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The Truth about Hell - but the mainstream fundies can't accept it. and maybe you can't either

 
Anonymous Coward (OP)
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10/11/2012 12:26 PM
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Re: The Truth about Hell - but the mainstream fundies can't accept it. and maybe you can't either
...


it is punishment because you don't get to be with the Father/Creator.

there is a scripture that says that when we die we are instantly with the Father. this is true even in the purification process. it is with Divine Holy fire that we are purified. God is present every moment of it.

Everyone will go thru this process. The thing is, is how long will it take?
 Quoting: Salt


But you stated, "they will cease to exist (eternally)?"

You're not contradicting yourself.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 25304079


maybe i am not explaining myself well.

when you die, you will go thru a purification process. it takes as long as it takes. for some, they refuse to repent (become purified) therefore they cannot reside in the holiest place.

holy cannot be in the same place as unholy.
if there is anything unholy in a person, it is either "burned away" with holy divine "fire" or it isn't.

for those that refuse to be purified, they will go to the same place as Satan, the False Prophet, demons and death. This is the second death. there is no more for these after that point. They simply will not exist anymore.

tell me something, when you are face to face with Jesus, will you still deny Him? hardly.

but, some will. some will refuse to let go of the evil parts of themselves. these will be eradicated with all evil.
 Quoting: Salt


None will refuse forever.

Philippians 10That at the name of Jesus every knee should bow, of things in heaven, and things in earth, and things under the earth;

11And that every tongue should confess that Jesus Christ is Lord, to the glory of God the Father.

God intends to reconcile 'all'

Colossians 1:20 And, having made peace through the blood of his cross, by him to reconcile all things unto himself; by him, I say, whether they be things in earth, or things in heaven.

You are right about the separation of the good from the evil. When we read about the New Jerusalem coming down from heaven in Revelation, we see that it says that there are those that are 'without' the city.

Revelation 22:
14Blessed are they that do his commandments, that they may have right to the tree of life, and may enter in through the gates into the city.15For without are dogs, and sorcerers, and whoremongers, and murderers, and idolaters, and whosoever loveth and maketh a lie.

This shows that the wicked are still there, but they are now shown 'without' the city. In other words they can not come into the city until they have been cleansed & repented of their wickedness.

Hell is being away from all of the good and living in a place with all of the evil ones. That is why there will be weeping and gnashing of teeth. No one will want to stay out there very long.

This is one reason why there will be kings and priests on the earth then. To help instruct and teach these evil ones in righteousness.


Revelation 5:10 And hast made us unto our God kings and priests: and we shall reign on the earth.


Consider this

Mark 7:25For a certain woman, whose young daughter had an unclean spirit, heard of him, and came and fell at his feet:

26The woman was a Greek, a Syrophenician by nation; and she besought him that he would cast forth the devil out of her daughter.

27But Jesus said unto her, Let the children first be filled: for it is not meet to take the children's bread, and to cast it unto the dogs.

28And she answered and said unto him, Yes, Lord: yet the dogs under the table eat of the children's crumbs.
29And he said unto her, For this saying go thy way; the devil is gone out of thy daughter.

This woman understood that the ones without would also benefit from the kingdom teachings. By His answer Jesus showed she was right.
 Quoting: _2 swords_


YES!
_2 swords_

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Re: The Truth about Hell - but the mainstream fundies can't accept it. and maybe you can't either
None will refuse forever.

Philippians 10That at the name of Jesus every knee should bow, of things in heaven, and things in earth, and things under the earth;

11And that every tongue should confess that Jesus Christ is Lord, to the glory of God the Father.

God intends to reconcile 'all'

Colossians 1:20 And, having made peace through the blood of his cross, by him to reconcile all things unto himself; by him, I say, whether they be things in earth, or things in heaven.
 Quoting: _2 swords_


All will be made to bow the knee, but not all will do so willingly. No one can be forced to love God; it is impossible. And without love, there is no relationship, and no citizenship, and no adoption. You'd also have to include Satan et al, who clearly will never repent.

As for reconciling all, see 2 Cor. 5:18-21 "Yet it all comes from God, the One who reconciled us to himself by means of the Anointed and assigned us to this service of reconciliation. Through the Anointed God reconciled the world to himself, not holding their faults against them, and gave us the message of reconciliation. That means we are the Anointed's representatives and God pleads through us. So, on behalf of the Anointed, we plead with you to be reconciled to God! For this One who knew no sin was made sin for our sakes, so that because of Him we can become right with God."

Paul says two things that seem on the surface to be contradictory: we are reconciled, and we need to be reconciled. But the answer is clear when we remember what it means to reconcile. It cannot be done by only one person, even God; it takes two to reconcile, and both must be willing. So God offers reconciliation to all, but not all accept.
 Quoting: Keep2theCode


There are no exceptions to all and every.

Yes all will willingly reconcile in the end.

God is alpha and omega and He knows His creation and what they will do.

He did not make anyone to be eternally punished. All things have had to work together in order for us all to learn the difference in good and evil and to willingly choose the good.
Anonymous Coward (OP)
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10/11/2012 12:30 PM
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Re: The Truth about Hell - but the mainstream fundies can't accept it. and maybe you can't either
"So God offers reconciliation to all, but not all accept."

agreed. scripture does tell us that some will not be reconciled. a small number, but still some will not.
X^24

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10/11/2012 12:32 PM
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Re: The Truth about Hell - but the mainstream fundies can't accept it. and maybe you can't either
The word "gospel" literally translated means good news, and that it is, even for those that don't follow it's precepts.

The vast majority of people on this Earth will inherit a degree of glory even the least of which would cause many men and women to commit suicide to immediately attain it. Only those spirits that followed Satan in the pre-existence and those that deny the holy ghost after having received a sure knowledge of it shall not inherit a degree of glory per this passage recently posted on this very thread.

“And whosoever speaketh a word against the Son of man, it shall be forgiven him: but whosoever speaketh against the Holy Ghost, it shall not be forgiven him, neither in this world, neither in the world to come” (Matt. 12:31–32).

Why the distinction?
Thread: GOD IS ABSOLUTELY AMAZING! AMEN!!! (Page 6)
 Quoting: X^24


Where is the scripture that teaches or shows anyone getting a second chance in the next life?
 Quoting: Keep2theCode


A fragment of a plain and precious truth:

"Else what shall they do which are baptized for the dead, if the dead rise not at all? why are they then baptized for the dead?" (1 Corinthians, 15:29) - [link to www.14lds.com]
The deception continues to crumble.
Thread: Tips for improving the GLP experience.
Christ was mischaracterized to the point of Crucifixion.
Anonymous Coward (OP)
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10/11/2012 12:32 PM
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Re: The Truth about Hell - but the mainstream fundies can't accept it. and maybe you can't either
the idea here is to accept Jesus in THIS life.
that is the teaching.
but, for those who refuse, well... it won't be pretty for those. but its a far stretch from burning in hell forever like the fundies want to teach.
sylvie

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10/11/2012 12:33 PM

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Re: The Truth about Hell - but the mainstream fundies can't accept it. and maybe you can't either
"... The 'logic' of hell in the bible is surprisingly simple: You receive back the treatment/effects you gave other agents (including God and yourself) with some kind of multiplier effect. [The bible is full of images of this reciprocity concept: reaping what you sow, being paid back, suffering loss as you had despoiled others, unkindness for unkindness shown, apathy for apathy rendered, 'eye for an eye', proportional judgement, etc] This is suited as well to what we have said of honor debts and shame as a response. You dishonor God; you receive dishonor in return. Appropriately your required response is to acknowledge your own need -- in effect, giving up your "honor" -- by admitting that you need God's help to pay the debt. ..."

[link to www.broadcaster.org.uk]
 Quoting: Salt


Makes a lot more sense to me than the tales of everlasting fire and brimstone. Many people who had NDEs say they underwent some kind of detailed "Life Review," where they saw everything good and bad they did... and they relived the bad from the viewpoint of their "victims."

I also believe in reincarnation; what you do to others in this lifetime, you'll have to endure yourself in another lifetime, to learn from your mistakes.
Keep2theCode

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10/11/2012 12:34 PM
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Re: The Truth about Hell - but the mainstream fundies can't accept it. and maybe you can't either
There are no exceptions to all and every.

Yes all will willingly reconcile in the end.

God is alpha and omega and He knows His creation and what they will do.

He did not make anyone to be eternally punished. All things have had to work together in order for us all to learn the difference in good and evil and to willingly choose the good.
 Quoting: _2 swords_


There are no exceptions to the meaning of reconcile.

There is no indication that all who are made to bow are reconciled, or that they ever will to do so; you can't just claim they will.

God made us with a free will, and it isn't free if we cannot refuse him. This is much more than a moral lesson; it's a choice between accepting God and rejecting Him. The very gospel itself hinges on this point, not a moral lesson.
Have I now become your enemy by telling you the truth? (Gal. 4:16)
sylvie

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10/11/2012 12:35 PM

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Re: The Truth about Hell - but the mainstream fundies can't accept it. and maybe you can't either
the idea here is to accept Jesus in THIS life.
that is the teaching.
but, for those who refuse, well... it won't be pretty for those. but its a far stretch from burning in hell forever like the fundies want to teach.
 Quoting: Salt


Sorry, but that's one thing I can't believe. If I were a first-class person, modest, kind, always there for others and serving others' needs but didn't believe in Jesus, I don't think I'd be kicked out of heaven.
Anonymous Coward (OP)
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10/11/2012 12:36 PM
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Re: The Truth about Hell - but the mainstream fundies can't accept it. and maybe you can't either
the idea here is to accept Jesus in THIS life.
that is the teaching.
but, for those who refuse, well... it won't be pretty for those. but its a far stretch from burning in hell forever like the fundies want to teach.
 Quoting: Salt


Sorry, but that's one thing I can't believe. If I were a first-class person, modest, kind, always there for others and serving others' needs but didn't believe in Jesus, I don't think I'd be kicked out of heaven.
 Quoting: sylvie


you can't become holy merely by being a good person in this life.
X^24

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10/11/2012 12:37 PM
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Re: The Truth about Hell - but the mainstream fundies can't accept it. and maybe you can't either
the idea here is to accept Jesus in THIS life.
that is the teaching.
but, for those who refuse, well... it won't be pretty for those. but its a far stretch from burning in hell forever like the fundies want to teach.
 Quoting: Salt


What of the billions of people that never had any chance to hear the gospel?
The deception continues to crumble.
Thread: Tips for improving the GLP experience.
Christ was mischaracterized to the point of Crucifixion.
Anonymous Coward (OP)
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Re: The Truth about Hell - but the mainstream fundies can't accept it. and maybe you can't either
There are no exceptions to all and every.

Yes all will willingly reconcile in the end.

God is alpha and omega and He knows His creation and what they will do.

He did not make anyone to be eternally punished. All things have had to work together in order for us all to learn the difference in good and evil and to willingly choose the good.
 Quoting: _2 swords_


There are no exceptions to the meaning of reconcile.

There is no indication that all who are made to bow are reconciled, or that they ever will to do so; you can't just claim they will.

God made us with a free will, and it isn't free if we cannot refuse him. This is much more than a moral lesson; it's a choice between accepting God and rejecting Him. The very gospel itself hinges on this point, not a moral lesson.
 Quoting: Keep2theCode


not all will be reconciled. it is of their own choosing.
Keep2theCode

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10/11/2012 12:42 PM
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Re: The Truth about Hell - but the mainstream fundies can't accept it. and maybe you can't either
"So God offers reconciliation to all, but not all accept."

agreed. but, scripture does tell us that some will not be reconciled. a small number, but still some will not.
 Quoting: Salt

I still await scriptural support for anyone at all ever getting a second chance after this life.

the idea here is to accept Jesus in THIS life.
that is the teaching.
but, for those who refuse, well... it won't be pretty for those. but its a far stretch from burning in hell forever like the fundies want to teach.
 Quoting: Salt


The bottom line is indeed that people need to accept Jesus in this life. As Paul told the Greeks, God had overlooked ignorance of Himself in the past, but now that Jesus has risen from the dead, there are no more excuses.

But whether there is an eternal hell is not up to "fundies" but the whole teaching of scripture. The OT tells us very little, but the NT speaks of the everlasting nature of both life and death, salvation and separation, and the finality of one's moral state when the Millennium ends.

I cannot read about child torturers and think that eternal hell is adequate punishment for the monsters who do this. If that's what "fundies" teach, I gladly stand with them on this point, because I love the victims more than the perpetrators. Justice will be done, and God Himself says "Vengeance is mine, I will repay". I cannot imagine a heaven where the child killer and the child shake hands and let bygones be bygones.
Have I now become your enemy by telling you the truth? (Gal. 4:16)
Anonymous Coward (OP)
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10/11/2012 12:46 PM
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Re: The Truth about Hell - but the mainstream fundies can't accept it. and maybe you can't either
"So God offers reconciliation to all, but not all accept."

agreed. but, scripture does tell us that some will not be reconciled. a small number, but still some will not.
 Quoting: Salt

I still await scriptural support for anyone at all ever getting a second chance after this life.

the idea here is to accept Jesus in THIS life.
that is the teaching.
but, for those who refuse, well... it won't be pretty for those. but its a far stretch from burning in hell forever like the fundies want to teach.
 Quoting: Salt


The bottom line is indeed that people need to accept Jesus in this life. As Paul told the Greeks, God had overlooked ignorance of Himself in the past, but now that Jesus has risen from the dead, there are no more excuses.

But whether there is an eternal hell is not up to "fundies" but the whole teaching of scripture. The OT tells us very little, but the NT speaks of the everlasting nature of both life and death, salvation and separation, and the finality of one's moral state when the Millennium ends.

I cannot read about child torturers and think that eternal hell is adequate punishment for the monsters who do this. If that's what "fundies" teach, I gladly stand with them on this point, because I love the victims more than the perpetrators. Justice will be done, and God Himself says "Vengeance is mine, I will repay". I cannot imagine a heaven where the child killer and the child shake hands and let bygones be bygones.
 Quoting: Keep2theCode


sister in Christ, the scriptural support was already given.
there will be nothing evil in heaven. holy will not be in the same place as unholy. all sin is on equal playing field with God. He is the judge, not us.
_2 swords_

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Re: The Truth about Hell - but the mainstream fundies can't accept it. and maybe you can't either
There are no exceptions to all and every.

Yes all will willingly reconcile in the end.

God is alpha and omega and He knows His creation and what they will do.

He did not make anyone to be eternally punished. All things have had to work together in order for us all to learn the difference in good and evil and to willingly choose the good.
 Quoting: _2 swords_


There are no exceptions to the meaning of reconcile.

There is no indication that all who are made to bow are reconciled, or that they ever will to do so; you can't just claim they will.

God made us with a free will, and it isn't free if we cannot refuse him. This is much more than a moral lesson; it's a choice between accepting God and rejecting Him. The very gospel itself hinges on this point, not a moral lesson.
 Quoting: Keep2theCode


You are just spinning the simple words of 'all' and 'every'.

Once you come to realize that God indeed plans to reconcile all of His creation you will love Him even more.

If death and hell, which are 'conditions' are cast into the lake of fire, this means they no longer exist. So then, this also means that no one can go there since they no longer exist.

Revelation 20:14And death and hell were cast into the lake of fire. This is the second death.
15And whosoever was not found written in the book of life was cast into the lake of fire.

The catch is that 'everyone' that has had life is in the book of life, because they have lived.


No matter what we believe though, things will be as God determines. The main thing is to believe in Jesus and trust Him to do all He says He will do. This alone makes us brothers and sisters in His kingdom and that is what we should act like to each other and treat each other the way that we would if His kingdom were already here.
Anonymous Coward (OP)
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10/11/2012 12:57 PM
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Re: The Truth about Hell - but the mainstream fundies can't accept it. and maybe you can't either
There are no exceptions to all and every.

Yes all will willingly reconcile in the end.

God is alpha and omega and He knows His creation and what they will do.

He did not make anyone to be eternally punished. All things have had to work together in order for us all to learn the difference in good and evil and to willingly choose the good.
 Quoting: _2 swords_


There are no exceptions to the meaning of reconcile.

There is no indication that all who are made to bow are reconciled, or that they ever will to do so; you can't just claim they will.

God made us with a free will, and it isn't free if we cannot refuse him. This is much more than a moral lesson; it's a choice between accepting God and rejecting Him. The very gospel itself hinges on this point, not a moral lesson.
 Quoting: Keep2theCode




Once you come to realize that God indeed plans to reconcile all of His creation you will love Him even more.


 Quoting: _2 swords_


this.
the deception is that God is a torturer if we do not bow down. the deception takes the LOVE out of the whole thing. many are being led astray, refusing God because of this false message.

God never intended for people to go to the eternal lake of fire. His plan is to reconcile EVERYONE and avails ample opportunity to do so.
_2 swords_

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10/11/2012 01:08 PM
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Re: The Truth about Hell - but the mainstream fundies can't accept it. and maybe you can't either
There are no exceptions to all and every.

Yes all will willingly reconcile in the end.

God is alpha and omega and He knows His creation and what they will do.

He did not make anyone to be eternally punished. All things have had to work together in order for us all to learn the difference in good and evil and to willingly choose the good.
 Quoting: _2 swords_


There are no exceptions to the meaning of reconcile.

There is no indication that all who are made to bow are reconciled, or that they ever will to do so; you can't just claim they will.

God made us with a free will, and it isn't free if we cannot refuse him. This is much more than a moral lesson; it's a choice between accepting God and rejecting Him. The very gospel itself hinges on this point, not a moral lesson.
 Quoting: Keep2theCode




Once you come to realize that God indeed plans to reconcile all of His creation you will love Him even more.


 Quoting: _2 swords_


this.
the deception is that God is a torturer if we do not bow down. the deception takes the LOVE out of the whole thing. many are being led astray, refusing God because of this false message.

God never intended for people to go to the eternal lake of fire. His plan is to reconcile EVERYONE and avails ample opportunity to do so.
 Quoting: Salt


Yes, that is a lie that God wants to burn anyone.

In fact He said He it is an abomination.

Jeremiah 32:32Because of all the evil of the children of Israel and of the children of Judah, which they have done to provoke me to anger, they, their kings, their princes, their priests, and their prophets, and the men of Judah, and the inhabitants of Jerusalem.

33And they have turned unto me the back, and not the face: though I taught them, rising up early and teaching them, yet they have not hearkened to receive instruction.

34But they set their abominations in the house, which is called by my name, to defile it.

35And they built the high places of Baal, which are in the valley of the son of Hinnom, to cause their sons and their daughters to pass through the fire unto Molech; which I commanded them not, neither came it into my mind, that they should do this abomination, to cause Judah to sin.

The teaching of hellfire is comparable to these evil teachings and we see how God felt about it.
Keep2theCode

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Re: The Truth about Hell - but the mainstream fundies can't accept it. and maybe you can't either
sister in Christ, the scriptural support was already given.
there will be nothing evil in heaven. holy will not be in the same place as unholy. all sin is on equal playing field with God. He is the judge, not us.
 Quoting: Salt


I'm sorry, but I didn't see any scripture that says anyone gets another chance after this life. I do agree that nothing bad will be in heaven of course; not sure the reason for adding that.
Have I now become your enemy by telling you the truth? (Gal. 4:16)
Anonymous Coward (OP)
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Re: The Truth about Hell - but the mainstream fundies can't accept it. and maybe you can't either
sister in Christ, the scriptural support was already given.
there will be nothing evil in heaven. holy will not be in the same place as unholy. all sin is on equal playing field with God. He is the judge, not us.
 Quoting: Salt


I'm sorry, but I didn't see any scripture that says anyone gets another chance after this life. I do agree that nothing bad will be in heaven of course; not sure the reason for adding that.
 Quoting: Keep2theCode


encapsulate all that was given, scripture and analysis.
it is plain.

i will try to repost in a way that points directly to what you are asking in a short and sweet way.

gimme a sec. i am multi-tasking right now.
Keep2theCode

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Re: The Truth about Hell - but the mainstream fundies can't accept it. and maybe you can't either
Question to both of you:

Can one person force another to reconcile?

And we can't get around the problem by saying God finds a way to make them "want" to choose it. This would make choice and free will a farce.
Have I now become your enemy by telling you the truth? (Gal. 4:16)
Anonymous Coward (OP)
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Re: The Truth about Hell - but the mainstream fundies can't accept it. and maybe you can't either
Question to both of you:

Can one person force another to reconcile?

And we can't get around the problem by saying God finds a way to make them "want" to choose it. This would make choice and free will a farce.
 Quoting: Keep2theCode


God doesn't force anyone to choose it.
it happens when the obvious is in front of you.
nobody can do this for another.
Keep2theCode

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Re: The Truth about Hell - but the mainstream fundies can't accept it. and maybe you can't either
Question to both of you:

Can one person force another to reconcile?

And we can't get around the problem by saying God finds a way to make them "want" to choose it. This would make choice and free will a farce.
 Quoting: Keep2theCode


God doesn't force anyone to choose it.
it happens when the obvious is in front of you.
nobody can do this for another.
 Quoting: Salt


People can look God straight in the eye and still reject him. Salvation is not simply believing that God exists, as James made clear. It is reconciliation, and there is absolutely no guarantee that all who see God will accept "the obvious".

God has made salvation by faith, not sight. If people won't accept him here, they won't accept him there. So again, and in the absence of scriptures indicating otherwise, no one who rejects Jesus in this life will accept him in the next.
Have I now become your enemy by telling you the truth? (Gal. 4:16)
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Re: The Truth about Hell - but the mainstream fundies can't accept it. and maybe you can't either
Question to both of you:

Can one person force another to reconcile?

And we can't get around the problem by saying God finds a way to make them "want" to choose it. This would make choice and free will a farce.
 Quoting: Keep2theCode


God doesn't force anyone to choose it.
it happens when the obvious is in front of you.
nobody can do this for another.
 Quoting: Salt


People can look God straight in the eye and still reject him. Salvation is not simply believing that God exists, as James made clear. It is reconciliation, and there is absolutely no guarantee that all who see God will accept "the obvious".

God has made salvation by faith, not sight. If people won't accept him here, they won't accept him there. So again, and in the absence of scriptures indicating otherwise, no one who rejects Jesus in this life will accept him in the next.
 Quoting: Keep2theCode


i think it has more to do with letting go of sin and evil. this is where the problem lies. it's not just seeing Jesus face to face and not accepting it. that's part, but the other part is not letting the purification process complete.

it seems to me that in some scripture that we really do not comprehend how deeply embedded sin gets enmeshed. Jesus talks about it.
_2 swords_

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Re: The Truth about Hell - but the mainstream fundies can't accept it. and maybe you can't either
Question to both of you:

Can one person force another to reconcile?

And we can't get around the problem by saying God finds a way to make them "want" to choose it. This would make choice and free will a farce.
 Quoting: Keep2theCode


God doesn't force anyone to choose it.
it happens when the obvious is in front of you.
nobody can do this for another.
 Quoting: Salt


People can look God straight in the eye and still reject him. Salvation is not simply believing that God exists, as James made clear. It is reconciliation, and there is absolutely no guarantee that all who see God will accept "the obvious".

God has made salvation by faith, not sight. If people won't accept him here, they won't accept him there. So again, and in the absence of scriptures indicating otherwise, no one who rejects Jesus in this life will accept him in the next.
 Quoting: Keep2theCode


We can believe it because He says so.

Colossians 1:20 And, having made peace through the blood of his cross, by him to reconcile all things unto himself; by him, I say, whether they be things in earth, or things in heaven.

What is the point of a resurrection if there is no second chance? What is the point of a second death if the first one is final?
Keep2theCode

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Re: The Truth about Hell - but the mainstream fundies can't accept it. and maybe you can't either
i think it has more to do with letting go of sin and evil. this is where the problem lies. it's not just seeing Jesus face to face and not accepting it. that's part, but the other part is not letting the purification process complete.

it seems to me that in some scripture that we really do not comprehend how deeply embedded sin gets enmeshed. Jesus talks about it.
 Quoting: Salt


But this all hinges on accepting your view in the first place, that this is purification and not punishment. Still, there is not one scripture showing anyone "letting the purification process complete". This is what I'm asking you to back up. Where is this taught or shown? Where does it say that some will be purified in the next life?
Have I now become your enemy by telling you the truth? (Gal. 4:16)
Jam
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10/11/2012 01:40 PM
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Re: The Truth about Hell - but the mainstream fundies can't accept it. and maybe you can't either
"to be absent the body and to be present with the Lord."

The verse would seem to contradict Jesus who said the state of the dead is sleep until his Second Coming. What Paul was saying is the next waking moment will be with the Lord at that second coming. When we sleep, waking up seems like just a moment. We do not remember sleep. Our next waking moment will be with the Lord.

Jesus called forth Lazarus. He did not coll him down from heaven or some other place. Jesus said "Lazarus sleeps".
-
Malachi 4:1 For, behold, the day comes, that shall burn as an oven; and all the proud, yes, and all that do wickedly, shall be stubble: and the day that comes shall burn them up, said the LORD of hosts, that it shall leave them neither root nor branch.

Psalms 37:20 But the wicked shall perish, and the enemies of the LORD shall be as the fat of lambs: they shall consume; into smoke shall they consume away.

Obadiah 1:16 For as you have drunk on my holy mountain, so shall all the heathen drink continually, yes, they shall drink, and they shall swallow down, and they shall be as though they had not been.


Sodom and Gomorrah being an example of what is to come.

Luk 17:29 But the same day that Lot went out of Sodom it rained fire and brimstone from heaven, and destroyed them all.

2 Pet 2:6 And turning the cities of Sodom and Gomorrha into ashes condemned them with an overthrow, making them an ensample to those that after should live ungodly;

Jude 1:7 Even as Sodom and Gomorrha, and the cities about them in like manner, giving themselves over to fornication, and going after strange flesh, are set forth for an example, suffering the vengeance of eternal fire.


The lost will "perish"

Romans 6:23 For the wages of sin is death; but the gift of God is eternal life through Jesus Christ our Lord.

Ez.18:23 Have I any pleasure at all that the wicked should die? said the Lord GOD: and not that he should return from his ways, and live?

Depart from evil, and do good; and dwell for ever more. -Psalms 37:27

For the LORD loves judgment, and forsakes not his saints; they are preserved for ever: but the seed of the wicked shall be cut off. -Psalms 37:28

The righteous shall inherit the land, and dwell therein for ever. -Psalms 37:29

In the way of righteousness is life: and in the pathway thereof there is no death. -Proverbs 12:28

For God so loved the world, that he gave his only begotten Son, that whoever believes in him should not perish, but have everlasting life. -John 3:16

To them who by patient continuance in well doing seek for glory and honor and immortality, eternal life: -Romans 2:7

For the wages of sin is death; but the gift of God is eternal life through Jesus Christ our Lord. -Romans 6:23

So when this corruptible shall have put on incorruption, and this mortal shall have put on immortality, then shall be brought to pass the saying that is written, Death is swallowed up in victory. -1 Corinthians 15:54

But is now made manifest by the appearing of our Savior Jesus Christ, who has abolished death, and has brought life and immortality to light through the gospel: -2 Timothy 1:10

___

When the Smoke Clears

[link to www.youtube.com]

Even the earliest of Protestant Reformers understood this truth about Hell..

[link to biblelight.net]

Enoch, Elijah and Moses are still in their graves!

[link to www.cgom.org]



[link to www.helltruth.com]
[link to www.truthaboutdeath.com]
Life and Love

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10/11/2012 01:40 PM
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Re: The Truth about Hell - but the mainstream fundies can't accept it. and maybe you can't either
"So God offers reconciliation to all, but not all accept."

agreed. scripture does tell us that some will not be reconciled. a small number, but still some will not.
 Quoting: Salt


I the eternal optimist thinks this number will be quite small.
We become like that to which we are devoted. Choose wisely.
Keep2theCode

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10/11/2012 01:41 PM
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Re: The Truth about Hell - but the mainstream fundies can't accept it. and maybe you can't either
We can believe it because He says so.

Colossians 1:20 And, having made peace through the blood of his cross, by him to reconcile all things unto himself; by him, I say, whether they be things in earth, or things in heaven.

What is the point of a resurrection if there is no second chance? What is the point of a second death if the first one is final?
 Quoting: _2 swords_


You're not addressing the meaning of reconcile, and the need for both parties to willingly accept it.

The point of resurrection is to spend eternity wherever we chose: with God or apart from God. The first death is physical, a separation of body and spirit. The second is spiritual, a separation of spirit from God.
Have I now become your enemy by telling you the truth? (Gal. 4:16)
_2 swords_

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10/11/2012 01:47 PM
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Re: The Truth about Hell - but the mainstream fundies can't accept it. and maybe you can't either
We can believe it because He says so.

Colossians 1:20 And, having made peace through the blood of his cross, by him to reconcile all things unto himself; by him, I say, whether they be things in earth, or things in heaven.

What is the point of a resurrection if there is no second chance? What is the point of a second death if the first one is final?
 Quoting: _2 swords_


You're not addressing the meaning of reconcile, and the need for both parties to willingly accept it.

The point of resurrection is to spend eternity wherever we chose: with God or apart from God. The first death is physical, a separation of body and spirit. The second is spiritual, a separation of spirit from God.
 Quoting: Keep2theCode


Ok, you want the meaning of reconcile.

RECONCI'LE, v.t. [L. reconcilio; re and concilio; con and calo, to call, Gr. The literal sense is to call back into union.]


1. To conciliate anew; to call back into union and friendship the affections which have been alienated; to restore to friendship or favor after estrangement; as, to reconcile men or parties that have been at variance.

Go thy way; first be reconciled to thy brother - Matt. 5.

We pray you in Christ's stead, be ye reconciled to God.
2Cor. 5. Eph. 2. Col. 1.


2. To bring to acquiescence, content or quiet submission; with to; as, to reconcile one's self to afflictions. It is our duty to be reconciled to the dispensations of Providence.

3. To make consistent or congruous; to bring to agreement or suitableness; followed by with or to.

The great men among the ancients understood how to reconcile manual labor with affairs of state.

Some figures monstrous and misshap'd appear, considered singly, or beheld too near; which but proportion'd to their light and place, due distance reconciles to form and grace.

4. To adjust; to settle; as, to reconcile differences or quarrels.



Colossians 1:20 And, having made peace through the blood of his cross, by him to reconcile all things unto himself; by him, I say, whether they be things in earth, or things in heaven.

The blood of Christ was for the purpose of this reconciliation. This is scriptural, that by Him 'all' things will be reconciled.

Last Edited by _2 swords_ on 10/11/2012 01:50 PM
Keep2theCode

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10/11/2012 01:49 PM
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Re: The Truth about Hell - but the mainstream fundies can't accept it. and maybe you can't either
Ok, you want the meaning of reconcile.

RECONCI'LE, v.t. [L. reconcilio; re and concilio; con and calo, to call, Gr. The literal sense is to call back into union.]


1. To conciliate anew; to call back into union and friendship the affections which have been alienated; to restore to friendship or favor after estrangement; as, to reconcile men or parties that have been at variance.

Go thy way; first be reconciled to thy brother - Matt. 5.

We pray you in Christ's stead, be ye reconciled to God.
2Cor. 5. Eph. 2. Col. 1.


2. To bring to acquiescence, content or quiet submission; with to; as, to reconcile one's self to afflictions. It is our duty to be reconciled to the dispensations of Providence.

3. To make consistent or congruous; to bring to agreement or suitableness; followed by with or to.

The great men among the ancients understood how to reconcile manual labor with affairs of state.

Some figures monstrous and misshap'd appear, considered singly, or beheld too near; which but proportion'd to their light and place, due distance reconciles to form and grace.

4. To adjust; to settle; as, to reconcile differences or quarrels.



Colossians 1:20 And, having made peace through the blood of his cross, by him to reconcile all things unto himself; by him, I say, whether they be things in earth, or things in heaven.
 Quoting: _2 swords_


You still don't understand what I'm saying. Of course this is the def. of reconcile, but ONE PERSON CANNOT FORCE ANOTHER TO DO IT; IT TAKES TWO willing parties. And you keep ignoring the scripture that says "BE RECONCILED TO GOD". You have no answer as to why Paul would say "you are reconciled" and then also "you need to be reconciled".

Do you honestly believe Satan will be reconciled to God??
Have I now become your enemy by telling you the truth? (Gal. 4:16)
_2 swords_

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10/11/2012 01:51 PM
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Re: The Truth about Hell - but the mainstream fundies can't accept it. and maybe you can't either
Ok, you want the meaning of reconcile.

RECONCI'LE, v.t. [L. reconcilio; re and concilio; con and calo, to call, Gr. The literal sense is to call back into union.]


1. To conciliate anew; to call back into union and friendship the affections which have been alienated; to restore to friendship or favor after estrangement; as, to reconcile men or parties that have been at variance.

Go thy way; first be reconciled to thy brother - Matt. 5.

We pray you in Christ's stead, be ye reconciled to God.
2Cor. 5. Eph. 2. Col. 1.


2. To bring to acquiescence, content or quiet submission; with to; as, to reconcile one's self to afflictions. It is our duty to be reconciled to the dispensations of Providence.

3. To make consistent or congruous; to bring to agreement or suitableness; followed by with or to.

The great men among the ancients understood how to reconcile manual labor with affairs of state.

Some figures monstrous and misshap'd appear, considered singly, or beheld too near; which but proportion'd to their light and place, due distance reconciles to form and grace.

4. To adjust; to settle; as, to reconcile differences or quarrels.



Colossians 1:20 And, having made peace through the blood of his cross, by him to reconcile all things unto himself; by him, I say, whether they be things in earth, or things in heaven.
 Quoting: _2 swords_


You still don't understand what I'm saying. Of course this is the def. of reconcile, but ONE PERSON CANNOT FORCE ANOTHER TO DO IT; IT TAKES TWO willing parties. And you keep ignoring the scripture that says "BE RECONCILED TO GOD". You have no answer as to why Paul would say "you are reconciled" and then also "you need to be reconciled".

Do you honestly believe Satan will be reconciled to God??
 Quoting: Keep2theCode


Yes, I believe that 'all' means all even Satan.

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