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Dr.Astros response to "2012 A-Z" pin!!

 
Sum1Else

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12/18/2012 09:26 PM

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Re: Dr.Astros response to "2012 A-Z" pin!!
Please don't consider this a judgement of any kind, but do you happen to be an atheist Dr. Astro?

Atheism as distinct from pantheism and non-duality, that is.
 Quoting: pi 20063747


WTF? You want that we burn Astro at the stake?
nothing is as it appears
pi
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12/18/2012 09:31 PM
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Re: Dr.Astros response to "2012 A-Z" pin!!
Please don't consider this a judgement of any kind, but do you happen to be an atheist Dr. Astro?

Atheism as distinct from pantheism and non-duality, that is.
 Quoting: pi 20063747


WTF? You want that we burn Astro at the stake?
 Quoting: Sum1Else


Not at all. Most scientists are viewed as atheists by default. I was just curious, that's all. Astronomers and physicists seem more likely to hold belief in a "God".
Anonymous Coward
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12/18/2012 09:45 PM
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Re: Dr.Astros response to "2012 A-Z" pin!!
Astro,
Never underestimate the power of stupid people in large groups.
pi
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12/18/2012 09:53 PM
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Re: Dr.Astros response to "2012 A-Z" pin!!
Astro,
Never underestimate the power of stupid people in large groups.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 9595622


Nahh, it's the ones that could lead the stupid groups that you gotta watch out for...
Albanian (OP)
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12/19/2012 12:40 AM
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bump
Kimpy2
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12/19/2012 12:41 AM
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Re: Dr.Astros response to "2012 A-Z" pin!!
Dr. Astro, if you care to reply, what do you think of that video going around glp titles "2012 A-Z" ? If you watched it?
Quoting: Albanian 12582427


It's crap. Earth does NOT orbit Alcyone. Our sun does NOT orbit Alcyone. Our solar system does NOT orbit Alcyone. Let alone in 25,627 years. Nor do we orbit Sirius.

Let's look at the numbers for Alcyone just to show you how ridiculous this is. Alcyone is of course part of the Pleiades, so let's use the total mass of the Pleiades cluster to see if we're orbiting it. Alcyone has a parallax of about 8.09 milliarcseconds, which corresponds to a distance of about 402 light years.
[link to simbad.u-strasbg.fr]
It also has a proper motion of about 19.34 milliarcseconds in right ascension and -43.67 milliarcseconds in declination per year. Now at a distance of 402 light years, those 43.67 milliarcseconds/year in declination translate to 805,195,033 kilometers per year or about 25.515 km/second. Now the Pleiades cluster has a total mass of about 740 sun masses ( [link to arxiv.org] ), so at a distance of 400 light years, the escape velocity for the entire Pleiades cluster is about 0.227861 km/second (that velocity will not get you around the 2,500 light year circumference of the orbit in 25,627 years either; just look at it, a roughly circular orbit would have to be about a tenth the speed of light!). In other words, even just taking into account our proper motion in declination, to say nothing of our total motion relative to Alcyone including in right ascension and radial velocity, we're traveling over 100 times too fast to be orbiting the Pleiades! We are not orbiting the Pleiades, let alone Alcyone, not even close.

As for Sirius, it has a proper motion of 1.2 arcseconds/year in declination and .546 arcseconds per year in right ascension ( [link to simbad.u-strasbg.fr] ) (15 km/sec and 6.8 km/sec velocity relative to our solar system respectively). Since we're about 8.6 light years from the Sirius system, and since Sirius A and B have a combined mass of nearly 3 times the sun's mass, the escape velocity from the Sirius system at the distance of our sun is about 0.1 km/sec. In other words, our solar system is traveling many times too fast relative to Sirius to be able to orbit it or be in a trinary configuration with it.
 Quoting: Albanian 12582427


yoda Dr. Astro, it's rather you who are full of caca, you gave the wrong declination for Sirius. Plus you prolly don't embrace the Electric Universe. Astro-math alone does not convince me. One must rely heavily on observational evidence as well (like the declination of Sirius NOT CHANGING since the Great Pyramid's construction!) It seems you're a reductionist traveling way too fast to stop and smell the stars.
SNIP
The Sun's Astral Companion
A Model for the Sun-Sirius System
[link to www.viewzone.com]
By William Brown
A Companion to our Sun?

The vast majority of observable stars are binary or multiple star systems. In these systems, two or more stars share a common focus of revolution and are gravitationally bound to each other in defined orbits. This is such a common observation such that the gravitational interaction of multiple stars appears to be the "normal" mode of stellar system formation.
This is logical because stars are formed in nebulae that are "stellar nurseries" [right] where great conglomerates of light elements formed during the Big Bang while heavy elements were synthesized in the heart of giant, primordial stars, and were ejected upon their disruption. Special note should be made of the many complex organic compounds permeating such nebulae [1,2], because of the implications for cosmic biogenesis and panspermia -- theories which hold that life has an extrasolar origenesis.

The Spire [right]. This column of star forming material is 57 trillion miles long.

The close proximity of stars to each other upon formation clearly involves a high probability for gravitational binding, assuming that astral formations aren't directly driven by binary interactions (which could very well be the case). Intellectually this establishes the basis for a dual-star interaction within our Solar System. It is generally presumed that the Sun is a unique exception to this commonly observed phenomenon, however, observational evidence suggests that the Sun is moving in a defined orbit around a companion system of stars.

Evidence is plentiful for the support of a model involving the interaction of multiple stars in our solar system and will be presented in this article. Also, multiple flaws abound in the centuries-old models of heliocentricism that were formed before it was understood that the solar system moves through space.

Dark Star or Nemesis?

Is the idea of a solar companion to our Sun unprecedented? Not at all, in fact there have been numerous scientific publications examining the evidence for a "dark star", literally speaking, to which our Sun could be gravitationally bound in a definite orbit [3]. This alternate dark star is known as Nemesis, and its proposition comes primarily from observed perturbations of orbiting objects such as the planet-sized Kuiper belt object named Sedna [4].

The Pllars of Creation - A Hubble Telescope image of the Eagle Nebula within the constellation Serpens. The light of super-massive stars can be seen shining forth.

Walter Cruttenden of the Binary Star research institute has propounded that a solar companion need not necessarily be of the "dark star" variety. Given the paucity of empirical observations and measurements of the movement of many of the bright stars within our own local galactic sector, it is with some justification that visible stars be examined to see if any may share a common focal point with our own Solar System [5]. At the heart of the poly-solar system theory is a simplification of the mechanics of constellation precession (precession observable) with a more logical model, one that does not rely on a putative wobble of the Earth but instead explains the precession observable with the movement of the Solar System itself.

Precession
In astronomy, axial precession is a gravity-induced, slow and continuous change in the orientation of an astronomical body's rotational axis. In particular, it refers to the gradual shift in the orientation of Earth's axis of rotation, which, like a wobbling top, traces out a pair of cones joined at their apices in a cycle of approximately 26,000 years (called a Great or Platonic Year in astrology).

Earth's precession was historically called precession of the equinoxes because the equinoxes moved westward along the ecliptic relative to the fixed stars, opposite to the motion of the Sun along the ecliptic. This term is still used in non-technical discussions, that is, when detailed mathematics are absent. Historically, Hipparchus is credited with discovering precession of the equinoxes. The exact dates of his life are not known, but astronomical observations attributed to him by Ptolemy date from 147 BC to 127 BC.

The above video explains the Precession of Equinox and introduces some new and old theories.

Who is our Sun's twin?

Is there a candidate for binary revolution among the visible stars? Logically we could begin with the closest star to our own, which is Alpha Centauri. At a distance of 4.37 light years, it is the third brightest star and, as is common, it is itself a binary system.

Another star that shows evidence of being gravitationally bound within the system and is called Alpha Proxima. Alpha Proxima is 0.2 light years from Alpha Centauri AB, about 400 times the distance of Neptune's orbit from the Sun. This shows that a dual or poly star system does not have to necessarily be in close orbital interaction. However Alpha Centauri lies at a declination of -60°, which is well out of the plane of the Solar System, and as such, has a near circumpolar motion in the sky.

A more suitable candidate would be a star closer to the plane of the Solar System, or celestial equator. Sirius meets this criteria, at a declination of -17°. It is also the brightest star in the night sky, three times brighter than Alpha Centauri and twice as bright as the next brightest star Canopus. Sirius is also the 5th closest system of stars to our own [6]. More significant is the fact that The Sirius Research Group has been recording the position of Sirius for approximately 20 years now and has not recorded any measurable alteration in its location relative to the precession [7].

Imagine that you are holding hands with a friend, face to face. If you both began to spin around in a circle, your friend would appear to be stationary, while everything around them would appear to be spinning very rapidly. Your joined hands would be the focal point of the revolving motion. While the surrounding environment would not be spinning around, it would appear to be from you perspective.

This illustrates how the perception of both you and your friend can be very illusionary -- you see yourselves as relatively stationary while the background whirls around you. This is very similar to our situation with respect to observations of celestial motion between the Sun and its solar companions. Our observation of this phenomenon is more complex in that we must also factor in the orbital motion of the Earth and planets around the Sun.

Celestial bodies in our Solar System show harmonic resonance with the Sirius system. Pluto and Sedna are at an incline to the plane of the solar system of roughly 17°, the same as Sirius. Both have orbital periods of 250 years and 12,000 years, which are at 1:5 and 1:2 resonances with Sirius, respectively (12,000 years is roughly one half of the orbit of the Sun around Sirius, hence a 1:2 resonance).

Resonance is a criterion stipulated for any system of orbiting bodies, which is why planets and moons are often times tidally locked with their parent body, and is another reason why the hypothesis of a putative wobble is very unappealing. A wobble is indicative of dynamic instability, not harmonic resonance (think of a spinning top before it falls, it begins to wobble).

A Sirius Candidate

Sirius is a binary system. Sirius A is the highly visible star, but there is a companion known as Sirius B, first described in modern times by the Dogon tribe of Mali (Africa) and subsequently verified by the observational science of astronomers. The Dogon also described a third celestial body with characteristics of a neutron star. While a neutron wouldn't be visible in the same manner as Sirius B, the combined gravitational attraction of a neutron star, a white giant star and a white dwarf would certainly provide the gravitational force needed to keep the Sun bound at a distance of 8.6 light years. In fact, the presence of a neutron star is by no means necessary for the gravitational interaction of the Sun with Sirius.

Historic and mythological descriptions of Sirius provides further insight into the nature of the relationship between the Sun and Sirius. A shaft leading from the Queens chamber of the Great Pyramid of Egypt was -- and still is -- aligned precisely with Sirius. Given the high probability that it was constructed that way, and considering that the pyramids form a star map in and of themselves, it shows how many epochs Sirius has been in a stationary position relative to the movement of the other stars.

When European philosophers first hypothesized that the Earth revolves around the Sun it was a radical and revolutionary idea of that era. Nicholas Copernicus developed the model and scientific explanation by which the Earth revolved around the Sun, and proponents of the model expounded it after its posthumous publication in 1543. The process of overturning the geocentric model of the Solar System, where the stationary Earth was at the center of the Universe, was not an easy venture and came to be known as the Copernican Revolution. Like most ideas that challenge the existing paradigm, it was not well received by most philosophers of the day.
IRQ_1

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12/19/2012 12:53 AM
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Re: Dr.Astros response to "2012 A-Z" pin!!
Please don't consider this a judgement of any kind, but do you happen to be an atheist Dr. Astro?
 Quoting: pi 20063747

No.
 Quoting: Dr. Astro


So how long have you had your own trolls? Just curious.
Jack of all trades, master of none.
We are all the result of our past choices meeting the future.
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CeeLite
>>Haida Gwaii

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12/19/2012 01:20 AM

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Re: Dr.Astros response to "2012 A-Z" pin!!
Dr. Astro, if you care to reply, what do you think of that video going around glp titles "2012 A-Z" ? If you watched it?
Quoting: Albanian 12582427


It's crap. Earth does NOT orbit Alcyone. Our sun does NOT orbit Alcyone. Our solar system does NOT orbit Alcyone. Let alone in 25,627 years. Nor do we orbit Sirius.

Let's look at the numbers for Alcyone just to show you how ridiculous this is. Alcyone is of course part of the Pleiades, so let's use the total mass of the Pleiades cluster to see if we're orbiting it. Alcyone has a parallax of about 8.09 milliarcseconds, which corresponds to a distance of about 402 light years.
[link to simbad.u-strasbg.fr]
It also has a proper motion of about 19.34 milliarcseconds in right ascension and -43.67 milliarcseconds in declination per year. Now at a distance of 402 light years, those 43.67 milliarcseconds/year in declination translate to 805,195,033 kilometers per year or about 25.515 km/second. Now the Pleiades cluster has a total mass of about 740 sun masses ( [link to arxiv.org] ), so at a distance of 400 light years, the escape velocity for the entire Pleiades cluster is about 0.227861 km/second (that velocity will not get you around the 2,500 light year circumference of the orbit in 25,627 years either; just look at it, a roughly circular orbit would have to be about a tenth the speed of light!). In other words, even just taking into account our proper motion in declination, to say nothing of our total motion relative to Alcyone including in right ascension and radial velocity, we're traveling over 100 times too fast to be orbiting the Pleiades! We are not orbiting the Pleiades, let alone Alcyone, not even close.

As for Sirius, it has a proper motion of 1.2 arcseconds/year in declination and .546 arcseconds per year in right ascension ( [link to simbad.u-strasbg.fr] ) (15 km/sec and 6.8 km/sec velocity relative to our solar system respectively). Since we're about 8.6 light years from the Sirius system, and since Sirius A and B have a combined mass of nearly 3 times the sun's mass, the escape velocity from the Sirius system at the distance of our sun is about 0.1 km/sec. In other words, our solar system is traveling many times too fast relative to Sirius to be able to orbit it or be in a trinary configuration with it.
 Quoting: Albanian 12582427


Yeah yeah...and only a few centuries ago the earth was flat and the sun went around it while it stood still and you were burnt at the stake if ya said otherwise.

Its funny how these astronomers STILL think they know everything.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 16361854


I don't claim to know everything. But I do know some things, like this. Eratosthenes showed not only that the earth was round with empirical evidence, but he even calculated its circumference over a thousand years before superstitious idiots burned people at the stake for being "witches" or feared going over the edge of the "flat earth." Those weren't astronomers, those were idiots who thought much like my haters here on GLP. Instead of burning at the stake, they just flame my threads instead. It's all hot air though, the substance of what I say is never actually addressed, just like it wasn't addressed in your post.
 Quoting: Dr. Astro


I was wondering what you had to say about all this, those videos got me worried. Thanks! :)
Pray this thing doesn't hit or sink [link to twitter.com]
[link to twitter.com (secure)]
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Re: Dr.Astros response to "2012 A-Z" pin!!
Dr. Astro, if you care to reply, what do you think of that video going around glp titles "2012 A-Z" ? If you watched it?
Quoting: Albanian 12582427


It's crap. Earth does NOT orbit Alcyone. Our sun does NOT orbit Alcyone. Our solar system does NOT orbit Alcyone. Let alone in 25,627 years. Nor do we orbit Sirius.

Let's look at the numbers for Alcyone just to show you how ridiculous this is. Alcyone is of course part of the Pleiades, so let's use the total mass of the Pleiades cluster to see if we're orbiting it. Alcyone has a parallax of about 8.09 milliarcseconds, which corresponds to a distance of about 402 light years.
[link to simbad.u-strasbg.fr]
It also has a proper motion of about 19.34 milliarcseconds in right ascension and -43.67 milliarcseconds in declination per year. Now at a distance of 402 light years, those 43.67 milliarcseconds/year in declination translate to 805,195,033 kilometers per year or about 25.515 km/second. Now the Pleiades cluster has a total mass of about 740 sun masses ( [link to arxiv.org] ), so at a distance of 400 light years, the escape velocity for the entire Pleiades cluster is about 0.227861 km/second (that velocity will not get you around the 2,500 light year circumference of the orbit in 25,627 years either; just look at it, a roughly circular orbit would have to be about a tenth the speed of light!). In other words, even just taking into account our proper motion in declination, to say nothing of our total motion relative to Alcyone including in right ascension and radial velocity, we're traveling over 100 times too fast to be orbiting the Pleiades! We are not orbiting the Pleiades, let alone Alcyone, not even close.

As for Sirius, it has a proper motion of 1.2 arcseconds/year in declination and .546 arcseconds per year in right ascension ( [link to simbad.u-strasbg.fr] ) (15 km/sec and 6.8 km/sec velocity relative to our solar system respectively). Since we're about 8.6 light years from the Sirius system, and since Sirius A and B have a combined mass of nearly 3 times the sun's mass, the escape velocity from the Sirius system at the distance of our sun is about 0.1 km/sec. In other words, our solar system is traveling many times too fast relative to Sirius to be able to orbit it or be in a trinary configuration with it.
 Quoting: Albanian 12582427


yoda Dr. Astro, it's rather you who are full of caca, you gave the wrong declination for Sirius.
 Quoting: Kimpy2 20290901

Wrong.

Proper motions mas/yr [error ellipse]: -546.01 -1223.07
[link to simbad.u-strasbg.fr]

-1223.07 mas/yr in declination = 1.2 arcseconds per year.

I'm guessing you thought I was giving the coordinates of Sirius. Look up what proper motion is before you accuse me of being full of shit. I know what the hell I'm talking about, you clearly don't, so you're the one who's full of it.

Plus you prolly don't embrace the Electric Universe. Astro-math alone does not convince me.
 Quoting: idiot

Translation, you're a wilfully ignorant idiot who doesn't understand "astro-math" so you refuse to believe it and gladly latch onto any alternative bullshit you can find. Thanks for admitting that you're an irrational moran who openly admits he'll ignore proof.
One must rely heavily on observational evidence as well (like the declination of Sirius NOT CHANGING since the Great Pyramid's construction!)
 Quoting: idiot

Behold, "holy sirius."
holysirius
Yes, Sirius DOES move, it DOES experience proper motion and it DOES precess along with all the other stars. Here are two images of Sirius taken 28 years apart.
siriusmoves
I used the diffraction spikes to place a small black dot at the exact center of Sirius and you can clearly see how it moves in that period of time (it moved less than 1 arcminute, incidentally, still detectable and consistent with its proper motion, but NOT consistent with the claim that it doesn't precess like the other stars). Whoops, there goes the "declination of Sirius not changing since the great pyramid's construction." LOL!

It seems you're a reductionist traveling way too fast to stop and smell the stars.
 Quoting: idiot

It seems you're a fucking idiot who blindly reposts shit that was already debunked by the very post you responded to.

As for Sirius, it has a proper motion of 1.2 arcseconds/year in declination and .546 arcseconds per year in right ascension ( [link to simbad.u-strasbg.fr] ) (15 km/sec and 6.8 km/sec velocity relative to our solar system respectively). Since we're about 8.6 light years from the Sirius system, and since Sirius A and B have a combined mass of nearly 3 times the sun's mass, the escape velocity from the Sirius system at the distance of our sun is about 0.1 km/sec. In other words, our solar system is traveling many times too fast relative to Sirius to be able to orbit it or be in a trinary configuration with it.

Oh right, you don't understand "astro-math" so you just ignore it. By all means, continue to wallow in your ignorance. And by the way, just for good measure, most stars in our galaxy are actually single:
[link to www.cfa.harvard.edu (secure)]

Don't accuse me of being full of shit. I know what I'm talking about.

Last Edited by Dr. Astro on 12/19/2012 01:47 AM
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Re: Dr.Astros response to "2012 A-Z" pin!!
Please don't consider this a judgement of any kind, but do you happen to be an atheist Dr. Astro?
 Quoting: pi 20063747

No.
 Quoting: Dr. Astro


So how long have you had your own trolls? Just curious.
 Quoting: IRQ_1


Quite a while now. Hardly a day goes by without one of them complaining. Yet they never actually address the substance of what I say. They just ignore it, or even post the same stuff that I already debunked as if the information I just gave didn't exist (more like, went in one ear and out the other).
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Re: Dr.Astros response to "2012 A-Z" pin!!
Please don't consider this a judgement of any kind, but do you happen to be an atheist Dr. Astro?
 Quoting: pi 20063747

No.
 Quoting: Dr. Astro


So how long have you had your own trolls? Just curious.
 Quoting: IRQ_1


Quite a while now. Hardly a day goes by without one of them complaining. Yet they never actually address the substance of what I say. They just ignore it, or even post the same stuff that I already debunked as if the information I just gave didn't exist (more like, went in one ear and out the other).
 Quoting: Dr. Astro


Just like their hollow Earth theory, the trolls have a hollow head.

Most of us on here know that you are the real deal and respect your knowledge on such matters.
IRQ_1

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Re: Dr.Astros response to "2012 A-Z" pin!!
Please don't consider this a judgement of any kind, but do you happen to be an atheist Dr. Astro?
 Quoting: pi 20063747

No.
 Quoting: Dr. Astro


So how long have you had your own trolls? Just curious.
 Quoting: IRQ_1


Quite a while now. Hardly a day goes by without one of them complaining. Yet they never actually address the substance of what I say. They just ignore it, or even post the same stuff that I already debunked as if the information I just gave didn't exist (more like, went in one ear and out the other).
 Quoting: Dr. Astro


It was really just pure curiosity. While I don't always agree with your stances on some topics I do appreciate the time and energy you put into your posts. It might sound like a contradiction but I don't think it is.

Merry Christmas and the best to and yours Dr. Astro.
Jack of all trades, master of none.
We are all the result of our past choices meeting the future.
"shall not be infringed."
pi
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Re: Dr.Astros response to "2012 A-Z" pin!!
Please don't consider this a judgement of any kind, but do you happen to be an atheist Dr. Astro?
 Quoting: pi 20063747

No.
 Quoting: Dr. Astro


So how long have you had your own trolls? Just curious.
 Quoting: IRQ_1


Quite a while now. Hardly a day goes by without one of them complaining. Yet they never actually address the substance of what I say. They just ignore it, or even post the same stuff that I already debunked as if the information I just gave didn't exist (more like, went in one ear and out the other).
 Quoting: Dr. Astro


I honestly hope you didn't view that question as some sort of an attack, I asked it because you seem like a man who is honest and analytical and belief in "God" is a fairly novel idea for me. I was only trying to find out more about you, I feel that the question of "God" is a valid one.

I would appreciate your view as to where I showed you disrespect.
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Re: Dr.Astros response to "2012 A-Z" pin!!
Please don't consider this a judgement of any kind, but do you happen to be an atheist Dr. Astro?
 Quoting: pi 20063747

No.
 Quoting: Dr. Astro


So how long have you had your own trolls? Just curious.
 Quoting: IRQ_1


Quite a while now. Hardly a day goes by without one of them complaining. Yet they never actually address the substance of what I say. They just ignore it, or even post the same stuff that I already debunked as if the information I just gave didn't exist (more like, went in one ear and out the other).
 Quoting: Dr. Astro


Wow Astronut, since you "left" GLP, you certainly found some teeth. Glad to see you back! Thanks for giving us what you can. Stay strong!
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...

No.
 Quoting: Dr. Astro


So how long have you had your own trolls? Just curious.
 Quoting: IRQ_1


Quite a while now. Hardly a day goes by without one of them complaining. Yet they never actually address the substance of what I say. They just ignore it, or even post the same stuff that I already debunked as if the information I just gave didn't exist (more like, went in one ear and out the other).
 Quoting: Dr. Astro


I honestly hope you didn't view that question as some sort of an attack, I asked it because you seem like a man who is honest and analytical and belief in "God" is a fairly novel idea for me. I was only trying to find out more about you, I feel that the question of "God" is a valid one.

I would appreciate your view as to where I showed you disrespect.
 Quoting: pi 20063747


I didn't mean my response in reference to you, I apologize. I simply meant to answer the question as it applies in a general sense and I should have specified it as such.
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Re: Dr.Astros response to "2012 A-Z" pin!!
I didn't mean my response in reference to you, I apologize. I simply meant to answer the question as it applies in a general sense and I should have specified it as such.
 Quoting: Dr. Astro


Ah ok then, thank you for the clarification.
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Re: Dr.Astros response to "2012 A-Z" pin!!
Dr. Astro, if you care to reply, what do you think of that video going around glp titles "2012 A-Z" ? If you watched it?
Quoting: Albanian 12582427


It's crap. Earth does NOT orbit Alcyone. Our sun does NOT orbit Alcyone. Our solar system does NOT orbit Alcyone. Let alone in 25,627 years. Nor do we orbit Sirius.

Let's look at the numbers for Alcyone just to show you how ridiculous this is. Alcyone is of course part of the Pleiades, so let's use the total mass of the Pleiades cluster to see if we're orbiting it. Alcyone has a parallax of about 8.09 milliarcseconds, which corresponds to a distance of about 402 light years.
[link to simbad.u-strasbg.fr]
It also has a proper motion of about 19.34 milliarcseconds in right ascension and -43.67 milliarcseconds in declination per year. Now at a distance of 402 light years, those 43.67 milliarcseconds/year in declination translate to 805,195,033 kilometers per year or about 25.515 km/second. Now the Pleiades cluster has a total mass of about 740 sun masses ( [link to arxiv.org] ), so at a distance of 400 light years, the escape velocity for the entire Pleiades cluster is about 0.227861 km/second (that velocity will not get you around the 2,500 light year circumference of the orbit in 25,627 years either; just look at it, a roughly circular orbit would have to be about a tenth the speed of light!). In other words, even just taking into account our proper motion in declination, to say nothing of our total motion relative to Alcyone including in right ascension and radial velocity, we're traveling over 100 times too fast to be orbiting the Pleiades! We are not orbiting the Pleiades, let alone Alcyone, not even close.

As for Sirius, it has a proper motion of 1.2 arcseconds/year in declination and .546 arcseconds per year in right ascension ( [link to simbad.u-strasbg.fr] ) (15 km/sec and 6.8 km/sec velocity relative to our solar system respectively). Since we're about 8.6 light years from the Sirius system, and since Sirius A and B have a combined mass of nearly 3 times the sun's mass, the escape velocity from the Sirius system at the distance of our sun is about 0.1 km/sec. In other words, our solar system is traveling many times too fast relative to Sirius to be able to orbit it or be in a trinary configuration with it.
 Quoting: Albanian 12582427


yoda Dr. Astro, it's rather you who are full of caca, you gave the wrong declination for Sirius.
 Quoting: Kimpy2 20290901

Wrong.

Proper motions mas/yr [error ellipse]: -546.01 -1223.07
[link to simbad.u-strasbg.fr]

-1223.07 mas/yr in declination = 1.2 arcseconds per year.

I'm guessing you thought I was giving the coordinates of Sirius. Look up what proper motion is before you accuse me of being full of shit. I know what the hell I'm talking about, you clearly don't, so you're the one who's full of it.

Plus you prolly don't embrace the Electric Universe. Astro-math alone does not convince me.
 Quoting: idiot

Translation, you're a wilfully ignorant idiot who doesn't understand "astro-math" so you refuse to believe it and gladly latch onto any alternative bullshit you can find. Thanks for admitting that you're an irrational moran who openly admits he'll ignore proof.
One must rely heavily on observational evidence as well (like the declination of Sirius NOT CHANGING since the Great Pyramid's construction!)
 Quoting: idiot

Behold, "holy sirius."
:holysirius:
Yes, Sirius DOES move, it DOES experience proper motion and it DOES precess along with all the other stars. Here are two images of Sirius taken 28 years apart.
:siriusmoves:
I used the diffraction spikes to place a small black dot at the exact center of Sirius and you can clearly see how it moves in that period of time (it moved less than 1 arcminute, incidentally, still detectable and consistent with its proper motion, but NOT consistent with the claim that it doesn't precess like the other stars). Whoops, there goes the "declination of Sirius not changing since the great pyramid's construction." LOL!

It seems you're a reductionist traveling way too fast to stop and smell the stars.
 Quoting: idiot

It seems you're a fucking idiot who blindly reposts shit that was already debunked by the very post you responded to.

As for Sirius, it has a proper motion of 1.2 arcseconds/year in declination and .546 arcseconds per year in right ascension ( [link to simbad.u-strasbg.fr] ) (15 km/sec and 6.8 km/sec velocity relative to our solar system respectively). Since we're about 8.6 light years from the Sirius system, and since Sirius A and B have a combined mass of nearly 3 times the sun's mass, the escape velocity from the Sirius system at the distance of our sun is about 0.1 km/sec. In other words, our solar system is traveling many times too fast relative to Sirius to be able to orbit it or be in a trinary configuration with it.

Oh right, you don't understand "astro-math" so you just ignore it. By all means, continue to wallow in your ignorance. And by the way, just for good measure, most stars in our galaxy are actually single:
[link to www.cfa.harvard.edu (secure)]

Don't accuse me of being full of shit. I know what I'm talking about.
 Quoting: Dr. Astro


yodaHa! Ha!!! You're no scientist! You're an egoist!!! A Dr. Ego who is highly INSECURE ABOUT YOUR SCIENCE or you would not have responded so viciously. You're also no teacher; a true teacher is open to any and all possibilities and a free discussion. You are SHUT DOWN, TOP DOWN, and INTOLERANT OF OPPOSING VIEWS. The ancients knew this planet was in a SIGNIFICANT rotational relationship with Sirius: that is why they CONFIDENTLY BUILT A SHAFT INTO THEIR EPIC, INIMITABLE ARCHITECTURE FROM THE QUEEN'S CHAMBER OF THE GREAT PYRAMID THAT TO THIS DAY HOLDS SIRIUS FIRMLY IN ITS SIGHT!! Debunk that, Dr. Ego.
Now you are implying that Sirius is not a binary system (the article link you sent) when that is well established (and the black-dot motion is precisely from the electromagnetic/ gravitational waltz between Sirius A and Sirius B, but its motion does not change the system's orbital relationship with our Sun. The article is claiming most stars in our galaxy are single but all that means is a revised view: that one star is in front of the other over vast distances (they're NOT in the same ecliptic plane as they used to think binaries were), but they are still binary in their electromagnetic/gravitational/orbital relationships with each other. Just like our Sun (the cathode) is in electromagnetic relationship with the most distant zone of stagnation (the anode) 122 AUs away!!!! V-ger I and V-ger II have just confirmed the magnetic river (your standard model description), which is actually an "electromagnetic river" that connects our solar system at the edge of our Sun's anode zone to the rest of the galaxy and universe, SEAMLESSLY. Sorry, Dr. EGO, but your reductionist isolationist view is totally going the way of the dinosaur. You simply have to stop thinking that our solar system is isolated and spinning on its own thumb. I call for a civil truce with you. LET's BE BROS, NOT ASS HO's to one another! We are moving into Aquarius, after all. ("After all," hmmmmmm, is a very heavy phrase. PEACE, MON.
Da fuq

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12/19/2012 01:23 PM
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Re: Dr.Astros response to "2012 A-Z" pin!!
Dr. Astro, if you care to reply, what do you think of that video going around glp titles "2012 A-Z" ? If you watched it?
Quoting: Albanian 12582427


It's crap. Earth does NOT orbit Alcyone. Our sun does NOT orbit Alcyone. Our solar system does NOT orbit Alcyone. Let alone in 25,627 years. Nor do we orbit Sirius.

Let's look at the numbers for Alcyone just to show you how ridiculous this is. Alcyone is of course part of the Pleiades, so let's use the total mass of the Pleiades cluster to see if we're orbiting it. Alcyone has a parallax of about 8.09 milliarcseconds, which corresponds to a distance of about 402 light years.
[link to simbad.u-strasbg.fr]
It also has a proper motion of about 19.34 milliarcseconds in right ascension and -43.67 milliarcseconds in declination per year. Now at a distance of 402 light years, those 43.67 milliarcseconds/year in declination translate to 805,195,033 kilometers per year or about 25.515 km/second. Now the Pleiades cluster has a total mass of about 740 sun masses ( [link to arxiv.org] ), so at a distance of 400 light years, the escape velocity for the entire Pleiades cluster is about 0.227861 km/second (that velocity will not get you around the 2,500 light year circumference of the orbit in 25,627 years either; just look at it, a roughly circular orbit would have to be about a tenth the speed of light!). In other words, even just taking into account our proper motion in declination, to say nothing of our total motion relative to Alcyone including in right ascension and radial velocity, we're traveling over 100 times too fast to be orbiting the Pleiades! We are not orbiting the Pleiades, let alone Alcyone, not even close.

As for Sirius, it has a proper motion of 1.2 arcseconds/year in declination and .546 arcseconds per year in right ascension ( [link to simbad.u-strasbg.fr] ) (15 km/sec and 6.8 km/sec velocity relative to our solar system respectively). Since we're about 8.6 light years from the Sirius system, and since Sirius A and B have a combined mass of nearly 3 times the sun's mass, the escape velocity from the Sirius system at the distance of our sun is about 0.1 km/sec. In other words, our solar system is traveling many times too fast relative to Sirius to be able to orbit it or be in a trinary configuration with it.
 Quoting: Albanian 12582427


yoda Dr. Astro, it's rather you who are full of caca, you gave the wrong declination for Sirius.
 Quoting: Kimpy2 20290901

Wrong.

Proper motions mas/yr [error ellipse]: -546.01 -1223.07
[link to simbad.u-strasbg.fr]

-1223.07 mas/yr in declination = 1.2 arcseconds per year.

I'm guessing you thought I was giving the coordinates of Sirius. Look up what proper motion is before you accuse me of being full of shit. I know what the hell I'm talking about, you clearly don't, so you're the one who's full of it.

Plus you prolly don't embrace the Electric Universe. Astro-math alone does not convince me.
 Quoting: idiot

Translation, you're a wilfully ignorant idiot who doesn't understand "astro-math" so you refuse to believe it and gladly latch onto any alternative bullshit you can find. Thanks for admitting that you're an irrational moran who openly admits he'll ignore proof.
One must rely heavily on observational evidence as well (like the declination of Sirius NOT CHANGING since the Great Pyramid's construction!)
 Quoting: idiot

Behold, "holy sirius."
holysirius
Yes, Sirius DOES move, it DOES experience proper motion and it DOES precess along with all the other stars. Here are two images of Sirius taken 28 years apart.
siriusmoves
I used the diffraction spikes to place a small black dot at the exact center of Sirius and you can clearly see how it moves in that period of time (it moved less than 1 arcminute, incidentally, still detectable and consistent with its proper motion, but NOT consistent with the claim that it doesn't precess like the other stars). Whoops, there goes the "declination of Sirius not changing since the great pyramid's construction." LOL!

It seems you're a reductionist traveling way too fast to stop and smell the stars.
 Quoting: idiot

It seems you're a fucking idiot who blindly reposts shit that was already debunked by the very post you responded to.

As for Sirius, it has a proper motion of 1.2 arcseconds/year in declination and .546 arcseconds per year in right ascension ( [link to simbad.u-strasbg.fr] ) (15 km/sec and 6.8 km/sec velocity relative to our solar system respectively). Since we're about 8.6 light years from the Sirius system, and since Sirius A and B have a combined mass of nearly 3 times the sun's mass, the escape velocity from the Sirius system at the distance of our sun is about 0.1 km/sec. In other words, our solar system is traveling many times too fast relative to Sirius to be able to orbit it or be in a trinary configuration with it.

Oh right, you don't understand "astro-math" so you just ignore it. By all means, continue to wallow in your ignorance. And by the way, just for good measure, most stars in our galaxy are actually single:
[link to www.cfa.harvard.edu (secure)]

Don't accuse me of being full of shit. I know what I'm talking about.
 Quoting: Dr. Astro


yodaHa! Ha!!! You're no scientist! You're an egoist!!! A Dr. Ego who is highly INSECURE ABOUT YOUR SCIENCE or you would not have responded so viciously. You're also no teacher; a true teacher is open to any and all possibilities and a free discussion. You are SHUT DOWN, TOP DOWN, and INTOLERANT OF OPPOSING VIEWS. The ancients knew this planet was in a SIGNIFICANT rotational relationship with Sirius: that is why they CONFIDENTLY BUILT A SHAFT INTO THEIR EPIC, INIMITABLE ARCHITECTURE FROM THE QUEEN'S CHAMBER OF THE GREAT PYRAMID THAT TO THIS DAY HOLDS SIRIUS FIRMLY IN ITS SIGHT!! Debunk that, Dr. Ego.
Now you are implying that Sirius is not a binary system (the article link you sent) when that is well established (and the black-dot motion is precisely from the electromagnetic/ gravitational waltz between Sirius A and Sirius B, but its motion does not change the system's orbital relationship with our Sun. The article is claiming most stars in our galaxy are single but all that means is a revised view: that one star is in front of the other over vast distances (they're NOT in the same ecliptic plane as they used to think binaries were), but they are still binary in their electromagnetic/gravitational/orbital relationships with each other. Just like our Sun (the cathode) is in electromagnetic relationship with the most distant zone of stagnation (the anode) 122 AUs away!!!! V-ger I and V-ger II have just confirmed the magnetic river (your standard model description), which is actually an "electromagnetic river" that connects our solar system at the edge of our Sun's anode zone to the rest of the galaxy and universe, SEAMLESSLY. Sorry, Dr. EGO, but your reductionist isolationist view is totally going the way of the dinosaur. You simply have to stop thinking that our solar system is isolated and spinning on its own thumb. I call for a civil truce with you. LET's BE BROS, NOT ASS HO's to one another! We are moving into Aquarius, after all. ("After all," hmmmmmm, is a very heavy phrase. PEACE, MON.
 Quoting: Kimpy2 20290901



When one has a golf ball size consciousness. You're gonna have a golf ball size understanding of things. Just leave him be.
Anonymous Coward
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12/19/2012 01:27 PM
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Re: Dr.Astros response to "2012 A-Z" pin!!
Please don't consider this a judgement of any kind, but do you happen to be an atheist Dr. Astro?
 Quoting: pi 20063747

No.
 Quoting: Dr. Astro


So how long have you had your own trolls? Just curious.
 Quoting: IRQ_1


Since the day he began his boy scouting.
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Re: Dr.Astros response to "2012 A-Z" pin!!
yodaHa! Ha!!! You're no scientist! You're an egoist!!! A Dr. Ego who is highly INSECURE ABOUT YOUR SCIENCE or you would not have responded so viciously.
 Quoting: Kimpy2 20290901

Says the guy shouting at me.
Glass house, stones, yours is in pieces.
You're also no teacher; a true teacher is open to any and all possibilities and a free discussion. You are SHUT DOWN, TOP DOWN, and INTOLERANT OF OPPOSING VIEWS.
 Quoting: KimpyEgo

I'm open to being proven wrong, but I'm not so open to "all possibilities" that my brains fall out. The evidence I posted is irrefutable. If you think it's refutable, then prove it. That requires actual proof, which is why I just trounced you.
The ancients knew this planet was in a SIGNIFICANT rotational relationship with Sirius: that is why they CONFIDENTLY BUILT A SHAFT INTO THEIR EPIC, INIMITABLE ARCHITECTURE FROM THE QUEEN'S CHAMBER OF THE GREAT PYRAMID THAT TO THIS DAY HOLDS SIRIUS FIRMLY IN ITS SIGHT!! Debunk that, Dr. Ego.
 Quoting: KimpyEgo

LOL! What the Egyptians did in building their pyramid is utterly irrelevant and proves nothing with regards to the fact that we are NOT orbiting Sirius and we are NOT gravitationally bound to it.
Now you are implying that Sirius is not a binary system (the article link you sent) when that is well established (and the black-dot motion is precisely from the electromagnetic/ gravitational waltz between Sirius A and Sirius B,
 Quoting: KimpyEgo

Wrong. The link did not say that it was not a binary system. Sirius A and B are separated by 3-11 arcseconds, which is much smaller than the motion observed - in fact at the image scale I posted, each pixel is about 11 arcseconds, meaning that the orbital motion of Sirius A and B would account for at most 1 pixel ( [link to nova.astrometry.net] notice too that the annotation circle is slightly offset from the center, down and to the right, since the frame analyzed is the older image and the astrometry software does not know how old the image it is so it assumes that Sirius' position should be at its modern location, confirming my own analysis). The motion observed is due to the system's proper motion, NOT due to its orbital motion with Sirius B.
but its motion does not change the system's orbital relationship with our Sun.
 Quoting: KimpyEgo

There is no orbital relationship, as I already proved.
The article is claiming most stars in our galaxy are single but all that means is a revised view: that one star is in front of the other over vast distances (they're NOT in the same ecliptic plane as they used to think binaries were),
 Quoting: KimpyEgo

Epic fail, that is not what the article is saying. Your reading comprehension is abysmal.

"Indeed, in the current epoch two-thirds of all main sequence stellar systems in the Galactic disk are composed of single stars."

"The most simple and straightforward hypothesis to explain these two facts and the finding of a high SSF in this paper is that the most common outcome of the star formation process is a single rather than multiple star."
Sorry, Dr. EGO, but your reductionist
 Quoting: KimpyEgo

Aha, you're the same idiot from last night. That explains it all. You're pissed that I shattered your delusional beliefs.
Siriusmoves
Yup, Sirius shows proper motion and precesses!
I call for a civil truce with you.
 Quoting: KimpyEgo

You just attacked and shouted at me. Fuck off.

Last Edited by Dr. Astro on 12/19/2012 03:32 PM
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Re: Dr.Astros response to "2012 A-Z" pin!!
When one has a golf ball size consciousness. You're gonna have a golf ball size understanding of things. Just leave him be.
 Quoting: Da fuq

I can't help it, he makes it too easy. He's like a golf ball just sitting on a tee, just waiting for me to whack him.
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12/19/2012 03:25 PM
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Re: Dr.Astros response to "2012 A-Z" pin!!
When one has a golf ball size consciousness. You're gonna have a golf ball size understanding of things. Just leave him be.
 Quoting: Da fuq

I can't help it, he makes it too easy. He's like a golf ball just sitting on a tee, just waiting for me to whack him.
 Quoting: Dr. Astro


Please keep doing what you do for those of us who appreciate your studies. It helps me cope with the bullshit around here at times. Thank you!
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02/14/2013 06:53 PM
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Re: Dr.Astros response to "2012 A-Z" pin!!
Dis asstro, I read your initial reply to the posters, and you do everything you complain about in your reply.

MR Astro is not a doctor, he just uses the moniker to make people trust him more.
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Re: Dr.Astros response to "2012 A-Z" pin!!
When one has a golf ball size consciousness. You're gonna have a golf ball size understanding of things. Just leave him be.
 Quoting: Da fuq

I can't help it, he makes it too easy. He's like a golf ball just sitting on a tee, just waiting for me to whack him.
 Quoting: Dr. Astro


You should try to get along better, I like most of your science but man you can be a real douche bag sometimes. Try to not troll the trolls, obviously you never learned to just ignore the trolls. They follow you around here and make you look like a a know it all jerk. Please adjust and try to ignore those that provoke you into reducing your credibility with your anger filled replies. The problem is you are good at it and try to hard to destroy some idiots opinions with hostile words and facts, lol grow up bud.

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