True Christians do NOT support the modern state of Israel

Thank you...

But, take a minute and let that really sink in. WE (who believe in Christ) are the sons of God. Ie. not the old 12 (13) tribes. WE (Christians) are the chosen people.

Incredible how all this is coming right back to the words of Christ. More relevant today, than ever.

I don't think there ever WAS an old Testament "nation of Israel". The geographical area had names like "Judea". Didn't "Israel" refer to THE PEOPLE? Specifically, 'the body of believers'?

Excellent point.

Shlomo Sands book "The Invention of the Jewish People" details this very thing. How Jews peacefully coexisted with their Arab neighbors in Palestine for centuries.

NOTE: these are the only 'Jews' they can actually trace back to the descendants of Abraham - IE the Palestinian Jews. (Palestinians). Many people do not realize that the Palestinians are not all Arabs. Some are Christians and Jews.

OT refers to 'kingdoms'. The northern and southern were based on how Moses divided the tribes and allotted them the land.

Many people do not fully read God's covenant with Abraham. If his descendants did not follow His ways, God said he would destroy them and drive them from the land.

The final destruction was in 70 AD when God said He divorced Judah and compared Jerusalem to Sodom and Egypt.

OP :-

G2453

Ioudaios
ee-oo-dah'-yos
From G2448 (in the sense of G2455 as a country); udaean, that is, belonging to Jehudah: - Jew (-ess), of Juda.

From Strongs

To translate this as "Judean" would not give it its full sense

The land of Israel and surrounding in 1000 BC
[link to listsoplenty.com]

Thank you... appreciate someone actually digging.

I agree. Big rabbit hole though.

What are your thoughts?

G2453 appears to me to be more a reference to a certain people as designated by location than race.

Scripture is scripture, they are Gods people and he will protect them. You can blame a bible for someones beliefs but lack of belief like yours is not the bibles fault but yours , Gods word is not meant for everybody even though they read the bible and for others God will send strong delusion (you) that they will never comprehend His word.

Excellent point.

Shlomo Sands book "The Invention of the Jewish People" details this very thing. How Jews peacefully coexisted with their Arab neighbors in Palestine for centuries.

NOTE: these are the only 'Jews' they can actually trace back to the descendants of Abraham - IE the Palestinian Jews. (Palestinians). Many people do not realize that the Palestinians are not all Arabs. Some are Christians and Jews.


Amen...and those Palestinian Christians and Jews are both persecuted by the Zionist False-Jews they are forced to live with. If certain Christian Zionists here would only realize that their Christian brothers and sisters in Israel are being starved, tortured, and killed by those they so zealously support, it still would not make a difference to them. For some reason, they are unable to recognize Truth. As a result, these Christian Zionist/Israel Supporters apparently approve of what is done to their Christian brothers and sisters at the hands of these hijackers.

Your spiting hairs to justify your dogma


The Greek word used is Ioudaios compare it to the superscription on the cross

INRI

IESVS·NAZARENVS·REX·IVDÆORVM (Iesus Nazarenus, Rex Iudaeorum), which translates to English as "Jesus the Nazarene, King of the Jews

Christ was from Galilee not Judea


When Flavius Josephus wrote War of the Jews,which describes in detail the Roman conquest of Israel,was he only talking about Judea? Or all of Eretz Yisrael = Land of Israel (ie the Jews)Galilee,Judea,Samaria etc His audience knew exactly what he was talking about.

When the Emperor Claudius banned all Jews from Rome in 49 AD was he only talking about Judeans? Funny because even Jewish Christian were kicked out of Rome per Acts


1st century context OP,its important

Last Edited by mathetes on 04/07/2011 07:29 PM

Let me stir the pot a little...

If my argument is correct, then Christians should not be supporting Muslims, Catholics or Jews, for we are the chosen of God, His children, spiritual offspring, to whom the promises apply.

Good point... appreciate the clarification and additional history.

You have a sharp intellect and have done your homework.

Do you believe the modern state of Israel is the fulfillment of prophecy? If so, can you substantiate?

And are you familiar with the Scofield history?

Technical note:

I firmly believe Jesus was King of the Jews, as the Romans wrote, and all other men.

Christ was specifically from Nazareth, but was born in Bethlehem which would not have made him a Galilean.

My family are Jews from Baghdad (Iraq) they lived in Dhimitude under muslims for a few centuries, It was not pleasant.

Suggest you read "from time immemorial" by Joan Peters, it lists the various pograms in 'peaseful' Iraq and Iran as well as Egypt and the Mahgreb.

You can carry on with your replacement theology all you like, but ask yourself this, when Jesus comes again, will he have stopped being a Jew? (He is the same yesterday, today and forever I am given to understand....)

Ask yourself why Jesus preached Torah and Prophets on the "Road to Emmaus" if they had been superceeded by the "cross" (which is a babylonian pagan torture ikon)

you should love the sinners but not their sins.

you should pray that those in those religious organizations have their eyes opened and that they see.

you should pray that those in babylon hear the warning and come out of her before judgement is cast upon her

you should pray that those in israel regain their sight and understand and believe Jesus came in the flesh.

you should quit making up ideas that sound mormon in nature. america isnt zion. when the Lord comes, it will be right where he assended from. Israel

Jesus is the Holy King that was prophesied, and he will rule from Gods Holy Mountain, in Israel.

the land of Israel is the apple of Gods eye.

the land in question is what everyone has fought to posses. not america.

and the only time this piece of earth has any value what so ever is when there are jews involved.

before 1948, there was practically no one, but after the jews showed up a multitude of displaced arabs showed up. its because a muslim government with unwanted people sent them there. to stir the pot. the arabs that were trully there from the beginning have citizenship. the multitude outside of Israel are just there to burden the hearts of soft people like you.

your falling for the lie

You mean the time he spent in jail for ripping off his mother in law?

Yeah.

You are wrong my friend, very wrong, and the future of what will happen, will show you.

how does this become my thread??? I don't think so

True,but others considered him a Galilean...anyway great debate OP

I've decided that you are truly retarded.

"You troll, I ban"


don't ban me bro

THE VERY FACT THAT THE DESCEDENTS OF THE ANCIENT PEOPLE OF ISRAEL HAVE BEEN GATHERED FROM ALL THE LANDS TO WHICH THEY WERE TAKEN ENSLAVED IN CHAINS AND HAVE BEEN BROUGHT BACK TO PART OF THEIR ANCIENT HOMELAND IS FULLFILLMENT OF GOD'S OWN SWORN PROPHECY OF WHAT HE SAID HE WOULD DO.


ANYONE WHO ARGUES AGAINST THE FACT OF THIS RETURN
IS ARGUING AGANIST THE VERY PLANS OF GOD ALMIGHTY HIMSELF
WHO IN HIS WISDOM USED THE CRAFTINESS OF WICKED MEN AND DECIETFUL NATIONS THAT ARE NOW TRYING TO DESTROY ISRAEL (USA. UK.EUROPE INCLUDED AND JUDGEMENT IS NOW IN OPERATION UPON THOSE NATIONS AND NOT JUST THEM )
HE USED THESE KINGDOMS WICKED OF THIS WORLD- TO FULFILL HIS PROMISE OF RETURNING HIS ANCIENT PEOPLE WHO ARE STILL HIS BELOVED TO THE LAND HE NOT ONLY PROMISED BUT GAVE TO THEM FOREVER.

WAR IS OF THIS WORLD (SEE USA. UK .EUROPE AND ALL WORLDY GOVERNMENTS INCLUDING ISLAMICS CATHOLIC ETC EVEN ISREALS WORLDLY GOVERNMENT)
AS I SAY WAR IS OF THIS WORLD.
NOT OF THE KINGDOM OF HEAVEN


FLESHLY ISLRAEL ARE A PEOPLE , GOD MADE AN A COVENENENT PROMISE WITH GOD DOES NOT BREAK COVENENTS
THAT COVENENT WOULD BE FULFFILLED THROUGH AND IN JESUS CHRIST STARTING WITH THE JEWS AND ENCOMPASSING THE GENTILES
AND THE JEWS WHO DID NOT BELIEVE WERE TAKEN AND JUDGED AND SENT OUT OF THEIR LAND FOR NOT BELIEVING AND YET GOD PROMISED HE WOULD GATHER THEM FORM ALL TH NATIONS THEY WERE TAKEN CAPTIVE INTO AND BERING THEM BACK TO THE LAND OF THEIR FATHERS-
THIS IS THE ISRAEL YOU SEE TODAY

ALL ISRAEL SHALL BE SAVED
WHEN THEY TURN TO THEIR MESSIAH JESUS CHRIST THE ONLY BEGOTTEN SON OF GOD .

do not be ignorant of the mystery concerning ISRAEL
FOR GODS OWN MERCY TO THE NATIONS IS INVOLVED

Even so have these also now not believed, that through your mercy they also may obtain mercy.
[link to kingjbible.com]

Even so have these ... - That is, the Jews.

That through your mercy ... - The immediate effect of the unbelief of the Jews was to confer salvation on the Gentiles, or to open the way for the preaching of the gospel to them.

Adnd dont be decieved
DOWN WITH THE PAPAL ANTICHRIST WHO PREACH "ANOTHER" JESUS

GOD USES THE WICKED AS A TOOL OF JUDGEMENT
GOD USES EVIL AS A TOOL OF JUDGEMENT
GOD USES WAR AS A TOOL OF JUDGEMENT

DURING THE PERIOD BEFORE ISRAEL WAS GATHERED FROM THE NATIONS THE CHIEF TOOL GOD USED AGANIST THEM WAS

1 THE ROMAN EMPIRE
2 THE CATHOLIC EMPIRE AND ITS PROSTITUTED KINGS
HITLER WAS ONE OF THEM

HOW CAN THOSE WHO DO GOOD AND OBEY GOD DO EVIL ?

OR HOW CAN THE CHURCH DO EVIL?

OR HOW COULD ISRAEL BE JUDGED BY GOD THROUGH THE CATHOLIC CHURCH?

BECAUSE THE CATHOLIC CHURCH HEADED BY THE PAPACY IS A FALSE CHURCH

HOW CAN THOSE WHOM OBEY GOD DO EVIL?
AND BE USED AS A TOOL OF JUDGEMENT WITH WAR?

THE COMMAND OF THE OBEDIENT OF GOD IN CHRIST
IS TO LOVE YOUR ENEMY AND JUDGE THEM NOT
ONLY TO PRAY FOR THEM - CLEARLY THOSE WHO ARE GODS CANNOT ACT AS A TOOL OF JUDGMENT IN THIS WORLD
IN THE NEXT YES BUT NOT THIS,.

YET THE CATHOLIC CHURCH HEADED BY PAPACY MURDERED THE JEWS AND SPONSERED HITLER AND TODAY THE MUSLIMS TO THE THE SAME NOW

YET THE CATHOLIC CHURCH HEADED BY PAPACY MURDERED THE JEWS AND SPONSERED HITLER AND TODAY THE MUSLIMS TO THE THE SAME NOW

AND NOT ONLY THE MUSLIMS
BUT TODAY AMERICA
THE UK
EUROPE AND EVERY NATION ON EARTH

hello...... rant much? lol

FOR AN EXPLANATION OF THIS DECEPTION
SO YOU CAN CLEARLY SEE THROUGH IT
GO HERE
And first Understand the importance to the Lord God Of IsREAL CONCERNING THE TEACHING ON HIS SON JESUS CHRIST COMING IN THE FLESH

2 John 1:7 Many deceivers, who do not acknowledge Jesus Christ as coming in the flesh, have gone out into the world. Any such person is the deceiver and the antichrist.
[link to bible.cc]

AND IF THEY DENY JESUS CHRIST CAME IN THE FLESH
THEY ARE DENYING THE TRUE JESUS CHRIST
AND SO TEACHING "ANOTHER" CHRIST

AND WOHEVER DOES THAT DENIES JESUS IS THE CHRIST, THE SON OF GOD-

Who is a liar but he that denieth that Jesus is the Christ? He is antichrist, that denieth the Father and the Son.
[link to kingjbible.com]

BREAKING NEWS THE CATHOLIC CHURCH DENIES THAT JESUS CAME IN THE FLESH

Thread: BREAKING NEWS THE CATHOLIC CHURCH DENIES THAT JESUS CAME IN THE FLESH

Finally!!!! Someone who gets it!

OP let me ask you this though if I may: Do you know about the two sticks prophecy of Ezekiel and how it says that the northern (Jews) and southern (Christians) kingdoms will be reunited into one stick in the Lord's hands?

Also are you familiar with the prophecy that says the fake Jews (the "serpents" or "children of the devil" as they're called) will one day be exposed and caused to worship at the feet of the true Christians?

Or do you believe there is no hope for the Jews at all?