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We've Allowed The Gun Grabbers To Control The Argument, And It's Time To Take It Back...

 
Saddletramp
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01/08/2013 02:12 PM

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We've Allowed The Gun Grabbers To Control The Argument, And It's Time To Take It Back...
It's classic Hegelian Dialectic: Problem, Reaction, Solution...

The problem, as they are framing it, is guns...

But is that really the problem?

Would any of the new laws they are proposing (the solution) have stopped these heinous crimes?

The answer to all of the above questions is a resounding NO, so really why are we having this debate? It's off the real topic and entirely academic at this point.

Let's examine the solution first: In a nut shell; Brand-spankin'-new laws to stop any NEW "Assualt" weapons from being sold, but people who currently own "Assualt" weapons would be grandfathered in...

So this 110 lb boy would have still had access to the weapons he used.

I mean come on guys, he broke at least five laws before he ever shot the first child in the school, so how would "New" laws stop any of this?!?!?

1.) He lied on a background check application to purchase a firearm that was eventually denied. He perjured himself. Nothing happened to him...

2.) He stole his mother's weapons, that she legally owned. Felony Grand theft, nothing happened when he broke that law, because he killed the only witness.

3.) He killed his mother. Felony Capital Murder, nothing happened to him because the crime was not discovered until after the fact.

4.) He stole his mothers car to drive to the school. Felony Grand Theft Auto, nothing happened to him, because no one knew he didn't have his mother's permission to drive the car, he had already killed the only witness.

5.) Took a weapon into a Gun Free Zone. Felony Firearms Violation, nothing happened to him because well, it was just too late by then, and there was no one on scene with a weapon to stop him.

You see guys, new laws don't stop criminals. He broke plenty of existing laws (felonies that would have put him in jail for life or even given him the death penalty) before he even committed the first murder in the school. It's a strawman argument, easily defeated, and really non-sequator when you think about it.

So what is the REAL problem behind these shootings? And what is the REAL solution?

Here's what almost every single spree shooter in the last twenty years has in common:

Mind and Brain Chemistry altering Psychotropic Drugs prescribed by a doctor...

These drugs have shown time and time and time again the ability to take a mildly clinically depressed individual and turn them into Suicidal/Homicidal Lunatic...yet we allow family physicians to prescribe them like candy without any form of control...

Here is the real solution, schedule II these psychotropic drugs in the same catagory as Opiates, monitor how doctors prescribe these dangerous, highly addictive drugs, and penalize doctors that prescribe them too liberally (just like opiates), monitor how much of them people take, how many prescriptions they fill, put them in the database, etc.

And if you're specialist will still prescribe these drugs to you, and you still want to take them, then you have to surrender your firearms until you are no longer taking the drugs, and you are cleared by your doctor or a judge.

Or better yet, limit these drugs to institutionalized patients with "Real" mental illness.

Hopefully the parents of these victims (assuming the story is correct, whichever version you follow) will sue the living shit out of Big Pharma and cause them to take a second look at passing these dangerous drugs out like they were water bottles at a marathon...

Until we get down to the real causation of this problem, we will do nothing but aggrivate it...

Last Edited by Saddletramp on 01/08/2013 03:14 PM
"And how can a man die better than facing fearful odds, for the ashes of his fathers, and the temples of his Gods..." ~ Horatius

"Because he told the truth, and once you've heard the truth, everything else is just cheap whiskey..."
IssueX

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01/08/2013 02:15 PM
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Re: We've Allowed The Gun Grabbers To Control The Argument, And It's Time To Take It Back...
Giving you a bump and stars, to start the debate...
milehighmike

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01/08/2013 02:18 PM

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Re: We've Allowed The Gun Grabbers To Control The Argument, And It's Time To Take It Back...
5 Stars and I've added a link to this thread to the ongoing timeline (Page 8):


Thread: USA Gun Control Timeline, a social experiment...Post Sandy Hook to Present
"Successful people are always looking for opportunities to help others. Unsuccessful people are always asking, 'What's in it for me?'" — Brian Tracy: Personal and business training author, speaker, and consultant

"We are all, right now, living the life we choose." -- Peter McWilliams, Author

"The bad news is time flies. The good news is you're the pilot." -- Michael Altshuler
Saddletramp (OP)
We Don't Rent Pigs...

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01/08/2013 02:30 PM

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Re: We've Allowed The Gun Grabbers To Control The Argument, And It's Time To Take It Back...
The problem is, we've allowed the MSM (The Propaganda Arm of the Government) to frame the argument for this debate...we've got to stop arguing their argument and start attacking the real problem...
"And how can a man die better than facing fearful odds, for the ashes of his fathers, and the temples of his Gods..." ~ Horatius

"Because he told the truth, and once you've heard the truth, everything else is just cheap whiskey..."
oLOVEz

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01/08/2013 02:49 PM

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Re: We've Allowed The Gun Grabbers To Control The Argument, And It's Time To Take It Back...
It's classic Hegelian Dialectic: Problem, Reaction, Solution...

The problem, as they are framing it, is guns...

But is that really the problem?

Would any of the new laws they are proposing (the solution) have stopped these heinous crimes?

The answer to all of the above questions is a resounding NO, so really why are we having this debate? It's off the real topic and entirely academic at this point.

Let's examine the solution first: In a nut shell, stop any NEW "Assualt" weapons from being sold, but people who currently own "Assualt" weapons would be grandfathered in...

So this 110 lb boy would have still had access to the weapons he used.

I mean come on guys, he broke at least five laws before he ever shot the first child in the school, so how would "New" laws stop any of this?!?!?

1.) He lied on a background application to purchase a firearm that was eventually denied. He perjured himself. Nothing happened to him...

2.) He stole his mother's weapons, that she legally owned. Felony Grand theft, nothing happened when he broke that law, because he killed the only witness.

3.) He killed his mother. Felony Capital Murder, nothing happened to him because the crime was not discovered until after the fact.

4.) He stole his mothers car to drive to the school. Felony Grand Theft Auto, nothing happened to him, because no one knew he didn't have his mother's permission to drive the car, he had already killed the only witness.

5.) Took a weapon into a Gun Free Zone. Felony Firearms Violation, nothing happened to him because well, it was just too late by then, and there was no one on scene with a weapon to stop him.

You see guys, new laws don't stop criminals. He broke plenty of existing laws (felonies that would have put him in jail for life or even given him the death penalty) before he even committed the first murder in the school. It's a strawman argument, easily defeated, and really non-sequator when you think about it.

So what is the REAL problem behind these shootings? And what is the REAL solution?

Here's what almost every single spree shooter in the last twenty years has in common:

Mind and Brain Chemistry altering Psychotropic Drugs prescribed by a doctor...

These drugs have shown time and time and time again the ability to take a mildly clinically depressed individual and turn them into Suicidal/Homicidal Lunatic...yet we allow family physicians to prescribe them like candy without any form of control...

Here is the real solution, schedule these psychotropic drugs in the same catagory as Opiates, monitor how doctors prescribe these dangerous, highly addictive drugs, and penalize doctors that prescribe them too liberally (just like opiates), monitor how much of them people take, how many prescriptions they fill, put them in the database, etc.

And if you're specialist will still prescribe these drugs to you, and you still want to take them, then you have to surrender your firearms until you are no longer taking the drugs, and you are cleared by your doctor or a judge.

Unitl we get down to the real causation of this problem, we will do nothing but aggrivate it...

Freedom is not the problem people...
 Quoting: Saddletramp


Impressive observations and suggestions! 5 Stars from me.

I agree there is a Rx epidemic on our hands in the USA. I have had my experience using SSRI's and ended up manic and delusional.

I quit taking the meds being prescribed to me and several months later I was back to my normal self. Those pills that mess with your brain are not candy, and are extremely dangerous. Yet the dr's will write a script to anybody who shows any signs of having a bad day...
chaakin

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01/08/2013 03:03 PM
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Re: We've Allowed The Gun Grabbers To Control The Argument, And It's Time To Take It Back...
How do we get this info on MSM? More people need to hear this.
littlemiracles

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01/08/2013 03:06 PM
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Re: We've Allowed The Gun Grabbers To Control The Argument, And It's Time To Take It Back...
The problem is, we've allowed the MSM (The Propaganda Arm of the Government) to frame the argument for this debate...we've got to stop arguing their argument and start attacking the real problem...
 Quoting: Saddletramp


5 stars for you!
Saddletramp (OP)
We Don't Rent Pigs...

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01/08/2013 03:06 PM

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Re: We've Allowed The Gun Grabbers To Control The Argument, And It's Time To Take It Back...
How do we get this info on MSM? More people need to hear this.
 Quoting: chaakin


Don't waste your time with the MSM, they're not going to run with this, it doesn't fit the script.

Send this info (You're free to copy this at will) to your Congressman and Senator, and get it out on youtube and the blogs, alternative media has a big enough share of viewers to alter this outcome if we can focus the view on the real problem before it's too late...
"And how can a man die better than facing fearful odds, for the ashes of his fathers, and the temples of his Gods..." ~ Horatius

"Because he told the truth, and once you've heard the truth, everything else is just cheap whiskey..."
Anonymous Coward
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01/08/2013 03:08 PM
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Re: We've Allowed The Gun Grabbers To Control The Argument, And It's Time To Take It Back...
It's classic Hegelian Dialectic: Problem, Reaction, Solution...

The problem, as they are framing it, is guns...

But is that really the problem?

Here's what almost every single spree shooter in the last twenty years has in common:

Mind and Brain Chemistry altering Psychotropic Drugs prescribed by a doctor...


These drugs have shown time and time and time again the ability to take a mildly clinically depressed individual and turn them into Suicidal/Homicidal Lunatic...yet we allow family physicians to prescribe them like candy without any form of control...

Here is the real solution, schedule II these psychotropic drugs in the same catagory as Opiates, monitor how doctors prescribe these dangerous, highly addictive drugs, and penalize doctors that prescribe them too liberally (just like opiates), monitor how much of them people take, how many prescriptions they fill, put them in the database, etc.

And if you're specialist will still prescribe these drugs to you, and you still want to take them, then you have to surrender your firearms until you are no longer taking the drugs, and you are cleared by your doctor or a judge.

Or better yet, limit these drugs to institutionalized patients with "Real" mental illness.

Hopefully the parents of these victims (assuming the story is correct, whichever version you follow) will sue the living shit out of Big Pharma and cause them to take a second look at passing these dangerous drugs out like they were water bottles at a marathon...

Until we get down to the real causation of this problem, we will do nothing but aggrivate it...
 Quoting: Saddletramp


clappa

so true
The Sonic Dreamer

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01/08/2013 03:08 PM
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Re: We've Allowed The Gun Grabbers To Control The Argument, And It's Time To Take It Back...
5,p

hf
Currently working on:
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Anonymous Coward
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01/08/2013 03:23 PM
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Re: We've Allowed The Gun Grabbers To Control The Argument, And It's Time To Take It Back...
People need to start websites to counter the gun-grab sites.

The only problem, is that people are scared of the govt

Anything outside f what the govt wants, and they will shut down the site, or "suicide" the person hosting the site.
Saddletramp (OP)
We Don't Rent Pigs...

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01/08/2013 03:26 PM

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Re: We've Allowed The Gun Grabbers To Control The Argument, And It's Time To Take It Back...
People need to start websites to counter the gun-grab sites.

The only problem, is that people are scared of the govt

Anything outside f what the govt wants, and they will shut down the site, or "suicide" the person hosting the site.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 31709651



"And how can a man die better than facing fearful odds, for the ashes of his fathers, and the temples of his Gods..." ~ Horatius

"Because he told the truth, and once you've heard the truth, everything else is just cheap whiskey..."
senobwas

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01/08/2013 03:30 PM
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Re: We've Allowed The Gun Grabbers To Control The Argument, And It's Time To Take It Back...
How about this idea: Let the states decide legality of owning firearms....then all the blue states will outlaw guns and the libtards will be happy with their gun control. The red states will allow firearms and conservatives will be happy. Criminals will flock to the blue states to conduct unimpeded mayhem and they will be happy. When enough idiotic liberals have succumbed to the ravages of the criminal element the conservatives can take back the country to sanity!! Everybody wins! And furthermore, since 97% of violent crimes are committed by self described Democrats why not out Democrats...there, problem solved! no more violent crimes!
Mr. D
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01/08/2013 03:32 PM
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Re: We've Allowed The Gun Grabbers To Control The Argument, And It's Time To Take It Back...
Truth of the matter is there is no "Argument". The Constitution protects our Right to Bear Arms. End of argument that never was. What they are proposing is ILLEGAL. Either we follow the laws or we don't, plain and simple.

How about an anarchist state? That is in short what they are proposing as it would take a repeal of the Second Amendment to legally take our guns which isn't going to happen. (There will be a Revolution before that happens and no, not a civil war).
Anonymous Coward
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01/08/2013 03:33 PM
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Re: We've Allowed The Gun Grabbers To Control The Argument, And It's Time To Take It Back...
People need to start websites to counter the gun-grab sites.

The only problem, is that people are scared of the govt

Anything outside f what the govt wants, and they will shut down the site, or "suicide" the person hosting the site.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 31709651



 Quoting: Saddletramp


Wait,

Are you saying that these gangsta groups are against govt?

Cuz theyre not.

They're against the police.

Police are pawns to the govt.

Govt don't care if cops are threatened.

Try making this video with the politicians and govt leaders as the target.
Anonymous Coward
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01/08/2013 03:35 PM
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Re: We've Allowed The Gun Grabbers To Control The Argument, And It's Time To Take It Back...
And this is why gangs are allowed (and created) to grow to millions of members.

They are a threat to society. Not govt officials


People need to start websites to counter the gun-grab sites.

The only problem, is that people are scared of the govt

Anything outside f what the govt wants, and they will shut down the site, or "suicide" the person hosting the site.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 31709651



 Quoting: Saddletramp


Wait,

Are you saying that these gangsta groups are against govt?

Cuz theyre not.

They're against the police.

Police are pawns to the govt.

Govt don't care if cops are threatened.

Try making this video with the politicians and govt leaders as the target.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 31709651
Anonymous Coward
User ID: 30264892
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01/08/2013 03:38 PM
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Re: We've Allowed The Gun Grabbers To Control The Argument, And It's Time To Take It Back...
How about this idea: Let the states decide legality of owning firearms....then all the blue states will outlaw guns and the libtards will be happy with their gun control. The red states will allow firearms and conservatives will be happy. Criminals will flock to the blue states to conduct unimpeded mayhem and they will be happy. When enough idiotic liberals have succumbed to the ravages of the criminal element the conservatives can take back the country to sanity!! Everybody wins! And furthermore, since 97% of violent crimes are committed by self described Democrats why not out Democrats...there, problem solved! no more violent crimes!
 Quoting: senobwas


I like it. Same with homosexuality and gay marriage. Stop it at the state lines. Or better yet ship them all to Hawaii and tell them to stay there. In a couple of lifetimes we will have another un-populated paradise to re-colonize.
Saddletramp (OP)
We Don't Rent Pigs...

User ID: 736749
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01/08/2013 03:41 PM

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Re: We've Allowed The Gun Grabbers To Control The Argument, And It's Time To Take It Back...
People need to start websites to counter the gun-grab sites.

The only problem, is that people are scared of the govt

Anything outside f what the govt wants, and they will shut down the site, or "suicide" the person hosting the site.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 31709651



 Quoting: Saddletramp


Wait,

Are you saying that these gangsta groups are against govt?

Cuz theyre not.

They're against the police.

Police are pawns to the govt.

Govt don't care if cops are threatened.

Try making this video with the politicians and govt leaders as the target.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 31709651


laugh

It's called a joke in response to a serious question...

With regards to the original question, I dunno, you just have to have the balls to do it and accept the fact their may be consquences to excercising your right to Freedom of Speech...

Last Edited by Saddletramp on 01/08/2013 03:43 PM
"And how can a man die better than facing fearful odds, for the ashes of his fathers, and the temples of his Gods..." ~ Horatius

"Because he told the truth, and once you've heard the truth, everything else is just cheap whiskey..."
HangZen
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01/08/2013 03:42 PM
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Re: We've Allowed The Gun Grabbers To Control The Argument, And It's Time To Take It Back...
Truth of the matter is there is no "Argument". The Constitution protects our Right to Bear Arms. End of argument that never was. What they are proposing is ILLEGAL. Either we follow the laws or we don't, plain and simple.

How about an anarchist state? That is in short what they are proposing as it would take a repeal of the Second Amendment to legally take our guns which isn't going to happen. (There will be a Revolution before that happens and no, not a civil war).
 Quoting: Mr. D 4603964


^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^

YEP!
Saddletramp (OP)
We Don't Rent Pigs...

User ID: 736749
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01/08/2013 03:44 PM

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Re: We've Allowed The Gun Grabbers To Control The Argument, And It's Time To Take It Back...
How about this idea: Let the states decide legality of owning firearms....then all the blue states will outlaw guns and the libtards will be happy with their gun control. The red states will allow firearms and conservatives will be happy. Criminals will flock to the blue states to conduct unimpeded mayhem and they will be happy. When enough idiotic liberals have succumbed to the ravages of the criminal element the conservatives can take back the country to sanity!! Everybody wins! And furthermore, since 97% of violent crimes are committed by self described Democrats why not out Democrats...there, problem solved! no more violent crimes!
 Quoting: senobwas


I would agree with that, but the Federal Government usurped this issue a long time ago...

So NOW, in REALITY, we have to deal with this on a Federal Level...
"And how can a man die better than facing fearful odds, for the ashes of his fathers, and the temples of his Gods..." ~ Horatius

"Because he told the truth, and once you've heard the truth, everything else is just cheap whiskey..."
davvi

User ID: 3677166
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01/08/2013 03:48 PM

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Re: We've Allowed The Gun Grabbers To Control The Argument, And It's Time To Take It Back...
How about this idea: Let the states decide legality of owning firearms....then all the blue states will outlaw guns and the libtards will be happy with their gun control. The red states will allow firearms and conservatives will be happy. Criminals will flock to the blue states to conduct unimpeded mayhem and they will be happy. When enough idiotic liberals have succumbed to the ravages of the criminal element the conservatives can take back the country to sanity!! Everybody wins! And furthermore, since 97% of violent crimes are committed by self described Democrats why not out Democrats...there, problem solved! no more violent crimes!
 Quoting: senobwas


I like it. Same with homosexuality and gay marriage. Stop it at the state lines. Or better yet ship them all to Hawaii and tell them to stay there. In a couple of lifetimes we will have another un-populated paradise to re-colonize.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 30264892


the same with taxes, lets tax blue states at much higher rates and red states very little.
I am proud to be Hispanic says the Hispanic.
I am proud to be Black says the Black.
I am proud to be Asian says the Asian.
I am proud to be White says the "racist."


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Anonymous Coward
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01/08/2013 03:56 PM
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Re: We've Allowed The Gun Grabbers To Control The Argument, And It's Time To Take It Back...
Uh, ok. Didn't get that as a joke.
scratching



But it brings up a good point. TPTB have done a great job confusing who the real enemy is.


People need to start websites to counter the gun-grab sites.

The only problem, is that people are scared of the govt

Anything outside f what the govt wants, and they will shut down the site, or "suicide" the person hosting the site.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 31709651



 Quoting: Saddletramp


Wait,

Are you saying that these gangsta groups are against govt?

Cuz theyre not.

They're against the police.

Police are pawns to the govt.

Govt don't care if cops are threatened.

Try making this video with the politicians and govt leaders as the target.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 31709651


laugh

It's called a joke in response to a serious question...

With regards to the original question, I dunno, you just have to have the balls to do it and accept the fact their may be consquences to excercising your right to Freedom of Speech...
 Quoting: Saddletramp
Saddletramp (OP)
We Don't Rent Pigs...

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01/08/2013 04:01 PM

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Re: We've Allowed The Gun Grabbers To Control The Argument, And It's Time To Take It Back...
Uh, ok. Didn't get that as a joke.
scratching



But it brings up a good point. TPTB have done a great job confusing who the real enemy is.


...



 Quoting: Saddletramp


Wait,

Are you saying that these gangsta groups are against govt?

Cuz theyre not.

They're against the police.

Police are pawns to the govt.

Govt don't care if cops are threatened.

Try making this video with the politicians and govt leaders as the target.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 31709651


laugh

It's called a joke in response to a serious question...

With regards to the original question, I dunno, you just have to have the balls to do it and accept the fact their may be consquences to excercising your right to Freedom of Speech...
 Quoting: Saddletramp

 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 31709651


Divide and Conquer...
"And how can a man die better than facing fearful odds, for the ashes of his fathers, and the temples of his Gods..." ~ Horatius

"Because he told the truth, and once you've heard the truth, everything else is just cheap whiskey..."
Anonymous Coward
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01/08/2013 04:17 PM
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Giving you a bump and stars, to start the debate...
 Quoting: IssueX


+1
WAKEUPAMERICA01

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01/08/2013 04:52 PM

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Absolutley correct in your analysis. We've seen Teddy on the TV and got to see the bullhorn last night. It seems that this issue is predominatly one sided as of right now. A lot of high profile folks are speaking up for more rights infringement and the issue has certainly become political. Hell is was political minutes after that incident.
5*
WAKE UP AMERICA
WAKE UP AMERICA
"I love the man that can smile in trouble, that can gather strength from distress, and grow brave by reflection. 'Tis the business of little minds to shrink; but he whose heart is firm, and whose conscience approves his conduct, will pursue his principles unto death."
Thomas Paine, The American Crisis, No. 1, December 19, 1776
"Those who expect to reap the blessings of freedom, must, like men, undergo the fatigues of supporting it."

Thomas Paine, The American Crisis, No. 4, September 11, 1777
"I believe that banking institutions are more dangerous to our liberties than standing armies. Already they have raised up a monied aristocracy that has set the government at defiance. The issuing power (of money) should be taken away from the banks and restored to the people to whom it properly belongs." -- Thomas Jefferson, U.S. President.
"A majority of the people of the United States have lived all of their lives under emergency rule. For 40 years, [79 years now in 2012] freedoms and governmental procedures guaranteed by the Constitution have in varying degrees been abridged by laws brought into force by statutes of national emergency."
No Dhimmi
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01/08/2013 04:53 PM

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bump
Background of my avatar: [link to en.wikipedia.org]

The religion of submission cannot survive an open and honest discussion of its convoluted and foolish scriptures, its sexually perverted terrorist prophet, or its deceitful and demented god. When Western leaders become unified and resolute in their hostility to Islam's violent and ungodly beginnings, Muslims will flee the religion because they will be horrified by its endorsement of terrorism, mass murder, slave trading, plunder, kidnapping, and rape.

If Muslims & their apologists really want to cure "Islamophobia," here is an easy way. Focus their indignation on Muslims committing violent acts in the name of Islam, not on non-Muslims reporting on those acts.
[link to www.cspipublishing.com]
[link to www.faithfreedom.org]
[link to thereligionofpeace.com]
[link to www.bibleprobe.com]
[link to www.fatherzakaria.net]

Ecclesiastes 10:2 “The heart of the wise inclines to the right, but the heart of the fool to the left.”

We are all born ignorant, but it takes a lot of work to keep looking the other way to remain stupid.

Islam is not a race - the racism rant is lame, used by the intellectually lazy to derail the debate.
Anonymous Coward
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01/08/2013 05:04 PM
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Re: We've Allowed The Gun Grabbers To Control The Argument, And It's Time To Take It Back...
Thread: Taking away law abiding citizens guns because of criminals is COLLECTIVE PUNISHMENT...something these "governments" supposedly look down upo
Anonymous Coward
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01/08/2013 05:12 PM
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Re: We've Allowed The Gun Grabbers To Control The Argument, And It's Time To Take It Back...
Why argue?

What they propose goes against the Constitution and is therefore illegal. Any attempt to enforce such illegal legislation will be met with a resounding "Fuck you."

I'm done talking about it. It just makes them think they have a legitimate argument if I respond to them.
Anonymous Coward
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01/08/2013 05:26 PM
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Re: We've Allowed The Gun Grabbers To Control The Argument, And It's Time To Take It Back...
2.) He stole his mother's weapons, that she legally owned.

So what is the REAL problem behind these shootings?
 Quoting: Saddletramp


Hmmmmmm .... the mother who was able to legally owning guns?


And what is the REAL solution?
 Quoting: Saddletramp


Hmmmmmm .... not giving guns to crazy mothers?
Anonymous Coward
User ID: 31366547
United Kingdom
01/08/2013 05:38 PM
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Re: We've Allowed The Gun Grabbers To Control The Argument, And It's Time To Take It Back...
Strange the way you see it. The rest of us see you growing up as a nation. Your acting like teenagers throwing fits and stomping around saying its not fair and you dont understand me. The bottom line is this, wheres theres guns theres more crime and deaths, simple stats across the globe, and try to deny it. You may aswell except the fact that pubity is nearly over and you have to get responsible now, thats if you want the rest of the world to take you deriously mate.
Anonymous Coward
User ID: 31761290
United Kingdom
01/08/2013 05:40 PM
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Re: We've Allowed The Gun Grabbers To Control The Argument, And It's Time To Take It Back...
2.) He stole his mother's weapons, that she legally owned.

So what is the REAL problem behind these shootings?
 Quoting: Saddletramp


Hmmmmmm .... the mother who was able to legally owning guns?


And what is the REAL solution?
 Quoting: Saddletramp


Hmmmmmm .... not giving guns to crazy mothers?
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 8379601


It is a lot more valuable to a free society to have guns available.

Shit like school shootings are a small price to pay, for the overall benefit that guns bring to civilization.

Millions of potential crimes are thwarted, every year, in the USA, by gun owners who don't even discharge their weapons.

And, anyway, school shootings are all orchestrated false flags, by the scum that be.

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