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The sun is right where it should be in the sky!

 
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The sun is right where it should be in the sky!
This year has produced more reports of the sun being in the "wrong place" in the sky than I can remember from previous years, so I wanted to develop a simple technique for accurately and objectively measuring the sun's position in the sky to a much greater resolution than is possible with the human eye, without even having to rely on my telescope's built-in permanently-encoded computer. To that end, this afternoon I setup my telescope to view the sun and measure its position with astrometric precision without even using GOTO technology.

Of course, you can't see background stars with the sun in the same field of view, so how do you perform astrometry of the sun itself? Simple, let the earth's rotation do the work. I simply pointed the telescope at the setting sun (with a safe full-aperture solar filter attached, of course) and started recording video. Moments later, right as a tree top started encroaching on the view, I disengaged the tracking system altogether and noted the time, so at this point the telescope was motionless and the sun started moving out of the field of view as the earth rotated.

Then it was just a matter of waiting. Waiting 2 hours 37 minutes, as a matter of fact. I had disengaged the tracking at 6:41:45 PM eastern time, and this was the corresponding frame of the video, showing the limb of the sun that would later be used to determine its exact position:
[link to i319.photobucket.com]
After the sun set enough that it was safe, I removed the solar filter and waited. At 9:19:21 PM eastern time, a series of fairly bright stars streaked into the field of view, producing this image:
[link to i319.photobucket.com]
Directly merging the two images with 50% opacity allows me to determine with exact precision whether or not the sun was where it should have been in the sky. Overlaying the merged image onto Stellarium set to the exact same points in time at my location shows definitively that the sun was exactly where it should have been, at RA: 11h 15m 24s DEC: +4d 47' 26".
[link to i319.photobucket.com]
The full 2+ hour video from sunset to the above star streak image will be uploaded in a little while, as soon as the video file is done compressing to a reasonable size from the 2+ Gigabyte original file.

Last Edited by Dr. Astro on 09/11/2011 12:10 AM
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samanthasunflower

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09/10/2011 11:55 PM

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Re: The sun is right where it should be in the sky!
I just looked outside. The sun isn't in the sky, it's all dark. We are all doooooooooooooooooooooooomed!!!!\


5a
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09/10/2011 11:58 PM
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Re: The sun is right where it should be in the sky!
I just looked outside. The sun isn't in the sky, it's all dark. We are all doooooooooooooooooooooooomed!!!!\


5a
 Quoting: samanthasunflower


I just looked outside. The sun isn't in the sky, it's all dark. We are all doooooooooooooooooooooooomed!!!!\


5a
 Quoting: samanthasunflower


3 days of darkness, It has begun folks!


damned
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Re: The sun is right where it should be in the sky!
The beauty of this technique is anyone can do it using just a telescope, a safe full aperture solar filter, a camera that can hook up to the telescope, and a clock. You don't even need a tracking system, let alone a GOTO system. It's extremely easy to duplicate, and I'll be able to repeat this test later on as well when we enter the next season of "the sun is too far south."
astrobanner2
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09/11/2011 12:00 AM
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Re: The sun is right where it should be in the sky!
I think it's a result of being completely disconnected with nature. We live such climate-controlled lives, and we can have light 24 hours a day, so the natural world seems weird after a while.
HilosPP

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09/11/2011 12:14 AM

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Re: The sun is right where it should be in the sky!
I just looked outside. The sun isn't in the sky, it's all dark. We are all doooooooooooooooooooooooomed!!!!\


5a
 Quoting: samanthasunflower


I just looked outside. The sun isn't in the sky, it's all dark. We are all doooooooooooooooooooooooomed!!!!\


5a
 Quoting: samanthasunflower


3 days of darkness, It has begun folks!


damned
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 1312616


Haha, no pics no proof, its night time where I'm at so of course its dark.
The Silver Singing Saiyan; Israel's Redeemer.
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antikythera

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09/11/2011 12:15 AM
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Re: The sun is right where it should be in the sky!
I just looked outside. The sun isn't in the sky, it's all dark. We are all doooooooooooooooooooooooomed!!!!\


5a
 Quoting: samanthasunflower


Oh noooooo, same here.

runningscreaming
The wolves among you will devour the sheep.
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ScrumpTheTexan
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09/11/2011 12:16 AM

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Re: The sun is right where it should be in the sky!
I just looked outside. The sun isn't in the sky, it's all dark. We are all doooooooooooooooooooooooomed!!!!\


5a
 Quoting: samanthasunflower


Oh noooooo, same here.

runningscreaming
 Quoting: antikythera


+3

I see no sun outside!

scream
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2Crazy4U

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09/11/2011 12:21 AM
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Re: The sun is right where it should be in the sky!
I just looked outside. The sun isn't in the sky, it's all dark. We are all doooooooooooooooooooooooomed!!!!\


5a
 Quoting: samanthasunflower


Oh noooooo, same here.

runningscreaming
 Quoting: antikythera


+3

I see no sun outside!

scream
 Quoting: ScrumpTheTexan


+4 Its very dark down here

damned

Last Edited by 2Crazy4U on 09/11/2011 12:22 AM
Life its not measure by the number of breath you take, but by the moments that take your breath away.
Anonymous Coward
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09/11/2011 12:22 AM
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Re: The sun is right where it should be in the sky!
[link to science.nasa.gov]
Anonymous Coward
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09/11/2011 12:23 AM
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Re: The sun is right where it should be in the sky!
Play on words so I call

bsflag
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09/11/2011 12:23 AM
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Re: The sun is right where it should be in the sky!
The sun is shining on the other side of the earth right now and I like when that happens. Too bright when it's over here.
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09/11/2011 12:25 AM

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Re: The sun is right where it should be in the sky!
Play on words so I call

bsflag
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 1485094


What are you talking about?
astrobanner2
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09/11/2011 12:32 AM
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Re: The sun is right where it should be in the sky!
that we must try to understand the sun and whats really going on in our universe.
have you tried to learn more about einsteins theories?
i found a really great canal:
Anonymous Coward
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09/11/2011 12:34 AM
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Re: The sun is right where it should be in the sky!
[link to astrotometry.com]
BoxerLvr

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09/11/2011 12:35 AM
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Re: The sun is right where it should be in the sky!
This year has produced more reports of the sun being in the "wrong place" in the sky than I can remember from previous years, so I wanted to develop a simple technique for accurately and objectively measuring the sun's position in the sky to a much greater resolution than is possible with the human eye, without even having to rely on my telescope's built-in permanently-encoded computer. To that end, this afternoon I setup my telescope to view the sun and measure its position with astrometric precision without even using GOTO technology.

Of course, you can't see background stars with the sun in the same field of view, so how do you perform astrometry of the sun itself? Simple, let the earth's rotation do the work. I simply pointed the telescope at the setting sun (with a safe full-aperture solar filter attached, of course) and started recording video. Moments later, right as a tree top started encroaching on the view, I disengaged the tracking system altogether and noted the time, so at this point the telescope was motionless and the sun started moving out of the field of view as the earth rotated.

Then it was just a matter of waiting. Waiting 2 hours 37 minutes, as a matter of fact. I had disengaged the tracking at 6:41:45 PM eastern time, and this was the corresponding frame of the video, showing the limb of the sun that would later be used to determine its exact position:
[link to i319.photobucket.com]
After the sun set enough that it was safe, I removed the solar filter and waited. At 9:19:21 PM eastern time, a series of fairly bright stars streaked into the field of view, producing this image:
[link to i319.photobucket.com]
Directly merging the two images with 50% opacity allows me to determine with exact precision whether or not the sun was where it should have been in the sky. Overlaying the merged image onto Stellarium set to the exact same points in time at my location shows definitively that the sun was exactly where it should have been, at RA: 11h 15m 24s DEC: +4d 47' 26".
[link to i319.photobucket.com]
The full 2+ hour video from sunset to the above star streak image will be uploaded in a little while, as soon as the video file is done compressing to a reasonable size from the 2+ Gigabyte original file.
 Quoting: Astromut




clappa

Last Edited by BoxerLvr on 09/11/2011 02:49 PM
It is precisely because it is fashionable for Americans to know no science, even though they may be well educated otherwise, that they so easily fall prey to nonsense. They thus become part of the armies of the night, the purveyors of nitwittery, the retailers of intellectual junk food, the feeders on mental cardboard, for their ignorance keeps them from distinguishing nectar from sewage. — Isaac Asimov
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09/11/2011 12:37 AM

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Re: The sun is right where it should be in the sky!
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 1535447


Astrometry != astrotometry
astrobanner2
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09/11/2011 12:38 AM
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Re: The sun is right where it should be in the sky!
well, its about understanding 4th and 5th dimension
Anonymous Coward
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09/11/2011 12:41 AM
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Re: The sun is right where it should be in the sky!
This year has produced more reports of the sun being in the "wrong place" in the sky than I can remember from previous years, so I wanted to develop a simple technique for accurately and objectively measuring the sun's position in the sky to a much greater resolution than is possible with the human eye, without even having to rely on my telescope's built-in permanently-encoded computer. To that end, this afternoon I setup my telescope to view the sun and measure its position with astrometric precision without even using GOTO technology.

Of course, you can't see background stars with the sun in the same field of view, so how do you perform astrometry of the sun itself? Simple, let the earth's rotation do the work. I simply pointed the telescope at the setting sun (with a safe full-aperture solar filter attached, of course) and started recording video. Moments later, right as a tree top started encroaching on the view, I disengaged the tracking system altogether and noted the time, so at this point the telescope was motionless and the sun started moving out of the field of view as the earth rotated.

Then it was just a matter of waiting. Waiting 2 hours 37 minutes, as a matter of fact. I had disengaged the tracking at 6:41:45 PM eastern time, and this was the corresponding frame of the video, showing the limb of the sun that would later be used to determine its exact position:
[link to i319.photobucket.com]
After the sun set enough that it was safe, I removed the solar filter and waited. At 9:19:21 PM eastern time, a series of fairly bright stars streaked into the field of view, producing this image:
[link to i319.photobucket.com]
Directly merging the two images with 50% opacity allows me to determine with exact precision whether or not the sun was where it should have been in the sky. Overlaying the merged image onto Stellarium set to the exact same points in time at my location shows definitively that the sun was exactly where it should have been, at RA: 11h 15m 24s DEC: +4d 47' 26".
[link to i319.photobucket.com]
The full 2+ hour video from sunset to the above star streak image will be uploaded in a little while, as soon as the video file is done compressing to a reasonable size from the 2+ Gigabyte original file.
 Quoting: Astromut


I would just kindly like you to know that maybe where you are from it hasn't move but up her in alaska, not just my opinion youtube Inuits warn of changing sun. I live in an ALaskan valley in which there is no horizon so the sun rise besides moutain peaks and set besides moutn peaks at the same place every year at the same time. I have pay attention to this, one main thing is the sun use to shine on my side of the mountain where my house is located about 1 hour longer than the rest of the town. IT NO LONGER DOES, then sun sets behind a earlier peak in the sky, the sun also rises in a diffrent postion
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09/11/2011 12:51 AM

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Re: The sun is right where it should be in the sky!
I would just kindly like you to know that maybe where you are from it hasn't move but up her in alaska, not just my opinion youtube Inuits warn of changing sun.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 1543097

Well, the Inuits are wrong, the sun is not changing (they claim it's due to a change in our axial tilt, I have already shown that is not the case here Thread: There is no physical "pole shift." (Update: There is still no physical "pole shift.") ). Now, you may be seeing some kind of localized change in atmospheric refraction resulting in what would look like odd rise/set times/locations for the sun; Novaya Zemlya has even been documented as early as 400 years ago as causing the sun to appear two weeks early in the arctic. The sun's true position in the sky, however, is exactly where it should be.
astrobanner2
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09/11/2011 01:04 AM
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Re: The sun is right where it should be in the sky!
bump
2Crazy4U

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09/11/2011 01:05 AM
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Re: The sun is right where it should be in the sky!
Man... i don't have anything personal against you, and i am not the kind of coward to write Sh*/4 in the karma system.

But WHY you always have to take the fun out of things that otherwise will be fun..

(Geesus i know that the truth goes first, but again DANG boy, you always kill the party)
Life its not measure by the number of breath you take, but by the moments that take your breath away.
antikythera

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09/11/2011 01:08 AM
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Re: The sun is right where it should be in the sky!
epicfacesunlol
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2Crazy4U

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09/11/2011 01:10 AM
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Re: The sun is right where it should be in the sky!
epicfacesunlol
 Quoting: antikythera


laugh
Life its not measure by the number of breath you take, but by the moments that take your breath away.
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09/11/2011 01:30 AM

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Re: The sun is right where it should be in the sky!
Well, whenever youtube's done processing it, the original raw video footage will be here:
[link to www.youtube.com]
It's heavily compressed, but prior to upload the stars I used to measure the sun's position were still easily visible.
astrobanner2
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Re: The sun is right where it should be in the sky!
Youtube's finally done processing the video. For simplicity's sake I inverted the video to correct for the mirroring of the telescope (though the camera itself was still slightly rotated, which is why it's important to have multiple stars to align to when solving the image astrometrically).

astrobanner2
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Re: The sun is right where it should be in the sky!
Thread: Einsteins Erbe...Evolution of our worldview and understanding of the universe, the sun, the earth, the stars
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09/11/2011 02:57 AM
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Re: The sun is right where it should be in the sky!
The sun rose and set 15 degrees to far north around the solstice, after some wobbling the earths tilt settled back into it's normal rotine. The sun sets right were it should now. Nibiru, the ribbon, I don't know... But I know what I observed.
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09/11/2011 03:07 AM

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Re: The sun is right where it should be in the sky!
The sun rose and set 15 degrees to far north around the solstice, after some wobbling the earths tilt settled back into it's normal rotine. The sun sets right were it should now. Nibiru, the ribbon, I don't know... But I know what I observed.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 1544474


No, what you saw was normal seasonal variation, the earth's tilt has been just fine.
Thread: There is no physical "pole shift." (Update: There is still no physical "pole shift.")
[link to www.godlikeproductions.com]
Don't worry, I can and will repeat this method for measuring the sun's position during future suntard seasons as well.

Last Edited by Dr. Astro on 09/11/2011 03:10 AM
astrobanner2
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09/11/2011 03:24 AM
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Re: The sun is right where it should be in the sky!
I laugh at the "sun is in the wrong" place crowd. Year in, year out, Stonehenge is the same at every equinox and how old is it? 5,6,7 thousand years old?

It's pretty sad that ancient man, looks leap and bounds smarter than modern man...when it comes to natural surroundings.
Anonymous Coward
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09/11/2011 08:42 AM
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Re: The sun is right where it should be in the sky!
The clouds look different though

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