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12 USC 411, "...Federal reserve notes shall be redeemed for lawful money on demand..."

 
Anonymous Coward
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United States
12/30/2011 02:32 PM
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12 USC 411, "...Federal reserve notes shall be redeemed for lawful money on demand..."
Has anyone done this, and what exactly are you getting in exchange for FRN's? Any pics? Thanks!
Anonymous Coward (OP)
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12/30/2011 02:41 PM
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Re: 12 USC 411, "...Federal reserve notes shall be redeemed for lawful money on demand..."
bump
Anonymous Coward
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12/30/2011 02:47 PM
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Re: 12 USC 411, "...Federal reserve notes shall be redeemed for lawful money on demand..."
I do it and so do many others. US Treasury notes are located on the right side of the face of all Federal Reserve Notes.

The US treasury seal is separated by the drawing of the dead president on every Federal Reserve note but the $1 and $2 bill.

if you do not record your "demand for lawful money per 12-USC 411"

You by default, are using unredeemed Federal Reserve Notes (the note on the left of the dead guy).

If you demand redemption on all accounts and transactions, you are proving the use of the US Treasury note on the Right side of every BILL.

Not rocket science, just the law!!
John Donson
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United States
12/30/2011 02:47 PM
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Re: 12 USC 411, "...Federal reserve notes shall be redeemed for lawful money on demand..."
I would but the closest Fed Res Bank is in Ga, some 7 hours away from me. Doesn't seem like a good investment of time and resources to go that far.
Anonymous Coward (OP)
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12/30/2011 02:58 PM
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Re: 12 USC 411, "...Federal reserve notes shall be redeemed for lawful money on demand..."
I do it and so do many others. US Treasury notes are located on the right side of the face of all Federal Reserve Notes.

The US treasury seal is separated by the drawing of the dead president on every Federal Reserve note but the $1 and $2 bill.

if you do not record your "demand for lawful money per 12-USC 411"

You by default, are using unredeemed Federal Reserve Notes (the note on the left of the dead guy).

If you demand redemption on all accounts and transactions, you are proving the use of the US Treasury note on the Right side of every BILL.

Not rocket science, just the law!!
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 7852806




I don't understand, can you explain in a little more detail? Also, have you actually gotten a physical replacement for the FRN??? If so, can you post a pic, I would be interested in seeing what it looks like. Thanks!
AC
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12/30/2011 03:03 PM
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Re: 12 USC 411, "...Federal reserve notes shall be redeemed for lawful money on demand..."
Interesting this would appear. I was just reading about the Fed recently.

[link to www.bibliotecapleyades.net]

Even the government cannot define money. Some years ago, a Mr. A.F. Davis mailed a ten-dollar Federal Reserve Note to the Treasury Department.



In his letter of transmittal, he called attention to the inscription on the bill which said that it was redeemable in "lawful money," and then requested that such money be sent to him. In reply, the Treasury merely sent two five-dollar bills from a different printing series bearing a similar promise to pay.



Mr. Davis responded:

Dear Sir
Receipt is hereby acknowledged of two $5.00 United States notes, which we interpret from your letter are to be considered as lawful money. Are we to infer from this that the Federal Reserve notes are not lawful money?


I am enclosing one of the $5.00 notes which you sent to me. I note that it states on the face, "The United States of America will pay to the bearer on demand five dollars."

I am hereby demanding five dollars.

One week later, Mr. Davis received the following reply from Acting Treasurer, M.E. Slindee:

Dear Mr. Davis:
Receipt is acknowledged of your letter of December 23rd, transmitting one $5. United States Note with a demand for payment of five dollars. You are advised that the term "lawful money" has not been defined in federal legislation...



The term "lawful currency" no longer has such special significance. The $5 United States Note received with your letter of December 23rd is returned herewith.

The phrases "...will pay to the bearer on demand" and "...is redeemable in lawful money" were deleted from our currency altogether in 1964.
Anonymous Coward
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12/30/2011 03:04 PM
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Re: 12 USC 411, "...Federal reserve notes shall be redeemed for lawful money on demand..."
I do it and so do many others. US Treasury notes are located on the right side of the face of all Federal Reserve Notes.

The US treasury seal is separated by the drawing of the dead president on every Federal Reserve note but the $1 and $2 bill.

if you do not record your "demand for lawful money per 12-USC 411"

You by default, are using unredeemed Federal Reserve Notes (the note on the left of the dead guy).

If you demand redemption on all accounts and transactions, you are proving the use of the US Treasury note on the Right side of every BILL.

Not rocket science, just the law!!
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 7852806




I don't understand, can you explain in a little more detail? Also, have you actually gotten a physical replacement for the FRN??? If so, can you post a pic, I would be interested in seeing what it looks like. Thanks!
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 1003364



From what I understand, you will NOT be provided lawful money. Fed Notes are "legal" money, not "lawful" money. Lawful money have a different seal on them. At one point you could get lawful money, but that was a long time ago.

Regardless, what he is saying, is that you go and demand lawful money (as per the law), and you record the entire thing, so when they fail to provide you with the lawful money (which they're obligated to) you're no longer restricted by the legal issues related to the use of FRN's (such as income taxes).

Imagine Ford trucks became money tomorrow, and ford gave everyone a bunch of trucks, and then people used them to trade for the stuff they needed (sounds absurd I know).... they could collect taxes because you're using THEIR property as a unit of exchange. This is what the FED does, your taxes are a charge for using THEIR property as a method of exchange.

So under the law, they stated that you didn't have to use their notes, you could instead use lawful money. But now that's gone, and you cannot get lawful money, which is basically (in the eyes of true law) a default on their obligations which frees you from your obligation.
Anonymous Coward (OP)
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12/30/2011 03:06 PM
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Re: 12 USC 411, "...Federal reserve notes shall be redeemed for lawful money on demand..."
Very interesting! Thanks. Yet, as the previous poster indicated that he somewho writes on transactions for lawful money, is that basically a waste of time given this example? Thanks again!
John Donson
User ID: 7813130
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12/30/2011 03:06 PM
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Re: 12 USC 411, "...Federal reserve notes shall be redeemed for lawful money on demand..."
I do it and so do many others. US Treasury notes are located on the right side of the face of all Federal Reserve Notes.

The US treasury seal is separated by the drawing of the dead president on every Federal Reserve note but the $1 and $2 bill.

if you do not record your "demand for lawful money per 12-USC 411"

You by default, are using unredeemed Federal Reserve Notes (the note on the left of the dead guy).

If you demand redemption on all accounts and transactions, you are proving the use of the US Treasury note on the Right side of every BILL.

Not rocket science, just the law!!
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 7852806




I don't understand, can you explain in a little more detail? Also, have you actually gotten a physical replacement for the FRN??? If so, can you post a pic, I would be interested in seeing what it looks like. Thanks!
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 1003364


They actually look identical except for a few things. Real money says "US Treasury Note" instead of Federal Reserve Note at the top. Also, the serial numbers to the right of the dead President (as you look at it) are red in color vs. green. That's the only difference.
The problem is when you spend it. You will get FeRN's for change.
You should look at how to endorse your paychecks so they are deposited as real money vs. FeRNs. This is supposed to keep you from paying income tax. It's all in the codes!
Anonymous Coward (OP)
User ID: 1003364
United States
12/30/2011 03:08 PM
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Re: 12 USC 411, "...Federal reserve notes shall be redeemed for lawful money on demand..."
I do it and so do many others. US Treasury notes are located on the right side of the face of all Federal Reserve Notes.

The US treasury seal is separated by the drawing of the dead president on every Federal Reserve note but the $1 and $2 bill.

if you do not record your "demand for lawful money per 12-USC 411"

You by default, are using unredeemed Federal Reserve Notes (the note on the left of the dead guy).

If you demand redemption on all accounts and transactions, you are proving the use of the US Treasury note on the Right side of every BILL.

Not rocket science, just the law!!
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 7852806




I don't understand, can you explain in a little more detail? Also, have you actually gotten a physical replacement for the FRN??? If so, can you post a pic, I would be interested in seeing what it looks like. Thanks!
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 1003364



From what I understand, you will NOT be provided lawful money. Fed Notes are "legal" money, not "lawful" money. Lawful money have a different seal on them. At one point you could get lawful money, but that was a long time ago.

Regardless, what he is saying, is that you go and demand lawful money (as per the law), and you record the entire thing, so when they fail to provide you with the lawful money (which they're obligated to) you're no longer restricted by the legal issues related to the use of FRN's (such as income taxes).

Imagine Ford trucks became money tomorrow, and ford gave everyone a bunch of trucks, and then people used them to trade for the stuff they needed (sounds absurd I know).... they could collect taxes because you're using THEIR property as a unit of exchange. This is what the FED does, your taxes are a charge for using THEIR property as a method of exchange.

So under the law, they stated that you didn't have to use their notes, you could instead use lawful money. But now that's gone, and you cannot get lawful money, which is basically (in the eyes of true law) a default on their obligations which frees you from your obligation.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 7761560





Yea, but is the demand for lawful money a circle jerk based on the previous posters post on the interaction with the Fed?
Anonymous Coward (OP)
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12/30/2011 03:10 PM
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Re: 12 USC 411, "...Federal reserve notes shall be redeemed for lawful money on demand..."
I do it and so do many others. US Treasury notes are located on the right side of the face of all Federal Reserve Notes.

The US treasury seal is separated by the drawing of the dead president on every Federal Reserve note but the $1 and $2 bill.

if you do not record your "demand for lawful money per 12-USC 411"

You by default, are using unredeemed Federal Reserve Notes (the note on the left of the dead guy).

If you demand redemption on all accounts and transactions, you are proving the use of the US Treasury note on the Right side of every BILL.

Not rocket science, just the law!!
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 7852806




I don't understand, can you explain in a little more detail? Also, have you actually gotten a physical replacement for the FRN??? If so, can you post a pic, I would be interested in seeing what it looks like. Thanks!
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 1003364


They actually look identical except for a few things. Real money says "US Treasury Note" instead of Federal Reserve Note at the top. Also, the serial numbers to the right of the dead President (as you look at it) are red in color vs. green. That's the only difference.
The problem is when you spend it. You will get FeRN's for change.
You should look at how to endorse your paychecks so they are deposited as real money vs. FeRNs. This is supposed to keep you from paying income tax. It's all in the codes!
 Quoting: John Donson 7813130



Pic? Yea, but does this actually work? Or is denoting your paycheck as payable in real money a waste of time, circle jerk when the rubber actually hits the road?
John Donson
User ID: 7813130
United States
12/30/2011 03:18 PM
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Re: 12 USC 411, "...Federal reserve notes shall be redeemed for lawful money on demand..."
I do it and so do many others. US Treasury notes are located on the right side of the face of all Federal Reserve Notes.

The US treasury seal is separated by the drawing of the dead president on every Federal Reserve note but the $1 and $2 bill.

if you do not record your "demand for lawful money per 12-USC 411"

You by default, are using unredeemed Federal Reserve Notes (the note on the left of the dead guy).

If you demand redemption on all accounts and transactions, you are proving the use of the US Treasury note on the Right side of every BILL.

Not rocket science, just the law!!
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 7852806




I don't understand, can you explain in a little more detail? Also, have you actually gotten a physical replacement for the FRN??? If so, can you post a pic, I would be interested in seeing what it looks like. Thanks!
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 1003364


They actually look identical except for a few things. Real money says "US Treasury Note" instead of Federal Reserve Note at the top. Also, the serial numbers to the right of the dead President (as you look at it) are red in color vs. green. That's the only difference.
The problem is when you spend it. You will get FeRN's for change.
You should look at how to endorse your paychecks so they are deposited as real money vs. FeRNs. This is supposed to keep you from paying income tax. It's all in the codes!
 Quoting: John Donson 7813130



Pic? Yea, but does this actually work? Or is denoting your paycheck as payable in real money a waste of time, circle jerk when the rubber actually hits the road?
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 1003364


It's in the codes so it must be legal, right? Try it and find out.
Anonymous Coward (OP)
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United States
12/30/2011 03:20 PM
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Re: 12 USC 411, "...Federal reserve notes shall be redeemed for lawful money on demand..."
...




I don't understand, can you explain in a little more detail? Also, have you actually gotten a physical replacement for the FRN??? If so, can you post a pic, I would be interested in seeing what it looks like. Thanks!
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 1003364


They actually look identical except for a few things. Real money says "US Treasury Note" instead of Federal Reserve Note at the top. Also, the serial numbers to the right of the dead President (as you look at it) are red in color vs. green. That's the only difference.
The problem is when you spend it. You will get FeRN's for change.
You should look at how to endorse your paychecks so they are deposited as real money vs. FeRNs. This is supposed to keep you from paying income tax. It's all in the codes!
 Quoting: John Donson 7813130



Pic? Yea, but does this actually work? Or is denoting your paycheck as payable in real money a waste of time, circle jerk when the rubber actually hits the road?
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 1003364


It's in the codes so it must be legal, right? Try it and find out.
 Quoting: John Donson 7813130




Yea,... :) Hell, legal or not, I don't think they have to obligate their side from all the crap going on today!!
John Donson
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United States
12/30/2011 03:21 PM
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Re: 12 USC 411, "...Federal reserve notes shall be redeemed for lawful money on demand..."
...




I don't understand, can you explain in a little more detail? Also, have you actually gotten a physical replacement for the FRN??? If so, can you post a pic, I would be interested in seeing what it looks like. Thanks!
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 1003364


They actually look identical except for a few things. Real money says "US Treasury Note" instead of Federal Reserve Note at the top. Also, the serial numbers to the right of the dead President (as you look at it) are red in color vs. green. That's the only difference.
The problem is when you spend it. You will get FeRN's for change.
You should look at how to endorse your paychecks so they are deposited as real money vs. FeRNs. This is supposed to keep you from paying income tax. It's all in the codes!
 Quoting: John Donson 7813130



Pic? Yea, but does this actually work? Or is denoting your paycheck as payable in real money a waste of time, circle jerk when the rubber actually hits the road?
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 1003364


It's in the codes so it must be legal, right? Try it and find out.
 Quoting: John Donson 7813130


I got a bit off point! You have to physically take your FeRNs to the Fed Res Bank to redeem them for real money, but you can endorse your check to get your checks deposited in real money so you don't have to pay income tax on your wages.
Anonymous Coward (OP)
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United States
12/30/2011 03:22 PM
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Re: 12 USC 411, "...Federal reserve notes shall be redeemed for lawful money on demand..."
...


They actually look identical except for a few things. Real money says "US Treasury Note" instead of Federal Reserve Note at the top. Also, the serial numbers to the right of the dead President (as you look at it) are red in color vs. green. That's the only difference.
The problem is when you spend it. You will get FeRN's for change.
You should look at how to endorse your paychecks so they are deposited as real money vs. FeRNs. This is supposed to keep you from paying income tax. It's all in the codes!
 Quoting: John Donson 7813130



Pic? Yea, but does this actually work? Or is denoting your paycheck as payable in real money a waste of time, circle jerk when the rubber actually hits the road?
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 1003364


It's in the codes so it must be legal, right? Try it and find out.
 Quoting: John Donson 7813130


I got a bit off point! You have to physically take your FeRNs to the Fed Res Bank to redeem them for real money, but you can endorse your check to get your checks deposited in real money so you don't have to pay income tax on your wages.
 Quoting: John Donson 7813130




Yea but has anyone tried that and been successful, or did they still get raped by the IRS in court???
John Donson
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12/30/2011 03:23 PM
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Re: 12 USC 411, "...Federal reserve notes shall be redeemed for lawful money on demand..."
...


They actually look identical except for a few things. Real money says "US Treasury Note" instead of Federal Reserve Note at the top. Also, the serial numbers to the right of the dead President (as you look at it) are red in color vs. green. That's the only difference.
The problem is when you spend it. You will get FeRN's for change.
You should look at how to endorse your paychecks so they are deposited as real money vs. FeRNs. This is supposed to keep you from paying income tax. It's all in the codes!
 Quoting: John Donson 7813130



Pic? Yea, but does this actually work? Or is denoting your paycheck as payable in real money a waste of time, circle jerk when the rubber actually hits the road?
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 1003364


It's in the codes so it must be legal, right? Try it and find out.
 Quoting: John Donson 7813130




Yea,... :) Hell, legal or not, I don't think they have to obligate their side from all the crap going on today!!
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 1003364


The Fed Res operates under codes. Arm yourself with their codes and take it down there when you try to cash in your FeRNs. They would have to if you are carrying their codes, charters and by-laws to show them as proof that what you are doing is well within the guidelines THEY established and is perfectly legal.
Anonymous Coward (OP)
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12/30/2011 03:24 PM
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Re: 12 USC 411, "...Federal reserve notes shall be redeemed for lawful money on demand..."
So what is the code that says you do not have to pay taxes on lawful money?
John Donson
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12/30/2011 03:33 PM
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Re: 12 USC 411, "...Federal reserve notes shall be redeemed for lawful money on demand..."
So what is the code that says you do not have to pay taxes on lawful money?
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 1003364


Google is your friend!
Anonymous Coward
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12/30/2011 03:37 PM
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Re: 12 USC 411, "...Federal reserve notes shall be redeemed for lawful money on demand..."
sumthinup
John Donson
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12/30/2011 03:41 PM
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Re: 12 USC 411, "...Federal reserve notes shall be redeemed for lawful money on demand..."
sumthinup
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 7957972


Do I have to do everything for you?

[link to www.law.cornell.edu]

All that is required is a restricted endorsement on the back of any check to the effect of:

Redeemed in Lawful money
Pursuant to Title 12 USC §411
True name dba Legal name

I have a red ink stamp. Your true name is your first and middle, your “legal name” is “FIRST LAST”. Look at your drivers license. Wonder why your name is in ALL CAPS? Same on your birth certificate. Same on any notice from a court. That’s your legal name, a trust formed by the government in order to do business with you and on you.

Make copies of all your checks (front and back) with your restricted endorsement. Keep them on file, or even better, file them in a case jacket at your nearest district court. This is what all the IRS will be required to see. Lawful money is not taxable income. You have not endorsed private credit, you have not bonded your substance to the contract with the Federal Reserve.
Anonymous Coward (OP)
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12/30/2011 03:46 PM
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Re: 12 USC 411, "...Federal reserve notes shall be redeemed for lawful money on demand..."
What about this:


[link to www.federalreserve.gov]


What is lawful money? How is it different from legal tender?

"Lawful money" is a term used in the Federal Reserve Act, the act that authorizes the Board of Governors of the Federal Reserve System to issue Federal Reserve notes. The Act states that Federal Reserve notes "shall be obligations of the United States and shall be receivable by all national and member banks and Federal reserve banks and for all taxes, customs, and other public dues. They shall be redeemed in lawful money on demand at the Treasury Department of the United States, in the city of Washington, District of Columbia, or at any Federal Reserve bank." The Act did not, however, define the term "lawful money," but up until 1913, the only currency issued by the United States that was legally recognized as "lawful money" was various issues of "demand notes" (subsequently known as "old demand notes") and "United States notes" authorized by Congress during the Civil War.

At the time, some currency was not considered legal tender, although it could be used by national banking associations as "lawful money reserves." Thus, the term "lawful money" had a broader meaning than the term "legal tender."

In 1933, Congress changed the law so that all U.S. coins and currency (including Federal Reserve notes), regardless of when issued, constitutes "legal tender" for all purposes. Federal and state courts since then have repeatedly held that Federal Reserve notes are also "lawful money." Milam v. U.S., 524 F.2d 629 (9th Cir. 1974), is typical of the federal and state court cases holding that Federal Reserve notes are "lawful money." In Milam, the United States Court of Appeals for the Ninth Circuit reviewed a judgment denying relief to an individual who sought to redeem a $50 Federal Reserve Bank Note in "lawful money." The United States tendered Milam $50 in Federal Reserve notes, but Milam refused the notes, asserting that "lawful money" must be gold or silver. The Ninth Circuit, noting that this matter had been put to rest by the U.S. Supreme Court nearly a century before in the Legal Tender Cases (Juilliard v. Greenman), 110 U.S. 421 (1884), rejected this assertion as frivolous and affirmed the judgment.
theSearchingJones

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12/30/2011 03:48 PM
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bump
We get the powers over us that we've earned collectively. Humanity, as a whole, is self-interested, shallow, ignorant, violent and immoral; small wonder, therefore, that our leaders (secret or otherwise) reflect that. You want better leaders, become better people.

I forgive myself, I Love myself, I'm sorry, Please forgive me, I forgive you, I love you, Thank you.

God Bless You;
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Love is the answer ~ Peace be with You.
NowUNoIT
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12/30/2011 04:14 PM
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sumthinup
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 7957972


Do I have to do everything for you?

[link to www.law.cornell.edu]

All that is required is a restricted endorsement on the back of any check to the effect of:

Redeemed in Lawful money
Pursuant to Title 12 USC §411
True name dba Legal name

I have a red ink stamp. Your true name is your first and middle, your “legal name” is “FIRST LAST”. Look at your drivers license. Wonder why your name is in ALL CAPS? Same on your birth certificate. Same on any notice from a court. That’s your legal name, a trust formed by the government in order to do business with you and on you.

Make copies of all your checks (front and back) with your restricted endorsement. Keep them on file, or even better, file them in a case jacket at your nearest district court. This is what all the IRS will be required to see. Lawful money is not taxable income. You have not endorsed private credit, you have not bonded your substance to the contract with the Federal Reserve.
 Quoting: John Donson 7813130

Good stuff!! Thanxs for sharing..
Anonymous Coward (OP)
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12/30/2011 04:22 PM
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Re: 12 USC 411, "...Federal reserve notes shall be redeemed for lawful money on demand..."
The problem is that FRN's have become the defacto lawful money, because Congress never instituted what "lawful money" is!!!
Anonymous Coward
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12/30/2011 04:39 PM
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Re: 12 USC 411, "...Federal reserve notes shall be redeemed for lawful money on demand..."
this thread is ALL about 12USC411 check it out Thread: Pay No Taxes legally -End the FED -synopsis page 8-Why are waiting for someone to do it for us like Ron paul (Page 47)
12 USC 411
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Russian Federation
12/30/2011 06:43 PM
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Re: 12 USC 411, "...Federal reserve notes shall be redeemed for lawful money on demand..."
[link to stormthunder.com]

That link explains it in detail.

Look at any newer $5, 10, 20, 50, 100 Federal reserve Note, there are 2 notes on the face of it.

One side (the left) clearly is marked "THIS NOTE IS LEGAL TENDER FOR ALL DEBTS PUBLIC AND PRIVATE"

On the right side of the note is the US Treasury Note, it is not marked "LEGAL TENDER, nor is it marked with the Federal Reserve seal.

IT IS A SEPARATE NOTE!!! It is an unredeemed US Treasury note. Unless and until you make a written demand at any Federal Reserve BANK (all Banks in the US are Federal Reserve banks, so you do not have to go to one of the main banks) you are presumed to be using FRNs on the left side of the note.

You will not get any Red sealed notes for your green sealed notes, since 1977, all notes have been "TWO FACED" one FRN and one US Treasury NOTE.

You can get coins, but you cannot get Notes now other than what every one else uses.

You can use the US Treasury note AFTER you make your demand on the record at any BANK!
12 USC 411
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12/30/2011 06:43 PM
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Re: 12 USC 411, "...Federal reserve notes shall be redeemed for lawful money on demand..."
[link to stormthunder.com]

That link explains it in detail.

Look at any newer $5, 10, 20, 50, 100 Federal reserve Note, there are 2 notes on the face of it.

One side (the left) clearly is marked "THIS NOTE IS LEGAL TENDER FOR ALL DEBTS PUBLIC AND PRIVATE"

On the right side of the note is the US Treasury Note, it is not marked "LEGAL TENDER, nor is it marked with the Federal Reserve seal.

IT IS A SEPARATE NOTE!!! It is an unredeemed US Treasury note. Unless and until you make a written demand at any Federal Reserve BANK (all Banks in the US are Federal Reserve banks, so you do not have to go to one of the main banks) you are presumed to be using FRNs on the left side of the note.

You will not get any Red sealed notes for your green sealed notes, since 1977, all notes have been "TWO FACED" one FRN and one US Treasury NOTE.

You can get coins, but you cannot get Notes now other than what every one else uses.

You can use the US Treasury note AFTER you make your demand on the record at any BANK!
Lawful money
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Russian Federation
12/30/2011 06:53 PM
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Re: 12 USC 411, "...Federal reserve notes shall be redeemed for lawful money on demand..."
The only Government issued "lawful money" is Gold or Silver coin.

Contract (agreement) makes law. When you use (endorse) Federal Reserve Notes, you MAKE THEM LAWFUL MONEY.

That is exactly what the Rickman case cited above is saying.

BUT, if you DEMAND LAWFUL MONEY at any Bank, in writing, you are NOT using FRN nor US Treasury notes as anything but what they already are, a TENDER of payment and evidence of DEBT.

The Obligation to pay that debt resides with the issuer of said notes (either the Federal Reserve or the US Treasury. That means, even IF there is a TAX owed on the Notes, it remains the Obligation to pay the tax or debt to the issuer, not YOU, since you did not endorse (sign on) to pay it yourself with you time, energy, ideas and work.

From 12 USC 411 "The said notes shall be obligations of the United
States..."


The Notes and all debt (expressed in $$ value) remains an obligation of the United States, unless and until you sign your name on deposits or withdrawals or you do not demand your REDEMPTION from that debt and leave it with the issuer of it.
Lawful money.
User ID: 7852806
Russian Federation
12/30/2011 07:05 PM
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Re: 12 USC 411, "...Federal reserve notes shall be redeemed for lawful money on demand..."
The problem is that FRN's have become the defacto lawful money, because Congress never instituted what "lawful money" is!!!
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 1003364


Congress has the authority to "coin money and set the value thereof".

Lawful money depends on contract, toothpicks can be lawful money, if you contract with someone to fix their car for a pound of tooth picks, the tooth picks are lawful money for that agreement.

Should you fix the car and they do not give you a pound of tooth picks, you can go to court, sue them and the court will award you?

A pound of tooth picks, because your contract made them "lawful money". Should the other guy then appeal stating "Toothpicks have not been defined by Congress as lawful money, therefor, I do not have to give the toothpicks".

The Higher court will rule EXACTLY as in the Rickman case.

"The appellants claim that tooth picks are not lawful money as defined by Congress makes no difference for this case, toothpicks are lawful money."

Rickman used and spent Federal Reserve notes as "lawful money" he then owed a fee (income Tax) then tried to claim that because congress did or did not do something is STUPID.

Rickman never demanded his FRNs be redeemed, had he done that, the IRS would have never had a case and there would have been no agreement between Rickman and the Federal Reserve that FRNS are lawful money, by his use and endorsement of them.

It is really simple in fact, its not even legal advise, just common sense.
Anonymous Coward
User ID: 7937263
Puerto Rico
12/30/2011 08:31 PM
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Re: 12 USC 411, "...Federal reserve notes shall be redeemed for lawful money on demand..."
That clause says it all, 'redeemed for lawful money' because the Constitution says the only people that have the power to print money is Congress, the funny money printed by the Federal Reserves is unlawful.
Anonymous Coward
User ID: 7852806
Russian Federation
12/30/2011 10:15 PM
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Re: 12 USC 411, "...Federal reserve notes shall be redeemed for lawful money on demand..."
That clause says it all, 'redeemed for lawful money' because the Constitution says the only people that have the power to print money is Congress, the funny money printed by the Federal Reserves is unlawful.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 7937263


The US Treasury notes are backed by 300,000,000 in gold coins, these coins are in trust for everyone demanding redemption of lawful money.

Even Gold Certs and US Bank notes are fiat and constitutionally "unlawful" however, contracts make law and Gold backed US Bank notes which carry no debt and interest liability are way WAY ahead of Federal Reserve debt notes.

Sorry we cannot get gold or silver coin any more, but we do have a choice.

Take it or leave it.

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