SCOTUS case Texas V. White or why states can't secede

And I read somewhere years ago that the Seminole Indians of Florida were the only Indian Tribe which NEVER surrendered their sovereignty to the U.S. Government.

I could envision a whole bunch of Floridians suddenly discovering some Seminole in their ancestry!

Exactly

they won't ask permission...or in the case of a possible breakdown in the Federal budget, it may well turn into every state for itself, a question of survival

Again, look at what happened to the USSR. In the 1960s they were using tanks and armies to squelch possible rebellions in satellite states

By 1991, provinces were breaking away, and there was nothing which could be done to prevent it

[link to en.wikipedia.org]

The most successful breakaway provinces were the oil and resource rich ones, fwiw

Everything is cyclical, and a badly managed, highly indebted federal government which fails to represent the will of the people, will have difficulties attempting to quell numerous provincial rebellions

this is doubly true if those provinces are richer than the central government

We are speaking hypothetically here, and I truly hope that the worst case scenarios do not manifest, the US dollar does not collapse and that extreme austerity measures aren't implemented next year

However, should push come to shove, people will not stop to ask permission to save their own lives....

This was more of a way to force the Southern States to take on their portion of the National Debt after the Civil War...

The ruling was not whether the states could secede, it was if they had indeed seceded in the eyes of the winner of the war...a distinct difference.

Has anyone thought that this is exactly what TPTB want,once you dissolve your union then your going too be picked clean one by one and each state will always want something different and will never agree on anything,you will then find out that you cant get back together again when things turn around.

Your all supposed to defend your entire country,its either all or nothing.

OK, so I just checked out the government site at [link to petitions.whitehouse.gov (secure)]

65k sigs in three days. So what happens now? how long has Obama got to respond and what could heppen if he refuses to?

That only applies to the ones that POTUS and USA know about.

Nice try dipshit, but as you and I both know laws mean nothing. In a nation of laws ruled by outlaws, who gives a shit what the laws say. It was also unconstitutional to force people to purchase things from another individual, aka health care. It is unconstitutional to take away a persons right to privacy, can you say patriot act, ndaa, tsa boys and girls. It's illegal to sell guns to the drug cartels, operation gun runner. It's also illegal to steal peoples money, MF global.

really nice try. Try this law on for size.

When in the Course of human events, it becomes necessary for one people to dissolve the political bands which have connected them with another, and to assume among the powers of the earth, the separate and equal station to which the Laws of Nature and of Nature's God entitle them, a decent respect to the opinions of mankind requires that they should declare the causes which impel them to the separation.

We hold these truths to be self-evident, that all men are created equal, that they are endowed by their Creator with certain unalienable Rights,[74] that among these are Life, Liberty and the pursuit of Happiness. That to secure these rights, Governments are instituted among Men, deriving their just powers from the consent of the governed, That whenever any Form of Government becomes destructive of these ends, it is the Right of the People to alter or to abolish it, and to institute new Government, laying its foundation on such principles and organizing its powers in such form, as to them shall seem most likely to effect their Safety and Happiness. Prudence, indeed, will dictate that Governments long established should not be changed for light and transient causes; and accordingly all experience hath shewn, that mankind are more disposed to suffer, while evils are sufferable, than to right themselves by abolishing the forms to which they are accustomed. But when a long train of abuses and usurpations, pursuing invariably the same Object evinces a design to reduce them under absolute Despotism, it is their right, it is their duty, to throw off such Government, and to provide new Guards for their future security.

I cite the following as to why exactly our government has become tyrannical.

1. taxation without any representation. The true rulers of our country are not on any ballot, in fact they buy and purchase the puppets that run what use to be our constitutional republic. I will never in my lifetime have the power to vote for my true ruler. The IMF, The Federal Reserve, The United Nations, and many others are not on my ballot.

2. The long abuse of this government participating in illegal wars, and illegal actions against the public. Operation Gunrunner, Growing Poppy in Afghanistan, Killing citizens without a trial, illegal search and seizures, seizing of lands, stealing of property.

3. I accuse the government of nothing less than outright theft. Stealing money from one citizen to give to another citizen or corporation is illegal, and unconstitutional. It is not charity, tax, or patriotic to have ones labor, energy stolen.

4. The Federal Reserve coining our currency and lending it to our government is illegal. Money is to be coined by congress, private individuals printing our currency into oblivion and charging us all tax through inflation is illegal. Who are these tyrannical individuals? They are not elected, and therefore do not represent me.

5. Most recent is the nullification of the constitution with bills like SOPA, NDAA, Patriot Act, all unconstitutional, and illegal acts.

These are all very real, and very precise charges. These are not light, or transient. They have not been levied without much thought, but they do explain what is wrong with our once proud nation. I am not unpatriotic, actually it is the opposite. I wish for our constitutional republic to be returned. For the power of the people to stand, for liberty and most of all freedom! None of the fore mentioned exist in this fascist United Government of American Slavery we exist under today.

In 1912 there was no Federal Income Tax (Federal Reserve Tax) NO Federal REserve (private banking cartel) and not much debt to mention. Now we are taxed slaves fighting banker wars and working our lives away for our masters to pay debts that are both fictional and are not ours to pay back. We are not cattle but free men. We do not need to bow to anyone. We are not Taxed Slaves!

What the Federal Reserve did to our once great nation was a violent overthrow of our constitutional GOvernment. This is not a revolution, this is a retaking of our rights, our freedoms, and our country. The revolution took place in 1912 and we lost. It's time to restore the republic for which it once stood.

Dear Government, YOUR FIRED!

I don't think so. It's like your tired of being married, you got the house the dog and had some kids and how you want to leave. The problem is you've taken on responsibilities and now you've decided you want out. Your decision now effects more then just you. Your kids are the innocent,who didn't ask for any of this and don't deserve it. We seem to take the easy road, don't want to put in the hard work. Marriage is like this county, you don't bail because sometimes is hard. You stand together and work it out. Just because your party didn't win, or there are things that need work, doesn't mean you take the easy way. If the first settlers would have taken the easy way we wouldn't be here. If you ever believed in this country. The question is do you think America is worth the hard work to save her.

I saw a thread here yesterday which had a link to the various State petitions. As an Oregonian I was pleased to see that Oregon is one of the States which seems to be growing a collective set of balls.

However, I believe that there are MANY more who support the idea than are willing to sign the petitions, because they are nervous about doing it. Common sense tells them that those petitions would just end up being lists of whom to "round up" first for the FEMA camps. Or WORSE (read between the lines) because the Gubb'mint would not want people in "their" camps who might foment revolution against them.

However, if it were put to a State or National vote and they could remain anonymous......

I have a feeling that there might be a LOT more votes in favor of seccession once that Obamacare Tax kicks in....

A LOT of people will be OBLIVIOUS until it affects them personally.

fkd my link, if you try to open it delete the final period (this guy: . ). Almost 69K now.

15 states, is not unilateral.

There's a book that came out I think back in the 80s about the break up of North America into something like six separate nations. In the northwest British Columbia, Washington State,Oregon, northern California became one country, New England states, New Brunswick, Maritime Islands Nova Scotia, Newfoundland became another country, and so-on.

It would be interesting to see if the Canadian government allowed Quebec to seceded from Canada, and if this would have some kind of domino effect. I think the U.S. and Canadian federal governments would do EVERYTHING in their power to prevent a state or province from seceding.

I just tried your link to that page, and got, "The page you're looking for is currently unavailable to view".

Is the Obama regime already trying to squash the revolution?

It's more like we're tired of the debt and now we're really pissed off at the stolen election.

The effective way to solve these problems is to start over. We'll still be the same people, and we can even make a new compact among some or all of the States so that we don't get "picked clean".

The nation is ungovernable and we should all go our separate ways.

But it will never happen.

If Texas or any other state attempted to nullify federal law and exert sovereignty in any form that competes with U.S. power, it would be occupied by U.S. military immediately and elected leaders arrested, martial law declared.

People in DC and NYC would say things like anarchists, selfish, racist, states rights=slavery, etc.

There was nothing in the Constitution before the War Between the States that said a State could not secede. It was only after the war that the North stuck that crap in to cover their barbaric asses.

Look at the USSR. When it broke up hardly a gun was fired with little to no bloodshed. The U.S. supports breaking up nations all over the globe but yet when it happened here they had a bloody war. Who is really against the "will of the people"? Who are the real barbarians?



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They consider us their property. We cannot be allowed to leave. It is like the Berlin Wall. If you leave, it is a reflection on the failure of the central government.

They don't consider the states to be their own entities which have empowered the central government to undertake certain affairs that are more easily done by a central authority.

They consider the states to be administrative units of the central government.

The Constitution is what gives the Government it's power. t is the legal contract with the people and that Government. When the Government throws out the Constitution and refuses to conduct itself according to that contract then the contract has been broken and is null and void. Without that contract they only thing the Government uses to enforce it's power is not the consent of the people but the power of the gun.

G. W. Bush said that the Constitution was just a GD piece of paper and at that point the contract was no longer valid.

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It is not a contract in any sense.

It is a list of powers loaned to the government by the people through their state governments.

It is no more a contract than the list of safety rules posted on workplace bulletin boards.

if you do not like ROMNEYCARE,
(credit where it is due, that was the template)

push for SINGLE PAYER.

BUISNISSES / EMPLOYERS should have nothing to do with WORKERS'S health care.

it is NONE OF the bosses BUISNESS,
knowing, if i have a medical condition,
unless it affects my job performance.


ALL CIVILIZED COUNTRIES have 'single payer' healthcare.

SOME THIRD WORLD COUNTRIES,
have 'single payer' healthcare.

THEY LOOK DOWN ON US.

ha ha ha ha ha !!
no HEALTH for YOU !!!


please, PLEASE, pretty please;
let us move up to the level of those THIRD WORLD COUNTRIES !!

let us see what it is like to be civilized.
(without having to go to another country, to find out)

If the Confederate states couldn't legally secede, then why did Congress require that they had to be readmitted into the Union after the Civil War?

That was kind of the point of fighting the whole thing, wasn't it?

What nukes? Military bases?

there ARE other WEAPONS besides NUKES..

A right is God given and does not need any special language, law or permit. Neither the Texas Constitution, nor the Constitution of the United States, explicitly or implicitly disallows the secession of Texas (or any other "free and independent State") from the United States. Joining the "Union" was ever and always voluntary, rendering voluntary withdrawal an equally lawful and viable option (regardless of what any self-appointed academic, media, or government "experts"—including Abraham Lincoln himself—may have ever said).

Both the original (1836) and the current (1876) Texas Constitutions also state that "All political power is inherent in the people ... they have at all times the inalienable right to alter their government in such manner as they might think proper."

This is a non-issue. texans know common law and common law would dictate that if you have the power and authority to join, you have the power and authority to leave.

It is no different than any other contract.
Yes, they may leave in breach and there would be consequences to that (returning all unspent grants and funding, returning Federal property such as weapons, vehicles and other equipment, etc) , but they can still leave.