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The reason why Christians MUST SAY ALIENS ARE DEMONS OR FALLEN ANGELS

 
Anonymous Coward
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The reason why Christians MUST SAY ALIENS ARE DEMONS OR FALLEN ANGELS
***NOTE: Those with nothing to say, or those making rude comments, will be removed and banned immediately. This thread is for discussion. That doesn't mean you have to agree with me. I more than welcome disagreement, but it must be civil and adult. The BS flag, for example, will earn an immediate ban and removal.**


The reason Christians deny that aliens are extraterrestrial or other-dimensional beings is simple: to do otherwise would invalidate and render meaningless the story of Jesus and by extension, the entire Bible and the very basis for their faith.

Granted, not all Christians think alike. The hierarchy of the Catholic church serves as a recent example. Many other Christians believe in the ET nature of alien visitors, however, the largest and most vocal segment seems to be the one that claims ETs are demons or fallen angels. For this segment, they MUST claim than ETs are demonic in order to maintain their belief in Jesus as savior. They must use the Bible to prove the Bible. For example, they prove th belief that aliens are fallen angels by relating the story of the Nephilim. This, according to the myth, proves that ET is of satanic origin. If they did otherwise, the entire story collapses. And they’re right – the existence of Jesus and his sacrifice here on Earth would be a pointless exercise for a God that created an infinite number of beings on other worlds, some of whom are visiting Earth. The demon/fallen angel origins of alien beings is the only theory that fits and gels with Christian dogma. For such a Christian, this theory makes perfect sense and confirms to them that they are at war with spiritual forces, not flesh and blood beings and that ET from other worlds don’t exist, only spiritually-based demons and fallen angels. Sadly, their hatred of ETs is reminiscient of centuries old prejudices that continually drives nations to war. Such hatred prevents them from understanding the wonderful nature of what is unfolding in the coming months and years.

The question then arises as to whether these other worlds and creations need a savior just as we did. Not to mention that the Bible is silent about life on other worlds. Vague references to heaven declaring God’s glory is grossly insufficient evidence that he populated the universe with life. So, in order to square that huge omission with the salvation story, Christianity must ascribe a demonic origin to ETs. It’s a dishonest charge made by dishonest Christian leaders parroted by the honest and sincere people who are Christians.

The fact is that this universe and every other of the infinite number of universes is overflowing with infinite varieties of life. NONE of the existing life forms are demonic or fallen angels. They are simply different from us. That, in itself, is miraculous and should bring comfort to Christians that their God is limitless and has proven as much.
Anonymous Coward (OP)
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Re: The reason why Christians MUST SAY ALIENS ARE DEMONS OR FALLEN ANGELS
bsflag
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 1316


These flags just mean you can't refute what I've said. Otherwise, you'd refute it.
walker8989

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Re: The reason why Christians MUST SAY ALIENS ARE DEMONS OR FALLEN ANGELS
You say it;s a fact the universe is overflowing with life?

Link please.
Anonymous Coward
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04/05/2011 04:04 PM
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Re: The reason why Christians MUST SAY ALIENS ARE DEMONS OR FALLEN ANGELS
Wow I'm a Christian and you are seriously confused....

The nephilim are biblical even outside the man-made canon. The book of Enoch explains in detail what is OUT there. Et's, nephilim are practically the same thing. the details vary immensly though...

Um...and none of that makes void the salvation of Jesus Christ.
Anonymous Coward (OP)
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Re: The reason why Christians MUST SAY ALIENS ARE DEMONS OR FALLEN ANGELS
You say it;s a fact the universe is overflowing with life?

Link please.
 Quoting: walker8989


There is no link. And I do not have to prove it.
Anonymous Coward
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Re: The reason why Christians MUST SAY ALIENS ARE DEMONS OR FALLEN ANGELS
Actually God's word lets us know there are other created beings, angles and demons come to mind. But what proof do you offer for anything else being out there?
the prophecyer

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Re: The reason why Christians MUST SAY ALIENS ARE DEMONS OR FALLEN ANGELS
Though it may seem an unlikely location to happen upon a conference on astrobiology, the Vatican recently held a “study week” of over 30 astronomers, biologists, geologists and religious leaders to discuss the question of the existence of extraterrestrials. This follows the statement made last year by the Pope’s chief astronomer, Father Gabriel Funes, that the existence of extraterrestrials does not preclude a belief in God, and that it’s a question to be explored by the Catholic Church. The event, put on by the Pontifical Academy of Sciences, took place at the Casina Pio IV on the Vatican grounds from November 6-11.

The conference was meant to focus on the scientific perspective on the subject of the existence of extraterrestrial life, and pulled in perspectives from atheist scientists and Catholic leaders alike. It was split into eight different segments, starting with a topics about life here on Earth such as the origins of life, the Earth’s habitability through time, and the environment and genomes. Then the detection of life elsewhere, search strategies for extrasolar planets, the formation and properties of extrasolar planets was discussed, culminating in the last segment, intelligence elsewhere and ‘shadow life’ – life with a biochemistry completely different than that found on Earth.

Speakers at the event included notable physicist Paul Davies and Jill C. Tarter, the Director of the Center for SETI Research. Numerous astrobiologists and astronomers researching extrasolar planets also were in attendance to give lectures.

more - [link to www.universetoday.com]

The director of the Vatican observatory said it’s possible that intelligent life exists on other planets. And since aliens would be part of God’s creation, their existence would not contradict the Catholic faith. In an interview with the Vatican newspaper Rev. Jose Gabriel Funes discussed the Big Bang theory, as well as creation and evolution. The interview was originally published in Italian, but a priest from Holland translated the full interview to English and posted it on his website.

[link to www.universetoday.com]
Try not. do, or do not. There is no try!

[link to www.youtube.com]
Anonymous Coward
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Re: The reason why Christians MUST SAY ALIENS ARE DEMONS OR FALLEN ANGELS
Because they are!
Anonymous Coward (OP)
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Re: The reason why Christians MUST SAY ALIENS ARE DEMONS OR FALLEN ANGELS
Wow I'm a Christian and you are seriously confused....

The nephilim are biblical even outside the man-made canon. The book of Enoch explains in detail what is OUT there. Et's, nephilim are practically the same thing. the details vary immensly though...

Um...and none of that makes void the salvation of Jesus Christ.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 1326748


Of course it does. Jesus' sacrifice was meant to bring salvation to a sinful creation. How does he "save" the rest of the universe? Must he be sacrificed at the cross on countless worlds? Why aren't those worlds referenced in the bible?

As for the book of Enoch, yes it tells the story of the Nephilim. However, the interpretation that they were fallen angels is typical of a primitive and ignorant people. That they were evil does NOT mean they were fallen angels. It means that they were evil.
daughter
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Re: The reason why Christians MUST SAY ALIENS ARE DEMONS OR FALLEN ANGELS
Proof positive:

Because the aliens/demons FLEE at the mention of the name of:

JESUS CHRIST!


They TREMBLE at the name!

Praise Jesus!
Anonymous Coward (OP)
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04/05/2011 04:12 PM
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Re: The reason why Christians MUST SAY ALIENS ARE DEMONS OR FALLEN ANGELS
Actually God's word lets us know there are other created beings, angles and demons come to mind. But what proof do you offer for anything else being out there?
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 1266868


I am not here to prove their existence. This post is for other purposes. If you are looking for proof of anything, I suggest you seek proof that ETs are demonic, first. Proof, not bible quotes.
Anonymous Coward (OP)
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04/05/2011 04:15 PM
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Re: The reason why Christians MUST SAY ALIENS ARE DEMONS OR FALLEN ANGELS
Proof positive:

Because the aliens/demons FLEE at the mention of the name of:

JESUS CHRIST!


They TREMBLE at the name!

Praise Jesus!
 Quoting: daughter 1313697


Aliens do not always flee when the name Jesus is mentioned. Many stories say that when the contactee tries to invoke the magical name of Jesus, the ETs either look at them with a perplexed look and continue their work, or in one case I read, the ET laughed and continued. Some do leave and that supports the theory that ETs set up our religions. When that particular race contacts us, and the contactee invokes the name of Jesus, they leave. This is intended to not interfere with the contactee's belief system. It even supports it. It doesn't mean they are genuinely fearful of Jesus or the name.
Anonymous Coward
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Re: The reason why Christians MUST SAY ALIENS ARE DEMONS OR FALLEN ANGELS
Proof positive:

Because the aliens/demons FLEE at the mention of the name of:

JESUS CHRIST!


They TREMBLE at the name!

Praise Jesus!
 Quoting: daughter 1313697


:failbib:
Anonymous Coward (OP)
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04/05/2011 04:18 PM
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Re: The reason why Christians MUST SAY ALIENS ARE DEMONS OR FALLEN ANGELS
Though it may seem an unlikely location to happen upon a conference on astrobiology, the Vatican recently held a “study week” of over 30 astronomers, biologists, geologists and religious leaders to discuss the question of the existence of extraterrestrials. This follows the statement made last year by the Pope’s chief astronomer, Father Gabriel Funes, that the existence of extraterrestrials does not preclude a belief in God, and that it’s a question to be explored by the Catholic Church. The event, put on by the Pontifical Academy of Sciences, took place at the Casina Pio IV on the Vatican grounds from November 6-11.

The conference was meant to focus on the scientific perspective on the subject of the existence of extraterrestrial life, and pulled in perspectives from atheist scientists and Catholic leaders alike. It was split into eight different segments, starting with a topics about life here on Earth such as the origins of life, the Earth’s habitability through time, and the environment and genomes. Then the detection of life elsewhere, search strategies for extrasolar planets, the formation and properties of extrasolar planets was discussed, culminating in the last segment, intelligence elsewhere and ‘shadow life’ – life with a biochemistry completely different than that found on Earth.

Speakers at the event included notable physicist Paul Davies and Jill C. Tarter, the Director of the Center for SETI Research. Numerous astrobiologists and astronomers researching extrasolar planets also were in attendance to give lectures.

more - [link to www.universetoday.com]

The director of the Vatican observatory said it’s possible that intelligent life exists on other planets. And since aliens would be part of God’s creation, their existence would not contradict the Catholic faith. In an interview with the Vatican newspaper Rev. Jose Gabriel Funes discussed the Big Bang theory, as well as creation and evolution. The interview was originally published in Italian, but a priest from Holland translated the full interview to English and posted it on his website.

[link to www.universetoday.com]
 Quoting: the prophecyer


“Just like there is an abundance of creatures on earth, there could also be other beings, even intelligent ones, that were created by God. That doesn’t contradict our faith, because we cannot put boundaries to God’s creative freedom. As saint Francis would say, when we consider the earthly creatures to be our “brothers and sisters”, why couldn’t we also talk about a “extraterrestrial brother”? He would still be part of creation.”

That's what I would expect Christians to say. However, and strangely, the ET=demon belief has surfaced over the past few years. Most who promote this have books to sell, BTW.
Anonymous Coward
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04/05/2011 04:22 PM
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Re: The reason why Christians MUST SAY ALIENS ARE DEMONS OR FALLEN ANGELS
Well if God created this world, he could certainly create others. It's arrogant to think otherwise.
Anonymous Coward
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04/05/2011 04:23 PM
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Re: The reason why Christians MUST SAY ALIENS ARE DEMONS OR FALLEN ANGELS
Wow I'm a Christian and you are seriously confused....

The nephilim are biblical even outside the man-made canon. The book of Enoch explains in detail what is OUT there. Et's, nephilim are practically the same thing. the details vary immensly though...

Um...and none of that makes void the salvation of Jesus Christ.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 1326748


Of course it does. Jesus' sacrifice was meant to bring salvation to a sinful creation. How does he "save" the rest of the universe? Must he be sacrificed at the cross on countless worlds? Why aren't those worlds referenced in the bible?

As for the book of Enoch, yes it tells the story of the Nephilim. However, the interpretation that they were fallen angels is typical of a primitive and ignorant people. That they were evil does NOT mean they were fallen angels. It means that they were evil.
 Quoting: Free Spirit


Fallen angels, evil angels same thing. There are also angels that serve the Most High.

Ok, John 17 tells us, well Christ is speaking and in fact praying to the Father and He says that we humans are not of this world just as He, Christ, is also not of this world. Please read that chapter, KJV style.


John 17:5 And now, O Father, glorify thou me with thine own self with the glory which I had with thee before the world was.

17:6 I have manifested thy name unto the men which thou gavest me out of the world: thine they were, and thou gavest them me; and they have kept thy word.

17:7 Now they have known that all things whatsoever thou hast given me are of thee.

17:8 For I have given unto them the words which thou gavest me; and they have received them, and have known surely that I came out from thee, and they have believed that thou didst send me.

17:9 I pray for them: I pray not for the world, but for them which thou hast given me; for they are thine.

17:10 And all mine are thine, and thine are mine; and I am glorified in them.

17:11 And now I am no more in the world, but these are in the world, and I come to thee. Holy Father, keep through thine own name those whom thou hast given me, that they may be one, as we are.

17:12 While I was with them in the world, I kept them in thy name: those that thou gavest me I have kept, and none of them is lost, but the son of perdition; that the scripture might be fulfilled.

17:13 And now come I to thee; and these things I speak in the world, that they might have my joy fulfilled in themselves.

17:14 I have given them thy word; and the world hath hated them, because they are not of the world, even as I am not of the world.

17:15 I pray not that thou shouldest take them out of the world, but that thou shouldest keep them from the evil.

17:16 They are not of the world, even as I am not of the world.

17:17 Sanctify them through thy truth: thy word is truth.

17:18 As thou hast sent me into the world, even so have I also sent them into the world.

17:19 And for their sakes I sanctify myself, that they also might be sanctified through the truth.

17:20 Neither pray I for these alone, but for them also which shall believe on me through their word;

17:21 That they all may be one; as thou, Father, art in me, and I in thee, that they also may be one in us: that the world may believe that thou hast sent me.

17:22 And the glory which thou gavest me I have given them; that they may be one, even as we are one:

17:23 I in them, and thou in me, that they may be made perfect in one; and that the world may know that thou hast sent me, and hast loved them, as thou hast loved me.

17:24 Father, I will that they also, whom thou hast given me, be with me where I am; that they may behold my glory, which thou hast given me: for thou lovedst me before the foundation of the world.

17:25 O righteous Father, the world hath not known thee: but I have known thee, and these have known that thou hast sent me.

17:26 And I have declared unto them thy name, and will declare it: that the love wherewith thou hast loved me may be in them, and I in them.


Did you notice Christ also mentions that He existed before the foundation of this world. This is only a temporary earth age that we are in and I believe we existed in a prior age that ended as Lucifer fell. There are other scriptures that indicate we existed prior to this age.

Another example...

Jeremiah 1: 5 Before I formed thee in the belly I knew thee; and before thou camest forth out of the womb I sanctified thee, [and] I ordained thee a prophet unto the nations.

Anyway, back to John 17, Christ was sent to THIS world to save...the goings on of other worlds that might exist is not really relevant to us right now...other than the angels that travel to and fro. In the book of Job, God asks Satan what he's been up to, Satan replies...to and fro on the earth...

Job 2:2 And the LORD said unto Satan, From whence comest thou? And Satan answered the LORD, and said, From going to and fro in the earth, and from walking up and down in it.
Judethz
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04/05/2011 04:24 PM

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Re: The reason why Christians MUST SAY ALIENS ARE DEMONS OR FALLEN ANGELS
You say it;s a fact the universe is overflowing with life?

Link please.
 Quoting: walker8989


There is no link. And I do not have to prove it.
 Quoting: Free Spirit


grizzy Then why should we believe it?
Anonymous Coward (OP)
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04/05/2011 04:27 PM
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Re: The reason why Christians MUST SAY ALIENS ARE DEMONS OR FALLEN ANGELS
Wow I'm a Christian and you are seriously confused....

The nephilim are biblical even outside the man-made canon. The book of Enoch explains in detail what is OUT there. Et's, nephilim are practically the same thing. the details vary immensly though...

Um...and none of that makes void the salvation of Jesus Christ.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 1326748


Of course it does. Jesus' sacrifice was meant to bring salvation to a sinful creation. How does he "save" the rest of the universe? Must he be sacrificed at the cross on countless worlds? Why aren't those worlds referenced in the bible?

As for the book of Enoch, yes it tells the story of the Nephilim. However, the interpretation that they were fallen angels is typical of a primitive and ignorant people. That they were evil does NOT mean they were fallen angels. It means that they were evil.
 Quoting: Free Spirit


Fallen angels, evil angels same thing. There are also angels that serve the Most High.

Ok, John 17 tells us, well Christ is speaking and in fact praying to the Father and He says that we humans are not of this world just as He, Christ, is also not of this world. Please read that chapter, KJV style.

 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 1326748



By "evil" I meant that the being was evil but that they were no more angelic or demonic than the worst human.

Also, I know there are some who believe Christ was an alien, i.e. from elsewhere in the universe. My belief is that he never existed, but thanks anyway for your contribution.
Anonymous Coward (OP)
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Re: The reason why Christians MUST SAY ALIENS ARE DEMONS OR FALLEN ANGELS
You say it;s a fact the universe is overflowing with life?

Link please.
 Quoting: walker8989


There is no link. And I do not have to prove it.
 Quoting: Free Spirit


:grizzy: Then why should we believe it?
 Quoting: Judethz


I didn't ask you to believe it. It's the premise from which I formed this thread and doesn't require the belief of anyone except me. It's my belief, it doesn't have to be yours.
Anonymous Coward
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Re: The reason why Christians MUST SAY ALIENS ARE DEMONS OR FALLEN ANGELS
Believe in benevolent ET's if you like, but don't say you were not warned.
Anonymous Coward (OP)
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Re: The reason why Christians MUST SAY ALIENS ARE DEMONS OR FALLEN ANGELS
Believe in benevolent ET's if you like, but don't say you were not warned.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 687593


We shouldn't presume anything about ET, either that they are ALL benevolent or that they are demonic simply because they are ET.
The Goatman

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Re: The reason why Christians MUST SAY ALIENS ARE DEMONS OR FALLEN ANGELS
Indeed there are banevolent and malevolent ET's. In the Bible the malevolent ones are called Angels and the benevolent ones have been relegated to Demon and Fallen status.

Last Edited by The Goatman on 04/05/2011 04:36 PM
Anonymous Coward
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Re: The reason why Christians MUST SAY ALIENS ARE DEMONS OR FALLEN ANGELS
I believe the Judeo-Christian world view offeres the best explanation for these 'aliens' or beings.

Michael Heiser gives a fantastic explanation of them from anctient manuscripts. He is a phd on ancient languages and has done several discussions on these beings digging back into the original manuscripts. He shows from not only ancient biblical texts but from other ancient texts from the area and eras that these beings fit the description of the fallen angles based on agreement in the texts. I know many here dont agree with the divine origin of the bible but if you look at it as a historical text alone its reliable.

Take a few minutes and listen to his research, he proves zechariah sitchin was not qualified by any standard to make translations and in fact is fraudulent.

Anonymous Coward
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Re: The reason why Christians MUST SAY ALIENS ARE DEMONS OR FALLEN ANGELS
Indeed there are banevolent and malevolent ET's. In the Bible the malevolent ones are called Angels and the benevolent ones have been relegated to Demon and Fallen status.
 Quoting: The Goatman


I would generally agree. Angel means "messenger", which is a job description. It doesn't have to be Mona Lisa with wings.
Anonymous Coward
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Re: The reason why Christians MUST SAY ALIENS ARE DEMONS OR FALLEN ANGELS
Indeed there are banevolent and malevolent ET's. In the Bible the malevolent ones are called Angels and the benevolent ones have been relegated to Demon and Fallen status.
 Quoting: The Goatman


I would generally agree. Angel means "messenger", which is a job description. It doesn't have to be Mona Lisa with wings.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 1329427


(Except for getting malevolent and benevolent reversed)
Anonymous Coward
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Re: The reason why Christians MUST SAY ALIENS ARE DEMONS OR FALLEN ANGELS
the reason is simple mr. slaved spirit...

your embracement of the alien creatures(demons) is biblical prophesy.

Hopefully when E.T. is probing your free spirit with there finger they will pull out that spiritual compass and give it to you.
Anonymous Coward
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Re: The reason why Christians MUST SAY ALIENS ARE DEMONS OR FALLEN ANGELS
the reason is simple mr. slaved spirit...

your embracement of the alien creatures(demons) is biblical prophesy.

Hopefully when E.T. is probing your free spirit with there finger they will pull out that spiritual compass and give it to you.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 1329552


Is OP embracing them, just saying "Hold off on reaching a verdict"?
morsmortis
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Re: The reason why Christians MUST SAY ALIENS ARE DEMONS OR FALLEN ANGELS
I wrote on this the other day, in another thread. The programming we receive as children instills certain protections against entities not associated with the Christian religion. These entities can and will visit you during the hypnagogic sleep state(Sleep paralysis) if you are "chosen". You must remember, somewhere in our bloodlines, a conversion took place, and it was an extremely violent and bloody conversion. These entities are attempting to show you the irony behind Christianity, as it has killed more people than it has saved. Christianity attempts to fool people into believing that it's easy to ask forgiveness, but I'm afraid it's not that simple.

Christianity is the religion of serial killers, rapists, child molesters, murders, and seekers of power. It enables these individuals to form a Nihilistic opinion of the world, and seek repentance on at a later date. I feel sorry for you if you believe a white light will forgive your crimes. Our souls are not like credit cards. You cannot default on your actions. If your actions are malignant, you will experience the pain they cause until the cycle is stopped. Why do you think Christians promote the destruction of our race via the Apocalypse? The Apocalypse stops the chain of custody by killing nearly everyone - effectively freeing "sinners" from their actions.

The evil you experience when you see shadows during Sleep Paralysis is temporary. It's an interrogation technique to determine if you are going to call on Jesus. Embrace the fear, and show the entities you are not afraid. They in turn, will lose their fear of you and give you VALUABLE information. Remember, the Cross is a sign of war. It was used on battlefields to instill fear in it's enemies. In Europe, Pagan temples were burned to the ground, and churches were built on their ashes - a cross standing at a zenith depicted physical and spiritual victory over pagan forces. So, any time you call on Christ it will cause these entities to scatter.
Anonymous Coward
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Re: The reason why Christians MUST SAY ALIENS ARE DEMONS OR FALLEN ANGELS
the reason is simple mr. slaved spirit...

your embracement of the alien creatures(demons) is biblical prophesy.

Hopefully when E.T. is probing your free spirit with there finger they will pull out that spiritual compass and give it to you.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 1329552


Is OP embracing them, just saying "Hold off on reaching a verdict"?
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 1329427


I see what you are sayin...

Lets wait until after we get probed...

You know you can always speed up the process with them by just asking them (aliens) to visit you themselves.

I sure they will be happy to explain the purpose of the bible.

don't be shy, just ask em
they are waiting
Anonymous Coward
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Re: The reason why Christians MUST SAY ALIENS ARE DEMONS OR FALLEN ANGELS
OP, why is it that these so called aliens always have to be channeled so that humans can communicate with them? Because they are spirits living in a spirit world. The bible states that Satan is the prince of the power of the air. Satan and his demons inhabit the "second heaven" that space between earth and God's heaven (the third) These so called aliens being channeled by humans are nothing more than demons. They are setting the world up for massive deception and you're falling for it.
Anonymous Coward
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Re: The reason why Christians MUST SAY ALIENS ARE DEMONS OR FALLEN ANGELS
the reason is simple mr. slaved spirit...

your embracement of the alien creatures(demons) is biblical prophesy.

Hopefully when E.T. is probing your free spirit with there finger they will pull out that spiritual compass and give it to you.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 1329552


Is OP embracing them, just saying "Hold off on reaching a verdict"?
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 1329427


I see what you are sayin...

Lets wait until after we get probed...

You know you can always speed up the process with them by just asking them (aliens) to visit you themselves.

I sure they will be happy to explain the purpose of the bible.

don't be shy, just ask em
they are waiting
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 1329552


Wow, you're right - as True Christians, we have a responsibility to assume the very worst, and overreact *now* before they've even stepped forward

hf

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