Rapture of the Church and the 7 year tribulation(actually 10 year tribulation)

You do get saved but why not accept Jesus as your savior now and only go through the 42 months prior to the 7 year tribulation

You are putting your security in the wrong place. It is not in the arms of the flesh that will provide our means, but our trust in the Lord, that will be honored by God. Your idols are in the security of your material things and not the true God!

In the above verse, Pre-tribbers claim that Jesus will rapture the church before the tribulation. They claim the "hour of temptation" refers to the tribulation and "I will also keep them from" refers to Jesus' removal of the church from the earth. When translators have written "I will also keep the from the hour...," pre-tribbers claim "kept from" should have been translated "kept out of."

the word kept in the Greek means to "guard" not removal
look it up in the Strongs

Jesus only has 1 church...revelation is showing 7, which means there are 7 levels of those walking with Jesus...some have Jesus as Savior but the church of Philadelphia has Jesus and Lord and Savior...Jesus is Lord and Savior to those in the church of philadelphia level..the other levels show Jesus saved them but Jesus isn't first in their life but He will be at the end of the 7 year tribulation....Reguarding the Jesus only "guarding" the church of Philadelphia for being faithful, what kind of reward would that be Jesus is guarding all of the levels of the church. "kept out of" means kept out of the last 7 years because they were faithful in the 42 months tribulation prior to the 7 year trib that people don't see coming and will show who is faithful to Jesus and who is faithful to the rapture. What do you trust in, Jesus or the rapture?

Last Edited by waterman on 11/22/2012 02:01 PM

Some good stuff here. . .

[link to www.gods-kingdom-ministries.net]

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Thanks, I'm going to read that. People think that Gods Word is a one level Word, if something happened that fulfilled a scripture they put a "the end" on it and it can't apply to anything else. The destruction of Israel in Isaiah, Jeremiah and the prophets was only the physical level, the spiritual Israel is coming next and the spiritual Israel is the United States, judgement is coming and people only look at tiny geographical Israel as were gog and magog war of psalm 83 war is going...Wrong it is with spiritual Isreal(United States). Isaiah 7 war will happen in geographical Israel but the psalm 83 war is with spritual israel(united states)..the scripture actuall says it will come to your "hidden ones", how are you hidden if everyone knows where your located. They are hidden becasue it is spiritual Israel being attacked

There is 1 more rapture doctrine, it has the 1,000 year reign as being on earth with a selective group (Re:20:4) that is a static population and when Satan and all other fallen angels are released from the Pit God will then sent fire down from heaven which sends them to the fiery lake, During that event the people are removed from the earth in the same glorified bodies they had for the full time from when the 7th trump sounded. This rapture even come wiyth a verse.

Isa:51:6:
Lift up your eyes to the heavens,
and look upon the earth beneath:
for the heavens shall vanish away like smoke,
and the earth shall wax old like a garment,
and they that dwell therein shall die in like manner:
but my salvation shall be for ever,
and my righteousness shall not be abolished.

Or the verse below includes all Gentiles and the 7 letters basically set 14 relationships a person can have with god that God uses to judge people by, especially the ones alive when the 7th trump sounds. At that time your place for the next 1,000 years is determined. All out earthly religions will be made null and void and everyone will either be a sheep or a goat, the sheep are alive and the goats go to the earthly Pit, the same place all fallen angels are in now and the same place Satan will be in chains in the place designed for them (rather that it being the fiery lake.

Re:1:7:
Behold,
he cometh with clouds;
and every eye shall see him,
and they also which pierced him:
and all kindreds of the earth shall wail because of him.
Even so,
Amen.

I think the pretrib christians may be likened to the 5 foolish virgins who did not take extra oil for their lamps believing the bridegroom will come early, while the mid or postrib christians may be likened to the 5 wise virgins who took extra oil for their lamps preparing for the possibility that the bridegroom might come later than expected.



Note that the 5 foolish virgins who did not prepare for a late arrival of the bridegroom were denied entrance to the marriage of the bridegroom.

If people could see that revelation 2:10 is stating there are 10 years of tribulation but only the last 7 are after the end of the "age of grace" they could see that the tarrying of the Lord is when the united states is destroyed the 10 year tribulation clock starts, and those who are faithful for the 42 months prior to the 7 year tribulation will be kept from it because they kept oil(remained faithful to Jesus) and didn't have to have a rapture to still love the Lord....Those people will be raptured before the last 7 years which are not a part of the "age of grace"

Last Edited by waterman on 11/22/2012 03:12 PM

The question is not whether Christ will come before, during, or after the tribulation.

The question is whether you as a christian is prepared and willing to wait for Christ even if he comes late, or after the tribulation.

Grace has no "end"

I'm talking about from the time Jesus rose from the grave and the day of pentecost came (the birth of the church) until the beginning of the 70th week of Daniel. The end of the time period between the birth of the church and the beginning of 70th week which many call the "age of grace"

Last Edited by waterman on 11/22/2012 03:28 PM

I know, and that age actually has no end.

That 70th week is not the same part of that age..it is a 7 year period in itself...you are saved by grace and by being a martyr getting your head chopped off and your testimony of Jesus Christ

[link to www.biblegateway.com]

Romans 5:3

King James Version (KJV)

3 And not only so, but we glory in tribulations also: knowing that tribulation worketh "patience";

Revelation 3:10(to the church of Philadelphia)


Because thou hast kept the word of my "patience", I also will keep thee from the hour of temptation(7 year tribulation), which shall come upon all the world, to try them that dwell upon the earth.
...Why because you remained faithful during the 42 month tribulation prior to the 7 year tribulation shown in Rev.2:10:



10 Do not fear any of those things which you are about to suffer. Indeed, the devil is about to throw some of you into prison, that you may be tested, and you will have tribulation ten days(years). Be faithful until death, and I will give you the crown of life.

Last Edited by waterman on 11/22/2012 03:40 PM

What unbiblical drivel you are posting.

Jesus returns one more time and all will see and hear Him and those remaining will be 'raptured' if you will, taken up with Him. It is a lie that He returns secretly.

You better keep your eyes open, as, unless you die before, you are in for the ride with the rest of us.

The dividing line for who will live (Re:10 and who will die (Re:16) is the sound of the 7th trump (Re:11)

Re:9:20:
And the rest of the men which were not killed by these plagues yet repented not of the works of their hands,
that they should not worship devils,
and idols of gold,
and silver,
and brass,
and stone,
and of wood:
which neither can see,
nor hear,
nor walk:
Re:9:21:
Neither repented they of their murders,
nor of their sorceries,
nor of their fornication,
nor of their thefts.

The 70th week is part of a single block of time. John the Baptist being called to start preaching was when it started. God calling John stopped Jesus from preaching that message from when He first came back from the 40 days in the wilderness. He did start to do that when John was put in prison and it is their combined time that makes up the full 3 1/2 years before the cross at mid-week. Acts 10 and the arrival of some Gentiles to be taught abbout God marks the end of the 70th week. Revelation promotes a 3 1/2 year timeline with the ones given running side-by-side to each other instead of end-to-end. The Beast from the Pit kills the two witnesses at the end of their 1260 days, 4 days later the Beast's 42 months (1260 days) come to an end when the 7th trump sounds on the day the two witnesses are resurrected. Woes 1 and 2 take 3 1/2 years. woe 3 takes a few hours and it starts and finishes (all 7 vials poured out) on the same day, also on that day is the resurrection of everyone destined to be alive for the 1,000 years.

Last Edited by MHz on 11/22/2012 05:00 PM

There is no rapture. It's a hoax.

There are 4 groups of people on the rapture:

Is your faith in Jesus Christ or is it in the rapture, It will be tested!

1. Pre-tribulation rapture
2. Mid-tribulation rapture
3. Post-tribulation rapture
4. No tribulation rapture


two more group 4......thanks

The 144,000 is 12,000 Jews from each of the 12 tribes of Israel ( Jacobs sons). 12x12000= 144,000.

The two witnesses are the prophets here to witness to Jews. Only two men did not die in the Bible and were taken up by God. Moses( God buried his body) and Elijah ( taken away in a chariot of fire). These two men were also seen talking to Jesus on the Mount of Olives before his death. I believe these are the two witnesses.

The age of Christianity ends with the rapture of the church. Just as the Jewish people have not had salvation( or a recognition of Jesus as their messiah) since the beginning of the Gentile age. No one but Jews will be saved during the tribulation.

Lot was spared from Sodom and Gommorah because He was a righteous soul who vexed his spirit living there everyday. His cousin Abraham interceded for him and " even 10 righteous souls who may be there" and God spared them. The Church will be raptured.

Amos 8:11 tells us there will be a famine of the word of God in the end Amos 8:11:Behold, the days come, saith the Lord GOD, that I will send a famine in the land, not a famine of bread, nor a thirst for water, but of hearing the words of the LORD...how will there be a famine if all these strong christians are all still here....answer: They aren't here and that is why God raises up the two witnesses(Moses aaron type) to reach the rest of the church. The other part of the church that was at the level of the church of philadelphia left after their 42 month tribulation prior to the 7 year tribulation.........there is a 10 year tribulation but to those who remain faithful during those extra 42 months before the 7 year trib that nobody is telling you about they will be raptured.

Revelation 2:10

New King James Version (NKJV)

10 Do not fear any of those things which you are about to suffer. Indeed, the devil is about to throw some of you into prison, that you may be tested, and you will have tribulation ten days(years). Be faithful until death, and I will give you the crown of life.

Last Edited by waterman on 11/22/2012 05:20 PM

Put me on record as stating that this famine has been underway for *decades*

Sure there is, the Great White Throne event so mankind can see God's home and then enter New Jerusalem for the ride back to an earth that will be as lifeless as described in Ge:2 except this time all of mankind is behind Adam and Eve when they exit the city and just as the living water healed the Dead Sea in Eze:47 the water this time will heal the earth bringing life back to all other flesh (land sea and air beings)going back to all life created in Ge:1 and including the sparrows in the NT that God says He will remember and for the God of the living that means having them flying around again. The new earth will include the whole universe if you are concerned about having enough room. Angelic being are at the GWT event but they stay in that 3rd heaven as perfected angels, like God and the Holy Spirit.

Last Edited by MHz on 11/22/2012 05:20 PM

I think not.

Jer:4:28:
For this shall the earth mourn,
and the heavens above be black:
because I have spoken it,
I have purposed it,
and will not repent,
neither will I turn back from it.

Last Edited by MHz on 11/22/2012 05:23 PM

Its not here yet..you can get a bible for free, there is a church on every block,the word of God is preached on t.v, it's on the radio...when this famine comes you won't be able to get a hold of a bible...people don't look for things of the Word of God but its not a famine because it is still available

Last Edited by waterman on 11/22/2012 05:28 PM

The new Jerusalem is not a physical structure, it's simply the Kingdom of God.

And for the record, it's important to understand that not only do its "gates" never close, but they remain open so that the kings and armies of the nations may be brought within (Isaiah 60).

Having scripture available means nothing - the scribes of Jesus' day were said to be in it constantly, and yet they missed their Messiah. They missed the whole point. It's about *understanding*, not just the texts.

That may be true also but the word won't be available because it says:
It says hearing not understanding

Behold, the days come, saith the Lord GOD, that I will send a famine in the land, not a famine of bread, nor a thirst for water, but of hearing the words of the LORD