Magna Carta stated "applying interest to a loan, shall be punishable with Death" | |
Indigo454 (OP) User ID: 807 United States 12/30/2005 02:04 PM Report Abusive Post Report Copyright Violation | |
Anonymous Coward User ID: 58 United States 12/30/2005 02:08 PM Report Abusive Post Report Copyright Violation | Indigo what you fail to realize is the modern banking system has made possible better lives for all as economies have grown geometrically since that time in history. I'm not saying I agree w/ 30% cc debt....but money is an asset...just like a mule. |
Indigo454 (OP) User ID: 807 United States 12/30/2005 02:11 PM Report Abusive Post Report Copyright Violation | |
Quester User ID: 41010 Canada 12/30/2005 02:33 PM Report Abusive Post Report Copyright Violation | Our monetary system has made life better and worse. Although, imo, money in itself is neutral, how it is used is what gives it power. We have allowed money to become a tool of greed and materialism instead of a symbol of services exchanged and energy flowing. Money in and of itself does neither good deeds nor bad, people make choices, use money for greater good or for selfishness. Interest charged on "loans" does not, imo, benefit the greater whole; it gives all the power to the few who control the money and they do not give a sh!t about any thing but their own selfish needs at the expense of all other life. People are like stained glass windows. They sparkle and shine when the sun is out, but when the darkness sets in, their true beauty is revealed only if there is a light from within. |
Indigo454 (OP) User ID: 807 United States 12/30/2005 02:37 PM Report Abusive Post Report Copyright Violation | |
Anonymous Coward User ID: 58 United States 12/30/2005 02:44 PM Report Abusive Post Report Copyright Violation | |
Indigo454 (OP) User ID: 807 United States 12/30/2005 02:47 PM Report Abusive Post Report Copyright Violation | |
Anonymous Coward User ID: 58 United States 12/30/2005 02:51 PM Report Abusive Post Report Copyright Violation | if you loan an asset would not expect some remuneration for "loss of use" of that asset? should you be able to live in an apoartment rent free? there must be an incentive for someone to bulid an apatrment complex (rent + capital appreciation, just as there must be an incentive to loan money (interest/repayment of principal). Now, I will take your side in the argument that interest rates are way to high, but thats a separate issue. |
Indigo454 (OP) User ID: 807 United States 12/30/2005 02:59 PM Report Abusive Post Report Copyright Violation | |
Quester User ID: 41010 Canada 12/30/2005 03:00 PM Report Abusive Post Report Copyright Violation | But this is how I choose to live, It works for me and creates no harm or debt. People are like stained glass windows. They sparkle and shine when the sun is out, but when the darkness sets in, their true beauty is revealed only if there is a light from within. |
Anonymous Coward User ID: 58 United States 12/30/2005 03:03 PM Report Abusive Post Report Copyright Violation | |
Anonymous Coward User ID: 58 United States 12/30/2005 03:05 PM Report Abusive Post Report Copyright Violation | "I have no cc, no loans, I pay my rent every month. I am looking to rent to own land or find someone willing to hold deed until payment complete. I operate on cash and if i loan someone money it is never more then I can afford to lose, interest free too. But this is how I choose to live, It works for me and creates no harm or debt." but the rent you are paying is "interest" on the asset you are using, comprende? and without loans, that apartment you are living in wouldn't exist. |
Indigo454 (OP) User ID: 807 United States 12/30/2005 03:22 PM Report Abusive Post Report Copyright Violation | |
Quester User ID: 41010 Canada 12/30/2005 03:22 PM Report Abusive Post Report Copyright Violation | Actually the home I live in was given by the man who built it, to the local old folks home when he died. This "asset" buys an awful lot for those elders and what is not spent sits in an account to pay taxes and maintenance costs. The amount of "interest" that is paid to this savings (which the bank holds, considers an asset, and loans people money against)is absolutely pitiful when compared to the interest charged on one of this bank's loans. People are like stained glass windows. They sparkle and shine when the sun is out, but when the darkness sets in, their true beauty is revealed only if there is a light from within. |
Anonymous Coward User ID: 58 United States 12/30/2005 03:27 PM Report Abusive Post Report Copyright Violation | It is this being questioned." This is an incorrect statement. I agree w/ quest that the spread between interest charged and interest paid is obscene. |
Quester User ID: 41010 Canada 12/30/2005 03:27 PM Report Abusive Post Report Copyright Violation | Well I guess they could change to a bank that pays higher interest on savings, but that will just rape someone else down the road. People are like stained glass windows. They sparkle and shine when the sun is out, but when the darkness sets in, their true beauty is revealed only if there is a light from within. |
Anonymous Coward User ID: 58 United States 12/30/2005 03:29 PM Report Abusive Post Report Copyright Violation | |
Indigo454 (OP) User ID: 807 United States 12/30/2005 03:32 PM Report Abusive Post Report Copyright Violation | 58 I would like to draw your attention back to the original theme of this thread. The Bank of England was first formed in 1694. King William of Orange was in financial difficulties as a result of a war with France. The Goldsmiths "lent him" 1.2 million pounds (a staggering amount in those days) with certain conditions: 1.The interest rate was to be 8%. It must be remembered that Magna Carta stated that the charging or collecting of interest carried the death penalty. Peace |
Quester User ID: 41010 Canada 12/30/2005 04:01 PM Report Abusive Post Report Copyright Violation | So King Bill Says to these rich goldsmith guys "Man I am so broke, Can I borrow some money till I get back on my feet, then I'll pay you back." The goldsmith guys say "Well what's in it for us? We won't have use of that money for XX years." I guess at the time it made sense to old Bill that the goldsmith guys should be compensated for the potential loss of use of the monies loaned. That is what interest charges are - compensation for potential loss of use. But as most monetary transactions are now just paper and electronics this outrageous fee is just down right greedy and self serving, and benefiting an elite few to the complete disregard for life. People are like stained glass windows. They sparkle and shine when the sun is out, but when the darkness sets in, their true beauty is revealed only if there is a light from within. |
Indigo454 (OP) User ID: 807 United States 12/30/2005 04:11 PM Report Abusive Post Report Copyright Violation | |
Quester User ID: 41010 Canada 12/30/2005 04:13 PM Report Abusive Post Report Copyright Violation | Great thread, I've enjoyed but I must get ready for work. bye People are like stained glass windows. They sparkle and shine when the sun is out, but when the darkness sets in, their true beauty is revealed only if there is a light from within. |
Indigo454 (OP) User ID: 807 United States 12/30/2005 06:09 PM Report Abusive Post Report Copyright Violation | |
Rock Reynolds nli User ID: 57761 United States 12/30/2005 07:13 PM Report Abusive Post Report Copyright Violation | |
Indigo454 (OP) User ID: 24797 United States 12/30/2005 07:18 PM Report Abusive Post Report Copyright Violation | |
Duncan Kunz User ID: 13705 United States 12/30/2005 07:45 PM Report Abusive Post Report Copyright Violation | "1...It must be remembered that Magna Carta stated that the charging or collecting of interest carried the death penalty." That is simply not true. Here is a translation of the Magna Carta,along with the original (which I can read, albeit slowly): [link to www.bl.uk] If you go through it, the only place it even mentions interest is in section 10: "10. Si quis mutuo ceperit aliquid a Judeis, plus vel minus, et moriatur antequam debitum illud solvatur, debitum non usuret quamdiu heres fuerit infra etatem, de quocumque teneat; et si debitum illud inciderit in manus nostras, nos non capiemus nisi catallum contentum in carta." In English: "(10) If anyone who has borrowed a sum of money from Jews dies before the debt has been repaid, his heir shall pay no interest on the debt for so long as he remains under age, irrespective of whom he holds his lands. If such a debt falls into the hands of the Crown, it will take nothing except the principal sum specified in the bond." This is implicit in permitting the charging of interest on a debt, even if you're a (gasp!) Jew. Where's the EVIDENCE, Jim? |
Anonymous Coward User ID: 2103 United Kingdom 12/30/2005 07:53 PM Report Abusive Post Report Copyright Violation | Indigo you clearly have no clue about basic business principles. Why would anyone risk lending money without any return? The economy simply cannot function without interest. Money has a time value or do you not understand that? |
Duncan Kunz User ID: 13705 United States 12/30/2005 07:56 PM Report Abusive Post Report Copyright Violation | |
Indigo454 (OP) User ID: 807 United States 12/30/2005 10:19 PM Report Abusive Post Report Copyright Violation | Duncan I appreciate your forum police activity and think you do an admiral job in your quest to honor every little detail of any statement made. The point was really more about William Of Orange signing the Charter for the Bank Of England and assigning this Charter to the Goldsmiths. An act which has had far reaching implications, financially for whole of humanity, but especially for the money-grabbing global elite. Peace |
Indigo454 (OP) User ID: 807 United States 12/30/2005 10:50 PM Report Abusive Post Report Copyright Violation | Just a few more points from the Magna Carta....... Neither we nor any royal official will take wood for our castle, or for any other purpose, without the consent of the owner. To any man whom we have deprived or dispossessed of lands, castles, liberties, or rights, without the lawful judgement of his equals, we will at once restore these. In future nothing shall be paid or accepted for the issue of a writ of inquisition of life or limbs. It shall be given gratis, and not refused. How things change |
Anonymous Coward User ID: 13705 United States 12/30/2005 10:53 PM Report Abusive Post Report Copyright Violation | "I appreciate your forum police activity and think you do an admiral job in your quest to honor every little detail of any statement made." If you make a comment that is simiply incorrect, AND that comment is the entire thrust of the thread, then why SHOULDN'T you draw their attention to it. It sounds to me like you would prefer your initial ideas, even if they're wrong. We can't very well be "seekers after truth" that way! "The point was really more about William Of Orange signing the Charter for the Bank Of England and assigning this Charter to the Goldsmiths." William of Orange lived in the late seventeenth/early eighteenth century, about four hundred fifty years after the charter was written and signed. I don't understand you posts, Indigo454. It seems like you want to convince people of your ideas (which is fine by me), yet the "facts" you use to support your theses are quite often incorrect. I don't think that's right, somehow. |