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Thanksgiving = Sweeping The Ugly Truth Under the Rug

 
Anonymous Coward (OP)
User ID: 1106916
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11/15/2011 08:38 AM
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Re: Thanksgiving = Sweeping The Ugly Truth Under the Rug
Good post. It was an atrocity what we (our forefathers) did to the Native Americans. I have read "The Sand Creek Massacre" and "Bury My Heart At Wounded Knee." It was nothing short of genocide.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 1826295


To an outsider, USA policies that amount to genocide on foreign soil, continues to this day. What gives?hiding
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 1431121


The USA = born under a BAD star, in its current form no long term good can com from the US it has collected some very bad karma on its short journey and is in desperate need for a cleansing, lovely kind people though just very badly led from the get go.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 1355229


I agree, but I'd also say that the same is true for your country as well.
david
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11/15/2011 08:38 AM
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Re: Thanksgiving = Sweeping The Ugly Truth Under the Rug
Good post. It was an atrocity what we (our forefathers) did to the Native Americans. I have read "The Sand Creek Massacre" and "Bury My Heart At Wounded Knee." It was nothing short of genocide.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 1826295


To an outsider, USA policies that amount to genocide on foreign soil, continues to this day. What gives?hiding
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 1431121


perhaps you have a valid point, seems to me though the balkan nations share a long and proud history of alternately trying to wipe each other off the map.
Catnip

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11/15/2011 08:42 AM
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Re: Thanksgiving = Sweeping The Ugly Truth Under the Rug
someone does'nt know there history and stocks very well.just alil fyi,american indians are made up of WHITE and MONGOLOID stocks.the white man was in america way b4 the indians were even thought of.it was white and mongoloid man that made it possible for there to even be "indians".

another fyi,i like how you people like to make it out that "white man" is this evil sick devil and everyone else are these clean kind gentle people.lmao take a look at africa,mexico lmao.i like how you people love to skip over facts like,the american indians were some of the most savage people in america.
they war'd with there own kind, ie other tribes.they would slaughter and war with other tribes daily.now all the sudden they were these flower picking saints....GO BLOW SMOKE UP SOMEONE ELSES ASS!!!!!!!!!!!.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 2206799



please forgive lisa lisa, she knows not what she does. fyi, Christians worked as missionaries to try to save many of the 'native americans' but heaven forbid anyone look at that in a positive light.... most see that as 'oppression'.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 3840599


Why do Christians need to save anyone? Native Americans lived in harmony with the earth; they were only thought heathens by those who did not live in that harmony, and still don't. Native Americans never wasted anything. When they killed an animal for food, they also made clothes from the hides and tools from the bones. They killed only what they needed. The Christians in their misguided thinking tried stop this by slaughtering all of the buffalo with the intention of starving them out. How cruel! Christians should work on saving themselves and leave others alone. The world would then be a much better place. A first step in living in harmony.
"When you change the way you look at things, the things you look at change"
Clownkiller

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11/15/2011 08:42 AM
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Re: Thanksgiving = Sweeping The Ugly Truth Under the Rug
And people like to ignore or dismiss things that make them feel uncomfortable.
 Quoting: Lisa*Lisa


Just ancient history.
david
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11/15/2011 08:45 AM
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Re: Thanksgiving = Sweeping The Ugly Truth Under the Rug
Good post. It was an atrocity what we (our forefathers) did to the Native Americans. I have read "The Sand Creek Massacre" and "Bury My Heart At Wounded Knee." It was nothing short of genocide.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 1826295


To an outsider, USA policies that amount to genocide on foreign soil, continues to this day. What gives?hiding
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 1431121


The USA = born under a BAD star, in its current form no long term good can com from the US it has collected some very bad karma on its short journey and is in desperate need for a cleansing, lovely kind people though just very badly led from the get go.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 1355229


i'm just loving this! the u s a getting lectured on our warlike tendencies, from europeans?
Anonymous Coward (OP)
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11/15/2011 08:47 AM
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Re: Thanksgiving = Sweeping The Ugly Truth Under the Rug
Interesting post I just found on GLP from 2005:


Native Circle

Issues, Mistakes, Lies & Misconceptions about American Indian people. The Thanksgiving Myth

Let me begin by stating that thousands of years before the ´official´ Thanksgiving Day was proclaimed by Governor Winthrop of the Massachussetts Bay Colony in 1637, North American Indigenous people across the continent had celebrated seasons of Thanksgiving. ´Thanksgiving´ is a very ancient concept to American Indian nations.

The big problem with the American Thanksgiving holiday is its false association with American Indian people. The infamous ´Indians and pilgrims´ myth. It is good to celebrate Thanksgiving, to be thankful for your blessings. It is not good to distort history, to falsely portray the origin of this holiday and lie about the truth of its actual inception. Here are some accurate historical facts about the true origin of this American holiday that may interest you.........................................
´Thanksgiving´ did not begin as a great loving relationship between the pilgrims and the Wampanoag, Pequot and Narragansett people.

In fact,in October of 1621 when the pilgrim survivors of their first winter in Turtle Island sat down to share the first unofficial ´Thanksgiving' meal, the Indians who were there were not even invited! There was no turkey, squash, cranberry sauce or pumpkin pie. A few days before this alleged feast took place, a company of ´pilgrims´ led by Miles Standish actively sought the head of a local Indian chief, and an 11 foot high wall was erected around the entire Plymouth settlement for the very purpose of keeping Indians out! Officially, the holiday we know as ´Thanksgiving´ actually came into existence in the year 1637. Governor Winthrop of the Massachussetts Bay Colony proclaimed this first official day of Thanksgiving and feasting to celebrate the return of the colony´s men who had arrived safely from what is now Mystic, Connecticut. They had gone there to participate in the massacre of over 700 Pequot men, women and children, and Mr. Winthrop decided to dedicate an official day of thanksgiving complete with a feast to ´give thanks´ for their great ´victory´....

As hard as it may be to conceive, this is the actual origin of our current Thanksgiving Day holiday. Many American Indian people these days do not observe this holiday, for obvious reasons. I see nothing wrong with gathering with family to give thanks to our Creator for our blessings and sharing a meal. I do, however, hope that Americans as a whole will one day acknowledge the true origin of this holiday, and remember the pain, loss, and agony of the Indigenous people who suffered at the hands of the so-called ´pilgrims´. It is my hope that children´s plays about ´the first Thanksgiving´, complete with Indians and pilgrims chumming at the dinner table, will someday be a thing of the past. Why perpetuate a lie? Let us face the truths of the past, and give thanks that we are learning to love one another for the rich human diversity we share.

(Written by John Two-Hawks)
ISSUES MISTAKES LIES & MISCONCEPTIONS


[link to www.godlikeproductions.com]
Anonymous Coward
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11/15/2011 08:48 AM
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Re: Thanksgiving = Sweeping The Ugly Truth Under the Rug
You people are all morans - don't mix your cause up with the holiday of Thanksgiving - the tradition started long before the USA or the attempted genocide.

People like to transend their causes into things they are not-
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 1215807


And people like to ignore or dismiss things that make them feel uncomfortable.
 Quoting: Lisa*Lisa



Well some may but it doesn't help your cause when it is misguided. The history of what we did to the Indians is well documented. I suppose those who feel quilty about a past they had nothing to do with can give everything they have to some tribe and move out of the country.
samanthasunflower

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11/15/2011 08:48 AM

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Re: Thanksgiving = Sweeping The Ugly Truth Under the Rug
The original Thanksgiving was all about thanking God for the good harvest brought about by dumping socialism in favor of Capitalism.

The first few years that the Pilgrims were here, they tried to live as the good little socialists for the common good. Since hard work was not rewarded, most people didn't work hard. Then when winter came, people starved to death.

After a few years of this, they divided the land up and went capitalist. Since their work was directly tied to their survival and wealth, the Pilgrims had a reason to work hard. They were able to plant and harvest more than they had before.

Since the local Indians were neighbors and friends, they were invited. There had been some problems between the two groups, but no-one had commited genocide yet.

Although the plagues from Europe had already hit the area years ago, brought in by Indian traders from South America. No person meant to do this. Believe it or not, people didn't understand what diseases like small pox were in the 1600's, or how they were spread. This is why there was land for the Pilgrims to move to. The tribe that had inhabited the land had died from small pox, or some other European originating disease, a year or so before the Pilgrims arrived. Which meant that the Pilgrims got to move into their houses and farm their farmland. This is usually left out of the history books.

The original Thanksgiving is about thanking God for capitalism. Which is why today's marxists, socialist, and communists want it destroyed.
Anonymous Coward (OP)
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11/15/2011 08:49 AM
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Re: Thanksgiving = Sweeping The Ugly Truth Under the Rug
You people are all morans - don't mix your cause up with the holiday of Thanksgiving - the tradition started long before the USA or the attempted genocide.

People like to transend their causes into things they are not-
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 1215807


And people like to ignore or dismiss things that make them feel uncomfortable.
 Quoting: Lisa*Lisa



Well some may but it doesn't help your cause when it is misguided. The history of what we did to the Indians is well documented. I suppose those who feel quilty about a past they had nothing to do with can give everything they have to some tribe and move out of the country.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 1215807


It has nothing to do with "feeling guilty". It has everything to do with TRUTH and acknowledging the TRUTH.
Anonymous Coward
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11/15/2011 08:52 AM
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Re: Thanksgiving = Sweeping The Ugly Truth Under the Rug
please forgive lisa lisa, she knows not what she does. fyi, Christians worked as missionaries to try to save many of the 'native americans' but heaven forbid anyone look at that in a positive light.... most see that as 'oppression'.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 3840599


Despite seeing all those westerns like "the lone ranger and tonto" and hundreds even thousands of others that came out of hollywood portraying the red man as a savage cannibal, this outsider can still see through the fraud.
Anonymous Coward
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11/15/2011 08:52 AM
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Re: Thanksgiving = Sweeping The Ugly Truth Under the Rug
I never did like Thanksgiving.
It is truly inhumane what we did to the Indian people.
 Quoting: spiritnut


Oh Jeebus! That's not why people celebrate it.

Thanksgiving today means being thankful for what we have.

The origin of Thanksgiving is the same.

What they did to the Native Americans was horrific, yes. But I doubt anyone in their right mind who attributes Thanksgiving to genocide.

Point is, that it only matters why we still celebrate Thanksgiving today. To be thankful. Nothing more and nothing less. Please don't turn a special holiday into a basis for a stupid political agenda.
Anonymous Coward
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11/15/2011 08:53 AM
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Re: Thanksgiving = Sweeping The Ugly Truth Under the Rug
Why are the christians getting so hateful? The rage and hatred they spew on this thread is shocking.
Anonymous Coward (OP)
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11/15/2011 08:54 AM
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Re: Thanksgiving = Sweeping The Ugly Truth Under the Rug
Why are the christians getting so hateful? The rage and hatred they spew on this thread is shocking.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 1091302


I have not been hateful to anyone. In fact, I"m doing my best to keep my temper in check even tho I'm getting slammed right and left.

That's nothing new tho, I"m getting used to it.

dance
Anonymous Coward
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11/15/2011 08:54 AM
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Re: Thanksgiving = Sweeping The Ugly Truth Under the Rug
Hi OP,

You know how many People died in the Name of Jesus Christ?
That Rug is WAY bigger than the Genocide of the Indian People (which was a Tragedy undoubtly)

This is enough Reason for me to not follow J C and his crazy gang of pedophile Christian Priests.

Sure, J C was a good Guy, obviously - but the things that happened in his Name are way to terrible to ignore them.
Anonymous Coward (OP)
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11/15/2011 08:55 AM
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Re: Thanksgiving = Sweeping The Ugly Truth Under the Rug
Hi OP,

You know how many People died in the Name of Jesus Christ?
That Rug is WAY bigger than the Genocide of the Indian People (which was a Tragedy undoubtly)

This is enough Reason for me to not follow J C and his crazy gang of pedophile Christian Priests.

Sure, J C was a good Guy, obviously - but the things that happened in his Name are way to terrible to ignore them.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 1643155


You're right........I don't disagree that the RC church commited atrositites and still does, I have nothing to do with them as they are an abomination as far as I'm concerned.

But Jesus has NOTHING to do with people who abuse children. They are following the devil, not Jesus.
Matrix-V

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11/15/2011 08:58 AM
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Re: Thanksgiving = Sweeping The Ugly Truth Under the Rug
"They were kicked out of the land that was theirs for hundreds of years,"

fuck off. no one 'owns' anything. It is all borrowed while in 3rd density. True though you shouldnt hurt or kill another person but then again this is all just experiences for those people at that time.
weegie

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11/15/2011 08:59 AM
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Re: Thanksgiving = Sweeping The Ugly Truth Under the Rug
Sorry, but Thanksgiving is NOT about thanking the Indians. You obviously went to school a hell of a long time after I did. Way back when, we were taught the Indians joined the Pilgrims in thanking GOD...the Great Unmentionable in our schools these days. I REFUSE to apologize for Thanksgiving. This country has mistreated the Indians on many occasions, but Thanksgiving wasn't one of them.
Anonymous Coward
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11/15/2011 08:59 AM
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Re: Thanksgiving = Sweeping The Ugly Truth Under the Rug
The lie here, is the belief, that all the nations of indians, were peaceful, and never committed atrocities upon one another.
 Quoting: Clownkiller


No, not all were peaceful, but some were. Regardless, that does not justify what was done, not even close. The fact is that they were here first, and they were kicked out of their land. It was theirs and it was because of greed that their land was stolen and they were murdered.

Some americans are savages too. Some are, and some aren't.

You don't judge a whole nation of people because of the acts of some.
 Quoting: Lisa*Lisa


You don't know beans.
The idea that the land could be "owned" by anyone was
foreign to the indigenous people of the Americas.
They were territorial savages.
They created no worthwhile civilization in eons.
Their culture was primitive and remained so until they
were absorbed by Western Civilization.

If you think living outdoors in the freezing cold,
hunting and gathering for your survival,
and ALWAYS looking over your shoulder is special,
TRY IT SOME TIME.

You'll come running back to Western Civilization
like the spoiled pampered twit you are.
Catnip

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11/15/2011 08:59 AM
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Re: Thanksgiving = Sweeping The Ugly Truth Under the Rug
Why are the christians getting so hateful? The rage and hatred they spew on this thread is shocking.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 1091302


Yup, they are judgmental as hell. They forget what the Bible says about being judging others.
"When you change the way you look at things, the things you look at change"
Epic Beard Guy
Constitutional Crusader

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11/15/2011 09:05 AM

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Re: Thanksgiving = Sweeping The Ugly Truth Under the Rug
45 million to 250,000 really is quite incredible, american karma is fucked beyond all recognition.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 5364053


It was the British before there was an America. I guess your karma kinda' sucks too!
s226
Hope for the best, but prepare for the worst.
"America is at that awkward stage. It's too late to work within the system, but too early to shoot the bastards." -- Claire Wolfe
Anonymous Coward
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11/15/2011 09:09 AM
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Re: Thanksgiving = Sweeping The Ugly Truth Under the Rug
They did horrifying things to the Indians. Sadly the Indians were friendly with them and the 'Pilgrims' stabbed them in the back. monsters...
 Quoting: Lion of Judah


Very wrong. History via myth, years later. Pilgrims: 1620. King Phillip's war: 1675-76.
Most of the Cape Cod Indians were already dead from European plague when the Pilgrims arrived--which is why there was cleared land and abandoned corn stocks.
There were many great friendships and much mutual respect between the original settlers and the remaining natives. The natives knew how to survive the winter (unless they got smallpox from trappers) and the Pilgrims DIDN'T!.
If any Plymouth separatists were involved in Indian wars, it was their grandchildren, not the originals. There were a few deadly disagreements and misunderstandings between individuals, but no effort to eradicate Indians.
The Puritans (different than the Plymouth separatists) came later and settled in Boston. Ship after ship. By 1675 when many of the more child-like local Indians had been converted to Christianity and settled in "praying towns", they were rounded up and stuck on an island in Boston harbor in the winter.
Clownkiller

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11/15/2011 09:09 AM
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Re: Thanksgiving = Sweeping The Ugly Truth Under the Rug
Some americans are savages too. Some are, and some aren't.

You don't judge a whole nation of people because of the acts of some.
 Quoting: Lisa*Lisa

Really?!
Anonymous Coward (OP)
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11/15/2011 09:15 AM
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Re: Thanksgiving = Sweeping The Ugly Truth Under the Rug
I'm so sad at the lack of care or compassion that so many have displayed in this thread twords the american indians and what happened to them. It's a pity that so many hearts are cold twords the suffering of others.

Who cares, it's turkey day and I want to eat my turkey.

They were pagan heathens anyway.

They were savages and it wasn't their land anyway.

The list goes on and on.........

Makes me sad, the sheeple attitude that justifies the wrong that was done. It will happen again too, in the future, but this time it will be the christians and all who are faithful to God.

They will come for us, and again, it will be justified and swept under the rug as people celebrate our extermination.

"Father forgive them for they know not what they do".

:weep:
Alesiah

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11/15/2011 09:26 AM
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Re: Thanksgiving = Sweeping The Ugly Truth Under the Rug
Thanksgiving = Sweeping The Ugly Truth Under the Rug.

The atrocities that were done against the Indian people were horrific and cruel. Atleast recognize the truth about this "holiday". To deny it is another insult to the Indians that were slaughtered and forced out of their homes and their land. They were kicked out of the land that was theirs for hundreds of years, sent away on a "trail of tears" to unknown territory where many died on the way, and many others died when they got there from diseases and starvation. It never should have happened.

Jesus warned the Indians of the white man that would come with "sticks that killed from a distance". He cried when He told them about what white man would do to them because He knew! He knew about the murders, the atrocities that white man was going to do to the Indian people! He knew that their land would be stolen from them, many would die and life would never be the same for them again!

Yet, this lie of thanksgiving goes on, like nothing ever happened. In schools, children dress up like pilgrims and indians..and everybody is happy.....but nobody mentions the death and horror that really occurred.

How would the Jewish people feel if nobody ever acknowledged the holocaust? How would the Christians feel if nobody acknowledged our people being fed to the lions? How would Veterans feel if nobody remembered the vets that died in the wars?

It happened.......and it's a sad and sorry part of our history that just gets swept under the rug like it never even happened.

If people want to celebrate "thanksgiving", then it should be a memorial for all of the Indians that were murdered and abused at the hands of white man because that's the truth, that's honest and that's the right thing to do.

"Some aspects of the conventional story are true enough. But it's also true that by 1637 Massachusetts Gov. John Winthrop was proclaiming a thanksgiving for the successful massacre of hundreds of Pequot Indian men, women and children, part of the long and bloody process of opening up additional land to the English invaders. The pattern would repeat itself across the continent until between 95 and 99 percent of American Indians had been exterminated and the rest were left to assimilate into white society or die off on reservations, out of the view of polite society.

Simply put: Thanksgiving is the day when the dominant white culture (and, sadly, most of the rest of the non-white but non-indigenous population) celebrates the beginning of a genocide that was, in fact, blessed by the men we hold up as our heroic founding fathers.

The first president, George Washington, in 1783 said he preferred buying Indians' land rather than driving them off it because that was like driving "wild beasts" from the forest. He compared Indians to wolves, "both being beasts of prey, tho' they differ in shape." Thomas Jefferson” president #3 and author of the Declaration of Independence, which refers to Indians as the "merciless Indian Savages" — was known to romanticize Indians and their culture, but that didn't stop him in 1807 from writing to his secretary of war that in a coming conflict with certain tribes, "[W]e shall destroy all of them."


[link to www.tooter4kids.com]

[link to salon.glenrose.net]
 Quoting: Lisa*Lisa


You are correct about this celebration.
AND, the "Trail of Tears" was horrific.
When you spend your 20 dollar bill you can look at the face of the man who was responsible for it.

John Marshall the Third Court Justice, tried to "STOP IT" and ruled in the favor of the Indians, but Marshall's ruling was thrown out by President Jackson.

I give honor to Marshall in his attempt to save the Indians and the homes of the Indian people..
The individuals like that, is who I will remember on this Thanksgiving...
ndcstl

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11/15/2011 09:28 AM

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Re: Thanksgiving = Sweeping The Ugly Truth Under the Rug
Who cares? We won and they lost. Survival of the fittest. Winners get to write history. I'm going to eat a crap ton of food and watch football on Thanksgiving!

macgun


Go USA!!!!!
"The lips of wisdom are closed, except to the ears of Understanding"

A question that sometimes drives me hazy: am I or are the others crazy?
Albert Einstein

Get over here!- Scorpion
Anonymous Coward
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11/15/2011 09:30 AM
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Re: Thanksgiving = Sweeping The Ugly Truth Under the Rug
We're gonna have a huge feast:

turkey
stuffing
mashed potatoes
pumkin pie
and all the rest

mmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmm

and the best part, no kids
ClassicHen

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11/15/2011 09:32 AM
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Re: Thanksgiving = Sweeping The Ugly Truth Under the Rug
Everyone who is educated knows the sad story of what happened to the Indians. They also know that people in history were brutal to each other. And they are today, still, sometimes with a more civilized veneer. Unmanned drones, anyone?

But we are still allowed to give thanks for what we have to be thankful for. If you want to turn Thanksgiving into a Day of Mourning, be my guest.
Beamer
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11/15/2011 09:33 AM
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Re: Thanksgiving = Sweeping The Ugly Truth Under the Rug
Thanksgiving = Sweeping The Ugly Truth Under the Rug.

The atrocities that were done against the Indian people were horrific and cruel. Atleast recognize the truth about this "holiday". To deny it is another insult to the Indians that were slaughtered and forced out of their homes and their land. They were kicked out of the land that was theirs for hundreds of years, sent away on a "trail of tears" to unknown territory where many died on the way, and many others died when they got there from diseases and starvation. It never should have happened.

Jesus warned the Indians of the white man
 Quoting: Lisa*Lisa


That may fly in a censored classroom somewhere but not on the internet.

Wasnt the white man. Think we can narrow that down a little? Im white and done nothing to the natives anywhere.

The Puritan White Christians who created the British American Colonies made the treaty and had thanksgiving with the native Indians (so-named by Columbus the Spanish Catholic butcher).

Before the colonists is when the Natives had problems with Spain. Acting on orders of the pope's Spanish inquisition the natives were subjugated and Africans brought to all the Americas.
[link to en.wikipedia.org]
(see also: history of Haiti at CIA factbook)
[link to www.reformation.org]
[link to www.archive.org]

Then after the American Revolution the new masonic govt had numerous Indian was. Most Indian wars were after 1775. Again the Cap[ital in Washington was founded by Freemasons and the Catholic Church in the Catholic colony Maryland.

So this was not the Americans rather the pope's empire, as usual.
[link to www.manataka.org]
Anonymous Coward
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11/15/2011 09:33 AM
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Re: Thanksgiving = Sweeping The Ugly Truth Under the Rug
[link to www.urantia.org]


Maybe this will help you ignorant ones to finally learn your true origins.
Anonymous Coward
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11/15/2011 09:34 AM
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Re: Thanksgiving = Sweeping The Ugly Truth Under the Rug
[link to garry-nelson.hubpages.com]

so the injuns accumulated no bad karma for genociding off the original inhabitants of merica ?

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