Godlike Productions - Conspiracy Forum
Users Online Now: 2,965 (Who's On?)Visitors Today: 1,842,374
Pageviews Today: 2,578,970Threads Today: 652Posts Today: 12,918
06:02 PM


Rate this Thread

Absolute BS Crap Reasonable Nice Amazing
 

Alcoholics Anonymous Dangerous Mind Control Cult

 
Anonymous Coward
User ID: 27792160
United States
12/26/2012 01:32 AM
Report Abusive Post
Report Copyright Violation
Re: Alcoholics Anonymous Dangerous Mind Control Cult
Does not promote powerlessness.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 21790634


Step 1: We admitted we were powerless over alcohol—that our lives had become unmanageable.

F
 Quoting: Gigolo Jesus


Yeah, because I used to drink and I gave it up. If I say I have no control, then I don't. AA is bullshit, mostly.
Anonymous Coward
User ID: 30495500
12/26/2012 01:33 AM
Report Abusive Post
Report Copyright Violation
Re: Alcoholics Anonymous Dangerous Mind Control Cult
AA is a good program for an alcoholic/addict who actually wants to better his/her life in addition to stop drinking.

I grew up in church resenting the fact that I 'had to go' every Sunday & Wednesday. I went to AA and found God. It's a spiritual program that works for people who have open hearts and minds and are willing to actually "work" for their recovery and regain control of their own lives.

I am very grateful to the program. Granted I enjoy spending time alone scouring GLP while freaking out. But what I enjoy even more is attending a meeting where I place myself near other beating hearts and like souls who actually care for me and my well-being.

God Bless.
Paradise Havona

User ID: 1405948
United States
12/26/2012 01:54 AM
Report Abusive Post
Report Copyright Violation
Re: Alcoholics Anonymous Dangerous Mind Control Cult
normally i wouldn't comment on this... but my family and I have experience with AA, my grandpa has been in "recovery" for 25 years (right before I was born)

they started telling me I needed to go to AA when I started drinking in my teenage years... I did not like the idea at first, but went anyways.

OP, I definitely believe you are right about people becoming dependent on those meetings and the people there. It is sad they try to brainwash you into believing that alcohol is stronger than you..... which is absofuckinglutely retarded in my opinion.

Anyways... having been there and done that I decided to tell you that I completely agree with you. People can change their minds about who they are and what they are... the mind is a very powerful tool, we should definitely learn to use it instead of trying to fix the problem with a sugar pill.

hf
i get on this site... way too much
Anonymous Coward
User ID: 30872877
United States
12/26/2012 01:57 AM
Report Abusive Post
Report Copyright Violation
Re: Alcoholics Anonymous Dangerous Mind Control Cult
AA is for quitters.

:drink:
Anonymous Coward
User ID: 27108896
United States
12/26/2012 02:02 AM
Report Abusive Post
Report Copyright Violation
Re: Alcoholics Anonymous Dangerous Mind Control Cult
saved my life!

It is a choice.

It is needed.

if you don't like it, don't go!
Anonymous Coward
User ID: 27234159
United States
12/26/2012 02:50 AM
Report Abusive Post
Report Copyright Violation
Re: Alcoholics Anonymous Dangerous Mind Control Cult
Douglas Rushkoff has an interesting essay on Alcoholic Anonymous in his book, 'You are being lied to'.

He basically is saying that AA becomes kind of a self fulfilling prophecy. They pound into your brain that all it takes is just one drink and you are fucked again just as you came into the program. I have been a member for a couple years about a decade ago, and I saw that a few people would probably have been dead without it, but the majority had enough self control that they could have pulled themselves out of alcoholism by some other means.

Their is IMO a danger of there constant one liners reinforcing the idea that there is no other hope but AA such as:

Don't drink, don't think and go to meetings

A. A. is the last stop on the train

Surrender to become Victorious

The bottle, big house, or the box

Death, insanity, or recovery.

We don't get run over by the train, we get hit by the engine (1st. drink).

Don't work my program, or your program, work "the program"

If you can't remember your last drink, maybe you haven't had it.

Underneath every skirt is a slip.

The farther I get from my last drink, the closer I get to my next drunk

Once an alcoholic always an alcoholic.

As I said before, there are definitely cases that have no choice but the extreme. I cannot knock it wholeheartedly. But I do believe there is a definite self fulfilling prophecy element to it. It was constantly drilled into my brain that if I didn't do the steps, didn't go to meetings, I would be dead or in jail.

What turned me around was myself, I just got tired of living the way I used to. I stayed sober for about a year after I left the program, and very cautiously I went out to a bar with my buddies.

I'm a hard drinker, I definitely have a compulsion to get hammered. But I actually had to relearn that just because I take one drink, doesn't mean I have to keep drinking as the program implies will happen.

Now don't get me wrong, I get hammered maybe 4 or 5 times out of a year now, but I used to drink daily. Like I said, it was a self realization that I couldn't drink my problems away and it was making my situation worse that fixed it for me.

IMO AA is not entirely a cult, but there are definitely some cult like attitudes going on in the program. If you absolutely need it, it should be a last resort. But do not join unless you are completely out of options.
Jeff
User ID: 20291328
United States
12/26/2012 03:03 AM
Report Abusive Post
Report Copyright Violation
Re: Alcoholics Anonymous Dangerous Mind Control Cult
Alcoholism is a choice. So is the program... any program.
Jeff
User ID: 20291328
United States
12/26/2012 03:11 AM
Report Abusive Post
Report Copyright Violation
Re: Alcoholics Anonymous Dangerous Mind Control Cult
Alcoholism is a choice. So is the program... any program. Alcohol is the biggest serial killer on the planet. Just remember that.
 Quoting: Jeff 20291328
Anonymous Coward
User ID: 30761365
United States
12/26/2012 03:35 AM
Report Abusive Post
Report Copyright Violation
Re: Alcoholics Anonymous Dangerous Mind Control Cult
Yes
Anonymous Coward
User ID: 30856165
United States
12/26/2012 03:37 AM
Report Abusive Post
Report Copyright Violation
Re: Alcoholics Anonymous Dangerous Mind Control Cult
The need for AA is a replacement for a need to drink (or do drugs).

Addiction (regardless what you are addicted to) is a mindset that is really, really hard to break.

If you do not have an addictive personality you cannot possibly 'get' what its like to be an addictive person.

AA attempts (albeit poorly in some ways) to give people a better (questionable as it may be) outlet for their addictive behaviors.


As for the powerless over alcohol thing. If you had an addictive personality you would keenly understand what that means. But (assuming you don't get addicted to stuff) you can't relate to it because you haven't been in the hands of something.

Alcoholism and drug addiction (any addiction) is not curable. Of course once again as a 'normy' you don't get how its possible for this to be, but then you don't wake up every day craving some drug of choice, you don't have the screaming in your brain to have a drink or a shot or a line or whatever.

I am a drug addict, thankfully decades clean and sober in that I haven't touched my drug of choice in a very long time. However the habits and personality traits of addiction still reside in me. I could very easily hook up with a drug dealer tomorrow and be right back where I was before I decided that I had a 'little problem'.

As a normy you can't possibly understand this. And if you can understand this then you have an addictive personality and need a program of recovery yourself.
 Quoting: Bowyn Aerrow


Well, you have your way and others have theirs. Who are you to say what another may, or may not need, or how to go about getting there? I gave up a long term crack addiction 7 years ago, and alcohol 3 years ago, along with smoking. I am no closer now to, or more in jeapordy of using again than I was when I manned up (so to speak, I am a woman) and decided it was time to get a life! I have the power within myself, a God given will, to avoid situations that would put me in positions where I might encounter old habits, and say no when presented with an offer to drink, or have a smoke from people who just don't understand. You have your way others have theirs!
Anonymous Coward
User ID: 30856165
United States
12/26/2012 03:39 AM
Report Abusive Post
Report Copyright Violation
Re: Alcoholics Anonymous Dangerous Mind Control Cult
normally i wouldn't comment on this... but my family and I have experience with AA, my grandpa has been in "recovery" for 25 years (right before I was born)

they started telling me I needed to go to AA when I started drinking in my teenage years... I did not like the idea at first, but went anyways.

OP, I definitely believe you are right about people becoming dependent on those meetings and the people there. It is sad they try to brainwash you into believing that alcohol is stronger than you..... which is absofuckinglutely retarded in my opinion.

Anyways... having been there and done that I decided to tell you that I completely agree with you. People can change their minds about who they are and what they are... the mind is a very powerful tool, we should definitely learn to use it instead of trying to fix the problem with a sugar pill.

hf
 Quoting: Paradise Havona


Bravo! clappa
Just Me..
User ID: 30658637
United Kingdom
12/26/2012 03:48 AM
Report Abusive Post
Report Copyright Violation
Re: Alcoholics Anonymous Dangerous Mind Control Cult
14yrs sober I have not been to a meeting for about 9 yrs...the non alcoholic will never be able too understand the alcoholic...actually I am happy to be one...non alcoholics are just so frigging dumb and stupid....
Anonymous Coward
User ID: 30727109
United States
12/26/2012 03:50 AM
Report Abusive Post
Report Copyright Violation
Re: Alcoholics Anonymous Dangerous Mind Control Cult
Worked for family members of mine...

The principles taught in AA rate very highly in terms of kineseology. Cult may have a negative connotation, so might not be the best word to describe them. I'd call it a religion, custom cut and tailored to a specific niche. Morality, self discipline, responsibly... why are these bad things to teach and honor?
 Quoting: Hales


hi hales
Just Me..
User ID: 30658637
United Kingdom
12/26/2012 04:00 AM
Report Abusive Post
Report Copyright Violation
Re: Alcoholics Anonymous Dangerous Mind Control Cult
And do not confuse the alcoholic with a drug addict...not the same...anyone can become hooked on drugs...only about one in ten will be a alcoholic.......
Anonymous Coward
User ID: 9938337
Sweden
12/26/2012 04:01 AM
Report Abusive Post
Report Copyright Violation
Re: Alcoholics Anonymous Dangerous Mind Control Cult
One session with Iboga will treat any addictions over night,alcohol,heroin,pills,nicotin,It will make you free by your own self,make you see .You can get professional treatment in Germany. Or go to africa and find a real Iboga shaman. No Bullshit its for real.
Anonymous Coward
User ID: 30856165
United States
12/26/2012 04:07 AM
Report Abusive Post
Report Copyright Violation
Re: Alcoholics Anonymous Dangerous Mind Control Cult
The need for AA is a replacement for a need to drink (or do drugs).

Addiction (regardless what you are addicted to) is a mindset that is really, really hard to break.

If you do not have an addictive personality you cannot possibly 'get' what its like to be an addictive person.

AA attempts (albeit poorly in some ways) to give people a better (questionable as it may be) outlet for their addictive behaviors.


As for the powerless over alcohol thing. If you had an addictive personality you would keenly understand what that means. But (assuming you don't get addicted to stuff) you can't relate to it because you haven't been in the hands of something.

Alcoholism and drug addiction (any addiction) is not curable. Of course once again as a 'normy' you don't get how its possible for this to be, but then you don't wake up every day craving some drug of choice, you don't have the screaming in your brain to have a drink or a shot or a line or whatever.

I am a drug addict, thankfully decades clean and sober in that I haven't touched my drug of choice in a very long time. However the habits and personality traits of addiction still reside in me. I could very easily hook up with a drug dealer tomorrow and be right back where I was before I decided that I had a 'little problem'.

As a normy you can't possibly understand this. And if you can understand this then you have an addictive personality and need a program of recovery yourself.
 Quoting: Bowyn Aerrow


Your post just does not set well with me. I think the reason is that you are apparently trying to dictate to others what it is like being an addict, not just explaining how it is for YOU PERSONALLY. Paragraph by paragraph...I am not powerless in the face any substance, even being a former addict. Many people are not powerless. I Personally believe that addictions can be cured. I'm sure many others do as well. Not all of us are in you stated extreme danger of using on a moments notice. Not everyone needs a program of recovery in the way you seem to feel they do. I personally believe, for myself, that it all comes down to choices, willpower and accountability. Please don't push your ways onto the rest of the world!
Anonymous Coward
User ID: 30863446
United States
12/26/2012 04:27 AM
Report Abusive Post
Report Copyright Violation
Re: Alcoholics Anonymous Dangerous Mind Control Cult
Some people like drinking alcohol at lot. No one knows why.

All current theories of Addiction are just that, theories.

[link to online.wsj.com]

All too often, you read that they've found a gene for this and a gene for that, and it's very rarely that simple. We don't expect to find a single gene in everyone," says Howard J. Edenberg, a professor of biochemistry and molecular biology at the Indiana University School of Medicine. Dr. Edenberg is one of four principal investigators in the government-funded Collaborative Study on the Genetics of Alcoholism (COGA), which has been tracking alcoholism in families since 1989. To date, COGA researchers have interviewed more than 14,000 people and sampled the DNA of 262 families. They've found evidence for several alcohol-related genes—and are increasingly convinced that different types of alcoholics reflect many genetic variations. [

Much more research is needed.
Anonymous Coward
User ID: 29130443
Canada
12/26/2012 04:44 AM
Report Abusive Post
Report Copyright Violation
Re: Alcoholics Anonymous Dangerous Mind Control Cult
OP -- you're absolutely right. Ultimately it comes down to control and money, both of which AA first wheedles out of and then demands from its adherents. To tell people who haven't had a drink in 20 years that they're still alcoholics is so ridiculous and contrary to common sense that even a child can see it's a lie. AA is not interested in getting to the root of the reason for a person's addiction; they're just interested in having the "addict" refocus his or her addictive behavior on AA. I used to work for the Salvation Army, and they operate hand-in-glove with AA. I was appalled by what I witnessed first-hand in both organizations and quit after only a few months.
Anonymous Coward
User ID: 29130443
Canada
12/26/2012 04:54 AM
Report Abusive Post
Report Copyright Violation
Re: Alcoholics Anonymous Dangerous Mind Control Cult
You're not born with 'addictive behavior'; you develop it in response to circumstances. You choose it, sometimes consciously, sometimes unconsciously. But just as it is developed, it can also be 'undeveloped'. It is not a lifetime sentence.

AA preaches (yes, preaches) that addictive behavior is beyond one's control and lasts a lifetime, but that is a blatant lie. People buy this lie and brand themselves as 'addicts'. That is also a choice people make, to choose to believe this lie. Then they look to 'research' and the witness of 'experts' to support this lie, so that they can continue to blame forces beyond their control.

It is easier to brand yourself an addict than to take personal responsibility for the circumstances and choices that led to your addiction.

AA is not interested in getting to root of why you developed your addictive behavior; they're only interested in keeping you believing you have an 'incurable' addictive behavior so that they can make money from you.

Dreadful organization based on lies. Avoid it like the plague, and if you're in it, GET OUT.
Anonymous Coward
User ID: 7697081
Netherlands
12/26/2012 05:05 AM
Report Abusive Post
Report Copyright Violation
Re: Alcoholics Anonymous Dangerous Mind Control Cult
Nobody is pushing anyone in to the rooms.

Nobody is enforcing the twelve steps to someone at all.

If a person is willing to try the steps i can show him how i did it.
There are only 12 steps but there are countless millions of ways to apply it to once own life.

As the higher power/God shizzle; I needed a way of thinking/acting which bypasses my Ego/addictive mind to grow spiritually.
I don't believe in an omniopotent/present being and i don't have to.

What a see on a weekly basis is that the peolpe from the fellowship change before my eyes, turning from lonely, cynical and fearfull persons in to persons who have a positive outlook on their life and themselves.

Is the AA/NA/CA any A for that matter the only way of recovery? Off course not! But it does help, undenialble, millions arround the globe!

Is alcoholism a disease? i say yes. A chronic, progressive and primairy one.

Yound help through NLP and what not. I'm happy for you!
I found my way with the 12 step and feel freed, happy and positive for over 4 years now.

All the best to you and yours!
Anonymous Coward
User ID: 24554510
United States
12/26/2012 05:10 AM
Report Abusive Post
Report Copyright Violation
Re: Alcoholics Anonymous Dangerous Mind Control Cult
Hello,

I'm a retard and i agree with OP and so i know all people who agree with OP are retarded like me. 2.
Anonymous Coward
User ID: 29130443
Canada
12/26/2012 05:17 AM
Report Abusive Post
Report Copyright Violation
Re: Alcoholics Anonymous Dangerous Mind Control Cult
Nobody is pushing anyone in to the rooms.

Nobody is enforcing the twelve steps to someone at all.

If a person is willing to try the steps i can show him how i did it.
There are only 12 steps but there are countless millions of ways to apply it to once own life.

As the higher power/God shizzle; I needed a way of thinking/acting which bypasses my Ego/addictive mind to grow spiritually.
I don't believe in an omniopotent/present being and i don't have to.

What a see on a weekly basis is that the peolpe from the fellowship change before my eyes, turning from lonely, cynical and fearfull persons in to persons who have a positive outlook on their life and themselves.

Is the AA/NA/CA any A for that matter the only way of recovery? Off course not! But it does help, undenialble, millions arround the globe!

Is alcoholism a disease? i say yes. A chronic, progressive and primairy one.

Yound help through NLP and what not. I'm happy for you!
I found my way with the 12 step and feel freed, happy and positive for over 4 years now.

All the best to you and yours!
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 7697081


Alcoholism is not a disease, any more that reliance on any other kind of drug is a disease. Addiction is learned behavior, and it can be unlearned.

AA preys on people when they're down and keeps them down; people who buy into the lie that alcohol is a disease trade one kind of ball and chain for another.
Anonymous Coward
User ID: 29130443
Canada
12/26/2012 05:27 AM
Report Abusive Post
Report Copyright Violation
Re: Alcoholics Anonymous Dangerous Mind Control Cult
Nobody is pushing anyone in to the rooms.

Nobody is enforcing the twelve steps to someone at all.

If a person is willing to try the steps i can show him how i did it.
There are only 12 steps but there are countless millions of ways to apply it to once own life.

As the higher power/God shizzle; I needed a way of thinking/acting which bypasses my Ego/addictive mind to grow spiritually.
I don't believe in an omniopotent/present being and i don't have to.

What a see on a weekly basis is that the peolpe from the fellowship change before my eyes, turning from lonely, cynical and fearfull persons in to persons who have a positive outlook on their life and themselves.

Is the AA/NA/CA any A for that matter the only way of recovery? Off course not! But it does help, undenialble, millions arround the globe!

Is alcoholism a disease? i say yes. A chronic, progressive and primairy one.

Yound help through NLP and what not. I'm happy for you!
I found my way with the 12 step and feel freed, happy and positive for over 4 years now.

All the best to you and yours!
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 7697081


The hallmark of a cult (bad) is that adherents' personalities change. That means they've been brainwashed into thinking and acting other than how they really are and the change is artificial and superficial. That is why cult members must remain within the cult, to feed and sustain the artificiality; otherwise, the brainwashing begins to wear off.

On the contrary, the hallmark of true spiritual conversion (good) is that the convert's values change but the converts' personalities remain the same. In such conversion, a person does not require adherence or membership in any organization to sustain the converted state, since it is genuine.

Overcoming addictive behavior is, at root, a changing of one's values. This is never addressed at AA.
7.83Hz
Infinity^Infinity

User ID: 29258733
Australia
12/26/2012 05:33 AM

Report Abusive Post
Report Copyright Violation
Re: Alcoholics Anonymous Dangerous Mind Control Cult
Just like drug rehab or jail, make connections...
Anything in life worth doing is worth overdoing. Moderation's for cowards.
Hypertiger

User ID: 12277324
Canada
12/26/2012 05:57 AM
Report Abusive Post
Report Copyright Violation
Re: Alcoholics Anonymous Dangerous Mind Control Cult
You are all addicted to the global trade system.

Basically at birth you are exposed to it by everyone without a choice.

Trying to break free from the addiction is illegal according to the rules.

As long as you don't get caught.

So then many people find solace in lies and delusion.

until they are forced to accept Truth.

forced to care.

That's what the poppies in Afghanistan make people do.

Keep forcing them to care about producing ever greater amounts of healthy poppies.

Force.

"Government is not reason; it is not eloquent; it is force. Like fire, it is a dangerous servant and a fearful master."--George Washington

How about a cult within a cult.

a hierarchy within a hierarchy....or hierarchical with the bottom supporting the top.

or the top living of the yield of power from the bottom.

Poppies are basically just valuable obediant slaves.

Addicted to the same thing you all are.

Called an exchange for mutual benifit.

If you are happy and I am happy...it's positive.

But I could easily gain more power and leave you negative.

and when the happiness wears off...you need to come back for more power.

and I rob you again by taking more than I give.

but because you are ignorant.

you never figure out.

Why you are dominated.

You all below don't want to know why.

You all are addicted to ignorance.

That is where you all dervive happiness from.

Just like the poppies in the fields.
Anonymous Coward
User ID: 27855176
United States
12/26/2012 06:12 AM
Report Abusive Post
Report Copyright Violation
Re: Alcoholics Anonymous Dangerous Mind Control Cult
My biological Dad died an alcoholic, my stepfather just took his 30 year cake. My mother is a speed freak who will die that way. My step brother died of substance abuse. I have lost a best friend to alcoholism.

AA is something that works. Donations are accepted but not demanded. If you haven't grown up in the thickest of shit or around AA just keep your trap shut. I myself am not an alcoholic but have attended meetings. I am 30 now and have seen many do very positive things with their lives thanks to AA.

The reason people attend is to remind them of where they could be and also help others. Many of you are addicted to this site. You act as if this site is nothing but positive posts. For a forum claiming it is so new age and open minded there are many of you who are judgemental as f#&%, grow up.
Anonymous Coward
User ID: 26484773
United States
12/26/2012 06:14 AM
Report Abusive Post
Report Copyright Violation
Re: Alcoholics Anonymous Dangerous Mind Control Cult
OP, what other cult do you know of that preaches "Take what you need and leave the rest"??????
Anonymous Coward
User ID: 27855176
United States
12/26/2012 06:21 AM
Report Abusive Post
Report Copyright Violation
Re: Alcoholics Anonymous Dangerous Mind Control Cult
I might also add, OP you picked someone up from a meeting and gathered all that inner information...why not go in and listen for an hour and not judge people on your "gut". Superficial twat.
Citizenperth
FUKUSHIMA, GLPTARD 24/7/365

User ID: 30883279
Australia
12/26/2012 06:23 AM

Report Abusive Post
Report Copyright Violation
Re: Alcoholics Anonymous Dangerous Mind Control Cult
RULES:

1. I am always right.
2. If confused or debated refer to rule number 1.
It's life as we know it, but only just.
My Fukushima Site:
[link to citizenperth.wordpress.com]
sic ut vos es vos should exsisto , denego alius vicis facio vos change , exsisto youself , proprie

GLP's best Fuku thread: Thread: *** Fukushima *** and other nuclear-----updates and links
twitter: @citizenperth
“If I had an hour to solve a problem and my life depended on it, I would use the first 55 minutes determining the proper question to ask, for once I knew the proper question, I could solve the problem in less than five minutes.”
- Albert Einstein
anonymous coward 22265

User ID: 30704843
United States
12/26/2012 06:37 AM
Report Abusive Post
Report Copyright Violation
Re: Alcoholics Anonymous Dangerous Mind Control Cult
it's founder, bill wilson came up with the idea for a program/fellowship for those who struggled with the bottle, and it didnt take long for word to get back to our controllers of the establishment and they quickly sprung into action - as bill wilson was approached by none other than one JOHN D ROCKEFEELER - a true enemy of the human race to get involved with an offer of "help" - and it was off to the oxford group - (illuminati front) for the 12 steps. powerless and lack of control are the first two things this cult mind controls the individual with - pure and utter bullshit - then there's the old - "you must find a power outside of yourself that is greater than yourself" nonsense to keep you insane.

it is nothing more than christianity with a more modern spin put on it - you can actually choose a "god of your understanding" oh, joy - what a wonderful program. it is exactly that - a PROGRAM - downloaded into the computer (the mind) that the robot (person) then unconsciously follows the orders from.

i realize that it does help people, but it's success rate is an absysmal 3 to 5% and these robots actually claim that the program works! it has all the components of religion - powerless, lack control, have a disease for which there is no known cure/ comparable to - unworthy, born of original sin, must accept christ to be "saved" - as you must accept the 12 steps to be "saved"

try putting down the cult to one of it's brainwashed, mind controlled members, and watch their response - no different than a christian defending the dogma of christianity. it prevents one from becoming self determined and reaching higher levels of consciousness - just as it's architects planned - thinking for oneself is considered one of the highest crimes in this fearmongering cult - just more typical orwellian "group think" robots - and if u dare express an opinion, thought, or belief outside of what is considered acceptable by 12 steps - you will be shunned - looked upon as dangerous.

like i said, it has helped many, but even more have died trying to get baetter because this inefficient program didnt offer them the help they actually needed - and even those it has helped are selling themselves short - as u would expect with anything the illuminati gets themselves involved in on our behalf.

i would suggest if someone is struggling with an addiction to use them for help, and as soon as they're feeling better, to get outta there as quickly as possible before they actually start believing that nonsense and having it control their mind and life.
anonymous coward 22265

News