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Why Drugs cannot provide Spiritual experience (Was: Real Reason Legalizing Drugs)

 
William_the_Bloody
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04/07/2012 01:23 PM
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Why Drugs cannot provide Spiritual experience (Was: Real Reason Legalizing Drugs)
By definition, spirituality is SPIRITIUAL. It has nothing to do with physical objects in the material world. It is not a vapor released from a plant or a chemical released in digestion that starts tweaking your brain's pleasure receptors.

REAL Spirituality is experienced by spiritual discipline, there are no shortcuts.

Oh sure, there are shortcuts that will take you into some pretty fantastic areas of demonic deception and if it's lies your after than go for it...

But the real stuff is hard work, devotion, piety, sacrifice and humility.

Like everything else in this world, there's the real thing that almost no one ever finds, and there's the counterfeit that is widely available.
William_the_Bloody (OP)

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04/07/2012 01:32 PM
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Re: Why Drugs cannot provide Spiritual experience (Was: Real Reason Legalizing Drugs)
To add:

Picking the thread up from here, where OP became so threatened by my counter-arguments that she proclaimed me a troll and banned me from her thread

Thread: Real Reason Elites Intend to Legalize Some Drugs? (Page 2)

Last Edited by William_the_Bloody on 04/07/2012 01:32 PM
Anonymous Coward
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04/07/2012 01:35 PM
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Re: Why Drugs cannot provide Spiritual experience (Was: Real Reason Legalizing Drugs)
Tell that to all the if not EVERY shame through out history....those shamans Do what before trancing into a spiritual realm? Smoke some dank ass herb or Get HIGH AS HELL on some type of plant..
Anonymous Coward
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04/07/2012 01:37 PM
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Re: Why Drugs cannot provide Spiritual experience (Was: Real Reason Legalizing Drugs)
be it the amazon or the middle of the desert in africa they GET HIGH then go all voodoo spiritual. so OK...Btw i do believe in the spiritual realm but most spiritualists do consume so crazy amounts of DMT before beginning a TRIP into the spirit realm
William_the_Bloody (OP)

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04/07/2012 01:40 PM
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Re: Why Drugs cannot provide Spiritual experience (Was: Real Reason Legalizing Drugs)
be it the amazon or the middle of the desert in africa they GET HIGH then go all voodoo spiritual. so OK...Btw i do believe in the spiritual realm but most spiritualists do consume so crazy amounts of DMT before beginning a TRIP into the spirit realm
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 1551413


Anyone can do DMT and get into the Spirit Realm, including Shamans...the question remains: Where are they going within the spirit realm?

Take the Aztecs/Mayans/Central American types...many of these cultures ended up doing Human Sacrifices at the guidence of their Shamans who were on DMT trips.

See where I'm going with this?

Drugs are shortcuts through bad neighborhoods.
Anonymous Coward
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04/07/2012 01:42 PM
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Re: Why Drugs cannot provide Spiritual experience (Was: Real Reason Legalizing Drugs)
kinda just oxy moroned yourself dude
Anonymous Coward
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04/07/2012 01:43 PM
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Re: Why Drugs cannot provide Spiritual experience (Was: Real Reason Legalizing Drugs)
This one of the dumbest threads/notions I've ever seen posted on GLP.
William_the_Bloody (OP)

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04/07/2012 01:44 PM
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Re: Why Drugs cannot provide Spiritual experience (Was: Real Reason Legalizing Drugs)
So, counterfeit and deceptive spiritual experience is cool with you people?

Just checking.
Anonymous Coward
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04/07/2012 01:47 PM
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Re: Why Drugs cannot provide Spiritual experience (Was: Real Reason Legalizing Drugs)
Someone thinks he is enlightened...
Anonymous Coward
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04/07/2012 01:47 PM
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Re: Why Drugs cannot provide Spiritual experience (Was: Real Reason Legalizing Drugs)
So, counterfeit and deceptive spiritual experience is cool with you people?

Just checking.
 Quoting: William_the_Bloody


What the fuck is wrong with you??
Anonymous Coward
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04/07/2012 01:49 PM
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Re: Why Drugs cannot provide Spiritual experience (Was: Real Reason Legalizing Drugs)
Someone thinks he is enlightened...
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 13860815


Yeah, his way or the highway.

Like some kind of spiritual bigot.

I'm not even going to bother trying to argue with this one.
William_the_Bloody (OP)

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04/07/2012 01:53 PM
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Re: Why Drugs cannot provide Spiritual experience (Was: Real Reason Legalizing Drugs)
I'm not even going to bother trying to argue with this one.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 7659486


Finally, an intelligent response. Well done.
Anonymous Coward
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04/07/2012 01:55 PM
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Re: Why Drugs cannot provide Spiritual experience (Was: Real Reason Legalizing Drugs)
The root word of pharmacy is sorcery
Anonymous Coward
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04/07/2012 02:00 PM
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Re: Why Drugs cannot provide Spiritual experience (Was: Real Reason Legalizing Drugs)
I'm not even going to bother trying to argue with this one.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 7659486


Finally, an intelligent response. Well done.
 Quoting: William_the_Bloody


OP, you're a fucking loon and you don't know what you're talking about.

I bet you also had a brother die of a "weed overdose", right?

propoganda
William_the_Bloody (OP)

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04/07/2012 02:12 PM
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Re: Why Drugs cannot provide Spiritual experience (Was: Real Reason Legalizing Drugs)
OP, you're a fucking loon and you don't know what you're talking about.

I bet you also had a brother die of a "weed overdose", right?

propoganda
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 12244660


I'm not the one resorting to frothing-at-the-mouth vulgarity and so forth. So far, you haven't countered with anything.

Maybe you're high right now?
SecretsoftheUniverse

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04/07/2012 02:14 PM
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Re: Why Drugs cannot provide Spiritual experience (Was: Real Reason Legalizing Drugs)
careful with your judgements.

they often come back to bite you.
The Spiral is the Answer.

secretsoftheuniverse314.blogspot.com
Anonymous Coward
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04/07/2012 02:17 PM
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Re: Why Drugs cannot provide Spiritual experience (Was: Real Reason Legalizing Drugs)
Drugs can provide a glimpse into what is there, but they do not produce Enlightenment. They are useful tools to get a wider perspective and pose yourself new questions that need a life change to answer. BUT.. they are not supposed to be used over and over again, a handful of times is enough to get the message.

Tool. Not solution.
Anonymous Coward
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04/07/2012 02:22 PM
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Re: Why Drugs cannot provide Spiritual experience (Was: Real Reason Legalizing Drugs)
By definition, spirituality is SPIRITIUAL. It has nothing to do with physical objects in the material world. It is not a vapor released from a plant or a chemical released in digestion that starts tweaking your brain's pleasure receptors.

REAL Spirituality is experienced by spiritual discipline, there are no shortcuts.

Oh sure, there are shortcuts that will take you into some pretty fantastic areas of demonic deception and if it's lies your after than go for it...

But the real stuff is hard work, devotion, piety, sacrifice and humility.

Like everything else in this world, there's the real thing that almost no one ever finds, and there's the counterfeit that is widely available.
 Quoting: William_the_Bloody


It is all part of the one experience of creation/All That Is. I too would say that psychedelics (or any other mind altering drug) cannot bestow "spirituality", whatever that means to you. Psychedelics will offer new pathways of experience though.

In fact, it is probably true for many people, that the lessons they need to learn, will be endured without any kind resort to psychedelics. Honor all paths for their potential to offer lessons. What is it that you need to experience in heeding the call of the Higher Self? Discover that reality.
Anonymous Coward
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04/07/2012 02:28 PM
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Re: Why Drugs cannot provide Spiritual experience (Was: Real Reason Legalizing Drugs)
OP, you're a fucking loon and you don't know what you're talking about.

I bet you also had a brother die of a "weed overdose", right?

propoganda
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 12244660


I'm not the one resorting to frothing-at-the-mouth vulgarity and so forth. So far, you haven't countered with anything.

Maybe you're high right now?
 Quoting: William_the_Bloody

I don't need to counter your argument because you don't know what you're talking about.

Because you're a fucking loon.

*mouth froths*

And so what if I was high? People who don't use drugs love to paint a picture of people on drugs being raving madmen, when this has been proven over and over to not be the case. Take for example the recent study by the National US Highway Safety Administration that proves that people who smoke Cannabis are safer drivers. That's far from frothing at the mouth.

Again, you're a fucking loon, and you don't know what you're talking about. Now if you respond with something that's scientifically accurate about your statement, such as disproving Pineal Gland activity, disproving the effects of DMT on the human brain, and disproving the God Helmet, for example, that adds credence to the belief that drugs can be a spiritual tool, then I might actually respond with something that you would call a "counter".

Now, shut up, shill.
propogandapropogandapropoganda
William_the_Bloody (OP)

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04/07/2012 02:48 PM
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Re: Why Drugs cannot provide Spiritual experience (Was: Real Reason Legalizing Drugs)
Drugs can provide a glimpse into what is there, but they do not produce Enlightenment. They are useful tools to get a wider perspective and pose yourself new questions that need a life change to answer. BUT.. they are not supposed to be used over and over again, a handful of times is enough to get the message.

Tool. Not solution.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 7242673


I can agree with this. It should also only be employed by someone properly prepared to use the tool safely.

Someone who goes in and gets a full ego dump may not be able to handle what they are taught...might rally back in the 100% opposite direction just to get away from it or worse, kill themselves.

However, those truly desiring a spiritual path can safely do so by practicing the timeless spiritual disiplines of fasting, meditation, prayer and so on.

Even Christ had to deal with the Devil after fasting 40 days/nights...what does Jim-Bob and Jane have to deal with just short-cutting with some street acid?

Bad times.
William_the_Bloody (OP)

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04/07/2012 02:51 PM
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Re: Why Drugs cannot provide Spiritual experience (Was: Real Reason Legalizing Drugs)
I don't need to counter your argument because you don't know what you're talking about.

Because you're a fucking loon.

*mouth froths*

And so what if I was high? People who don't use drugs love to paint a picture of people on drugs being raving madmen, when this has been proven over and over to not be the case. Take for example the recent study by the National US Highway Safety Administration that proves that people who smoke Cannabis are safer drivers. That's far from frothing at the mouth.

Again, you're a fucking loon, and you don't know what you're talking about. Now if you respond with something that's scientifically accurate about your statement, such as disproving Pineal Gland activity, disproving the effects of DMT on the human brain, and disproving the God Helmet, for example, that adds credence to the belief that drugs can be a spiritual tool, then I might actually respond with something that you would call a "counter".

Now, shut up, shill.
propogandapropogandapropoganda
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 12244660


So your argument of "I'm a better driver because I'm high" really illustrates how drugs create genuine spiritual experiences?

Pineal Gland, DMT, God Helmet...all that stuff is fine and true, but it doesn't negate the fact that the drugs don't launch you into the space you need to be in to be in a safe place Astrally. Further, the drugs make you more receptive to spiritual deception. You do not bring along your full reasoning capacity.

What am I shilling, exactly? A shill wants you to buy something.
Anonymous Coward
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04/07/2012 02:54 PM
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Re: Why Drugs cannot provide Spiritual experience (Was: Real Reason Legalizing Drugs)
drugs no good
Monbazillac

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04/07/2012 03:00 PM
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Re: Why Drugs cannot provide Spiritual experience (Was: Real Reason Legalizing Drugs)
no need to sacrifice anything, some useless stuff must be thrown out and replaced by usefull ones = replacement for the better (change) not sacrifice (loss).

sacrifice imply suffering, hurting yourself and a lot of negative shit so stop using their fav words and be wise about the words you are using, please it's important.

if you don't work nothing will came to you, if you don't seek you will find nothing, you are the only one who can save yourself that's the real deal = to grow up into your mind, body and spirit because it's a team work.

stop poisoning yourself, respect your body.
stop dumbing yourself, nourish your mind.
stop blinding yourself, grow your spirit.

work and humility are not understood correctly too, to be humble is not to bow down like a slave and to work is about inner discipline only.

of course you are right, no shortcuts leaf boss
Anonymous Coward
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04/07/2012 03:04 PM
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Re: Why Drugs cannot provide Spiritual experience (Was: Real Reason Legalizing Drugs)
I don't need to counter your argument because you don't know what you're talking about.

Because you're a fucking loon.

*mouth froths*

And so what if I was high? People who don't use drugs love to paint a picture of people on drugs being raving madmen, when this has been proven over and over to not be the case. Take for example the recent study by the National US Highway Safety Administration that proves that people who smoke Cannabis are safer drivers. That's far from frothing at the mouth.

Again, you're a fucking loon, and you don't know what you're talking about. Now if you respond with something that's scientifically accurate about your statement, such as disproving Pineal Gland activity, disproving the effects of DMT on the human brain, and disproving the God Helmet, for example, that adds credence to the belief that drugs can be a spiritual tool, then I might actually respond with something that you would call a "counter".

Now, shut up, shill.
propogandapropogandapropoganda
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 12244660


So your argument of "I'm a better driver because I'm high" really illustrates how drugs create genuine spiritual experiences?

Pineal Gland, DMT, God Helmet...all that stuff is fine and true, but it doesn't negate the fact that the drugs don't launch you into the space you need to be in to be in a safe place Astrally. Further, the drugs make you more receptive to spiritual deception. You do not bring along your full reasoning capacity.

What am I shilling, exactly? A shill wants you to buy something.
 Quoting: William_the_Bloody


Have you taken Ayahuasca?
Have you meditated while under the effects of Cannabis?
Do you practice meditation on a daily basis?

If you did not answer yes to all of these questions then you do not know what you are talking about.

You're shilling the idea that select drugs cannot be used to reach a spiritually enlightening place, when in fact, anyone who actually does practice the very tenants of Shamanism would be able to tell you otherwise wholeheartedly.

And more importantly, one has to be ready for these types of journeys, one has to have the proper set and setting. Joe and Jane can't just take acid and expect enlightenment, but if they prepare adequately beforehand for a few weeks to months, then the drugs will do their job as tools.

Now, stap it. Shill.
Anonymous Coward
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04/07/2012 03:09 PM
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Re: Why Drugs cannot provide Spiritual experience (Was: Real Reason Legalizing Drugs)
Everyone is enlightened. See: [link to www.hallvworthington.com]
Anonymous Coward
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04/07/2012 03:12 PM
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Re: Why Drugs cannot provide Spiritual experience (Was: Real Reason Legalizing Drugs)
OP, you're a fucking loon and you don't know what you're talking about.

I bet you also had a brother die of a "weed overdose", right?

propoganda
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 12244660


I'm not the one resorting to frothing-at-the-mouth vulgarity and so forth. So far, you haven't countered with anything.

Maybe you're high right now?
 Quoting: William_the_Bloody


i take more than my fair share of psychadelics and op knows exactly what he is talking about.
Anonymous Coward
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04/07/2012 03:21 PM
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Re: Why Drugs cannot provide Spiritual experience (Was: Real Reason Legalizing Drugs)
This one of the dumbest threads/notions I've ever seen posted on GLP.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 7659486


clappa
William_the_Bloody (OP)

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04/07/2012 03:30 PM
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Re: Why Drugs cannot provide Spiritual experience (Was: Real Reason Legalizing Drugs)
You're shilling the idea that select drugs cannot be used to reach a spiritually enlightening place, when in fact, anyone who actually does practice the very tenants of Shamanism would be able to tell you otherwise wholeheartedly.


Now, stap it. Shill.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 12244660


I would argue that Shaminism has led some cultures into some pretty dark, unenlightened shit that benefits Demonic Astral Entities VERY MUCH.

In fact, your overall tone and rabidness suggests you would be highly susceptible to negative Astral influence.
Anonymous Coward
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04/07/2012 03:32 PM
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Re: Why Drugs cannot provide Spiritual experience (Was: Real Reason Legalizing Drugs)
You are clearly Anti-Marijuana by reading the last forum and this one! What problem do you have with the plant? Some people enjoy it and some don't, just like alcohol. Cannabis has been given a bad name by the media because of its medicinal purposes and is classified as a type 3 drug along side of cocaine and LSD which is absolutely insane. Cannabis is completely harmless and less destructive by far then most if not all legalized drugs. I respect your opinion to be against the plant but you don't need to try to force your opinions on other people who enjoy the plant!

Marijuana should at least be decriminalized and moved to a type 2 or type 1 drug, People who smoke once in a while are not murderers or criminals and do not belong in jail! The plant was taken a way from us because it is to easily accessible to the public, especially to take it medicinally. Please go do your research on the plant and please don't watch no stupid history channel or discovery channel crap, go watch the unbiased views of real scientists providing real scientific facts! Don't be a sheep

Drugs cant provide spiritual experiences unless your into some heavy stuff like DMT or LSD then you might see some stuff but im for sure marijuana will not provide any kind of spiritual experience!
Anonymous Coward
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04/07/2012 03:34 PM
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Re: Why Drugs cannot provide Spiritual experience (Was: Real Reason Legalizing Drugs)
i take more than my fair share of psychadelics
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 13947866


There's your problem.

Less is more.

And it's "psychedelics".
Anonymous Coward
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04/07/2012 03:35 PM
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Re: Why Drugs cannot provide Spiritual experience (Was: Real Reason Legalizing Drugs)
**EDIT**

Drugs can help you reach your spiritual experience but only if you are trying to reach that experience. Someone who uses marijuana casually will not reach that experience, but someone who would smoke and then meditate and try to contact an entity will because they are calling for that and the marijuana would help to relax! But then again they could most likely do that same experience without the marijuana

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