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Say goodbye to cheap electricity

 
Anonymous Coward
User ID: 27212869
United States
11/07/2012 10:01 AM
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Re: Say goodbye to cheap electricity
30kW. Man Trin you are set up there for a nice life now.

To replicate that, I'd have to swap out my crummy 6.5 kW gasoline generator for a 30kW diesel, preferably an old military unit. I wouldn't need a permit for it, but the switch (connect / disconnect from the grid) isn't built for that much either.

I am doing OK here running 4 computes, a TV, and my regular oil heating and propane cooking and well. Even the clothes washer. But when I tried to run the clothes dryer, it just about choked, the voltage went down to 220, etc.

Really I am jealous, but here we don't get as much sun anyway.
Pat Mccrotch

User ID: 2369524
United States
11/07/2012 10:02 AM
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Re: Say goodbye to cheap electricity
Bushobama
 Quoting: BRIEF


IMa little curious to see who we'll blame it on...clappa
Pat Mccrotch
Anonymous Coward
User ID: 1440282
United States
11/07/2012 10:05 AM
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Re: Say goodbye to cheap electricity
Where do you guys get this 'war on coal' business
Obama has supported the coal industry and particularly oil and gas.

I think coal workers obviously know that.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 7061022


please, do not interrupt their party

now back to your regularly scheduled delusion
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 3324945




Well maybe you will listen the messiah himself.

He says "electricity rates will necessarily will skyrocket."


Now believe what you want. Don't believe me or the various websites.

You cannot deny Obama said this. He is here ..right here...

Obama: My Plan Makes Electricity Rates Skyrocket


 Quoting: FatalW1shes


I remember that video, and I thought there was no way Obama can stay in power saying that on camera..I was wrong..I saw the Rev Wright black version of the KKK sermons and how Obama said he never heard those and I thought there was no way Obama would survive that..and I was wrong..I saw the self described radical commie Van Jones appointed a czar and I thought there was no way Obama would survive that..and I was wrong..they called Reagan the teflon presisent, and they were wrong..it's Obama
Anonymous Coward
User ID: 27056671
Germany
11/07/2012 10:05 AM
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Re: Say goodbye to cheap electricity
what's the big deal?

all you need is $250,000 and a spare football field at your house and you can go solar!

everyones doing it!

it's the way of the future!
 Quoting: ^TrInItY^


lol
Anonymous Coward
User ID: 26753099
United States
11/07/2012 10:09 AM
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Re: Say goodbye to cheap electricity
Texas republicans deregulated prices
for electricity 12 years ago
saying competition would drive prices lower.
Now they pay among the highest prices
per kilowatt hour of any state in the union.
Deregulation allows the vultures to feed.
Anonymous Coward
User ID: 27225352
United Kingdom
11/07/2012 10:10 AM
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Re: Say goodbye to cheap electricity
what's the big deal?

all you need is $250,000 and a spare football field at your house and you can go solar!

everyones doing it!

it's the way of the future!
 Quoting: ^TrInItY^


Doesn't take that much space, I have plenty on my roof and I can sell the excess back to the grid.

Now for those city-dwelling Obama voters who live in apartments, I guess they are truly fucked, but they voted for it so they should enjoy it.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 27212869


lol

just because you have a few solar panels on your roof does NOT make you fully energy independent

you have a GRID TIE system

that does NOT provide for all your power needs AT ALL and you know that as you STILL get a power bill

I happen to be 100% off grid and I KNOW what it takes to do it...

Solar is not practical in real world practice

take it from someone who has actually done it

I'm glad I did because I'm self sufficient but for the average person in the average neighborhood it just aint happening
 Quoting: ^TrInItY^


so with a $250,000 investment how many years will it take you to clear that investment amount?
how much were you spending on electric per year?
MidnightAngel

User ID: 2750629
United States
11/07/2012 10:11 AM
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Re: Say goodbye to cheap electricity
Americans are getting used to taking it up the backside.

So they convince themselves that they like it.

Learn to like it more.


hf
 Quoting: yourmamaknows




Here crisco this may help
Anonymous Coward
User ID: 26820407
United States
11/07/2012 10:16 AM
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Re: Say goodbye to cheap electricity
it will take 20 years to pay for itself based on current rates

at which point the technology will no doubt be obsolete
 Quoting: ^TrInItY^


not to mention that the panels themselves will not be producing anywhere near their original capacity.

most are down to 15% of what they did brand new by that much use/exposure to elements...
Anonymous Coward
User ID: 20889314
Canada
11/07/2012 10:16 AM
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Re: Say goodbye to cheap electricity
what's the big deal?

all you need is $250,000 and a spare football field at your house and you can go solar!

everyones doing it!

it's the way of the future!
 Quoting: ^TrInItY^


While I understand your frustration........... that is bullshit. It ain't cheap to completely run a house on solar, but that is a gross exaggeration. I have a house that is 1800 sq.ft. up and 1800 down. A full blown solar system that will run my home most of the time is about $25-30K. Also have a generator backup for long periods of crap weather when generation is not up to snuff, but it only runs a couple hours a day during periods like that to help top up the storage batteries.

It is fine to disagree with something, but lets keep things a bit realistic or this is no better than the govt disinfo out there.
Anonymous Coward
User ID: 27213481
United States
11/07/2012 10:17 AM
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Re: Say goodbye to cheap electricity
[link to www.youtube.com]


Let's do this in your backyard.
FatalW1shes (OP)

User ID: 18009481
United States
11/07/2012 10:20 AM
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Re: Say goodbye to cheap electricity
it will take 20 years to pay for itself based on current rates

at which point the technology will no doubt be obsolete
 Quoting: ^TrInItY^


not to mention that the panels themselves will not be producing anywhere near their original capacity.

most are down to 15% of what they did brand new by that much use/exposure to elements...
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 26820407


the panels are rated for 20 years of output within 10% of original

the batteries however are only rated for 15 years
 Quoting: ^TrInItY^


We tried at my house. 30k after Government rebates....

We didn't qualify because our roof was too small...missed it by 50 sqft or some shit.

Price was over 50k without help.


So time to look at a higher seer rating air conditioner, better windows with higher R values and more insulation in the attic.

Best we can do is be more efficient and use less to make up for increasing rates.

I even thought about a wind generator but we live in an HOA so no chance of that happening.
Saddletramp
We Don't Rent Pigs...

User ID: 1052341
United States
11/07/2012 10:20 AM

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Re: Say goodbye to cheap electricity
Americans are getting used to taking it up the backside.

So they convince themselves that they like it.

Learn to like it more.


hf
 Quoting: yourmamaknows


You might as well get the chisel out and start making a more accessible fuck hole now coz your current ones aint big enough for Barry's big black snake!
 Quoting: ET*Dude


You forget, he's half Irish...

naughty
"And how can a man die better than facing fearful odds, for the ashes of his fathers, and the temples of his Gods..." ~ Horatius

"Because he told the truth, and once you've heard the truth, everything else is just cheap whiskey..."
Anonymous Coward
User ID: 20886919
United States
11/07/2012 10:21 AM
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Re: Say goodbye to cheap electricity
I live in Ohio - voted Romney. I am disgusted that my state went to Obama.
So many people woke up out here - there's something terribly wrong!
We will pay the price - just know not all Ohioans are stupid idiots :(
Anonymous Coward
User ID: 27213481
United States
11/07/2012 10:22 AM
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Re: Say goodbye to cheap electricity
Neighbor just installed solar.

32 panels in an area @ 25x20ft.

They have a 4000 sq.ft. house. Will still be able to sell some energy to the power companies.
Apocalypse Troll
Trollicus Apocalyptus

User ID: 4316
United States
11/07/2012 10:22 AM

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Re: Say goodbye to cheap electricity
what's the big deal?

all you need is $250,000 and a spare football field at your house and you can go solar!

everyones doing it!

it's the way of the future!
 Quoting: ^TrInItY^


Damn - I have the field...
attxflag
"Honor the Texas flag; I pledge allegiance to thee, Texas, one state under God, one and indivisible."

[link to www.statutes.legis.state.tx.us]
Anonymous Coward
User ID: 26329297
Australia
11/07/2012 10:22 AM
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Re: Say goodbye to cheap electricity
and the governor will fight the EPA the whole way down


 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 14348632


He will have a heart attack or a skiing accident soon.
Nine's

User ID: 23438707
United States
11/07/2012 10:23 AM
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Re: Say goodbye to cheap electricity
I guess that is what they wanted. They swung towards Obama. There are a lot of Coal miners and Coal mines shutting down ........
 Quoting: FatalW1shes


IF the polls are to be believed, slightly more than half of Ohio swung towards Obama. Maybe instead of blaming the state, we should break it down into race and sex of those who voted for him. Black vs. white, male vs. female. If we're going to blame an entire state for the choice of half, we better be specific.

Say goodbye to cheap power. Those fools in those states are going to get a rude awakening.
 Quoting: FatalW1shes


I said good bye to cheap power during the Bush reign, along with gas and groceries.

The half that swung toward Obama will probably get a pleasant surprise in an increased check to pay their electric bill. The only ones affected will be the half that pays for the increase.

I do know Ohio is 88% coal powered. They are so fucking fucked I want to see the looks on their faces when they see their electric bills. Bastards turned to Obama again. They will soon pay for what they got.
 Quoting: FatalW1shes


I'm in Ohio and if you want to see my face, bring a flashlight. Power won't be on and I won't be the only one. The ones you'll see will be those who have electricity and they won't likely be the ones paying for it.
Saddletramp
We Don't Rent Pigs...

User ID: 1052341
United States
11/07/2012 10:23 AM

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Re: Say goodbye to cheap electricity
it will take 20 years to pay for itself based on current rates

at which point the technology will no doubt be obsolete
 Quoting: ^TrInItY^


not to mention that the panels themselves will not be producing anywhere near their original capacity.

most are down to 15% of what they did brand new by that much use/exposure to elements...
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 26820407


the panels are rated for 20 years of output within 10% of original output... i.e. gaurenteed not to lose more than 10% of their power capacity for the next 20 years

the batteries however are only rated for 15 years
 Quoting: ^TrInItY^


Those batteries never last 15 years!!!

We have several solar water pumps on our ranches, we finally just threw out the battery set ups and just went to where they only pump when the sun shines...
"And how can a man die better than facing fearful odds, for the ashes of his fathers, and the temples of his Gods..." ~ Horatius

"Because he told the truth, and once you've heard the truth, everything else is just cheap whiskey..."
FatalW1shes (OP)

User ID: 18009481
United States
11/07/2012 10:25 AM
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Re: Say goodbye to cheap electricity
what's the big deal?

all you need is $250,000 and a spare football field at your house and you can go solar!

everyones doing it!

it's the way of the future!
 Quoting: ^TrInItY^


While I understand your frustration........... that is bullshit. It ain't cheap to completely run a house on solar, but that is a gross exaggeration. I have a house that is 1800 sq.ft. up and 1800 down. A full blown solar system that will run my home most of the time is about $25-30K. Also have a generator backup for long periods of crap weather when generation is not up to snuff, but it only runs a couple hours a day during periods like that to help top up the storage batteries.

It is fine to disagree with something, but lets keep things a bit realistic or this is no better than the govt disinfo out there.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 20889314


It's close to 60k in Texas without Rebates and just DIY.

And that isn't even a promise that you will feed back into the system or be totally independent. At night you will still draw from the power company. I don't know where you live and what company sold you that line...but its way more than 30k. It may be close to that with all the rebates, green kick backs and stuff, but there is no way the initial cost was only 30k
Anonymous Coward
User ID: 27212869
United States
11/07/2012 10:28 AM
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Re: Say goodbye to cheap electricity
it will take 20 years to pay for itself based on current rates

at which point the technology will no doubt be obsolete
 Quoting: ^TrInItY^


not to mention that the panels themselves will not be producing anywhere near their original capacity.

most are down to 15% of what they did brand new by that much use/exposure to elements...
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 26820407


the panels are rated for 20 years of output within 10% of original output... i.e. gaurenteed not to lose more than 10% of their power capacity for the next 20 years

the batteries however are only rated for 15 years
 Quoting: ^TrInItY^


Those batteries never last 15 years!!!

We have several solar water pumps on our ranches, we finally just threw out the battery set ups and just went to where they only pump when the sun shines...
 Quoting: Saddletramp


Just wondering how much you paid for those solar / battery setups.

I am wondering if there's like a 10x markup on "home" solar systems.
Anonymous Coward
User ID: 27213481
United States
11/07/2012 10:28 AM
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Re: Say goodbye to cheap electricity
Neighbor just installed solar.

32 panels in an area @ 25x20ft.

They have a 4000 sq.ft. house. Will still be able to sell some energy to the power companies.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 27213481


lol

you're crazy

you guys have no idea what you're talking about

seriously

32 panels?

lets see...

maybe they are 300watt panels if you're lucky...

that's 9600 watts of power...

lmfao

my 1600 sq foot house uses 30,000 watts when all loads are on at the same time

that little solar shit he's installed might cover the cost of his yard lights


I think I have something like 160 panels?

they are not 300 watt panels
 Quoting: ^TrInItY^


LOL NO I'm not crazy you twat! Just were installed and the workers cleared out two days ago.
Anonymous Coward
User ID: 20889314
Canada
11/07/2012 10:28 AM
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Re: Say goodbye to cheap electricity
what's the big deal?

all you need is $250,000 and a spare football field at your house and you can go solar!

everyones doing it!

it's the way of the future!
 Quoting: ^TrInItY^


While I understand your frustration........... that is bullshit. It ain't cheap to completely run a house on solar, but that is a gross exaggeration. I have a house that is 1800 sq.ft. up and 1800 down. A full blown solar system that will run my home most of the time is about $25-30K. Also have a generator backup for long periods of crap weather when generation is not up to snuff, but it only runs a couple hours a day during periods like that to help top up the storage batteries.

It is fine to disagree with something, but lets keep things a bit realistic or this is no better than the govt disinfo out there.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 20889314


bullshit man

you're NOT running a NORMAL house on 25-30k of solar

my house is about that size and has a pool / 5hp well pump that has to water acres of yard soooo


maybe my house used to cost about $600 a month in electricity to run

what you can do for your 25-30k is a log cabin son

not a real house with central air / heat pump etc

I know from experience and you do too

stop talking shit withy our DC lighting and propane refrigerator

lol
 Quoting: ^TrInItY^


Ah well I didnt know 'normal' meant having a pool and central air as it sure as hell isn't where I live. I have wood heat, propane kitchen range and hot water. Generator is on propane. The solar runs the rest, including a 220 deep well pump, fridge, etc. It isn't a log cabin.................. difference here is you live a lot higher on the hog than people do where I live. Mind you the pool would be frozen for about 6 months of the year so not really practical for most people on normal incomes for the area.

Nor do we irrigate our lawns here, we are not that anal. So again, what you are quoting has nothing to do with an average home cause what you are doing is not average by any stretch. Apples and oranges.
Kirk

User ID: 25384388
United States
11/07/2012 10:30 AM

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Re: Say goodbye to cheap electricity
Say goodbye to your asshole, a big black snake is on the loose
 Quoting: ET*Dude


ROFL
Sadly you can't tell those people anything. They believe you can pluck wealth out of the air and there is no such thing as cause and effect. They will soon taste the fruit of their folly and it will be bitter. The only school that will work with them apparently.
Worry is a misuse of the imagination.
SpaceCommand
USCF National Master FIDE 2125

User ID: 1009022
United States
11/07/2012 10:32 AM

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Re: Say goodbye to cheap electricity
what's the big deal?

all you need is $250,000 and a spare football field at your house and you can go solar!

everyones doing it!

it's the way of the future!
 Quoting: ^TrInItY^


Yes I remember pictures of your solar project, after an episode with smart meters. Please keep us to date.
"With an eye made quiet by the power of harmony and the deep power of joy, we see into the life of things." William Wordsworth

And yet the same revolutionary beliefs for which our forebears fought are still at issue around the globe—the belief that the rights of man come not from the generosity of the state, but from the hand of God.

John F. Kennedy Inaugural Address

Lincoln's economic advisor Henry C. Carey explained the universal issue in his 1851 Harmony of Interests:

"Two systems are before the world.... One looks to pauperism, ignorance, depopulation, and barbarism; the other to increasing wealth, comfort, intelligence, combination of action, and civilization. One looks towards universal war; the other towards universal peace. One is the English system; the other ... the American system, for ... elevating while equalizing the condition of man throughout the world."
Anonymous Coward
User ID: 786321
United States
11/07/2012 10:35 AM
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Re: Say goodbye to cheap electricity
windy mills and corn
Anonymous Coward
User ID: 27212869
United States
11/07/2012 10:35 AM
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Re: Say goodbye to cheap electricity
Neighbor just installed solar.

32 panels in an area @ 25x20ft.

They have a 4000 sq.ft. house. Will still be able to sell some energy to the power companies.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 27213481


lol

you're crazy

you guys have no idea what you're talking about

seriously

32 panels?

lets see...

maybe they are 300watt panels if you're lucky...

that's 9600 watts of power...

lmfao

my 1600 sq foot house uses 30,000 watts when all loads are on at the same time

that little solar shit he's installed might cover the cost of his yard lights


I think I have something like 160 panels?

they are not 300 watt panels
 Quoting: ^TrInItY^


LOL NO I'm not crazy you twat! Just were installed and the workers cleared out two days ago.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 27213481


yea but I'm saying 9600 watts of panels isn't going to provide even 1/4th the energy needs of a 4000 sq foot house
 Quoting: ^TrInItY^

He doesn't have to provide the peak energy usage. Trin, you do because you're trying to use that system to live off the grid, with your propane generator only as backup.

All he has to do is generate enough over an average 24 hour period to equal his average consumption, and he can feed to the grid and draw it back when needed.

That may not be true forever though if power companies go to hourly pricing. But that could even work out in his favor, as peak hours tend to be in daytime, so he might even be feeding the grid at peak prices and drawing, at night, at offpeak (lower) prices.
Kirk

User ID: 25384388
United States
11/07/2012 10:38 AM

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Re: Say goodbye to cheap electricity
...


not to mention that the panels themselves will not be producing anywhere near their original capacity.

most are down to 15% of what they did brand new by that much use/exposure to elements...
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 26820407


the panels are rated for 20 years of output within 10% of original output... i.e. gaurenteed not to lose more than 10% of their power capacity for the next 20 years

the batteries however are only rated for 15 years
 Quoting: ^TrInItY^


Those batteries never last 15 years!!!

We have several solar water pumps on our ranches, we finally just threw out the battery set ups and just went to where they only pump when the sun shines...
 Quoting: Saddletramp


these are trojan 2 volt 1046ah wet cells

they are warrantied for 15 years

last even longer they say

you do have to water them ever 3 or 4 months but that's about it as far as maintenance goes

if you don't water them the plates will get destroyed and they won't last obviously

but if you water them they should last..

so far I've had them going 2 or 3 years and they are working fine
 Quoting: ^TrInItY^

Trin, lead acid is a poor technology. My battery book has a curve for life vs depth of discharge.
[link to www.amazon.com]
That's why I always say if you can afford the initial cost you should go with Edison cells.
[link to www.zappworks.com]
They can be willed to your grandchildren.

Last Edited by Kirk on 11/07/2012 10:44 AM
Worry is a misuse of the imagination.
Anonymous Coward
User ID: 27212869
United States
11/07/2012 10:39 AM
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Re: Say goodbye to cheap electricity
On the other hand, in the even longer run if a lot of people install grid-tie solar, it will drive down the market price of power during sunny days, so again you'll be feeding the grid at low prices and often drawing power back at higher prices.

It's nice to have the grid to use as a battery though, where you can feed and withdraw power at will. Then you don't have to maintain your own battery!
Anonymous Coward
User ID: 20889314
Canada
11/07/2012 10:39 AM
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Re: Say goodbye to cheap electricity
...


While I understand your frustration........... that is bullshit. It ain't cheap to completely run a house on solar, but that is a gross exaggeration. I have a house that is 1800 sq.ft. up and 1800 down. A full blown solar system that will run my home most of the time is about $25-30K. Also have a generator backup for long periods of crap weather when generation is not up to snuff, but it only runs a couple hours a day during periods like that to help top up the storage batteries.

It is fine to disagree with something, but lets keep things a bit realistic or this is no better than the govt disinfo out there.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 20889314


bullshit man

you're NOT running a NORMAL house on 25-30k of solar

my house is about that size and has a pool / 5hp well pump that has to water acres of yard soooo


maybe my house used to cost about $600 a month in electricity to run

what you can do for your 25-30k is a log cabin son

not a real house with central air / heat pump etc

I know from experience and you do too

stop talking shit withy our DC lighting and propane refrigerator

lol
 Quoting: ^TrInItY^


Ah well I didnt know 'normal' meant having a pool and central air as it sure as hell isn't where I live. I have wood heat, propane kitchen range and hot water. Generator is on propane. The solar runs the rest, including a 220 deep well pump, fridge, etc. It isn't a log cabin.................. difference here is you live a lot higher on the hog than people do where I live. Mind you the pool would be frozen for about 6 months of the year so not really practical for most people on normal incomes for the area.

Nor do we irrigate our lawns here, we are not that anal. So again, what you are quoting has nothing to do with an average home cause what you are doing is not average by any stretch. Apples and oranges.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 20889314


a 500-600 dollar a month power bill is not uncommon
 Quoting: ^TrInItY^


That is painful! Where I live we have some of the cheapest hydro-electric in North America. Monthly bill here (did when I first bought the farm) for the size of house we have and with an electric furnace/hot water/range/drier would average about $220 a month for the year. After I switched to propane for the range and hotwater and went to wood heating my elect. bill went down to about $85-100 per month prior to putting in the solar. But again. no pool (we have a lake) and no central air (rarely gets hot enough and house is well insulated).
Anonymous Coward
User ID: 26487248
United States
11/07/2012 10:41 AM
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Re: Say goodbye to cheap electricity
30kW. Man Trin you are set up there for a nice life now.

To replicate that, I'd have to swap out my crummy 6.5 kW gasoline generator for a 30kW diesel, preferably an old military unit. I wouldn't need a permit for it, but the switch (connect / disconnect from the grid) isn't built for that much either.

I am doing OK here running 4 computes, a TV, and my regular oil heating and propane cooking and well. Even the clothes washer. But when I tried to run the clothes dryer, it just about choked, the voltage went down to 220, etc.

Really I am jealous, but here we don't get as much sun anyway.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 27212869


even with my battery storage I still have a 30kw backup propane generator hooked up to 1000 gallons of propane in the ground

in august I never saw the sun and the house kicked over to generator 3 nights that month...

the panels will still generate power when it's cloudy but not enough to keep up with demand so after a week or two of clouds it starts to run low at about 2 or 3 am

solar isn't the miracle solution the green tards make it out to be

sure it's cool if you have the money and are inclined to do such a thing

but just not feasible for normal people
 Quoting: ^TrInItY^


Wrong.

It's completely feasible for "normal" people.
It's called a solar lease and you should look into it.
Many large solar companies offer it and it's a "miracle solution" at ZERO money down.

I've had it installed on my home for FREE and my attic roof reinforced for FREE and I pay way less for electricity now and I get a reimbursement at the end of every year for power Ive sold back to the electric company so yes I do laugh all the way to the bank and no I'm not full of shit, friend.

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