Will God ever accept Lucifer into Heaven again

The Bible shows God can and does change his mind! Refer to Jonah and the planned judgement of Nineveh.

And the American Christian enters the ring.

What part of these verses do you see as being 'torture'?

Isa:65:17:
For,
behold,
I create new heavens and a new earth:
and the former shall not be remembered,
nor come into mind.

Isa:65:22:
They shall not build,
and another inhabit; they shall not plant,
and another eat:
for as the days of a tree are the days of my people,
and mine elect shall long enjoy the work of their hands.
Isa:65:23:
They shall not labour in vain,
nor bring forth for trouble;
for they are the seed of the blessed of the LORD,
and their offspring with them.
Isa:65:24:
And it shall come to pass,
that before they call,
I will answer;
and while they are yet speaking,
I will hear.

How about the teachings of Christ in a manner appropriate for the context instead of endless walls of bible verses?

In that story Jonah was to go and deliver a warning that if they didn't change they would be destroyed, they heard the message and did what it suggested, even a little more as they put sackcloth on the animals as well. I wanted to point that out before posting the verse below, what is in prophecy will come to pass.

Isa:55:11:
So shall my word be that goeth forth out of my mouth:
it shall not return unto me void,
but it shall accomplish that which I please,
and it shall prosper in the thing whereto I sent it.

Jer:4:28:
For this shall the earth mourn,
and the heavens above be black:
because I have spoken it,
I have purposed it,
and will not repent,
neither will I turn back from it.

Last Edited by MHz on 12/26/2012 04:00 AM

None if it. That's why I spend significant time here refuting the wildly-predominant-yet-illogical-and-unscriptural belief in Hell.

Keep the good fight up man.

The whole chapter is about the ones called 'the rest' in Re:20. Go ahead read it and show me where it isn't, feel free to post some verses to support your view.

lol 'Wall of verses' means those few make you quite small in terms of knowing anything inside the Bible. The day of the Lord has about 40 passages that are relevent so bypass any topic that mentions that term. Just sain ...

Yeah dude.

It's the year 2012.

Why don't more people know the bible as well as you do?

I agree it is an excellent, provocative and wise piece of literature. But who do you know that reads like that these days?

All I'm saying is the bible's honey on the inside, but with a whole load of frills, teeth and claws that many people find intimidating at best and downright ugly at worst.

Distill it to it's honey and you'll be better received, trust me.

I have a library (real books, not novels) that makes your collection of mens health and cosmopolitan look like...a collection of mens health and cosmo!
Just because I don't believe in fictions doesn't mean I'm not well read :-)

This one?

Isa:28:15:
Because ye have said,
We have made a covenant with death,
and with hell are we at agreement;
when the overflowing scourge shall pass through,
it shall not come unto us:
for we have made lies our refuge,
and under falsehood have we hid ourselves:

Isa:28:18:
And your covenant with death shall be disannulled,
and your agreement with hell shall not stand;
when the overflowing scourge shall pass through,
then ye shall be trodden down by it.

Isa:65:12:
Therefore will I number you to the sword,
and ye shall all bow down to the slaughter:
because when I called,
ye did not answer;
when I spake,
ye did not hear;
but did evil before mine eyes,
and did choose that wherein I delighted not.
Isa:65:13:
Therefore thus saith the Lord GOD,
Behold,
my servants shall eat,
but ye shall be hungry:
behold,
my servants shall drink,
but ye shall be thirsty:
behold,
my servants shall rejoice,
but ye shall be ashamed:
Isa:65:14:
Behold,
my servants shall sing for joy of heart,
but ye shall cry for sorrow of heart,
and shall howl for vexation of spirit.
Isa:65:15:
And ye shall leave your name for a curse unto my chosen:
for the Lord GOD shall slay thee,
and call his servants by another name:


So that would be two one-way tickets then.

Last Edited by MHz on 12/26/2012 04:13 AM

Well most of us madmen deal in terms of non-duality. It is meant as a metaphor, if a very deep one. It isn't just people making up random stories.

There is a common theme; a set of common archetypes that underlie all story, fact or fiction. Just because you don't understand what people are talking about doesn't mean that any random nonsense is equally valid.

Sorry, not following what you're asking?

And wtf is this?

Ah, I see. So nothing more than a bible thumper. Don't you watch any TV shows? Everyone hates those people.

Imagine trying to have a debate with a ceiling fan and you'll get my drift.

A big fat head.

Take your pick, you can not read it and ask an endless amount of questions or read it (a lot) and have more answers than questions.

Who said sin and death were gentle subjects, the cross was an actual death. Tell you what, (just for yourself) take the time to read Ge:1-3 and Re:20-22 and just go with that. The whole inside has to do with the prophecies and fulfillment of the two bruises in Ge:3:15. The 4 Gospels was the final part of the bruise to the heel, nobody is saying it is a small subject but the mini version gives you a starting and ending point and really if you don't know it has a happy ending a lot of the OT will make you physically ill to your stomach and I'm not kidding about that part.

Last Edited by MHz on 12/26/2012 04:20 AM

I rely on Hindi and Buddhist texts for spirituality.

I do like Genesis and Revelations. Quite a lot.

It's all the same story on the inside.

This is what I'm saying - Christianity Inc. has no inkling of any such thing. To churchbots it's all a big grim ultimatum. Turn or burn.

Fortunately, God has something better in mind.

Yes sir...

It was life-changing stuff for me :)

Just what it looks like unless you can show me where you two would fit into the first group that are alive for the 1,000 years (while you are sleeping since only the ones that are unrepented at His return end up in hell. They live inside New Jerusalem in the new earth, you two would be in the Isa:65 new earth verses. The ones that die before the 7th trump take the route that Job was told about.

Re:20:4:
And I saw thrones,
and they sat upon them,
and judgment was given unto them:
and I saw the souls of them that were beheaded for the witness of Jesus,
and for the word of God,
and which had not worshipped the beast,
neither his image,
neither had received his mark upon their foreheads,
or in their hands;
and they lived and reigned with Christ a thousand years.
Re:20:5:
But the rest of the dead lived not again until the thousand years were finished.
This is the first resurrection.

Job:14:12:
So man lieth down,
and riseth not:
till the heavens be no more,
they shall not awake,
nor be raised out of their sleep.
Job:14:13:
O that thou wouldest hide me in the grave,
that thou wouldest keep me secret,
until thy wrath be past,
that thou wouldest appoint me a set time,
and remember me!
Job:14:14:
If a man die,
shall he live again?
all the days of my appointed time will I wait,
till my change come.
Job:14:15:
Thou shalt call,
and I will answer thee:
thou wilt have a desire to the work of thine hands.
Job:14:16:
For now thou numberest my steps:
dost thou not watch over my sin?
Job:14:17:
My transgression is sealed up in a bag,
and thou sewest up mine iniquity.

Well, I like to hope I might possibly qualify for The Life during the 1000 years, but I'll go with whatever He decides, knowing it's for the best. I still think you need to slow down a little, since I'm not following what you're getting at.

My stance is that Hell is a popular myth. Stories of an afterlife of torture and misery for the wicked were around in various flavors long before the days of Israel. These beliefs were widespread in the pagan world. And then our God comes along, befriends Abram and gives Israel His counsel and His laws, but mentions *nothing* about any alleged fate of endless torment. Search the old testament - it's simply not there. And then, against His command, His people adopt the corrupt ways of the neighboring cultures, and end up incorporating the ancient fairy tales of hellfire into their beliefs. He warned them about this in Deuteronomy 12, saying "don't become like the heathen nations, who *burn* their sons and daughters for their gods, which is an abomination".

Since then, the legend of Hell has snowballed into a humongous idol that few in the church dare to examine. But when we do, we'll find that it's unscriptural and that it entirely contradicts the nature of a Person who would humble Himself to nothing and literally die for His enemies.

UNrelated question, Mhz - you still hang out at the old Bible Wheel forum at all? Haven't been there in ages myself. Just curious what "attendance" is like since RAM's big announcement.

To a certain extent, even listening to me and the verses I post still means you should verify for yourself that the passage says what the few verses I post say.

For instance, all Gentiles from the time of acts 10 belong to the 7 churches of Re:2 and 3. Each church has some that have a good relationship with God and some that do not. Those 14 different relationships are what God is going to use when the 7th trump sounds so being a member of another religion means doesn't mean anything to God as far as where you end up, that is either forgiven and alive for the 1,000 years and then residing inside New Jerusalem in the new earth or it means being in the grave for the 1,000 years and then living outside the city walls as in Isa:65.

Everything in the OT that was an event related to the completion of the bruise to the heel, from Acts:10 all the verses related to the bruise to the serpents head (and some OT prophecies that are still unfulfilled.

If the mystism in Revelation is a bit confusing read the vision and explanation in Da:7 about the 4th beast and then read Re:17 and the vision and explanation of the harlot and those keep the words quite easy to understand for the rest of the prophecies.

Nope, never

To tell you the truth I don't even remember being there. I started here and then went to Christianity.com, the rapture ready, then Christian Talk Zone and a few other places. Granted there are a few where I was only there for a thread or two. Got booted from one for asking a mod when the last time she read a verse that made her have any kind of emotion, good thing me and the site owner had 3 years talk behind us at that point.

What was the announcement about? At CTZ they put me in my own section and wouldn't let me interact with anybody outside that area, lol. I thought it was pretty funny but they were dead serious about 'containing me'

Like what?

You already turned down the ultimate gift, and promise.

What did you have in mind? Something you simply pulled out of your rear?

All the prophets of God, the disciples, the apostles, and even Jesus Himself, all delusional or liars, according to you. But a clueless internet clown who just believes whatever makes him feel good, is right?

So that's how it works for you... eh?

There are a could of other things that make reading easier, the slaughter of the innocents in Matthew 2 is related to Jer:31 and it makes 'the land of the enemy' the grave rather than any Gentile Nation and the scattering at the arrest in the garden is related to the smite the Shepherd in Zec:13 as being the 'little ones' ate Gentiles as being the Church, 1/3 have repented and 2/3 are not repented at the 7th trump and they die. I use those as something solid and the rest of the prophecies fit right in with no deciphering or any mental gymnastics.

Last Edited by MHz on 12/26/2012 04:53 AM

What if this duality existence is all just a play, and some beings took on the role as bad guy, while others took on the role as good guy? Then at the end of the play the curtain goes down, players take off their mask and will show their real faces? Then actors are basically actors who took on roles to tell the story. Hollywood is all about illusion. So yeah, in the end all the actors will get paid for their work, no matter what role they played.