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| 01:37 AM | ||
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| 01:37 AM | ||
There is no Collapse. There is only the New Norm. | |
| Mortgage Hostage Offer Upgrade  User ID: 1571626  United States11/15/2011 06:02 PM Report Abusive Post Report Copyright Violation | |
| Anonymous Coward User ID: 5427711  Portugal11/15/2011 06:03 PM Report Abusive Post Report Copyright Violation | |
| Mortgage Hostage (OP) User ID: 1571626 United States11/15/2011 06:07 PM Report Abusive Post Report Copyright Violation | Thank you for the reply! I will check out the video as soon as i get home. I'm at work. I can tell you that this is not going to happen. The crisis in the 1929's was far worse than this. And look what happened to them. By the 1950's things were booming again. Yes, takes time. The great depression was far worse than this. Do you see anyone starving outside for food? Do you see bread lines for the un-employed? All i see is Occupy Wall Streeters with new laptops and cool phones updating to Facebook. This is no crisis. This is actually a dream compared to what the folks in the great depression had to endure. New Norm thats all this is. I will watch your video. Thank you for the reply. MH |
| Anonymous Coward User ID: 5110867 United States11/15/2011 06:28 PM Report Abusive Post Report Copyright Violation | |
| Debt 4 Green User ID: 4682207 United States11/15/2011 06:49 PM Report Abusive Post Report Copyright Violation | There is no collapse of the markets. Not today, not tomorrow or next year. What's happening now is called the "New Normal" Quoting: Mortgage Hostage The market collapse that we all talk about is not going to happen. I am hoping the market collapses. I've been waiting patiently for a re-fi on my house. I'm currently being held hostage by my house. There is no way i can sell it and get what i paid for it. Forget about making a profit. I would just like to break even and not owe a single penny. The sad truth is this. The real estate market will come back, but it will take time. The markets will not collapse. Look all around you. People are still visiting Vegas, people are still flying around the country. Record sales are being recorded during blackfriday, etc, etc... The list goes on forever. We're in the new Norm. Homes are not worth those exaggerated prices they used to be. If you're waiting for financial doom to come, let me tell you. You will be waiting forever. There is no doom. I for one hope that the market does crash, i need an out of my house. But the reality is, we're no where near this. There are still more people paying their mortgages than people who are being foreclosed on. Even the people like me who are upside down on their house;are continuing to pay their mortgage. why? I dont know, but we are. Bottom line. Things will remain the same. You watch! look 3yrs ago no one would have thought that gas would be at $3.75 a gallon as the norm. Now its just the norm. We see $3.65 and we go out of our way to save a dime. Market is not going to crash, the US has too much technology. The system will remain the same. Occupy Wall street will end soon. Winter months are coming. You going to stand in the cold? What we need to do is have a Dont pay your mortgage thing. Remember readers! New Norm! thats what this all is. Forget Gerald Celente. He is right on predicting market trends, but crashes, never. The market never crashes. Money is printed. There is enough money to make everyone a millionaire. How could a system like this collapse? We're all consumers and we will continue consuming. If you dont consume, the system will consume you. IE homeless etc... I would agree with you in terms of it being the new "norm" as this is truth which has been shown throughout a short-term history (EX. Patriot Act, War, TSA) however. This whole speculation of market collapse comes from more sources then just the real estate market. This has been a crisis that has been cooking for decades. Massive amounts of wreckless spending (EX QE 1) without paying back the wreckless spending. The problem is that we borrowed, borrowed, borrowed, without really considering where to get the money to pay for it later. That's where we are at right now. The end of the road. Sure we can keep printing more money, but it will just go into the massive black hole of debt that already exists. Eventually it won't matter how much money they print, it will be impossible to print our way out of the rut we dug ourselves in.  |
| Anonymous Coward User ID: 5266819 United States11/15/2011 06:50 PM Report Abusive Post Report Copyright Violation | |
| Anonymous Coward User ID: 5181695 United States11/15/2011 06:51 PM Report Abusive Post Report Copyright Violation | |
| Anonymous Coward User ID: 5181695 United States11/15/2011 06:51 PM Report Abusive Post Report Copyright Violation | |
| Mortgage Hostage (OP) User ID: 1513046 United States11/15/2011 07:11 PM Report Abusive Post Report Copyright Violation | Ok got home and the first thing i did was watch the video. I'm not impressed. Good effort on behalf of the video creators but the world they describe is not the world we live in. See, back in 1929 things were bad, really, really, bad! People were standing in line for bread. Unemployment was high, wayyyy high! People were starving. Do you see anyone starving today? What i see is a bunch of OWStreeters in line with Ipads, Iphones, you name it, snapping pictures and posting them to Facebook. This is the New Norm. Not a Collapse. There is no Collapse. Here i will make a prediction. but first lets do a quick history check. Back in 1929, 1930 or even 1935 did you ever hear of any company posting profits for black friday? Well of course not, black Friday did not exist. You're correct! Those were some real hard times. This year, instead of a record number of people standing in line for bread. There will be record number of people standing outside best buy for a chance to "Consume".. Not just best buy but, JCPenny, Macy, Walmart, Gamestop you name it. There is no Collapse! There will be new records set this year for black friday. Now you really want to know the sad truth? You can tally up all the sales of bread in any given town for that day, Vs any day in 1929 and i am willing to bet you that 1929 has us beat. I highly doubt you will be out shopping for food the day after ThanksGiving. Instead you will be out with the masses shopping. "The New Normal" This is whats upon us. My fellow GLPer's I love you all but you need to wake up and realize that there is no Collapse. Records will be broken this year in Vegas in terms of tourism. People are still paying $400 for a ticket from Chicago to NYC. New car's are being built. These are all things that were not possible in 1929 during the REAL Collapse. Thoughts? |
| Anonymous Coward User ID: 1351486 United States11/15/2011 07:16 PM Report Abusive Post Report Copyright Violation | you need to get out more.. there are plenty of people starving, homeless,etc...its only going to get worse. This country depends on a large middle class to support the infrastructure and that continues to decline..America will go broke state by state...and the world will follow -any way, why are you depressed that it isn't going to collapse? You think you have it rough now??? lol |
| LindaE User ID: 1415061 United States11/15/2011 07:16 PM Report Abusive Post Report Copyright Violation | And if we didn't have food stamps that get recharged every few weeks, we would see foodlines. The Salvation Army is doing a great job of feeding people, and a lot of local churches are offering dinners near the end of the month when the money gets tight. Schools are loading backpacks for some lower income kids to take home over the weekend so they won't go hungry. You just have to talk with the people who are working with these people to see the need. We're keeping it under the covers... for the moment. |
| Mortgage Hostage (OP) User ID: 1513046 United States11/15/2011 07:33 PM Report Abusive Post Report Copyright Violation | you need to get out more.. there are plenty of people starving, homeless,etc...its only going to get worse. Quoting: exiled1 This country depends on a large middle class to support the infrastructure and that continues to decline..America will go broke state by state...and the world will follow -any way, why are you depressed that it isn't going to collapse? You think you have it rough now??? lol Thank you for the reply! I agree there are people out there who have it rough. But it's always been this way. What i talk about here is how some are blowing the Collapse trumpets, when indeed there is no Collapse in sight, just record profits for retailers. You asked, why are you depressed that it isn't going to Collapse. Well the reason i feel this way is because prior to purchasing my house, I had a gut feeling that i was over paying for something that was not worth that much money. Some might say man $195,000 is nothing to fret about, but it sure is. I would like to move but cant. My house is only worth $140,000 on a good day like Armageddon. My home is in showroom condition. Look, all I'm saying is that things may seem like they're bad but in reality, it just depends on YOUR current financial situation. Look here is the bottom line. If Collapse was imminent, if a Real Estate crash was going to take down the most powerful military in the world, yes you read that right, a real estate crash, not even a bullet. Who would have thought? NOT... If a real Collapse was imminent they would pardon or forgive our debts. Thats a real Collapse for yah in the mirror. Shoot i think Colombia just did this to their people. They adjusted their mortgage to the new rates. Not here in America. Why because we will continue to consume. You wait and see my friend. People will be standing in MOBS on black Friday. But the sad thing here is that you wont see anyone standing in line for more than 3seconds for a loaf of bread. |
| Anonymous Coward User ID: 1508293 United States11/15/2011 07:46 PM Report Abusive Post Report Copyright Violation | |
| Anonymous Coward User ID: 1508293 United States11/15/2011 07:47 PM Report Abusive Post Report Copyright Violation | |
| Anonymous Coward User ID: 1351486 United States11/15/2011 08:08 PM Report Abusive Post Report Copyright Violation | you need to get out more.. there are plenty of people starving, homeless,etc...its only going to get worse. Quoting: exiled1 This country depends on a large middle class to support the infrastructure and that continues to decline..America will go broke state by state...and the world will follow -any way, why are you depressed that it isn't going to collapse? You think you have it rough now??? lol Thank you for the reply! I agree there are people out there who have it rough. But it's always been this way. What i talk about here is how some are blowing the Collapse trumpets, when indeed there is no Collapse in sight, just record profits for retailers. You asked, why are you depressed that it isn't going to Collapse. Well the reason i feel this way is because prior to purchasing my house, I had a gut feeling that i was over paying for something that was not worth that much money. Some might say man $195,000 is nothing to fret about, but it sure is. I would like to move but cant. My house is only worth $140,000 on a good day like Armageddon. My home is in showroom condition. Look, all I'm saying is that things may seem like they're bad but in reality, it just depends on YOUR current financial situation. Look here is the bottom line. If Collapse was imminent, if a Real Estate crash was going to take down the most powerful military in the world, yes you read that right, a real estate crash, not even a bullet. Who would have thought? NOT... If a real Collapse was imminent they would pardon or forgive our debts. Thats a real Collapse for yah in the mirror. Shoot i think Colombia just did this to their people. They adjusted their mortgage to the new rates. Not here in America. Why because we will continue to consume. You wait and see my friend. People will be standing in MOBS on black Friday. But the sad thing here is that you wont see anyone standing in line for more than 3seconds for a loaf of bread. The world is changing, this is true, and it is also quite obvious America can not support itself in this new state... and banks are continually adjusting their rates down for people..you probably can get a modification yourself if you jump through the right hoops |
| Anonymous Coward User ID: 1349914 United States11/15/2011 08:10 PM Report Abusive Post Report Copyright Violation | There is no collapse of the markets. Not today, not tomorrow or next year. What's happening now is called the "New Normal" Quoting: Mortgage Hostage The market collapse that we all talk about is not going to happen. I am hoping the market collapses. I've been waiting patiently for a re-fi on my house. I'm currently being held hostage by my house. There is no way i can sell it and get what i paid for it. Forget about making a profit. I would just like to break even and not owe a single penny. The sad truth is this. The real estate market will come back, but it will take time. The markets will not collapse. Look all around you. People are still visiting Vegas, people are still flying around the country. Record sales are being recorded during blackfriday, etc, etc... The list goes on forever. We're in the new Norm. Homes are not worth those exaggerated prices they used to be. If you're waiting for financial doom to come, let me tell you. You will be waiting forever. There is no doom. I for one hope that the market does crash, i need an out of my house. But the reality is, we're no where near this. There are still more people paying their mortgages than people who are being foreclosed on. Even the people like me who are upside down on their house;are continuing to pay their mortgage. why? I dont know, but we are. Bottom line. Things will remain the same. You watch! look 3yrs ago no one would have thought that gas would be at $3.75 a gallon as the norm. Now its just the norm. We see $3.65 and we go out of our way to save a dime. Market is not going to crash, the US has too much technology. The system will remain the same. Occupy Wall street will end soon. Winter months are coming. You going to stand in the cold? What we need to do is have a Dont pay your mortgage thing. Remember readers! New Norm! thats what this all is. Forget Gerald Celente. He is right on predicting market trends, but crashes, never. The market never crashes. Money is printed. There is enough money to make everyone a millionaire. How could a system like this collapse? We're all consumers and we will continue consuming. If you dont consume, the system will consume you. IE homeless etc... you're right No collapse...just ever higher prices, and fewer and fewer choices for the average person I wish it could crash as well, then we might have a chance at freedom, but I can tell it won't happen These little crashes and gyrations are being used to erode value, to be used as an excuse to usher in all kinds of new restrictiosn and regulations which will remove even more chance of profit... sadly, it is all going according to plan good post OP |
| Mortgage Hostage (OP) User ID: 1513046 United States11/15/2011 08:28 PM Report Abusive Post Report Copyright Violation | you're right No collapse...just ever higher prices, and fewer and fewer choices for the average person I wish it could crash as well, then we might have a chance at freedom, but I can tell it won't happen These little crashes and gyrations are being used to erode value, to be used as an excuse to usher in all kinds of new restrictiosn and regulations which will remove even more chance of profit... sadly, it is all going according to plan good post OP Thanks everyone for the reply's.. I appreciate the readership and responses to this post. Honestly, i can go on and on about this subject. Couple of months ago i thought all of this was possible, but with all the researching i been doing on the net. The only conclusion the research lead me to is, no collapse. I'm telling you all. If you're a skeptic, just sit back and watch. I'm not talking sci-fi here. Watch black friday and then Cyber monday. watch how we the sheep consume en-masses... This is not bad. This is the new norm. Here let's look at the hardest hit city in America. Las Vegas NV. Do you see or hear about houses being demolished? People are still living in there homes. There are more people paying their mortgage in Vegas than there are folks not paying their mortgage. Casino parking lots are FULL! Live in Vegas? Drive by Palace Station over by North Las Vegas Air Terminal and tell me the parking lot is not full. This Casino is not even on the strip. Go do disney and stand in line for 120mins waiting for a 2min ride. While waiting ask yourself why are their so many people here? Go to any ski resort in Colorado and ask why are there record numbers of people here. Here i have a question for you readers. Why are their still people moving to California? Why are there still people buying new cars in record numbers? Why am i seeing more and more Escalades N $45K SUV's on the road. Why am i not seeing older cars on the roads. etc etc... What Collapse people? What Collapse? Look around you. |
| Ohwell User ID: 1130828  United Kingdom11/15/2011 08:35 PM Report Abusive Post Report Copyright Violation | Their greatest weapon is to trick you that debt (money) is real. They have to make this collapse as systemic or as logical as possible to make people believe that their government is working for them. S&P, the banks and the government are not separate entities (well on the surface, they appear as such) but they are all owned by the NWO and both want a crash. Its in their script. The only problem is if the crash comes too quick and not make sense, it would wake up too many people who have been brainwashed to believe they are special or better than others. These are the so called professionals, experts, ideologists etc. who think they know how the world works. Now, you wouldn't want to do that would you? To make a great number of people wake up all of a sudden with their pants down  and wonder how the heck did that happen?You wouldn't want them to question and realise that absolutely everything they have ever been told about the world is a lie, would you? Its game over at that point for the NWO and this is what they are trying to prevent. They don't want attention of the masses on them and blame pointed at them. If the collapse is slow, the gullible masses unaffected by the crisis will still think that its just a hard recession and they will keep on keeping on at the expense of others affected. People are just not that concerned about the plights of the suffering of others. The REAL WAR is between the NWO's aeons of global enslavement (humanity's true historical origin and creation as a slave specie) and humanity's awakening and realisation that they are all but pawns, pets and slaves in this entirely rigged world system. Will they come to that realisation and face the ugly truth and reality? Well, pray this crash is sudden or expedited by a force so great and that which the NWO never factored into the equation or modelled in their plans. This is the only hope if humanity awakens as one with the same message and realisation that they've been duped from the very start. |
| Mortgage Hostage (OP) User ID: 1513046 United States11/15/2011 08:45 PM Report Abusive Post Report Copyright Violation | Their greatest weapon is to trick you that debt (money) is real. They have to make this collapse as systemic or as logical as possible to make people believe that their government is working for them. S&P, the banks and the government are not separate entities (well on the surface, they appear as such) but they are all owned by the NWO and both want a crash. Its in their script. Quoting: Ohwell The only problem is if the crash comes too quick and not make sense, it would wake up too many people who have been brainwashed to believe they are special or better than others. These are the so called professionals, experts, ideologists etc. who think they know how the world works. Now, you wouldn't want to do that would you? To make a great number of people wake up all of a sudden with their pants down and wonder how the heck did that happen?You wouldn't want them to question and realise that absolutely everything they have ever been told about the world is a lie, would you? Its game over at that point for the NWO and this is what they are trying to prevent. They don't want attention of the masses on them and blame pointed at them. If the collapse is slow, the gullible masses unaffected by the crisis will still think that its just a hard recession and they will keep on keeping on at the expense of others affected. People are just not that concerned about the plights of the suffering of others. The REAL WAR is between the NWO's aeons of global enslavement (humanity's true historical origin and creation as a slave specie) and humanity's awakening and realisation that they are all but pawns, pets and slaves in this entirely rigged world system. Will they come to that realisation and face the ugly truth and reality? Well, pray this crash is sudden or expedited by a force so great and that which the NWO never factored into the equation or modelled in their plans. This is the only hope if humanity awakens as one with the same message and realisation that they've been duped from the very start. This made me think of a show i watched last night titled "The Lottery Changed my Life" now let's say you won the lottery. Looks like your in the UK, is that pounds? I think so? I get pounds of ham at the deli, Sara lee honey ham, really good! Opps! got off subject... if you won the lottery, would you really still feel this way? Do you think you would still believe in this conspiracy theory? Here, I'll give you the benefit of the doubt and assume you're right, there is nothing that I, nor you can do to change this. Lot's of us are awake. The problem is that the system we live in is consumer - consume based. We're too busy consuming. 2yrs from now we will be on GLP looking at these old post and saying, wow this dude was right. Shit just worked itself out. The New Normal. :) |
| Anonymous Coward User ID: 961432 United States11/15/2011 09:01 PM Report Abusive Post Report Copyright Violation | The government has been papering over the collapse since '08, by deficit spending about $1.5 trillion a year or about 12% of GDP. GDP prints on average have been around 2%, so if you took out the government deficit spending (debt) we would be running -8% GDP yoy, that is beyond a depression, that is a collapse. To make all that debt the world has accumulated for about 30 years, the world's GDP would have to increase about 15% annually to absorb the current global usury charges. This whole system is built on leverage, and that leverage is increasing exponentially every year. Sooner or later the wheels are gonna come off the bus, that is if the debt issued has any value whatsoever, and the banks hold that debt as assets and that debt is based on mathematics. The math says it comes apart eventually, either the system is valuable built on the math or it is not. You choose. |
| Anonymous Coward User ID: 961432 United States11/15/2011 09:04 PM Report Abusive Post Report Copyright Violation | |
| Ohwell User ID: 1130828 United Kingdom11/15/2011 09:09 PM Report Abusive Post Report Copyright Violation | This made me think of a show i watched last night titled "The Lottery Changed my Life" now let's say you won the lottery. Looks like your in the UK, is that pounds? I think so? I get pounds of ham at the deli, Sara lee honey ham, really good! Opps! got off subject... if you won the lottery, would you really still feel this way? Do you think you would still believe in this conspiracy theory? Here, I'll give you the benefit of the doubt and assume you're right, there is nothing that I, nor you can do to change this. Lot's of us are awake. The problem is that the system we live in is consumer - consume based. We're too busy consuming. 2yrs from now we will be on GLP looking at these old post and saying, wow this dude was right. Shit just worked itself out. The New Normal. :) Quoting: Mortgage Hostage Would you be happy if you lost your job or you think you are in control of what happens in your life? No scorn intended please.... Do you realise the NWO will get rid of you as they would any other person? So don't think you are secured within your job. I will say this.......this war is not as one sided as you may think. I have spent a great deal of time figuring out what the heck is going on in our world and my research has taken me to esoteric levels and the true origins of mankind - created as a slave specie and had their DNAs tampered with. Humans, unlike other animals, lack any form of ability to live in balance with nature or each other. We lack the unique ability of seeing each other's pains and suffering and yes, we are somehow dependent on the system which clothes us, provides for us, feeds us etc. Can you see that you are willing to adjust to a new normal even at the expense of your fellow human being? Is that normal? The fact that the same people who did 9/11 are still in power and are orchestrating the crisis to kill us in huge numbers doesn't bother you it seems. Do you think any of this makes sense or you are happy with the illusion that you have a job even when others don't and to assume everything is fine? You think what is at stake here is just about jobs or a NEW NORMAL? These are the difficult questions you need to ask and wish everyone else come to terms with. What is the point working when they are gonna kill you the next moment. Doesn't that bother you? Yeah, I know its crazy!!! Yes we are being forced to work to survive and it isn't right. Its wrong what we are being made to do can only be blamed on our designers who have stripped from us (our DNA) the skills and spiritual abilities we really need to live with each other and nature. Lions don't kill lions for food and they respect each other's territories. Humans who are meant to be more intelligent do all sorts of evil. This guy does a good summary of what I just said. |
| Mortgage Hostage (OP) User ID: 1513046 United States11/15/2011 09:16 PM Report Abusive Post Report Copyright Violation | The government has been papering over the collapse since '08, by deficit spending about $1.5 trillion a year or about 12% of GDP. GDP prints on average have been around 2%, so if you took out the government deficit spending (debt) we would be running -8% GDP yoy, that is beyond a depression, that is a collapse. To make all that debt the world has accumulated for about 30 years, the world's GDP would have to increase about 15% annually to absorb the current global usury charges. This whole system is built on leverage, and that leverage is increasing exponentially every year. Sooner or later the wheels are gonna come off the bus, that is if the debt issued has any value whatsoever, and the banks hold that debt as assets and that debt is based on mathematics. The math says it comes apart eventually, either the system is valuable built on the math or it is not. You choose. I dont get it? How could you come to this conclusion with all thats going on around you. Your numbers make sense, but money is printed or should i say, digitally added. As long as American dollars are the world standard, we will continue to print money. Most of this debt is based on over charged interest for loans, thereby making it "FAKE MONEY" America is the creator of Technology, there is nothing without us. Things are bad in this country but they could technically be much worse. We could have a REAL Collapse, not some fake Collapse. How about them grammys a couple of months ago huh? Bunch of Overpaid millionaire TV stars receiving awards. Think these guys are thinking about a Collapse? No way, they probably wouldnt even know what you were talking about if you asked them about a Collapse. |
| Mortgage Hostage (OP) User ID: 1513046 United States11/15/2011 09:18 PM Report Abusive Post Report Copyright Violation | This made me think of a show i watched last night titled "The Lottery Changed my Life" now let's say you won the lottery. Looks like your in the UK, is that pounds? I think so? I get pounds of ham at the deli, Sara lee honey ham, really good! Opps! got off subject... if you won the lottery, would you really still feel this way? Do you think you would still believe in this conspiracy theory? Here, I'll give you the benefit of the doubt and assume you're right, there is nothing that I, nor you can do to change this. Lot's of us are awake. The problem is that the system we live in is consumer - consume based. We're too busy consuming. 2yrs from now we will be on GLP looking at these old post and saying, wow this dude was right. Shit just worked itself out. The New Normal. :) Quoting: Mortgage Hostage Would you be happy if you lost your job or you think you are in control of what happens in your life? No scorn intended please.... Do you realise the NWO will get rid of you as they would any other person? So don't think you are secured within your job. I will say this.......this war is not as one sided as you may think. I have spent a great deal of time figuring out what the heck is going on in our world and my research has taken me to esoteric levels and the true origins of mankind - created as a slave specie and had their DNAs tampered with. Humans, unlike other animals, lack any form of ability to live in balance with nature or each other. We lack the unique ability of seeing each other's pains and suffering and yes, we are somehow dependent on the system which clothes us, provides for us, feeds us etc. Can you see that you are willing to adjust to a new normal even at the expense of your fellow human being? Is that normal? The fact that the same people who did 9/11 are still in power and are orchestrating the crisis to kill us in huge numbers doesn't bother you it seems. Do you think any of this makes sense or you are happy with the illusion that you have a job even when others don't and to assume everything is fine? You think what is at stake here is just about jobs or a NEW NORMAL? These are the difficult questions you need to ask and wish everyone else come to terms with. What is the point working when they are gonna kill you the next moment. Doesn't that bother you? Yeah, I know its crazy!!! Yes we are being forced to work to survive and it isn't right. Its wrong what we are being made to do can only be blamed on our designers who have stripped from us (our DNA) the skills and spiritual abilities we really need to live with each other and nature. Lions don't kill lions for food and they respect each other's territories. Humans who are meant to be more intelligent do all sorts of evil. This guy does a good summary of what I just said. Checking out the video now... |
| Anonymous Coward User ID: 961432 United States11/15/2011 09:30 PM Report Abusive Post Report Copyright Violation | The government has been papering over the collapse since '08, by deficit spending about $1.5 trillion a year or about 12% of GDP. GDP prints on average have been around 2%, so if you took out the government deficit spending (debt) we would be running -8% GDP yoy, that is beyond a depression, that is a collapse. To make all that debt the world has accumulated for about 30 years, the world's GDP would have to increase about 15% annually to absorb the current global usury charges. This whole system is built on leverage, and that leverage is increasing exponentially every year. Sooner or later the wheels are gonna come off the bus, that is if the debt issued has any value whatsoever, and the banks hold that debt as assets and that debt is based on mathematics. The math says it comes apart eventually, either the system is valuable built on the math or it is not. You choose. I dont get it? How could you come to this conclusion with all thats going on around you. Your numbers make sense, but money is printed or should i say, digitally added. As long as American dollars are the world standard, we will continue to print money. Most of this debt is based on over charged interest for loans, thereby making it "FAKE MONEY" America is the creator of Technology, there is nothing without us. Things are bad in this country but they could technically be much worse. We could have a REAL Collapse, not some fake Collapse. How about them grammys a couple of months ago huh? Bunch of Overpaid millionaire TV stars receiving awards. Think these guys are thinking about a Collapse? No way, they probably wouldnt even know what you were talking about if you asked them about a Collapse. "Money" cannot be as you say, printed. Currency (which is different than money) can come into being from the issuance of debt. The US Treasury sells bonds at auctions to the primary dealers who purchase the bonds with federal reserve credit. The US Treasury then promises to pay off those bonds, with interest, over the term of the instrument. Or lets say you use your credit card to purchase something at the store, but don't have any money currently in your bank to pay for it. That is currency coming into being, but there is the promise that you will pay off that debt with interest that makes it "valuable". The bank who issued you the card is counting that debt you incurred from the transaction as an asset. The only real "printing" of "money" that has occurred that I can tell, was when the fed purchased the toxic RMBS and CMBS securities from banks at the peak market value. That is the underlying collateral of the instruments was falling apart, and if sold on the market the banks could have gotten maybe 10 cents on the dollar, but the fed issued credit (which they have the authority to do only for US treasury securities) and purchased the instruments at the peak market values before the crisis. Anyway, the entire system is interrelated through debt. If you "print" money to pay off interest and principle then you undermine the future value of the instrument by debasing the standard unit of account of the bill of credit. Really, there is simply hundreds of trillions of dollars in debt in the world economy that will never be paid off in current purchasing power, meaning that debt will be liquidated by the market through bankruptcy or governments will begin to "print" non interest bearing currency to pay off the principle and interest of the debt inducing a hyper-inflationary collapse similar to Weimar Germany. |
| Anonymous Coward User ID: 961432 United States11/16/2011 11:23 AM Report Abusive Post Report Copyright Violation | The government has been papering over the collapse since '08, by deficit spending about $1.5 trillion a year or about 12% of GDP. GDP prints on average have been around 2%, so if you took out the government deficit spending (debt) we would be running -8% GDP yoy, that is beyond a depression, that is a collapse. To make all that debt the world has accumulated for about 30 years, the world's GDP would have to increase about 15% annually to absorb the current global usury charges. This whole system is built on leverage, and that leverage is increasing exponentially every year. Sooner or later the wheels are gonna come off the bus, that is if the debt issued has any value whatsoever, and the banks hold that debt as assets and that debt is based on mathematics. The math says it comes apart eventually, either the system is valuable built on the math or it is not. You choose. I dont get it? How could you come to this conclusion with all thats going on around you. Your numbers make sense, but money is printed or should i say, digitally added. As long as American dollars are the world standard, we will continue to print money. Most of this debt is based on over charged interest for loans, thereby making it "FAKE MONEY" America is the creator of Technology, there is nothing without us. Things are bad in this country but they could technically be much worse. We could have a REAL Collapse, not some fake Collapse. How about them grammys a couple of months ago huh? Bunch of Overpaid millionaire TV stars receiving awards. Think these guys are thinking about a Collapse? No way, they probably wouldnt even know what you were talking about if you asked them about a Collapse. "Money" cannot be as you say, printed. Currency (which is different than money) can come into being from the issuance of debt. The US Treasury sells bonds at auctions to the primary dealers who purchase the bonds with federal reserve credit. The US Treasury then promises to pay off those bonds, with interest, over the term of the instrument. Or lets say you use your credit card to purchase something at the store, but don't have any money currently in your bank to pay for it. That is currency coming into being, but there is the promise that you will pay off that debt with interest that makes it "valuable". The bank who issued you the card is counting that debt you incurred from the transaction as an asset. The only real "printing" of "money" that has occurred that I can tell, was when the fed purchased the toxic RMBS and CMBS securities from banks at the peak market value. That is the underlying collateral of the instruments was falling apart, and if sold on the market the banks could have gotten maybe 10 cents on the dollar, but the fed issued credit (which they have the authority to do only for US treasury securities) and purchased the instruments at the peak market values before the crisis. Anyway, the entire system is interrelated through debt. If you "print" money to pay off interest and principle then you undermine the future value of the instrument by debasing the standard unit of account of the bill of credit. Really, there is simply hundreds of trillions of dollars in debt in the world economy that will never be paid off in current purchasing power, meaning that debt will be liquidated by the market through bankruptcy or governments will begin to "print" non interest bearing currency to pay off the principle and interest of the debt inducing a hyper-inflationary collapse similar to Weimar Germany. You know, on second thought I take that back. Any time a bank issues non secured credit they are essentially printing money. That represents most of the credit card debt out there, as the bank creates the currency to pay for the item purchased on a card while ignoring any sound mark to market accounting methods to ensure that extended credit is backstopped by a quantifiable asset the bank is holding. I think most socialists are disturbed by the idea that banks can print currency on their own.  |
| Anonymous Coward User ID: 2926765 United States11/16/2011 11:32 AM Report Abusive Post Report Copyright Violation | |
| Anonymous Coward User ID: 5626600 United States11/18/2011 02:18 PM Report Abusive Post Report Copyright Violation | It's been 2days since i posted this and still no collapse. When are you people going to wake up and realize that this is the New Norm. The masses will be out on black friday shopping and setting new black friday records in the so called Collapsed economy. Vegas hotels are sold out! Airline tickets are selling just as much as they did back in the good old non collapsed days. |
