Motion & Rest (OP)

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03/20/2011 03:46 AM

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Re: ****Isn't the Messiah Suppose to Decend from King David?****
Mary was not a descendant of David. And if she was it would still not make the Messiah a LEGAL heir to the throne because the bloodline was through the males. He has to be born as a descendant of David at his 2nd coming. NOT HIS 1ST!
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 966064


Yes, she was

And Jesus is the Messiah
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 1217735


mary was a levite. besides jesus said it himself that this "son of man" is to come and not him. jesus is not the prophesied messiah.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 1281640


If you know where he says that in scripture it would be greatly appreciated. I know he says it in the Gospel of Thomas.

Last Edited by Motion & Rest on 03/20/2011 03:49 AM
"If you bring forth what is within you, what you have will save you. If you do not have that within you, what you do not have within you [will] kill you."

"Whoever has come to know the world has discovered a carcass, and whoever has discovered a carcass, of that person the world is not worthy."

"Those who know all, but are lacking in themselves, are utterly lacking."
Anonymous Coward
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03/20/2011 03:47 AM
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Re: ****Isn't the Messiah Suppose to Decend from King David?****
A wicked and adulterous generation seeketh after a sign;
and there shall no sign be given unto it,
but the sign of the prophet Jonas.

And he left them, and departed.
Anonymous Coward
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03/20/2011 03:51 AM
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Re: ****Isn't the Messiah Suppose to Decend from King David?****
Mary was not a descendant of David. And if she was it would still not make the Messiah a LEGAL heir to the throne because the bloodline was through the males. He has to be born as a descendant of David at his 2nd coming. NOT HIS 1ST!
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 966064


Joseph and Mary were both descendents of King David as was Jesus. This was as the Bible fortold it would be according to prophecy.

When Jesus returns he will be returning from Heaven and will descend to the Earth with his holy angels.

Jesus will not need to be reborn again on this Earth.

That is not what is meant by the Second Advent.
Anonymous Coward
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03/20/2011 03:52 AM
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Re: ****Isn't the Messiah Suppose to Decend from King David?****
Numbers 1:18
and they called the whole community together on the first day of the second month. The people indicated their ancestry by their clans and families, and the men twenty years old or more were listed by name, one by one

If Jesus came from a virgin mother, then how can his ancestry be in the line of David, if only men are listed?

So how can he be the one the prophets spoke of? He has a different father than the OT god.

PRAISE THE VIRGIN SPIRIT!!
 Quoting: Motion & Rest


Mary and Joseph come from the line of David.
Anonymous Coward
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03/20/2011 03:53 AM
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Re: ****Isn't the Messiah Suppose to Decend from King David?****
THE MESSIAH IS THE SON OF MAN .. IT'S A TITLE ...
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Re: ****Isn't the Messiah Suppose to Decend from King David?****
[link to web.archive.org]
mrphilosophias

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Re: ****Isn't the Messiah Suppose to Decend from King David?****
1 2 The book of the genealogy of Jesus Christ, the son of David, the son of Abraham.
2
Abraham became the father of Isaac, Isaac the father of Jacob, Jacob the father of Judah and his brothers.
3
Judah became the father of Perez and Zerah, whose mother was Tamar. Perez became the father of Hezron, Hezron the father of Ram,
4
Ram the father of Amminadab. Amminadab became the father of Nahshon, Nahshon the father of Salmon,
5
Salmon the father of Boaz, whose mother was Rahab. Boaz became the father of Obed, whose mother was Ruth. Obed became the father of Jesse,
6
Jesse the father of David the king. David became the father of Solomon, whose mother had been the wife of Uriah.
7
3 Solomon became the father of Rehoboam, Rehoboam the father of Abijah, Abijah the father of Asaph.
8
Asaph became the father of Jehoshaphat, Jehoshaphat the father of Joram, Joram the father of Uzziah.
9
Uzziah became the father of Jotham, Jotham the father of Ahaz, Ahaz the father of Hezekiah.
10
Hezekiah became the father of Manasseh, Manasseh the father of Amos, 4 Amos the father of Josiah.
11
Josiah became the father of Jechoniah and his brothers at the time of the Babylonian exile.
12
After the Babylonian exile, Jechoniah became the father of Shealtiel, Shealtiel the father of Zerubbabel,
13
Zerubbabel the father of Abiud. Abiud became the father of Eliakim, Eliakim the father of Azor,
14
Azor the father of Zadok. Zadok became the father of Achim, Achim the father of Eliud,
15
Eliud the father of Eleazar. Eleazar became the father of Matthan, Matthan the father of Jacob,
16
Jacob the father of Joseph, the husband of Mary. Of her was born Jesus who is called the Messiah.
17
Thus the total number of generations from Abraham to David is fourteen generations; from David to the Babylonian exile, fourteen generations; from the Babylonian exile to the Messiah, fourteen generations. 5
18
6 Now this is how the birth of Jesus Christ came about. When his mother Mary was betrothed to Joseph, 7 but before they lived together, she was found with child through the holy Spirit.
19
Joseph her husband, since he was a righteous man, 8 yet unwilling to expose her to shame, decided to divorce her quietly.
20
Such was his intention when, behold, the angel of the Lord 9 appeared to him in a dream and said, "Joseph, son of David, do not be afraid to take Mary your wife into your home. For it is through the holy Spirit that this child has been conceived in her.
21
She will bear a son and you are to name him Jesus, 10 because he will save his people from their sins."
22
All this took place to fulfill what the Lord had said through the prophet:
23
11 "Behold, the virgin shall be with child and bear a son, and they shall name him Emmanuel," which means "God is with us."
24
When Joseph awoke, he did as the angel of the Lord had commanded him and took his wife into his home.
25
He had no relations with her until she bore a son, 12 and he named him Jesus.
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Re: ****Isn't the Messiah Suppose to Decend from King David?****
THE MESSIAH IS THE SON OF MAN .. IT'S A TITLE ...
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 966064


And that should say a whole lot about whom the Nazarene really was.
"If you bring forth what is within you, what you have will save you. If you do not have that within you, what you do not have within you [will] kill you."

"Whoever has come to know the world has discovered a carcass, and whoever has discovered a carcass, of that person the world is not worthy."

"Those who know all, but are lacking in themselves, are utterly lacking."
Anonymous Coward
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03/20/2011 04:00 AM
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Re: ****Isn't the Messiah Suppose to Decend from King David?****
You people need to study harder. Christ was rightful heir and was a Priest King by blood through Mary. All generations are documented well. Read the OT and Matthew. Sheesh. Men were listed 20+ since the time of Moses -those old enough to go to war if needed. All people indicated ancestry by clans and families.... this did not mean that they were excluded. Men twenty and above were listed in case of war. Read more carefully.... and stop reading it like it was originally written in English.

The devil is always working to try and find ways to make the non-believers hardened in their hearts. You just need to stop believing the lies. You'll get all turned upside and confused. Confusion is of the devil. Those that believe good is bad and bad is good have already fallen victim to his games. Don't be fooled. Do your homework.
Anonymous Coward
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Re: ****Isn't the Messiah Suppose to Decend from King David?****
Yes .... This is the most important subject when identifying the Messiah ... He has to be of the seed of David! All of the prophets confirm this :)
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 966064


His disciples said to him, "Twenty-four prophets have spoken in Israel, and they all spoke of you."

He said to them, "You have disregarded the living one who is in your presence, and have spoken of the dead."
 Quoting: Motion & Rest


Exactly!!!

Aren't Christ bashers supposed to do their homework before posting lame, half-baked threads about the lineage of Christ Yeshua!!!! Thought so....
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Re: ****Isn't the Messiah Suppose to Decend from King David?****
THE MESSIAH IS THE SON OF MAN .. IT'S A TITLE ...
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 966064


And that should say a whole lot about whom the Nazarene really was.
 Quoting: Motion & Rest



The Son of Man ... or Son of Adam ... is a title used in the Book of Ezekial as well as DANIEL 7:13 which is a prophecy that pertains to Him!
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Re: ****Isn't the Messiah Suppose to Decend from King David?****
Adam's R1b
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Re: ****Isn't the Messiah Suppose to Decend from King David?****
When his feet lands on the Mount of Olives/ Har Zayith then you will all know exactly who HE is ... until then, assumptions prove nothing
Anonymous Coward
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Re: ****Isn't the Messiah Suppose to Decend from King David?****
First of all, Mary's lineage wouldn't count for Kingship.

Second, we don't even know her lineage.

Both Matthew and Luke list Joseph's and yet neither agree.

In fact, Luke has him descending via Nathan rather than Solomon which disqualifies him right there.
 Quoting: Da Purple Chicken

People like you amaze me... you have no clue what you are talking about, yet you still feel the need to spout your ignorance.

Second, we don't even know her lineage.
 Quoting: Da Purple Chicken

Yes we do!

Both Matthew and Luke list Joseph's and yet neither agree.
 Quoting: Da Purple Chicken

Wrong. One is for Joseph, the other for Mary.
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Re: ****Isn't the Messiah Suppose to Decend from King David?****
THE MESSIAH IS THE SON OF MAN .. IT'S A TITLE ...
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 966064


And that should say a whole lot about whom the Nazarene really was.
 Quoting: Motion & Rest


Son of Man refers to Christ Jesus. Adam actually translates to "the man". All the sons after him, his grand children and so on, are called sons of man, or sons of Adam. Christ is a son of Adam, hence the title Son of Man. Many people have been fooled into thinking that Adam was the first man, but man was actually created on the 6th day. Adam was an 8th day creation and he was the first man in the Messiah bloodline. One little point, a day with the Lord is as a 1000 years to us. Keep that in mind when reading the creation story.

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