Coming to grips with Chemtrails [shills invited]

Because those LOGICAL dispersal methods don't excite the conspiracy nuts! They PREFER their paranoid and ignorant fantasy about the trails in the sky. The truth isn't really interesting to these people.

^None in China, either.

[link to upload.wikimedia.org]

2025 is a study designed to comply with a directive from the chief of staff of the Air Force to examine the
concepts, capabilities, and technologies the United States will require to remain the dominant air and space
force in the future. Presented on 17 June 1996, this report was produced in the Department of Defense school
environment of academic freedom and in the interest of advancing concepts related to national defense. The
views expressed in this report are those of the authors and do not reflect the official policy or position of the
United States Air Force, Department of Defense, or the United States government

Current technologies that will mature over the next 30 years will offer anyone who has the necessary
resources the ability to modify weather patterns and their corresponding effects, at least on the local scale.
Current demographic, economic, and environmental trends will create global stresses that provide the
impetus necessary for many countries or groups to turn this weather-modification ability into a capability.
In the United States, weather-modification will likely become a part of national security policy with
both domestic and international applications. Our government will pursue such a policy, depending on its
interests, at various levels. These levels could include unilateral actions, participation in a security
framework such as NATO, membership in an international organization such as the UN, or participation in a
coalition. Assuming that in 2025 our national security strategy includes weather-modification, its use in our
national military strategy will naturally follow. Besides the significant benefits an operational capability
would provide, another motivation to pursue weather-modification is to deter and counter potential
adversaries.


[link to csat.au.af.mil]

This is a report concerning the modification of weather patterns and which countries, groups, or alliances will be involved. The emissions that we are seeing from the aircraft, which some refer to as chemtrails, and others (like pussyboy) as persistent contrails, are seen in all NATO countries and any other countries working with NATO governments. They are not seen in countries with no affiliation...as has been my personal experience of being in many countries over the last several years and observing this phenomenon since about 1997. It's possible that testing existed on a very small scale before that, but all of a sudden it went mainstream and the trails were everywhere. Possibly due to the technology being honed to a point that it would be efficient to use on a large scale. This is, I admit, conjecture on my part.Of course, like most people, I can't prove anything. I tend to go with my gut which tells me that something about these emissions is not to our greater good. It also tells me that Noble is just doing his job. It must be hard to support such a crock of shit...when you're actually conscious of it...eh, Noble?! Nice to see you, buddy!

There is no evidence that the trails in the sky have anything to do with any of that. All you have is assumption and speculation...

Your "gut" is lying to you..

And about my replies being my "job"...that's just more evidence of YOUR paranoia.

Ask ANYONE on the planet who has studied this subject and see what they say...Oh wait...they are all in on it...right?

What a paranoid loser moron you must be....

OK, let me see if I understand this fully:

Clouds can form from water vapour and exist for many hours and this is perfectly acceptable, but if an aircraft produces a cirrus cloud that lasts for more than ten minutes, it must be caused by a chemical additive and not water vapour in the exhaust?

Furthermore, anyone who disagrees with this statement is obviously a paid government plant, and not just someone who has their own differing opinion on the matter, even though you don't know that person, have never met them and couldn't possibly have any idea that they were or were not being paid by some shady government agency because this is the X-Files and not real life.

Dear, oh dear - imagine if we lived in a world where the free exchange of ideas was allowed, wouldn't that be nice? I've nothing against those who believe in chemtrails, even if they are incorrect. Why is it then that I'll now be called a 'shill' (is this the fucking 1950s?) just because I agree with atmospheric physics and not them?

Everyone's entitled to their opinion, but when someone has a track record of going after nothing but chemtrail threads, it's kinda obvious that there's something going on more than meets the eye.

I mean, here's Noble's day, Get up at the crack of dawn, and do a chemtrail search on GLP. Repeat and repeat.

But you could be right, maybe he has no life.

He'll say he just gets a kick out of it, that's the excuse.

Well okay let's assume that's true. Good, because I get a kick out of his nonsense and predictability too, he's provided me so much entertainment here, reason why I keep coming back to GLP, for the shits n giggles lol

I've read a lot of Chemtrail threads where Noble has posted, I have no reason to believe he's paid to do so, any more than I was paid to debunk Punisher's ridiculously bad astronomical claims, but I was still accused of it.

Maybe, like I do in a bad science thread, he wants to make sure the counter argument is presented, as after all, a one sided argument is no fun at all.

As to your last paragraph - entertainment is fine because that is why we all come here, but Noble doesn't post 'nonsense' - he posts facts based on atmospheric physics. It is perfectly acceptable that these trails are water vapour from aircraft exhaust, that persist due to atmospheric conditions (just like a naturally occurring cirrus cloud) and later diffuse into a 'contrail cirrus' as they are called. Whatever you think about the man posting, don't attack the content as it is scientifically sound.

As to the chem/con prefix, it's all down to personal opinion and, quite honestly there are a lot of people who base their opinoin on the trails on anecdotal evidence. If there were really something going on, they'd only serve to lessen the credibility of a genuine believer.

I don't "go after" any threads. I post in "chemtrail" threads because lies told about aviation and ignorance spread as truth bothers me. My life happens to revolve around aviation and i'll feel free to post in these threads if that's what i want to do. What's "obvious" is that you are in the habit of making assumptions based on your paranoid world view and spreading those assumptions as truth...and I'm here to call you on it! OF COURSE that upsets you...and I don't give a shit!

Sorry, where I see ignorance and lies presented as fact...i'm going to say something about it.

keep whining about it though...it's hilarious!


My sleeping and surfing habits are none of your business BTW...

You make the case perfectly, calm collected and without name calling. Others would do well to learn from you.

Yup...and I pay a pretty heavy price for doing so.

Even though everything I believe is accepted as fact be everyone who has ever studied atmospheric science and aviation.

It's OK, I expect to be disagreed with on here. But i won't sit back while ignorance is being spread as truth.

But won't....

I only engage in name calling when it is done to me, I will of course return in kind but I feel that I can present the pro-contrails argument without having to do that.

I don't care if everyone else slings insults at each other, I'll only react if they do it to me lol!

Okay fair enough, but you can't expect the rest of us to not do the same. So...

Let's play an easy game first. Correct, believable answers will award you with the genuine humanity factor. This may seem trivial, but they go a long way to prove you are, in fact, human like the rest of us. Believable answers will award you listening points, and will grant you further questions. But be warned: the questions will get harder.

And if you don't: then game over. At least as far as I'm concerned. That is, boring=my going elsewhere.

First question: describe your thrill of flying. You can also include your most memorable moment, good and/or bad.

Let me ask you...would it bother YOU to be accused of being a "government shill" several times a day just for posting the truth?

I figure if they can abuse me with THAT paranoid nonsense...calling them "ignorant chemtards" is only fair play.

The fact is, by definition, they are ignorant...and they continue to prove it with every thread/post. Yet, they attack those of us who are only trying to post the truth and facts.

It's quite funny that the truth is rejected in favor of this ridiculous paranoid fantasy.

And it's YOUR job to determine what's "believable"?!

LOL!!!!

No thanks!

FACT

there are simply more trails and more persistent trails in the sky than before. . . .they are more obvious . . . They may have a climatic effect. . . .some people don't like it. . . .some people think they are part of a conspiracy. . .

FACT:

There are simply more planes flying through conditions which are conducive to persistent contrail creation than before...

Not that it matters...you people don't have the chance of a snowball in hell of stopping aviation in any capacity.

fact. . . .they don't have to fly through those conditions at the frequency they do. . . .they can greatly reduce the frequency and magnitude of trails. . . .

Of course I'd be pissed off if I was being called a 'shill'. Christ the word alone pisses me off, sounds like some cheesy 1950s pulp comic shite.

I agree with you 100% and you obviously have been around the block, so to speak, on these threads and have more reason than I to speak your mind more directly. I'm not in any way criticising you, and I hope it didn't seem that way.

If I was being called stupid, or a 'shill' or the other things you get called, you're bloody right I'd respond to it.




It is a fact that there are more trails. There has been an increase in air traffic, and an evolution of the engines as well. Atmospheric science demonstrates the behaviour of the engine exhausts and, for me at least, adequately explains what I observe now, and have observed in the past to a lesser degree. They almost certainly have a climatic effect, as do the engine exhausts from cars and trucks at ground level but nobody suspects they are chemtrailing at the surface ...

With the best will in the world, basing an assumption that something 'bigger' is going on based on anecdotal evidence and the likes of what one might read on here, is misguided and unnecessary.

Whatever gets you going, though, no harm to you - it's no skin of my nose either way.

thought so, goodbye.

Known atmospheric effects, known methods to mitigate them, NO ACTIONS taken to mitigate them = intentional desire to alter climate. . . . Simple. . . .

But CO2 emissions from jet engines are no different from the emissions from vehicles on the ground. There's no big conspiracy to alter the climate using transport. It's just an unfortunate side effect of the use of petroleum products to power them, and not adopting alternative fuel sources.

See ya later!

WRONG! That's where you make your mistake...you seem to "believe" that air traffic is simply able to be rerouted around areas of saturated and very cold air. As pointed out to you MANY times before...it's hard to know where such conditions will show up...Despite what you 'believe" can be done with "sounding data"...it's not known if an area is conducive to contrail creation until the airplane is already flying through it.

To believe ATC can just reroute several planes in any given area to alleviate persistent contrails is just more ignorance on your part.

Nope...not at all.

The radiative forcing of the persistent trails and their accompanying cirrus cloud banks are the issue, the CO2 is a different issue. . . .Aircraft produce more radiative forcing than any source. . . .and it can be easily reduced by 70%.

Maybe so, but it's a bit of a stretch to say that the laziness of those in control to adopt alternative methods with respect to air transport somehow lends credibility to the 'chemtrail' conspiracy, or some sinister plan to kill us all with 747s. No harm to you but I just can't buy into that myself.

Any other source...or any other source in AVIATION. Please provide a quote.

That is a one sided argument. First, there is more traffic now then before. Since 1975, the number of flights has doubled from 5 million to 10 million per year for just the US. That is close to 30,000 flights per day. Planes fly higher now with more efficient engines that are more prone to contrail formation. Since WWII, the Air Force has worked to eliminate contrails, they are a give away. Commercial airlines don't care.

And here is a web site for contrail prediction

[link to angler.larc.nasa.gov]