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"Curiosity Mars "landing" BIGGEST HOAX EVER!!!"

 
nomuse (not logged in)
User ID: 2380183
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08/18/2012 01:49 PM
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Re: "Curiosity Mars "landing" BIGGEST HOAX EVER!!!"
Ah. I see that was mentioned already upthread.

Fascinates me how dynamic the atmosphere is, also in re the chemical composition, and even the molecular composition; the Martian atmosphere is too thin to sequester ozone at the upper margins of the atmosphere; hard UV penetrates much closer to the surface and wreaks havoc on the molecular makeup of the atmospheric gases.

The thermal profile is also fascinating; has even more of a re-curve than Earth's.

All of this stuff, for me, underlines just how changeable and potentially unstable our own fragile envelop is. A slightly starting mass, tectonic activity, biotic activity, solar constant, and this planet could look like another Mars -- or another Venus.

It behooves us to understand what happens to planets over time because we risk having a probe sent by some other intelligence, a million years from, scraping away at the barren surface of the third planet of our sun and trying to determine if it had ever held life...
hard to remember
User ID: 22222354
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08/19/2012 04:05 AM
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Re: "Curiosity Mars "landing" BIGGEST HOAX EVER!!!"
its hard remember who you were writting for eng. the whole mission is a fake you dont need to do so many number crunching. just common sence. I cannot get fair mobile phone coverage on earth. come on to get ever thruster to work and to get slow down to 0 come on with a parashute, as i think you said they landed in a crator to fake it... fake fake fake..all government are built on lying to the people.like building 7 it came down because of those pesky fire yer right. do some fomulas and sqare rooting of thats, dont waist your time nasa is faking it!!! and stop pretending you are talking to nomuse you and he are the same guy pretending to be against each other. then youll begin to agree with each other and kiss. it wont work the para shute is a fake...
nomuse (not logged in)
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08/19/2012 01:01 PM
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Re: "Curiosity Mars "landing" BIGGEST HOAX EVER!!!"
its hard remember who you were writting for eng. the whole mission is a fake you dont need to do so many number crunching. just common sence. I cannot get fair mobile phone coverage on earth. come on to get ever thruster to work and to get slow down to 0 come on with a parashute, as i think you said they landed in a crator to fake it... fake fake fake..all government are built on lying to the people.like building 7 it came down because of those pesky fire yer right. do some fomulas and sqare rooting of thats, dont waist your time nasa is faking it!!! and stop pretending you are talking to nomuse you and he are the same guy pretending to be against each other. then youll begin to agree with each other and kiss. it wont work the para shute is a fake...
 Quoting: hard to remember 22222354


Err, what?

What do your unrealistic, advertising-driven expectations for a piece of consumer technology have to do with anything?

Did the fact that a plastic coat hanger (that you bought at 8/$1.75 at the local super-save store) break mean that the Brooklyn Bridge might fall down at any moment?

The cell phone is an optimized bit of engineering designed to provide the largest subscriber area possible with just good enough service so the customers will keep paying for it. It is designed specifically to be as cheap as possible, and to perform only as well as they need to in order to keep their customers from switching. It is an extremely low-powered, statistically modeled, NETWORK -- as in, no phone could POSSIBLY talk to another phone by itself; the thing only works as part of a much larger system.

But I guess you don't understand or use technology -- because then you might have used a spell-check on your post!
nomuse (not logged in)
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08/19/2012 01:08 PM
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Re: "Curiosity Mars "landing" BIGGEST HOAX EVER!!!"
I have to add in defense of the cell phone;

The consumer desire -- which has become expectation because the marketing people are willing to play to it -- is for a device which is extremely portable, works everywhere, has a bright screen you can read in daylight, remembers your numbers for you, plays music when you aren't on the phone, or games, or checks email, and will any day now deliver real-time TV as well. And it would be too much of a hassle to be plugging it in all the time so it has to do all this for days on a single small battery.

It is only just possible because of the dense batteries and extremely low-power electronics we are doing now, as well as the leaps in efficiency in display technology. On the transmission side -- potentially the most power-hungry aspect of the whole thing -- digital error correction and applied psycho-acoustics makes it possible to provide the illusion that you are getting as good a connection as a simple wire.

A whole host of difficult engineering is behind it, plus a host of near-invisible compromises. In a way, given the demanded performance parameters, the miracle is that it delivers most of the time.
Pianoman

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08/22/2012 11:13 PM
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Re: "Curiosity Mars "landing" BIGGEST HOAX EVER!!!"
engineer
CONCLUSION: Even air at 1% the density of earth (more or less) has significant
effects on drag. The atmosphere on Mars varies greatly from season to season
(up to 30x at the poles, but Earth changes a lot at the poles also), and from
day to night. It seems that NASA has opened up their vaults, and if you look
hard, you can find a lot of data from previous Mars missions.

I've read through all your posts here more or less. This conclusion is not consistent in tone or quality with your earlier vociferous objection to the idea that a 2 ton craft can decelerate from 13,000 mph to 900 mph in the first 4 minutes of the 7 minutes of terror before the parachute deployment-- even if the martian atmosphere was 2% rather than 1% as dense as earths-- and even if there is dust in the atmosphere and even if the polar density is 30X that. I thought your differences with your wife were somewhat funny in a dark way- but now I think maybe she might have been right. Still, if a bit of college level physics can expose this hoax, I think NASA's little science fiction video game is going to read game over pretty soon. This latest Curiosity mission is just plain silly as you pointed out in your earlier posts as they related to my special interest which was the intitial decleration. Thanks for all that work-- even if "they" are making you back off now-- which is what seems to be occurring here.
Pianoman

User ID: 13563628
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08/22/2012 11:13 PM
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Re: "Curiosity Mars "landing" BIGGEST HOAX EVER!!!"
engineer
CONCLUSION: Even air at 1% the density of earth (more or less) has significant
effects on drag. The atmosphere on Mars varies greatly from season to season
(up to 30x at the poles, but Earth changes a lot at the poles also), and from
day to night. It seems that NASA has opened up their vaults, and if you look
hard, you can find a lot of data from previous Mars missions.
 Quoting: Pianoman
UNQUOTE

Pianoman.
I've read through all your posts here more or less. This conclusion is not consistent in tone or quality with your earlier vociferous objection to the idea that a 2 ton craft can decelerate from 13,000 mph to 900 mph in the first 4 minutes of the 7 minutes of terror before the parachute deployment-- even if the martian atmosphere was 2% rather than 1% as dense as earths-- and even if there is dust in the atmosphere and even if the polar density is 30X that. I thought your differences with your wife were somewhat funny in a dark way- but now I think maybe she might have been right. Still, if a bit of college level physics can expose this hoax, I think NASA's little science fiction video game is going to read game over pretty soon. This latest Curiosity mission is just plain silly as you pointed out in your earlier posts as they related to my special interest which was the intitial decleration. Thanks for all that work-- even if "they" are making you back off now-- which is what seems to be occurring here.
Dr. AstroModerator
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08/22/2012 11:18 PM

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Re: "Curiosity Mars "landing" BIGGEST HOAX EVER!!!"
engineer
even if "they" are making you back off now-- which is what seems to be occurring here.
 Quoting: Pianoman

Oh for fuck's sakes!
astrobanner2
Anonymous Coward
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08/22/2012 11:18 PM
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Re: "Curiosity Mars "landing" BIGGEST HOAX EVER!!!"
I did write Pioneer Aerospace to ask them for specs, specifically Cd, on the parachute they made for Curiosity, and I asked a parachute mfgr as well. We will see - I don't know if they will reply or not. Today, I lean a little more in NASA's favor, because I have read 100s of documents with data that led up to the engineering and design of Curiosity. I am the type that feels a little "ill" when I see the "happy photos" of everyone at NASA kissing & hugging - I hate those kind of work environments ...

Anyway, here we go ... I don't want to repeat this stuff, so hopefully this will suffice for further work.

Part 0 / 6
==========
Today, we clear up poor data with NASA references,
to settle worries about poor data giving poor results.
Hopefully, our input data will be as good as it gets now.
==========
[link to marsprogram.jpl.nasa.gov]

Cruise Stage: (Fueled) 539 kg (1,188 lbs)
Configuration for travel between Earth & Mars.

Entry/Descent/Landing: (Aeroshell/fueled descent stage) 2,401 kg (5,293 lbs)
Configuration for entry into the Martian atmosphere.
Includes the aeroshell and a "sky crane" lander structure.

Rover: 899 kg (1,982 lbs)
A wheeled vehicle with science instruments
for discoveries on the Martian surface.

EDL + ROVER = 7275 lbs

The spacecraft design for the Mars Science Laboratory mission is based largely
on the successful twin Viking landers sent to Mars in the 1970s. The rover
design is based on the Mars Exploration Rovers, which landed on Mars in early
2004. The system for entry, descent, and landing is entirely new. How much
does the spacecraft weigh? The Mars Science Laboratory mission had a total
launch mass, including the rockets that lifted it away from Earth, of about
531,000 kilograms (1.17 million pounds). The total mass of the spacecraft is
3,893 kilograms (8,463 pounds).
==========
[link to quest.nasa.gov]

Atmospheric Density

Earth: 1.2256 kg/m3 = .002378
Mars: 0.0155 kg/m3 = .000030075 (.00003)
MAM: p = 14.62*e(-.00003*0)/(1149*(-25.68-.000548*0+459.7)) = .000029317

[link to nssdc.gsfc.nasa.gov]

Surface gravity (m/s^2) 3.71 9.80 0.379 (.38)

Apology from me to NASA, I am not sure if they heard me or not,
but now I am finding data for atmospheric density being released:

[link to ntrs.nasa.gov]
[link to www26.us.archive.org]

Search: aeroshell drag coefficient ... for that number if interested.
==========
Back to Mars atmospheric science class ...
We are doing a sanity check on NASA's Mars Atmospheric Model (MAM),
assuming they have a Mach 2.2 largest-strongest-ever parachute,
we will use the following 2 functions:
=====
V = sqrt(2*W*.38/(rho*C*S)) [link to www.pcprg.com]

Where:

V = velocity in ft/s
W = weight in lbs
rho = density in slugs/ft^3
C = Cd, drag coefficient = 2.2-2.5 ( MY OPINION ) see;
Cd=2.2 => [link to www.fruitychutes.com]
[link to fruitychutes.com]
[link to cdn.theatlantic.com]
S = Pi*radius^2 (circular area, radius = 25.5ft)
.38 = Mars gravitational coefficient for weight/lbs/lbf
=====
NASA's Mars Atmospheric Model, MAM:

p = P/(1149*(T+459.7)) [link to www.grc.nasa.gov]

Where:

p = density (slugs/ft^3)
P = pressure (lbs/ft^2)
T = temperature (F)
h = altitude (ft)
e(x) = 2.718^x

For h > 23000ft, T = -10.34-.001217*h, P = 14.62*e(-.00003*h)
Thus, p = 14.62*e(-.00003*h)/(1149*(-10.34-.001217*h+459.7))
For h < 23000ft, T = -25.68-.000548*h, P = 14.62*e(-.00003*h)
Thus, p = 14.62*e(-.00003*h)/(1149*(-25.68-.000548*h+459.7))
=====
 Quoting: Engineer 694654


you making the Big mistake the one that gets the so-called "smart" ones. You see they did build it and spend the money, Just it never left the planet and it cost about 80 percent less than the 2.5 billion if you dont go to mars for real :) Its a scam man
Khunopie
User ID: 22452032
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08/23/2012 04:03 AM
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Re: "Curiosity Mars "landing" BIGGEST HOAX EVER!!!"
[link to www.toplistsonline.com]

First the Curiosity spacecraft entered the atmosphere using a heat shield. This slowed the craft somewhat, but not nearly enough to make the landing. Next, a supersonic parachute--the largest ever built--was used to slow the craft further. For its final stage, Curiosity used a revolutionary jet-propelled "space crane" to lower it gently to the surface.


--

Sorry, don't buy it. Supersonice parachute AND the LARGEST EVER BUILT? I want some evidence of a parachute like that. Got some??? A parachute that can withstand several supersonic shock waves? (one for each multiple of the speed of sound)

I am sure NASA would HAVE TO TEST such a parachute - any articles or videos of this testing? I'd love to see it.
 Quoting: Engineer 694654

Don't Nasa engineers have really super HP calculators to do all this hard figuring so they don't have to test? LOL
Dr. AstroModerator
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08/23/2012 08:43 AM

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[link to www.toplistsonline.com]

First the Curiosity spacecraft entered the atmosphere using a heat shield. This slowed the craft somewhat, but not nearly enough to make the landing. Next, a supersonic parachute--the largest ever built--was used to slow the craft further. For its final stage, Curiosity used a revolutionary jet-propelled "space crane" to lower it gently to the surface.


--

Sorry, don't buy it. Supersonice parachute AND the LARGEST EVER BUILT? I want some evidence of a parachute like that. Got some??? A parachute that can withstand several supersonic shock waves? (one for each multiple of the speed of sound)

I am sure NASA would HAVE TO TEST such a parachute - any articles or videos of this testing? I'd love to see it.
 Quoting: Engineer 694654

Don't Nasa engineers have really super HP calculators to do all this hard figuring so they don't have to test? LOL
 Quoting: Khunopie 22452032




astrobanner2
pianoman
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08/25/2012 03:38 PM
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Re: "Curiosity Mars "landing" BIGGEST HOAX EVER!!!"
engineer
even if "they" are making you back off now-- which is what seems to be occurring here.
 Quoting: Pianoman

Oh for fuck's sakes!
 Quoting: Dr. Astro


That's your argument? An expletive? You'll note that Engineer has not been back since making his conclusion-- which was nowhere near as substantiated as his case against the lander. You simply deny that there is a "lie or die" policy in place... which is fine. I can understand the need to be complicit in covering a policy like that up. Anyone who followed Engineer's case, through this forum from the beginning, however, can detect the instant incongruous change in Engineer's style and sheer volume... not to mention his disappearance. So, Dr. Astro... woof woof.
Anonymous Coward
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08/28/2012 08:49 AM
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Re: "Curiosity Mars "landing" BIGGEST HOAX EVER!!!"
bump
Anonymous Coward
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08/28/2012 10:41 AM
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Re: "Curiosity Mars "landing" BIGGEST HOAX EVER!!!"
what's the pressure of Mars?
[link to arkcode.com]
Anonymous Coward
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08/28/2012 10:43 AM
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Re: "Curiosity Mars "landing" BIGGEST HOAX EVER!!!"
Click on next, one at a time
[link to arkcode.com]
be be
User ID: 2429514
Australia
08/29/2012 06:45 AM
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Re: "Curiosity Mars "landing" BIGGEST HOAX EVER!!!"
engineer
even if "they" are making you back off now-- which is what seems to be occurring here.
 Quoting: Pianoman

Oh for fuck's sakes!
 Quoting: Dr. Astro


That's your argument? An expletive? You'll note that Engineer has not been back since making his conclusion-- which was nowhere near as substantiated as his case against the lander. You simply deny that there is a "lie or die" policy in place... which is fine. I can understand the need to be complicit in covering a policy like that up. Anyone who followed Engineer's case, through this forum from the beginning, however, can detect the instant incongruous change in Engineer's style and sheer volume... not to mention his disappearance. So, Dr. Astro... woof woof.
 Quoting: pianoman 13563628


Very well put conclution piano man thats whats this sites about shill site. may the real engeneer step forward or is he banned for stalking.
Dr. AstroModerator
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08/29/2012 08:38 AM

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Re: "Curiosity Mars "landing" BIGGEST HOAX EVER!!!"
engineer
even if "they" are making you back off now-- which is what seems to be occurring here.
 Quoting: Pianoman

Oh for fuck's sakes!
 Quoting: Dr. Astro


That's your argument? An expletive? You'll note that Engineer has not been back since making his conclusion-- which was nowhere near as substantiated as his case against the lander. You simply deny that there is a "lie or die" policy in place... which is fine. I can understand the need to be complicit in covering a policy like that up. Anyone who followed Engineer's case, through this forum from the beginning, however, can detect the instant incongruous change in Engineer's style and sheer volume... not to mention his disappearance. So, Dr. Astro... woof woof.
 Quoting: pianoman 13563628


Very well put conclution piano man thats whats this sites about shill site. may the real engeneer step forward or is he banned for stalking.
 Quoting: be be 2429514


You're both paranoid and need help if you seriously think he was threatened rather than realized the truth.
astrobanner2
dog owner
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09/04/2012 03:18 AM
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Re: "Curiosity Mars "landing" BIGGEST HOAX EVER!!!"
...

. sakes!
 Quoting: Dr. Astro


That's your argument? An expletive? You'll note that Engineer has not been back since making his conclusion-- which was nowhere near as substantiated as his case against the lander. You simply deny that there is a "lie or die" policy in place... which is fine. I can understand the need to be complicit in covering a policy like that up. Anyone who followed Engineer's case, through this forum from the beginning, however, can detect the instant incongruous change in Engineer's style and sheer volume... not to mention his disappearance. So, Dr. Astro... woof woof.
 Quoting: pianoman 13563628


Very well put conclution piano man thats whats this sites about shill site. may the real engeneer step forward or is he banned for stalking.
 Quoting: be be 2429514

be a good dog and sit in the corner. Why has engeneer being banned!!hiding
You're both paranoid and need help if you seriously think he was threatened rather than realized the truth.
 Quoting: Dr. Astro
SmartGuy
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09/07/2012 08:44 AM
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To: the aerospace engineer with a chemistry degree and a little dick.

You are a jackass.
-150
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Russian Federation
10/06/2012 11:19 AM
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Re: "Curiosity Mars "landing" BIGGEST HOAX EVER!!!"
That's a genuinely impressive awensr.
Anonymous Coward
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10/20/2012 09:21 AM
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To: the aerospace engineer with a chemistry degree and a little dick.

You are a jackass.
 Quoting: SmartGuy 21024925


shill
James2053
User ID: 19955095
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11/30/2012 01:52 PM
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Re: "Curiosity Mars "landing" BIGGEST HOAX EVER!!!"
You would hear "it is 10 seconds since the vehicle module was released from orbit, the onboard computers are now reporting a speed of XXX based on XXX measuring devices, laser sensors are reporting a height of XXX, atmospheric pressure from the XXX device is detecting XXX, temperature sensors are reporting XXX ... it is now 1 minute ...." and so on. But they are afraid people will catch them with the fraud, so they will never do that.
 Quoting: Engineer 694654


The Engineer has logically thought this through, like a Bobby Fischer would if he hadn't cared so much about chess. I became a true believer of NASA fraud (specifically landers, not probes nor orbiters), when I easily digital signal processed many NASA archive hi-res images of the Apollo missions where the camera captured the Sun's image.

What they though was all white and wash-out had a tiny bandwidth of real data at the "whitest" frequencies. Just remove the clipped or bloomed values and stretch that tiny piece across the full bandwith and voila, a military type search beam complete with rim, 3 pronged tripod and central area housing & bulb. Compare with an earth-based image of the same thing and the signatures are identical.

So astronomers & scientists can detect traces of magnesium in a star thousands of trillions of miles away but can't see that those Apollo sun images are spot lights? Well, they can't without losing their grant.

I like the way this Engineer thinks. I wish all engineers had to take a little reality test on Apollo or Mars Curiosity technology before acceptance into a firm. If they didn't ask questions here like the Engineer or had some serious doubt, then they are out.
Anonymous Coward
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04/22/2016 10:28 PM
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Interesting story.
Anonymous Coward
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04/22/2016 10:49 PM
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Re: "Curiosity Mars "landing" BIGGEST HOAX EVER!!!"
Do you think the International Space Station is a hoax too??

Get a pair of binoculars and find a fly over time at this website

[link to spotthestation.nasa.gov (secure)]

I've done it. I saw it. It's really up there.


It's amazing humans capacity of denial when you threaten their provincial thinking.


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