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Christians: We are not under the law of the Old Testament....................

 
Sir Phydeau

User ID: 5465427
United States
05/01/2012 05:24 AM
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Re: Christians: We are not under the law of the Old Testament....................
Forgive me my frustration. I parted company for a bit so that I would not act on my own frustration and "take it out on you".

Simple answer: I don't know.

There.

Your repeatedly rephrasing the same question over and over when I gave you the best answer I could ... well, it felt more like someone trying to back me into a corner than genuine curiosity. Perhaps I misinterpreted this.
 Quoting: Sir Phydeau


Well the thread is about Christians not being under the old testament law (Law of Moses). So if some of those other people want to say that they are under the Law of Moses, and that Christians are wrong for not being under the Law of Moses, they should be able to explain how their theories are superior to Christianity.

But instead of a clear explanation, that other guy just contradicted himself repeatedly. That's a bad sign.

At first he posted what Jesus said about how there would be no change to the Law of Moses, then he posted repeatedly telling people about changes to the Law of Moses, and said Jesus did it. So it made me wonder: where does the bible say that the Law of Moses got changed?

Now if you don't believe that the Law of Moses got changed, of course you would not be able to find the statement of changes in the bible. Just like I don't believe that Jesus changed the Law of Moses, and I cannot find in the bible that it says that the Law of Moses was changed, altered, modified, etc.

It seems like some people (not you, don't get offended) change their theory with each post, and don't seem to care if the changes contradict what they posted before.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 15345578


Very eloquently and concisely stated, sir.

I'd like to add, it seems VERY difficult for most people to utter the words "I don't know" and more rare, "I was wrong".

That adds a lot to the bumping of heads I often see on these threads.
"When the facts change, I change my mind. What do you do, sir?" — John M. Keynes
"The way to see by [blind] faith is to shut the eye of reason." - Benjamin Franklin
The Self Defining Hebrew System: [link to www.thechronicleproject.org]
Real men keep Torah.
Knighted into the Army of Yahuwah on 10-9-10.

Avinu shebashamayim, yitkadesh shimkha. Tavo malkhutekha ye'aseh r'tzonekha ba'aretz ka'asher na'asah vashamayimTen-lanu haiyom lechem chukeinu. u'selach-lanu et-ashmateinu ka'asher solechim anachnu la'asher ashmu lanu. Ve'al-tevieinu lidei massah, ki im-hatsileinu min-hara. Ki lekha ha-mamlakha vehagevurah veha-tiferet l'olemei olamim. Amen.
Sir Phydeau

User ID: 5465427
United States
05/01/2012 05:27 AM
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Re: Christians: We are not under the law of the Old Testament....................
...


LAW keepers..GRACE beleivers..CATHOLICS..Messianics..could ALL of you..PLEASE..


JUST FOR ONCE SHUT THE FUCK UP!!!!


SHIT..at the rate YOU lot of childish useless fucks carry on..people will LONG to go to hell..will BEG for it..


CAUSE IT WILL BE BETTER THAN SPENDING AN ETERNITY WITH ALL YOU ARGUING CHILDISH IGNORANT HATE FILLED USELESS FUCKS!
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 13891991


Filth mouth has arrived. He loves to shock but it's not
a shock even with the CAPS.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 14488282


He made a good point though.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 15189875


Christians Hate good points.

They hurt too much.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 14331313


Generalizing dude is generalizing.

:P
"When the facts change, I change my mind. What do you do, sir?" — John M. Keynes
"The way to see by [blind] faith is to shut the eye of reason." - Benjamin Franklin
The Self Defining Hebrew System: [link to www.thechronicleproject.org]
Real men keep Torah.
Knighted into the Army of Yahuwah on 10-9-10.

Avinu shebashamayim, yitkadesh shimkha. Tavo malkhutekha ye'aseh r'tzonekha ba'aretz ka'asher na'asah vashamayimTen-lanu haiyom lechem chukeinu. u'selach-lanu et-ashmateinu ka'asher solechim anachnu la'asher ashmu lanu. Ve'al-tevieinu lidei massah, ki im-hatsileinu min-hara. Ki lekha ha-mamlakha vehagevurah veha-tiferet l'olemei olamim. Amen.
Anonymous Coward
User ID: 14331313
Australia
05/01/2012 05:32 AM
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Re: Christians: We are not under the law of the Old Testament....................
...


Filth mouth has arrived. He loves to shock but it's not
a shock even with the CAPS.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 14488282


He made a good point though.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 15189875


Christians Hate good points.

They hurt too much.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 14331313


Generalizing dude is generalizing.

:P
 Quoting: Sir Phydeau


True.

But when 99% of the christians ARE being argumentative, child minded idiots setting an utterly rotten example of love and patience as Jesus taught them to do, and then someone comes along sick of the crap and spells it out for what it is, and all but one or two out of all the christians get all upset because they have been exposed for the total hypocrites they are, then its ok to be general.

Because IN general, as in 99% of christians..ARE useless argumentative, childsish, selfish, self rightous, know it all, must be right at all costs, IDIOTS.
Anonymous Coward
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Australia
05/01/2012 05:35 AM
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Re: Christians: We are not under the law of the Old Testament....................
Jesus is from the order of Melchizedek, not a Levite.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 13479329


THAT's the word I misspelled earlier! Thank you!
 Quoting: Sir Phydeau


For more information about Jesus the High Priest, please read Hebrews 6:13-8:6.

For more about the Sacrifice of Jesus, please read Hebrews 9:1-10:24.


If therefore perfection were by the Levitical priesthood, (for under it the people received the law,) what further need was there that another priest should rise after the order of Melchisedec, and not be called after the order of Aaron?
-- Hebrews 7:11


So Christ was once offered to bear the sins of many; and unto them that look for him shall he appear the second time without sin unto salvation.
-- Hebrews 9:28
Sir Phydeau

User ID: 5465427
United States
05/01/2012 05:39 AM
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He made a good point though.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 15189875


Christians Hate good points.

They hurt too much.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 14331313


Generalizing dude is generalizing.

:P
 Quoting: Sir Phydeau


True.

But when 99% of the christians ARE being argumentative, child minded idiots setting an utterly rotten example of love and patience as Jesus taught them to do, and then someone comes along sick of the crap and spells it out for what it is, and all but one or two out of all the christians get all upset because they have been exposed for the total hypocrites they are, then its ok to be general.

Because IN general, as in 99% of christians..ARE useless argumentative, childsish, selfish, self rightous, know it all, must be right at all costs, IDIOTS.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 14331313


Was just givin' ya crap for a laugh. Hence the :P

Believe me, I understand. Spent a decade as an atheist and even now that I've re-found my faith (or more accurately, it found me) it seems I'm constantly running into "Oh, you're a believer now, that's great. Wait, you OBEY?!?! Whaaaaa? That's HORRIBLE!"

Never satisfied, it seems.
"When the facts change, I change my mind. What do you do, sir?" — John M. Keynes
"The way to see by [blind] faith is to shut the eye of reason." - Benjamin Franklin
The Self Defining Hebrew System: [link to www.thechronicleproject.org]
Real men keep Torah.
Knighted into the Army of Yahuwah on 10-9-10.

Avinu shebashamayim, yitkadesh shimkha. Tavo malkhutekha ye'aseh r'tzonekha ba'aretz ka'asher na'asah vashamayimTen-lanu haiyom lechem chukeinu. u'selach-lanu et-ashmateinu ka'asher solechim anachnu la'asher ashmu lanu. Ve'al-tevieinu lidei massah, ki im-hatsileinu min-hara. Ki lekha ha-mamlakha vehagevurah veha-tiferet l'olemei olamim. Amen.
Sir Phydeau

User ID: 5465427
United States
05/01/2012 05:47 AM
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Re: Christians: We are not under the law of the Old Testament....................
AS for the sacrifice questions, this is the best answer I can find online. I'm still not 100% satisfied with it so, I'm sure I'll continue to research for a while.

[link to www.straightdope.com]

It's basically a very long, drawn out "because the Temple was destroyed in 70 AD" ... but at least it teaches a bit of history and such.
"When the facts change, I change my mind. What do you do, sir?" — John M. Keynes
"The way to see by [blind] faith is to shut the eye of reason." - Benjamin Franklin
The Self Defining Hebrew System: [link to www.thechronicleproject.org]
Real men keep Torah.
Knighted into the Army of Yahuwah on 10-9-10.

Avinu shebashamayim, yitkadesh shimkha. Tavo malkhutekha ye'aseh r'tzonekha ba'aretz ka'asher na'asah vashamayimTen-lanu haiyom lechem chukeinu. u'selach-lanu et-ashmateinu ka'asher solechim anachnu la'asher ashmu lanu. Ve'al-tevieinu lidei massah, ki im-hatsileinu min-hara. Ki lekha ha-mamlakha vehagevurah veha-tiferet l'olemei olamim. Amen.
Anonymous Coward
User ID: 1313099
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05/01/2012 08:03 AM
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Re: Christians: We are not under the law of the Old Testament....................
...



shut up, seriously.
i have never promoted any of those things.
you are seriously disturbed.
quit stalking me.
i continue to report your stalking abusive posts.
soon you will be gone.
 Quoting: Salt


I was here first oh wise seminary student. You stop following me with your.... tomato

Your sodomy thread to ask is sodomy okay? Ahhh....shouldn't
you know by now?

"shut up" isn't lady like.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 14488282


ignoring you. and will continue to report your abusive posts.

everyone else... feel free to visit my threads and see that quite the contrary is the case. i do not promote sodomy. this man is abusive and sick and likes to pick on women at GLP
 Quoting: Salt


She's not a man. Her name is Mary. She stalks any and all threads that contain anything about the Law because she despises Torah observant followers.

Just watch her maniacal glee when she's trolling. It's obvious she longs for the days when she could declare us heretics and murder us, just like the "good ol' days"

:crusade:

She'll most likely be leaving you alone on this thread now that I'm here. She knows I have a temper and will continue to poke at me in the hopes she'll get a negative reaction.

She's in for a surprise, though. His strength has assisted me in become a FAR calmer person than I was 2 years ago when she started her crusade.

I'm just gonna not reply to her and act like she's not even here. Watch how she starts spamming the thread for attention. It'll be epic lulz.
 Quoting: Sir Phydeau


i hear ya. OPs need to bring the ban hammer down to keep her out, and report abusive posts.

BAN HER AT THE STAKE!
Sir Phydeau

User ID: 5465427
United States
05/01/2012 08:09 AM
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Re: Christians: We are not under the law of the Old Testament....................
i hear ya. OPs need to bring the ban hammer down to keep her out, and report abusive posts.

BAN HER AT THE STAKE!
 Quoting: Salt


Her and I have about a 2 year history of going back and forth on religious crap.

When I converted from atheism she was on the 120+ thread I'd made to discuss issues of faith and such.

She had read I was raised Catholic and has been obsessed with getting me to return to HER faith using such arrogant statements as "One True Faith".

Way back then, my temper was mostly unchecked. It just flowed like hot lava, so, I often "tore her apart" brutally. So, she's somewhat justified in her grudge.

Then the day came that I must have tried for 8 or 10 pages to meet in the middle with her and she was having no part of it.

All that crap said, I don't think I'd ever ban her from one of my threads. She has just as much right to express herself as anyone else ... and there's trolls on here that are FAR, FAR worse.

I'm truly hoping that tonight she and I made progress towards a peace between us. Because honestly, peace is what I seek.
"When the facts change, I change my mind. What do you do, sir?" — John M. Keynes
"The way to see by [blind] faith is to shut the eye of reason." - Benjamin Franklin
The Self Defining Hebrew System: [link to www.thechronicleproject.org]
Real men keep Torah.
Knighted into the Army of Yahuwah on 10-9-10.

Avinu shebashamayim, yitkadesh shimkha. Tavo malkhutekha ye'aseh r'tzonekha ba'aretz ka'asher na'asah vashamayimTen-lanu haiyom lechem chukeinu. u'selach-lanu et-ashmateinu ka'asher solechim anachnu la'asher ashmu lanu. Ve'al-tevieinu lidei massah, ki im-hatsileinu min-hara. Ki lekha ha-mamlakha vehagevurah veha-tiferet l'olemei olamim. Amen.
Anonymous Coward
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05/01/2012 08:11 AM
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Re: Christians: We are not under the law of the Old Testament....................
of course you cant follow the old testament.. that is a horor book of fairy tails.. it will scare the kidos.. Besides you dont want to be like the muzzies do you
Sir Phydeau

User ID: 5465427
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05/01/2012 08:15 AM
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Re: Christians: We are not under the law of the Old Testament....................
of course you cant follow the old testament.. that is a horor book of fairy tails.. it will scare the kidos.. Besides you dont want to be like the muzzies do you
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 15334105


fairies have tails?
"When the facts change, I change my mind. What do you do, sir?" — John M. Keynes
"The way to see by [blind] faith is to shut the eye of reason." - Benjamin Franklin
The Self Defining Hebrew System: [link to www.thechronicleproject.org]
Real men keep Torah.
Knighted into the Army of Yahuwah on 10-9-10.

Avinu shebashamayim, yitkadesh shimkha. Tavo malkhutekha ye'aseh r'tzonekha ba'aretz ka'asher na'asah vashamayimTen-lanu haiyom lechem chukeinu. u'selach-lanu et-ashmateinu ka'asher solechim anachnu la'asher ashmu lanu. Ve'al-tevieinu lidei massah, ki im-hatsileinu min-hara. Ki lekha ha-mamlakha vehagevurah veha-tiferet l'olemei olamim. Amen.
Anonymous Coward
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United States
05/01/2012 08:18 AM
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Re: Christians: We are not under the law of the Old Testament....................
i hear ya. OPs need to bring the ban hammer down to keep her out, and report abusive posts.

BAN HER AT THE STAKE!
 Quoting: Salt


Her and I have about a 2 year history of going back and forth on religious crap.

When I converted from atheism she was on the 120+ thread I'd made to discuss issues of faith and such.

She had read I was raised Catholic and has been obsessed with getting me to return to HER faith using such arrogant statements as "One True Faith".

Way back then, my temper was mostly unchecked. It just flowed like hot lava, so, I often "tore her apart" brutally. So, she's somewhat justified in her grudge.

Then the day came that I must have tried for 8 or 10 pages to meet in the middle with her and she was having no part of it.

All that crap said, I don't think I'd ever ban her from one of my threads. She has just as much right to express herself as anyone else ... and there's trolls on here that are FAR, FAR worse.

I'm truly hoping that tonight she and I made progress towards a peace between us. Because honestly, peace is what I seek.
 Quoting: Sir Phydeau


her tactics, delivery, and things she chooses to say suggest a very disturbed person.
Sir Phydeau

User ID: 5465427
United States
05/01/2012 08:20 AM
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Re: Christians: We are not under the law of the Old Testament....................
i hear ya. OPs need to bring the ban hammer down to keep her out, and report abusive posts.

BAN HER AT THE STAKE!
 Quoting: Salt


Her and I have about a 2 year history of going back and forth on religious crap.

When I converted from atheism she was on the 120+ thread I'd made to discuss issues of faith and such.

She had read I was raised Catholic and has been obsessed with getting me to return to HER faith using such arrogant statements as "One True Faith".

Way back then, my temper was mostly unchecked. It just flowed like hot lava, so, I often "tore her apart" brutally. So, she's somewhat justified in her grudge.

Then the day came that I must have tried for 8 or 10 pages to meet in the middle with her and she was having no part of it.

All that crap said, I don't think I'd ever ban her from one of my threads. She has just as much right to express herself as anyone else ... and there's trolls on here that are FAR, FAR worse.

I'm truly hoping that tonight she and I made progress towards a peace between us. Because honestly, peace is what I seek.
 Quoting: Sir Phydeau


her tactics, delivery, and things she chooses to say suggest a very disturbed person.
 Quoting: Salt


She's a LOT smarter than she lets on. She'll intentionally state things she knows gets a negative reaction then plays it off under the guise that she's totally innocent and only trying to help.

It's really funny when you actually think about it.

Pretty tactful, too.
"When the facts change, I change my mind. What do you do, sir?" — John M. Keynes
"The way to see by [blind] faith is to shut the eye of reason." - Benjamin Franklin
The Self Defining Hebrew System: [link to www.thechronicleproject.org]
Real men keep Torah.
Knighted into the Army of Yahuwah on 10-9-10.

Avinu shebashamayim, yitkadesh shimkha. Tavo malkhutekha ye'aseh r'tzonekha ba'aretz ka'asher na'asah vashamayimTen-lanu haiyom lechem chukeinu. u'selach-lanu et-ashmateinu ka'asher solechim anachnu la'asher ashmu lanu. Ve'al-tevieinu lidei massah, ki im-hatsileinu min-hara. Ki lekha ha-mamlakha vehagevurah veha-tiferet l'olemei olamim. Amen.
Anonymous Coward
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Israel
05/01/2012 08:31 AM
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Re: Christians: We are not under the law of the Old Testament....................
The premise Christians: We are not under the law of the Old Testament....................


is silly


Sure some Romans like the first pope might have wanted you to believe that but Jesus says :


“The teachers of the law and the Pharisees sit in Moses’ seat.

So you must obey them and do everything they tell you.

(Matthew 23:2-3)


Sure sounds like Jesus was teaching people to follow Jewish law as taught by the Pharisees


CHRISTIANS LOVE TO IGNORE THIS TEACHING
Sir Phydeau

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05/01/2012 08:36 AM
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Re: Christians: We are not under the law of the Old Testament....................
The premise Christians: We are not under the law of the Old Testament....................


is silly


Sure some Romans like the first pope might have wanted you to believe that but Jesus says :


“The teachers of the law and the Pharisees sit in Moses’ seat.

So you must obey them and do everything they tell you.

(Matthew 23:2-3)


Sure sounds like Jesus was teaching people to follow Jewish law as taught by the Pharisees


CHRISTIANS LOVE TO IGNORE THIS TEACHING
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 15353747


In Shem Tov's Hebrew Matthew (many scholars believe Matthew was actually written in Hebrew, the many, many, many Hebrew word puns contained within support this) says, "Do has he says" not "Do as they say".

Amazing how one little word can change the whole meaning of the statement.

How the "bible is inerrant" folks resolve this for themselves, I know not.
"When the facts change, I change my mind. What do you do, sir?" — John M. Keynes
"The way to see by [blind] faith is to shut the eye of reason." - Benjamin Franklin
The Self Defining Hebrew System: [link to www.thechronicleproject.org]
Real men keep Torah.
Knighted into the Army of Yahuwah on 10-9-10.

Avinu shebashamayim, yitkadesh shimkha. Tavo malkhutekha ye'aseh r'tzonekha ba'aretz ka'asher na'asah vashamayimTen-lanu haiyom lechem chukeinu. u'selach-lanu et-ashmateinu ka'asher solechim anachnu la'asher ashmu lanu. Ve'al-tevieinu lidei massah, ki im-hatsileinu min-hara. Ki lekha ha-mamlakha vehagevurah veha-tiferet l'olemei olamim. Amen.
eh steve

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05/01/2012 11:24 AM
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Re: Christians: We are not under the law of the Old Testament....................
“Mosaic Law”… “The Law of Moses” … what …?

1. Moses had no rules or “laws” of his own. 2. Moses was a scribe and he wrote down the Towrah of Yahowah. 3. Although most often translated as “LAW”, In Hebrew, Towrah is better translated into English as teaching, instructions and guidance.

Man loves to throw around words like, “KEEP”, “DO” and “OBEY” yet the Hebrew words they come from, Shamar and Shama’ more accurately translate to Observe and Listen.

Yahowah has given “all” men, created in His likeness the same three gifts… Life, Freewill and a Conscience (the ability to learn and to know right from wrong).

He does not demand that you choose to engage in a relationship with Him. He does not demand that you obey Him. He does not demand that you worship Him. Yet He does have a few conditions if you choose to engage in a relationship with Him the results of which are highly beneficial to the person choosing to walk towardHim.

“Yahowah’s Towrah (Towrah – written instruction and teaching, source of direction and guidance) is complete and entirely perfect (tamym – without defect, lacking nothing, correct, sound, genuine, right, helpful, healing, beneficial, and true), returning, restoring, and transforming (suwb – turning around, bringing back, changing, and renewing) the soul (nepesh – consciousness). Yahowah’s testimony (‘eduwth – witness) is trustworthy and reliable (‘aman – verifiable, confirming, supportive, and establishing), making understanding and obtaining wisdom (hakam – educating and enlightening to the point of comprehension) simple for the open-minded (pethy).” (Psalm 19:7)
KlLLUMINATI (OP)

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05/01/2012 11:53 AM
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Re: Christians: We are not under the law of the Old Testament....................
The premise Christians: We are not under the law of the Old Testament....................


is silly


Sure some Romans like the first pope might have wanted you to believe that but Jesus says :


“The teachers of the law and the Pharisees sit in Moses’ seat.

So you must obey them and do everything they tell you.

(Matthew 23:2-3)


Sure sounds like Jesus was teaching people to follow Jewish law as taught by the Pharisees


CHRISTIANS LOVE TO IGNORE THIS TEACHING
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 15353747



The change in laws is discussed at length in the letter to the Hebrews. In Hebrews 1:1-2 the author says "God, after He spoke long ago to the fathers in the prophets in many portions and in many ways, in these last days has spoken to us in his Son whom He appointed heir of all things, through whom also He made the world." God has changed the manner in which he directs his people. This change was foretold in Jeremiah 31:31-34: "Behold days are coming," declares the LORD, "when I will make a new covenant with the house of Israel and with the house of Judah not like the covenant which I made with their fathers in the day I took them by the hand to bring them out of the land of Egypt, My covenant which they broke, although I was a husband to them," declares the LORD. "But this is the covenant which I will make with the house of Israel after those days," declares the LORD, "I will put My law within them and on their heart I will write it, and I will be their God, and they shall be My people. They will not teach again, each man his neighbor and each man his brother, saying, 'Know the LORD, for they will all know me, from the least of them to the greatest of them," declares the LORD, "for I will forgive their iniquity, and their sin I will remember no more." "Notice that God said the covenant(testament) would be different from the law given at Mt Sinai. Why would God change his law? Did he change his mind? No. The change in the law was planned from the very beginning. Before the world was created, God planned to send his Son and that through Jesus we would obtain salvation I Peter 1:19-20, II Timothy 1:9, II Thessalonians 2: 13-14. Such a salvation through Christ could not take place under the law given by Moses.

Romans 15:4 tells us that OT was written for our learning to bring us patience and hope. It contains examples for us so that we will not be caught unaware and make the same mistakes that the Israelites made I Corinthians 10:1-12. In Galatians 3:24-25, we find that the OT is our teacher, to bring us to Christ. Now that Christ has come, we are no longer under its dominion. So we see that we can learn from the examples found in the OT, but when we must determine what God would have us to do today we must turn to his current will the NT.

[link to carm.org]
[link to www.letusreason.org]
She just goes a little mad sometimes. We all go a little mad sometimes. Haven't you?
-Norman Bates

I think that rich people should live like poor people, and poor people should live like rich people, and change every week....
-Tupac Shakur

Somebody help me, tell me where to go from here cause even Thugs cry, but do the Lord care?
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I don't have no fear of death. My only fear is coming back reincarnated.
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Anonymous Coward
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05/01/2012 12:14 PM
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Re: Christians: We are not under the law of the Old Testament....................
There seems to be some confusion about whether or not the OT is to be followed. A testament is a will or a covenant. We still use the word today when we speak of a person's "last will and testament." These names indicate that the Bible is composed of two wills of God an old will and a new will.

The change in wills is discussed in the letter to the Hebrews. In Hebrews 1:1-2, the author says, "God after He spoke long ago to the fathers in the prophets in many portions and in many ways, in these last days has spoken to us in His Son, whom He appointed heir of all things, through whom also He made the world." God has changed the manner in which he directs his people. This change was told in Jeremiah 31:31-34: "Behold, days are coming," declares the LORD, "when I will make a new covenant with the house of Israel and with the house of Judah, not like the covenant which I made with their fathers in the day I took them by the hand to bring them out of the land of Egypt, My covenant which they broke, although I was a husband to them," declares the LORD.

The OT is still a part of our bibles because it contains examples for us so that we will not be caught unaware and make the same mistakes that the Israelites made we find that the Old Law(OT) is our teacher to bring us to Christ. Now that Christ has come we are no longer under it. We see that we can learn from the examples found in the Old Testament but when we must determine what God would have us to do today, we must turn to his current will which is the NT.

[link to www.gotquestions.org]




churchlady
 Quoting: KlLLUMINATI


The New Testament is just about MONEY, after you clear away the bullshit, astrozombie assimilation, astrology and buddah rip offs. The real deal is Mathew 21:12

The New TESTAMENTS 11th commandmenT:

"Thou shalt not FUCK with the Moneychangers"

Then Revelations discusses currency. Dont worry, you have ALREADY accepted the "number of the beast" because you use it every day: it is PAPER CURRENCY.

And yes, it effects your soul; you end up doing ANYTHING for money. It demonizes those who are behind the control of money; and reinforces the instinct that one is OVERWEALMED by... you guessed it...

the moneychangers. BANKERS.

So you see, after all the bullshit is cleared, its all about the MONEY.
KlLLUMINATI (OP)

User ID: 11546392
United States
05/01/2012 12:19 PM
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Re: Christians: We are not under the law of the Old Testament....................
There seems to be some confusion about whether or not the OT is to be followed. A testament is a will or a covenant. We still use the word today when we speak of a person's "last will and testament." These names indicate that the Bible is composed of two wills of God an old will and a new will.

The change in wills is discussed in the letter to the Hebrews. In Hebrews 1:1-2, the author says, "God after He spoke long ago to the fathers in the prophets in many portions and in many ways, in these last days has spoken to us in His Son, whom He appointed heir of all things, through whom also He made the world." God has changed the manner in which he directs his people. This change was told in Jeremiah 31:31-34: "Behold, days are coming," declares the LORD, "when I will make a new covenant with the house of Israel and with the house of Judah, not like the covenant which I made with their fathers in the day I took them by the hand to bring them out of the land of Egypt, My covenant which they broke, although I was a husband to them," declares the LORD.

The OT is still a part of our bibles because it contains examples for us so that we will not be caught unaware and make the same mistakes that the Israelites made we find that the Old Law(OT) is our teacher to bring us to Christ. Now that Christ has come we are no longer under it. We see that we can learn from the examples found in the Old Testament but when we must determine what God would have us to do today, we must turn to his current will which is the NT.

[link to www.gotquestions.org]




churchlady
 Quoting: KlLLUMINATI


The New Testament is just about MONEY, after you clear away the bullshit, astrozombie assimilation, astrology and buddah rip offs. The real deal is Mathew 21:12

The New TESTAMENTS 11th commandmenT:

"Thou shalt not FUCK with the Moneychangers"

Then Revelations discusses currency. Dont worry, you have ALREADY accepted the "number of the beast" because you use it every day: it is PAPER CURRENCY.

And yes, it effects your soul; you end up doing ANYTHING for money. It demonizes those who are behind the control of money; and reinforces the instinct that one is OVERWEALMED by... you guessed it...

the moneychangers. BANKERS.

So you see, after all the bullshit is cleared, its all about the MONEY.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 6231580



So are you saying we should stone homosexuals because that is one of the old laws.

[link to www.swartzentrover.com]
She just goes a little mad sometimes. We all go a little mad sometimes. Haven't you?
-Norman Bates

I think that rich people should live like poor people, and poor people should live like rich people, and change every week....
-Tupac Shakur

Somebody help me, tell me where to go from here cause even Thugs cry, but do the Lord care?
-Tupac Shakur

I don't have no fear of death. My only fear is coming back reincarnated.
-Tupac Shakur

I believe in human beings, and that all human beings should be respected as such, regardless of their color.
-Malcolm X

A man who stands for nothing will fall for anything.
-Malcolm X

When there’s no more room in Hell, the dead will walk the Earth.
-Dawn of the Dead

What an excellent day for an exorcism.
-The Exorcist
Sir Phydeau

User ID: 5465427
United States
05/01/2012 01:25 PM
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Re: Christians: We are not under the law of the Old Testament....................
There seems to be some confusion about whether or not the OT is to be followed. A testament is a will or a covenant. We still use the word today when we speak of a person's "last will and testament." These names indicate that the Bible is composed of two wills of God an old will and a new will.

The change in wills is discussed in the letter to the Hebrews. In Hebrews 1:1-2, the author says, "God after He spoke long ago to the fathers in the prophets in many portions and in many ways, in these last days has spoken to us in His Son, whom He appointed heir of all things, through whom also He made the world." God has changed the manner in which he directs his people. This change was told in Jeremiah 31:31-34: "Behold, days are coming," declares the LORD, "when I will make a new covenant with the house of Israel and with the house of Judah, not like the covenant which I made with their fathers in the day I took them by the hand to bring them out of the land of Egypt, My covenant which they broke, although I was a husband to them," declares the LORD.

The OT is still a part of our bibles because it contains examples for us so that we will not be caught unaware and make the same mistakes that the Israelites made we find that the Old Law(OT) is our teacher to bring us to Christ. Now that Christ has come we are no longer under it. We see that we can learn from the examples found in the Old Testament but when we must determine what God would have us to do today, we must turn to his current will which is the NT.

[link to www.gotquestions.org]




churchlady
 Quoting: KlLLUMINATI


The New Testament is just about MONEY, after you clear away the bullshit, astrozombie assimilation, astrology and buddah rip offs. The real deal is Mathew 21:12

The New TESTAMENTS 11th commandmenT:

"Thou shalt not FUCK with the Moneychangers"

Then Revelations discusses currency. Dont worry, you have ALREADY accepted the "number of the beast" because you use it every day: it is PAPER CURRENCY.

And yes, it effects your soul; you end up doing ANYTHING for money. It demonizes those who are behind the control of money; and reinforces the instinct that one is OVERWEALMED by... you guessed it...

the moneychangers. BANKERS.

So you see, after all the bullshit is cleared, its all about the MONEY.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 6231580



So are you saying we should stone homosexuals because that is one of the old laws.

[link to www.swartzentrover.com]
 Quoting: KlLLUMINATI


There is no sanhedrin. To think that Hebrews ran around with rocks in their pockets is like thinking that Texans run around with electric chairs in their pockets.

Stoning was a direction to the judges of the sanhedrin.
"When the facts change, I change my mind. What do you do, sir?" — John M. Keynes
"The way to see by [blind] faith is to shut the eye of reason." - Benjamin Franklin
The Self Defining Hebrew System: [link to www.thechronicleproject.org]
Real men keep Torah.
Knighted into the Army of Yahuwah on 10-9-10.

Avinu shebashamayim, yitkadesh shimkha. Tavo malkhutekha ye'aseh r'tzonekha ba'aretz ka'asher na'asah vashamayimTen-lanu haiyom lechem chukeinu. u'selach-lanu et-ashmateinu ka'asher solechim anachnu la'asher ashmu lanu. Ve'al-tevieinu lidei massah, ki im-hatsileinu min-hara. Ki lekha ha-mamlakha vehagevurah veha-tiferet l'olemei olamim. Amen.
Anonymous Coward
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05/01/2012 01:53 PM
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Re: Christians: We are not under the law of the Old Testament....................
I am so glad the I am not a Christian.
Sir Phydeau

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05/01/2012 02:01 PM
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Re: Christians: We are not under the law of the Old Testament....................
I am so glad the I am not a Christian.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 3632012


Me too, I'm glad you're not either.

Just kidding :P
"When the facts change, I change my mind. What do you do, sir?" — John M. Keynes
"The way to see by [blind] faith is to shut the eye of reason." - Benjamin Franklin
The Self Defining Hebrew System: [link to www.thechronicleproject.org]
Real men keep Torah.
Knighted into the Army of Yahuwah on 10-9-10.

Avinu shebashamayim, yitkadesh shimkha. Tavo malkhutekha ye'aseh r'tzonekha ba'aretz ka'asher na'asah vashamayimTen-lanu haiyom lechem chukeinu. u'selach-lanu et-ashmateinu ka'asher solechim anachnu la'asher ashmu lanu. Ve'al-tevieinu lidei massah, ki im-hatsileinu min-hara. Ki lekha ha-mamlakha vehagevurah veha-tiferet l'olemei olamim. Amen.
Sir Phydeau

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05/01/2012 02:04 PM
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Re: Christians: We are not under the law of the Old Testament....................
“Yahowah’s Towrah (Towrah – written instruction and teaching, source of direction and guidance) is complete and entirely perfect (tamym – without defect, lacking nothing, correct, sound, genuine, right, helpful, healing, beneficial, and true), returning, restoring, and transforming (suwb – turning around, bringing back, changing, and renewing) the soul (nepesh – consciousness). Yahowah’s testimony (‘eduwth – witness) is trustworthy and reliable (‘aman – verifiable, confirming, supportive, and establishing), making understanding and obtaining wisdom (hakam – educating and enlightening to the point of comprehension) simple for the open-minded (pethy).” (Psalm 19:7)
 Quoting: eh steve


That was beautiful.
"When the facts change, I change my mind. What do you do, sir?" — John M. Keynes
"The way to see by [blind] faith is to shut the eye of reason." - Benjamin Franklin
The Self Defining Hebrew System: [link to www.thechronicleproject.org]
Real men keep Torah.
Knighted into the Army of Yahuwah on 10-9-10.

Avinu shebashamayim, yitkadesh shimkha. Tavo malkhutekha ye'aseh r'tzonekha ba'aretz ka'asher na'asah vashamayimTen-lanu haiyom lechem chukeinu. u'selach-lanu et-ashmateinu ka'asher solechim anachnu la'asher ashmu lanu. Ve'al-tevieinu lidei massah, ki im-hatsileinu min-hara. Ki lekha ha-mamlakha vehagevurah veha-tiferet l'olemei olamim. Amen.
Sir Phydeau

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05/01/2012 02:33 PM
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Re: Christians: We are not under the law of the Old Testament....................
1) “For truly, I say to you, till heaven and earth pass away, not an iota, not a dot, will pass the law until all is accomplished. Whoever then relaxes one of the least of these commandments and teaches men so, shall be called least in the kingdom of heaven; but he who does them and teaches them shall be called great in the kingdom of heaven.” (Matthew 5:18-19 RSV) Clearly the Old Testament is to be abided by until the end of human existence itself. None other then Jesus said so.

2) All of the vicious Old Testament laws will be binding forever. "It is easier for Heaven and Earth to pass away than for the smallest part of the letter of the law to become invalid." (Luke 16:17 NAB)

3) Jesus strongly approves of the law and the prophets. He hasn’t the slightest objection to the cruelties of the Old Testament. "Do not think that I have come to abolish the law or the prophets. I have come not to abolish but to fulfill. Amen, I say to you, until heaven and earth pass away, not the smallest part or the smallest part of a letter will pass from the law, until all things have taken place." (Matthew 5:17 NAB)

3b) "All scripture is inspired by God and is useful for teaching, for refutation, for correction, and for training in righteousness..." (2 Timothy 3:16 NAB)

3c) "Know this first of all, that there is no prophecy of scripture that is a matter of personal interpretation, for no prophecy ever came through human will; but rather human beings moved by the holy Spirit spoke under the influence of God." (2 Peter 20-21 NAB)

4) Jesus criticizes the jewish people for not killing their disobedient children according to Old Testament law. Mark.7:9-13 "Whoever curses father or mother shall die" (Mark 7:10 NAB)
 Quoting: DOUBLE-U-TEE-EFF??


erp derp?

Ah!

Derp.

Seems you feel you have an axe to grind. Sorry that someone has hurt you in the past and you feel a need to hold such negative bias over it. I really mean that.

EDIT: Wow, someone gave you negative karma for being a tobacco user? Sheesh, people get their panties in a bunch here for almost anything these days.

Last Edited by Sir Phydeau on 05/01/2012 02:35 PM
"When the facts change, I change my mind. What do you do, sir?" — John M. Keynes
"The way to see by [blind] faith is to shut the eye of reason." - Benjamin Franklin
The Self Defining Hebrew System: [link to www.thechronicleproject.org]
Real men keep Torah.
Knighted into the Army of Yahuwah on 10-9-10.

Avinu shebashamayim, yitkadesh shimkha. Tavo malkhutekha ye'aseh r'tzonekha ba'aretz ka'asher na'asah vashamayimTen-lanu haiyom lechem chukeinu. u'selach-lanu et-ashmateinu ka'asher solechim anachnu la'asher ashmu lanu. Ve'al-tevieinu lidei massah, ki im-hatsileinu min-hara. Ki lekha ha-mamlakha vehagevurah veha-tiferet l'olemei olamim. Amen.
Krime
User ID: 15335079
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05/01/2012 02:58 PM
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Re: Christians: We are not under the law of the Old Testament....................
Thank You OP!
This is why so many find the bible contradictory. And why people like that of the Landover Baptist Church forum (parody) get by with crazy bible quotes.
example:
one might argue, "no it says in the bible an eye for an eye, tooth for tooth etc. Deuteronomy 18:21
but then one can also go to the new, where Christ revised in matthew 5:38-40.
But really the bible is more a historical reference than anything.
If you follow what Christ says in matthew 22:36-40, the rest is just a learning tool.

Matthew 22:36-40:
36) Master, which is the great commandment in the law?
37) Jesus said unto him, thou shall love thy Lord thy God with all thy heart, and with all thy soul, and with all thy mind.
38) This is the first and great commandment.
39)And the second is like unto it, Thou shalt love thy neighbor as thyself.
40) On these two commandments hang all the law and the prophets.
God bless!
Anonymous Coward
User ID: 13479329
Slovakia
05/01/2012 03:04 PM
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Re: Christians: We are not under the law of the Old Testament....................
Thank You OP!
This is why so many find the bible contradictory. And why people like that of the Landover Baptist Church forum (parody) get by with crazy bible quotes.
example:
one might argue, "no it says in the bible an eye for an eye, tooth for tooth etc. Deuteronomy 18:21
but then one can also go to the new, where Christ revised in matthew 5:38-40.
But really the bible is more a historical reference than anything.
If you follow what Christ says in matthew 22:36-40, the rest is just a learning tool.

Matthew 22:36-40:
36) Master, which is the great commandment in the law?
37) Jesus said unto him, thou shall love thy Lord thy God with all thy heart, and with all thy soul, and with all thy mind.
38) This is the first and great commandment.
39)And the second is like unto it, Thou shalt love thy neighbor as thyself.
40) On these two commandments hang all the law and the prophets.
God bless!
 Quoting: Krime 15335079


Anyone who breaks one of the least of these commandments and teaches others to do the same will be called least in the kingdom of heaven, but whoever practices and teaches these commands will be called great in the kingdom of heaven. Matthew 5:19
Krime
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05/01/2012 03:12 PM
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Re: Christians: We are not under the law of the Old Testament....................
Yes 13479329:
If you love your neighbor as you love yourself (basicly the "Golden Rule") all the commandments fit into that.
Sir Phydeau

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05/01/2012 03:31 PM
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Re: Christians: We are not under the law of the Old Testament....................
Matthew 22:36-40:
36) Master, which is the great commandment in the law?
37) Jesus said unto him, thou shall love thy Lord thy God with all thy heart, and with all thy soul, and with all thy mind.
38) This is the first and great commandment.
39)And the second is like unto it, Thou shalt love thy neighbor as thyself.
40) On these two commandments hang all the law and the prophets.
God bless!
 Quoting: Krime 15335079


I wish to address this portion only for the reason that so few modern believers truly understand what is being said here.

Having the Word cut up into numbered sound bytes is a relatively new thing. Back then, there wasn't even punctuation, much less chapter breaks and numbered verses.

So, let's say back then I wanted to express John 3:16. I would state, "For YHWH so loved the world".

This begins @ Deut 6:4

"4 “Hear, O Israel: The Lord our God, the Lord is one! 5 You shall love the Lord your God with all your heart, with all your soul, and with all your strength.

6 “And these words which I command you today shall be in your heart. 7 You shall teach them diligently to your children, and shall talk of them when you sit in your house, when you walk by the way, when you lie down, and when you rise up. 8 You shall bind them as a sign on your hand, and they shall be as frontlets between your eyes. (The "Mark of YHWH" as the mark of the Beast will be on one's hand or forehead) 9 You shall write them on the doorposts of your house and on your gates.

ANY Hebrew older than about 5 or 6 would have instantly known what He was saying there.

Another example of the same thing that's got deep poetic beauty is when He is on the stake. He says, "Eli Eli lama sabachthani?" which is, "My God, my God, why have you forsaken me?"

He was not having a crisis of faith. He was saying the opening line of Psalm 22. Think about that moment. His followers in great emotional pain suddenly hearing that line and suddenly having that entire Psalm flood their heads.

There's many, many, MANY other statements, moments and events that the depth and poetic beauty is all but lost on most of modern Christianity due to their anti-Semitism and the RCC hatred of anything Hebraic.

Last Edited by Sir Phydeau on 05/01/2012 03:34 PM
"When the facts change, I change my mind. What do you do, sir?" — John M. Keynes
"The way to see by [blind] faith is to shut the eye of reason." - Benjamin Franklin
The Self Defining Hebrew System: [link to www.thechronicleproject.org]
Real men keep Torah.
Knighted into the Army of Yahuwah on 10-9-10.

Avinu shebashamayim, yitkadesh shimkha. Tavo malkhutekha ye'aseh r'tzonekha ba'aretz ka'asher na'asah vashamayimTen-lanu haiyom lechem chukeinu. u'selach-lanu et-ashmateinu ka'asher solechim anachnu la'asher ashmu lanu. Ve'al-tevieinu lidei massah, ki im-hatsileinu min-hara. Ki lekha ha-mamlakha vehagevurah veha-tiferet l'olemei olamim. Amen.
Sir Phydeau

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05/01/2012 03:31 PM
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Re: Christians: We are not under the law of the Old Testament....................
Yes 13479329:
If you love your neighbor as you love yourself (basicly the "Golden Rule") all the commandments fit into that.
 Quoting: Krime 15335079


"Hang upon" it, actually. Just as a coat hangs on a hanger. Does the coat hanger abolish the coat?

Last Edited by Sir Phydeau on 05/01/2012 03:32 PM
"When the facts change, I change my mind. What do you do, sir?" — John M. Keynes
"The way to see by [blind] faith is to shut the eye of reason." - Benjamin Franklin
The Self Defining Hebrew System: [link to www.thechronicleproject.org]
Real men keep Torah.
Knighted into the Army of Yahuwah on 10-9-10.

Avinu shebashamayim, yitkadesh shimkha. Tavo malkhutekha ye'aseh r'tzonekha ba'aretz ka'asher na'asah vashamayimTen-lanu haiyom lechem chukeinu. u'selach-lanu et-ashmateinu ka'asher solechim anachnu la'asher ashmu lanu. Ve'al-tevieinu lidei massah, ki im-hatsileinu min-hara. Ki lekha ha-mamlakha vehagevurah veha-tiferet l'olemei olamim. Amen.
Anonymous Coward
User ID: 14488282
United States
05/01/2012 03:32 PM
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Re: Christians: We are not under the law of the Old Testament....................
i hear ya. OPs need to bring the ban hammer down to keep her out, and report abusive posts.

BAN HER AT THE STAKE!
 Quoting: Salt


Her and I have about a 2 year history of going back and forth on religious XXX.

When I converted from atheism she was on the 120+ thread I'd made to discuss issues of faith and such.

She had read I was raised Catholic and has been obsessed with getting me to return to HER faith using such arrogant statements as "One True Faith".

Way back then, my temper was mostly unchecked. It just flowed like hot lava, so, I often "tore her apart" brutally. So, she's somewhat justified in her grudge.

Then the day came that I must have tried for 8 or 10 pages to meet in the middle with her and she was having no part of it.

All that XXX said, I don't think I'd ever ban her from one of my threads. She has just as much right to express herself as anyone else ... and there's trolls on here that are FAR, FAR worse.

I'm truly hoping that tonight she and I made progress towards a peace between us. Because honestly, peace is what I seek.
 Quoting: Sir Phydeau


her tactics, delivery, and things she chooses to say suggest a very disturbed person.
 Quoting: Salt


She's a LOT smarter than she lets on
. She'll intentionally state things she knows gets a negative reaction then plays it off under the guise that she's totally innocent and only trying to help.

It's really funny when you actually think about it.

Pretty tactful, too.
 Quoting: Sir Phydeau


Mods, Salt and "Sir" are former Catholics who attack the faith and others personally especially if they share the true teachings of the faith. This isn't a discussion forum if you can't object to their posts. Correct?

Sodomy is a mortal sin, it's been established, we know
since the Old Testament. There are tons of objections in Salt's thread. She dishes up more personal negative than she receives.

Hey, what happened to your forgive me "Sir?" What a con.

You are explaining to everyone who you really are today.

Catholicism is the true faith and your "disturbed" mix is false and this why you attack the faith and me personally.

When I and others (there was one gentleman, he explained your sect, it's phoniness in a sentence with his posts) point it out, you turn to insults, the vulgar or Bah, hah, poor sorry "Sir."

Attack Protestantism, please lay off Catholicism.

You're not going to that, you're Protestant now. "My people"....you were baptized Roman Catholic. You're not Jewish.

Start your own thread if you can't handle comments to say no way are we in the Old Covenant and Yahshua is my personal Lord and Savior.
Sir Phydeau

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05/01/2012 03:37 PM
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Re: Christians: We are not under the law of the Old Testament....................
...


Her and I have about a 2 year history of going back and forth on religious XXX.

When I converted from atheism she was on the 120+ thread I'd made to discuss issues of faith and such.

She had read I was raised Catholic and has been obsessed with getting me to return to HER faith using such arrogant statements as "One True Faith".

Way back then, my temper was mostly unchecked. It just flowed like hot lava, so, I often "tore her apart" brutally. So, she's somewhat justified in her grudge.

Then the day came that I must have tried for 8 or 10 pages to meet in the middle with her and she was having no part of it.

All that XXX said, I don't think I'd ever ban her from one of my threads. She has just as much right to express herself as anyone else ... and there's trolls on here that are FAR, FAR worse.

I'm truly hoping that tonight she and I made progress towards a peace between us. Because honestly, peace is what I seek.
 Quoting: Sir Phydeau


her tactics, delivery, and things she chooses to say suggest a very disturbed person.
 Quoting: Salt


She's a LOT smarter than she lets on
. She'll intentionally state things she knows gets a negative reaction then plays it off under the guise that she's totally innocent and only trying to help.

It's really funny when you actually think about it.

Pretty tactful, too.
 Quoting: Sir Phydeau


Mods, Salt and "Sir" are former Catholics who attack the faith and others personally especially if they share the true teachings of the faith. This isn't a discussion forum if you can't object to their posts. Correct?

Sodomy is a mortal sin, it's been established, we know
since the Old Testament. There are tons of objections in Salt's thread. She dishes up more personal negative than she receives.

Hey, what happened to your forgive me "Sir?" What a con.

You are explaining to everyone who you really are today.

Catholicism is the true faith and your "disturbed" mix is false and this why you attack the faith and me personally.

When I and others (there was one gentleman, he explained your sect, it's phoniness in a sentence with his posts) point it out, you turn to insults, the vulgar or Bah, hah, poor sorry "Sir."

Attack Protestantism, please lay off Catholicism.

You're not going to that, you're Protestant now. "My people"....you were baptized Roman Catholic. You're not Jewish.

Start your own thread if you can't handle comments to say no way are we in the Old Covenant and Yahshua is my personal Lord and Savior.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 14488282


M'Lady, are you actually trying to ask for mods to ban us for picking on you?

Why do you insist on grabbing on a single statement I make and then repeating it over and over and over on thread after thread?

Oh, that's rich, you imply I'm a whiner in the very same post that you're whining and calling out to mods. You repeatedly call me "vulgar" when I've not directed any profanity to you in a year or so. Grow up. Disagreeing is NOT "can't handle". It's called standing your ground.

I thought we made peace last night. Calm down.

Your belief of "once catholic always catholic" is utter poppycock.

It's not my fault they refuse to ex-communicate me.

Stop replying to my postings.

Last Edited by Sir Phydeau on 05/01/2012 03:44 PM
"When the facts change, I change my mind. What do you do, sir?" — John M. Keynes
"The way to see by [blind] faith is to shut the eye of reason." - Benjamin Franklin
The Self Defining Hebrew System: [link to www.thechronicleproject.org]
Real men keep Torah.
Knighted into the Army of Yahuwah on 10-9-10.

Avinu shebashamayim, yitkadesh shimkha. Tavo malkhutekha ye'aseh r'tzonekha ba'aretz ka'asher na'asah vashamayimTen-lanu haiyom lechem chukeinu. u'selach-lanu et-ashmateinu ka'asher solechim anachnu la'asher ashmu lanu. Ve'al-tevieinu lidei massah, ki im-hatsileinu min-hara. Ki lekha ha-mamlakha vehagevurah veha-tiferet l'olemei olamim. Amen.

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