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"100 Reasons Why Evolution Is STUPID!"

 
andreidita

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12/09/2012 01:15 PM
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Re: "100 Reasons Why Evolution Is STUPID!"
reality is a combination of two opposing forces.

one which is inertial, involutionary, static, past oriented.
another which is creative, evolutionary, dynamic, future oriented.

the interplay of these to forces can be observed at any level of reality being it physical, social, metaphysical, mental or else

and even this dual understanding tells more about our subjective understanding of reality, than about reality itelf

Last Edited by andreidita on 12/09/2012 01:17 PM
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Re: "100 Reasons Why Evolution Is STUPID!"
i always asked the supporters of classic evolutionary theory,

if evolution is made through natural selection of random mutations which are fit to certain medium changes, where are the strange creatures which are the result of random mutations which were not so fit.
if it's so easy for a fish to randomly mutate into a bird such that to survive the change from water medium to earth medium, how come we don't get also very strange creatures?
 Quoting: andreidita


"Very strange" is subjective and has to do with perception. You don't get out much do you. Very strange creatures are everywhere.
Any sufficiently advanced technology is indistinguishable from magic. ~Arthur C. Clarke

Don't go around saying the world owes you a living. The world owes you nothing. It was here first. ~Mark Twain

He's a nut-bag! Just because the fucker's got a library card doesn't make him Yoda! ~David Mills ~ Se7en

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andreidita

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12/09/2012 01:23 PM
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Re: "100 Reasons Why Evolution Is STUPID!"
"Very strange" is subjective and has to do with perception. You don't get out much do you. Very strange creatures are everywhere.
 Quoting: Chip


hehe, i get out quite a lot. and the 'strangeness' you talk about becomes just simple, boring and predictable after you add understanding to perception :)

i was talking about the inexistence of abominations at the level of natural species. if random mutation is really random than we would get quite a lot of species unfit in the long run, but fit enough to survive for at least a few generations. and we don't have that

Last Edited by andreidita on 12/09/2012 01:27 PM
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Re: "100 Reasons Why Evolution Is STUPID!"
"Very strange" is subjective and has to do with perception. You don't get out much do you. Very strange creatures are everywhere.
 Quoting: Chip


hehe, i get out quite a lot. and the 'strangeness' you talk about becomes just simple, boring and predictable after you add understanding to perception :)

i was talking about the inexistence of abominations at the level of natural species. if random mutation is really random than we would get quite a lot of species unfit in the long run, but fit enough to survive for at least a few generations. and we don't have that
 Quoting: andreidita


Sure we do. As I said...it's a matter of perception. There are creatures in the deep ocean we haven't discovered as of yet and some of the ones we have are down right frightening.
Any sufficiently advanced technology is indistinguishable from magic. ~Arthur C. Clarke

Don't go around saying the world owes you a living. The world owes you nothing. It was here first. ~Mark Twain

He's a nut-bag! Just because the fucker's got a library card doesn't make him Yoda! ~David Mills ~ Se7en

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Anonymous Coward (OP)
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12/09/2012 04:53 PM
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Re: "100 Reasons Why Evolution Is STUPID!"
bump
Parabola

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12/09/2012 05:18 PM

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Re: "100 Reasons Why Evolution Is STUPID!"
Firstly, Id like to apologize for the sarcasm in my last message. I wasn't sure if you were trolling or not, but now I see that you are being sincere. We clearly have very different beliefs about this topic. I'm ok with that.

These sources are biased and uncredible. Ever hear of the peer-review process? So many of the claims you made are illogical and/or based on misinformation.
 Quoting: Parabola


Uncredible because you say so? Nope. Try again.

Yes they are biased against superstitious evolution religions which have been fully exposed as equivocation and pseudoscience. As your next comment shows, Evos will retreat to the definition of evolution as simply "change over time" when they are challenged for evidence.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 23223519


Uncredible because I accept the scientific method. It's ok if you don't. We can agree to disagree.

I don't think "Evos" retreat behind this definition. It is the definition we accept in light of the evidence we've integrated. I am not challenged for evidence, I have just come to a different conclusion than you. And I'm honestly not sure what you mean by the term "superstitious evolution religions'. And I'm not sure what religion has to do with an evolutionary debate, but since you brought it there, my 'religion' (i.e. my comfort system) is an appreciation for all that remains unknown.

For example:
"Random Mutations never produce anything novel". This is simply untrue. Do you understand the concept of genetic coding, transcription and translation? Do you know what an allele is? If mutations never produce anything novel, how do we have diversity within a population? Please explain allelic variability.
 Quoting: Parabola


Wow, you are using allele frequency as evidence for evolution? Love the equivocation. Why not just use the fact that animals reproduce as evidence for evolution? What a joke. It's no wonder you believe in it.

And Nope, genetic variation does not produce any novel functional complexity such as a new protein. Prove me wrong, show me an example and I will pick it apart with simple logic. Otherwise you're just yammering and equivocating.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 23223519


Mutations are causal mechanisms of allellic variability. If you understand translation and transcription (no I am not spewing terms, an understanding of these mechanisms is essential for informed evolutionary discussions), you would understand how allelic variability results in protein diversity. Its really quite a beautiful phenomenon.

There are lots of examples I could provide, but I think the difference between our perspectives lies in our different definitions of logic, and I honestly dont feel like exploring this with you since you reply so defensively.

"Every major biological structure appears suddenly". Incorrect again (and the statement doesn't make much sense either). Research cladograms, homoplasies, synapomorphies. We can document transistional changes at the genetic, molecular, cellular, system, organismal, and population levels.
 Quoting: Parabola


Do you think spewing terms is making an argument? Cladograms, synapomorphies, and phylogentics are techniques of grouping organisms with similar genetic or morphological function. They say nothing of how those functions, or body plans, first came into being. All homoplasy shows is the same function appearing separately in independent lineages.

Show me fossil evidence of the gradual formation of a single body plan. I need a good laugh.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 23223519


Why do you keep comming back to the fossils? First, as many here have pointed out there are a lot of transistional fossils. Second, the fossil record is only one way of documenting the gradual changes. And if you had actually considered my response, instead of reacting defensively to it, you would have made the connections.
"Experimental evidence shows the evolutionary mechanism of Random Mutation + Natural Selection to be a total failure." Eh? A failure at what? And what is the source of this opinion? (peer-reviewed please)
 Quoting: Parabola


Entirely based on a peer-review. There is not one paper that empirically demonstrates fuctional novel protein function arising from RM-NS.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 23223519


Correct, there are thousands.

Since you are arguing in the affirmative, provide the paper.

There is a list of peer-reviewed papers detailing the limits on evolutionary mechanisms. Here are 50 of them:
[link to www.discovery.org]

There is even work being done on Natural Genetic Engineering to compensate for the obvious shortcomings of RM-NS.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 23223519


You believe in intelligent design, cool. I believe that evolution occurs. Perform a google scholar search on any of these terms and you will find evidence counter to your arguments. Take it or leave it.

"It is utter foolishness to compare observable phenomena to a historical claim of animals mutating into other animals over millions of years of culled genetic accidents." Statements like these reveal that you do not properly understand the concepts that you are attempting to argue.

There is plenty of evidence. You are just choosing to ignore it, and instead are weaving fictious stories for yourself. Have fun with that!
 Quoting: Parabola


Nope. No evidence. I challenge you to produce it.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 23223519


I, and countless others have provided rigorous empirical evidence. What you do with it is your choice.

Last Edited by Parabola on 12/09/2012 05:34 PM
Vinyard

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12/09/2012 05:29 PM
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Re: "100 Reasons Why Evolution Is STUPID!"
Kent Hovind is a criminal asshole.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 29334060


Typical shills to attack people like that. His imprisonment has nothing to do with his seminars. LISTEN to what he says instead of sticking your head in the sand with your pre-conceived notions.

I've seen the video before by the way, along with every seminar and a few college courses. I agree with Hovind on most points but to be honest he's inaccurate in some cases. His seminars are like 6 - 8 years old or something so it's understandable. I love his debates with evolutionists. Hovind crush them all!
I also purchased a lot of interesting books from his website DrDino.com. They're great and interesting!

Last Edited by Marlo Stanfield on 12/09/2012 05:32 PM
Anonymous Coward
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12/09/2012 05:43 PM
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Re: "100 Reasons Why Evolution Is STUPID!"
Explain the constant mutations of viruses and their ability to adapt.

Have that on my desk by sun down...thanks.
 Quoting: Chip




What does that have to do with monkeys turning into humans?
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 17492600


pick
-
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12/09/2012 06:02 PM
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Re: "100 Reasons Why Evolution Is STUPID!"
Explain the constant mutations of viruses and their ability to adapt.

Have that on my desk by sun down...thanks.
 Quoting: Chip




What does that have to do with monkeys turning into humans?
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 17492600


pick
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 1473574



It is still a virus and always will be. Same with the dog, horse, frog, bear, ect ect.

Virus mutations are not evolution

[link to creation.com]
Chris12138

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12/09/2012 06:13 PM

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Re: "100 Reasons Why Evolution Is STUPID!"
The guy actually makes MANY valid points. Only about 30min in though.


PIN THIS SHIT!

smile_kiss
Chris12138

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12/09/2012 06:39 PM

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Re: "100 Reasons Why Evolution Is STUPID!"
42:00 in. Still very interesting.

bump
Chris12138

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12/09/2012 07:03 PM

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Re: "100 Reasons Why Evolution Is STUPID!"
1 hr in. Still pretty compelling.


Double bump!

bumpbump
Anonymous Coward
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12/09/2012 07:28 PM
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Re: "100 Reasons Why Evolution Is STUPID!"
Explain the constant mutations of viruses and their ability to adapt.

Have that on my desk by sun down...thanks.
 Quoting: Chip


ok, explain it smart ass? How DO they mutate and adapt?

You have just replaced the word 'god' in your vocabulary with the word 'evolution', evolution being a euphemism for your atheism.

God doesn't mutate viruses, 'no god' does.

we will just call your god, nogod.
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Re: "100 Reasons Why Evolution Is STUPID!"
Explain the constant mutations of viruses and their ability to adapt.

Have that on my desk by sun down...thanks.
 Quoting: Chip


ok, explain it smart ass? How DO they mutate and adapt?

You have just replaced the word 'god' in your vocabulary with the word 'evolution', evolution being a euphemism for your atheism.

God doesn't mutate viruses, 'no god' does.

we will just call your god, nogod.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 1109901


I am FAR from atheist. If you read the actual words written in Genesis they follow the same road map offered in the process of "evolution". Also for further information read the thread. I gave my perspective and made it legible enough for the intellectually impaired folks just like yourself.
Any sufficiently advanced technology is indistinguishable from magic. ~Arthur C. Clarke

Don't go around saying the world owes you a living. The world owes you nothing. It was here first. ~Mark Twain

He's a nut-bag! Just because the fucker's got a library card doesn't make him Yoda! ~David Mills ~ Se7en

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AlcoholicRunner
I abduct humans and drink at the same time.

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12/09/2012 08:59 PM

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Re: "100 Reasons Why Evolution Is STUPID!"
Try this one.

It has more to do with electric than gravity. Golden ratio. and So on.

[link to www.thunderbolts.info]
Anonymous Coward
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12/09/2012 10:22 PM
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Re: "100 Reasons Why Evolution Is STUPID!"
For example:
"Random Mutations never produce anything novel". This is simply untrue. Do you understand the concept of genetic coding, transcription and translation? Do you know what an allele is? If mutations never produce anything novel, how do we have diversity within a population? Please explain allelic variability.
 Quoting: Parabola


Wow, you are using allele frequency as evidence for evolution? Love the equivocation. Why not just use the fact that animals reproduce as evidence for evolution? What a joke. It's no wonder you believe in it.

And Nope, genetic variation does not produce any novel functional complexity such as a new protein. Prove me wrong, show me an example and I will pick it apart with simple logic. Otherwise you're just yammering and equivocating.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 23223519


Mutations are causal mechanisms of allellic variability. If you understand translation and transcription (no I am not spewing terms, an understanding of these mechanisms is essential for informed evolutionary discussions), you would understand how allelic variability results in protein diversity. Its really quite a beautiful phenomenon.
 Quoting: Parabola



I understand transcription and translation just fine, though I'm beginning to doubt that you do. And you have yet to make a point. You're still yammering about variations. Yes, we get it. Mutations happen. Entire Genome Duplication events happen. Lets move on.

Show me an example of random mutations producing genes for a single novel protein.


There are lots of examples I could provide, but I think the difference between our perspectives lies in our different definitions of logic, and I honestly dont feel like exploring this with you since you reply so defensively.
 Quoting: Parabola


No, our difference lies in the fact that I'm right and you're wrong. Otherwise you'd provide an example.

Maybe you should be reconsidering the superstitious idea of a culled genetic accident's power to build and fill every ecological niche on earth with the most brilliantly designed structures imaginable.

Or stick with your religion, whatever..
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Re: "100 Reasons Why Evolution Is STUPID!"
Adaptation, Mutation, of course..
but Evolution, no.
 Quoting: RDprofessor


What's the difference?
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 22089462


Can you please honestly think about this.

The fact that genetic variation exists, is not evidence that genetic variation can build complex body plans.

It is amazing that people will so flippantly suggest one proves the other.

It's like saying "well, sand collects on beaches, so doesn't it follow that the sand can form itself into castles and mansions and literature on the beach?"

Is this really how most Evo's think?



And observed adaptations, such as Cecal Valves in Lizards, are typically produced by phenotypic plasticity, or an organism's ability to change based on direct fixed responses to environmental conditions. NOT random mutations.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 23223519


Your limited intellect has reached it's full potential. Next time through press the panoramic view of life.
 Quoting: Chip


An Evo with nothing to say, what a shock.
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Re: "100 Reasons Why Evolution Is STUPID!"
...


What's the difference?
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 22089462


Can you please honestly think about this.

The fact that genetic variation exists, is not evidence that genetic variation can build complex body plans.

It is amazing that people will so flippantly suggest one proves the other.

It's like saying "well, sand collects on beaches, so doesn't it follow that the sand can form itself into castles and mansions and literature on the beach?"

Is this really how most Evo's think?



And observed adaptations, such as Cecal Valves in Lizards, are typically produced by phenotypic plasticity, or an organism's ability to change based on direct fixed responses to environmental conditions. NOT random mutations.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 23223519


Your limited intellect has reached it's full potential. Next time through press the panoramic view of life.
 Quoting: Chip


An Evo with nothing to say, what a shock.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 23223519


A stupid fuck who sucks his pastors cock...what a shock.
Any sufficiently advanced technology is indistinguishable from magic. ~Arthur C. Clarke

Don't go around saying the world owes you a living. The world owes you nothing. It was here first. ~Mark Twain

He's a nut-bag! Just because the fucker's got a library card doesn't make him Yoda! ~David Mills ~ Se7en

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CatBTX

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12/09/2012 10:27 PM

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Re: "100 Reasons Why Evolution Is STUPID!"
Explain the constant mutations of viruses and their ability to adapt.

Have that on my desk by sun down...thanks.
 Quoting: Chip


Mutation is not evolution.
Sorta like Cancer is not evolution.

Adaptation is not evolution...
Sorta like my putting on a winter coat does not make me a higher evolved human.

And I am not trolling you... I am actually a closet fan of your replies (most of the time)...

But this instance is the exception.
 Quoting: El Tiburon


Different words do not make the process any different. Evolution is adaptation.
 Quoting: Chip


Evolution, adaptation and mutation are not the answers.

Now, manipulation is an entirely different story and is far more plausible.
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Re: "100 Reasons Why Evolution Is STUPID!"
Explain the constant mutations of viruses and their ability to adapt.

Have that on my desk by sun down...thanks.
 Quoting: Chip


Mutation is not evolution.
Sorta like Cancer is not evolution.

Adaptation is not evolution...
Sorta like my putting on a winter coat does not make me a higher evolved human.

And I am not trolling you... I am actually a closet fan of your replies (most of the time)...

But this instance is the exception.
 Quoting: El Tiburon


Different words do not make the process any different. Evolution is adaptation.
 Quoting: Chip


Evolution, adaptation and mutation are not the answers.

Now, manipulation is an entirely different story and is far more plausible.
 Quoting: CatBTX


Yes, it is something that according to ancient manuscripts actually occurred.
Any sufficiently advanced technology is indistinguishable from magic. ~Arthur C. Clarke

Don't go around saying the world owes you a living. The world owes you nothing. It was here first. ~Mark Twain

He's a nut-bag! Just because the fucker's got a library card doesn't make him Yoda! ~David Mills ~ Se7en

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Parabola

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12/09/2012 10:56 PM

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Re: "100 Reasons Why Evolution Is STUPID!"
I understand transcription and translation just fine, though I'm beginning to doubt that you do. And you have yet to make a point. You're still yammering about variations. Yes, we get it. Mutations happen. Entire Genome Duplication events happen. Lets move on.

Show me an example of random mutations producing genes for a single novel protein.

No, our difference lies in the fact that I'm right and you're wrong. Otherwise you'd provide an example.

Maybe you should be reconsidering the superstitious idea of a culled genetic accident's power to build and fill every ecological niche on earth with the most brilliantly designed structures imaginable.

Or stick with your religion, whatever..
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 23223519


There's that defensive 'logic' again coupled with evident oversimplifications and misunderstandings (bolded pts). And as I said before, I'm not interested in having this discussion with you. Peace!
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12/10/2012 10:30 AM
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Re: "100 Reasons Why Evolution Is STUPID!"
I understand transcription and translation just fine, though I'm beginning to doubt that you do. And you have yet to make a point. You're still yammering about variations. Yes, we get it. Mutations happen. Entire Genome Duplication events happen. Lets move on.

Show me an example of random mutations producing genes for a single novel protein.

No, our difference lies in the fact that I'm right and you're wrong. Otherwise you'd provide an example.

Maybe you should be reconsidering the superstitious idea of a culled genetic accident's power to build and fill every ecological niche on earth with the most brilliantly designed structures imaginable.

Or stick with your religion, whatever..
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 23223519


There's that defensive 'logic' again coupled with evident oversimplifications and misunderstandings (bolded pts). And as I said before, I'm not interested in having this discussion with you. Peace!
 Quoting: Parabola


Nonsense. You come in here like most other arrogant Evos, telling skeptics that they just don't understand Evolution because they're ignorant.

I call you on your BS, and you run away, because you can not refute my arguments.
AllGunsBlazing

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Re: "100 Reasons Why Evolution Is STUPID!"
i always asked the supporters of classic evolutionary theory,

if evolution is made through natural selection of random mutations which are fit to certain medium changes, where are the strange creatures which are the result of random mutations which were not so fit.
if it's so easy for a fish to randomly mutate into a bird such that to survive the change from water medium to earth medium, how come we don't get also very strange creatures?
 Quoting: andreidita




No one ever claimed a fish randomly turned into a bird anyway.

And if you want to see any genetic mutations that result in changes that are not so fit...just look at Downs Syndrome or any type of birth defect. Or animals being born with an extra head or leg.
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Re: "100 Reasons Why Evolution Is STUPID!"
i always asked the supporters of classic evolutionary theory,

if evolution is made through natural selection of random mutations which are fit to certain medium changes, where are the strange creatures which are the result of random mutations which were not so fit.
if it's so easy for a fish to randomly mutate into a bird such that to survive the change from water medium to earth medium, how come we don't get also very strange creatures?
 Quoting: andreidita


It's a good question. But don't expect to ever get a good answer.

Think about it, for every beneficial mutation becoming fixated in the population and progressing towards a new body plan, you had the rest of that population diverging into another evolutionary direction.

Where are all the fossils of dead-end designs that didn't work out? How about a failed reproductive system that started out good but led to major detriments?

There is nothing like that. All we find are the same perfect designs. Extinctions always being due to some catastrophic event. Random Mutation and SuperNatural Selection somehow knew the right avenues to take every time.
andreidita

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Re: "100 Reasons Why Evolution Is STUPID!"
i always asked the supporters of classic evolutionary theory,

if evolution is made through natural selection of random mutations which are fit to certain medium changes, where are the strange creatures which are the result of random mutations which were not so fit.
if it's so easy for a fish to randomly mutate into a bird such that to survive the change from water medium to earth medium, how come we don't get also very strange creatures?
 Quoting: andreidita


It's a good question. But don't expect to ever get a good answer.

Think about it, for every beneficial mutation becoming fixated in the population and progressing towards a new body plan, you had the rest of that population diverging into another evolutionary direction.

Where are all the fossils of dead-end designs that didn't work out? How about a failed reproductive system that started out good but led to major detriments?

There is nothing like that. All we find are the same perfect designs. Extinctions always being due to some catastrophic event. Random Mutation and SuperNatural Selection somehow knew the right avenues to take every time.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 23223519


yep this was precisely the point :) where are all those fossils of dead end designs?
you know what is funny? i started from 10 years old with chemistry, trying to understand how the universe works, and i invested almost 20 years in perfecting the rational mind.

and it is so funny/sad to see people parading as rational and just parroting 'truths' obtained via authority figures and blindly accepted.

if they were capable of using simple logic without being emotionally attached to 'truths' they already believe (in a religious/dogmatic way),

they would see for example the implication of the concept of random mutations, and with basic math they would see that out of 1 billion possibilities of functional body mutations only very few would be fit in the way all our evolutionary organisms are fit.

and this leads to practically zero probability of stumbling in a random way exactly upon those changes.

and the only logical conclusion is that the evolutionary process is teleologic, it has a purpose, it is driven.
the human being is a mirror of how the universe works, we are a combination of purposes that aspire us towards the future and of inertia/needs that keep us in the past.
Anonymous Coward
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12/10/2012 06:17 PM
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Re: "100 Reasons Why Evolution Is STUPID!"
1 hr in. Still pretty compelling.


Double bump!

bumpbump
 Quoting: Chris12138


I don't want to burst your bubble, but most of the things he has stated have been either:
A. Proven to be false
B. Was already known to be false
c: half-truths
Anonymous Coward
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Re: "100 Reasons Why Evolution Is STUPID!"
Explain the constant mutations of viruses and their ability to adapt.

Have that on my desk by sun down...thanks.
 Quoting: Chip


Mutation is not evolution.
Sorta like Cancer is not evolution.

Adaptation is not evolution...
Sorta like my putting on a winter coat does not make me a higher evolved human.

And I am not trolling you... I am actually a closet fan of your replies (most of the time)...

But this instance is the exception.
 Quoting: El Tiburon


Different words do not make the process any different. Evolution is adaptation.
 Quoting: Chip


Evolution, adaptation and mutation are not the answers.

Now, manipulation is an entirely different story and is far more plausible.
 Quoting: CatBTX

How so?
Spittin'Cesium

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12/10/2012 06:20 PM

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Re: "100 Reasons Why Evolution Is STUPID!"
I have 100 reasons why Stupid is Evolution.
The thing that hath been,
is That which shall be;
and that which is done is that which shall be done:and there is no new thing under the Sun.
Ecclesiastes 9:1
nomuse (not logged in)
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Re: "100 Reasons Why Evolution Is STUPID!"
Let me know when they find remains of giraffe's with necks that show gradual change. Where are the remains of all these animals evolving? That's because they didn't. They all "appeared" at the same time according to fossil records and the earth's layers.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 17492600


But...that's exactly what IS seen!

Let me know if you actually intend to come back to the thread, and I'll dig up names and representative fossils of that progression.

Actually, you really need to look no further than the Okapi, which is an almost unchanged relic of a Miocene ancestor.
nomuse (not logged in)
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Re: "100 Reasons Why Evolution Is STUPID!"
Nonsense. Gravity is testable, measurable, and repeatable. It is utter foolishness to compare observable phenomena to a historical claim of animals mutating into other animals over millions of years of culled genetic accidents.

 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 23223519


Nope. It is easy to propose alternates to universal gravitation. For instance; Intelligent Falling. Let us propose that googillians of invisible tiny angels are at work racing to every individual object on Earth, and dragging it downwards with all the power of their tiny undetectable wings.

Prove that isn't so. You can't.

Less facetiously, we don't entirely understand gravity. The current theory revolves around the Higgs Field, but the Higgs itself is only a couple sigmas in to being reliably detected. There is PLENTY of margin for error in our current understanding of the nature of mass and gravitational attraction.

There is also margin of error in every other scientific field. We may be wrong about the photometric effect, we may be wrong about the nature of pressure in a gas. What we have, in all cases, is a statistical likelihood. And evolutionary biology is no different.

Perhaps the idea of common descent is a little less demonstrated and a little less tested than the wave/particle nature of light. But even if you were to argue that, it is a far, far, far, far, far way from that to stating that we are blindly guessing about the former.



The fossil record shows consistent gaps between major body plans. Every major biological structure appears suddenly, from insects to feathers to feet to vertabrates to reproduction, circulatory, nervous systems, to eyeballs, brains, etc. etc. everything.

 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 23223519


There are major gaps in your reading.

There are elements of development we are less sure about. They are not grouped in any consistent way. They don't cluster in some convenient point of development or at some convenient era.

And most of your examples are wrong. We've charted the formation of the mammal foot all the way from the first limb buds. We've charted the formation of the notochord and the first spine. We've charted the evolution of the mammalian heart. I just last month read yet another paper on the evolution of the feather.

It sounds very much like the last thing you read was somewhere around the Second Edition of "On The Origins of Species." I trust you will believe me that evolutionary biologists, paleontologists, and so forth have been gainfully employed in the century since!


Molecular phylogeny splits identical morphology into independent lineages, forcing evolutionists to dream up baseless, unsubstantiated models like 'convergent evolution', stating the exact same creatures must have evolved over and over again. There is no consistency between protein mapping to form anything close to a uniform tree.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 23223519


Err, no.

The phytogenetic tree is identical to every other cladistic, from paleontological to mutation frequencies in non-coding parts of the gene.

There is no animal of higher organization than a single-cell for which a shrug of "must be convergent evolution" is used to excuse physiological replication.

Let's just take fliers as a large-scale convergency. There are some five different groups of flying animals either alive today or well-represented in the fossil record. Each is unique. The closest you will get between, say, bat and bird is a certain superficial similarity. The actual structures are physiologically distinct and show origin along different paths.

Same for eyes, of which there are multiple examples each of which is in fact unique to its line of descent.

If you have a specific counter-example, I'd be entertained to hear it.



Experimental evidence shows the evolutionary mechanism of Random Mutation + Natural Selection to be a total failure.

50,000+ generations of E.Coli produce nothing novel. We never observe a single novel protein evolve.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 23223519


I'm sorry, but that is a clear falsehood. That is exactly what we observe. Speciation events have been observed in the laboratory. Major changes of diet and form have been observed in the laboratory. Populations are constantly changing, enough that we've been able to construct fairly accurate clocks.




Other major changes in organisms such as Italian Wall Lizards forming cecal valves and other altered structures turn out to be a fixed response to the environment, a phenomena termed Phenotypic Plasticity. You move the lizards out, and the cecal valves recede on que. Nothing random about it at all. It is built into the organism.

Same with the Nylonase(modified Esterase) enzyme. Wild-type bacteria is shown to adapt to produce Nylonase in only 9 days, consistently. It is a fixed adaptation to the environment.

Random Mutations never produce anything novel, and Natural Selection doesn't have any material with which to create.

The foundational mechanism of Evolution is an empty vapor. It's not happening.


Evolution is little more than a Public Relations industry and a religion of supernatural materialism.


 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 23223519


Now this is interesting. After showing a gross ignorance of current science, you then come up with startlingly specific examples to support your claims.

You obviously didn't find these on your own. The rest of your post demonstrates you probably do not even UNDERSTAND the references you have made.

And, yes, there certainly are simple movements around the built-in plasticity of an organism.

But you have two huge barriers to claiming that in reference to the nylonerase examples. First is that the environment did not include nylon for a good 2 billion years. Even if you use a more ludicrous time-table, I think you would be forced to agree that there was no nylon-6 in the Garden of Eden.

The other, even more interesting, barrier is that THERE IS NO ALLELE FOR THIS IN FLAVOBACTIN. None. Period. It isn't in the intron, it isn't in the extron. No plasmid carries it. No other bacteria is close at hand to borrow it from (bacteria are genetically promiscuous that way). The code for that protein does not exist and to say that it is already in the genetics is a gross mischaracterization; similar to saying that, since my post here uses the 26 letters of the English language same as Shakespeare does, my post already includes Act II, scene 3 of "Hamlet, Prince of Denmark" (first folio edition).

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