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Why you CANNOT "do all things" through Christ as is written in Philippians 4:13. Is the verse wrong?

 
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11/20/2012 09:56 PM
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Why you CANNOT "do all things" through Christ as is written in Philippians 4:13. Is the verse wrong?
No, the verse is not wrong. But, the way people use it usually is.


Philippians 4:13 I can do all things through Christ who strengthens me.



From an article by Byron Yawn
[link to www.churchleaders.com]

You can’t actually “do all things” in Christ.

Not the way you think you can anyway.

I realize this sounds like sacrilege given the suburban spin we’ve put on this biblical expression, but it’s true. Paul did not intend some sort of personal triumphalism here.

Flatly, the Apostle Paul couldn’t “do all things” either. Paul could not get out of prison—which is where he penned this verse (Philippians 4:13)—no matter how intensely he believed in Jesus. He was stuck there until God determined otherwise.

But, he could “be imprisoned” in Christ who strengthened him to be imprisoned. Prison is such a good place to discover Christ’s sufficiency.

The true meaning of “all things” might disappoint contemporary Christians. But, it shouldn’t.

The actual point is even more glorious than the suburban legend. It gets us so much closer to grace. We normally take it to mean something like, “I can do anything I set my mind to if I simply believe.”

That is … I can achieve any personal goal by faith.

Get this job.

Win this game.

Ace this test.

But, the verse has little (or nothing) to do with our personal achievement in the face of severe odds. It’s not about our achievements at all. It’s about Christ’s achievement and a constant dependence on him regardless of one’s station in life—good or bad.

Besides, there’s a real danger in applying it the way we’re prone to.

What if you can’t “do” it?

What if things don’t work out—no matter how much you believe?

Your failure might call into question the goodness of God or the sufficiency of Christ. It robs countless hurting and weak people of the truth here. There is power in weakness.

A more accurate translation of the principle is: “I can trust in Christ (and the benefits of his life, death and resurrection) even when I can’t achieve a personal goal. I can fail to achieve my goals and still trust my Savior’s love.

Or, I can have cancer.

Or, I can lose everything.

Or, I can be fired.

I can ‘do all this’ because of who Jesus is.”

It’s the unpredictable swings of life (want, prosperity) that Paul was able to traverse by focusing on the work of Christ. This is the “all things” he has in view here.

For Paul, Jesus’ righteous life made seasons of poverty seem like wealth and seasons of wealth seem like poverty. He could experience all these things without falling into despair on one side, or idolatry on the other.

Point is … Christ is sufficient even when I can’t change things. Or, when my circumstance has the potential to change me. I can be in the worst place of my entire life with joy and peace because Christ is infinitely better.

So, when I can’t change my state of affairs, the person of Christ sustains me. What Paul is saying goes way beyond the point of our usual rendering. “If I’m in a circumstance where there is nothing I can do, I can do still that in Christ.” I can do nothing, if need be, and keep Christ as the supreme object of my faith. The things we are able to do are much greater than personal goals. They are the things of life.

I’ve seen the truth of this verse lived out by people in the midst of life’s worst hardships. I’ve witnessed this truth come to life when people were near death. I have seen people who could do nothing actually do all things.


((50% rule observed))
[link to www.churchleaders.com]
Anonymous Coward (OP)
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11/20/2012 10:22 PM
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Re: Why you CANNOT "do all things" through Christ as is written in Philippians 4:13. Is the verse wrong?
shameless bump
MC Sqiggily D

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11/20/2012 10:27 PM
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Re: Why you CANNOT "do all things" through Christ as is written in Philippians 4:13. Is the verse wrong?
The basket you are going to hell in is broken.
Anonymous Coward
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11/20/2012 10:29 PM
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Re: Why you CANNOT "do all things" through Christ as is written in Philippians 4:13. Is the verse wrong?
I don't know how to use this website, else I would donate a bump

:)

but I will say this is a great topic...

controversial even... :)

Christ does exhort us to ask for things in his name and I do think this can be very effective, especially if we are aware of the supernatural component... like praying for my cat to be protected from negative energies if she is not feeling well... I have noticed changes in little things and turn to prayer more for this... it feels powerful to ask in Jesus' name repeatedly... I see results... but I never expect results... in the sense that I trust that God's will must come first...

Roger Morneau has some interesting techniques when it comes to prayer that some might not agree with, but he seems to almost charm God into granting him things...

:)
Anonymous Coward (OP)
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11/20/2012 10:46 PM
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Re: Why you CANNOT "do all things" through Christ as is written in Philippians 4:13. Is the verse wrong?
I don't know how to use this website, else I would donate a bump

:)

but I will say this is a great topic...

controversial even... :)

Christ does exhort us to ask for things in his name and I do think this can be very effective, especially if we are aware of the supernatural component... like praying for my cat to be protected from negative energies if she is not feeling well... I have noticed changes in little things and turn to prayer more for this... it feels powerful to ask in Jesus' name repeatedly... I see results... but I never expect results... in the sense that I trust that God's will must come first...

Roger Morneau has some interesting techniques when it comes to prayer that some might not agree with, but he seems to almost charm God into granting him things...

:)
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 22070412


does it not let you in to read the article?
Anonymous Coward (OP)
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11/20/2012 10:56 PM
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Re: Why you CANNOT "do all things" through Christ as is written in Philippians 4:13. Is the verse wrong?
important to grasp the whole chapter:

Closing Appeal for Steadfastness and Unity

4:1 Therefore, my brothers and sisters, you whom I love and long for, my joy and crown, stand firm in the Lord in this way, dear friends!

2 I plead with Euodia and I plead with Syntyche to be of the same mind in the Lord. 3 Yes, and I ask you, my true companion, help these women since they have contended at my side in the cause of the gospel, along with Clement and the rest of my co-workers, whose names are in the book of life.
Final Exhortations

4 Rejoice in the Lord always. I will say it again: Rejoice! 5 Let your gentleness be evident to all. The Lord is near. 6 Do not be anxious about anything, but in every situation, by prayer and petition, with thanksgiving, present your requests to God. 7 And the peace of God, which transcends all understanding, will guard your hearts and your minds in Christ Jesus.

8 Finally, brothers and sisters, whatever is true, whatever is noble, whatever is right, whatever is pure, whatever is lovely, whatever is admirable—if anything is excellent or praiseworthy—think about such things. 9 Whatever you have learned or received or heard from me, or seen in me—put it into practice. And the God of peace will be with you.
Thanks for Their Gifts

10 I rejoiced greatly in the Lord that at last you renewed your concern for me. Indeed, you were concerned, but you had no opportunity to show it. 11 I am not saying this because I am in need, for I have learned to be content whatever the circumstances. 12 I know what it is to be in need, and I know what it is to have plenty. I have learned the secret of being content in any and every situation, whether well fed or hungry, whether living in plenty or in want. 13 I can do all this through him who gives me strength.

14 Yet it was good of you to share in my troubles. 15 Moreover, as you Philippians know, in the early days of your acquaintance with the gospel, when I set out from Macedonia, not one church shared with me in the matter of giving and receiving, except you only; 16 for even when I was in Thessalonica, you sent me aid more than once when I was in need. 17 Not that I desire your gifts; what I desire is that more be credited to your account. 18 I have received full payment and have more than enough. I am amply supplied, now that I have received from Epaphroditus the gifts you sent. They are a fragrant offering, an acceptable sacrifice, pleasing to God. 19 And my God will meet all your needs according to the riches of his glory in Christ Jesus.

20 To our God and Father be glory for ever and ever. Amen.
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11/20/2012 10:58 PM
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Re: Why you CANNOT "do all things" through Christ as is written in Philippians 4:13. Is the verse wrong?
All things Christians do are with strength from Christ. Through Christ all things are done. There is no need to be contradictory.
Anonymous Coward (OP)
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11/20/2012 10:59 PM
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Re: Why you CANNOT "do all things" through Christ as is written in Philippians 4:13. Is the verse wrong?
All things Christians do are with strength from Christ. Through Christ all things are done. There is no need to be contradictory.
 Quoting: - 14012564


did you read the article?
ibis

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11/20/2012 11:05 PM
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Re: Why you CANNOT "do all things" through Christ as is written in Philippians 4:13. Is the verse wrong?
I think it interesting that the NIV states in that verse, "I can do everything through him who gives me strength."

him - with a lower case h.

Doesn't mention anyone specifically. NASB = Him, KJV = Christ, NLT = Christ, etc...

Is the verse wrong?
Anonymous Coward (OP)
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11/20/2012 11:07 PM
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Re: Why you CANNOT "do all things" through Christ as is written in Philippians 4:13. Is the verse wrong?
I think it interesting that the NIV states in that verse, "I can do everything through him who gives me strength."

him - with a lower case h.

Doesn't mention anyone specifically. NASB = Him, KJV = Christ, NLT = Christ, etc...

Is the verse wrong?
 Quoting: ibis


i think every new translation american bible has issues. i try to stick with KJV and NLT. Sometimes i refer to the amplified.

if a verse sounds wrong, i pull up multiple translations to see what they all say and then compare.

if it's really a sticky situation, i sometimes go to the mechanical translations. i just did that recently for a study involving Genesis.
Anonymous Coward
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11/20/2012 11:11 PM
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Re: Why you CANNOT "do all things" through Christ as is written in Philippians 4:13. Is the verse wrong?
No, the verse is not wrong. But, the way people use it usually is.


Philippians 4:13 I can do all things through Christ who strengthens me.



From an article by Byron Yawn
[link to www.churchleaders.com]




You can’t actually “do all things” in Christ.

Not the way you think you can anyway.

I realize this sounds like sacrilege given the suburban spin we’ve put on this biblical expression, but it’s true. Paul did not intend some sort of personal triumphalism here.

Flatly, the Apostle Paul couldn’t “do all things” either. Paul could not get out of prison—which is where he penned this verse (Philippians 4:13)—no matter how intensely he believed in Jesus. He was stuck there until God determined otherwise.

But, he could “be imprisoned” in Christ who strengthened him to be imprisoned. Prison is such a good place to discover Christ’s sufficiency.

The true meaning of “all things” might disappoint contemporary Christians. But, it shouldn’t.

The actual point is even more glorious than the suburban legend. It gets us so much closer to grace. We normally take it to mean something like, “I can do anything I set my mind to if I simply believe.”

That is … I can achieve any personal goal by faith.

Get this job.

Win this game.

Ace this test.

But, the verse has little (or nothing) to do with our personal achievement in the face of severe odds. It’s not about our achievements at all. It’s about Christ’s achievement and a constant dependence on him regardless of one’s station in life—good or bad.

Besides, there’s a real danger in applying it the way we’re prone to.

What if you can’t “do” it?

What if things don’t work out—no matter how much you believe?

Your failure might call into question the goodness of God or the sufficiency of Christ. It robs countless hurting and weak people of the truth here. There is power in weakness.

A more accurate translation of the principle is: “I can trust in Christ (and the benefits of his life, death and resurrection) even when I can’t achieve a personal goal. I can fail to achieve my goals and still trust my Savior’s love.

Or, I can have cancer.

Or, I can lose everything.

Or, I can be fired.

I can ‘do all this’ because of who Jesus is.”

It’s the unpredictable swings of life (want, prosperity) that Paul was able to traverse by focusing on the work of Christ. This is the “all things” he has in view here.

For Paul, Jesus’ righteous life made seasons of poverty seem like wealth and seasons of wealth seem like poverty. He could experience all these things without falling into despair on one side, or idolatry on the other.

Point is … Christ is sufficient even when I can’t change things. Or, when my circumstance has the potential to change me. I can be in the worst place of my entire life with joy and peace because Christ is infinitely better.

So, when I can’t change my state of affairs, the person of Christ sustains me. What Paul is saying goes way beyond the point of our usual rendering. “If I’m in a circumstance where there is nothing I can do, I can do still that in Christ.” I can do nothing, if need be, and keep Christ as the supreme object of my faith. The things we are able to do are much greater than personal goals. They are the things of life.

I’ve seen the truth of this verse lived out by people in the midst of life’s worst hardships. I’ve witnessed this truth come to life when people were near death. I have seen people who could do nothing actually do all things.


((50% rule observed))
[link to www.churchleaders.com]
 Quoting: Salt


In other words..in MODERN english..Paul meant this..

Philippians 4:13 I can put up with and get through all the utter bullshit life throws at me through Christ who strengthens me.
Anonymous Coward (OP)
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11/20/2012 11:13 PM
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Re: Why you CANNOT "do all things" through Christ as is written in Philippians 4:13. Is the verse wrong?
In other words..in MODERN english..Paul meant this..

Philippians 4:13 I can put up with and get through all the utter bullshit life throws at me through Christ who strengthens me.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 17639181


exactamundo...
Anonymous Coward
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11/20/2012 11:18 PM
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Re: Why you CANNOT "do all things" through Christ as is written in Philippians 4:13. Is the verse wrong?
No, the verse is not wrong. But, the way people use it usually is.


Philippians 4:13 I can do all things through Christ who strengthens me.



From an article by Byron Yawn
[link to www.churchleaders.com]




You can’t actually “do all things” in Christ.

Not the way you think you can anyway.

I realize this sounds like sacrilege given the suburban spin we’ve put on this biblical expression, but it’s true. Paul did not intend some sort of personal triumphalism here.

Flatly, the Apostle Paul couldn’t “do all things” either. Paul could not get out of prison—which is where he penned this verse (Philippians 4:13)—no matter how intensely he believed in Jesus. He was stuck there until God determined otherwise.

But, he could “be imprisoned” in Christ who strengthened him to be imprisoned. Prison is such a good place to discover Christ’s sufficiency.

The true meaning of “all things” might disappoint contemporary Christians. But, it shouldn’t.

The actual point is even more glorious than the suburban legend. It gets us so much closer to grace. We normally take it to mean something like, “I can do anything I set my mind to if I simply believe.”

That is … I can achieve any personal goal by faith.

Get this job.

Win this game.

Ace this test.

But, the verse has little (or nothing) to do with our personal achievement in the face of severe odds. It’s not about our achievements at all. It’s about Christ’s achievement and a constant dependence on him regardless of one’s station in life—good or bad.

Besides, there’s a real danger in applying it the way we’re prone to.

What if you can’t “do” it?

What if things don’t work out—no matter how much you believe?

Your failure might call into question the goodness of God or the sufficiency of Christ. It robs countless hurting and weak people of the truth here. There is power in weakness.

A more accurate translation of the principle is: “I can trust in Christ (and the benefits of his life, death and resurrection) even when I can’t achieve a personal goal. I can fail to achieve my goals and still trust my Savior’s love.

Or, I can have cancer.

Or, I can lose everything.

Or, I can be fired.

I can ‘do all this’ because of who Jesus is.”

It’s the unpredictable swings of life (want, prosperity) that Paul was able to traverse by focusing on the work of Christ. This is the “all things” he has in view here.

For Paul, Jesus’ righteous life made seasons of poverty seem like wealth and seasons of wealth seem like poverty. He could experience all these things without falling into despair on one side, or idolatry on the other.

Point is … Christ is sufficient even when I can’t change things. Or, when my circumstance has the potential to change me. I can be in the worst place of my entire life with joy and peace because Christ is infinitely better.

So, when I can’t change my state of affairs, the person of Christ sustains me. What Paul is saying goes way beyond the point of our usual rendering. “If I’m in a circumstance where there is nothing I can do, I can do still that in Christ.” I can do nothing, if need be, and keep Christ as the supreme object of my faith. The things we are able to do are much greater than personal goals. They are the things of life.

I’ve seen the truth of this verse lived out by people in the midst of life’s worst hardships. I’ve witnessed this truth come to life when people were near death. I have seen people who could do nothing actually do all things.


((50% rule observed))
[link to www.churchleaders.com]
 Quoting: Salt


Paul could not even rid himself of the "messenger from satan" who tormented him though he asked thrice. Because it was not "in Christ" to release Paul from said torment. I sympathize with him greatly. Anyone who has experienced the ring can
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11/20/2012 11:22 PM
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Re: Why you CANNOT "do all things" through Christ as is written in Philippians 4:13. Is the verse wrong?
Paul could not even rid himself of the "messenger from satan" who tormented him though he asked thrice. Because it was not "in Christ" to release Paul from said torment. I sympathize with him greatly. Anyone who has experienced the ring can
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 12420326


right...
ibis

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11/20/2012 11:24 PM
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Re: Why you CANNOT "do all things" through Christ as is written in Philippians 4:13. Is the verse wrong?
Then is the NIV, as many contend, wrongly translated for those of us with English backgrounds? A word worthy of respect should be capitalized -(ie Him vs him, Christ vs christ or him) or is it only what's in the heart that matters? I am inquiring in Truth.
Anonymous Coward (OP)
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11/20/2012 11:26 PM
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Re: Why you CANNOT "do all things" through Christ as is written in Philippians 4:13. Is the verse wrong?
Then is the NIV, as many contend, wrongly translated for those of us with English backgrounds? A word worthy of respect should be capitalized -(ie Him vs him, Christ vs christ or him) or is it only what's in the heart that matters? I am inquiring in Truth.
 Quoting: ibis


people are finding a number of problems with this version.

here is a helpful link:
[link to www.davnet.org]
Anonymous Coward
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11/20/2012 11:32 PM
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Re: Why you CANNOT "do all things" through Christ as is written in Philippians 4:13. Is the verse wrong?
look at the golden gate bridge, look at the ipod, we've done them, its a fucking swedish house mafia commercial for vodka
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11/20/2012 11:35 PM
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Re: Why you CANNOT "do all things" through Christ as is written in Philippians 4:13. Is the verse wrong?
look at the golden gate bridge, look at the ipod, we've done them, its a fucking swedish house mafia commercial for vodka
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 1457378


:pancakecrystal:
Anonymous Coward
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11/20/2012 11:39 PM
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Re: Why you CANNOT "do all things" through Christ as is written in Philippians 4:13. Is the verse wrong?
go play halflife 2 its like quake 3 with better guns
Anonymous Coward
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Philippines
11/20/2012 11:40 PM
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Re: Why you CANNOT "do all things" through Christ as is written in Philippians 4:13. Is the verse wrong?
Then is the NIV, as many contend, wrongly translated for those of us with English backgrounds? A word worthy of respect should be capitalized -(ie Him vs him, Christ vs christ or him) or is it only what's in the heart that matters? I am inquiring in Truth.
 Quoting: ibis


According to the Internet, Rupert Marduk owns the company (Zondervan) that has the sole rights to print the NIV.

also owns the company that prints the satanic bible

seems redundant

[link to www.whale.to]
Anonymous Coward (OP)
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11/20/2012 11:45 PM
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Re: Why you CANNOT "do all things" through Christ as is written in Philippians 4:13. Is the verse wrong?
Then is the NIV, as many contend, wrongly translated for those of us with English backgrounds? A word worthy of respect should be capitalized -(ie Him vs him, Christ vs christ or him) or is it only what's in the heart that matters? I am inquiring in Truth.
 Quoting: ibis


According to the Internet, Rupert Marduk owns the company (Zondervan) that has the sole rights to print the NIV.

also owns the company that prints the satanic bible

seems redundant

[link to www.whale.to]
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 12420326


well there it is...

i will have to check that out for myself
Anonymous Coward
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Philippines
11/20/2012 11:50 PM
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Re: Why you CANNOT "do all things" through Christ as is written in Philippians 4:13. Is the verse wrong?
Then is the NIV, as many contend, wrongly translated for those of us with English backgrounds? A word worthy of respect should be capitalized -(ie Him vs him, Christ vs christ or him) or is it only what's in the heart that matters? I am inquiring in Truth.
 Quoting: ibis


According to the Internet, Rupert Marduk owns the company (Zondervan) that has the sole rights to print the NIV.

also owns the company that prints the satanic bible

seems redundant

[link to www.whale.to]
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 12420326


well there it is...

i will have to check that out for myself
 Quoting: Salt


then there's this:
Thread: Pandemonium! R U In?


it is all gone

always was

the world is under direct control of satan

but his authority is delegated

lease is almost up

get in the ark
Anonymous Coward (OP)
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11/20/2012 11:51 PM
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Re: Why you CANNOT "do all things" through Christ as is written in Philippians 4:13. Is the verse wrong?
Then is the NIV, as many contend, wrongly translated for those of us with English backgrounds? A word worthy of respect should be capitalized -(ie Him vs him, Christ vs christ or him) or is it only what's in the heart that matters? I am inquiring in Truth.
 Quoting: ibis


According to the Internet, Rupert Marduk owns the company (Zondervan) that has the sole rights to print the NIV.

also owns the company that prints the satanic bible

seems redundant

[link to www.whale.to]
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 12420326


well there it is...

i will have to check that out for myself
 Quoting: Salt


then there's this:
Thread: Pandemonium! R U In?


it is all gone

always was

the world is under direct control of satan

but his authority is delegated

lease is almost up

get in the ark
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 12420326


word.

you should start a thread about murdock and the NIV
Anonymous Coward
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Philippines
11/21/2012 12:00 AM
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Re: Why you CANNOT "do all things" through Christ as is written in Philippians 4:13. Is the verse wrong?
...


According to the Internet, Rupert Marduk owns the company (Zondervan) that has the sole rights to print the NIV.

also owns the company that prints the satanic bible

seems redundant

[link to www.whale.to]
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 12420326


well there it is...

i will have to check that out for myself
 Quoting: Salt


then there's this:
Thread: Pandemonium! R U In?


it is all gone

always was

the world is under direct control of satan

but his authority is delegated

lease is almost up

get in the ark
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 12420326


word.

you should start a thread about murdock and the NIV
 Quoting: Salt


i am in enough trouble already
T Ceti H.C. Radnarg

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11/21/2012 12:02 AM
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Re: Why you CANNOT "do all things" through Christ as is written in Philippians 4:13. Is the verse wrong?
The basket you are going to hell in is broken.
 Quoting: MC Sqiggily D
1rof1..the first testament called and said it wasn't on fire...
How unfortunate for some rulers when men,women,and children continue to think... Keep repeating the lies loud enough and long enough and just maybe the people will start to believe the lies again and good luck with that...finding your energy open until mars becomes raging aries...
T Ceti H.C. Radnarg

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11/21/2012 12:04 AM
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Re: Why you CANNOT "do all things" through Christ as is written in Philippians 4:13. Is the verse wrong?
of course we can do all things through Christ..Christ is our spirit that moves the flesh..without our Christ,our flesh dont do shit but crumble into dust...hey joan jethi do you hate yourself for loving me? lmao

Last Edited by T Ceti H.C. Radnarg on 11/21/2012 12:06 AM
How unfortunate for some rulers when men,women,and children continue to think... Keep repeating the lies loud enough and long enough and just maybe the people will start to believe the lies again and good luck with that...finding your energy open until mars becomes raging aries...
Anonymous Coward (OP)
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11/21/2012 12:05 AM
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Re: Why you CANNOT "do all things" through Christ as is written in Philippians 4:13. Is the verse wrong?
...


well there it is...

i will have to check that out for myself
 Quoting: Salt


then there's this:
Thread: Pandemonium! R U In?


it is all gone

always was

the world is under direct control of satan

but his authority is delegated

lease is almost up

get in the ark
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 12420326


word.

you should start a thread about murdock and the NIV
 Quoting: Salt


i am in enough trouble already
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 12420326



heh... well, there is a great disclaimer at the bottom of our front page. there's your plausible deniability.
Anonymous Coward
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11/21/2012 12:25 AM
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Re: Why you CANNOT "do all things" through Christ as is written in Philippians 4:13. Is the verse wrong?
nice post...

clappa
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11/21/2012 12:34 AM
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Re: Why you CANNOT "do all things" through Christ as is written in Philippians 4:13. Is the verse wrong?
nice post...

clappa
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 26040853



hf
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User ID: 21291600
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11/21/2012 12:52 AM
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Re: Why you CANNOT "do all things" through Christ as is written in Philippians 4:13. Is the verse wrong?
of course we can do all things through Christ..Christ is our spirit that moves the flesh..without our Christ,our flesh dont do shit but crumble into dust...hey joan jethi do you hate yourself for loving me? lmao
 Quoting: T Ceti H.C. Radnarg


so you didn't read the article.
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User ID: 26735250
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11/21/2012 07:11 AM
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Re: Why you CANNOT "do all things" through Christ as is written in Philippians 4:13. Is the verse wrong?
Morning bump for a wonderful thread!

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We become like that to which we are devoted. Choose wisely.