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Message Subject Union or No Union?
Poster Handle Anonymous Coward
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You don't get it do you? It's not the unions, it's your beloved capitalists heros who are doing it. They're the ones shoving the shiv in your back and shipping your factories to China. Like I said Burt, you're one stupid fucker.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 27428056

What is a business IN business to do? Make money, of course, That's the sole reason for its existence. When politicians find political and financial gain in excessively regulating and taxing a company into the red, it has one of two choices: sink or swim. And for better or worse, if moving overseas becomes necessary to the viability and profitability of the company, how precisely does that make one's "beloved capitalist heroes" the bad guys? Unions have become the standard-bearers or an entitlement society. Moreover, a modern labor union is nothing more than a pyramid scheme, who's gains are made at the expense of ALL Americans, not just the members they "serve." Union labor is an unnecessary expense to any business, and simply put, they are recruiting pools for the democratic party. The reason the foreign auto and equipment manufacturers have excelled here in the U.S. is based entirely on the highly-skilled, highly-motivated, NON-UNION labor they employ. That may very well change when they too are somehow punished by the politicians for their success. And if you're still a die-hard union advocate at the end of the day, go start a business for yourself in a non-unionized market and learn for yourself what makes a labor union non-competitive.
 Quoting: Veranidae

Well you may have a point, but I sure as fuck do not want to go back to being a non unionized worker and having to deal with the constant badgering BS etc. Ask those foreign workers if they "like" their non union jobs. I bet all of them wish they didn't have to slave away like they do. I'm saying there can be a better balance. Unions were good and still can be, but is corporate greed better then?
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 28492103

Union v. Non-Union can certainly be enigmatic, depending on the prism you're looking at it through. You can't apply the value of a labor union to the general welfare of the population at large as though the prism we're looking through is in the year 1900. Labor laws, standardized practices, and safety features on equipment have made any argument for the same irrelevant. We've all been frustrated at work, and we're all searching for some degree of certainty in our lives. No one can argue that. But we don't enter this world with any guarantees and have no claim to entitlements. Particularly not in the workplace. If the same set of dynamics were equally as favorable to non-union businesses as they are to union business, if the playing field was level in a free-market economy, and if politicians did not have and exercise the power to reward select segments of the population for their votes through accommodating legislation, I'd welcome union companies as competitors. Furthermore, when I was reconciling my meager 401k investments yesterday, my only concern was for the success of my investments.

I have every confidence that people can ALWAYS guide themselves through this world better than any living man or group thereof can offer for guidance and oversight. Some people don't share that confidence. And that's fine. I don't believe in entitlements or collectivism, nor do I ask for it to be force-fed to me. When you strip away the benefits a union offers its members to find it's an illusion, or a pyramid scheme at best, as mentioned earlier, I can't imagine it wouldn't frustrate a lover of liberty an independence who happens to belong to a union as much as it does someone like me. Unions and modern government are a system of socialism inside a developing system of socialism.
 Quoting: Veranidae

That's a good post, and I agree in a lot of ways. I just don't understand why people think that unions are driven by socialism. To me, that would mean that communism is the better choice then? Lol I don't think it is the better way either. The fact that unions have made it so far today, has made the playing field unequal.

But I guess what I am saying is that the union was there to protect the worker back in the day. Today we all know that is not the case. A perfect example of this is that in my union, which is government job, I work in an old age home, but our government wants to freeze all our wages. To me it's not a huge deal as we are paid quite well. But let's flip that and ask the government employees to freeze their wages. That simply doesn't happen. So again there is no balance where I think there can be.
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