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Principal at School Says I Cannot Email Other Parents About Class Related Things!

 
Anonymous Coward
User ID: 22950961
United States
12/05/2012 12:44 PM
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Principal at School Says I Cannot Email Other Parents About Class Related Things!
Long story short, the elementary school where my child attends decided that because I used the parent email list to contact other parents and ask their opinion of goings on in class, I am directing malice towards the teacher. I have tried talking with this teacher about anything that's bothered me about her lessons or lack thereof... and I did it as nicely as possible. All I got in return were responses that dodged all my questions.

I can't argue about my opinion of the teacher, but I did in no way, say anything bad about this teacher. This teacher has dumbed down the level difficulty that 2nd grade should be. All the kids have done so far is review from 1st grade and earlier. Then, all of a sudden the teacher assigned a cultural heritage project and proclaimed that the kids should be able to research it, present it etc with no help from their parents. Absolutely impossible expectations since the kids haven't learned anything beyond a 1st grade level so far this year.

I simply asked other parents if they thought that the most recent project the teacher had assigned was too hard for the children.

So, my question is this: Does this principal have any right to tell me I cannot contact other parents via email to discuss class matters?
Anonymous Coward
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12/05/2012 12:46 PM
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Re: Principal at School Says I Cannot Email Other Parents About Class Related Things!
Nope.
Justalittlebad

User ID: 24677767
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12/05/2012 12:47 PM
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Re: Principal at School Says I Cannot Email Other Parents About Class Related Things!
Make them put in writing.
Justalittlebad/more or less
Anonymous Coward
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12/05/2012 12:47 PM
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Re: Principal at School Says I Cannot Email Other Parents About Class Related Things!
What is he going to do if you continue? I don't see that there is much of anything they can do. The parents all consented to the use of their emails, and the school distributed them. In my opinion, that is where his "jurisdiction" ends. Did you let him know you had approached the teacher first? What was his response?
Anonymous Coward (OP)
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12/05/2012 12:50 PM
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Re: Principal at School Says I Cannot Email Other Parents About Class Related Things!
Nope.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 26156669


I didn't think so, I figured that it violated my right to free speech. I just don't understand why someone as supposedly honorable as a school principle would try to control my personal liberties like that.

How should I confront her? I've had about enough of this crazy school and I don't feel like backing down and letting them get their way. Honestly, I'd rather find some way to expose this and make a change for the better. I can't speak for the children in other classes at this school, but the kids in my child's class are not getting the basic education that they deserve. The teacher wouldn't even give them spelling tests until I started asking why my child hadn't been tested in spelling yet. The teacher's response? "I do not believe in making the students memorize spelling words". Really? WTF?!
Anonymous Coward (OP)
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12/05/2012 12:51 PM
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Re: Principal at School Says I Cannot Email Other Parents About Class Related Things!
Make them put in writing.
 Quoting: Justalittlebad


I've got it in writing already. I requested that all of our communications forthwith be through email.
Anonymous Coward
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12/05/2012 12:52 PM
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Re: Principal at School Says I Cannot Email Other Parents About Class Related Things!
local assemblyman
Anonymous Coward (OP)
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12/05/2012 12:54 PM
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Re: Principal at School Says I Cannot Email Other Parents About Class Related Things!
What is he going to do if you continue? I don't see that there is much of anything they can do. The parents all consented to the use of their emails, and the school distributed them. In my opinion, that is where his "jurisdiction" ends. Did you let him know you had approached the teacher first? What was his response?
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 18677079


The principal does know that I contacted the teacher first. All the principal has done is back up the teacher with vague rhetoric about state core standards; which themselves are so vague that they could support anyones teaching methods or weak curriculums. The principal dodged all of my questions and concerns and told me that they were unfounded. The principal didn't have a leg to stand on when other parents chimed in and said they felt the same way as I did.
Justalittlebad

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12/05/2012 12:56 PM
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Re: Principal at School Says I Cannot Email Other Parents About Class Related Things!
Make them put in writing.
 Quoting: Justalittlebad


I've got it in writing already. I requested that all of our communications forthwith be through email.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 22950961


I would take w/ you have to an Attorney.
Justalittlebad/more or less
Alufiend
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12/05/2012 12:56 PM
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Re: Principal at School Says I Cannot Email Other Parents About Class Related Things!
better be careful. nowadays they call CPS and take the child away since you are questioning the system.
you must be a bad parent for wanting to know how they are brainwashing your child.
Anonymous Coward
User ID: 8625642
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12/05/2012 12:58 PM
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Re: Principal at School Says I Cannot Email Other Parents About Class Related Things!
Nope.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 26156669


I didn't think so, I figured that it violated my right to free speech. I just don't understand why someone as supposedly honorable as a school principle would try to control my personal liberties like that.

How should I confront her? I've had about enough of this crazy school and I don't feel like backing down and letting them get their way. Honestly, I'd rather find some way to expose this and make a change for the better. I can't speak for the children in other classes at this school, but the kids in my child's class are not getting the basic education that they deserve. The teacher wouldn't even give them spelling tests until I started asking why my child hadn't been tested in spelling yet. The teacher's response? "I do not believe in making the students memorize spelling words". Really? WTF?!
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 22950961


There are plenty and I mean plenty of bad administrators. Excellence is not really rewarded for a variety of reasons. Principals are no more honorable than any other profession. Some are great people. Most are functionaries that take a reactive rather than proactive approach to almost everything.

Don't confront her though unless you are ready for the potential ramifications. Just go about your business of emailing the other parents but be careful because the principal might recruit some of them to allege that you are "harassing" them. Principals are connected in the community. If you have a real bad one on your hands then you might be retaliated against. Try to get other parent support before any "confrontation".
Anonymous Coward (OP)
User ID: 22950961
United States
12/05/2012 12:58 PM
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Re: Principal at School Says I Cannot Email Other Parents About Class Related Things!
better be careful. nowadays they call CPS and take the child away since you are questioning the system.
you must be a bad parent for wanting to know how they are brainwashing your child.
 Quoting: Alufiend 28365032


That's a scary thought...
Anonymous Coward
User ID: 17670138
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12/05/2012 12:59 PM
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Re: Principal at School Says I Cannot Email Other Parents About Class Related Things!
It is only going to get worse, pull your kid before it is too late. Private school, or home school is going to be the only way for your kid to get any kind of education.
Anonymous Coward (OP)
User ID: 22950961
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12/05/2012 01:01 PM
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Re: Principal at School Says I Cannot Email Other Parents About Class Related Things!


There are plenty and I mean plenty of bad administrators. Excellence is not really rewarded for a variety of reasons. Principals are no more honorable than any other profession. Some are great people. Most are functionaries that take a reactive rather than proactive approach to almost everything.

Don't confront her though unless you are ready for the potential ramifications. Just go about your business of emailing the other parents but be careful because the principal might recruit some of them to allege that you are "harassing" them. Principals are connected in the community. If you have a real bad one on your hands then you might be retaliated against. Try to get other parent support before any "confrontation".


Thank you for your thoughts. I appreciate hearing what others have to say. Honestly, I think the parents around here are too occupied with other things than to retaliate. At least that's how it seems right now.
Anonymous Coward
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12/05/2012 01:01 PM
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Re: Principal at School Says I Cannot Email Other Parents About Class Related Things!
What is he going to do if you continue? I don't see that there is much of anything they can do. The parents all consented to the use of their emails, and the school distributed them. In my opinion, that is where his "jurisdiction" ends. Did you let him know you had approached the teacher first? What was his response?
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 18677079


The principal does know that I contacted the teacher first. All the principal has done is back up the teacher with vague rhetoric about state core standards; which themselves are so vague that they could support anyones teaching methods or weak curriculums. The principal dodged all of my questions and concerns and told me that they were unfounded. The principal didn't have a leg to stand on when other parents chimed in and said they felt the same way as I did.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 22950961


Are you in California?

The principal has likely committed a minor violation of your first amendment right to association and speech but keep in mind that speech/association can be abridged if there is a compelling governmental interest in doing so - such as if you were disrupting the school - but not because of the content of your speech - rather because of the frequency, manner, etc.

Are you emailing parents directly or through a school-provided list-serv or other service?
mopar28m
John 3:16

User ID: 14265444
United States
12/05/2012 01:02 PM

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Re: Principal at School Says I Cannot Email Other Parents About Class Related Things!
better be careful. nowadays they call CPS and take the child away since you are questioning the system.
you must be a bad parent for wanting to know how they are brainwashing your child.
 Quoting: Alufiend 28365032


I not only question the system, I challenge it big time.

The teachers, the principal & the school board know me by name.

You wouldn't believe how many alternative assignments my kids got in class when the project they were doing went against our personal beliefs or I felt they were way beyond what was expected of my kids at whatever age they were at the time.

We helped out kids with their school projects, I don't care what the teacher said.
vaccinefreehealth.spam

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Racin​g to end vaccinations.
Anonymous Coward
User ID: 29106373
United States
12/05/2012 01:05 PM
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Re: Principal at School Says I Cannot Email Other Parents About Class Related Things!
better be careful. nowadays they call CPS and take the child away since you are questioning the system.
you must be a bad parent for wanting to know how they are brainwashing your child.
 Quoting: Alufiend 28365032


That's a scary thought...
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 22950961


Call a local news station and report this..and if you have money and are able hire an attorney.
Anonymous Coward
User ID: 25180363
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12/05/2012 01:06 PM
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Re: Principal at School Says I Cannot Email Other Parents About Class Related Things!
Why was the school distributing other parents email addresses?
Anonymous Coward (OP)
User ID: 22950961
United States
12/05/2012 01:06 PM
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Re: Principal at School Says I Cannot Email Other Parents About Class Related Things!
What is he going to do if you continue? I don't see that there is much of anything they can do. The parents all consented to the use of their emails, and the school distributed them. In my opinion, that is where his "jurisdiction" ends. Did you let him know you had approached the teacher first? What was his response?
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 18677079


The principal does know that I contacted the teacher first. All the principal has done is back up the teacher with vague rhetoric about state core standards; which themselves are so vague that they could support anyones teaching methods or weak curriculums. The principal dodged all of my questions and concerns and told me that they were unfounded. The principal didn't have a leg to stand on when other parents chimed in and said they felt the same way as I did.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 22950961


Are you in California?

The principal has likely committed a minor violation of your first amendment right to association and speech but keep in mind that speech/association can be abridged if there is a compelling governmental interest in doing so - such as if you were disrupting the school - but not because of the content of your speech - rather because of the frequency, manner, etc.

Are you emailing parents directly or through a school-provided list-serv or other service?
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 8625642


No, I'm in Wa. I emailed parents using a chain list of emails that is provided with every class related email that I get. If I'm not allowed to use those email addresses (which are in the email directory anyways), then why didn't the teacher just BCC all the emails to parents? It's beginning to sound like this whole mess isn't going to be worth it, but I don't want to let this administrator off the hook quite yet. I wish things were different. It just seems like the teacher and the principal lack any amount of logic or common sense.
Anonymous Coward
User ID: 1898146
United States
12/05/2012 01:10 PM
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Re: Principal at School Says I Cannot Email Other Parents About Class Related Things!
no right to limit.... perhaps the principal was asking you to follow protocol and have a conference. Go through the channels and get what you need
Anonymous Coward (OP)
User ID: 22950961
United States
12/05/2012 01:10 PM
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Re: Principal at School Says I Cannot Email Other Parents About Class Related Things!
better be careful. nowadays they call CPS and take the child away since you are questioning the system.
you must be a bad parent for wanting to know how they are brainwashing your child.
 Quoting: Alufiend 28365032


I not only question the system, I challenge it big time.

The teachers, the principal & the school board know me by name.

You wouldn't believe how many alternative assignments my kids got in class when the project they were doing went against our personal beliefs or I felt they were way beyond what was expected of my kids at whatever age they were at the time.

We helped out kids with their school projects, I don't care what the teacher said.
 Quoting: mopar28m


Thank you for your response. You and I sound like we've been through some of the same situations. I just felt as though the teacher should be assigning things that the kids can complete on their own so they can build some confidence. I couldn't believe that they've pushed cultural heritage two years in a row at this school now. It doesn't accomplish anything at this age except programming.

A child at the age of 7-8 typically has next to zero interest in cultural heritage. Why not have them do something like make a volcano with baking soda and vinegar. That way the parents could oversee and help a bit, but the child would get the satisfaction of building most of it and of course the chemical reaction culminating in the "eruption".
Anonymous Coward
User ID: 8625642
United States
12/05/2012 01:12 PM
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Re: Principal at School Says I Cannot Email Other Parents About Class Related Things!
What is he going to do if you continue? I don't see that there is much of anything they can do. The parents all consented to the use of their emails, and the school distributed them. In my opinion, that is where his "jurisdiction" ends. Did you let him know you had approached the teacher first? What was his response?
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 18677079


The principal does know that I contacted the teacher first. All the principal has done is back up the teacher with vague rhetoric about state core standards; which themselves are so vague that they could support anyones teaching methods or weak curriculums. The principal dodged all of my questions and concerns and told me that they were unfounded. The principal didn't have a leg to stand on when other parents chimed in and said they felt the same way as I did.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 22950961


Are you in California?

The principal has likely committed a minor violation of your first amendment right to association and speech but keep in mind that speech/association can be abridged if there is a compelling governmental interest in doing so - such as if you were disrupting the school - but not because of the content of your speech - rather because of the frequency, manner, etc.

Are you emailing parents directly or through a school-provided list-serv or other service?
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 8625642


No, I'm in Wa. I emailed parents using a chain list of emails that is provided with every class related email that I get. If I'm not allowed to use those email addresses (which are in the email directory anyways), then why didn't the teacher just BCC all the emails to parents? It's beginning to sound like this whole mess isn't going to be worth it, but I don't want to let this administrator off the hook quite yet. I wish things were different. It just seems like the teacher and the principal lack any amount of logic or common sense.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 22950961


No, you are allowed to use the email addresses. The school does not own those in any way. If the parents object to your emails then you should stop. I was trying to see if it was somehow a listserv that the school set up or something like that.

If you want to "confront" the principal, I would do it in writing via email or certified letter and advise that you were doing nothing other than exercising your 1st amendment rights to discuss issues of public concern and to associate with other parents and that the email addresses are not school property.

Advise that you will continue to do so and are prepared to seek legal counsel if any further attempt is made to curtail your rights.

However - as I said - some principals are vindictive and could marshal parents/community against you in some way. I have seen it happen. Not telling you to back down at all - just be aware and smart.
mopar28m
John 3:16

User ID: 14265444
United States
12/05/2012 01:14 PM

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Re: Principal at School Says I Cannot Email Other Parents About Class Related Things!
better be careful. nowadays they call CPS and take the child away since you are questioning the system.
you must be a bad parent for wanting to know how they are brainwashing your child.
 Quoting: Alufiend 28365032


I not only question the system, I challenge it big time.

The teachers, the principal & the school board know me by name.

You wouldn't believe how many alternative assignments my kids got in class when the project they were doing went against our personal beliefs or I felt they were way beyond what was expected of my kids at whatever age they were at the time.

We helped out kids with their school projects, I don't care what the teacher said.
 Quoting: mopar28m


Thank you for your response. You and I sound like we've been through some of the same situations. I just felt as though the teacher should be assigning things that the kids can complete on their own so they can build some confidence. I couldn't believe that they've pushed cultural heritage two years in a row at this school now. It doesn't accomplish anything at this age except programming.

A child at the age of 7-8 typically has next to zero interest in cultural heritage. Why not have them do something like make a volcano with baking soda and vinegar. That way the parents could oversee and help a bit, but the child would get the satisfaction of building most of it and of course the chemical reaction culminating in the "eruption".
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 22950961


Exactly!!!! One of my college profs today said that if you don't have interest in what you are doing, then you aren't going to do well on it.

Go talk to the Superintendent of the school system & if he/she won't listen to you. Then if you have time, go to the school board.

Children of that age can't be expected to put something together like that. Middle school- maybe, high school-definitely.
vaccinefreehealth.spam

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Racin​g to end vaccinations.
Spine monkey

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12/05/2012 01:15 PM
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Re: Principal at School Says I Cannot Email Other Parents About Class Related Things!
be as wise as serpents and as gentle as doves
Laura Bow

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12/05/2012 01:15 PM
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Re: Principal at School Says I Cannot Email Other Parents About Class Related Things!
Long story short, the elementary school where my child attends decided that because I used the parent email list to contact other parents and ask their opinion of goings on in class, I am directing malice towards the teacher. I have tried talking with this teacher about anything that's bothered me about her lessons or lack thereof... and I did it as nicely as possible. All I got in return were responses that dodged all my questions.

I can't argue about my opinion of the teacher, but I did in no way, say anything bad about this teacher. This teacher has dumbed down the level difficulty that 2nd grade should be. All the kids have done so far is review from 1st grade and earlier. Then, all of a sudden the teacher assigned a cultural heritage project and proclaimed that the kids should be able to research it, present it etc with no help from their parents. Absolutely impossible expectations since the kids haven't learned anything beyond a 1st grade level so far this year.

I simply asked other parents if they thought that the most recent project the teacher had assigned was too hard for the children.

So, my question is this: Does this principal have any right to tell me I cannot contact other parents via email to discuss class matters?
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 22950961


I cannot see how they can do anything about this, especially since they were the ones distributing the parent contact list in the first place. What is this cultural heritage project exactly?
Anonymous Coward
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12/05/2012 01:16 PM
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Re: Principal at School Says I Cannot Email Other Parents About Class Related Things!
Do it anyway, OP and double your efforts!! Hell, give me the address list, I'll help.

Fuck em.
Anonymous Coward (OP)
User ID: 22950961
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12/05/2012 01:17 PM
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Re: Principal at School Says I Cannot Email Other Parents About Class Related Things!
No, you are allowed to use the email addresses. The school does not own those in any way. If the parents object to your emails then you should stop. I was trying to see if it was somehow a listserv that the school set up or something like that.

If you want to "confront" the principal, I would do it in writing via email or certified letter and advise that you were doing nothing other than exercising your 1st amendment rights to discuss issues of public concern and to associate with other parents and that the email addresses are not school property.

Advise that you will continue to do so and are prepared to seek legal counsel if any further attempt is made to curtail your rights.

However - as I said - some principals are vindictive and could marshal parents/community against you in some way. I have seen it happen. Not telling you to back down at all - just be aware and smart.


Thank you very much for your thoughts. It's just been strange noticing how many things seem problematic in the education system. I thought that they would be getting better all the time. It really seems like they're getting much worse. It would be interesting to compare the education system generationally and see the decline or why it has declined in some ways.

Most of the parents didn't reply to my email. All I did was ask them if they thought the project was too hard for their children to complete on their own. I didn't even mention the teacher except for the fact that my child is in that class. My email was only two sentences long. One sentence asking the question and the next thanking parents for their time in answering.
Anonymous Coward
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12/05/2012 01:17 PM
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Re: Principal at School Says I Cannot Email Other Parents About Class Related Things!
This is a psyche warfare tactic. By controlling the school's communication patterns with each parent they are able to manipulate all that each parent sees, hears, and feels. Ergo they are able to teach the kids...well, whatever they want.
Anonymous Coward
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12/05/2012 01:20 PM
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Re: Principal at School Says I Cannot Email Other Parents About Class Related Things!
No, you are allowed to use the email addresses. The school does not own those in any way. If the parents object to your emails then you should stop. I was trying to see if it was somehow a listserv that the school set up or something like that.

If you want to "confront" the principal, I would do it in writing via email or certified letter and advise that you were doing nothing other than exercising your 1st amendment rights to discuss issues of public concern and to associate with other parents and that the email addresses are not school property.

Advise that you will continue to do so and are prepared to seek legal counsel if any further attempt is made to curtail your rights.

However - as I said - some principals are vindictive and could marshal parents/community against you in some way. I have seen it happen. Not telling you to back down at all - just be aware and smart.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 22950961


Thank you very much for your thoughts. It's just been strange noticing how many things seem problematic in the education system. I thought that they would be getting better all the time. It really seems like they're getting much worse. It would be interesting to compare the education system generationally and see the decline or why it has declined in some ways.

Most of the parents didn't reply to my email. All I did was ask them if they thought the project was too hard for their children to complete on their own. I didn't even mention the teacher except for the fact that my child is in that class. My email was only two sentences long. One sentence asking the question and the next thanking parents for their time in answering.


After they said something to you about it. I would continue entirely out of spite to anger them as much as possible, and I would let them KNOW that I'm doing it too.

Sick of this bully bullshit.

resist
Anonymous Coward
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12/05/2012 01:21 PM
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Re: Principal at School Says I Cannot Email Other Parents About Class Related Things!
better be careful. nowadays they call CPS and take the child away since you are questioning the system.
you must be a bad parent for wanting to know how they are brainwashing your child.
 Quoting: Alufiend 28365032


That's a scary thought...
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 22950961


Challenge them in court! Don't let them push you around!!
Anonymous Coward (OP)
User ID: 22950961
United States
12/05/2012 01:21 PM
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Re: Principal at School Says I Cannot Email Other Parents About Class Related Things!


Thank you for your response. You and I sound like we've been through some of the same situations. I just felt as though the teacher should be assigning things that the kids can complete on their own so they can build some confidence. I couldn't believe that they've pushed cultural heritage two years in a row at this school now. It doesn't accomplish anything at this age except programming.

A child at the age of 7-8 typically has next to zero interest in cultural heritage. Why not have them do something like make a volcano with baking soda and vinegar. That way the parents could oversee and help a bit, but the child would get the satisfaction of building most of it and of course the chemical reaction culminating in the "eruption".


Exactly!!!! One of my college profs today said that if you don't have interest in what you are doing, then you aren't going to do well on it.

Go talk to the Superintendent of the school system & if he/she won't listen to you. Then if you have time, go to the school board.

Children of that age can't be expected to put something together like that. Middle school- maybe, high school-definitely.


The thing is, when I voiced my concerns to the teacher/administration I received no help. They dodged my logical concerns. When I emailed the parents, the teacher changed their tune and said all of a sudden that parents should help their children with the project, which in previous emails the teacher said that the children should be able to do this on their own with no parental help. It's really all kind of sad

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