Satan's corruption in Christianity

If you really understood the thinking in the Old Testament, you would understand the New Testament.
Instead of researching Trash, try understanding what is being taught in the Old Testament. All of the New Testament agrees with the Old Testament, if you have eyes to see.

Paul's teachings were approved by the other 12 Apostles, so what is your problem with them????
Do you know better than The Apostles, or those who go and train to be Pastors and Teachers and study this stuff??????

Instead, You follow lies and half truths and balk at the Real Truth.

It's not about understanding the thinking in the Old Testament its about understanding what is WRITTEN and SPOKEN BY GOD in the Old Testament and if you were a true follower of Yahushua Ha Mashiach you would not balk at the Old Testament as outdated half-truths like most Modern-Day Churchians often do. Yahushua came not to abolish the law but to fulfill it and it is OUR duty to keep the laws and precepts established by YHWH so that we may fulfill them as well.

who created satan?
sounds like evil is gods plan.



satan is the best friend the church has, for he has kept them IN BUSINESS all these years.

Thats for sure.

It's not like they allow discussions on christianity on asshole chistian forums (that are run by women and girly-men BTW).

God created Lucifer. Lucifer chose to attempt to be equal with God or higher. Then his name was changed. Free will - even the angels have it.

SORRY WRONG LINK. ITS A GOOD 1 THOUGH.

HERE IS THE GREEK SEPTUAGING TOE TO TOE WITH THE KJV MASORIC TEXT.

[link to ecmarsh.com]

free will is impossible with gods existance.

error.
free will is inevitable.
the problem most people have with it is the absolute truth that comes along with it.

Phenomenal thread title OP.

All of this makes me think, how Satan uses everything to deceive. He even uses the scriptures. Jesus says The sower soweth the word, he also says the devil sows seed.

Since sheep "HEAR" and others do not hear, how is their religion formed? I have an opinion...

First off let me say, I love the scriptures, I think they are from God, and are truth, this truth, is revealed by the author, and the author is to be known. The truth is within the text, explained by the same one who wrote it, if we interpret it; we end up with a private interpretation. The author is greater than the book, yet that doesn't diminish the book, or the truth that it contains.

Today many know the bible, but have never had God become real to them. Most people have never had God make himself known to them even through a beautiful sunset. To most God is just history, or he is way off in space somewhere. The importance is not in experiences, but instead experiencing God. I contend, you have to experienced God. Possibly he opens the scriptures to you, and makes them come alive; they became a "word" of God to you.

It would be like you and I having coffee everyday together, sharing life and all things included. We would age together and become deep friends. We may never have a spiritual experience, but we would definitely experience each other, as Moses experienced God at the tent, when Miriam and Aron spoke against Moses, and God spoke about how He and Moses were friends. Moses experienced God. God was experienced by everyone we read about in the OT and the NT.

You know the parable of the sower, the seeds sown by Jesus, and the seeds sown by the Devil. Those seeds manifest themselves for what they really are. These are people, could be religious, like the pharisees, who were called children of the devil by Jesus. They may be the nicest, sweetest people, but what seed are they of?

I fear that the so-called church, the large visible body that meets on the corner of every city in America is missing God. There are many within this so-called visible church (though fewer in number) that truly belong to Jesus, these are the invisible church. From my point of view, the visible church has sprung up not from experiencing God, but from its exposure to the bible "The Scriptures", but this is not necessarily so, of the invisible church "The Ecklesia".

For example most people throughout history couldn't read, we had no printing presses, and when printed most people couldn't afford the bible, this is seen during the dark ages, yet the ecklesia thrived. How? It wasn't because they had a bible; it was because God was real and made himself known to them. Possibly through someone who had a bible, but probably not.

Brother Lawrence / Laubach; in his book practicing the presence; makes the claim that God became real to him, by seeing a tree losing it leaves, knowing life would again come to the tree the following year.

Here forgive me.... Let me expound more and just be open, even though we don't know each other, possibly we can glean from one another as two who see the forest from different angles?

Could it be, that True and False Christianity...Are both produced by the Bible. Everything is about contrast (light, dark, evil, and good), or it's to express God's glory, and his many attributes...God even created evil for this purposes.

The contrast in Christianity is the true church, and the false church. The invisible ecklesia -vs- the large visible body of people in every church, on every corner. The wheat, and the chaff or tare. The good seed and the bad seed. The Pharisee, and Jesus, sheep and Goats, Light and darkness.

Today is a replay of the life of Jesus in his body singular (the one that died on the cross); now this body "His Body" is plural, many membered...The same prosecutions, torments, dying, will happen in us as it did in him. Now the Pharisees are the religious of today. True Christianity and false Christianity, is so close, to the real church, the real walk, the real life...So close that it could even fool the elect, if that were possible....

So how does God establish the tare, this large so-called church. Do we see it throughout time? Yes, and it all started with two trees. The tree of life, and the tree of knowledge. We see the essence of these two trees, in many forms. One is in the visible church, and the invisible church, the wheat and tare.

The large visible church exists and is sustained by the visible, tangible, written word (The Bible). They find themselves at home with the text, they can control it, they build laws, rules, religious rituals, and doctrines. By this same knowledge they also remove God, who is Spirit, out of their midst, issues of control, a form of religion, and rules, that denies the power thereof. There is no body ministry, led of God's Spirit.

Do you think this would all be obvious, and plainly visible, or only visible to us by discernment? It had to be hidden, even from those who were in the midst of it, or else they would not have participated. Both sides, real and false are hidden, even from themselves. If not hidden, you couldn't get anyone to participate in this plan of God.

I'm not against these people; most are genuine, nice, sweet people. But we are discussing truth here. Now God is revealing these things to us, and getting ready to reveal us to each other, to reveal the true church to herself, to reveal the false church to the true.

While most of the members of both groups are wonderful people and well intentioned, the visible false church, is still like the Pharisees of old. They search the scriptures daily, but won't come to Christ, that they might have life. In fact they were never destined to life, this is what the scriptures say, the body / the ecklesia / the invisible church has life, they were destined to life, from the beginning.

The true body, the ecklesia exist by "the word", they know a hidden walk, they know the masters voice. This has got to be the common denominator throughout time, since many could not read, and the few that could read, didn't have a copy of the bible. Yet the Ecklesia flourished, even in the dark ages, and in countries that never allowed sacred texts, like China, and Russia...

Today both flourish, and this thing called church, or churchianity, has said to all, we represent God. But they do not, and God is getting ready to show this world, his true church, the ecklesia....God's mercy, and the world demand such an event, to rid God, of the stain of falsehood. Whether that be TV preachers, or even all the pain caused to so many in the name of God by so-called Christianity, which was NOT Christianity, but instead, it was this false church the large, visible church, this system.

God is separating HIS people "The Ecclesia from this thing called church, "churchianity". He is building his kingdom, it is on the inside. That is what Jesus says.

There is no way for light and darkness to fellowship together and there is NO way all those people in all these churches are truly born again via an encounter with Christ. That encounter must take place...We must experience God.

So there is no way they can fellowship with you, or you with them, if you are part of that invisible "REAL" church, for what fellowship does light have with darkness. You might as well go to a Safeway store and try and "do church" with all the people there, it will not work.

Remember Jesus says "my sheep hear my voice", and man shall not live by bread alone, the word of the Lord came unto, peter rise and eat, ETC. You see what I mean? "The word of the Lord" via "The scriptures" can become a fresh word to you, but, we can not use the terms "The word" and "the bible" interchangeably.

The point I'm making is, there is a lot written in the bible about hearing, hardly anything about reading. Everything written in the bible was spoken before it was written. Genesis was spoken, and then written by Moses.

We must come to a common denominator, for people to receive Christ, to hear the message, or to experience Christianity, and it cannot be the bible, even though God has used the scriptures to do so on occasion. Still I love the scriptures, and they are true, they are God inspired. They have just been elevated to a position by this false church, where they have taken the place of God.

Also to express my point, do this: Every place in the scriptures where it says, "the word" or "the word came unto" replace every instance with "The bible"....It just will not make sense...

As far as people hearing "The word" vs studying "The scriptures" I see a big difference between the two. One is heard, one is read. Many can read, few can hear. One is always spoken, and one is written, but can be made alive to you, and become a spoken word. God also speaks apart from the scriptures, remember God spoke to Adam and Moses before there was a written bible.

Thus we have interchanged the two, elevating "The bible" above God, and the leading of the Spirit, and we have placed the bible above "The Word"...

I wonder, could we say that we love the scriptures, and that they are inspired, but God never meant for us to live by them, nor the Jewish people the Torah. But instead by the Spirit / the word / His breath...His words of promise, leading us into all truth?

We have two types of church. Those led by the Spirit, and those seeing and leaning only on "The book". I love the scriptures, and I have several bibles. BUT we must not elevate the bible above God, and I'm afraid that is what many churches (people) have done.

The "Word" and "The bible" are not one and the same...The common denominator throughout time Has been God reaching out to man, possibly by a sunset, or a person who was "LED" of the spirit to witnesses to you, or God speaks to you, but God has not, at all times used the bible. Of course there are times that the Spirit moves someone, through the use of Scripture, but that is not my point.

What do we say of the first 3000 years of man, until Moses wrote the Torah, where was God? He was doing what he has always done, personally interacting with man.

The faith we have is more than intellectual knowledge, it IS LIFE...Two trees were in the garden; today we face that same thing? "Knowledge" OR "Life"...

If you believe what you say then you still do Blood Sacrifices in the temple as required by the LAW, Right.
Oh I forgot you can't, because there isn't one.

So all the Food you eat are Kosher ????
How do you manage to Tithe according to the Law ?????
I am sure you also consecrate yourself after touching anything considered to be unclean!!!!!!
So You follow all 613+ Mosaic Laws to the letter, or you pick and chose what you want to uphold ????????? Just like the Pharisees did?????

If you break the Law or any part of it, you sin. Yet according to the Law you can not cleanse yourself of that sin. Since there is no priesthood or temple, you can not cover your sin, tithe, uphold the Sabbath and Holy Days ( just to name a few things), as required by the Law.

So the Law is Out Dated, if you accept Jesus as the One sacrifice for sin. If not, It is Outdated because there is no Temple. So you can not Keep the Law.

So you want to be justified by upholding the Law?????
So did the Judaizers, try reading Galatians Chapter 3.

if freewill is inevitable, then god is not who he claims to be, nor who his followers claim him to be.

if there is freewill in the bible, that directly contradicts gods power, knowledge, and creation.

If you break the Law or any part of it, you sin. Yet according to the Law you can not cleanse yourself of that sin. Since there is no priesthood or temple, you can not cover your sin, tithe, uphold the Sabbath and Holy Days ( just to name a few things), as required by the Law.
Quote 5536007



You have 613 laws to keep. Approx. half are positive, and the other half negative - get to work. I will however, rest in the Truth of Jesus, he fulfilled the law for me, because He knew my weakness in fallen flesh

Well, as long as you are having a good time.

Only one problem here, that is that one is more explicit than the other text. The thought and intent of the passage remains the same.
It is very much like the 4 Gospels, slightly different, but the same.
Unless you can show a major divergence that affects Salvation or another doctrine, then this is an Epic Fail.

[link to www.thenazareneway.com]

Oooh, the plot thickens. Thanks for the link. The writings of Luke and James have always resonated with me more so than the others, so this article really captured my attention. Lots to think about.

Yehoshua replaced the blood sacrifices as the ultimate sacrifice.

All of the unleavened bread laws are statutes and are to be upheld throughout the generations for ever.

In order to be free of the uncleanness of the world and to follow his law you must separate yourself from society and the system. (I'm in the process of that right now and am leaving everything behind).

When you become unclean you wash your garments, and yourself and become unclean until even. You repent of your sins, meaning to turn from your ways and never do it again.

The bible and YHWH aren't there to pick and choose from...it's the way of life that He created for us, which Satan has used to sway man away from YHWH through the means of technology and creating the system over time. This is why people believe it to be impossible to uphold the laws, because it is in modern society.

I have read the Bible and IT found something wrong with ME

the atoning death of Jesus Christ to pay the full penalty of our sins is the greatest story ever told. His resurrection to provide us the free gift of eternal life is our hope. we have full assurance of faith

obligate yourself to one law op and bind yourself to them all. conversely break one law you've broken them all. yes breaking one jot and tittle of the law keeps us from eternal life

Jesus paid the price for our sins it isn't cheap grace our Creator died for us!!

love rb

This is why man must separate himself from the system dependence created in this immoral world we live in. Man cannot walk upright in YHWH's righteousness on his own. However man assuredly can uphold the laws through YHWH alone.

Daniel 7:25
And he shall speak great words against the most High, and shall wear out the saints of the most High, and think to change times and laws: and they shall be given into his hand until a time and times and the dividing of time.

Psalms 25:15-21
Mine eyes are ever toward YHWH; for he shall pluck my feet out of the net. Turn thee unto me, and have mercy upon me; for I am desolate and afflicted. The troubles of my heart are enlarged: O bring thou me out of my distresses. Look upon mine affliction and my pain; and forgive all my sins. Consider mine enemies; for they are many; and they hate me with cruel hatred. O keep my soul, and deliver me: let me not be ashamed; for I put my trust in thee. Let integrity and uprightness preserve me; for I wait on thee.

Psalms 17:8-15
Keep me as the apple of the eye, hide me under the shadow of thy wings, From the wicked that oppress me, from my deadly enemies, who compass me about. They are inclosed in their own fat: with their mouth they speak proudly. They have now compassed us in our steps: they have set their eyes bowing down to the earth; Like as a lion that is greedy of his prey, and as it were a young lion lurking in secret places. Arise, YHWH, disappoint him, cast him down: deliver my soul from the wicked, which is thy sword: From men which are thy hand, YHWH from men of the world, which have their portion in this life, and whose belly thou fillest with thy hid treasure: they are full of children, and leave the rest of their substance to their babes. As for me, I will behold thy face in righteousness: I shall be satisfied, when I awake, with thy likeness.

Hosea 14:9
Who is wise, and he shall understand these things? prudent, and he shall know them? for the ways of YHWH are right, and the just shall walk in them: but the transgressors shall stumble in them.

Matthew 6:33:
But seek first the kingdom of Elohiym and His righteousness, and all these things shall be added to you.

Matthew 5:20
For I say unto you, That except your righteousness shall exceed the righteousness of the scribes and Pharisees, ye shall in no case enter into the kingdom of heaven.

Matthew 19:26
But Yeshua beheld them, and said unto them, With men this is impossible; but with YHWH all things are possible.

Interesting. However, some ancient Jesus movements, such as the Ebionites wrote that S/Paul and Simon Magus were one and the same. Simon Magus was a 'code name' for Saul of Tarsus.

Salvation is by faith alone, it's a gift from God. You can't get it by being a scholar and poring over books.

lol...you truth teller you...OH MY!! the HORROR!! lol...hey Jesus told the "religious ones" ...YOU CAN SEARCH THAT ( so called and will fail you twisted on purpose for your misleading ..scriptures as you worship them) and NOT FIND ME THERE!!!!!!!!!!!! beware....give up all your scripture keeping and just have the real thing...a relationship ...wow...how lovely!!

the Lord's standard is perfection

our trying to somehow please Him -- earning or maintaining salvation -- is futile. we are perfect in Him already.

we can and ought certainly strive to do things pleasing to Him -- mainly presch the gospel and make disciples as is our commission -- but outside of the Holy Spirit working in and through us we don't stand a chance

only those fruits of the Holy Spirit will stand as we enter eternity. our most righteous attempts of our own power are but filthy rags to God. our own works will be burned away like wood hay and stubble

we do not presume to do anything outside of the Holy Spirit working in and through us. we have this treasure in earthen vessels to show that this great power is from God, not from us ;)

love rb

Rb i hope this okay with you babe...WE ARE SHIT!! ahahah yep i agree

You need to re-read the epistle of James as a rebuke of Paul's beliefs. That's why it was written.

Also, there's a couple of really good books about Saul/Paul. One written by Jewish scholar Hyam Maccoby called The Mythmaker, and one by UK Professor Barrie Wilson called How Jesus Became Christian. Both very enlightening.

Indoctrinated much? Next you'll be telling me I have a 'religious spirit'.

out of the heart a man speaks hey been dare done dat dance...no judgements..okay>>>? just ask if you desire to really grow...why you ask so?? damn growing does hurt but so worth the effort...I LOVE THE FAILED ONES and the ones who SAY..." I FUCKED UP ...SORRY" meee too bro or sis!

As I posted in this thread:

Thread: WARNING about False Teachings here at GLP (Page 18)

The problem Christians have is that they do not know the truth. You do not know the truth by listening to one pastor or priest or the other. You do not know the truth by reading one book or the other (even the Bible). You begin to know the truth when you start living out the words of Jesus.

On the issue of keeping God's commandments, no-one can perfectly keep the commandments by exercise of will power--and God is only interested in perfection and nothing short of it. Through the grace that came through Jesus Christ, one can perfectly keep the commandments of God. In order to apply this grace, you must have faith (or truth) and faith or truth comes by living out Jesus' words in order to see how they work out. Paul's epistles give the most excellent description of the working of faith. You cannot develop faith if you do not believe Jesus' words enough to base your life on them.