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What ACTUAL revolution in the USA would look like. NOTHING like most here post.

 
s. d. butler

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12/28/2012 02:56 PM
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Re: What ACTUAL revolution in the USA would look like. NOTHING like most here post.
Taking out the power to several states would only hurt the civvy population, not the military.

The biggest threat people face is not getting blown up by military tanks but the fact that no one has access to the food supply unless they already have a garden. At any moment, the govt can freeze your accounts and then you have no food or anything.

The way an actual revolution would look is people starving in the streets because their credit cards don't work any more.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 30992272


That was my point... No power = total chaos... I don't care what the military tries to do at that point. They need power too (yes I know they can provide temp power on site but it still requires operational infrastructure).

My point if you have 3 States of people going totally batshit I don't care if you have the ENTIRE military on the ground at that point... won't matter.

And then it happens to another 3 States.... and so forth.

My point is that when there is resistance I am sure it will be all done WITHOUT firearms (or at least not requiring them).
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 23022509


The military has its own power. Do you really think they only to wage war when they have a plentiful supply of 120 volt outlets?

No power = total chaos = exactly what they need to convince people to just lay down and accept martial law, like every time a hurricane hits. People beg for the govt to save them when there's chaos.

There have been major multi-state outages before. None of the military were affected and no one went apeshit. If anyone had used that as a window to start a revolution, it would have been ten times easier for the military to stamp it out since they have mobile power generation and virtually no one else does.

This idea of cutting power lines in order to restore Constitutional law is quite retarded.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 30992272


But it's much much more than just cutting power lines. If you read OP's entire post, you will see he made reference to other acts of providing chaos which in turn would make all people forced to choose between those causing chaos or the inept government unable to stop it. Once again Vietnam is an excellent case study.
 Quoting: Evil Cretin


What they are talking about is systems disruption. It isnot directed at the people but at government.

Throw a thousand monkey wrenches into their little control, surveillance, tax, regulatory,filing and stamping schemes and they eventually can't function at all.

Add in non compliance on a massive scale and the would be totalitarians are nullified.

A better case study is the IRA after they finally realized bombing soft targets is a VERY bad idea and very counterproductive.

A great many people think the gubmint will fall of it's own weight. Too massive,stupid,expensive,grasping and power mad to survive.

They have already failed in the economic sense.

I would differ with the poster who claims we are the government. That is what people are taught but it's only true to an extent on a very local level. And on the local level there is still corruption, favoritism,graft,nepotism etc.

Bureaucracies exist of and for themselves, not for the people. They feed from the trough and the feeding is good. And they don't want that to be upset.

But it will be because the host can't and won't support this level of parasitism any longer.

Take a look at detroit and California.

Last Edited by s. d. butler on 12/28/2012 03:18 PM
Anonymous Coward
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12/28/2012 02:59 PM
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Re: What ACTUAL revolution in the USA would look like. NOTHING like most here post.
This is your idea of a well thought out senario? Because I can poke some major holes in this.

First of all, my father worked for the government and I volunteered where he worked a few summers as a teen. Let me tell you about government workers: they are the most paranoid, miserable and duplicitous people in the populous and let me tell you something else - I see every company no matter how small starting to resemble the government.

There was a time in the not too distant past where if you were not that ambitious you could get a fairly easy job and live a quiet simple little life without too much stress or bother. This is no longer the case. And the reason for that is because the government has gone ape shit recently and is trying to take utter and complete control of everything.

Another thing that you aren't factoring for is how much mind control is going on. From TV and movies to HAARP and ELF towers the government is doing everything in it's power to keep people sedate right now. I don't know if they have always worked like this and will continue to or not but I recall everyone having a hell of a lot more life in them in the 90's then they do now. But, this is what happens when people loose their morality. Morality is the fabric that keeps society together. If enough people don't follow the rules we all lose and that's the situation we find ourselves in.

There have always been two kinds of people in this world: givers and takers. At some point the takers overcame the givers and now we are in a real shit storm because we are almost out of givers.
Anonymous Coward
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12/28/2012 03:03 PM
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I wonder what percentage of the military and police force would disobey orders because of their sympathies with their fellow countrymen

TPTB have to be aware of this and that's why they will hesitate..could fracture the armed forces and expose cracks and divides that exist in the military like it does in the country...
joe mamma

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12/28/2012 03:04 PM
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Power going out would benefit the uprising. The government uses it as much as we do and they always use it to spy on us. Day one my goal would be to have spies in every major city take down electric plants and then push blame on the government. You need to even out the field a little and no power is a good way to start. Also you would want spies within the military that can give ya heads up on attacks and such. Even in modern warfare a good militia can do alot of damage. Making friends with another nation with some military power could work too. Set a emp over the us to tak out all satilites, and electronic. At this point its a ground gorilla war. Alot of people would die no doubt, but its possible just look at the revolutionary war. The odds were stacked against us then as well.
 Quoting: Anonymousman 11922974



not sure about your idea to cut off power to the civilians - they would turn against you and side with the government.
Anonymous Coward
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12/28/2012 03:05 PM
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Re: What ACTUAL revolution in the USA would look like. NOTHING like most here post.
It really amazes me. People are so far to one side of reality or the other that what I believe would be reality itself is basically seldom represented.

On one hand you have your very hard stance folks that say "from my cold dead hands" and have basically drawn a hard line in the sand over gun issues. They basically envision a "great resistance" where gun owners will go barrel to barrel fighting those coming to confiscate their weapons.

On the other hand you have those that really think disarming themselves and follow citizens is a great idea. Personally I can not understand how someone can think this way given history and what armed governments have done time and time again to their populations, but alas they still think it is a good idea. They believe that people will just "hand over their guns" when it is demanded of them by the federal govt. I suppose they have not been following how successful the govts "War on Drugs" has gone and how everyone "handed over their drugs".

The basic point is there will be people on both sides of the fence. But there will be one thing CERTAIN.... there will still be million of "illegal" firearms on the street and they will still be available to those that decide to use them for a mass act of violence .... just as much a car will be too if they want to use that for a act of mass violence.

Now, the one thing that is not really discussed is those folks that will be SO MAD that they will be ready for a revolution... a serious fight against the fed govt. They will be ready to fight but I don't think it will go down the way a lot of you THINK it will go down.... let me explain.

A group of people (say 50) even armed to the teeth have NO CHANCE of going up against a military unit or even heavily militarized police force with heavy weapons. This would work out just as well as say 50 people with handguns would do against a single tank.... not well. Head to head would NOT be the way I think people would go about taking down the beast.....

In my opinion they would simply collapse everything to the point the beast would be unable to maintain any order and control any longer....

And how do I think they would do this? Well I sat and thought to myself for entertainment purposes that if people were forced into a corner what could they REALLY do to fight back against such a superior force?

Well, for example, what would happen if someone took down say 2 or 3 high tension main power line towers? These things are in the middle of nowhere (not really monitored) and would take out multiple STATES if the correct ones were selected... NO POWER in multiple states = BAD NEWS. This involved no guns, no confronting superior forces... nothing. An in and out in the middle of the night.

I guess what I am getting at is with hundred of thousands of people that I assume will react against what the govt is proposing to do (if not a few million) they could literally overwhelm the system to the point that they would need to do nothing more than thump on the head the very basic and fragile underlying "support structure" (trucking, power, banking, etc) to do enough damage to make it impossible for them to operate.

Do you remember what a shitstorm the "DC Sniper" caused? That was a couple people in a trunk. Can you imagine if the same shit started happening again to people at gas pumps, ATM machines, etc etc. Coupled with power lines coming down and other crazy shit. What about if they started to vaporize gas stations? People stop filling their cars with gas and going to work, school, etc out of fear of going up in a fireball. See my point? AND WERE "ASSAULT WEAPONS" used for any of this? NOPE. Crazy ass people DON'T NEED ASSAULT WEAPONS to do serious damage to society. Remember an IQ test is *NOT* required to run for office. I have listened to a number of Senators and House Reps talk about things and I can tell you they are not sharp enough that they should be working in a sewer plant let along representing people in govt. They just don't GET IT. Think about the house rep that really thought the island of Guam could "capsize". SERIOUSLY? Did you not get it at age, oh say 5, that islands can not tip over?!?!?! The lack of intelligence in D.C. is frightening.

This is what worries me. I am far less concerned about the govts DIRECT action than the side effects INDIRECTLY that would be caused by people fighting back. I really do believe the govt is going to rely way to much on their "technological advantage" and "superior weapons". It does not take technology nor weapons to take down a large bloated INEFFICIENT system that can not operate or make a decision without major effort. Small fast moving groups of people even without weapons I think are going to be a MAJOR thorn in their side.

When people start to live in a State of hell and the govt is not able to help with that pain (because they are basically powerless to what these people will most likely do to them) is when the MAJORITY will turn against their controllers... and that is when they will totally lose control.

People are not complete idiots. I can just not see any group (even the big militia groups) making strategy that would at all involve direct confrontation with the Fed govts assets. Millions of people can not be monitored (and I am not taking Internet BS with monitoring emails and stupid shit -- I am talking out, moving about and doing what they feel need to be done in real life). 50,000 - 250,000 people will have no hope against containing tens of millions.

I wrote this only because I am just basically tired of reading posts by people that say stuff like "You will just puss out and hand over your weapons and be a good slave." To those folks I think you are really missing the picture of what I think will be a more realistic picture of people fighting back.... weapons not even necessary. I think this is a huge point people are missing.

I personally wish both sides would just "wise up" and back down. To the FED GOVT there is NO REASON for you to be going after your own population in the way you are and treating the masses like common criminals. You may think your MSM mouthpiece is working, but it is not. 95% of people I talk to on a daily basis now see through the BS and see what you are doing for face value. Oh BTW, they are basically not happy and most are pissed off. These may not all be people that will directly resist you but I CAN tell you they are certainly not going to HELP YOU. Back off these attacks on the people or I think it will in the end not work out the way you were hoping.

To the people, don't give up. Remember the govt is nothing more than PEOPLE. The govt is you, your neighbors and community. Govt is formed from the BOTTOM UP. Every IRS agent, every TSA agent, every DHS agent, postman, state public works person, code enforcement officer, water treatment plant worker, military men and women, etc etc.... these are all our neighbors. They work and live among us. There is a breaking point when even these folks with have to sit and look into the eyes of their children, wives and husbands and take real stock of what they are doing. What they are doing to their own families and the ones that live around them. A "job" is only a "job" in a functioning environment.

Personally I think we are approaching a point where there are going to be a lot of massive changes. The people have woke and can see what is taking place. What will they do? I think they will do as Americans have for a long time... adapt and deal with the problems at hand. How will they do this? I really don't know but one thing I can be certain of is that they will most likely use tactics and methods that none of us have even thought of.... and that includes the "people" among us that happen to "be employed" by government.

Interesting times ahead, I only hope that for all of us people start to wise up (this means you too govt) and return our country to the once wonderful place it used to be where you could live your life without an environment like depicted in the book 1984. The alternative will be a place I don't think ANY of us want to live -- and once again yes that means for your govt too. :)

Just a rant and some thoughts. Let us all hope that humans, for once, use their brains and find a peaceful solution for all of us that is acceptable to all of us.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 23022509


Nice rant.
acegotflows

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12/28/2012 03:06 PM
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Re: What ACTUAL revolution in the USA would look like. NOTHING like most here post.
I wonder what percentage of the military and police force would disobey orders because of their sympathies with their fellow countrymen

TPTB have to be aware of this and that's why they will hesitate..could fracture the armed forces and expose cracks and divides that exist in the military like it does in the country...
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 31025789


this is why they don't use military and police. They will be the first thrown to the slaughter, but think SLEEPER CELLS, MERCENARIES and invading armies...
"a foundation built on lies is always bound to crumble and those who aren't humble shall tumble to the earth"
Anonymous Coward
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12/28/2012 03:08 PM
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Re: What ACTUAL revolution in the USA would look like. NOTHING like most here post.
Could you imagine...

Suburban Guerrilla Warfare...jeez.

Good post, OP.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 30992870


no one said suburban...only a moran would think that.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 30966780


I did, moran. Stop jumping to conclusions. It was only my own contemplation in light of the logic given in the OP's post. Stop being so fucking hostile.
Anonymous Coward
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12/28/2012 03:09 PM
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Re: What ACTUAL revolution in the USA would look like. NOTHING like most here post.
I wonder what percentage of the military and police force would disobey orders because of their sympathies with their fellow countrymen

TPTB have to be aware of this and that's why they will hesitate..could fracture the armed forces and expose cracks and divides that exist in the military like it does in the country...
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 31025789


This was a huge theme in The Dark Knight, too.
Anonymous Coward
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12/28/2012 03:13 PM
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Re: What ACTUAL revolution in the USA would look like. NOTHING like most here post.
The Clinton administration put in much the same gun control legislation as is being proposed currently, in 1994... and nothing happened, life just went on as usual.

whatever
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 25007705


We didn't have the internet and communication as we know it then.
s. d. butler

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12/28/2012 03:20 PM
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Re: What ACTUAL revolution in the USA would look like. NOTHING like most here post.
Power going out would benefit the uprising. The government uses it as much as we do and they always use it to spy on us. Day one my goal would be to have spies in every major city take down electric plants and then push blame on the government. You need to even out the field a little and no power is a good way to start. Also you would want spies within the military that can give ya heads up on attacks and such. Even in modern warfare a good militia can do alot of damage. Making friends with another nation with some military power could work too. Set a emp over the us to tak out all satilites, and electronic. At this point its a ground gorilla war. Alot of people would die no doubt, but its possible just look at the revolutionary war. The odds were stacked against us then as well.
 Quoting: Anonymousman 11922974



not sure about your idea to cut off power to the civilians - they would turn against you and side with the government.
 Quoting: joe mamma


The poster only has a partial understanding of 4 GW.
ohnonotagain
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12/28/2012 03:23 PM

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Re: What ACTUAL revolution in the USA would look like. NOTHING like most here post.
For the past 25 years TPTB have been increasing the size of police every where. From the City to the Sticks. I live in Northern Michigan, the increase here has been mind blowing. I have no idea how it's paid for? We don't have the base to support it.

Not to mention, the style of uniforms have gone to a military type look, why? And their weapons are military grade, why? Training is military type tactics, why?

The town I live in has a population of approx 300...if say a fire fight started at 1pm....at 1:30pm they'd have over 100+ on the scene, by 2pm, 200+ if needed, locked & loaded.

The fact is, they've conditioned the police to act now, think later. They debrief them afterwards, which enforces their belief they did the right thing.

Military has the same training, it's all in the details of the orders received. Rebels against the US have taken control of said area, we need to put them down.

No brothers, we'll be fighting Police & US Soldiers, at least in the beginning. Prepare and accept this fact.

There is a way to do this without a single act of violence. But, it would require at least 80% of the people to comply. Which sadly, they wouldn't. So, in light of that sad fact, be prepared for the worst.

Last Edited by Dog Wayne on 12/28/2012 03:31 PM
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Beathan

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12/28/2012 03:25 PM
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Re: What ACTUAL revolution in the USA would look like. NOTHING like most here post.
Problem-Reaction-Solution
acegotflows

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12/28/2012 03:30 PM
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Re: What ACTUAL revolution in the USA would look like. NOTHING like most here post.
we live in the new order of the barbarians. All of this is scripted


"a foundation built on lies is always bound to crumble and those who aren't humble shall tumble to the earth"
TheCartel

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12/28/2012 03:30 PM
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Re: What ACTUAL revolution in the USA would look like. NOTHING like most here post.
Bloody
Alot of folks might not like to entertain this idea, but we need an alliance with our friends south of the border. Thoughts?

We the people can win, but with the advancements of the military industrial complex having weapons we do not know about..it might take a supernatural miracle
Anonymous Coward
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12/28/2012 03:32 PM
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Re: What ACTUAL revolution in the USA would look like. NOTHING like most here post.
For the past 25 years TPTB have been increasing the size of police every where. From the City to the Sticks. I live in Northern Michigan, the increase here has been mind blowing. I have no idea how it's paid for? We don't have the base to support it.

Not to mention, the style of uniforms have gone to a military type look, why? And their weapons are military grade, why? Training is military type tactics, why?

The town I live in has a population of approx 300...if say a fire fight started at 1pm....at 1:30pm they'd have over 100+ on the scene, by 2pm, 200+ if needed, locked & loaded.

The fact is, they've conditioned the police to act now, think later. They debrief them afterwards, which enforces their belief they did the right thing.

Military has the same training, it's all in the details of the orders received. Rebels against the US have taken control of said area, we need to put them down.

No brothers, we'll be fighting Police & US Soldiers, at least in the beginning. Prepare and accept this fact.

There is a way to do this without firing a single act of violence. But, it would require at least 80% of the people to comply. Which sadly, they wouldn't. So, in light of that sad fact, be prepared for the worst.
 Quoting: ohnonotagain




The many disenfranchised veterens coming back from war could sway them... They have the same training they understand a soldiers duty and their experience and opinions could sway many

I still think that if TPTB push the agenda to the limit..lthere would be fractures in the military there is your true catalyst for revolt/civil war...

A lot of pissed out soldiers/veterans out there.
moses767

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12/28/2012 03:34 PM
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Re: What ACTUAL revolution in the USA would look like. NOTHING like most here post.
Great speech AC230!! But know one thing; it will only happen like the Holy Bible says that it will happen. And according to my researching and reading the Holy Bible about 20 times from cover to cover in 38 years; the antichrist beast system wins and tries to force everybody to take their mark of the beast chip in their foreheads or their right hands. And if you don't take it, they will throw you into a FEMA camp or kill or martyre you.

And if you take their zombie making and mind controlling beast chip; God will reject you forever and throw you into the great lake of fire and brimstone!! Why? Because according to Revelation 13 & 14:9-11 (wink) it will mean that you have accepted and taken Satan and his antichrist beast man as your lord and god!! And God will make sure that your punishment will be 24/7, and forever and ever!!
NawtyBits

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Re: What ACTUAL revolution in the USA would look like. NOTHING like most here post.
Just a rant and some thoughts. Let us all hope that humans, for once, use their brains and find a peaceful solution for all of us that is acceptable to all of us.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 23022509


There is a peaceful solution until such a time there isn't.
I think, therefore I am. I think.
acegotflows

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12/28/2012 03:36 PM
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Re: What ACTUAL revolution in the USA would look like. NOTHING like most here post.
if they are grabbing guns and such, do you really think that they will use the gun technology that we know to fight against us? nope, they have better stuff, including sound and energy weapons. They want to transform the way war is fought-urban warfare. Guns are not practical in this type of war. If they cannot have the numbers to win it, they will just activate all the tech that is in all of our computers and scalar stuff to shut us down frequency wise. They already do it, just not to a complete disable...
"a foundation built on lies is always bound to crumble and those who aren't humble shall tumble to the earth"
Dr. Lecter

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Re: What ACTUAL revolution in the USA would look like. NOTHING like most here post.
For the past 25 years TPTB have been increasing the size of police every where. From the City to the Sticks. I live in Northern Michigan, the increase here has been mind blowing. I have no idea how it's paid for? We don't have the base to support it.

Not to mention, the style of uniforms have gone to a military type look, why? And their weapons are military grade, why? Training is military type tactics, why?

The town I live in has a population of approx 300...if say a fire fight started at 1pm....at 1:30pm they'd have over 100+ on the scene, by 2pm, 200+ if needed, locked & loaded.

The fact is, they've conditioned the police to act now, think later. They debrief them afterwards, which enforces their belief they did the right thing.

Military has the same training, it's all in the details of the orders received. Rebels against the US have taken control of said area, we need to put them down.

No brothers, we'll be fighting Police & US Soldiers, at least in the beginning. Prepare and accept this fact.

There is a way to do this without a single act of violence. But, it would require at least 80% of the people to comply. Which sadly, they wouldn't. So, in light of that sad fact, be prepared for the worst.
 Quoting: ohnonotagain


i come from a military family. i was in the military myself. my profession cause me to interact with mostly military, law enforcement, border patrol, ATF, DEA and DHS people.

Trust me on this one: half of them simply will not play the fed's game.
Liberal Logic - Demanding that the government stay out of their bedrooms while insisting on taxpayer funded birth control.
TheCartel

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Re: What ACTUAL revolution in the USA would look like. NOTHING like most here post.
For the past 25 years TPTB have been increasing the size of police every where. From the City to the Sticks. I live in Northern Michigan, the increase here has been mind blowing. I have no idea how it's paid for? We don't have the base to support it.

Not to mention, the style of uniforms have gone to a military type look, why? And their weapons are military grade, why? Training is military type tactics, why?

The town I live in has a population of approx 300...if say a fire fight started at 1pm....at 1:30pm they'd have over 100+ on the scene, by 2pm, 200+ if needed, locked & loaded.

The fact is, they've conditioned the police to act now, think later. They debrief them afterwards, which enforces their belief they did the right thing.

Military has the same training, it's all in the details of the orders received. Rebels against the US have taken control of said area, we need to put them down.

No brothers, we'll be fighting Police & US Soldiers, at least in the beginning. Prepare and accept this fact.

There is a way to do this without firing a single act of violence. But, it would require at least 80% of the people to comply. Which sadly, they wouldn't. So, in light of that sad fact, be prepared for the worst.
 Quoting: ohnonotagain




The many disenfranchised veterens coming back from war could sway them... They have the same training they understand a soldiers duty and their experience and opinions could sway many

I still think that if TPTB push the agenda to the limit..lthere would be fractures in the military there is your true catalyst for revolt/civil war...

A lot of pissed out soldiers/veterans out there.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 31025789
Evil Cretin

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Re: What ACTUAL revolution in the USA would look like. NOTHING like most here post.
For the past 25 years TPTB have been increasing the size of police every where. From the City to the Sticks. I live in Northern Michigan, the increase here has been mind blowing. I have no idea how it's paid for? We don't have the base to support it.

Not to mention, the style of uniforms have gone to a military type look, why? And their weapons are military grade, why? Training is military type tactics, why?

The town I live in has a population of approx 300...if say a fire fight started at 1pm....at 1:30pm they'd have over 100+ on the scene, by 2pm, 200+ if needed, locked & loaded.

The fact is, they've conditioned the police to act now, think later. They debrief them afterwards, which enforces their belief they did the right thing.

Military has the same training, it's all in the details of the orders received. Rebels against the US have taken control of said area, we need to put them down.

No brothers, we'll be fighting Police & US Soldiers, at least in the beginning. Prepare and accept this fact.

There is a way to do this without a single act of violence. But, it would require at least 80% of the people to comply. Which sadly, they wouldn't. So, in light of that sad fact, be prepared for the worst.
 Quoting: ohnonotagain


I agree that IN THE BEGINNING it would be rebels vs police/military. It would be important for TPTB to frame the conflicts as gun loonies trying to overthrow the government as they did in Waco, Ruby Ridge, etc. This way they keep the vast majority of citizens unfazed and unwilling to join the rebellion. But at some point as things escalate more and more people wouls see what was happening and join in the fray in those non-shooting ways that have been discussed.
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Re: What ACTUAL revolution in the USA would look like. NOTHING like most here post.
They will control the food supply and will force people to queue for at least half the day for sufficient food. When the people are starving they will not support revolution. The only possible way it could succeed is if by some magic more than 50% of all armed forces (police, military, state guards) joined the people. And that is unlikely to happen because the price of the privilege of being armed and trained is obedience to orders. Then there is the problem of money. Money is issued by central federal authority and presumably revolution would be against that central authority. If someone were planning such a thing they would have to think through an awful lot of logistics as well as how they were going to hide from the war machines that will be set on them. I do not think that someone who has not already been involved can imagine how strongly bureaucracies want to cling to their power. Anyone who has been involved in such as this will not want to be involved ever again.
 Quoting: Prostetnik


I wouldn't doubt that plans like this exist. 300 million plus people. I wouldn't doubt that many plans like this exist including recruiting the military and police en masse.

Look at what happened in places like Romania. Central power can come down very rapidly. Just as much chance as that happening as people queuing up at WalMart to be taken to the camps.

Perhaps that's why the plug hasn't been pulled? Pulling the plug lets out all the black swans.

Begs the question, is their even a central authority to pull the plug? Personally I think this is a dead hand system and no one is really in charge at all.
ohnonotagain
My Bite is Worse than my Bark

User ID: 30684538
United States
12/28/2012 03:57 PM

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Re: What ACTUAL revolution in the USA would look like. NOTHING like most here post.
For the past 25 years TPTB have been increasing the size of police every where. From the City to the Sticks. I live in Northern Michigan, the increase here has been mind blowing. I have no idea how it's paid for? We don't have the base to support it.

Not to mention, the style of uniforms have gone to a military type look, why? And their weapons are military grade, why? Training is military type tactics, why?

The town I live in has a population of approx 300...if say a fire fight started at 1pm....at 1:30pm they'd have over 100+ on the scene, by 2pm, 200+ if needed, locked & loaded.

The fact is, they've conditioned the police to act now, think later. They debrief them afterwards, which enforces their belief they did the right thing.

Military has the same training, it's all in the details of the orders received. Rebels against the US have taken control of said area, we need to put them down.

No brothers, we'll be fighting Police & US Soldiers, at least in the beginning. Prepare and accept this fact.

There is a way to do this without a single act of violence. But, it would require at least 80% of the people to comply. Which sadly, they wouldn't. So, in light of that sad fact, be prepared for the worst.
 Quoting: ohnonotagain


i come from a military family. i was in the military myself. my profession cause me to interact with mostly military, law enforcement, border patrol, ATF, DEA and DHS people.

Trust me on this one: half of them simply will not play the fed's game.
 Quoting: Dr. Lecter


I also have a Military background. I always believed this to be true, as I felt the same. But, they're sure complying now. With the Police, we've seen it on TV with peaceful protesters. The Military went door to door after Katrina taking guns, I was there and witnessed it. That was when I changed my thinking!

No, most at first, will comply with orders. After they actually kill a few of their fellow citizens, they just may have a change of heart.

But, I reserve the right to hope that what you say is true. I really don't treasure the thought of looking down my barrel at one of our own!

Last Edited by Dog Wayne on 12/28/2012 04:04 PM
Dogs are People To!

"The Tree of Liberty is Thirsty and needs Watering"

-Me
Dr. Suits
User ID: 31012657
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12/28/2012 04:39 PM
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Re: What ACTUAL revolution in the USA would look like. NOTHING like most here post.
As far as monitoring is concerned everyone has willingly attached a tracking device to themselves in the form of a "smart phone". I'm the only person I know that has never and will never own one. Connected to a computer data center everyone's movements are already tracked 100% even if the phone is "off". They can also activate the microphone and camera anytime they want. The vast majority of people have now given the government every single bit of personal info they ever could in the form of every friend and associate, all their personal interests, access to all their personal photos and videos, through Facebook especially.

They don't need to have 250,000 monitoring millions. Computers are doing it, storing it all. Even if they don't have the capacity to analyze the data it is still being stored indefinitely. Kids being born will have their entire lives documented from cradle to grave. Everyone they knew, every success and mistake, every movement on the Earth, every interest, etc.

And everyone, including everyone on this except myself and MAYBE on this forum a few others, is complying willingly.

Who else here has never and will never own a mobile phone or use social media?
IvantZtrooth

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12/28/2012 04:53 PM
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Re: What ACTUAL revolution in the USA would look like. NOTHING like most here post.
Most ordinary ninja were villagers and farmers, who learned to fight by any means necessary for their own self-preservation. So the age of the ninja returns...excellent :)
acegotflows

User ID: 28872932
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12/28/2012 04:55 PM
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Re: What ACTUAL revolution in the USA would look like. NOTHING like most here post.
As far as monitoring is concerned everyone has willingly attached a tracking device to themselves in the form of a "smart phone". I'm the only person I know that has never and will never own one. Connected to a computer data center everyone's movements are already tracked 100% even if the phone is "off". They can also activate the microphone and camera anytime they want. The vast majority of people have now given the government every single bit of personal info they ever could in the form of every friend and associate, all their personal interests, access to all their personal photos and videos, through Facebook especially.

They don't need to have 250,000 monitoring millions. Computers are doing it, storing it all. Even if they don't have the capacity to analyze the data it is still being stored indefinitely. Kids being born will have their entire lives documented from cradle to grave. Everyone they knew, every success and mistake, every movement on the Earth, every interest, etc.

And everyone, including everyone on this except myself and MAYBE on this forum a few others, is complying willingly.

Who else here has never and will never own a mobile phone or use social media?
 Quoting: Dr. Suits 31012657


there are only few people that aren't systematically spied on between finances and devices. This is why those people who don't live in cities those that grow their own foods and such are demonized. Because they are less tracked and regulated. The whole gun grabbing thing is targeting them, not city dwellers...
"a foundation built on lies is always bound to crumble and those who aren't humble shall tumble to the earth"
Anonymous Coward
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12/28/2012 05:04 PM
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Re: What ACTUAL revolution in the USA would look like. NOTHING like most here post.
It really amazes me. People are so far to one side of reality or the other that what I believe would be reality itself is basically seldom represented.

On one hand you have your very hard stance folks that say "from my cold dead hands" and have basically drawn a hard line in the sand over gun issues. They basically envision a "great resistance" where gun owners will go barrel to barrel fighting those coming to confiscate their weapons.

On the other hand you have those that really think disarming themselves and follow citizens is a great idea. Personally I can not understand how someone can think this way given history and what armed governments have done time and time again to their populations, but alas they still think it is a good idea. They believe that people will just "hand over their guns" when it is demanded of them by the federal govt. I suppose they have not been following how successful the govts "War on Drugs" has gone and how everyone "handed over their drugs".

The basic point is there will be people on both sides of the fence. But there will be one thing CERTAIN.... there will still be million of "illegal" firearms on the street and they will still be available to those that decide to use them for a mass act of violence .... just as much a car will be too if they want to use that for a act of mass violence.

Now, the one thing that is not really discussed is those folks that will be SO MAD that they will be ready for a revolution... a serious fight against the fed govt. They will be ready to fight but I don't think it will go down the way a lot of you THINK it will go down.... let me explain.

A group of people (say 50) even armed to the teeth have NO CHANCE of going up against a military unit or even heavily militarized police force with heavy weapons. This would work out just as well as say 50 people with handguns would do against a single tank.... not well. Head to head would NOT be the way I think people would go about taking down the beast.....

In my opinion they would simply collapse everything to the point the beast would be unable to maintain any order and control any longer....

And how do I think they would do this? Well I sat and thought to myself for entertainment purposes that if people were forced into a corner what could they REALLY do to fight back against such a superior force?

Well, for example, what would happen if someone took down say 2 or 3 high tension main power line towers? These things are in the middle of nowhere (not really monitored) and would take out multiple STATES if the correct ones were selected... NO POWER in multiple states = BAD NEWS. This involved no guns, no confronting superior forces... nothing. An in and out in the middle of the night.

I guess what I am getting at is with hundred of thousands of people that I assume will react against what the govt is proposing to do (if not a few million) they could literally overwhelm the system to the point that they would need to do nothing more than thump on the head the very basic and fragile underlying "support structure" (trucking, power, banking, etc) to do enough damage to make it impossible for them to operate.

Do you remember what a shitstorm the "DC Sniper" caused? That was a couple people in a trunk. Can you imagine if the same shit started happening again to people at gas pumps, ATM machines, etc etc. Coupled with power lines coming down and other crazy shit. What about if they started to vaporize gas stations? People stop filling their cars with gas and going to work, school, etc out of fear of going up in a fireball. See my point? AND WERE "ASSAULT WEAPONS" used for any of this? NOPE. Crazy ass people DON'T NEED ASSAULT WEAPONS to do serious damage to society. Remember an IQ test is *NOT* required to run for office. I have listened to a number of Senators and House Reps talk about things and I can tell you they are not sharp enough that they should be working in a sewer plant let along representing people in govt. They just don't GET IT. Think about the house rep that really thought the island of Guam could "capsize". SERIOUSLY? Did you not get it at age, oh say 5, that islands can not tip over?!?!?! The lack of intelligence in D.C. is frightening.

This is what worries me. I am far less concerned about the govts DIRECT action than the side effects INDIRECTLY that would be caused by people fighting back. I really do believe the govt is going to rely way to much on their "technological advantage" and "superior weapons". It does not take technology nor weapons to take down a large bloated INEFFICIENT system that can not operate or make a decision without major effort. Small fast moving groups of people even without weapons I think are going to be a MAJOR thorn in their side.

When people start to live in a State of hell and the govt is not able to help with that pain (because they are basically powerless to what these people will most likely do to them) is when the MAJORITY will turn against their controllers... and that is when they will totally lose control.

People are not complete idiots. I can just not see any group (even the big militia groups) making strategy that would at all involve direct confrontation with the Fed govts assets. Millions of people can not be monitored (and I am not taking Internet BS with monitoring emails and stupid shit -- I am talking out, moving about and doing what they feel need to be done in real life). 50,000 - 250,000 people will have no hope against containing tens of millions.

I wrote this only because I am just basically tired of reading posts by people that say stuff like "You will just puss out and hand over your weapons and be a good slave." To those folks I think you are really missing the picture of what I think will be a more realistic picture of people fighting back.... weapons not even necessary. I think this is a huge point people are missing.

I personally wish both sides would just "wise up" and back down. To the FED GOVT there is NO REASON for you to be going after your own population in the way you are and treating the masses like common criminals. You may think your MSM mouthpiece is working, but it is not. 95% of people I talk to on a daily basis now see through the BS and see what you are doing for face value. Oh BTW, they are basically not happy and most are pissed off. These may not all be people that will directly resist you but I CAN tell you they are certainly not going to HELP YOU. Back off these attacks on the people or I think it will in the end not work out the way you were hoping.

To the people, don't give up. Remember the govt is nothing more than PEOPLE. The govt is you, your neighbors and community. Govt is formed from the BOTTOM UP. Every IRS agent, every TSA agent, every DHS agent, postman, state public works person, code enforcement officer, water treatment plant worker, military men and women, etc etc.... these are all our neighbors. They work and live among us. There is a breaking point when even these folks with have to sit and look into the eyes of their children, wives and husbands and take real stock of what they are doing. What they are doing to their own families and the ones that live around them. A "job" is only a "job" in a functioning environment.

Personally I think we are approaching a point where there are going to be a lot of massive changes. The people have woke and can see what is taking place. What will they do? I think they will do as Americans have for a long time... adapt and deal with the problems at hand. How will they do this? I really don't know but one thing I can be certain of is that they will most likely use tactics and methods that none of us have even thought of.... and that includes the "people" among us that happen to "be employed" by government.

Interesting times ahead, I only hope that for all of us people start to wise up (this means you too govt) and return our country to the once wonderful place it used to be where you could live your life without an environment like depicted in the book 1984. The alternative will be a place I don't think ANY of us want to live -- and once again yes that means for your govt too. :)

Just a rant and some thoughts. Let us all hope that humans, for once, use their brains and find a peaceful solution for all of us that is acceptable to all of us.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 23022509


I agree wholeheartedly with your assessment. I would like to add another thought. Many people on this forum are familiar with the book "1984". I was fortunate enough to have been forced to read that and "Animal Farm" in my senior year of high school. I don't see many people considering the animal farm aspect of the situation after a hypothetical rebellion.
 Quoting: Evil Cretin


I agree. Thank you for your post, and its positive message of hope.

Many naysayers here bringing up racism. If this scenario ever happens, remember, united we stand. It will take all of us cooperating with each other.

Many naysayers here bringing up fear of breadlines, lack of food, lack of power. Again, united we stand. We help each other to the best of our abilities. We share our resources, something our government has never done.

Many naysayers here bringing up how to ideas in OP's post can't work. Well, they won't, for you. You wall be one of the first to fall. Those that cooperate and work with each other, looking for positive, unique solutions, will be the ones left standing.
acegotflows

User ID: 28872932
United States
12/28/2012 05:11 PM
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Re: What ACTUAL revolution in the USA would look like. NOTHING like most here post.
It really amazes me. People are so far to one side of reality or the other that what I believe would be reality itself is basically seldom represented.

On one hand you have your very hard stance folks that say "from my cold dead hands" and have basically drawn a hard line in the sand over gun issues. They basically envision a "great resistance" where gun owners will go barrel to barrel fighting those coming to confiscate their weapons.

On the other hand you have those that really think disarming themselves and follow citizens is a great idea. Personally I can not understand how someone can think this way given history and what armed governments have done time and time again to their populations, but alas they still think it is a good idea. They believe that people will just "hand over their guns" when it is demanded of them by the federal govt. I suppose they have not been following how successful the govts "War on Drugs" has gone and how everyone "handed over their drugs".

The basic point is there will be people on both sides of the fence. But there will be one thing CERTAIN.... there will still be million of "illegal" firearms on the street and they will still be available to those that decide to use them for a mass act of violence .... just as much a car will be too if they want to use that for a act of mass violence.

Now, the one thing that is not really discussed is those folks that will be SO MAD that they will be ready for a revolution... a serious fight against the fed govt. They will be ready to fight but I don't think it will go down the way a lot of you THINK it will go down.... let me explain.

A group of people (say 50) even armed to the teeth have NO CHANCE of going up against a military unit or even heavily militarized police force with heavy weapons. This would work out just as well as say 50 people with handguns would do against a single tank.... not well. Head to head would NOT be the way I think people would go about taking down the beast.....

In my opinion they would simply collapse everything to the point the beast would be unable to maintain any order and control any longer....

And how do I think they would do this? Well I sat and thought to myself for entertainment purposes that if people were forced into a corner what could they REALLY do to fight back against such a superior force?

Well, for example, what would happen if someone took down say 2 or 3 high tension main power line towers? These things are in the middle of nowhere (not really monitored) and would take out multiple STATES if the correct ones were selected... NO POWER in multiple states = BAD NEWS. This involved no guns, no confronting superior forces... nothing. An in and out in the middle of the night.

I guess what I am getting at is with hundred of thousands of people that I assume will react against what the govt is proposing to do (if not a few million) they could literally overwhelm the system to the point that they would need to do nothing more than thump on the head the very basic and fragile underlying "support structure" (trucking, power, banking, etc) to do enough damage to make it impossible for them to operate.

Do you remember what a shitstorm the "DC Sniper" caused? That was a couple people in a trunk. Can you imagine if the same shit started happening again to people at gas pumps, ATM machines, etc etc. Coupled with power lines coming down and other crazy shit. What about if they started to vaporize gas stations? People stop filling their cars with gas and going to work, school, etc out of fear of going up in a fireball. See my point? AND WERE "ASSAULT WEAPONS" used for any of this? NOPE. Crazy ass people DON'T NEED ASSAULT WEAPONS to do serious damage to society. Remember an IQ test is *NOT* required to run for office. I have listened to a number of Senators and House Reps talk about things and I can tell you they are not sharp enough that they should be working in a sewer plant let along representing people in govt. They just don't GET IT. Think about the house rep that really thought the island of Guam could "capsize". SERIOUSLY? Did you not get it at age, oh say 5, that islands can not tip over?!?!?! The lack of intelligence in D.C. is frightening.

This is what worries me. I am far less concerned about the govts DIRECT action than the side effects INDIRECTLY that would be caused by people fighting back. I really do believe the govt is going to rely way to much on their "technological advantage" and "superior weapons". It does not take technology nor weapons to take down a large bloated INEFFICIENT system that can not operate or make a decision without major effort. Small fast moving groups of people even without weapons I think are going to be a MAJOR thorn in their side.

When people start to live in a State of hell and the govt is not able to help with that pain (because they are basically powerless to what these people will most likely do to them) is when the MAJORITY will turn against their controllers... and that is when they will totally lose control.

People are not complete idiots. I can just not see any group (even the big militia groups) making strategy that would at all involve direct confrontation with the Fed govts assets. Millions of people can not be monitored (and I am not taking Internet BS with monitoring emails and stupid shit -- I am talking out, moving about and doing what they feel need to be done in real life). 50,000 - 250,000 people will have no hope against containing tens of millions.

I wrote this only because I am just basically tired of reading posts by people that say stuff like "You will just puss out and hand over your weapons and be a good slave." To those folks I think you are really missing the picture of what I think will be a more realistic picture of people fighting back.... weapons not even necessary. I think this is a huge point people are missing.

I personally wish both sides would just "wise up" and back down. To the FED GOVT there is NO REASON for you to be going after your own population in the way you are and treating the masses like common criminals. You may think your MSM mouthpiece is working, but it is not. 95% of people I talk to on a daily basis now see through the BS and see what you are doing for face value. Oh BTW, they are basically not happy and most are pissed off. These may not all be people that will directly resist you but I CAN tell you they are certainly not going to HELP YOU. Back off these attacks on the people or I think it will in the end not work out the way you were hoping.

To the people, don't give up. Remember the govt is nothing more than PEOPLE. The govt is you, your neighbors and community. Govt is formed from the BOTTOM UP. Every IRS agent, every TSA agent, every DHS agent, postman, state public works person, code enforcement officer, water treatment plant worker, military men and women, etc etc.... these are all our neighbors. They work and live among us. There is a breaking point when even these folks with have to sit and look into the eyes of their children, wives and husbands and take real stock of what they are doing. What they are doing to their own families and the ones that live around them. A "job" is only a "job" in a functioning environment.

Personally I think we are approaching a point where there are going to be a lot of massive changes. The people have woke and can see what is taking place. What will they do? I think they will do as Americans have for a long time... adapt and deal with the problems at hand. How will they do this? I really don't know but one thing I can be certain of is that they will most likely use tactics and methods that none of us have even thought of.... and that includes the "people" among us that happen to "be employed" by government.

Interesting times ahead, I only hope that for all of us people start to wise up (this means you too govt) and return our country to the once wonderful place it used to be where you could live your life without an environment like depicted in the book 1984. The alternative will be a place I don't think ANY of us want to live -- and once again yes that means for your govt too. :)

Just a rant and some thoughts. Let us all hope that humans, for once, use their brains and find a peaceful solution for all of us that is acceptable to all of us.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 23022509


I agree wholeheartedly with your assessment. I would like to add another thought. Many people on this forum are familiar with the book "1984". I was fortunate enough to have been forced to read that and "Animal Farm" in my senior year of high school. I don't see many people considering the animal farm aspect of the situation after a hypothetical rebellion.
 Quoting: Evil Cretin


I agree. Thank you for your post, and its positive message of hope.

Many naysayers here bringing up racism. If this scenario ever happens, remember, united we stand. It will take all of us cooperating with each other.

Many naysayers here bringing up fear of breadlines, lack of food, lack of power. Again, united we stand. We help each other to the best of our abilities. We share our resources, something our government has never done.

Many naysayers here bringing up how to ideas in OP's post can't work. Well, they won't, for you. You wall be one of the first to fall. Those that cooperate and work with each other, looking for positive, unique solutions, will be the ones left standing.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 31033255


bullets know no race. We have to stop looking at things that make us different and work on what makes us the same...
"a foundation built on lies is always bound to crumble and those who aren't humble shall tumble to the earth"
SE7EN
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12/28/2012 05:17 PM
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Re: What ACTUAL revolution in the USA would look like. NOTHING like most here post.
You forget what the Vietnamese did.

They took out tanks by digging pits etc.

And tunnels.
Anonymous Coward
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12/28/2012 05:17 PM
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Re: What ACTUAL revolution in the USA would look like. NOTHING like most here post.
As far as monitoring is concerned everyone has willingly attached a tracking device to themselves in the form of a "smart phone". I'm the only person I know that has never and will never own one. Connected to a computer data center everyone's movements are already tracked 100% even if the phone is "off". They can also activate the microphone and camera anytime they want. The vast majority of people have now given the government every single bit of personal info they ever could in the form of every friend and associate, all their personal interests, access to all their personal photos and videos, through Facebook especially.

They don't need to have 250,000 monitoring millions. Computers are doing it, storing it all. Even if they don't have the capacity to analyze the data it is still being stored indefinitely. Kids being born will have their entire lives documented from cradle to grave. Everyone they knew, every success and mistake, every movement on the Earth, every interest, etc.

And everyone, including everyone on this except myself and MAYBE on this forum a few others, is complying willingly.

Who else here has never and will never own a mobile phone or use social media?
 Quoting: Dr. Suits 31012657


there are only few people that aren't systematically spied on between finances and devices. This is why those people who don't live in cities those that grow their own foods and such are demonized. Because they are less tracked and regulated. The whole gun grabbing thing is targeting them, not city dwellers...
 Quoting: acegotflows


I think they want everyone's guns not just non-city dwellers. They certainly do want to make sure nobody has an self-sufficiency. When they started arresting people for having gardens at their home that's when people should have lost their shit.

They do rely heavily on pejoratives to make "city folk" feel better about themselves. They regularly refer to non-city dwellers as nuts, hicks, neo-nazis, etc. Everyone in the country is just a big dumb retard with guns waiting to rape and kill all the city folk.

In actuality the country is where you find real patriots, self-sufficient people who aren't hung up on so much bullshit and propaganda as the city-zombies.

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