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Supply Chain Disruptions from Sandy-PLEASE REPORT- NY, NJ, CT, PA,

 
Anonymous Coward (OP)
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11/04/2012 10:35 AM
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Re: Supply Chain Disruptions from Sandy-PLEASE REPORT- NY, NJ, CT, PA,
NORMAL = Trucks don't sit idling wasting gas. Trains dont sit idle waiting for trucks. Debris is rare and quickly cleared away. People feel no sense of panic, and do not clog up traffic routes, and empty fuel supplies in a panicked fashion.

What we have here is the opposite of normal, debris will take weeks to clear, trucks are idling with consumers clogging routes, taking all available gasoline. Trains are not meeting their loads and timetables, such a situation will worsen if not alleviated.

Each day of 'disruption' causes a weakening in the system to handle that disruption. Kinda like the classic scene with Lucy at the candy factory, the candy keeps coming but it doesn't matter because the system breaks down. If the candy stops, sure she can get a hold of things, but the NEEDS require the candy machine to flow even faster.

I won't say that this is full on doom, but if this were the "Street Fighter" video game, and the East Coast was Ryu, well, he just got hit by a severe Ha-Do-Ken and his health gauge is below half.

The weakness means further hits will not be received as well, therefore, yes, "ripe for disaster" is what I would call it.

Also it is due to years of JIT hypnosis, a diseased meme which this new generation of money-seeking gamblers called managers, have bought into. They have ruined America, these modern day businessmen with no sense. We need a modern day Joseph to take the ring of Pharaoh and order the nation to 'store up grain for seven years' because only such an event can cure the mental wrongness of this just in time modality. It's terminally vectored, and will surely destroy the nation eventually. What we need is warehouses and common sense people to stock them and dispense. But the anti-commies will never allow that to happen. We're fucked by anti-commies and fucked by commies. HA
 Quoting: bogged down 2913271


Excellent incite and I love Street Fighter. I think you have a very fair assessment of this situation.

It will start popping its ugly head in other parts of the country I would think. Not on the food level but you can see for the PDF link above that 23%(I think) of Chinese imports come into NY Harbor. Christmas and Hanukkah around the corner you may see a shortage of toys and other things of that nature elsewhere.
Anonymous Coward (OP)
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11/04/2012 10:39 AM
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Re: Supply Chain Disruptions from Sandy-PLEASE REPORT- NY, NJ, CT, PA,
I just drove from Maine ( where sandy brought us crazy 17' waves and 60mph winds) to the south, I filled up in Mass and agin in Ct as I heard that there were gas shortages. And I took 84 to 81 to avoid the city. There was no gas available at any of the 4 stations i stopped at on 84- just long lines of confused alarmed people w 60 people in line at subway and other food joints, but plastic bags on the gas nozzles and no gas signs in the windows of the stations. It was the same story at each stop, no gas, freaked people and more motorists stranded on the side of the hwy with no gas! I crossed into Pennsylvania with less than a quarter tank and saw a station w a line maybe 40 cars in line, cops at the station. Attendants pumping 15 gal per car. It was freaky. The news hasn't reported how wide spread this issue is and will be for some time. And don't forget people are still missing trapped cold and hungry in staten island and there's another storm on the way... Weird and scarey times, y'all!
 Quoting: blackstar


Thanks for the info. From what we have researched, it appears that NY Harbor provides a large amount to CT and Mass so that fact that it is spreading to those areas confirms the conditions we think are at the Harbor/Refinieries. etc. Most of the new gas coming in has been through PA so if they are rationing as well than yes, the problem is spreading quickly.

That Stretch of 84 across NY State to 81 is pretty barron too. Not like the West but You are saying that Binghampton, NY is also having gas lines now??

Have a safe trip and keep us posted.
Anonymous Coward (OP)
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11/04/2012 10:41 AM
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Re: Supply Chain Disruptions from Sandy-PLEASE REPORT- NY, NJ, CT, PA,
i live in mass. i work for a computer repair company and 2 of our parts suppliers were out of new jersey, one is not open any longer obviously, and the other lost their warehouse out in new jersey so now they are scrambling to get parts out of a warehouse in texas, which is good they have backup but it creates more costs for shipping for us and them and ultimately customers, and im sure other businesses and industries will be feeling this already with any suppliers they had in the affected areas.
 Quoting: crestedone


Yup, we have no clue as to the condition of the Warehouses in th area so thanks for the info. No need for names though. It will only make things worse.

Keep reporting in when you hear of others.
Anonymous Coward (OP)
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11/04/2012 10:42 AM
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Re: Supply Chain Disruptions from Sandy-PLEASE REPORT- NY, NJ, CT, PA,
Strong Cat 1 winds at 850mb altitude on Euro.

[link to pbs.twimg.com]

Very likely that will mix to the surface as gusts.
 Quoting: Luisport


Luisport you have been all over this storm so keep us posted.
Anonymous Coward (OP)
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11/04/2012 10:52 AM
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Re: Supply Chain Disruptions from Sandy-PLEASE REPORT- NY, NJ, CT, PA,
Now 5 Container Ships at Port Elizabeth. 2 not lined up to th Cranes.

One Hazard A has docked at Bayonne, NJ. Not sure what it is carrying but it isn't Gasoline.

Still 4 Oil Tankers sitting in the Harbor with anothr that just crossed under the bridge. ARTIC BLIZZARD

[link to www.marinetraffic.com]

There are now 8 Tankers in the Delaware Bay by Cape May waiting to get into Philly so the backlog has started there.

Norfolk, VA Is very busy with Container Cargo as well

Trains Still Cutoff.

[link to shipcsx.com]

[link to www.nscorp.com]
Anonymous Coward (OP)
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11/04/2012 10:52 AM
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Re: Supply Chain Disruptions from Sandy-PLEASE REPORT- NY, NJ, CT, PA,
Now 5 Container Ships at Port Elizabeth. 2 not lined up to th Cranes.

One Hazard A has docked at Bayonne, NJ. Not sure what it is carrying but it isn't Gasoline.

Still 4 Oil Tankers sitting in the Harbor with anothr that just crossed under the bridge. ARTIC BLIZZARD

[link to www.marinetraffic.com]

There are now 8 Tankers in the Delaware Bay by Cape May waiting to get into Philly so the backlog has started there.

Norfolk, VA Is very busy with Container Cargo as well

Trains Still Cutoff.

[link to shipcsx.com]

[link to www.nscorp.com]
Luisport

User ID: 26979555
Portugal
11/04/2012 11:02 AM

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Re: Supply Chain Disruptions from Sandy-PLEASE REPORT- NY, NJ, CT, PA,
Strong Cat 1 winds at 850mb altitude on Euro.

[link to pbs.twimg.com]

Very likely that will mix to the surface as gusts.
 Quoting: Luisport


Luisport you have been all over this storm so keep us posted.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 17033550


This post is copy from doorbert
Anonymous Coward
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11/04/2012 11:12 AM
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Re: Supply Chain Disruptions from Sandy-PLEASE REPORT- NY, NJ, CT, PA,
NORMAL = Trucks don't sit idling wasting gas. Trains dont sit idle waiting for trucks. Debris is rare and quickly cleared away. People feel no sense of panic, and do not clog up traffic routes, and empty fuel supplies in a panicked fashion.

What we have here is the opposite of normal, debris will take weeks to clear, trucks are idling with consumers clogging routes, taking all available gasoline. Trains are not meeting their loads and timetables, such a situation will worsen if not alleviated.

Each day of 'disruption' causes a weakening in the system to handle that disruption. Kinda like the classic scene with Lucy at the candy factory, the candy keeps coming but it doesn't matter because the system breaks down. If the candy stops, sure she can get a hold of things, but the NEEDS require the candy machine to flow even faster.

I won't say that this is full on doom, but if this were the "Street Fighter" video game, and the East Coast was Ryu, well, he just got hit by a severe Ha-Do-Ken and his health gauge is below half.

The weakness means further hits will not be received as well, therefore, yes, "ripe for disaster" is what I would call it.

Also it is due to years of JIT hypnosis, a diseased meme which this new generation of money-seeking gamblers called managers, have bought into. They have ruined America, these modern day businessmen with no sense. We need a modern day Joseph to take the ring of Pharaoh and order the nation to 'store up grain for seven years' because only such an event can cure the mental wrongness of this just in time modality. It's terminally vectored, and will surely destroy the nation eventually. What we need is warehouses and common sense people to stock them and dispense. But the anti-commies will never allow that to happen. We're fucked by anti-commies and fucked by commies. HA
 Quoting: bogged down 2913271


Excellent incite and I love Street Fighter. I think you have a very fair assessment of this situation.

It will start popping its ugly head in other parts of the country I would think. Not on the food level but you can see for the PDF link above that 23%(I think) of Chinese imports come into NY Harbor. Christmas and Hanukkah around the corner you may see a shortage of toys and other things of that nature elsewhere.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 17033550


Thanks OP. I'm also thinking of the 'dizzy' routine in Street Fighter where you take a few hits in a row and your guy wobbles with stars and birdies around his head, open for further damage.

Whats really sad, is that even now, as you are giving good intel, the PTB could move things such that the 'GLP effect' happens, and things return to semi-normal, thereby discrediting all the "boys who cried wolf".

However, it is important to note, that in the story of the boy who cries wolf, there is a wolf who eventually comes. Sadly, the story is told to chastize the student who makes his classmates nervous. But the same story should also serve as a lesson to the other classmates, that they should be aware, and not trust one kid to look for wolves. I think you understand my meaning.

Good thread.
Anonymous Coward (OP)
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11/04/2012 11:25 AM
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Re: Supply Chain Disruptions from Sandy-PLEASE REPORT- NY, NJ, CT, PA,
NORMAL = Trucks don't sit idling wasting gas. Trains dont sit idle waiting for trucks. Debris is rare and quickly cleared away. People feel no sense of panic, and do not clog up traffic routes, and empty fuel supplies in a panicked fashion.

What we have here is the opposite of normal, debris will take weeks to clear, trucks are idling with consumers clogging routes, taking all available gasoline. Trains are not meeting their loads and timetables, such a situation will worsen if not alleviated.

Each day of 'disruption' causes a weakening in the system to handle that disruption. Kinda like the classic scene with Lucy at the candy factory, the candy keeps coming but it doesn't matter because the system breaks down. If the candy stops, sure she can get a hold of things, but the NEEDS require the candy machine to flow even faster.

I won't say that this is full on doom, but if this were the "Street Fighter" video game, and the East Coast was Ryu, well, he just got hit by a severe Ha-Do-Ken and his health gauge is below half.

The weakness means further hits will not be received as well, therefore, yes, "ripe for disaster" is what I would call it.

Also it is due to years of JIT hypnosis, a diseased meme which this new generation of money-seeking gamblers called managers, have bought into. They have ruined America, these modern day businessmen with no sense. We need a modern day Joseph to take the ring of Pharaoh and order the nation to 'store up grain for seven years' because only such an event can cure the mental wrongness of this just in time modality. It's terminally vectored, and will surely destroy the nation eventually. What we need is warehouses and common sense people to stock them and dispense. But the anti-commies will never allow that to happen. We're fucked by anti-commies and fucked by commies. HA
 Quoting: bogged down 2913271


Excellent incite and I love Street Fighter. I think you have a very fair assessment of this situation.

It will start popping its ugly head in other parts of the country I would think. Not on the food level but you can see for the PDF link above that 23%(I think) of Chinese imports come into NY Harbor. Christmas and Hanukkah around the corner you may see a shortage of toys and other things of that nature elsewhere.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 17033550


Thanks OP. I'm also thinking of the 'dizzy' routine in Street Fighter where you take a few hits in a row and your guy wobbles with stars and birdies around his head, open for further damage.

Whats really sad, is that even now, as you are giving good intel, the PTB could move things such that the 'GLP effect' happens, and things return to semi-normal, thereby discrediting all the "boys who cried wolf".

However, it is important to note, that in the story of the boy who cries wolf, there is a wolf who eventually comes. Sadly, the story is told to chastize the student who makes his classmates nervous. But the same story should also serve as a lesson to the other classmates, that they should be aware, and not trust one kid to look for wolves. I think you understand my meaning.

Good thread.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 2913271


Great Points again. I am wondering, given the disorganization of FEMA as to whether the Gov even realizes the problem. If the GLP Effect gets the trains going than that is a great thing.

I do fear that this situation is about to explode. Mainly I am thinking about Long Island and Staten Island from a Supply perspective. When the Trains do come into Port and unload their food, etc., under normal circumstances, they have to be trucked over the bridges or Barge boats that carry the Rail Cars. It is much longer for them.

The only real solution is JFK and maybe even the old Grummen Facility out by the Hamptons, but in both causes there is an Airplane Fuel shortage as well. This would mean that the only solution of magnitude is the Military reopening the Grumman facility and doing their thing with their own supply chains.

That's all I can think of. No Boats, not enough trucks to replace the trains jobs, minimal airline fuel.

Scary.
Anonymous Coward
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11/04/2012 11:32 AM
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Re: Supply Chain Disruptions from Sandy-PLEASE REPORT- NY, NJ, CT, PA,
[...]

Great Points again. I am wondering, given the disorganization of FEMA as to whether the Gov even realizes the problem. If the GLP Effect gets the trains going than that is a great thing.

I do fear that this situation is about to explode. Mainly I am thinking about Long Island and Staten Island from a Supply perspective. When the Trains do come into Port and unload their food, etc., under normal circumstances, they have to be trucked over the bridges or Barge boats that carry the Rail Cars. It is much longer for them.

The only real solution is JFK and maybe even the old Grummen Facility out by the Hamptons, but in both causes there is an Airplane Fuel shortage as well. This would mean that the only solution of magnitude is the Military reopening the Grumman facility and doing their thing with their own supply chains.

That's all I can think of. No Boats, not enough trucks to replace the trains jobs, minimal airline fuel.

Scary.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 17033550


You have better knowledge of these things than me, but I sense that you are right.

I am reminded of the historical "Berlin blockade" where the Soviets closed off West Berlin. We did airdrops.

So if your analysis is correct, then that is what is needed, pure and simple, airdrops into the boroughs with giant parachutes.

Further, let us assume, that the US Military is smart (which I do believe) and quite aware. Then, they already know this. Therefore, where are the airdrops, and what will they drop? I mean, logistically, we arrive at that idea, simply that airdrops do save areas that are "cut off".

It always has amazed me how little the US military is allowed to help its own nation, with clear cut and simple solutions. But then, our "National Guard" is decimated and fighting a drug war in the Afghan sphere. So... yeah.

Do you have ideas as to how/what they would drop? What are the logistics of a sort of Berlin blockade event, how many people are isolated here and in what way COULD air support be given, assuming things worsen?
Luisport

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11/04/2012 11:36 AM

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Re: Supply Chain Disruptions from Sandy-PLEASE REPORT- NY, NJ, CT, PA,
...We expect more regions of NJ to be declared uninhabitable in the coming days as the situation continues to deteriorate.... [link to www.zerohedge.com]
Anonymous Coward (OP)
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11/04/2012 11:44 AM
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Re: Supply Chain Disruptions from Sandy-PLEASE REPORT- NY, NJ, CT, PA,
[...]

Great Points again. I am wondering, given the disorganization of FEMA as to whether the Gov even realizes the problem. If the GLP Effect gets the trains going than that is a great thing.

I do fear that this situation is about to explode. Mainly I am thinking about Long Island and Staten Island from a Supply perspective. When the Trains do come into Port and unload their food, etc., under normal circumstances, they have to be trucked over the bridges or Barge boats that carry the Rail Cars. It is much longer for them.

The only real solution is JFK and maybe even the old Grummen Facility out by the Hamptons, but in both causes there is an Airplane Fuel shortage as well. This would mean that the only solution of magnitude is the Military reopening the Grumman facility and doing their thing with their own supply chains.

That's all I can think of. No Boats, not enough trucks to replace the trains jobs, minimal airline fuel.

Scary.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 17033550


You have better knowledge of these things than me, but I sense that you are right.

I am reminded of the historical "Berlin blockade" where the Soviets closed off West Berlin. We did airdrops.

So if your analysis is correct, then that is what is needed, pure and simple, airdrops into the boroughs with giant parachutes.

Further, let us assume, that the US Military is smart (which I do believe) and quite aware. Then, they already know this. Therefore, where are the airdrops, and what will they drop? I mean, logistically, we arrive at that idea, simply that airdrops do save areas that are "cut off".

It always has amazed me how little the US military is allowed to help its own nation, with clear cut and simple solutions. But then, our "National Guard" is decimated and fighting a drug war in the Afghan sphere. So... yeah.

Do you have ideas as to how/what they would drop? What are the logistics of a sort of Berlin blockade event, how many people are isolated here and in what way COULD air support be given, assuming things worsen?
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 2913271


Yeah the Berlin Airdrop was a big deal. I also believe that the Military is sharp. I would imagine that it is not an easy task though. Aircraft Carriers are THE BEST asset in a situation like this and were used in the Tsunami over in India and I believe Japan recently. I did hear that there was one on the way early in the week. Large deck to stage supplies, Helicoptors to transport and something like 80,000 gallons of fresh water can be produced very quickly. Just one of them.

FEMA cannot compete with them.

Food, med supplies, water, blankets, beds, quick tents, you name it and they have it.

I also think that it wont be long before the Corp of Engineers is sent to repair the docks.
Anonymous Coward
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11/04/2012 11:47 AM
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Re: Supply Chain Disruptions from Sandy-PLEASE REPORT- NY, NJ, CT, PA,
[...]

Great Points again. I am wondering, given the disorganization of FEMA as to whether the Gov even realizes the problem. If the GLP Effect gets the trains going than that is a great thing.

I do fear that this situation is about to explode. Mainly I am thinking about Long Island and Staten Island from a Supply perspective. When the Trains do come into Port and unload their food, etc., under normal circumstances, they have to be trucked over the bridges or Barge boats that carry the Rail Cars. It is much longer for them.

The only real solution is JFK and maybe even the old Grummen Facility out by the Hamptons, but in both causes there is an Airplane Fuel shortage as well. This would mean that the only solution of magnitude is the Military reopening the Grumman facility and doing their thing with their own supply chains.

That's all I can think of. No Boats, not enough trucks to replace the trains jobs, minimal airline fuel.

Scary.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 17033550


You have better knowledge of these things than me, but I sense that you are right.

I am reminded of the historical "Berlin blockade" where the Soviets closed off West Berlin. We did airdrops.

So if your analysis is correct, then that is what is needed, pure and simple, airdrops into the boroughs with giant parachutes.

Further, let us assume, that the US Military is smart (which I do believe) and quite aware. Then, they already know this. Therefore, where are the airdrops, and what will they drop? I mean, logistically, we arrive at that idea, simply that airdrops do save areas that are "cut off".

It always has amazed me how little the US military is allowed to help its own nation, with clear cut and simple solutions. But then, our "National Guard" is decimated and fighting a drug war in the Afghan sphere. So... yeah.

Do you have ideas as to how/what they would drop? What are the logistics of a sort of Berlin blockade event, how many people are isolated here and in what way COULD air support be given, assuming things worsen?
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 2913271


Yeah the Berlin Airdrop was a big deal. I also believe that the Military is sharp. I would imagine that it is not an easy task though. Aircraft Carriers are THE BEST asset in a situation like this and were used in the Tsunami over in India and I believe Japan recently. I did hear that there was one on the way early in the week. Large deck to stage supplies, Helicoptors to transport and something like 80,000 gallons of fresh water can be produced very quickly. Just one of them.

FEMA cannot compete with them.

Food, med supplies, water, blankets, beds, quick tents, you name it and they have it.

I also think that it wont be long before the Corp of Engineers is sent to repair the docks.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 17033550


Yes even Enterprise could float off shore and produce desalinized water from its reactors, from what I heard from an old Navy dude.

Even then, the Berliners were far more well behaved and grateful than these people I think. Sad to say, but in Berlin at that time, those people were glad for anything. No sense of entitlement. Hmm.
Anonymous Coward (OP)
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11/04/2012 12:05 PM
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Re: Supply Chain Disruptions from Sandy-PLEASE REPORT- NY, NJ, CT, PA,
[...]

Great Points again. I am wondering, given the disorganization of FEMA as to whether the Gov even realizes the problem. If the GLP Effect gets the trains going than that is a great thing.

I do fear that this situation is about to explode. Mainly I am thinking about Long Island and Staten Island from a Supply perspective. When the Trains do come into Port and unload their food, etc., under normal circumstances, they have to be trucked over the bridges or Barge boats that carry the Rail Cars. It is much longer for them.

The only real solution is JFK and maybe even the old Grummen Facility out by the Hamptons, but in both causes there is an Airplane Fuel shortage as well. This would mean that the only solution of magnitude is the Military reopening the Grumman facility and doing their thing with their own supply chains.

That's all I can think of. No Boats, not enough trucks to replace the trains jobs, minimal airline fuel.

Scary.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 17033550


You have better knowledge of these things than me, but I sense that you are right.

I am reminded of the historical "Berlin blockade" where the Soviets closed off West Berlin. We did airdrops.

So if your analysis is correct, then that is what is needed, pure and simple, airdrops into the boroughs with giant parachutes.

Further, let us assume, that the US Military is smart (which I do believe) and quite aware. Then, they already know this. Therefore, where are the airdrops, and what will they drop? I mean, logistically, we arrive at that idea, simply that airdrops do save areas that are "cut off".

It always has amazed me how little the US military is allowed to help its own nation, with clear cut and simple solutions. But then, our "National Guard" is decimated and fighting a drug war in the Afghan sphere. So... yeah.

Do you have ideas as to how/what they would drop? What are the logistics of a sort of Berlin blockade event, how many people are isolated here and in what way COULD air support be given, assuming things worsen?
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 2913271


Yeah the Berlin Airdrop was a big deal. I also believe that the Military is sharp. I would imagine that it is not an easy task though. Aircraft Carriers are THE BEST asset in a situation like this and were used in the Tsunami over in India and I believe Japan recently. I did hear that there was one on the way early in the week. Large deck to stage supplies, Helicoptors to transport and something like 80,000 gallons of fresh water can be produced very quickly. Just one of them.

FEMA cannot compete with them.

Food, med supplies, water, blankets, beds, quick tents, you name it and they have it.

I also think that it wont be long before the Corp of Engineers is sent to repair the docks.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 17033550


Yes even Enterprise could float off shore and produce desalinized water from its reactors, from what I heard from an old Navy dude.

Even then, the Berliners were far more well behaved and grateful than these people I think. Sad to say, but in Berlin at that time, those people were glad for anything. No sense of entitlement. Hmm.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 2913271



Berliners were battered down by WWII as well though so not sure if it is Apples to Apples really.

Lets just keep getting anyone who is viewing, the facts and hopefully that will help them out. We have over 4500 views so lets just keep going.
Anonymous Coward (OP)
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11/04/2012 12:08 PM
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Re: Supply Chain Disruptions from Sandy-PLEASE REPORT- NY, NJ, CT, PA,
Aurthur Kill Diesel Spill now being Reported.

[link to www.youtube.com]

and the thread.

Thread: BREAKING NEWS: 300,000+ Gallon Oil Spill Staten Island Hurricane Sandy
Anonymous Coward (OP)
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11/04/2012 01:05 PM
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Re: Supply Chain Disruptions from Sandy-PLEASE REPORT- NY, NJ, CT, PA,
Another Update.

We have 8 Oil tankers in the NY Harbor Area all anchored and not heading to the docks.

One Oil Tanker, GLORY EXPRESS is heading to Docks in NJ, but is still on the way. It is smaller than a PANAMAX so it is carrying somewhere in the range of 10M - 13M gallons of Oil or Petroleum Product.
There does not appear to be any Cargo or Oil tankers heading towards NY Harbor from further away.

Philly appears to be the place they are diverting to mainly, and has a significant line of Oil tankers out in the Deleware Bay still.

Trains are Still Cutoff as per their websites.

We have reports of Gas Lines in CT and across the lower part of NY State along I-84 as well as Northeast PA to some extend.

Spoke to a friend in Jersey City this morning. Said on Friday that the Grocery Store was Like Communist Russia with long lines and empty shelves, but today it seems to be better so some food delivers are getting through at least in that area.


If anyone has grocery store updates that would be good info.
Real list

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11/04/2012 01:14 PM
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Re: Supply Chain Disruptions from Sandy-PLEASE REPORT- NY, NJ, CT, PA,
I heard some were selling their free gas (10 gallon limit). We can also assume blankets, food and water was taken by some not in dire need, but acting out of greed.
waterlily

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11/04/2012 01:42 PM
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...


You have better knowledge of these things than me, but I sense that you are right.

I am reminded of the historical "Berlin blockade" where the Soviets closed off West Berlin. We did airdrops.

So if your analysis is correct, then that is what is needed, pure and simple, airdrops into the boroughs with giant parachutes.

Further, let us assume, that the US Military is smart (which I do believe) and quite aware. Then, they already know this. Therefore, where are the airdrops, and what will they drop? I mean, logistically, we arrive at that idea, simply that airdrops do save areas that are "cut off".

It always has amazed me how little the US military is allowed to help its own nation, with clear cut and simple solutions. But then, our "National Guard" is decimated and fighting a drug war in the Afghan sphere. So... yeah.

Do you have ideas as to how/what they would drop? What are the logistics of a sort of Berlin blockade event, how many people are isolated here and in what way COULD air support be given, assuming things worsen?
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 2913271


Yeah the Berlin Airdrop was a big deal. I also believe that the Military is sharp. I would imagine that it is not an easy task though. Aircraft Carriers are THE BEST asset in a situation like this and were used in the Tsunami over in India and I believe Japan recently. I did hear that there was one on the way early in the week. Large deck to stage supplies, Helicoptors to transport and something like 80,000 gallons of fresh water can be produced very quickly. Just one of them.

FEMA cannot compete with them.

Food, med supplies, water, blankets, beds, quick tents, you name it and they have it.

I also think that it wont be long before the Corp of Engineers is sent to repair the docks.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 17033550


Yes even Enterprise could float off shore and produce desalinized water from its reactors, from what I heard from an old Navy dude.

Even then, the Berliners were far more well behaved and grateful than these people I think. Sad to say, but in Berlin at that time, those people were glad for anything. No sense of entitlement. Hmm.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 2913271





Berliners were battered down by WWII as well though so not sure if it is Apples to Apples really.

Lets just keep getting anyone who is viewing, the facts and hopefully that will help them out. We have over 4500 views so lets just keep going.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 17033550



The Berlin Airlift was also in support of the Allied commands there as it was for Berlin residents.


"The transports would have to deliver not only food for the populace but also coal to heat their homes during the winter, and bulky bags of coal would cut deeply into the available space within the aircraft. The airlift would continue after the good flying weather of summer had ended and winter fog, clouds, rain, and ice commenced. "

" He [Major General William H. Tunner, commander of the operation] established a truly impossible goal of a landing every minute, day or night if the ceiling at the destination was 400 feet or more. At times the aircrews participating in the operation came close to achieving this goal, touching down 3 minutes apart. The transport aircraft entered the air corridor at a prescribed time and altitude, followed the beams from radio ranges to keep on course, and obeyed instructions from ground radar controllers who regulated speed and interval within the aircraft stream. Each pilot in this endless procession had one chance to land. If the weather or some other reason prevented a landing, he would return to his home station and reenter the cycle later. "

"Between 26 June 1948 and 30 September 1949, the airlift delivered more than 2.3 million tons of cargo, approximately 75 percent of it in American aircraft. American aircrews made more than 189,000 flights, totaling nearly 600,000 flying hours and exceeding 92 million miles. "

"On Easter Sunday, 17 April 1949, this system delivered 13,000 tons of cargo, including the equivalent of 600 railroad cars of coal
. This so-called Easter Parade set a record for a day's tonnage during the operation."

" By the spring of 1949, it was obvious these tactics of harassment had failed to deter the American and British airmen involved in the airlift of supplies to Berlin. Consequently, the Soviet Union entered into negotiations which culminated in an agreement, signed on 5 May 1949, that resulted in the lifting of the blockade, but it did not settle the basic issue of freedom of access. " [Hence, the Berlin Wall]

[link to www.afhso.af.mil]

Also, in support of the military, remember that in the Vietnam War there was no "Front", per se - no troop trains, no truck convoys. Everything, troops, munitions and armaments, supplies, was moved by aircraft from battle zone to battle zone. Chinook helicopters and sky cranes moved everything they needed from here to there as it was needed and moved Vietnam citizens as passengers on the return trips.

Just a suggestion.
*********** WaterLily ***********
" Do I dare
Disturb the universe?"
-- T. S. Elliot, Love Song of J. Alfred Prufrock

*************************************
“We are as ignorant of the meaning of the dragon as we are of the meaning of the universe.”
-- Jorge Luis Borges
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
"Pompey made his preparations for the war at the end of the winter, entered upon it at the commencement of spring,
and finished it in the middle of the summer."
-- Cicero, De Imperio Cn. Pompei
Anonymous Coward
User ID: 26978014
United States
11/04/2012 01:46 PM
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Re: Supply Chain Disruptions from Sandy-PLEASE REPORT- NY, NJ, CT, PA,
Local truck activity for the past 3 days:
Only commercial trucks still running in southern/central area of Brooklyn are Fed Ex. But then again they have military contracts and strong connections there.

The rest of the trucks on the road are mainly Con Ed, Sanitation, Verizon, and an occasional (rare) private company.

Heading down to the harbor now to scope it out...be back in about an hour.

BTW: did you see that Flavola oil tanker is offshore again? After sitting off the Verrazano bridge since what Friday morning?

Can someone volunteer to keep track of the movements of the oil tankers from [link to www.marinetraffic.com?] Thanks!


OP and Lous: You guys are doing a great job! Thank you for your service!

hf
Anonymous Coward
User ID: 26978014
United States
11/04/2012 01:58 PM
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Re: Supply Chain Disruptions from Sandy-PLEASE REPORT- NY, NJ, CT, PA,
Almost forgot...there were huge military helicopters flying from direction of Staten Island (maybe from NJ) towards mid-town starting about 11:30am today.

These were BIG and they were flying low...they whizzed by my building and over NY harbor. Sorry, not familiar with military aircraft.

We had some helicopters flying around since Thursday afternoon, but those were black & i think ferrying VIP's or police helicopters. But the ones flying around this morning were different...
Anonymous Coward (OP)
User ID: 17033550
United States
11/04/2012 02:07 PM
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Re: Supply Chain Disruptions from Sandy-PLEASE REPORT- NY, NJ, CT, PA,
Local truck activity for the past 3 days:
Only commercial trucks still running in southern/central area of Brooklyn are Fed Ex. But then again they have military contracts and strong connections there.

The rest of the trucks on the road are mainly Con Ed, Sanitation, Verizon, and an occasional (rare) private company.

Heading down to the harbor now to scope it out...be back in about an hour.

BTW: did you see that Flavola oil tanker is offshore again? After sitting off the Verrazano bridge since what Friday morning?

Can someone volunteer to keep track of the movements of the oil tankers from [link to www.marinetraffic.com?] Thanks!


OP and Lous: You guys are doing a great job! Thank you for your service!

hf
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 26978014


Thanks for the update Brooklyn AC. I have the Martime Live map up 24/7 but I did miss that one being moved back out of the harbor. Cant look at it all the time of course. I was focused on the MISAKI being diverted to Philly.

Good Catch and thanks for your info too. it is a huge help.

The GLORY EXPRESS is now heading down the Aurther Kill Waterway from the North. Hasn't docked yet though. Maybe the spill is to the south end of the Aurther Kill.

Military Helicopters:

BlackHawk
[link to www.busybuzzblogging.com]

Chinook
[link to www.andybright.com]

Osprey
[link to www.aviationspectator.com]

The Osprey is unmistakable. Very strange sound to it and is much larger in person too.
waterlily

User ID: 19961452
United States
11/04/2012 02:10 PM
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Re: Supply Chain Disruptions from Sandy-PLEASE REPORT- NY, NJ, CT, PA,
Question:

On the live ships map, there is a tanker moored at Bayonne and the description has a (Hazard A) after it. What does this mean?

JO ILEX
Flag: Norway
Ship Type: Tanker - Hazard A (Major)
Status: Anchored/Moored
Speed/Course: 0 kn / 346˚
Length x Breadth: 144 m X 24 m
Draught: 10 m
Destination: NEW YORK
ETA: 2012-11-04 08:00 (UTC)
Received (1258): 0h 15min ago
*********** WaterLily ***********
" Do I dare
Disturb the universe?"
-- T. S. Elliot, Love Song of J. Alfred Prufrock

*************************************
“We are as ignorant of the meaning of the dragon as we are of the meaning of the universe.”
-- Jorge Luis Borges
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
"Pompey made his preparations for the war at the end of the winter, entered upon it at the commencement of spring,
and finished it in the middle of the summer."
-- Cicero, De Imperio Cn. Pompei
waterlily

User ID: 19961452
United States
11/04/2012 02:15 PM
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Re: Supply Chain Disruptions from Sandy-PLEASE REPORT- NY, NJ, CT, PA,
hf
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 26978014



Military Helicopters:

BlackHawk
[link to www.busybuzzblogging.com]

Chinook
[link to www.andybright.com]

Osprey
[link to www.aviationspectator.com]

The Osprey is unmistakable. Very strange sound to it and is much larger in person too.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 17033550


The Sky Crane carrying a house:
[link to en.wikipedia.org]

Another Chinook photo with cargo sling (the link didn't answer)
[link to www.boeing.com]

I hope it was one of them headed toward Staten Island, but you would probably have seen cargo slings if they were taking anything useful out there.
*********** WaterLily ***********
" Do I dare
Disturb the universe?"
-- T. S. Elliot, Love Song of J. Alfred Prufrock

*************************************
“We are as ignorant of the meaning of the dragon as we are of the meaning of the universe.”
-- Jorge Luis Borges
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
"Pompey made his preparations for the war at the end of the winter, entered upon it at the commencement of spring,
and finished it in the middle of the summer."
-- Cicero, De Imperio Cn. Pompei
Anonymous Coward (OP)
User ID: 17033550
United States
11/04/2012 02:21 PM
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Re: Supply Chain Disruptions from Sandy-PLEASE REPORT- NY, NJ, CT, PA,
Question:

On the live ships map, there is a tanker moored at Bayonne and the description has a (Hazard A) after it. What does this mean?

JO ILEX
Flag: Norway
Ship Type: Tanker - Hazard A (Major)
Status: Anchored/Moored
Speed/Course: 0 kn / 346˚
Length x Breadth: 144 m X 24 m
Draught: 10 m
Destination: NEW YORK
ETA: 2012-11-04 08:00 (UTC)
Received (1258): 0h 15min ago
 Quoting: waterlily


I will look around for that Info. Just hadn't gotten around to it yet.

Thanks for your post on that other thread too. Big help
Anonymous Coward (OP)
User ID: 17033550
United States
11/04/2012 02:24 PM
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Re: Supply Chain Disruptions from Sandy-PLEASE REPORT- NY, NJ, CT, PA,
Question:

On the live ships map, there is a tanker moored at Bayonne and the description has a (Hazard A) after it. What does this mean?

JO ILEX
Flag: Norway
Ship Type: Tanker - Hazard A (Major)
Status: Anchored/Moored
Speed/Course: 0 kn / 346˚
Length x Breadth: 144 m X 24 m
Draught: 10 m
Destination: NEW YORK
ETA: 2012-11-04 08:00 (UTC)
Received (1258): 0h 15min ago
 Quoting: waterlily


Anyone else can chime in and find it as well. Not finding anything quickly. Would love to know as well.
waterlily

User ID: 19961452
United States
11/04/2012 02:58 PM
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Re: Supply Chain Disruptions from Sandy-PLEASE REPORT- NY, NJ, CT, PA,
Question:

On the live ships map, there is a tanker moored at Bayonne and the description has a (Hazard A) after it. What does this mean?

JO ILEX
Flag: Norway
Ship Type: Tanker - Hazard A (Major)
Status: Anchored/Moored
Speed/Course: 0 kn / 346˚
Length x Breadth: 144 m X 24 m
Draught: 10 m
Destination: NEW YORK
ETA: 2012-11-04 08:00 (UTC)
Received (1258): 0h 15min ago
 Quoting: waterlily


Anyone else can chime in and find it as well. Not finding anything quickly. Would love to know as well.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 17033550


It looks like Jo Ilex is expected at Garden City Terminal in Savannah Georgia on Monday.
[link to m.savannahnow.com]
*********** WaterLily ***********
" Do I dare
Disturb the universe?"
-- T. S. Elliot, Love Song of J. Alfred Prufrock

*************************************
“We are as ignorant of the meaning of the dragon as we are of the meaning of the universe.”
-- Jorge Luis Borges
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
"Pompey made his preparations for the war at the end of the winter, entered upon it at the commencement of spring,
and finished it in the middle of the summer."
-- Cicero, De Imperio Cn. Pompei
Anonymous Coward (OP)
User ID: 17033550
United States
11/04/2012 03:10 PM
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Re: Supply Chain Disruptions from Sandy-PLEASE REPORT- NY, NJ, CT, PA,
GLORY EXPRESS an Oil Tanker has Docked at Kinder Morgan Terminals.

This must be north of the Oil/Diesel Spill area.

This Terminal only seems to have 4 docks for similar size Tankers. Somewhere in the rangge of 10m-13m gal of Oil/Petroleum products.

No other movement to report on Ships.

I can't seem to find anything on those Hazard Ratings.

Trains Still Cut Off. Tried a different NJ Terminal just to see.

CSX
[link to shipcsx.com]

Norfolk Southern
[link to www.nscorp.com]

Also here is an example of a Rail Control Room. It is all Real Time. I do not believe their websites are off


[link to www.eyevis.ae]
Anonymous Coward (OP)
User ID: 17033550
United States
11/04/2012 03:56 PM
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Re: Supply Chain Disruptions from Sandy-PLEASE REPORT- NY, NJ, CT, PA,
STOLT NORLAND has now been rerouted to Wilmington, NC after sitting around for a few days and never making it to the Docks.

Interesting...

a US Gov Vessel is heading somewhere towards Breezy Point/Rockaways.

284M long...about 931ft long so no small ship.


Might be an Aircraft Carrier comparing the length to the USS Lincoln, H.W. Bush and Truman.

[link to www.dimensionsinfo.com]

No other activity in NY Harbor.
Anonymous Coward (OP)
User ID: 17033550
United States
11/04/2012 04:12 PM
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Re: Supply Chain Disruptions from Sandy-PLEASE REPORT- NY, NJ, CT, PA,
Fumbled the Football on this one and are blaming everyone but themselves for it.


[link to www.nypost.com]
Anonymous Coward (OP)
User ID: 17033550
United States
11/04/2012 04:24 PM
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Re: Supply Chain Disruptions from Sandy-PLEASE REPORT- NY, NJ, CT, PA,
Well...Cannot put this one together.


"Massive tanker sails to New York Harbor as delay hits 16 hours at one Brooklyn gas station"


"Cuomo said the reopening of New York Harbor after Hurricane Sandy has already allowed the delivery of 8 million gallons of gas — with another 28 million due in the next few days."

Read more: [link to www.nydailynews.com]

No Ship Name in the article.

As we have seen there are plenty of "Massive Tankers" that "Sailed into The Harbor." Only one has docked so far. THE GLORY EXPRESS and it docked in NJ. It may be unloading now but that is all we have seen, unless www.marinetraffic.com does not track ALL ships.

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