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Do Christians and Jews worship the same God?

 
ru1im2
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01/06/2013 01:03 AM
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Do Christians and Jews worship the same God?
I've asked many Christians this question and almost universally they say, yes.

But when I remind them that Jesus Christ claimed to be God in the flesh, and that Jews deny this, they stammer a little and say something about both worship the God of Abraham, Isaac and Jacob.

But isn't Jesus Christ the God of Abraham, Isaac and Jacob?

And if not, who is Jesus according to these Christians?

Jews deny that they worship the same God as the Christians by the way.
pi

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01/06/2013 01:06 AM
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Re: Do Christians and Jews worship the same God?
I've asked many Christians this question and almost universally they say, yes.

But when I remind them that Jesus Christ claimed to be God in the flesh, and that Jews deny this, they stammer a little and say something about both worship the God of Abraham, Isaac and Jacob.

But isn't Jesus Christ the God of Abraham, Isaac and Jacob?

And if not, who is Jesus according to these Christians?

Jews deny that they worship the same God as the Christians by the way.
 Quoting: ru1im2


Italics: not the same as GoD above.

Underlined: no.

Bold: they do?
IamOrthodox

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01/06/2013 01:09 AM
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Re: Do Christians and Jews worship the same God?
Yes........Christ is the Messiah for Christians but Jews do not believe He is........ the God is the same though!
IamOrthodox
John16:33
Don'tBeAfraid

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01/06/2013 01:11 AM
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Re: Do Christians and Jews worship the same God?
I think you're leading up to Marcionism and the Demiurge.

See:
[link to en.wikipedia.org]

It's considered to be a very old heresy.
pi

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01/06/2013 01:12 AM
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Re: Do Christians and Jews worship the same God?
Yes........Christ is the Messiah for Christians but Jews do not believe He is........ the God is the same though!
 Quoting: IamOrthodox


Are you Jewish? What are the Jew's views on Christ exactly? By the way I am impartial to faith.
ru1im2 (OP)

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01/06/2013 01:12 AM
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Re: Do Christians and Jews worship the same God?
Yes........Christ is the Messiah for Christians but Jews do not believe He is........ the God is the same though!
 Quoting: IamOrthodox


So I can believe in God without Jesus Christ and still believe in the true God?
Ozi dude
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01/06/2013 01:18 AM
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Re: Do Christians and Jews worship the same God?
That is a question that has plagued me for many years. I have studied both testaments over time though i am not that religious. The answer I have come to is NO. The god of the old test. is nasty yet jesus preaches love and peace. In short there are many contradictions of that sort in the bible and I cant see how the laws of the old test. are from the same God that gave us Jesus.
ru1im2 (OP)

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Re: Do Christians and Jews worship the same God?
Yes........Christ is the Messiah for Christians but Jews do not believe He is........ the God is the same though!
 Quoting: IamOrthodox


So I can believe in God without Jesus Christ and still believe in the true God?
 Quoting: ru1im2


Or are you saying that they both believe in a false god?

I'm a little confused.
ru1im2 (OP)

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01/06/2013 01:25 AM
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Re: Do Christians and Jews worship the same God?
I think you're leading up to Marcionism and the Demiurge.

See:
[link to en.wikipedia.org]

It's considered to be a very old heresy.
 Quoting: Don'tBeAfraid


No, that's not quite what I'm saying.

It seems that Christians are saying that Jesus Christ is not God, and that seems contrary to what Jesus and Paul were quoted as saying in the Bible.

JOHN 10:30

I and my Father are one.


Last Edited by RU1IM2 on 01/06/2013 01:30 AM
ru1im2 (OP)

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01/06/2013 01:31 AM
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Re: Do Christians and Jews worship the same God?
I think you're leading up to Marcionism and the Demiurge.
See:
[link to en.wikipedia.org]
It's considered to be a very old heresy.
 Quoting: Don'tBeAfraid


No, that's not quite what I'm saying.

It seems that Christians are saying that Jesus Christ is not God, and that seems contrary to what Jesus and Paul were quoted as saying in the Bible.

JOHN 10:30

I and my Father are one.

 Quoting: ru1im2
Anonymous Coward
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01/06/2013 01:48 AM
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Re: Do Christians and Jews worship the same God?
That is a question that has plagued me for many years. I have studied both testaments over time though i am not that religious. The answer I have come to is NO. The god of the old test. is nasty yet jesus preaches love and peace. In short there are many contradictions of that sort in the bible and I cant see how the laws of the old test. are from the same God that gave us Jesus.
 Quoting: Ozi dude 31537915


Give me some examples please.

The God is the same. God 'adopted' in a sense a group of wayward people, the Jews. In my opinion, he had to 'grow them up' should I say?

In Scriptures the Jews would say Moses allowed them to divorce their wives. Jesus answered them that it was only allowed because of the hardness of their hearts but it was not meant to be that way from the beginning.

Then, they objected to His healing on the Sabbath saying that no one was allowed to do any work. He answered them this way,

Matthew 12:11 He said to them, “Which one of you who has a sheep, if it falls into a pit on the Sabbath, will not take hold of it and lift it out? Of how much more value is a man than a sheep! So it is lawful to do good on the Sabbath.”

It's evident to me that even though the Jews were extremely strict in their interpretation of God's laws that Jesus was showing them that God didn't want blind obedience but obedience tempered with common sense and mercy and kindness towards others.

In the Old Testament, even David and his men when they were hungry weren't condemned by God for eating the food that was only lawful to be eaten by the priests.

Sounds like the same God to me!
KonspiracyKitty

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01/06/2013 02:00 AM

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Re: Do Christians and Jews worship the same God?
Christians, Muslims, and Jews all worship the same God. The "God of Abraham" as their God is known.

Christian faiths are based on Judaism, and in fact the thing they call their "Old Testament" is the big Jewish holy text.

Same with Islam. It has the same characters and many of the same stories as the other two. And, in common with Christians in particular, they do view Jesus as a special person, a prophet, but not the son of God. They also mention Mary in the Qu'ran more than the Christian Bible mentions her.

So yes, I would absolutely say they follow the same God. There are differences obviously, but the bulk of their teachings are beliefs are the same.

Or course, they all believe the other religions went astray, got it wrong, are in fact evil imposters, worship Satan, or some such thing. So I'm sure a Christian wouldn't say they worship the same God as a Muslim and a Jew wouldn't say...and so on.
Anonymous Coward
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01/06/2013 02:09 AM
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Re: Do Christians and Jews worship the same God?
I think you're leading up to Marcionism and the Demiurge.

See:
[link to en.wikipedia.org]

It's considered to be a very old heresy.
 Quoting: Don'tBeAfraid


No, that's not quite what I'm saying.

It seems that Christians are saying that Jesus Christ is not God, and that seems contrary to what Jesus and Paul were quoted as saying in the Bible.

JOHN 10:30

I and my Father are one.

 Quoting: ru1im2


Why do you have a problem with Jesus saying that? Didn't He basically say the same thing concerning husbands and wives?

‘Therefore a man shall leave his father and his mother and hold fast to his wife, and the two shall become one flesh’? So they are no longer two but one flesh. What therefore God has joined together, let not man separate.”
(Matthew 19:5-6 ESV)

Everyone knows that a husband and a wife AREN'T the same people (the husband is NOT the wife and the wife is NOT the husband) yet they should agree on things concerning their home, family, etc.

He also said that He wanted his disciples to be one.

John 17:11 Holy Father, keep them in your name, which you have given me, that they may be one, even as we are one.

I honestly doubt that Jesus was saying here that Peter, John, Matthew, Luke, etc., were all one and the same person, yet I don't doubt that Jesus may have been asking that they be in agreement with each other and hold fast to the same basic truths.
Anonymous Coward
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01/06/2013 02:20 AM
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Re: Do Christians and Jews worship the same God?
Christians, Muslims, and Jews all worship the same God. The "God of Abraham" as their God is known.

Christian faiths are based on Judaism, and in fact the thing they call their "Old Testament" is the big Jewish holy text.

Same with Islam. It has the same characters and many of the same stories as the other two. And, in common with Christians in particular, they do view Jesus as a special person, a prophet, but not the son of God. They also mention Mary in the Qu'ran more than the Christian Bible mentions her.

So yes, I would absolutely say they follow the same God. There are differences obviously, but the bulk of their teachings are beliefs are the same.

Or course, they all believe the other religions went astray, got it wrong, are in fact evil imposters, worship Satan, or some such thing. So I'm sure a Christian wouldn't say they worship the same God as a Muslim and a Jew wouldn't say...and so on.
 Quoting: KonspiracyKitty


Muslims may CLAIM to worship the same God, but I highly doubt that. They don't follow God's commandments (one in particular, keeping the Sabbath holy). They have 'borrowed' from the Jewish faith and then been brave enough to change the things they borrowed (such as saying that Ishmael, not Isaac, was the son that Abraham took to be sacrificed).

The biggest difference is what I put in bold above, that they deny Jesus to be the son of God. Scripture says the ones doing so are 'anti-christ.'

1st John 2:22 Who is the liar but he who denies that Jesus is the Christ? This is the antichrist, he who denies the Father and the Son.
Anonymous Coward
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01/06/2013 02:35 AM
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Re: Do Christians and Jews worship the same God?
Do all ants preserve the same royal jelly? Yes, and no.
MartianPrincess

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01/06/2013 02:36 AM
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Re: Do Christians and Jews worship the same God?
Yes. (I'm Jewish).
Occam's Razor, morans!
pi

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01/06/2013 02:37 AM
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Re: Do Christians and Jews worship the same God?
Yes........Christ is the Messiah for Christians but Jews do not believe He is........ the God is the same though!
 Quoting: IamOrthodox


Are you Jewish? What are the Jew's views on Christ exactly? By the way I am impartial to faith.
 Quoting: pi


Yes. (I'm Jewish).
 Quoting: MartianPrincess


...

hmm
Anonymous Coward
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01/06/2013 02:40 AM
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Re: Do Christians and Jews worship the same God?
From looking at how the world is going, and the blind support Xtians give to Israel as it plows a people under via slow genocide and apartheid , you would have to think they are both under the same kind of influence/spell.
MartianPrincess

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01/06/2013 02:40 AM
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Re: Do Christians and Jews worship the same God?
Yes........Christ is the Messiah for Christians but Jews do not believe He is........ the God is the same though!
 Quoting: IamOrthodox


Are you Jewish? What are the Jew's views on Christ exactly? By the way I am impartial to faith.
 Quoting: pi


Yes. (I'm Jewish).
 Quoting: MartianPrincess


...

hmm
 Quoting: pi


What he said, no Jeebus, yes same God.
Occam's Razor, morans!
pi

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01/06/2013 02:44 AM
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Re: Do Christians and Jews worship the same God?
Yes........Christ is the Messiah for Christians but Jews do not believe He is........ the God is the same though!
 Quoting: IamOrthodox


Are you Jewish? What are the Jew's views on Christ exactly? By the way I am impartial to faith.
 Quoting: pi


Yes. (I'm Jewish).
 Quoting: MartianPrincess


...

hmm
 Quoting: pi


What he said, no Jeebus, yes same God.
 Quoting: MartianPrincess


I see, but what I am getting at is the whole "nailed up on a cross" bit.

What I have a hard time understanding, is why Christians do not simply see Christ on the Cross as part of GoD's plan. Why are the Jews blamed for this?

hmm
Taruwah

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01/06/2013 02:44 AM
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Re: Do Christians and Jews worship the same God?
God and Jesus are both inventions of the Roman Emperor Constantine; for reasons of state Constantine, a Mithras worshipper, needed a 'religion' to unite his disparate peoples, so he combined Mithra, a male only religion, with Cybele worship (mainly female) and Isis Horus Seth (IHS) from Egypt, he then included the 'grace' part of Marcion Christianity and called it 'catholicism' that is to say universalism (So you can do anything you want in effect).

He could not use Mithra as the central figure, so he invented 'Ha Zeus' (Jesus).

The Hebrew YHWH (Yehovah) and the Torah made flesh (Yehushua) are nothing to do with the above.

This is why the descriptions of the early "followers of the way" in Acts bear little resemblence to the 'church' as it has come down to us.

The 'church' is still absolutely full of roman pagan ritual from the above sources, it keeps Mithra's birthday on 25th December and it keeps Ishtar (Easter) as part of the Cybele rite. These pagan festivals have no place in the scriptures.

Worst of all it keeps Sunday as 'the Lord's (Ba'al in Hebrew) day instead of the shabbat on the 7th day in direct contravention of the 10 commandments and it has rejected Yehovah's Torah, the framework of creation by which all things were made and which became flesh and dwelt amongst us.

"If you love me, keep my commandments" John 14 v 15

Last Edited by Taruwah on 01/06/2013 02:47 AM
Seek FIRST the Kingdom of YHWH and His knowledge of Good and Bad (righteousness) , for He says "My ways are not thy ways"
MartianPrincess

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01/06/2013 02:48 AM
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Re: Do Christians and Jews worship the same God?
...


Are you Jewish? What are the Jew's views on Christ exactly? By the way I am impartial to faith.
 Quoting: pi


Yes. (I'm Jewish).
 Quoting: MartianPrincess


...

hmm
 Quoting: pi


What he said, no Jeebus, yes same God.
 Quoting: MartianPrincess


I see, but what I am getting at is the whole "nailed up on a cross" bit.

What I have a hard time understanding, is why Christians do not simply see Christ on the Cross as part of GoD's plan. Why are the Jews blamed for this?

hmm
 Quoting: pi


History is written by the victor.
Occam's Razor, morans!
pi

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01/06/2013 02:48 AM
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Re: Do Christians and Jews worship the same God?
...


...


...

hmm
 Quoting: pi


What he said, no Jeebus, yes same God.
 Quoting: MartianPrincess


I see, but what I am getting at is the whole "nailed up on a cross" bit.

What I have a hard time understanding, is why Christians do not simply see Christ on the Cross as part of GoD's plan. Why are the Jews blamed for this?

hmm
 Quoting: pi


History is written by the victor.
 Quoting: MartianPrincess


Suppose so huh?

Thanks for sharing. :)
Anonymous Coward
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01/06/2013 02:58 AM
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Re: Do Christians and Jews worship the same God?
God and Jesus are both inventions of the Roman Emperor Constantine; for reasons of state Constantine, a Mithras worshipper, needed a 'religion' to unite his disparate peoples, so he combined Mithra, a male only religion, with Cybele worship (mainly female) and Isis Horus Seth (IHS) from Egypt, he then included the 'grace' part of Marcion Christianity and called it 'catholicism' that is to say universalism (So you can do anything you want in effect).

He could not use Mithra as the central figure, so he invented 'Ha Zeus' (Jesus).

The Hebrew YHWH (Yehovah) and the Torah made flesh (Yehushua) are nothing to do with the above.

This is why the descriptions of the early "followers of the way" in Acts bear little resemblence to the 'church' as it has come down to us.

The 'church' is still absolutely full of roman pagan ritual from the above sources, it keeps Mithra's birthday on 25th December and it keeps Ishtar (Easter) as part of the Cybele rite. These pagan festivals have no place in the scriptures.

Worst of all it keeps Sunday as 'the Lord's (Ba'al in Hebrew) day instead of the shabbat on the 7th day in direct contravention of the 10 commandments and it has rejected Yehovah's Torah, the framework of creation by which all things were made and which became flesh and dwelt amongst us.

"If you love me, keep my commandments" John 14 v 15
 Quoting: Taruwah


I like you.
Anonymous Coward
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01/06/2013 03:02 AM
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Re: Do Christians and Jews worship the same God?
I think you're leading up to Marcionism and the Demiurge.

See:
[link to en.wikipedia.org]

It's considered to be a very old heresy.
 Quoting: Don'tBeAfraid


No, that's not quite what I'm saying.

It seems that Christians are saying that Jesus Christ is not God, and that seems contrary to what Jesus and Paul were quoted as saying in the Bible.

JOHN 10:30

I and my Father are one.

 Quoting: ru1im2


That is only your interpretation of that particular line in the Biblical texts.

That line may very mean something completely different than what you are trying to say.

P.S the Biblical text were never intended to be read literally, that is probably the worst way to interpret them and prone to confusion and in a lot of cases, death.
Anonymous Coward
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01/06/2013 03:08 AM
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Re: Do Christians and Jews worship the same God?
I've asked many Christians this question and almost universally they say, yes.

But when I remind them that Jesus Christ claimed to be God in the flesh, and that Jews deny this, they stammer a little and say something about both worship the God of Abraham, Isaac and Jacob.

But isn't Jesus Christ the God of Abraham, Isaac and Jacob?

And if not, who is Jesus according to these Christians?

Jews deny that they worship the same God as the Christians by the way.
 Quoting: ru1im2


You have just discovered the stupidity of Abrahamic religion.

Well done.

Not being sarcastic, I really mean that.
Anonymous Coward
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01/06/2013 03:12 AM
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Re: Do Christians and Jews worship the same God?
God and Jesus are both inventions of the Roman Emperor Constantine; for reasons of state Constantine, a Mithras worshipper, needed a 'religion' to unite his disparate peoples, so he combined Mithra, a male only religion, with Cybele worship (mainly female) and Isis Horus Seth (IHS) from Egypt, he then included the 'grace' part of Marcion Christianity and called it 'catholicism' that is to say universalism (So you can do anything you want in effect).

He could not use Mithra as the central figure, so he invented 'Ha Zeus' (Jesus).

The Hebrew YHWH (Yehovah) and the Torah made flesh (Yehushua) are nothing to do with the above.

This is why the descriptions of the early "followers of the way" in Acts bear little resemblence to the 'church' as it has come down to us.

The 'church' is still absolutely full of roman pagan ritual from the above sources, it keeps Mithra's birthday on 25th December and it keeps Ishtar (Easter) as part of the Cybele rite. These pagan festivals have no place in the scriptures.

Worst of all it keeps Sunday as 'the Lord's (Ba'al in Hebrew) day instead of the shabbat on the 7th day in direct contravention of the 10 commandments and it has rejected Yehovah's Torah, the framework of creation by which all things were made and which became flesh and dwelt amongst us.

"If you love me, keep my commandments" John 14 v 15
 Quoting: Taruwah


Interesting.

This makes Islamic continuation of the story from both books even more interesting.

That leaves me with one question in the end though....

Do two wrongs make a right?
Ohwow!

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01/06/2013 08:01 AM

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Re: Do Christians and Jews worship the same God?
Whosoever denieth the Son, the same hath not the Father: (but) he that acknowledgeth the Son hath the Father also.
1 john 2:23


Then answered all the people, and said, His blood be on us, and on our children.
Matthew 27:25

No, not the same God. The first followers of Christ were JewS, of Judea.

No, not all Christians participate in the pagan rituals as introduced into the Church early on, such as Chist Mass. The early Church was approved by the government of the time, and wanted to include everyone with no barriers, worship who you will, just add Jesus in the mix.

Not so with followers of Christ. They will not bow their knee to a mere man nor a legendary godman of mythology. As proved by history, they would willingly die before bowing to a created man or myth. They know their God, and His name is Jesus, who came to reveal the True God of Heaven.
Anonymous Coward
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01/06/2013 08:06 AM
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Re: Do Christians and Jews worship the same God?
But isn't Jesus Christ the God of Abraham, Isaac and Jacob?
 Quoting: ru1im2


Not Jesus.

It´s Jesus´ Father.
Elsabiades....
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01/06/2013 08:08 AM
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Re: Do Christians and Jews worship the same God?
Simple answer: No. One true "god" must send one true "messiah"....All religion is myth; however, when you hear a politician or a religious leader refer to "judeo-christian" values; you are listening to an idiot. It's an oxymoron.
Anonymous Coward
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01/06/2013 08:12 AM
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Re: Do Christians and Jews worship the same God?
The god in the old testament is Enlil. The god in new testament is Enki.

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