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Reincarnation, banned as heresy, NEVER recieved Papel approval.

 
ATONTRUTH
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Reincarnation, banned as heresy, NEVER recieved Papel approval.
Anyone who cares to dig into the historical records of the early church will see that between the third and the fifth century, the Roman Catholic church issued a number of documents that effectively banned the idea of reincarnation as heresy. This knowledge is available for anyone who cares to do a bit of research. In fact, some theologians are aware that the edict to ban reincarnation as heresy did not receive papal approval. Therefore, some argue that this edict is not official church doctrine.

The fact that the church made a determined effort to ban reincarnation as heresy demonstrates that the concept of reincarnation was part of early Christianity. This is simply a historical fact which no one, at least no one who is willing to face reality, can deny.

If reincarnation was indeed part of early Christianity, then how could this idea possibly have been brought into the Christian faith? Is it possible that the idea was part of early Christianity because it was introduced by the very person who founded Christianity, namely Jesus?

It is a historical fact that one of the people who was instrumental in having the church ban the idea of reincarnation was the wife of the Roman emperor Justinian. Her name was Theodora, and she did not like the idea that she could be punished for her actions in a future life. Therefore, she used her considerable influence to start the process that eventually caused the Roman Catholic church to remove all traces, or almost all traces, of reincarnation from Christianity.

Theodora was a living example of how a power elite responds to the idea of reincarnation. First of all, a member of this power elite does not like the idea that they cannot escape punishment. Yet, beyond that personal concern, they have another reason why they do not want people to believe in the idea of reincarnation.

The idea of reincarnation states that you can be punished for your actions in a future lifetime. However, the other side of the coin is that you have more than one lifetime to work out your salvation. This is an idea which does not appeal to a power elite who wants to use religion to gain absolute power over the people.

The modus operandi of the power elite is to set up an organized church and claim that it offers the only path to salvation. This idea works best if people believe that they have only one lifetime to secure their salvation. If people believe that it is now or never, they are far more likely to follow the edicts of the outer church.

If you believe that you have more than one chance to qualify for salvation, then some of the immediacy goes away. You are not as likely to follow the outer church to the letter, and you are not as likely to blindly accept the claims made by the church.

A power elite who wants absolute control, simply cannot allow people to believe in the concept of reincarnation. This concept places the question of punishment in the hands of God, an authority that is above and beyond human beings.

For the full teaching:

[link to www.askrealjesus.com]
FHL(C) nli
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02/14/2012 09:23 PM
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Re: Reincarnation, banned as heresy, NEVER recieved Papel approval.
I give myself permanent permission, where needed, to quote myself in full.

FHL(C) nli
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02/13/2012 09:33 PM
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Re: How to identify a Satanic infiltrator in a Church
I have been thinking how budhhism(and also other cults and religions therefore, by association and practice) works, here are my preliminary thoughts, please feel free to add/expand.
/edit in accordance with scripture and the leading of the Holy spirit, Lord willing, amen YAHshua/Jesus.

It is also, Lord willing, to stimulate prayer.

Lamaism, represents from a dark spiritual point of view a series of men(there are abbesses as well, but lower in the physical spiritual hierarchy up front, but it seems vastly hypocritical, that of the spirits heavily and highly venerated amongst them, is kwanyin/ tibetan goddess/es etc), but claiming the original historical/histortical buddha(and therefore all they other bodhisattvas they claim as prior buddha’s as well) is above her but a “friend/associate”, and their abuse similar to other religious institutions of their nuns and associated apparent “holy orders”), in strategic locations around the globe, particularly in the far east, who are all high priests of helel/satan/the devil. As they all openly acknowledge they are possessed of other spirits, have communication and intercourse with other spirits, and worship and venerate other spirits, many hoping that in their lifetime they become so possessed of these spirits they deal with that they to will become a living buhhda, to be venerated and worshiped whilst they are alive that from a Christian point of view no other scriptural view can be held in truth honesty and honor, other than that these men and their religion/s are servants of the devil/s and also in this age through ecumenicalism are seeking as well to further fulfill scripture prophesy to become wolves in sheep’s clothing/false teachers and spots and blemishes amongst other things to the vast grouping of institutions around the globe calling themselves Christian. Primarily in this age it is achieved, this infiltration(and not just Christianity) and thence exercise of influence over others(especially in power/control/authority positions), by apparent personal sanctity, peace etc and following and encouraging the gaia groups(human interest/public opinion) and attempting through them to hijack the green movement, at worst they gain acknowledgement that they are important contributors to the cause(theirs actually, not healthy air /water, as to them the extinction of all human lives is no apparent loss, as they explain that consequence(the loss of life) away as karma/karmic debt and reincarnation, at the public level, while at the private level they are fully integrated with the one%/hidden controllers human and other wise/spirits whose goals are as evident as the Georgia guide stones..

FHL(C) nli
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Re: REINCARNATION ALL ABOUT AND MORE
O tickler of ears, tell me , if you are not representative of the personality you claim to now inhabit, that means you will, can and are going to be unaccountable to any who would try and thwart your desire for lusts and fulfillment in those lusts without feeling you will be held personally accountable, that instead some future incarnation can pay the price for the deeds that you the current personality commits in the here and now, so then you do not believe in Justice and personal responsibility let alone a Righteous and Holy Judge called YAHshua/YHVH/God are all you reincarnationists this way or just the buddhists?


FHL(C) nli
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Re: How to identify a Satanic infiltrator in a Church
The historical records of various nations support this view of lama/priest/monk/magician/miracle worker buddhism /daoism/ancestor worship(as opposed to veneration but this is a fine and often indistinguishable point in practice both generally being the same) and even christian cults, seeking positions of supreme influence of and over not only the individual but also the nation states. And again the historical records show that political buddhism was not above or averse to the spilling of blood in quantity especially by conflict and war to accomplish whatever their own personal and selfish ends were and that of their spiritual master/s, in particular helel(whom of course they would never publicly acknowledge as being in communication with or controlled by), most other spirit beings they will claim openly about by and in their older writings, as modern discourse are more geared to the unbelief in this present age in the west , and the denial of other spirits by/but instead claiming them as the “Higher self/ves” to avoid conflict with psychology and science so called, atheists and humanists/liberals.
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Re: Reincarnation, banned as heresy, NEVER recieved Papel approval.
Reincarnation was never apart of Christianity. But the resurrection is. That is why Jesus was resurrecting the dead to show what he is going to do in the future for human kind. And when he resurrected someone they came back as themselves. When people die they go to sleep and await a future resurrection.
Anonymous Coward
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02/14/2012 09:34 PM
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Re: Reincarnation, banned as heresy, NEVER recieved Papel approval.
"The fact that the church made a determined effort to ban reincarnation as heresy demonstrates that the concept of reincarnation was part of early Christianity. This is simply a historical fact which no one, at least no one who is willing to face reality, can deny."



putin


Two plus dog = green
Anonymous Coward
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02/14/2012 09:36 PM
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Re: Reincarnation, banned as heresy, NEVER recieved Papel approval.
Wouldn't it be funny if we all just kept coming back here, over and over and over and over and over and over again, just to keep doing the same stupid retarded shit to each other forever, lifetime after lifetime after lifetime, without ever learning a fucking thing?

lmao











huh
ATONTRUTH (OP)

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02/14/2012 09:39 PM
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Re: Reincarnation, banned as heresy, NEVER recieved Papel approval.
Reincarnation was never apart of Christianity. But the resurrection is. That is why Jesus was resurrecting the dead to show what he is going to do in the future for human kind. And when he resurrected someone they came back as themselves. When people die they go to sleep and await a future resurrection.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 1550123


Better take that beam out of your eye my friend. I doubt you've done any serious research on the early church, but hey, there is always another life time.

Last Edited by ATONTRUTH on 02/14/2012 09:41 PM
Thomas Dolby

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Re: Reincarnation, banned as heresy, NEVER recieved Papel approval.
What's Papel..?
"So put your hands down my pants and I'll bet you'll feel nuts
Yes I'm Siskel, yes I'm Ebert and you're getting two thumbs up"


"So live each and every day that you may look any man in the face and tell him to go to hell...! Edgar Cayce, reading 1739-6
ATONTRUTH (OP)

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02/14/2012 09:47 PM
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Re: Reincarnation, banned as heresy, NEVER recieved Papel approval.
What's Papel..?
 Quoting: Thomas Dolby


Papel = pope

The pope never signed the proclamation on the supposed reincarnation heresy, so in reality, since the pope is God's representitive on earth, not signing means that belief is not bound on earth. Therefore, it is NOT church doctrine.

Last Edited by ATONTRUTH on 02/14/2012 09:48 PM
Thomas Dolby

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Re: Reincarnation, banned as heresy, NEVER recieved Papel approval.
What's Papel..?
 Quoting: Thomas Dolby


Papel = pope

The pope never signed the proclamation on the supposed reincarnation heresy, so in reality, since the pope is God's representitive on earth, not signing means that belief is not bound on earth.
 Quoting: ATONTRUTH


And who the fuck is the pope to sign shit..?
"So put your hands down my pants and I'll bet you'll feel nuts
Yes I'm Siskel, yes I'm Ebert and you're getting two thumbs up"


"So live each and every day that you may look any man in the face and tell him to go to hell...! Edgar Cayce, reading 1739-6
FHL(C) nli
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02/14/2012 09:56 PM
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Re: Reincarnation, banned as heresy, NEVER recieved Papel approval.
Reincarnation was never apart of Christianity. But the resurrection is. That is why Jesus was resurrecting the dead to show what he is going to do in the future for human kind. And when he resurrected someone they came back as themselves. When people die they go to sleep and await a future resurrection.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 1550123


Better take that beam out of your eye my friend. I doubt you've done any serious research on the early church, but hey, there is always another life time.
 Quoting: ATONTRUTH


If you really know anything about His early Church, then Irenaeus in about heresies, deals with you gnostic liars rather clearly and to the point.
Anonymous Coward
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02/14/2012 10:09 PM
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Re: Reincarnation, banned as heresy, NEVER recieved Papel approval.
Anyone who cares to dig into the historical records of the early church will see that between the third and the fifth century, the Roman Catholic church issued a number of documents that effectively banned the idea of reincarnation as heresy. This knowledge is available for anyone who cares to do a bit of research. In fact, some theologians are aware that the edict to ban reincarnation as heresy did not receive papal approval. Therefore, some argue that this edict is not official church doctrine.

The fact that the church made a determined effort to ban reincarnation as heresy demonstrates that the concept of reincarnation was part of early Christianity. This is simply a historical fact which no one, at least no one who is willing to face reality, can deny.

If reincarnation was indeed part of early Christianity, then how could this idea possibly have been brought into the Christian faith? Is it possible that the idea was part of early Christianity because it was introduced by the very person who founded Christianity, namely Jesus?

It is a historical fact that one of the people who was instrumental in having the church ban the idea of reincarnation was the wife of the Roman emperor Justinian. Her name was Theodora, and she did not like the idea that she could be punished for her actions in a future life. Therefore, she used her considerable influence to start the process that eventually caused the Roman Catholic church to remove all traces, or almost all traces, of reincarnation from Christianity.

Theodora was a living example of how a power elite responds to the idea of reincarnation. First of all, a member of this power elite does not like the idea that they cannot escape punishment. Yet, beyond that personal concern, they have another reason why they do not want people to believe in the idea of reincarnation.

The idea of reincarnation states that you can be punished for your actions in a future lifetime. However, the other side of the coin is that you have more than one lifetime to work out your salvation. This is an idea which does not appeal to a power elite who wants to use religion to gain absolute power over the people.

The modus operandi of the power elite is to set up an organized church and claim that it offers the only path to salvation. This idea works best if people believe that they have only one lifetime to secure their salvation. If people believe that it is now or never, they are far more likely to follow the edicts of the outer church.

If you believe that you have more than one chance to qualify for salvation, then some of the immediacy goes away. You are not as likely to follow the outer church to the letter, and you are not as likely to blindly accept the claims made by the church.

A power elite who wants absolute control, simply cannot allow people to believe in the concept of reincarnation. This concept places the question of punishment in the hands of God, an authority that is above and beyond human beings.

For the full teaching:

[link to www.askrealjesus.com]
 Quoting: ATONTRUTH


whatever
Just more New Age Garbage. Regurgitating an old Heresy.
The Old Testament does not teach reincarnation and neither did Jesus.
Anonymous Coward
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02/14/2012 10:15 PM
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Re: Reincarnation, banned as heresy, NEVER recieved Papel approval.
reincarnation huh? Alot of people like the idea but i dont. Sure it sounds sexy, coming back as some great artist, rich, finding the love of the century and all that good stuff. But it also means some of us would come back and have been tortured to death, put on the rack, raped, sent to prison, homeless, sex slave, slave, and lives full of agony. No thanks, ill pass.
Princess Dagmar

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02/14/2012 10:16 PM
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Re: Reincarnation, banned as heresy, NEVER recieved Papel approval.
Jesus answered and said unto him, Verily, verily, I say unto thee, Except a man be born again, he cannot see the kingdom of God.

John 3:3
King James Version
The truth is the highest religion.
FHL(C) nli
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02/14/2012 10:33 PM
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Re: Reincarnation, banned as heresy, NEVER recieved Papel approval.
Jesus answered and said unto him, Verily, verily, I say unto thee, Except a man be born again, he cannot see the kingdom of God.

John 3:3
King James Version
 Quoting: Princess Dagmar


Yes dear and then it goes on to make it quite clear that is of the spirit and not the flesh, and involves the same personality/individual, is that what you are saying?
ATONTRUTH (OP)

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Re: Reincarnation, banned as heresy, NEVER recieved Papel approval.
whatever
Just more New Age Garbage. Regurgitating an old Heresy.
The Old Testament does not teach reincarnation and neither did Jesus.


The church removed most all references of reincarnation from the bible, but not all. Educate yourself.

[link to www.reincarnation.ws]

[link to www.theosophy-nw.org]

Josephus, the Jewish historian who lived during most of the first century AD, records in his Jewish War (3, 8, 5) and in his Antiquities of the jewish people (18, 1, 3) that reincarnation was taught widely in his day, while his contemporary in Alexandria, Philo Judaeus, in various of his writings, also refers to reimbodiment in one or another form. Moreover, there are passages of the New Testament that can be understood only if seen against the background of pre-existence of souls as a generally held belief. For instance, Matthew (16:13-14) records that when Jesus asked his disciples "Whom do men say that I am?" they replied that some people said he was John the Baptist (who had been executed only a few years before the question was asked). Others thought he was Elijah, or Jeremiah, or another of the prophets. Later in Matthew (17:13), far from rejecting the concept of rebirth Jesus tells his disciples that John the Baptist was Elijah.

John (9:2-4) reports that the disciples asked Jesus whether a blindman had sinned or his parents that he had been born blind. Jesus replied that it was in order that the works of God may be made manifest in the blind man, that is, that the law of cause and effect might be fulfilled. Or, as St. Paul phrased the thought: we reap what we sow. The blind man could not have sown the seeds of his blindness in his present body, but must have done so in a previous lifetime.

The earliest Christians, especially those who were members of one or other of the Gnostic sects, such as the Valentinians, Ophites and Ebionites, included reimbodiment among their important teachings. For them it enabled fulfillment of the law -- karma -- as well as providing the means for the soul to purify itself from the muddy qualities resulting from its immersion in matter and the egoism we have developed in the first stages of our journey through earth life.

After the original generations of Christians, we find the early Church Fathers, such as Justin Martyr (AD 100-l65), St. Clement of Alexandria ( AD 150-220), and Origen ( AD 185-254) teaching the pre-existence of souls, taking up reincarnation or one or another aspect of reimbodiment. Examples are scattered through Origen's works, especially Contra Celsum (1, xxxii), where he asks: "Is it not rational that souls should be introduced into bodies, in accordance with their merits and previous deeds . . . ?" And in De Principiis he says that "the soul has neither beginning nor end." St. Jerome (AD 340-420), translator of the Latin version of the Bible known as the Vulgate, in his Letter to Demetrias (a Roman matron), states that some Christian sects in his day taught a form of reincarnation as an esoteric doctrine, imparting it to a few "as a traditional truth which was not to be divulged."

Synesius (AD 370-480), Bishop of Ptolemais, also taught the concept, and in a prayer that has survived, he says: "Father, grant that my soul may merge into the light, and be no more thrust back into the illusion of earth." Others of his Hymns, such as number III, contain lines clearly stating his views, and also pleas that he may be so purified that rebirth on earth will no longer be necessary. In a thesis on dreams, Synesius writes: "It is possible by labor and time, and a transition into other lives, for the imaginative soul to emerge from this dark abode." This passage reminds us of verses in the Revelation of John (3:12), with its symbolic, initiatory language leading into: "Him that overcometh will I make a pillar in the temple of my God, and he shall go no more out."

In many documented near-death experiences involving Jesus, the concept of reincarnation appears. In the NDE testimony of Jeanie Dicus, she was asked by Jesus if she would like to reincarnate or return. Sandra Rogers was asked the same question by Jesus during her NDE. One of the reasons many Christians reject the validity of near-death testimony is because they sometimes appear to conflict with their interpretation of Christian doctrines. But Christians are usually very surprised to learn that reincarnation was a doctrine once held by many early Christians....


The first-century Jewish historian Flavius Josephus wrote about the Pharisees being believers in reincarnation. The Pharisees were the Jewish sect which Paul belonged to before his NDE and conversion to Christianity. Josephus wrote about the Pharisees' belief that the souls of evil men are punished after death. But the souls of good men are "removed into other bodies" and they will have "power to revive and live again."

From time to time throughout Jewish history, there was a persistent belief about dead prophets returning to life through reincarnation. But the Sadducees, a purist sect of Judaism, rejected the Persian concepts of resurrection and all Hellenistic influences involving reincarnation that was happening in Jesus' day. The Sadducees accepted only the orthodox Hebrew belief in Sheol. So there were a variety of influences going on in Jerusalem at the time of Jesus.


When Jesus began his ministry, many people wondered if he was the reincarnation of one of the prophets.

.....


Reincarnation and the Secret Teachings of Jesus

There are many Bible verses that affirm the reality of reincarnation. We will examine some of them here.

The episode in the Bible where Jesus identified John the Baptist as the reincarnation of Elijah the prophet is one of the clearest statements which Jesus made concerning reincarnation.

For all the prophets and the law have prophesied until John. And if you are willing to receive it, he is Elijah who was to come. (Matt. 11:13-14)

In the above passage, Jesus clearly identifies John the Baptist as the reincarnation of Elijah the prophet. Later in Matthew's gospel Jesus reiterates it.

And the disciples asked him, saying, "Why then do the scribes say that Elijah must come first?"

But he answered them and said, "Elijah indeed is to come and will restore all things. But I say to you that Elijah has come already, and they did not know him, but did to him whatever they wished. So also shall the Son of Man suffer at their hand."
Then the disciples understood that he had spoken of John the Baptist." (Matt. 17:10-13)

In very explicit language, Jesus identified John the Baptist as the reincarnation of Elijah. Even the disciples of Jesus understood what Jesus was saying. This identification of John to be the reincarnation of Elijah is very important when it comes to Bible prophecy. By identifying the John with Elijah, Jesus identified himself as the Messiah. The Hebrew scriptures mentions specific signs that would precede the coming of the Messiah. One of them is that Elijah will return first.

Behold I will send you Elijah the prophet, before the coming of the great and dreadful day of the Lord. (Mal. 4:5)

[link to www.infinityinst.com]

Reincarnation as a belief system was removed from our Western thinking in 553 CE at the Second Council of Constantinople. The argument was actually against the Doctrine of the Pre-existence of the Soul.
The argument had been set forth that Justinian as the Byzantine Emperor was therefore god and his was a chosen destiny at birth. While some state that we are all god, the truth is more perfectly stated when we say we are all a part of God; that within us is a spark of God's Consciousness that was given to us at creation. Were we all created at one time? Some believe so; others believe that we have existed in other embodiments on earth or even in other solar systems. Either way, the important factor is that we are spiritual beings having an occasional embodiment (human) experience. Interestingly the early Christian Fathers stated these beliefs.
Justin Martyr (100 - 165 CE) said the soul inhabits the human body more than once and denied that the embodied form could remember previous experiences.
Origen (185 - 254 CE) stated: The soul, which is immaterial and invisible in its nature, exists in no material place without having a body suited to the nature of that place. Accordingly, it at one time puts off one body, which was necessary before, but which is no longer adequate in its changed state and it exchanges it for a second.
[link to www.adishakti.org]

"The doctrine of reincarnation was banished because it gives power and authority to the people. Reincarnation contradicted the aspirations of a few bishops and deacons who felt they alone should dispense the truth to the multitudes. This authoritarian strangle-hold is strengthened by the doctrine of "one chance-one life" because a person who wrongly chose to think for themselves, dismissing the authority of the hierarchy, would not get another chance to put things aright if they guessed wrongly. The position of the hierarchy is that eternal damnation without parole would be the irrevocable fate of those who dared to question the hierarchy's authority."...


A significant number of early church pillars such as St. Augustine, Clement of Alexandria, St. Gregory of Nyssa, Justin Martyr, and St. Jerome believed in the doctrine of reincarnation. In his Confessions, St. Augustine ponders the common sense viability of reincarnation: Did my infancy succeed another age of mine that dies before it? Was it that which I spent within my mother's womb? . . . And what before that life again, O God of my joy, was I anywhere or in any body? Confessions of St. Augustine, Edward Pusey, translator, Book I. There is one early church father who is the central figure in this complex story of intrigue and deception. According to the Encyclopedia Britannica, Origen (C.E. 185-254) was the most prominent, most distinguished and most influential of the early church fathers. We would do well to consider the enormity of this statement. The Encyclopedia Britannica also declares that he was the most prolific writer and theologian of early Christianity with works numbering around 6,000. St. Jerome asks, “Which of us can read all that he has written?”
Anonymous Coward
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02/14/2012 11:14 PM
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Re: Reincarnation, banned as heresy, NEVER recieved Papel approval.
Bull´s eye OP!

Are you referring to the Council of Constantinople for example?
I think it was the 8th one (869) were they took away the spirit of man.

Before that man consisted of three parts:

1- Body
2- Soul
3- Spirit

They denied then that he had a spirit as well.
Without a spirit there´s no "need" or opportunity to (re)incarnate.
This dualism influenced the whole of Trinity.
It is now good vs evil

Through the same dualism of wrong vs right the POPE can suppress the sheeples by threatening them with wrath of God through DOGMA`s.
People don´t have to think or feel or decide for themselves.

All Free Will, our basic concept of Creation, killed as well by the dogma´s.
Brilliant Satanic Masterplan!

This is our the tragedy f humanity in a nutshell.
Yeah aren´t they nuts those illuminazies
5a

I am on too them and we are legion muwahaha
Anonymous Coward
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02/14/2012 11:23 PM
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Re: Reincarnation, banned as heresy, NEVER recieved Papel approval.
Now ain´t that funny; I thought you were one of the awaked so to speak.
But you actually agree with the church how they messed up the ancient teachings?
How they denied reincarnation retroactive?

If you´re really eager to find out the truth, I recommend you to read the eucumenic Councils of Constantinople.
They´re on wiki, very interesting history.
hf

Just imagine the impact on the whole of life of taking away the Spirit of Man.
You consist of nothing but a body and a soul since 869, because the POPE said so.
FHL(C) nli
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02/14/2012 11:38 PM
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Re: Reincarnation, banned as heresy, NEVER recieved Papel approval.
whatever
Just more New Age Garbage. Regurgitating an old Heresy.
The Old Testament does not teach reincarnation and neither did Jesus.
 Quoting: ATONTRUTH


The church removed most all references of reincarnation from the bible, but not all. Educate yourself.

[link to www.reincarnation.ws]

[link to www.theosophy-nw.org]

Josephus, the Jewish historian who lived during most of the first century AD, records in his Jewish War (3, 8, 5) and in his Antiquities of the jewish people (18, 1, 3) that reincarnation was taught widely in his day, while his contemporary in Alexandria, Philo Judaeus, in various of his writings, also refers to reimbodiment in one or another form. Moreover, there are passages of the New Testament that can be understood only if seen against the background of pre-existence of souls as a generally held belief. For instance, Matthew (16:13-14) records that when Jesus asked his disciples "Whom do men say that I am?" they replied that some people said he was John the Baptist (who had been executed only a few years before the question was asked). Others thought he was Elijah, or Jeremiah, or another of the prophets. Later in Matthew (17:13), far from rejecting the concept of rebirth Jesus tells his disciples that John the Baptist was Elijah.

John (9:2-4) reports that the disciples asked Jesus whether a blindman had sinned or his parents that he had been born blind. Jesus replied that it was in order that the works of God may be made manifest in the blind man, that is, that the law of cause and effect might be fulfilled. Or, as St. Paul phrased the thought: we reap what we sow. The blind man could not have sown the seeds of his blindness in his present body, but must have done so in a previous lifetime.

The earliest Christians, especially those who were members of one or other of the Gnostic sects, such as the Valentinians, Ophites and Ebionites, included reimbodiment among their important teachings. For them it enabled fulfillment of the law -- karma -- as well as providing the means for the soul to purify itself from the muddy qualities resulting from its immersion in matter and the egoism we have developed in the first stages of our journey through earth life.

After the original generations of Christians, we find the early Church Fathers, such as Justin Martyr (AD 100-l65), St. Clement of Alexandria ( AD 150-220), and Origen ( AD 185-254) teaching the pre-existence of souls, taking up reincarnation or one or another aspect of reimbodiment. Examples are scattered through Origen's works, especially Contra Celsum (1, xxxii), where he asks: "Is it not rational that souls should be introduced into bodies, in accordance with their merits and previous deeds . . . ?" And in De Principiis he says that "the soul has neither beginning nor end." St. Jerome (AD 340-420), translator of the Latin version of the Bible known as the Vulgate, in his Letter to Demetrias (a Roman matron), states that some Christian sects in his day taught a form of reincarnation as an esoteric doctrine, imparting it to a few "as a traditional truth which was not to be divulged."

Synesius (AD 370-480), Bishop of Ptolemais, also taught the concept, and in a prayer that has survived, he says: "Father, grant that my soul may merge into the light, and be no more thrust back into the illusion of earth." Others of his Hymns, such as number III, contain lines clearly stating his views, and also pleas that he may be so purified that rebirth on earth will no longer be necessary. In a thesis on dreams, Synesius writes: "It is possible by labor and time, and a transition into other lives, for the imaginative soul to emerge from this dark abode." This passage reminds us of verses in the Revelation of John (3:12), with its symbolic, initiatory language leading into: "Him that overcometh will I make a pillar in the temple of my God, and he shall go no more out."

In many documented near-death experiences involving Jesus, the concept of reincarnation appears. In the NDE testimony of Jeanie Dicus, she was asked by Jesus if she would like to reincarnate or return. Sandra Rogers was asked the same question by Jesus during her NDE. One of the reasons many Christians reject the validity of near-death testimony is because they sometimes appear to conflict with their interpretation of Christian doctrines. But Christians are usually very surprised to learn that reincarnation was a doctrine once held by many early Christians....


The first-century Jewish historian Flavius Josephus wrote about the Pharisees being believers in reincarnation. The Pharisees were the Jewish sect which Paul belonged to before his NDE and conversion to Christianity. Josephus wrote about the Pharisees' belief that the souls of evil men are punished after death. But the souls of good men are "removed into other bodies" and they will have "power to revive and live again."

From time to time throughout Jewish history, there was a persistent belief about dead prophets returning to life through reincarnation. But the Sadducees, a purist sect of Judaism, rejected the Persian concepts of resurrection and all Hellenistic influences involving reincarnation that was happening in Jesus' day. The Sadducees accepted only the orthodox Hebrew belief in Sheol. So there were a variety of influences going on in Jerusalem at the time of Jesus.


When Jesus began his ministry, many people wondered if he was the reincarnation of one of the prophets.

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Reincarnation and the Secret Teachings of Jesus

There are many Bible verses that affirm the reality of reincarnation. We will examine some of them here.

The episode in the Bible where Jesus identified John the Baptist as the reincarnation of Elijah the prophet is one of the clearest statements which Jesus made concerning reincarnation.

For all the prophets and the law have prophesied until John. And if you are willing to receive it, he is Elijah who was to come. (Matt. 11:13-14)

In the above passage, Jesus clearly identifies John the Baptist as the reincarnation of Elijah the prophet. Later in Matthew's gospel Jesus reiterates it.

And the disciples asked him, saying, "Why then do the scribes say that Elijah must come first?"

But he answered them and said, "Elijah indeed is to come and will restore all things. But I say to you that Elijah has come already, and they did not know him, but did to him whatever they wished. So also shall the Son of Man suffer at their hand."
Then the disciples understood that he had spoken of John the Baptist." (Matt. 17:10-13)

In very explicit language, Jesus identified John the Baptist as the reincarnation of Elijah. Even the disciples of Jesus understood what Jesus was saying. This identification of John to be the reincarnation of Elijah is very important when it comes to Bible prophecy. By identifying the John with Elijah, Jesus identified himself as the Messiah. The Hebrew scriptures mentions specific signs that would precede the coming of the Messiah. One of them is that Elijah will return first.

Behold I will send you Elijah the prophet, before the coming of the great and dreadful day of the Lord. (Mal. 4:5)

[link to www.infinityinst.com]

Reincarnation as a belief system was removed from our Western thinking in 553 CE at the Second Council of Constantinople. The argument was actually against the Doctrine of the Pre-existence of the Soul.
The argument had been set forth that Justinian as the Byzantine Emperor was therefore god and his was a chosen destiny at birth. While some state that we are all god, the truth is more perfectly stated when we say we are all a part of God; that within us is a spark of God's Consciousness that was given to us at creation. Were we all created at one time? Some believe so; others believe that we have existed in other embodiments on earth or even in other solar systems. Either way, the important factor is that we are spiritual beings having an occasional embodiment (human) experience. Interestingly the early Christian Fathers stated these beliefs.
Justin Martyr (100 - 165 CE) said the soul inhabits the human body more than once and denied that the embodied form could remember previous experiences.
Origen (185 - 254 CE) stated: The soul, which is immaterial and invisible in its nature, exists in no material place without having a body suited to the nature of that place. Accordingly, it at one time puts off one body, which was necessary before, but which is no longer adequate in its changed state and it exchanges it for a second.
[link to www.adishakti.org]

"The doctrine of reincarnation was banished because it gives power and authority to the people. Reincarnation contradicted the aspirations of a few bishops and deacons who felt they alone should dispense the truth to the multitudes. This authoritarian strangle-hold is strengthened by the doctrine of "one chance-one life" because a person who wrongly chose to think for themselves, dismissing the authority of the hierarchy, would not get another chance to put things aright if they guessed wrongly. The position of the hierarchy is that eternal damnation without parole would be the irrevocable fate of those who dared to question the hierarchy's authority."...


A significant number of early church pillars such as St. Augustine, Clement of Alexandria, St. Gregory of Nyssa, Justin Martyr, and St. Jerome believed in the doctrine of reincarnation. In his Confessions, St. Augustine ponders the common sense viability of reincarnation: Did my infancy succeed another age of mine that dies before it? Was it that which I spent within my mother's womb? . . . And what before that life again, O God of my joy, was I anywhere or in any body? Confessions of St. Augustine, Edward Pusey, translator, Book I. There is one early church father who is the central figure in this complex story of intrigue and deception. According to the Encyclopedia Britannica, Origen (C.E. 185-254) was the most prominent, most distinguished and most influential of the early church fathers. We would do well to consider the enormity of this statement. The Encyclopedia Britannica also declares that he was the most prolific writer and theologian of early Christianity with works numbering around 6,000. St. Jerome asks, “Which of us can read all that he has written?”


You OP are a liar and a thief, and as you have not/will not respond to my quite to the point posts, i can only conclude, you have no desire to discuss the Truth(For YAHshua is The Truth), and are set on an agenda of lies, distortion, deception and deceiving, what say you? I think i am quite clear, you are not and can not even defend your position with basic logic.
FHL(C) nli
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China
02/14/2012 11:45 PM
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Re: Reincarnation, banned as heresy, NEVER recieved Papel approval.
Anything the so called Saint Augustine has to say is suspect, for he was the arch/etype protagonist of papal authority, therefore all his writings are suspect, and if they can not even make impact on what is considered by many to be called Old testament writings, then, perverted reckonings and reasoning to make that which is called New testament reasoning fit your lies make him doubly suspect.
ForgetMyOpinion
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07/22/2013 01:37 AM
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Re: Reincarnation, banned as heresy, NEVER recieved Papel approval.
One thing is for certain; I did live before, and I remember having done so. Burn this body at the stake & I may yet remind you that you have lived before as well, despite arguments by the well-meaning & not so well-meaning. We say we believe one thing but in our conscience we know the truth. The laws of God are fair & just & learning to love God is possible through patience. One lifetime - now that sounds impatient, consider that you are made in the image of an immortal, omnipresent, omnipotent Being.hf

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