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Can anybody telll me if abortion was a sin, before Christianity came along?

 
Anonymous Coward
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11/06/2012 02:22 PM
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Re: Can anybody telll me if abortion was a sin, before Christianity came along?
BTW Catholics consider abortion ok up until what they call
"quickening"
 Quoting: bvndy


If they believe in abortion then they aren't Christians. All life is sacred to God and Jesus.
Anonymous Coward
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11/06/2012 02:25 PM
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Re: Can anybody telll me if abortion was a sin, before Christianity came along?
Killing babies is a sin.
thecelticcats (OP)

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11/06/2012 04:51 PM

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Re: Can anybody telll me if abortion was a sin, before Christianity came along?
I was brought up Catholic, so was told...ya'know.
Some of the teachings didn't seem right, so I was starting to think outside the box as I got older.

Well, I felt drawn to Celtic Paganism and read in a book(not sure if it's true or not) that abortion was a woman's right and there was nothing wrong with it.

I know the Catholic Religion is full makes people feel guilty about a lot of things!

Anybody see what I'm trying to say?

Overall, is abortion really bad, if you're doing it for several reasons, such as financial, having mental disabilities, and the father being broke also. I don't want a child to grow up without a dad(he wants nothing to do with it) and also I can barely take care of myself. I don't think the fetus feels anything when it's aborted. I just don't want the child to grow up to hate me for having it.
Is that so bad?
 Quoting: thecelticcats


YEAH, he's a lot better off dead, just because you're
feeling guilty.
Greeks and romans had the custom of leaving children,
if nobody else got them they starved to death.
Surrival rate for birth was 3 out of ten, abortion could kill mother and child.
I will never understand why carrying a child 9 months is
such a hardship, till I read the facts.
Most abortions are black, black babies are not as valued
as white, sadly.
Will grow up orphans, mostly
 Quoting: bvndy


Poor comprehension skills, loser!
I would feel guilty for bringing up a kid in such a f--ked up world with people like you in it!
Babies don't die. Their soul moves on.
You are such and idiot! It's amazing you know how to even post!fuckoff2
thecelticcats (OP)

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11/06/2012 04:54 PM

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Re: Can anybody telll me if abortion was a sin, before Christianity came along?
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 25722214


The woman wasn't put under. Ever hear of Propopol or another drug to put people under, sh!thead?

I'm sure that was a fake video made up by some Bible thumpers that had the funds to set that all up.

I call BS!
thecelticcats (OP)

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11/06/2012 04:57 PM

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Re: Can anybody telll me if abortion was a sin, before Christianity came along?
Killing anybody is a 'sin'.
'Thou shall not suffer a witch to live' The Bible said put to death certain other people too...
OH, but killing is a sin. One of the ten commandments.
How many people died in 'Holy Wars'? Excuses excuses.

Last Edited by Maria Monroe on 11/06/2012 04:59 PM
thecelticcats (OP)

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11/07/2012 12:39 PM

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Re: Can anybody telll me if abortion was a sin, before Christianity came along?
I think you know the answer or else the question wouldn't be causing you so much consternation...

BTW, regarding your answer on adoption and the various health and mental conditions of the Dad, you shouldn't be having sex with someone you can't depend on to take care of you or a baby. That is demeaning to you as a woman. It sounds like you have no respect for yourself or him - If that's true you certainly shouldn't be sexing it up...
 Quoting: notgonna

I told my therapist I didn't want a child years ago because of me looking at the negative things in myself and not my positive things and she said that's sound like I'm thinking like 'HITLAR' and that's a wrong way to think.
There's a saying those who point the finger, have four that point back at them.
Stop projecting and take your own advice because I'm just mirroring something in you, you feel guilty about and that's why you replied. I know about these things. HA!

Last Edited by Maria Monroe on 11/07/2012 12:40 PM
thecelticcats (OP)

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11/07/2012 12:43 PM

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Re: Can anybody telll me if abortion was a sin, before Christianity came along?
BTW, in the Bible it says you are supposed to have a child. God wanted man to do this. Everybody has a birthright to have a child no matter how screwed up they are, even my ex, because God has more power than people do and can make miracles happen.
Taruwah

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11/07/2012 01:09 PM
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Re: Can anybody telll me if abortion was a sin, before Christianity came along?
Yah said "Thou shalt not kill" to Moses somewhere around 3000BC, to the Hebrews of the time, this included the unborn.

The main justification for abortion is that a child is not 'alive' until it is 'born'. This is a legal assumption and any mother who has carried a child to term knows that there is a live being inside of her.

The real question is when that child passes from being a lump of developing tissue to a living human. Nobody in their right minds wants to murder children of any kind.

In the end it becomes a personal issue, and thus a personal decision. If the mother cannot face the pregnancy because she is physically ill and therefore in danger is one thing, but what if she is mentally ill and cannot face pregnancy?

Personally I hate abortion, especially when used as a form of birth control or by the modern eugenics movement. But in the end, the decision must rest with the mother, and the back street abortionist has had as long (and dangerous) a history as motherhood itself.

To drive abortion underground once more is not really palatable either. I keep Torah, so I do not have a problem, but I have no right to interfere with another person's choices.

I believe that those who abort live foeti will answer to Yah, but for those who do not so believe then they have secular choices which they must make.
Seek FIRST the Kingdom of YHWH and His knowledge of Good and Bad (righteousness) , for He says "My ways are not thy ways"
Anonymous Coward
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11/07/2012 01:10 PM
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Re: Can anybody telll me if abortion was a sin, before Christianity came along?
Yeah, Thou shalt not murder.
thecelticcats (OP)

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11/09/2012 10:32 PM

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Re: Can anybody telll me if abortion was a sin, before Christianity came along?
I dont think they had coathangers back then OP
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 10393879


Duh, they did it with herbs. Look it up.
Anonymous Coward
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11/09/2012 10:45 PM
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Re: Can anybody telll me if abortion was a sin, before Christianity came along?
I was brought up Catholic, so was told...ya'know.
Some of the teachings didn't seem right, so I was starting to think outside the box as I got older.

Well, I felt drawn to Celtic Paganism and read in a book(not sure if it's true or not) that abortion was a woman's right and there was nothing wrong with it.

I know the Catholic Religion is full makes people feel guilty about a lot of things!

Anybody see what I'm trying to say?

Overall, is abortion really bad, if you're doing it for several reasons, such as financial, having mental disabilities, and the father being broke also. I don't want a child to grow up without a dad(he wants nothing to do with it) and also I can barely take care of myself. I don't think the fetus feels anything when it's aborted. I just don't want the child to grow up to hate me for having it.
Is that so bad?
 Quoting: thecelticcats


'Abortion' is a modern euphamism for deliberately killing an unborn human, which is murder. Murder has always been a sin, even if it's not against the secular law of a particular nation. Regardless of motive, premeditated killing of an innocent life is always a sin.
Anonymous Coward
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11/09/2012 10:54 PM
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Re: Can anybody telll me if abortion was a sin, before Christianity came along?
All religion aside... Its a moral issue. Is it in your heart to kill? If you had to perform an abortion, you would then, have to ensure that the head, arms, legs, etc... were out of the uterus. Seriously... if you have no issue with that... then go for it. But most people could not do that.
Anonymous Coward
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11/09/2012 10:58 PM
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Re: Can anybody telll me if abortion was a sin, before Christianity came along?
Killing anybody is a 'sin'.
'Thou shall not suffer a witch to live' The Bible said put to death certain other people too...
OH, but killing is a sin. One of the ten commandments.
How many people died in 'Holy Wars'? Excuses excuses.
 Quoting: thecelticcats


There is morally justified killing of guilty adults. Then there is morally unjustified killing of innocent people, which is murder. Look up the legal definitions. Your statement that all killing is a sin is wrong. The Bible prohibits murder, but sanctions justified killing in self-defense, criminal justice, and national defense.

Golden Rule: Do unto others as you would have done unto you.

Do you wish your mother had murdered you in the womb?
thecelticcats (OP)

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11/10/2012 01:56 AM

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Re: Can anybody telll me if abortion was a sin, before Christianity came along?
Karma existed long before religion. Murdering someone will just bring bad karma upon you. It is something you will never live down.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 1550123

You're so stupid. I've done a lot of good karma for decades of my life and never seen any good karma, come back, out of it. You don't know sh!t about karma. Putting someone out of their misery, without pain, instead of having them spend almost 100 years, in pain living on this planet, makes sense.
Karma means 'the energy we put out is the energy we get back'. The energy I'm creating will only make me miscarry or the energy will go into the child and the child will have a miserable aura to set the tone for the rest of it's life(a curse).

Last Edited by Maria Monroe on 11/10/2012 01:58 AM
dontisntcant
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11/10/2012 01:58 AM
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Re: Can anybody telll me if abortion was a sin, before Christianity came along?
Many people won't approve. Fortunately, you don't need their approval.

Obviously, it's not ideal, but it is your life and your decision. Some say it's a form of murder. Which is to be avoided if possible. It can be a heavy experience. It should be respected as such. But don't feel guilty, or let these supposed Christians preach with such hatred and guilt. Only God judges us. They shouldn't presume to know your inner experience.

I believe you understand. But most of these people won't say anything you'll want to hear.

I imagine in earlier more cooperative societies which enjoyed different socially acceptable intoxicants and engaged in group orgies, the women had children, and all children belonged to the men of the tribe. Not only their own stock.

Different prevailing mentalities.
thecelticcats (OP)

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11/10/2012 02:11 AM

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Re: Can anybody telll me if abortion was a sin, before Christianity came along?
Many people won't approve. Fortunately, you don't need their approval.

Obviously, it's not ideal, but it is your life and your decision. Some say it's a form of murder. Which is to be avoided if possible. It can be a heavy experience. It should be respected as such. But don't feel guilty, or let these supposed Christians preach with such hatred and guilt. Only God judges us. They shouldn't presume to know your inner experience.

I believe you understand. But most of these people won't say anything you'll want to hear.

I imagine in earlier more cooperative societies which enjoyed different socially acceptable intoxicants and engaged in group orgies, the women had children, and all children belonged to the men of the tribe. Not only their own stock.

Different prevailing mentalities.
 Quoting: dontisntcant 26696239

I know. They say it's murder but how many died in 'Holy wars'?
God knows/reads my heart and lately the more I think about it, I believe this wasn't from God but a demonic spirit. I made the mistake of lowering my standards and going back to a man that was 'in the dark and lost' but people I believe can change and seen it...
If I'm suffering from cancer or anyone else I don't think it's murder to cut life short, and end suffering. I think it was Dr. Kevorkian (not sure of spelling) that got flack for his way of thinking also. God controls everything and I recently started to believe this was an interference of a demon, from this exbf jerk, even though we used birth control. This experience made me promise to myself I will never go back to him. Because I forgave and went back to him several times after he's done me wrong. Now, I know stay away and wait until I'm married and financially secure before I ever have sex again.
peace

Last Edited by Maria Monroe on 11/10/2012 02:13 AM
thecelticcats (OP)

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11/10/2012 02:22 AM

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Re: Can anybody telll me if abortion was a sin, before Christianity came along?
ROFLMAO I was waiting for a bad karma vote(just making sure I get under their skin) It worked! LOL Some crybaby gave me a bad karma vote and said 'I hope your abortion goes very wrong'. Their wish can't come true. I am a witch and never gave my real name and date of birth, in this forum so their wish isn't going to come true.

I will so a spell to make sure that their wish(that won't work on me) will surely bounce back triple on them ( Wiccan rule of three)

CHEERS!

Last Edited by Maria Monroe on 11/10/2012 02:23 AM
thecelticcats (OP)

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11/10/2012 02:24 AM

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Re: Can anybody telll me if abortion was a sin, before Christianity came along?
After the abortion, I will do the spell. HA HA! Scared? GOOD!

Last Edited by Maria Monroe on 11/10/2012 02:24 AM
thecelticcats (OP)

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11/10/2012 02:26 AM

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Re: Can anybody telll me if abortion was a sin, before Christianity came along?
Go ahead give me another bad karma vote. Won't get me banned.
Anonymous Coward
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11/10/2012 02:27 AM
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Re: Can anybody telll me if abortion was a sin, before Christianity came along?
I did not write this Antony Choy, who attends LCC, Hawaii did

I am against abortion because life begins at conception.

Prior to the Roe vs. Wade Supreme Court decision of 1973, about 500,000 illegal abortions were occurring per year. By 1975, over 1,000,000 babies were being aborted in the United States. Today, about 1,500,000 abortions occur each year. That's over 4000 per day, and nearly three per minute!

The fact is that Ninety-three percent of the abortions in America are for convenience. The mother's health is an issue only three percent of the time, and the baby's health is an issue only three percent of the time. Rape or incest are issues only one percent of the time. Ninety-three percent of all abortions in America are performed just because someone doesn't want a child! There are many couples in the world that cannot have children and would love to adopt a child.

There are four basic types of abortion being performed in America today, while two more types may be added in the near future.

First, there's the suction type abortion. This is where the unborn child is literally vacuumed from the mother's womb during the early stages of pregnancy.

The currette-type abortion is where the child is cut from the mother's womb with a spoon-like object.

A third type is similar to a Caesarean operation. The baby is surgically removed from the mother and allowed to suffocate, because the child's lungs aren't developed.

The fourth type of abortion is the Salt Brine technique. With this method, the unborn child is literally "pickled" to death by the injection of a strong salt solution. A few days after the injection the child is still born.

There is currently much debate about partial-birth abortions. This is where a child is partially delivered, then stabbed in the skull to have his or her brains sucked out.

There is also much talk about the RU-486 abortion pill from France, also called "mifepristione" in America. This pill works by inhibiting pregnancy hormones, and is normally used within seven weeks from conception. At the present time, mifepristone is illegal in the U.S., but there is much political pressure to make it legal.





I believe abortion is murder and represent the moral decay of society. In reference to pregnant women, the term "with child" occurs twenty-six times in the Bible. The term "with fetus" never occurs once.

In Luke chapter one, verses 36 and 41, we are told that Elisabeth conceived a "son" and that the "babe" leaped in her womb. God does not say that a "fetus" leaped in her womb! He says THE BABE leaped. This is the exact same word that God uses to describe Christ in the manger AFTER He is born (Luke 2:12, 16). In God eyes, an unborn babe and a newborn babe are the same. They are both living human beings!

Dear reader, please answer a question: What is an "infant?" Get the answer in your mind and keep it there for a moment. Do you have it? Okay, please consider Job 3:16: "Or as an hidden untimely birth I had not been; as infants which never saw light." Did you see that? Job referred to unborn children as INFANTS. Not fetuses! Not masses of tissue! INFANTS! In God's eyes, an unborn child is a living human baby. God never says once that an unborn child is anything less than a human being.

David said in Psalm 51:5, "Behold, I was shapen in iniquity, and in sin did my mother conceive me." He did not say that a fetus was shapen in iniquity and conceived in iniquity. David, speaking under the inspiration of the Holy Spirit, said that HE was conceived. David, not a blob of tissue, was conceived.

The same is the case in Psalm 139:13-16:

"For thou hast possessed my reins: thou hast covered me in my mother's womb. I will praise thee; for I am fearfully and wonderfully made: marvellous are thy works; and that my soul knoweth right well. My substance was not hid from thee, when I was made in secret, and curiously wrought in the lowest parts of the earth. Thine eyes did see my substance, yet being unperfect; and in thy book all my members were written, which in continuance were fashioned, when as yet there was none of them."

Who was in the womb? David! A literal and living person. The Bible never uses anything less than human terms to describe the unborn.

Notice that in Jeremiah 1:5 we are told that God KNEW Jeremiah:"Before I formed thee in the belly I knew thee; and before thou camest forth out of the womb I sanctified thee, and I ordained thee a prophet unto the nations."

To further confirm the fact that God views the unborn child as a person, please consider Exodus 21:22-23:

"If men strive, and hurt a woman with child, so that her fruit depart from her, and yet no mischief follow: he shall be surely punished, according as the woman's husband will lay upon him; and he shall pay as the judges determine. And if any mischief follow, then thou shalt give life for life,"

If the woman has a premature birth and the child lives ("no mischief follows"), then there's no death penalty. However, if the child dies (or the woman dies) God says the death penalty applies: "thou shalt give life for life." Why would God require the death penalty if He didn't consider the unborn child to be a human being?

Friend, like it or not, God says that life begins at conception, and the unborn child is a human being.

But the Bible isn't alone in declaring this truth. Science also declares that an unborn child is just as much an independent human being as you. The original human cell consists of 46 chromosomes, 23 from each parent. At no point during pregnancy does the mother contribute any new cells to the child. The original cell divides itself and multiplies to provide development and growth for the child. Scientifically speaking, the child is just as independent at six months before birth as he will be six months after birth. Yes, the mother does provide nourishment to the unborn child, but she also provides nourishment to the newborn child!

At two weeks pregnancy, the "fetus" can move alone. By four weeks the child has limbs, muscle tissue, a heart and heartbeat. Ears, eyes, and small hands are visible by the fifth week. The child responds to touch sensations by the sixth or seventh week. At eight weeks, the baby sometimes tries to take a breath when removed from the mother. At twelve weeks, the child will often struggle for life two or three hours when removed from the mother.


Abortion Involves the Shedding of Innocent BloodProverbs 6:16-17 says that God HATES those who shed innocent blood! Deuteronomy 27:25 says, "Cursed be he that taketh reward to slay an innocent person. And all the people shall say, Amen."

Who could possibly be more innocent than an unborn baby?! Yet, our society has become so wicked that it condones the slaying of 1.5 million innocent children every year. The Bible says that God HATES people who do this.



Abortion Is A Violation of the Golden Rule

In Matthew 7:12, the Lord Jesus Christ said, "Therefore all things whatsoever ye would that men should do to you, do ye even so to them: for this is the law and the prophets."

Would it be your desire to suffer and die while someone traps you in a cage and literally tears your arms and legs from your body?

Abortion is a violation of the golden rule.



Abortion Attempts To Destroy A Work of God

"I know that, whatsoever God doeth, it shall be for ever: nothing can be put to it, nor any thing taken from it: and God doeth it, that men should fear before him." (Ecc. 3:14)

God is eternal, so His work is also eternal. Abortion is an attempt to do away with unwanted people--an attempt to make a liar out of God by bringing an end to His work. However, Jesus said you can destroy a person's BODY, but not their SOUL (Mat. 10:28). Parent, if you've had an abortion, your aborted child is in Heaven right now, because you only destroyed the body!



Abortion Often Brings Shame, Heartache, and Deep Regret

After his sin with Bathsheba, King David confessed these words to God: "For I acknowledge my transgressions: and my sin is ever before me." (Psa. 51:3) David was living under constant conviction and regret for what he had done. He couldn't get away from it!

Most women who decide to have an abortion spend the rest of their lives regretting it. Are you thinking about an abortion? I challenge you to visit with some woman who have had abortions. Ask them if they would do it again. Ask them if they have any regrets.

In the book, The Christian and Social Issues, by Tom Wallace, a reference is made to a full page Washington Post ad, dated June 13, 1983. A lady who had undergone a saline abortion six months earlier describes the mental torments that she now suffers every day. She speaks of her "...everyday hell of never hearing a baby cry without crying within myself; counting days to see how old the baby would have been; wondering what contributions my baby would have made to our desperate society; and wondering if there will ever be another chance for motherhood."

Of the abortion itself, the lady recalls, "...sitting in a crowded waiting room studying each others fearful, anxious faces...signing death certificates for what is very much alive within you...seeing crying women given tranquilizers and sent home to recuperate and try to forget."

Abortion is wrong because it brings shame, heartache, and deep regret.



Abortion Disannuls A Plan of God

If God allows a child to be conceived, then God obviously has a plan for that child. Mary's parents didn't know that she'd give birth to the Savior of the world, but she did. God has a plan for unborn children (Jer. 1:5; Lk. 1:13-17; Gen. 4:25; Jud. 13:3-5), so to abort an unborn child is to stop a plan of God.



Abortion De-values Human Life

God created man to be the highest form of life on earth (Gen. 1:26-28). Human life is very precious to God. In fact, it is so precious that God Himself instituted the Death Penalty for anyone who takes the life of another (Exo. 21:12; Num. 35). God places great value on human life!

However, abortion promotes the message that life is NOT so valuable, and that man can do as he pleases with it. How long will it be before our nation decides that the killing of elderly people and sick people is justifiable? Why stop there? How long will it be before it becomes lawful to kill Bible believers who refuse to conform to the world system? It won't be as long as you may think (Rev. 13:16-18; Rev. 20:4). Abortion devalues human life, and it pushes our nation a step closer to that wicked day when it becomes lawful to murder innocent people.



Abortion Shows A Lack of Natural Affection

Paul tells us in 2 Timothy 3:3 that the last days will be characterized by people who lack "natural affection."

I believe the pro-abortion movement is a perfect example of this. It is NATURAL to conceive a child, grow to love that child, take care of the child during pregnancy, give birth to the child, and then raise the child with the best care possible. That's the natural process that God has ordained. It is NOT natural to kill the child! To commit such an act is to show a lack of natural affection, which is sin.



Abortion Encourages Sin

"Because sentence against an evil work is not executed speedily, therefore the heart of the sons of men is fully set in them to do evil." (Ecc. 8:11)

Why will 1,500,000 women have abortions this year? Largely because it has become popular. It is no longer illegal, and it is no longer considered a shameful sin by our society. Every time a woman has an abortion she helps society to become more comfortable with it. She's advertising it! By her example, she's encouraging others to commit the same sin, and other sins as well. The convenience of abortion will only lead to an increase of other sins such as adultery and fornication. Friend, abortion is wrong because abortion encourages sin!



Abortion Shows A Lack of Faith

Romans 14:23 says, "...for whatsoever is not of faith is sin." Hebrews 11:6 tells us that without faith it is IMPOSSIBLE to please God.

To have an abortion is to take matters into your own hands, rather than to trust God to work things out. This shows a lack of faith in God, which the Bible labels as SIN.

A desperate woman says, "I can't afford to have a child. I'm not ready for this." Lady, you need to start trusting God and claiming His promises. You need to STOP trying to run your own life for a change and START trusting God. You don't need an abortion, for such will only INCREASE your troubles. The devil has you thinking that abortion is the answer, that it will take care of everything, and you're very close to giving in to his subtle temptation. If you do, you'll regret it forever, and God will hold you accountable! Why not turn your life over to the Lord Jesus Christ right now? Why not make Him the Lord of your life and trust Him to work things out for you? Now, are you convinced that abortion is murder and morally wrong?
thecelticcats (OP)

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11/10/2012 02:28 AM

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Re: Can anybody telll me if abortion was a sin, before Christianity came along?
Killing anybody is a 'sin'.
'Thou shall not suffer a witch to live' The Bible said put to death certain other people too...
OH, but killing is a sin. One of the ten commandments.
How many people died in 'Holy Wars'? Excuses excuses.
 Quoting: thecelticcats


There is morally justified killing of guilty adults. Then there is morally unjustified killing of innocent people, which is murder. Look up the legal definitions. Your statement that all killing is a sin is wrong. The Bible prohibits murder, but sanctions justified killing in self-defense, criminal justice, and national defense.



Do you wish your mother had murdered you in the womb?
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 26542815

Yes, and I told her that many times.
Anonymous Coward
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11/10/2012 02:29 AM
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Re: Can anybody telll me if abortion was a sin, before Christianity came along?
BTW Catholics consider abortion ok up until what they call
"quickening"
 Quoting: bvndy


Not true! Catholics (and science shows) that life begins at conception. Immediately at fertilization, 100% of the dna is completed telling what sex, hair color etc. At 14 days after conception the human heart starts beating.
Anonymous Coward
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11/10/2012 02:30 AM
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Re: Can anybody telll me if abortion was a sin, before Christianity came along?
Go ahead give me another bad karma vote. Won't get me banned.
 Quoting: thecelticcats


Who cares about karma? or Obama which rhymes.

You have to stand before a holy and perfect God, even if you say you don't. Doesn't matter God is not like Santa... But even you can find forgiveness, wether I agree with it or not.
SowingSeeds

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11/10/2012 02:34 AM

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Re: Can anybody telll me if abortion was a sin, before Christianity came along?
The Bible says God knew us when we were in our mothers womb,therefore abortion at anytime is a sin.But to do away with the old testament laws,after He died and rose again,Jesus went to the gates of hell (I believe they were taken to what is called abraham's bosom),and freed those who had sinned from bondage.
For he that soweth to his flesh shall of the flesh reap corruption; but he that soweth to the Spirit shall of the Spirit reap life everlasting.Galatians 6:8

I believe that if this once great nation will fall on their knees and turn back to God,He will postpone the hellfire that is sure to reign down on us very soon.Prayer has Power.
Anonymous Coward
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11/10/2012 02:35 AM
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Re: Can anybody telll me if abortion was a sin, before Christianity came along?
God's people have always kept his law, even before he came to earth as Jesus. There was no time 'before' this.
Anonymous Coward
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11/10/2012 02:38 AM
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Re: Can anybody telll me if abortion was a sin, before Christianity came along?
Let's see...There is a decided shortage of humans today. Back then there were too many so it was ok to abort, sacrifice and murder (God was sanctioning it and commanding his people to do just that).
What the world needs now is as many people as we can add!
It solves all the problems of hunger, unemployment, wars. Abortion, murder and death in general are hinderances to the population of the planet which is what God wants.
'More people' should be our war cry!

There are people that actually think like this...
thecelticcats (OP)

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11/10/2012 02:38 AM

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Re: Can anybody telll me if abortion was a sin, before Christianity came along?
I did not write this Antony Choy, who attends LCC, Hawaii did

I am against abortion because life begins at conception.

Prior to the Roe vs. Wade Supreme Court decision of 1973, about 500,000 illegal abortions were occurring per year. By 1975, over 1,000,000 babies were being aborted in the United States. Today, about 1,500,000 abortions occur each year. That's over 4000 per day, and nearly three per minute!

The fact is that Ninety-three percent of the abortions in America are for convenience. The mother's health is an issue only three percent of the time, and the baby's health is an issue only three percent of the time. Rape or incest are issues only one percent of the time. Ninety-three percent of all abortions in America are performed just because someone doesn't want a child! There are many couples in the world that cannot have children and would love to adopt a child.

There are four basic types of abortion being performed in America today, while two more types may be added in the near future.

First, there's the suction type abortion. This is where the unborn child is literally vacuumed from the mother's womb during the early stages of pregnancy.

The currette-type abortion is where the child is cut from the mother's womb with a spoon-like object.

A third type is similar to a Caesarean operation. The baby is surgically removed from the mother and allowed to suffocate, because the child's lungs aren't developed.

The fourth type of abortion is the Salt Brine technique. With this method, the unborn child is literally "pickled" to death by the injection of a strong salt solution. A few days after the injection the child is still born.

There is currently much debate about partial-birth abortions. This is where a child is partially delivered, then stabbed in the skull to have his or her brains sucked out.

There is also much talk about the RU-486 abortion pill from France, also called "mifepristione" in America. This pill works by inhibiting pregnancy hormones, and is normally used within seven weeks from conception. At the present time, mifepristone is illegal in the U.S., but there is much political pressure to make it legal.





I believe abortion is murder and represent the moral decay of society. In reference to pregnant women, the term "with child" occurs twenty-six times in the Bible. The term "with fetus" never occurs once.

In Luke chapter one, verses 36 and 41, we are told that Elisabeth conceived a "son" and that the "babe" leaped in her womb. God does not say that a "fetus" leaped in her womb! He says THE BABE leaped. This is the exact same word that God uses to describe Christ in the manger AFTER He is born (Luke 2:12, 16). In God eyes, an unborn babe and a newborn babe are the same. They are both living human beings!

Dear reader, please answer a question: What is an "infant?" Get the answer in your mind and keep it there for a moment. Do you have it? Okay, please consider Job 3:16: "Or as an hidden untimely birth I had not been; as infants which never saw light." Did you see that? Job referred to unborn children as INFANTS. Not fetuses! Not masses of tissue! INFANTS! In God's eyes, an unborn child is a living human baby. God never says once that an unborn child is anything less than a human being.

David said in Psalm 51:5, "Behold, I was shapen in iniquity, and in sin did my mother conceive me." He did not say that a fetus was shapen in iniquity and conceived in iniquity. David, speaking under the inspiration of the Holy Spirit, said that HE was conceived. David, not a blob of tissue, was conceived.

The same is the case in Psalm 139:13-16:

"For thou hast possessed my reins: thou hast covered me in my mother's womb. I will praise thee; for I am fearfully and wonderfully made: marvellous are thy works; and that my soul knoweth right well. My substance was not hid from thee, when I was made in secret, and curiously wrought in the lowest parts of the earth. Thine eyes did see my substance, yet being unperfect; and in thy book all my members were written, which in continuance were fashioned, when as yet there was none of them."

Who was in the womb? David! A literal and living person. The Bible never uses anything less than human terms to describe the unborn.

Notice that in Jeremiah 1:5 we are told that God KNEW Jeremiah:"Before I formed thee in the belly I knew thee; and before thou camest forth out of the womb I sanctified thee, and I ordained thee a prophet unto the nations."

To further confirm the fact that God views the unborn child as a person, please consider Exodus 21:22-23:

"If men strive, and hurt a woman with child, so that her fruit depart from her, and yet no mischief follow: he shall be surely punished, according as the woman's husband will lay upon him; and he shall pay as the judges determine. And if any mischief follow, then thou shalt give life for life,"

If the woman has a premature birth and the child lives ("no mischief follows"), then there's no death penalty. However, if the child dies (or the woman dies) God says the death penalty applies: "thou shalt give life for life." Why would God require the death penalty if He didn't consider the unborn child to be a human being?

Friend, like it or not, God says that life begins at conception, and the unborn child is a human being.

But the Bible isn't alone in declaring this truth. Science also declares that an unborn child is just as much an independent human being as you. The original human cell consists of 46 chromosomes, 23 from each parent. At no point during pregnancy does the mother contribute any new cells to the child. The original cell divides itself and multiplies to provide development and growth for the child. Scientifically speaking, the child is just as independent at six months before birth as he will be six months after birth. Yes, the mother does provide nourishment to the unborn child, but she also provides nourishment to the newborn child!

At two weeks pregnancy, the "fetus" can move alone. By four weeks the child has limbs, muscle tissue, a heart and heartbeat. Ears, eyes, and small hands are visible by the fifth week. The child responds to touch sensations by the sixth or seventh week. At eight weeks, the baby sometimes tries to take a breath when removed from the mother. At twelve weeks, the child will often struggle for life two or three hours when removed from the mother.


Abortion Involves the Shedding of Innocent BloodProverbs 6:16-17 says that God HATES those who shed innocent blood! Deuteronomy 27:25 says, "Cursed be he that taketh reward to slay an innocent person. And all the people shall say, Amen."

Who could possibly be more innocent than an unborn baby?! Yet, our society has become so wicked that it condones the slaying of 1.5 million innocent children every year. The Bible says that God HATES people who do this.



Abortion Is A Violation of the Golden Rule

In Matthew 7:12, the Lord Jesus Christ said, "Therefore all things whatsoever ye would that men should do to you, do ye even so to them: for this is the law and the prophets."

Would it be your desire to suffer and die while someone traps you in a cage and literally tears your arms and legs from your body?

Abortion is a violation of the golden rule.



Abortion Attempts To Destroy A Work of God

"I know that, whatsoever God doeth, it shall be for ever: nothing can be put to it, nor any thing taken from it: and God doeth it, that men should fear before him." (Ecc. 3:14)

God is eternal, so His work is also eternal. Abortion is an attempt to do away with unwanted people--an attempt to make a liar out of God by bringing an end to His work. However, Jesus said you can destroy a person's BODY, but not their SOUL (Mat. 10:28). Parent, if you've had an abortion, your aborted child is in Heaven right now, because you only destroyed the body!



Abortion Often Brings Shame, Heartache, and Deep Regret

After his sin with Bathsheba, King David confessed these words to God: "For I acknowledge my transgressions: and my sin is ever before me." (Psa. 51:3) David was living under constant conviction and regret for what he had done. He couldn't get away from it!

Most women who decide to have an abortion spend the rest of their lives regretting it. Are you thinking about an abortion? I challenge you to visit with some woman who have had abortions. Ask them if they would do it again. Ask them if they have any regrets.

In the book, The Christian and Social Issues, by Tom Wallace, a reference is made to a full page Washington Post ad, dated June 13, 1983. A lady who had undergone a saline abortion six months earlier describes the mental torments that she now suffers every day. She speaks of her "...everyday hell of never hearing a baby cry without crying within myself; counting days to see how old the baby would have been; wondering what contributions my baby would have made to our desperate society; and wondering if there will ever be another chance for motherhood."

Of the abortion itself, the lady recalls, "...sitting in a crowded waiting room studying each others fearful, anxious faces...signing death certificates for what is very much alive within you...seeing crying women given tranquilizers and sent home to recuperate and try to forget."

Abortion is wrong because it brings shame, heartache, and deep regret.



Abortion Disannuls A Plan of God

If God allows a child to be conceived, then God obviously has a plan for that child. Mary's parents didn't know that she'd give birth to the Savior of the world, but she did. God has a plan for unborn children (Jer. 1:5; Lk. 1:13-17; Gen. 4:25; Jud. 13:3-5), so to abort an unborn child is to stop a plan of God.



Abortion De-values Human Life

God created man to be the highest form of life on earth (Gen. 1:26-28). Human life is very precious to God. In fact, it is so precious that God Himself instituted the Death Penalty for anyone who takes the life of another (Exo. 21:12; Num. 35). God places great value on human life!

However, abortion promotes the message that life is NOT so valuable, and that man can do as he pleases with it. How long will it be before our nation decides that the killing of elderly people and sick people is justifiable? Why stop there? How long will it be before it becomes lawful to kill Bible believers who refuse to conform to the world system? It won't be as long as you may think (Rev. 13:16-18; Rev. 20:4). Abortion devalues human life, and it pushes our nation a step closer to that wicked day when it becomes lawful to murder innocent people.



Abortion Shows A Lack of Natural Affection

Paul tells us in 2 Timothy 3:3 that the last days will be characterized by people who lack "natural affection."

I believe the pro-abortion movement is a perfect example of this. It is NATURAL to conceive a child, grow to love that child, take care of the child during pregnancy, give birth to the child, and then raise the child with the best care possible. That's the natural process that God has ordained. It is NOT natural to kill the child! To commit such an act is to show a lack of natural affection, which is sin.



Abortion Encourages Sin

"Because sentence against an evil work is not executed speedily, therefore the heart of the sons of men is fully set in them to do evil." (Ecc. 8:11)

Why will 1,500,000 women have abortions this year? Largely because it has become popular. It is no longer illegal, and it is no longer considered a shameful sin by our society. Every time a woman has an abortion she helps society to become more comfortable with it. She's advertising it! By her example, she's encouraging others to commit the same sin, and other sins as well. The convenience of abortion will only lead to an increase of other sins such as adultery and fornication. Friend, abortion is wrong because abortion encourages sin!



Abortion Shows A Lack of Faith

Romans 14:23 says, "...for whatsoever is not of faith is sin." Hebrews 11:6 tells us that without faith it is IMPOSSIBLE to please God.

To have an abortion is to take matters into your own hands, rather than to trust God to work things out. This shows a lack of faith in God, which the Bible labels as SIN.

A desperate woman says, "I can't afford to have a child. I'm not ready for this." Lady, you need to start trusting God and claiming His promises. You need to STOP trying to run your own life for a change and START trusting God. You don't need an abortion, for such will only INCREASE your troubles. The devil has you thinking that abortion is the answer, that it will take care of everything, and you're very close to giving in to his subtle temptation. If you do, you'll regret it forever, and God will hold you accountable! Why not turn your life over to the Lord Jesus Christ right now? Why not make Him the Lord of your life and trust Him to work things out for you? Now, are you convinced that abortion is murder and morally wrong?
 Quoting: Etrn9T


Look, I'm convinced, the TPTB, that have always controlled the world, wrote the Bible and I don't believe it all, sorry. I'm convinced I've had an evil entity come into my body and it was put there by the devil, the more I meditate and think about it. I've tried for many, many years begging Jesus to fix things, being born again, going to Church and things have only seemed to have gotten worse and worse. Now, if you're a Pastor and can explain this, please do.
I'm tired. Not sure if I'll answer tonight or at all.

Last Edited by Maria Monroe on 11/10/2012 02:40 AM
Anonymous Coward
User ID: 19279205
United States
11/10/2012 02:42 AM
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Re: Can anybody telll me if abortion was a sin, before Christianity came along?
the zeusnian greeks tossed the faulty babies off the cliff
Anonymous Coward
User ID: 1291555
United States
11/10/2012 02:42 AM
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Re: Can anybody telll me if abortion was a sin, before Christianity came along?
God's people have always kept his law, even before he came to earth as Jesus. There was no time 'before' this.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 27399706


No Way, No One Did.... In fact the law was ment to show you that you can not keep the law, and YES you need a savior.

For I desired mercy, and not sacrifice; and the knowledge of God more than burnt offerings. Hosea 6:6

Why the law was our schoolmaster to bring us to Christ, that we might be justified by faith. Galatians 3:24

You have failed, ALL have failed, and even when you are on the right path, YOU WILL MESS UP.
Anonymous Coward
User ID: 1291555
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11/10/2012 02:53 AM
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Re: Can anybody telll me if abortion was a sin, before Christianity came along?
Look, I'm convinced, the TPTB, that have always controlled the world, wrote the Bible and I don't believe it all, sorry. I'm convinced I've had an evil entity come into my body and it was put there by the devil, the more I meditate and think about it. I've tried for many, many years begging Jesus to fix things, being born again, going to Church and things have only seemed to have gotten worse and worse. Now, if you're a Pastor and can explain this, please do.
I'm tired. Not sure if I'll answer tonight or at all.


1st I don't claim to cast out anything.. I do find it concerning that you know you are prosess but I'm not an export.

2nd off .. Are you in control?

No man can come to me, except the Father which hath sent me draw him: and I will raise him up at the last day. John 6:44

Why, my beloved, as you have always obeyed, not as in my presence only, but now much more in my absence, work out your own salvation with fear and trembling. For it is God who works in you both to will and to do of his good pleasure. Philippians 2:12-13.

3rd the promise

For whosoever shall call upon the name of the Lord shall be saved Romans 10:13

I can never make you believe, but you could never make me not. Some will see/hear many will not, but those that do seek, they will. Seek with everything, you have nothing to loose.

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