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WTF!!!!! Man burns himself to death to avoid US debtors prison!!!

 
Anonymous Coward
User ID: 1366664
Mexico
06/18/2011 01:24 PM
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Re: WTF!!!!! Man burns himself to death to avoid US debtors prison!!!
After six months of me not lifting a finger to save this marriage, she filed for divorce. Almost two years after the incident, I was talking with her on the phone. She told me that night she had called a mental health provider we had for one of the kids. Wendy, the counselor told my then wife that if she did not call the police on me, then she too would be arrested.-quote.

great counseling?

Imagine that folks the terrorist counselor?

get this....call the cops or you too will go to jail?

wtf?
Anonymous Coward
User ID: 936193
United States
06/18/2011 01:24 PM
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Re: WTF!!!!! Man burns himself to death to avoid US debtors prison!!!
Guy was obv frustrated but he also obv had more balls and committment than most Americans.

Not going to say I condone the act - a child could have been watching it occur and be scarred for life over it - but I'm not going to say I don't understand it either. I do.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 1421992


Suicide is what pussies and nutless cowards commit.

The word frustration doesn't cut it.

I feel daddy dumbass used this as a scapegoat to commit
suicide because he has underlying problems not publicly known.

No sympathy for idiots.
Kurt Kobain had talent.
But was a pussy for taking his own life
(if he did at all)
Anonymous Coward
User ID: 1366664
Mexico
06/18/2011 01:25 PM
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Re: WTF!!!!! Man burns himself to death to avoid US debtors prison!!!
Suddenly, everything made sense. She is the type that believes that people in authority actually know what they are talking about. If both she and I were arrested, what would happen to our three children, ages 7,4 and 1? They would end up in State custody. So my wife called the police on her husband to protect the children. And who was she protecting the kids from? Not her husband, the father of these children. She was protecting them from the State of New Hampshire.
This country is run by idiots.-quote.

I agree!
Anonymous Coward
User ID: 1330562
United States
06/18/2011 01:26 PM
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Re: WTF!!!!! Man burns himself to death to avoid US debtors prison!!!
I find it funny how all the slaves want to tell the other slaves how they should be working for this corrupt machine.

This is how they control you.


Slave "I work for a living, I pay my taxes, what makes you so special? Get off you ass and get a job!"

Freeman "I'm alive, I live and breathe the air of freedom for a living... I do side jobs for tax-free money, live humble and without debt."

Slave "I got brand new Nike Shoes and Chrome Rims on my new car, It'll be paid off in 5 years"

Freeman "I got 6 month old shoes I bought at Kmart, and a 10 year old used car I paid cash for, and don't owe a dime to NO ONE."

Cop "PAPERS NOW LOW LIFE SCUM!!!"
Anonymous Coward
User ID: 936193
United States
06/18/2011 01:27 PM
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Re: WTF!!!!! Man burns himself to death to avoid US debtors prison!!!
After six months of me not lifting a finger to save this marriage, she filed for divorce. Almost two years after the incident, I was talking with her on the phone. She told me that night she had called a mental health provider we had for one of the kids. Wendy, the counselor told my then wife that if she did not call the police on me, then she too would be arrested.-quote.

great counseling?

Imagine that folks the terrorist counselor?

get this....call the cops or you too will go to jail?

wtf?
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 1366664


Your story has more fucking holes in it
than Martin Luther King Blvd!

Sounds like someone was beating someone's ass.
You did it to yourself regardless. It takes 2 people
to enter into a marriage, and it takes 2 to fuck it up.

Not lifting a finger to save a marriage, in which you took
the same fucking vows as she did to love, honor obey in sickness and health and for better or for worse means YOU
were the dipshit that failed your marriage just as she failed it too.
Anonymous Coward
User ID: 1433532
United States
06/18/2011 01:28 PM
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Re: WTF!!!!! Man burns himself to death to avoid US debtors prison!!!
Blow it out your ass. The guy was a deadbeat and an abuser. I'm in the area.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 1433036


Blow it out your ass. The guy was a deadbeat and an abuser. I'm in the area.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 1433036


Yeah right. And that was the case for the tens of thousands of other dads who ended up in jail for not paying their bitch ex wife right?
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 1433063


These men aren't paying the ex wife, they are suppose to take care of their kids. Blaming the women in these cases when sick men do these things is not right. You all ahve no idea what you are talking about.
Anonymous Coward
User ID: 1366664
Mexico
06/18/2011 01:28 PM
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Re: WTF!!!!! Man burns himself to death to avoid US debtors prison!!!
Improvise, adapt and overcome. The Army teaches that to every soldier it trains. They say that no battle plan survives the first five minutes of combat. So your people on the ground had better be able to think for themselves. Taking casualties in war is just an occupational hazard. Taking casualties and not accomplishing your mission is a disaster. After 21 years of Army service, I am pretty good at improvising.-quote.

I call that a real hero....no dead beat dad here!
Anonymous Coward
User ID: 1366664
Mexico
06/18/2011 01:32 PM
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Re: WTF!!!!! Man burns himself to death to avoid US debtors prison!!!
(Odd isn't it? They know that 50% of victim spouses end up homeless and that 70% of them have children. How can they know the percentages when they do not know how many total arrests were made? Those people at the U.S. Justice Dept. cannot even pull off a credible cover-up. )-quote.
Anonymous Coward
User ID: 1433532
United States
06/18/2011 01:33 PM
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Re: WTF!!!!! Man burns himself to death to avoid US debtors prison!!!
In 2009, James Ball lost his job and was unable to continue making child support payments. His ex-wife, Karen Ball, filed for a hearing on contempt of court, which the court scheduled for 6/24/2011. She alleges that Thomas owes thousands in back child support and attorney’s fees and demands the court sentence him to jail until he can pay the amounts demanded.

James Ball burned himself to death on June 16, 2011 using a large amount of gasoline in front of the Keene, New Hampshire court house. Thomas Ball in a "suicide letter" stated he believed he would end up in jail, saying:

I am due in court the end of the month. The ex-wife lawyer wants me jailed for back child support. The amount ranges from $2,200. to $3,000. depending on who you ask. Not big money after being separated over ten years and unemployed for the last two. But I do owe it. If I show up for court without the money and the lawyer say jail, then the judge will have the bailiff take me into custody. There really are no surprises on how the system works once you know how it actually works. And it does not work anything like they taught you in high school history or civics class.
[link to freekeene.com]


THAT'S AMERICA...
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 1433063


There is no "Debtors" Prison. That was a court order for child support you stupid fear monger!

yeahsure
 Quoting: snow_bunny


That's absolutely right. I know a guy, deadbeat dad, and he works 3 weeks and gets another job. Because that's how long it takes the government to find he's working somewhere and start garnishing his wages.... This guy owes 40,000 in back child support. Yeah he's an ass for not paying it too.
 Quoting: GeekOfTheWeek


Amen! You want to see everything going wrong with America just read the assholes on here threatening to kill themselves, admiring this jerk, or threatening their own children because they don't want to work. Ghey.
 Quoting: Boyd Crowder 1387246



Yes, its scary if this is the way most people actually think. Sick world.
Anonymous Coward
User ID: 1366664
Mexico
06/18/2011 01:36 PM
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Re: WTF!!!!! Man burns himself to death to avoid US debtors prison!!!
After six months of me not lifting a finger to save this marriage, she filed for divorce. Almost two years after the incident, I was talking with her on the phone. She told me that night she had called a mental health provider we had for one of the kids. Wendy, the counselor told my then wife that if she did not call the police on me, then she too would be arrested.-quote.

great counseling?

Imagine that folks the terrorist counselor?

get this....call the cops or you too will go to jail?

wtf?
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 1366664


Your story has more fucking holes in it
than Martin Luther King Blvd!

Sounds like someone was beating someone's ass.
You did it to yourself regardless. It takes 2 people
to enter into a marriage, and it takes 2 to fuck it up.

Not lifting a finger to save a marriage, in which you took
the same fucking vows as she did to love, honor obey in sickness and health and for better or for worse means YOU
were the dipshit that failed your marriage just as she failed it too.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 936193



read the letter in the sentinel....

it´s from the man....

if your wife calls the cops on you for trying to teach your daughter not to lick peoples hands....

that is a serious breach of contract....

you can not save a woman who respects the establishment more than she respects her husband....

it´s simple logic....

but you don´t know that?
Anonymous Coward
User ID: 1366664
Mexico
06/18/2011 01:39 PM
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Re: WTF!!!!! Man burns himself to death to avoid US debtors prison!!!
Feminists had always claimed that when women took over, we would have a kinder, gentler, more nurturing world. After 36 million arrests and 72 million evictions what we got was Joe Stalin.-quote.
Anonymous Coward
User ID: 1432042
United States
06/18/2011 01:39 PM
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Re: WTF!!!!! Man burns himself to death to avoid US debtors prison!!!
That's what happens when the fucking divorce laws aren't reformed and the women ALWAYS FUCKING WIN. ALWAYS. ALWAYS.

I've never seen a case where the wife lost. Never. Doesn't matter if the wife have a $200k a year job and the father is unemployed. The wife wins. Every time.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 1433063


Agree u.s. laws are impossibly punitive and downright cruel to men. My brother was threatened with jail when child support pay'ts for 3 kids was $5,000/month based on a good business period which later became very slow until he closed the doors a few years back.
She didn't educate herself for work during that time and instead bought a million dollar home around the corner from his because she was jealous of his his new home.
He is a simple, good natured guy and put up with her constantly hauling him into court over other trivialities and a bastard of a judge who went with her every time.
All 3 are officially over 18 but she still pursues him for other things.

When I divorced my husband (who had a scary temper) I packed the car 4 months pregnant, drove 1,000 miles away and went for full custody and no responsiblity on his part and got it.
So I chose peace over money battles. It was hard but the right choice for my son and me.

Not all women are bitches, many choose simplicity over bondage over years of distress for everyone. I know quite a few personally who choose letting go.
Anonymous Coward
User ID: 1360621
United States
06/18/2011 01:40 PM
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Re: WTF!!!!! Man burns himself to death to avoid US debtors prison!!!
If you got the balls to call this man a coward... You obviously didn't read his good bye letter...and
I bet you don't have the balls to burn your hand with a Bic lighter much less douse yourself with gasoline and light up in the front door of the courthouse...
Fuck off.
You got no leg to stand on.
This old man is a true to life martyr.
Anonymous Coward
User ID: 1366664
Mexico
06/18/2011 01:40 PM
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Re: WTF!!!!! Man burns himself to death to avoid US debtors prison!!!
The actor Nickolas Cage was drunk in New Orleans with his wife. Everyone else is drunk in New Orleans, so why should Nick be any different. He and his wife were arguing over which house the rented for their stay. Nick grab his wife's arm and started to lead her to his house. The police arrested Nick for domestic violence. His wife was stunned. That was not domestic violence. "Nothing we can do," the police explained to her. "Just following orders."-quote.
Boyd Crowder
User ID: 1387246
United States
06/18/2011 01:42 PM
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Re: WTF!!!!! Man burns himself to death to avoid US debtors prison!!!
I find it funny how all the slaves want to tell the other slaves how they should be working for this corrupt machine.

This is how they control you.


Slave "I work for a living, I pay my taxes, what makes you so special? Get off you ass and get a job!"

Freeman "I'm alive, I live and breathe the air of freedom for a living... I do side jobs for tax-free money, live humble and without debt."

Slave "I got brand new Nike Shoes and Chrome Rims on my new car, It'll be paid off in 5 years"

Freeman "I got 6 month old shoes I bought at Kmart, and a 10 year old used car I paid cash for, and don't owe a dime to NO ONE."

Cop "PAPERS NOW LOW LIFE SCUM!!!"
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 1330562


I own 300 acres, paid for. I own two jeeps and a flat bed paid for. I have a college education, loans paid off. My wife and I have worked are asses off.

I buy new shoes, Nikes or Addias, every six months cash. You aren't free, AC, you just think you are.
vacuumhead
User ID: 1384464
United States
06/18/2011 01:43 PM
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Re: WTF!!!!! Man burns himself to death to avoid US debtors prison!!!
I have never been married, although I've been very close to making that mistake on several occasions.
As far as I'm concerned government nor religion has any business sanctioning any of my feelings or beliefs. My personal relationships are my own concern and should not fall under the auspices of any government office or some holier than thou skygod driven organization.
Our personal liberties may look great on paper but in actuality becoming increasing licensed by the state.
This escalating intervention merely stunts our personal growth and provides further justifications by the TPTB to increasingly control us for our own good.
Anonymous Coward
User ID: 967977
United States
06/18/2011 01:44 PM
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Re: WTF!!!!! Man burns himself to death to avoid US debtors prison!!!
Seriously, why get married? Everything works out for the women. Equality my ass. jerkit
Anonymous Coward
User ID: 1433549
United States
06/18/2011 01:44 PM
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Re: WTF!!!!! Man burns himself to death to avoid US debtors prison!!!
That's what happens when the fucking divorce laws aren't reformed and the women ALWAYS FUCKING WIN. ALWAYS. ALWAYS.

I've never seen a case where the wife lost. Never. Doesn't matter if the wife have a $200k a year job and the father is unemployed. The wife wins. Every time.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 1433063



can't say i blame him

i've been down that road many times...
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 1433082


What kind of stupid goes "down that road many times..."?
 Quoting: ella


A male that thinks overbreeding and popping out kid after kid with mulitple women makes him a "man". He needs to go to the vet and get fixed, if he can't control his libido.
Anonymous Coward
User ID: 1366664
Mexico
06/18/2011 01:47 PM
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Re: WTF!!!!! Man burns himself to death to avoid US debtors prison!!!
The mental health crowd is the third reason I said no. Some people think they are geniuses with their Masters and PH D's. Others think they are so wacky that they call them fruit loops. Well, I have a third name for them. Suckers. They did not get hired for their medical ability. They got these because they were willing to take these cases off the judge's hands. Which has done nothing for the credibility for their profession. We are not here to help-we are here to unload. And they created a liability that did not previously existed. If a judge releases a defendant and he goes kills someone, that judge or the judiciary cannot be sued. But a mental health worker, and their employer certainly can be held liable. Our judiciary is now using the mental health field like a ten dollar whore.-quote.

two dollars....
Anonymous Coward
User ID: 1432042
United States
06/18/2011 01:51 PM
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Re: WTF!!!!! Man burns himself to death to avoid US debtors prison!!!
I find it funny how all the slaves want to tell the other slaves how they should be working for this corrupt machine.

This is how they control you.


Slave "I work for a living, I pay my taxes, what makes you so special? Get off you ass and get a job!"

Freeman "I'm alive, I live and breathe the air of freedom for a living... I do side jobs for tax-free money, live humble and without debt."

Slave "I got brand new Nike Shoes and Chrome Rims on my new car, It'll be paid off in 5 years"

Freeman "I got 6 month old shoes I bought at Kmart, and a 10 year old used car I paid cash for, and don't owe a dime to NO ONE."

Cop "PAPERS NOW LOW LIFE SCUM!!!"
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 1330562


I own 300 acres, paid for. I own two jeeps and a flat bed paid for. I have a college education, loans paid off. My wife and I have worked are asses off.

I buy new shoes, Nikes or Addias, every six months cash. You aren't free, AC, you just think you are.
 Quoting: Boyd Crowder 1387246


Are you just bragging? Why?
All kinds of conditions form an individual life and each defines freedom according to what's possible for that person.
Some are born at a better time that make it possible to create those conditions. Others not. Certainly not for kids just starting out today.
Anonymous Coward
User ID: 1389309
United States
06/18/2011 01:52 PM
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Re: WTF!!!!! Man burns himself to death to avoid US debtors prison!!!
Actually I have seen 1 time and only 1 time a man won, my friend's wife was soooo strung out on drugs she forged a prescription and was arrested for it, he was an ex-cop and had probably the best attourney money can buy for the case (basically spent every penny he had), they kept filing motions (not sure on what basis) until the judge was a man and he won FULL custody of his kid when all was said and done. He then married and had another which "secured" the first one as the courts prefer not to break up siblings.

BUT I HAVE NEVER EVEN HEARD OF ANOTHER TIME, hope that give somebody some hope...

That's what happens when the fucking divorce laws aren't reformed and the women ALWAYS FUCKING WIN. ALWAYS. ALWAYS.

I've never seen a case where the wife lost. Never. Doesn't matter if the wife have a $200k a year job and the father is unemployed. The wife wins. Every time.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 1433063

 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 1412369


If he spent every penny he had on attorney - NO ONE won but the attorney!!
Anonymous Coward
User ID: 1417463
United States
06/18/2011 01:52 PM
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Re: WTF!!!!! Man burns himself to death to avoid US debtors prison!!!
Sad case, but not an isolated one.. and as far as the "scarring?... Bitch is going got have a teenager on their hands, and when they do, they will "slit the throat" of the one that "got their daddy killed"..

Unless of course the cunt can "brainwash" the child into believing "daddy was mean, daddy tried to rape you (yada, yada, yada).

Takes two to tango, and the child always loses, but women in the US, are certified sociopathic, with psychotic tendencies, fits of uncontrollable rage, and delusions of grandeur..

The memory of an elephant (for anything that caused emotional distress), the deviousness of a master in the art of torture, pain, and emotional scarring of the opposite sex.. need I go on..

Women are truly "evil", and the courts are co-opted by the split between their legs...

Guy did what he thought was the only thing left to do.. make a statement... fucin bitch!..
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 1432945


Too true! A woman owes allegiance to her man and her family, in that order. She invited the vampiric state to do her job of standing by her man, and she lost it all. I like women, but will never even sleep with one that trusts these assholes!
Anonymous Coward
User ID: 1420553
United States
06/18/2011 01:53 PM
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Re: WTF!!!!! Man burns himself to death to avoid US debtors prison!!!
Obviously very few here bothered to read this incredibly powerful and moving story. How anyone could read this and think this was about "avoiding debtors prison" is beyond me. Once again GLPer's miss the boat. Sad.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 1433361


I am one of the few that DID take the time to read it.

The guy was obviously well educated. He was articulate in his writing, and made his points very well. He showed his research, and made it clear he understood what he was up against. He obviously did his homework.

I have no idea what he did for a career but he must have been a professional before all this happened.

America is less of a nation with this guy gone, to say nothing of his kid's loss.
ArchaicSEAL
User ID: 873894
United States
06/18/2011 01:55 PM
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Re: WTF!!!!! Man burns himself to death to avoid US debtors prison!!!
Guy was obv frustrated but he also obv had more balls and committment than most Americans.

Not going to say I condone the act - a child could have been watching it occur and be scarred for life over it - but I'm not going to say I don't understand it either. I do.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 1421992


Good, let that child be scarred for life over it. No more easy living. Let people see, at a young age, what the reality of life is. We keep sheltering children, making them soft, making them accept things as they are or worst. I hope that 1 in 5 children scarred by such events take a stand later in life. I hope that such tragedy opens their eyes and drives them to bring justice, peace and hope to the world again. It is only in the fire that we mature, that we grow, that we burn off the impurities of a complacent lifestyle.
Anonymous Coward
User ID: 1417463
United States
06/18/2011 01:55 PM
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Re: WTF!!!!! Man burns himself to death to avoid US debtors prison!!!
It is the mans job to provide regardless. Now man up and pay your child support!
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 1311987


It is a womans job to woman up and spread her legs and open her mouth. See how these generalities work?
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 1395743


+1000!
Anonymous Coward
User ID: 1366664
Mexico
06/18/2011 01:55 PM
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Re: WTF!!!!! Man burns himself to death to avoid US debtors prison!!!
Eight years ago a man in California fled with his children after the police warned him to get out after they had arrested the wife and mother. None of the shelters would take him and the kids in because he was a man. I wonder if this would survive a legal gender discrimination challenge in a federal court?-quote.
Anonymous Coward
User ID: 1360621
United States
06/18/2011 01:55 PM
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Re: WTF!!!!! Man burns himself to death to avoid US debtors prison!!!
Obviously very few here bothered to read this incredibly powerful and moving story. How anyone could read this and think this was about "avoiding debtors prison" is beyond me. Once again GLPer's miss the boat. Sad.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 1433361


I am one of the few that DID take the time to read it.

The guy was obviously well educated. He was articulate in his writing, and made his points very well. He showed his research, and made it clear he understood what he was up against. He obviously did his homework.

I have no idea what he did for a career but he must have been a professional before all this happened.

America is less of a nation with this guy gone, to say nothing of his kid's loss.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 1420553
Anonymous Coward
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06/18/2011 01:56 PM
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Re: WTF!!!!! Man burns himself to death to avoid US debtors prison!!!
In 2009, James Ball lost his job and was unable to continue making child support payments. His ex-wife, Karen Ball, filed for a hearing on contempt of court, which the court scheduled for 6/24/2011. She alleges that Thomas owes thousands in back child support and attorney’s fees and demands the court sentence him to jail until he can pay the amounts demanded.

James Ball burned himself to death on June 16, 2011 using a large amount of gasoline in front of the Keene, New Hampshire court house. Thomas Ball in a "suicide letter" stated he believed he would end up in jail, saying:

I am due in court the end of the month. The ex-wife lawyer wants me jailed for back child support. The amount ranges from $2,200. to $3,000. depending on who you ask. Not big money after being separated over ten years and unemployed for the last two. But I do owe it. If I show up for court without the money and the lawyer say jail, then the judge will have the bailiff take me into custody. There really are no surprises on how the system works once you know how it actually works. And it does not work anything like they taught you in high school history or civics class.
[link to freekeene.com]


THAT'S AMERICA...
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 1433063


One Starred for the bogus thread title.

Shame on the OP for the deceptive summary and misleading characterization of an incredible story.
(at a minimum you could have included the very next paragraph)

I could have made a phone call or two and borrowed the money. But I am done being bullied for being a man. I cannot believe these people in Washington are so stupid to think they can govern Americans with an iron fist. Twenty-five years ago, the federal government declared war on men. It is time now to see how committed they are to their cause. It is time, boys, to give them a taste of war.

Jeers to all the posters who failed to actually read this article before commenting. (Hint: It was not about child support or debtors prison)

Epic Fail to GLP for once again, putting sensationalism before substance.


.
Anonymous Coward
User ID: 1366664
Mexico
06/18/2011 01:58 PM
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Re: WTF!!!!! Man burns himself to death to avoid US debtors prison!!!
Children of these parents also suffer. They used to have their own bedroom in a safe town with good schools. First they have a shelter, then Section 8 public housing. An urban school. Maybe good-maybe not. Kids learn how to be tough in an urban environment. The kids might go bad or they could come out just fine. But there will be no clunky car as a teenager. There will be no saving fund for college. There will be no monetary gift to use as a down payment for a starter home. -quote.
Anonymous Coward
User ID: 1432042
United States
06/18/2011 02:01 PM
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Re: WTF!!!!! Man burns himself to death to avoid US debtors prison!!!
I have never been married, although I've been very close to making that mistake on several occasions.
As far as I'm concerned government nor religion has any business sanctioning any of my feelings or beliefs. My personal relationships are my own concern and should not fall under the auspices of any government office or some holier than thou skygod driven organization.
Our personal liberties may look great on paper but in actuality becoming increasing licensed by the state.
This escalating intervention merely stunts our personal growth and provides further justifications by the TPTB to increasingly control us for our own good.
 Quoting: vacuumhead 1384464



Pre-nups are totally necessary these days, and if you and your mate are friends I would get them to understand how impossible it can be for a man if things don't work out a later on.
Then you can continue being friends and do the right things for all concerned by agreement and flexibility between you.

Child custody/visitation issues should be handled separately with a third party or the court, since those can involve issues of alcohol or substances or family violence.

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