Christians: We are not under the law of the Old Testament....................

?



Last Edited by Sir Phydeau on 05/01/2012 02:33 AM

You're silly, the protest of "forcing" anyone to believe
anything. We all do as we please.

If you are further along, you would not of said what you
said in your last thread. I replied to your comment.

Don't be unkind, it's still in you.

I wish and pray you come home, maybe, not until the
Great Warning takes place.

Messsianic Judaism and their denominations are a Protestant
sect started by the Baptists.

this religious BS is BS

wtf people grow the fuck up.

May you be saved from your hatred one day, madam.

I forgive you for your past insults and taunts and apologize for my own.

Go in peace.

Last Edited by Sir Phydeau on 05/01/2012 02:35 AM

Well last time i'll try to explain it for the book says ignorant people will always be ignorant and will not accept the truth for they do not want change and if you don;t have the truth in you then I know why you don;t understand anything I am saying, the new covenant is the old(You're are mixing the Old and the New) but it's the same thing, you need the old to understand the new, and I am mixing them to help you understand how they pretty much speak the same thing following the law

(Why do you want to remain in the Old Covenant?
Things are better, greater in the New.) Oh I guess your right screw the old one and follow the new one even though the new one says you need to follow the old one to receive eternal life

Jeremiah 31:32 “Not according to the covenant that I made with their fathers in the day that I took them by the hand to bring them out of the land of Egypt; which my covenant they brake, although I was an husband unto them, saith the LORD:” Meaning this covenant was not to be according to the sacrificial laws (the Levitical Priesthood). Please read Hebrews 7:11-28 & Hebrews 8:1-6.

Jeremiah 31:33 “But this shall be the covenant that I will make with the house of Israel; After those days, saith the LORD, I will put my law in their inward parts, and write it in their hearts; and will be their God, and they shall be my people.” Obviously verse 32 is not talking about the doing away with of the Law because this verse would contradict that understanding. The Heavenly Father is establishing his new covenant according to HIS laws that he had already given to the children of Israel. There was no confusion with Jeremiah of what Law the Heavenly Father was speaking of for he said “my law”.

The New covenant is establishing the old law into the hearts and minds of the people of the most high so they can actually follow and obey it in perfection, because as you will read the law on stone did't really work and people did not follow it

This people draweth nigh unto me with their mouth, and honoureth me with their lips; but their heart is far from me. mathew 15:8

Some things in this thread I have not found in the bible. Could somebody please point out:

Where does the bible say that most animal sacrifices were removed from the Law of Moses?

Where does the bible say that Jesus changed the Law of Moses?

If the bible doesn't say Jesus changed the Law of Moses, who changed it? When? Why?

Does the bible say somewhere exactly which laws were removed from the Law of Moses? Does it say which laws were added on? Where does it say these things?

You make me smile, where is the "hate", I was civil, your awful exaggeration again. It's juvenile. And then to address me politely..."madam."

Forgive me too Phydeau. If they seemed like "taunts" and "insults", most of it was a reply to your obvious meanness. And the rest was to get you to think about the faith and to defend it after your negative comments.

If once, you would do as I suggest but you won't. Tell your family, people who are still Catholic,

"I went to a Catholic Church, I felt God's presence there."

You could do it....

^^^THIS^^^

Hello friend,

I do not claim to have all the answers, despite how I might come off when I get passionate.

That said, I will attempt to convey my own understanding of such things.

Not all of the 613 mizvot apply to me. Many are for women only, many others were for the judges of the sanhedrin, and yet others still were for the priests.

For example: Any Law concerning menstruation do not apply to me obviously because I'm male.

As for the sacrificial laws ... Hebrew did not each have an altar in their backyard. These sacrifices were performed by the priests at the temple. The temple is no more, nor are the priests. Until the return of the High Priest, we have no high priest to perform these sacrifices.

What's more. HaMosiach fulfilled an eternal sacrifice.

Now something I wish to make abundantly clear about my own personal beliefs ... I believe that we ARE saved by our faith and grace. I merely obey out of love, not obligation. What's more, I obey and follow the Law to the best of my ability because HaMosiach stated that anyone that breaks the least of these commandments and teaches others to do the same will be called the least in Olam Haba. Yet those that do and teach the commandments will be called great.

I want to do my best to score straight As and not a C+, so to speak.

Further still, according to my translations and studies I do not believe in an everlasting torment for anyone. I believe that the "Elect" that have been drawn to Him and keep His commandments will be risen on the return of the King for the 1000 year reign of the New Jerusalem. All others will not rise until after that 1000 years and stand before the Judgment Throne. At that time, the wicked will be cast into the Purifying Lake of Fire until they are purified like in a silver refining pot (back then, a silversmith knew the silver was refined when he could see his own reflection in the surface). Once the purification is complete, ALL will be welcomed into the new heaven and Earth, or the New Eden.

So, those that insist that the Law is the path to salvation are WAY off base, imo. However, as it says in the Word, those who continue to intentionally live in sin after accepting ... well, it's not so good for them.

Sin is defined in the book of John, I believe, as transgression of the Law.

I mean, let's just use a bit of logic here ... how offensive must that be to HaMosiach when people abuse His gift as a "license to sin"? I imagine it's not a warm and fuzzy feeling for Him. But I digress.

I'm sorry, my love. Your condition for me to attend a Catholic Church for you to forgive me is something I can not, nor will not do.

In my belief, it would be an abomination for me to do so.

I felt YHWH in many places, but never in a Catholic Church, nor a Baptist church, nor a Pentecostal church, nor a non-denominational church.

The first time I ever felt overwhelming holiness was the first time I attended Synagogue.

I'm sorry that that seems to offend you, I really am.

This is my path. The path He has chosen for me. There honestly is nothing you can say or do that will ever make me turn my back on the things He has placed within me.

Well where does the bible say that the Messiah fulfilled an eternal sacrifice?

And why do you claim that Christians are using His Sacrifice as a license to sin? Quite simply, the bible says that Christians are not supposed to live under the Law of Moses. According to the bible, that is God's Will for Christians. So it's not a license to sin, it is what the bible says Christians are supposed to do.

As you can read in this thread, some people are saying that Jesus changed the Law of Moses. I'm simply trying to find out where the bible says that. Do you think that Jesus changed the Law of Moses? Is it in the bible?

Where does it state He was the sacrifice? Um ... all three Gospels, brother. It's kinda the central theme to the entire thing, even many of the Prophets.

As for the rest, I simply disagree. I personally don't care if you obey Him or not. You can ignore HaMosiach's many, many statements that we are to honor the Father's commandments. That's between you and Him. I merely share my studies to refute as I am commanded. What people do with it after that is entirely up to them.

No, I do not believe the Law has been abolished. However, I know from your previous posts, you only asked that so you could follow with "AHA! I BUSTED YOU!" and then attempt to make me look like a fool for being obedient.

If you'll read the post I made to you, I repeatedly stated that this was MY belief. Must I also clarify that I'm not telling YOU to do as I do?

We are going to have to agree to disagree on about 2/3 of your posting.

As Paul once asked, "Am I your enemy because I tell you the Truth?" (as I understand it)

As always, whatever anyone does is between them and the Elohim. I work out my own salvation with fear and trembling. I leave it to others to do the same ... or not, it's their choice.

All I know is that in the very end ALL will bend a knee and proclaim that YHWH is their God and Yahushua is His son, our Husband, High Priest and Redeemer.

Last Edited by Sir Phydeau on 05/01/2012 03:31 AM

I said forgive me, there's no condition.

Going to sit before the Tabernacle isn't a "condition" but a suggestion.

You have changed, do you think there is a chance you could
find holiness somewhere other than a Synagogue? Christ isn't there, He is in the Tabernacle of every Catholic Church.

The "temple" in the New Covenant is Christ's Church.

You are settling for something that isn't true. Judaism
rejects Christ.

"Messianic Judaism" isn't old at all or true. It's a mix
of beliefs non-Christian mixed with the heresy of Protestantism, both beliefs will never come together.

If you profess some of Protestantism which you do right now. You are aware, Jesus is returning soon. Are you waiting for the enlightenment of the Jewish nation? They'll be converted to Christianity, specifically Roman Catholicism, not Protestantism. So, there will be no more Judaism.

You're right, "nothing" I say or do, it will be God, trust, He can accomplish a worldwide Pentecost.


thank you for your kind reply,

Oh, I forgave you quite some time ago, as I stated about ... I dunno, 8 posts ago.

You've yet to state that you forgive ME, however.

As for the rest of your posting, it just comes off as lecturing me to convert back to Catholicism. Something I can not, nor will not do ... unless, in the VERY unlikely event YHWH commands me to do so.

THAT would be a different matter entirely.

As rabbi say at the end of EVERY and ALL heated discussions over the Word: HaMosiach will make it clear when he comes.

EDIT: As you know from past experience, Catholicism is something that just gets under my skin and maintaining a kind delivery can be quite difficult for me at times. Thank you for noticing and reacting to my keeping myself calm, relaxed and non-combative, for once. ;)

ADDITIONAL EDIT: I've made great efforts to not refer to the RCC in any derogatory manner, please reciprocate the same courtesy when referring to my faith. Please.

So far, in EVERY reply to me you've taken a shot at my faith ... please stop it.

Thanks.

Last Edited by Sir Phydeau on 05/01/2012 03:43 AM

Where does the bible say that the Law of Moses was changed to remove the sacrifices from that law, and replace those sacrifices with the Sacrifice of the Messiah?

That is what some people on this thread are saying. Is it in the bible?

UGH!!!

*pulls hair out in frustration*

I've not said that, now have I? Why do you keep asking me that? I can not defend a position I have not asserted, nor should I be expected to, sir.

I will repeat what I've already stated: Without a temple, there is no place for me to take animals or grain for sacrifices. Nor am I a High Priest of neither the Levite tribe nor of the Order of the Meckladesh (spelling is most likely WAY off on this one). Hence, I'm unable to perform these myself.

Without those crucial items, it's impossible for said sacrifices to be made in the manner prescribed in the Torah.

EDIT: I could be WAY off. I can only act on the thing the Ruach Reveals to me. If I'm incorrect, the Ruach will correct me and I'll find a way.

Last Edited by Sir Phydeau on 05/01/2012 03:48 AM

Are you aware that in the Law of Moses, God commanded the Israelites to build a tent temple?


1 And the LORD spake unto Moses, saying,

2 Speak unto the children of Israel, that they bring me an offering: of every man that giveth it willingly with his heart ye shall take my offering.

[...]

8 And let them make me a sanctuary; that I may dwell among them.

9 According to all that I shew thee, after the pattern of the tabernacle, and the pattern of all the instruments thereof, even so shall ye make it.
(Exodus 25:1-9)

Are those laws still in force? Or do they remain unchanged?

OP..do you have a facebook group under the name of KlLLUMINATI? Just wondering because i seen it before..

*sigh*

*walks away from source of frustration before making an ass of self*

Last Edited by Sir Phydeau on 05/01/2012 04:00 AM

What does this mean please?

"What's more. HaMosiach fulfilled an eternal sacrifice."

Is the Sacrifice of Messiah according to the Law of Moses? Or was the Law of Moses changed to allow this Sacrifice to be acceptable? If the Law of Moses was changed to allow the Sacrifice of the Messiah, is this recorded in the bible somewhere?

The law does not include murder of innocent blood. so oviously his death was not by the law of Moses. Silly reasoning gets you no were.

Jesus answered, It is written: 'Man does not live on bread alone, but on every word that comes from the mouth of God.' Matthew 4:4

Forgive me my frustration. I parted company for a bit so that I would not act on my own frustration and "take it out on you".

Simple answer: I don't know.

There.

Your repeatedly rephrasing the same question over and over when I gave you the best answer I could ... well, it felt more like someone trying to back me into a corner than genuine curiosity. Perhaps I misinterpreted this.

All I know is that I do not intentionally break any commandments and uphold any and all that are within my ability.

This is the best I can do in both my actions and my answer to you. If the answers are not satisfactory for you, my advice is to do what I did, PRAY. Ask Him to remove any and all preconceptions and false doctrines from you and show you the way. We have the Ruach for this.

I do wish to at least mention my thanks for showing me another issue I need to research further and come to a resolution. My current studies are on more advanced issues than "Why am I not doing the impossible?"

Last Edited by Sir Phydeau on 05/01/2012 04:58 AM

Jesus is from the order of Melchizedek, not a Levite.

THAT's the word I misspelled earlier! Thank you!

It's not silly reasoning. The Sacrifice of Jesus was one of the most important events in the world. If that Sacrifice was to pay for the sins of the world, then somebody should be able to explain how this compares with the Law of Moses.

Obviously Jesus is not a goat or a bullock or a real lamb, so His Sacrifice can't be according to the Law of Moses. And yet, it still counts for something, according to Christians.

And if you read the thread, you will notice several people said that Jesus changed the Law of Moses, removing the animal sacrifices, and replacing those with His Sacrifice.

So if we assume that people say these things because they are in the bible, where does the bible say that the laws regarding sacrifices in the Law of Moses were changed? Who changed the Law of Moses? When? Pretty simple really.

Well the thread is about Christians not being under the old testament law (Law of Moses). So if some of those other people want to say that they are under the Law of Moses, and that Christians are wrong for not being under the Law of Moses, they should be able to explain how their theories are superior to Christianity.

But instead of a clear explanation, that other guy just contradicted himself repeatedly. That's a bad sign.

At first he posted what Jesus said about how there would be no change to the Law of Moses, then he posted repeatedly telling people about changes to the Law of Moses, and said Jesus did it. So it made me wonder: where does the bible say that the Law of Moses got changed?

Now if you don't believe that the Law of Moses got changed, of course you would not be able to find the statement of changes in the bible. Just like I don't believe that Jesus changed the Law of Moses, and I cannot find in the bible that it says that the Law of Moses was changed, altered, modified, etc.

It seems like some people (not you, don't get offended) change their theory with each post, and don't seem to care if the changes contradict what they posted before.

... when Christ came into the world, he said: "Sacrifice and offering you did not desire, but a body you prepared for me;... Hebrews 10:5

Christians Hate good points.

They hurt too much.