I want to hear from the folks that have actually been thrue some sort collapse of they're society.

OK, lets say you are on that action, moving along some industrial suburb, not alone maybe, with others, maybe you have vehicule or two, let me asure you that you will never ever get passed the city limits, blockades they call them, right???. Now: if you stay undeground within city limits, then be sure they will be looking for ye on their sweeping rutine searches, not to mention day/night curfews, they have special infrared and night vision, you do not want to engage in any action that will put you in their radar screen.

Look guys, get out of dense populated areas, end of the story, and for those of you that wanna or have to stay in the city and are thrilled with some gunnery survival, well sorry to say but, you are dead within 60 days of lack of electricity (on average).

Are there any useless preps? Are generators any good or do they attract unwanted attention themselves?

Was there anything you were used to that ended up being all but an illusion after you didn't have it?
kinda like quitting cigarettes.

Holy cows . . . what a way to ask a question!!!, sorry my bad, i am a little upset ´cause i am also watching movie "The Holiday" Cameron Diaz 2006, and have to pause it regularly . . .anyways thought you asked if i has killed someone, shit my pants with it, sorry for not undertsanding . . .back to your question, nope, no experience with that, however . . . (thinking, thinking)

Look, I ignore what made you ask that but THE answer IS this: Every thing IS an illusion, even life itself.


(still thinking about paying off to get through)

Yeap, lets say you may have the "commodity" "they" want, and lets say ...geezzz this one IS hard .. . lets say it is sex, and family member are volunatrily willing to do so, wife, doughter, sun, yourself does not matter, the checkpoint people may turn around and say: BANG BANG BANG this is exactly why we are fucked BANG BANG , , ,understand what i mean? never ever bargain with security forces, ever, do as your told, and find another way, ok? the less time you spend with them the bigger chance the will not remember you

thanks for opening my eyes on many levels. I must be dilluting myself about some things.

TV, friends, sence of belonging somewhere, thank G´d my family was well off so no scarce of things, good contacts i should say . . . you ask about generators, how are they gonna run when fuel runs out, better put that money in something else as hand tool, or maybe a book and materials for alternative sources of energy,

What part of BUG-OUT you do not understand ? ? ?

I was a crusader myself, but then it stroke me, I realized why I learnt this: Sargents dropped into combat in Vietnam had an average life spectancy of 2 weeks and Lieutenants had one of 15 minutes. On average.

IF, and only if, human race is going to survive, then you must do your part trying to survive yourself, exposing your life to combat will not help anyone, the usgov got the results of a research about what would happen if no electricity, 90% (ninety percent) of population WILL DIE within ONE YEAR, get serious and get your ass up in the mountains, your crusade is with the little ones, teaching them, helping them to survive, little ones are going to have it really bad, any help will be welcomed, so do not waste yourself in the streets.

This is why you need to save those yellow pages books you get for free! A 5 gallon bucket, free plastic grocery store bags and yellow pages are all you need to crap happy!
Remove your toilet seat from the toilet (if water doesn't work for flushing), place plastic bag strategically so toilet seat holds it in place, do your business and wipe with yellow pages. Wrap it up and bury it in a hole since the trash men wont be around for awhile!
Cigs go stale and I wouldn't want the reputation for trading bad smokes in those times. Baby formula? Not enough people to barter with that you know.
I've been stocking up on bicycles and solar powered lights. Everybody needs transportation without fuel and everybody needs light at night. Think this way as those are the only two examples I will give.

Past tense my answer was here (few decades ago), if SHTF nothing will be of help if in city, never mind where you crappy happy!!! if all of your prepping comes to good use and you are still in a populated area, then remember this: Things will get worse, so get out !!! ... now, what are you going to do then???

Great postings from everybody, good contributions without exceptions, but I WANNA FINISH THE MOVIE I AM WATCHING "The Holiday" Cameron Diaz 2006, yes romantic stuff, so what

I'll tell you the last place I want to be is on a freeway trying to leave. The second last place I want to be is in the country with a bunch of people from the city who have no skills and a few days supply of goods.
I'm afraid I'll take my chances holed up in my house. There is no reason for me to go outside and you DO NOT want to storm my castle!

If you go now, freeway is gonna be free, if you go now, you will be able to learn and move back and forth for what you need, by the time SHTF, you will be ready, maybe with some other "people from the city" . . . if you stay, let´s say you are succesfull and you are able to survive a couple of months, please let me ask: What are you going to do with the thousands of people looking to loot what ever they can, tens of thousands, some cities HUNDREDS of thousands, a couple of MILLIONS in mayor urban areas . . . no ofence but: castle??? storm??? are you gonna confront securiy forces???
It is your choice now, and I am aware of it, I know billions will die. Do you know???

Moving into the country now is not an option. What is the difference between living in the suburbs and the country. EVERYBODY will be desperate.
The reality of the scenario is that thousands, hundreds of thousands, will not be trying to lay siege to my castle at once. My perimeter is protected and my neighbors have my back. We already talked at length about this very scenario and agreed that no strangers will be walking through the neighborhood without a watchful eye.

Wont survive in a big city, please don't fool yourself into believing that.

The ONLY real reason I own metals is what happened in former Yugoslavia. I sponsored a family to come to Canada n 1991. The wife (Dragana) had paid for her families rent and food with gold and silver. One ounce of silver for a whole months of rent! Not because it was 'worth' a months rent (wtf was silvers price in 91?) but because it HAD worth, unlike the pretty pieces of paper that the banks handed out.

My other friends family owns a really large hardware store in Rhodesia (I won't sully it with the 'new' name) and they trade for gold and silver as well. That plus they get a foreign currency 'allowance' from my friends father (retired British Colonel with rather fabulous wealth). If you know someone outside of the country who can provide you with a foreign currency income (or you hold a foreign bank account), that MAY help as people try and flee and are in need of something worth something, elsewhere.

Seeds are THE barter item of excellence for the near-mid term future. Preferably seeds from the area you live (I don't trust those 'canned' seeds...where did that plant last grow?).
Even if you have little space you can grow plants for seed.
Kale, beets etc. do fine in tubs.

Try this guy. His blog is pretty good, starts a little after the actual fall of things in Argentina, but he goes into good detail concerning what to expect.

[link to ferfal.blogspot.com]

Go to Just Measures Radio right now. They are discussing how people survived in places like Yugoslavia after the collapse.

[link to justmeasurescs.com]

I will survive! I question your ability to survive in the open country. Nuclear doom aside, you really stand no chance. What are you going to do? Build an adobe home, grow corn and hunt bison? Puhleeze! You'll be overrun in the night in a loose band of people. No loose band is going to be able to make it through my propane tanks, dogs, spot lights(solar powered with battery backup), rifles, shotguns, pistols, neighbors and barricaded doors.
What defense do you have in the open country? Run? Hide? Spending your life running and hiding is for criminals. I guarantee you it would be easier for me to take you out from 200 yards in the country vs. barricaded in the suburbs. You need to rethink your plan. I'm 50 yards away from the next house. How far are you away from the next cluster of trees?

All I will need good flir scope and high ground to find juicy location of people who think they "bug out on time".