Moon Hoax - Rockets CANNOT work in space | |
Anonymous Coward User ID: 15631138 United States 05/06/2012 04:00 PM Report Abusive Post Report Copyright Violation | Assumptions: Vacuum chamber is huge (lets just say many miles long) and add no mass or air resistance. Exhaust from rocket only goes into vacuum chamber. What happens? Chemicals (liquid hydrogen and oxygen) react making a very hot gas. In a hot gas the molecules move very fast and shoot out the nozzle. Due to conservation of momentum the molecules move one way then the rocket will move the other way. Momentum always is conserved: total momentum before: 0 - both the fuel and rocket are at rest total momentum after: 0 - hot gas shooting one way, rocket shoots other way The hot gas doesn't need to push off of anything, its all just conservation of momentum like recoil from a gun or throwing a ball while ice skating. HOWEVER: The rocket will eventually slow down when the hot gas hits the back side of the vacuum chamber, but that besides the point since there is no back side to space. Granted this is all based on the ASSUMPTION that momentum is conserved. Yes for everyone out there I said ASSUMPTION. Science is a constantly evolving field. Everything including rockets that we have observed obeys conservation of momentum. One day we may find some situation/object that doesn't, but until that day I CHOOSE to believe it. And if you choose no to believe in conservation of momentum, then that is FINE, but you should have a good reason or explanation for everything that we observe that says conservation of momentum is valid. Also, I work at x-ray rocket lab. Yes we dont go into deep space, but then again NONE of space is truely a vacuum. Anyway, we have to test our rockets in a vacuum chamber to make sure they will work. It take a lot to hold the rockets in place because when fired they exert a force. if a rocket didn't work in space you could just set them on a table and the wouldn't go anywhere and my job would be alot easier |
Anonymous Coward User ID: 16665027 United Kingdom 05/27/2012 10:31 AM Report Abusive Post Report Copyright Violation | The vacuum chamber on the end of a rocket is a really cool idea! Lets test it: Quoting: Anonymous Coward 15631138 Assumptions: Vacuum chamber is huge (lets just say many miles long) and add no mass or air resistance. Exhaust from rocket only goes into vacuum chamber. What happens? Chemicals (liquid hydrogen and oxygen) react making a very hot gas. In a hot gas the molecules move very fast and shoot out the nozzle. Due to conservation of momentum the molecules move one way then the rocket will move the other way. Momentum always is conserved: total momentum before: 0 - both the fuel and rocket are at rest total momentum after: 0 - hot gas shooting one way, rocket shoots other way The hot gas doesn't need to push off of anything, its all just conservation of momentum like recoil from a gun or throwing a ball while ice skating. HOWEVER: The rocket will eventually slow down when the hot gas hits the back side of the vacuum chamber, but that besides the point since there is no back side to space. Granted this is all based on the ASSUMPTION that momentum is conserved. Yes for everyone out there I said ASSUMPTION. Science is a constantly evolving field. Everything including rockets that we have observed obeys conservation of momentum. One day we may find some situation/object that doesn't, but until that day I CHOOSE to believe it. And if you choose no to believe in conservation of momentum, then that is FINE, but you should have a good reason or explanation for everything that we observe that says conservation of momentum is valid. Also, I work at x-ray rocket lab. Yes we dont go into deep space, but then again NONE of space is truely a vacuum. Anyway, we have to test our rockets in a vacuum chamber to make sure they will work. It take a lot to hold the rockets in place because when fired they exert a force. if a rocket didn't work in space you could just set them on a table and the wouldn't go anywhere and my job would be alot easier good post. if you work in a rocket lab what on earth are you doing on glp lol? do you have any videos of your rockets providing thrust in the vacuum chamber? |
Anonymous Coward User ID: 1277060 United States 06/21/2012 11:17 PM Report Abusive Post Report Copyright Violation | Space is not an absolute vacuum the molecules are just far apart. While this makes for less push from rocket, it also makes less resistance to the rockets movement, so it balances. Also rockets work fine underwater ( do you not play with bottle rockets where you live?) |
x26111 User ID: 18341768 Hungary 07/14/2012 05:39 PM Report Abusive Post Report Copyright Violation | |
Anonymous Coward User ID: 14143765 United States 07/15/2012 04:08 PM Report Abusive Post Report Copyright Violation | what happens if you lift the rear end of a jet ski out of the water? why wont it now go forward? it is still forcing water out of the jet, where is the equal/opposite now? Quoting: Anonymous Coward 13470385 Very good analogy. Funny how they all ignored it... Bad analogy because it has a false premise. The jet ski will still go forward. |
cp06866 User ID: 20620696 Trinidad and Tobago 08/01/2012 08:25 PM Report Abusive Post Report Copyright Violation | Nope. That statement is still as wrong as the first time you said it. How do you explain how every scientist (not just the rocket scientists although they have first hand knowledge) and every country that has ANYTHING to do with space agrees that rocket propulsion DOES work in space? Is it some vast conspiracy that only you and a few others know the "real" truth? That's called delusional. Get help. You need it. You are correct, they agree (without proof), yet they are incorrect! Scientist just hold on to Sir Newton's Law in order to explain it. I think you need help thinking/analysing/experimenting for yourself. You obviously need it. Stop studying what everyone believes, find out for yourself and stop waiting on others to do so. Newton's law does not apply to a rocket working without surrounding atmospheric pressure. Even Newton didn't agree with this. Yet his theory is held responsible (without proper experimental proof) for rocket propulsion in space. Newton's law wouldn't have had a place in this mess if NASA didn't fake the whole thing. So then, Newton's third law becomes the scapegoat. I don't know why people just repeat after others and then fool themselves into thinking that they know something... Last Edited by Kyros Nox on 08/01/2012 08:26 PM |
Anonymous Coward User ID: 17287479 United States 08/14/2012 04:26 PM Report Abusive Post Report Copyright Violation | |
Anonymous Coward User ID: 17287479 United States 08/14/2012 06:33 PM Report Abusive Post Report Copyright Violation | And also, should a craft make it to orbit, it wouldn't be able to make a retro burn to come home, because the retro rockets won't work up there. What are all the objects I see flying overhead at night after sunset and before sunrise? Saw many shuttle passes as well, predicted a week or so in advance. Still see the ISS when conditions are right. How are these spacecraft put up there if rockets don't work up there. And how did the Shuttle come home from orbit? Odd questions, considering you consider all satellites a hoax...like the GPS ones that everyone uses, DirecTV, weather satellites and all the rest... I think this one is busted. |
moonandmarshoax User ID: 20785085 United States 08/15/2012 09:59 PM Report Abusive Post Report Copyright Violation | one of the biggest hoaxes of all time! Quoting: Anonymous Coward 11057845 rocket propulsion cannot work in space. you get tricked by being told about newtons third law and how the propellant pushes against the body so therefore (equal opposite) has to push the rocket. but newtons third law ironically proves this to be false if viewed from the other way round, the propellant cannot push against a vacuum (zero force) so in turn (equal and opposite) applies zero force to the rocket/vehicle itself. can anyone find me a video of a rocket, firecracker or something similar creating force in a vacuum? not wading through the pages of shill-fest (they come out of the woodwork for anything nasa-related) but did anyone come up with a video of rocket propulsion working in a vacuum? that would be a worthwhile experiment to try and document, wouldn't it? i agree wirh you...its a hoax and too many bashers cant think for themselves no, 10 pages and still no evidence shown, just lots of bashing (you would think there would be loads of videos of these propulsion tests wouldn't you? unless its all BS ;) science says it works so people question no further and believe what they are told. |
moonandmarshoax User ID: 21338067 United States 08/15/2012 10:21 PM Report Abusive Post Report Copyright Violation | I have another for all these shills who can only blast out crap taught from the 1 digit grade science book...a rocket will NOT workm in space...ask these idiots how a parachute is going to work in a near vacuum atmosphere on mars...it cant...no atmosphere..no air resistance...been fighting for 6 days with these nutballs and nobody can show proof...no testing has been done on high altitude parachutes because it cant work...face it nasa and jpl are1. a bunch of liars...and jpl is nothing more than a PR firm to debunk conspiracy theorists...they only are gamer nerds who made a video simulation of what it WOULD look like with the landing...a bunch of brainwashed idiots...i want to see them in court swear that it happened or provide video of 1. A rocket working in a vacuum 2. A parachute working in air chamber with air pressure of .0022 psi NASA AND JPL are liars |
Anonymous Coward User ID: 17693083 United States 08/15/2012 11:43 PM Report Abusive Post Report Copyright Violation | Yeah, it slowed it some but it certainly didn't function the way a parachute does in Earth's atmosphere. It stabilized the descent, slowed it noticably, but it was the rockets that did the real work. On Earth, it would be comparable to a small drogue chute in it's function. It wasn't designed to land the spacecraft, just stabilize it for the rockets to do their thing. I know you don't believe any of it, but this might clarify things for others. |
Anonymous Coward User ID: 17693083 United States 08/16/2012 12:10 AM Report Abusive Post Report Copyright Violation | |
Anonymous Coward User ID: 21965794 United States 08/16/2012 12:19 AM Report Abusive Post Report Copyright Violation | one of the biggest hoaxes of all time! Quoting: Anonymous Coward 11057845 rocket propulsion cannot work in space. you get tricked by being told about newtons third law and how the propellant pushes against the body so therefore (equal opposite) has to push the rocket. but newtons third law ironically proves this to be false if viewed from the other way round, the propellant cannot push against a vacuum (zero force) so in turn (equal and opposite) applies zero force to the rocket/vehicle itself. can anyone find me a video of a rocket, firecracker or something similar creating force in a vacuum? Under this false assumption, there would be no such thing as comets or orbiting satellites. |
Anonymous Coward User ID: 21965794 United States 08/16/2012 12:20 AM Report Abusive Post Report Copyright Violation | I have another for all these shills who can only blast out Quoting: moonandmarshoax 21338067 crap taught from the 1 digit grade science book...a rocket will NOT workm in space...ask these idiots how a parachute is going to work in a near vacuum atmosphere on mars...it cant...no atmosphere..no air resistance...been fighting for 6 days with these nutballs and nobody can show proof...no testing has been done on high altitude parachutes because it cant work...face it nasa and jpl are1. a bunch of liars...and jpl is nothing more than a PR firm to debunk conspiracy theorists...they only are gamer nerds who made a video simulation of what it WOULD look like with the landing...a bunch of brainwashed idiots...i want to see them in court swear that it happened or provide video of 1. A rocket working in a vacuum 2. A parachute working in air chamber with air pressure of .0022 psi NASA AND JPL are liars All planets have atmospheres. ALL |
Passin' Through User ID: 14422899 United States 08/16/2012 12:25 AM Report Abusive Post Report Copyright Violation | Sigh... Quoting: Anonymous Coward 9438655 You can't push against the vacuum but you can make the fuel push the ship... Imagine yourself in a chair with wheel, not touching the ground make a strong motion, you will notice you will move. Dont even DARE thinking it was cause of the air... if it was cause of the air we would be able to fly simply by flapping our arms. Dunno if this cleared things up as Im not very good with explanations. So you are saying it is Wile E. Coyote. When he has a fan and a sail on a skateboard and both are attached to the same vehicle. When the fan blows against the sail he moves forward. I get it now. “If Noah’s flood really did occur, what would you expect to find? Billions of dead things, buried in rock layers, laid down by water, all over the earth.” And guess what we find? Billions of dead things, buried in rock layers, laid down by water, all over the earth. |
Anonymous Coward User ID: 22053784 United States 08/16/2012 04:16 AM Report Abusive Post Report Copyright Violation | |
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Anonymous Coward User ID: 22033686 United Kingdom 08/16/2012 04:31 AM Report Abusive Post Report Copyright Violation | I have another for all these shills who can only blast out Quoting: moonandmarshoax 21338067 crap taught from the 1 digit grade science book...a rocket will NOT workm in space...ask these idiots how a parachute is going to work in a near vacuum atmosphere on mars...it cant...no atmosphere..no air resistance...been fighting for 6 days with these nutballs and nobody can show proof...no testing has been done on high altitude parachutes because it cant work...face it nasa and jpl are1. a bunch of liars...and jpl is nothing more than a PR firm to debunk conspiracy theorists...they only are gamer nerds who made a video simulation of what it WOULD look like with the landing...a bunch of brainwashed idiots...i want to see them in court swear that it happened or provide video of 1. A rocket working in a vacuum 2. A parachute working in air chamber with air pressure of .0022 psi NASA AND JPL are liars All planets have atmospheres. ALL indeed no matter what atmoshpere there was on a planet, having a parachute would slow it down more than not having one. the point is to get that little bit of slowing down, even if it is no where near what it would do on earth. |
Anonymous Coward User ID: 22065733 United Kingdom 08/16/2012 04:24 PM Report Abusive Post Report Copyright Violation | |
Halcyon Dayz, FCD User ID: 19507663 Netherlands 08/16/2012 04:36 PM Report Abusive Post Report Copyright Violation | So you are saying it is Wile E. Coyote. When he has a fan and a sail on a skateboard and both are attached to the same vehicle. When the fan blows against the sail he moves forward. Quoting: Passin' Through I get it now. Wile would go backwards. The fan would propel the skateboard backward, the sail would be an airbreak slowing it down. A rocket engine (or motor) is basically an ongoing explosion. The explosion gasses push in all directions against the walls of the combustion chamber. There's a hole in the chamber, the gasses won't push at that spot. Add up all the vectors, and the result will be a force pushing in the direction opposite of the hole. Reaching for the sky makes you taller. Hi! My name is Halcyon Dayz and I'm addicted to morans. |
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Anonymous Coward User ID: 22058838 Croatia 08/16/2012 04:44 PM Report Abusive Post Report Copyright Violation | Do you have, or use, a GPS unit? Quoting: Anonymous Coward 17693083 What is the principle behind that, and how does it work? How about tran-oceanic phone calls? Answer: Satellites in Earth orbit. How did they get there? Do you understand the form - "EARTH ORBIT"? Satellites could get there by the rockets pushed from EARTH. When they come to the end of life EARTH gravity brings them back. "Rockets" satellites that go further into space are flying just because of the help of planets gravity push, not by the help of huge tanks of fuel (because there are no such tanks) in small satellites - crafts. and not like this [link to sciencenetlinks.com] |
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s.j User ID: 13337221 United States 08/16/2012 05:40 PM Report Abusive Post Report Copyright Violation | I have another for all these shills who can only blast out Quoting: moonandmarshoax 21338067 crap taught from the 1 digit grade science book...a rocket will NOT workm in space...ask these idiots how a parachute is going to work in a near vacuum atmosphere on mars...it cant...no atmosphere..no air resistance...been fighting for 6 days with these nutballs and nobody can show proof...no testing has been done on high altitude parachutes because it cant work...face it nasa and jpl are1. a bunch of liars...and jpl is nothing more than a PR firm to debunk conspiracy theorists...they only are gamer nerds who made a video simulation of what it WOULD look like with the landing...a bunch of brainwashed idiots...i want to see them in court swear that it happened or provide video of 1. A rocket working in a vacuum 2. A parachute working in air chamber with air pressure of .0022 psi NASA AND JPL are liars All planets have atmospheres. ALL indeed no matter what atmoshpere there was on a planet, having a parachute would slow it down more than not having one. the point is to get that little bit of slowing down, even if it is no where near what it would do on earth. Not if the parachute and rigging contribute more weight than it and the payload and the atmosphere and gravity were all designed for it to do. |
Anonymous Coward User ID: 22101456 United States 08/16/2012 10:31 PM Report Abusive Post Report Copyright Violation | Do you have, or use, a GPS unit? Quoting: Anonymous Coward 17693083 What is the principle behind that, and how does it work? How about tran-oceanic phone calls? Answer: Satellites in Earth orbit. How did they get there? Do you understand the form - "EARTH ORBIT"? Satellites could get there by the rockets pushed from EARTH. When they come to the end of life EARTH gravity brings them back. "Rockets" satellites that go further into space are flying just because of the help of planets gravity push, not by the help of huge tanks of fuel (because there are no such tanks) in small satellites - crafts. and not like this [link to sciencenetlinks.com] Take a satellite and upper stage booster in Earth orbit. The Mission Planners want to take this satellite from a 100 mile high orbit up to geosynchronous orbit (around 23,000 miles up). How does it get there? It fires it's engine, raising the opposite side of the orbit to 24k. Then, after travelling the half orbit to that 24k altitude, it fires again to raise the low end of the orbit...bingo, geosynch orbit...with the burns occuring away from the Earth in a vaccuum. That's how spaceships work, be it Earth orbit or a million miles out...action/reaction. Gravity doesn't push, it pulls. |