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Can an American citizen really "Withdraw Consent" from this government?

 
En Sof

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01/09/2013 01:54 PM
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Re: Can an American citizen really "Withdraw Consent" from this government?
The long and the short of it can be explained at this site:

[link to yourstrawman.com]

Bottom line...

We (the citizens of the U.S. and subsequently the rest of the world) have been tricked (over a long period of time) into a game of commerce.

There is only ONE law in the United States and that is COMMON LAW. Common law is basically the golden rule and states that every human being on the planet is entitled to their freedoms insofar as they maintain those very same rights for everyone else. The U.S. Constitution as was originally written spells this out.

EVERYTHING else is a statute designed within the framework of COMMERCE. These rules of commerce are based on the Uniform Commercial Code (UCC) and are the LEGAL (not lawful) framework from which our country has been methodically subjected to. This process was intentional, treasonous, and probably the greatest fraud perpetrated on the world. So methodical was it's nature, that it took GENERATIONS to implement fully.

Here is the game: IF you enter into a contract with another party, you are subject (by agreement) to the rules of the contract. These rules are what the people in the United States and the rest of the world THINK are the laws of the land.

U.S. citizens have been entered into this contractual game at birth by the registering of your birth certificate with the corporation of the United States (and even your state, county, etc). Every time you sign your name for a driver's license, marriage license, or even pay a traffic fine, you are ENGAGING IN COMMERCE with these corporations (what we typically think of as government).

How is this possible? The United States entered bankruptcy (more than once) and sells the souls of it's citizens to the banks and lawyers. At birth, each citizen's birth certificate is used to create fictitious corporate account under which you (by playing along with it) agree to abide by.

The secret is NOT to engage in commerce with ANY corporate entity that you do not want to. How to do this?

1) Realize that money is fictitious and doesn't exist. Money (Federal Reserve Notes) can only be used in LEGAL COMMERCE. This can only be accomplished by two corporate entities who agree to play the game.

2) Realize that ALL lawyers, judges, and bankers have been trained for years to play this game and have long forgotten (due to generations dying off and forgetting) how it's supposed to work and are instead trained (in our educational system) to play the legal (not lawful) game.

3) Realize that you have LAWFUL rights but they are very different from LEGAL rights.

4) Know thyself. Know your enemy. REMEMBER WHO YOU ARE!

Peace.
 Quoting: AwakenedDude


clappaclappa
Anonymous Coward
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01/09/2013 01:56 PM
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Re: Can an American citizen really "Withdraw Consent" from this government?
At some point you need to break the laws of a corrupt government to break the chains of oppression.

M.S Me.
Anonymous Coward
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01/09/2013 02:00 PM
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Re: Can an American citizen really "Withdraw Consent" from this government?
Learn what it means to "Go Galt"
and then do it.
Anonymous Coward
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01/09/2013 02:07 PM
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Re: Can an American citizen really "Withdraw Consent" from this government?
You can go live with the Native Americans.
They are practically sovereign.


In this world freedom does not exist.
You are a vassal of a country whether you like it or not.

If you disagree with these rules, you will be put in jail for life as a 'terrorist' or lynched.
nzreva

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01/09/2013 02:12 PM
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Re: Can an American citizen really "Withdraw Consent" from this government?
Try it and they'll kill you.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 31686426


That is not true, lots of Americans are already doing just that.
Anonymous Coward
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01/09/2013 02:16 PM
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Re: Can an American citizen really "Withdraw Consent" from this government?
[link to www.peoplestrust1776.org]

[link to www.abodia.com]


[link to www.youtube.com]

[link to www.scribd.com]

[link to americankabuki.blogspot.ca]

[link to www.youtube.com]

Check out tami peppermans blog/skype/paperwork she has filed
Anonymous Coward
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01/09/2013 02:18 PM
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Re: Can an American citizen really "Withdraw Consent" from this government?
Try it and they'll kill you.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 31686426


That is not true, lots of Americans are already doing just that.
 Quoting: nzreva


Sure have,and they are getting their freedom while others are spreading false shit like this person.
Anonymous Coward
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01/09/2013 02:25 PM
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Re: Can an American citizen really "Withdraw Consent" from this government?
ask Wesley Snipes how that works out.
Mr. Weird

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01/09/2013 02:47 PM
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Re: Can an American citizen really "Withdraw Consent" from this government?
Every year more Americans are renouncing their citizenship and moving to a more free country. The key is renouncing your citizenship. If you don't, no matter where you go in this world, the US government agencies will pursue you and hold you to any "obligations" they say you have to America. Obtaining citizenship in another country is not too hard, in some cases and it will put you out of reach of any US government agency that decides to go after you for anything.

Other than this route, you can join one of the many groups in different states that are pushing for secession. Stay in your home with your family and friends and leave the crap that our country is now buried in to Mr. Obama and his thugs. This is the most likely course of action that will be coming up. Texas is leading the pack and if they ARE ALLOWED to secede, the other states that have started the ball rolling in that direction will have a good chance of doing it, too.
AwakenedDude

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01/09/2013 02:47 PM
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Re: Can an American citizen really "Withdraw Consent" from this government?
ask Wesley Snipes how that works out.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 27515407


I would suggest that since NOONE really knows the details of his case, or WHY he went to prison (corporate media can't really be trusted), my best guess is that the LEGAL SYSTEM (which his lawyers are sworn to protect) found a way to convince a judge (yet another lawyer sworn to the same) that he ENTERED INTO A CONTRACT with them, therefore subjecting him to the RULES OF THEIR GAME. This is a game designed from start to finish to ENSURE that they always win. Always.

If you doubt what I'm saying, just look at the prison system. If they can prove you have entered into a contract with them (and there are MANY MANY ways this can happen), it's game over. Most people are so completely unaware of how the game is played, they fall into the trap. This is the purpose of the game. To enslave.

Again, anytime lawyers are brought into the GAME, you can expect to lose. Everyone, in a courtroom has ALREADY decided to enter into a contract with that corporate entity. In fact, showing up for court is, by THEIR rules, enough evidence to prove that you are complicit and voluntary agree to enter into a contract with them. That's how the game is played. The rules (until very recently) were only understood by those who have learned the unique vocabulary and rules of the legal system. Only those people who have been indoctrinated (law school) at swear an OATH of allegiance to their MASTERS (the BAR association) is allowed to play. It's perfectly evil in every way.

To break free, one must remove themselves from the game. Yes, that's easier said than done, but that, in a nutshell is the answer.


Peace.
Anonymous Coward
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01/09/2013 02:48 PM
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Re: Can an American citizen really "Withdraw Consent" from this government?
Hahahahaha. You people believe this country respects laws! Doesn't matter if you could legally quit the US. The US don't give a shit!!!
Anonymous Coward
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01/09/2013 03:31 PM
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Re: Can an American citizen really "Withdraw Consent" from this government?
A freeman lives by common law, you can legally withdraw AND maintain a person at the same time.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 31820656


A joyful fantasy with no basis in fact.
Central governments in general, and the US Federal government in particular, asserts that it owns your body, mind, soul, income, property, and children.

Your failure to acknowledge this will result in your imprisonment and/or death.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 8254811


This is pretty close to the truth despite ZERO basis in actual codified law... unless you really stretch.

Basically, a person with a birth certificate become a US "vessel" that is then subject to US "law" as a "Territory."

A person with no paperwork, living in one of the several states is in fact foreign to the "United States."

You can read it all in official gvmnt books.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 31826519


Try to apply any of it in court.

Boom.

Prison.
Anonymous Coward
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01/09/2013 03:31 PM
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Re: Can an American citizen really "Withdraw Consent" from this government?
I think GLP hit some kind of record with this thread - there is more disinformation here than anywhere else on the Net, perhaps in the galaxy. As a matter of fact, you shills better be careful, because if you load up anymore crap in once place, you're going to bend enough time and warp enough space to trigger flares from those two huge sunspots facing us right now. Actions have consequences.

For everyone else, calm down. The original Constitution is fully intact - it's just being used. A second Constitution, using almost all of the same-sounding terms, is being used in its place, that applies only to corporations. And you are being presumed to be a corporation by the government. That's why it calls you an "individual" instead of a "natural person." And individual is a person who is being treated as a corporation, under corporate regulations and statutes. A natural person is a person who is living free from corporate presumption or obligation, under common law.

You're not going to understand anything else until you get that basic concept firmly through your head, no ifs, ands or buts. And when you do get it through your head, very little further explanation will be needed. Because the difference betweeen a natural person and a corporation is one of creation - God creates a natural person, whereas the state creates a corporation. And in the "law" as it is currently practiced, creation means ownership. So God owns the natural person, and the state owns... individuals.

And if you've noticed that slaveowners used the same word - own - you're starting to get it.

And don't drag out the 13th Amendment - that addresses private owenership of slaves. it doesn't address government ownership of slaves, er, corporations, er, individuals.

It's not a difficult thing to understand, and it's "hidden in plain sight." But challenging it takes moral courage and... oh, look, a new app...
El Quisqueyano  (OP)

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01/09/2013 04:05 PM
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Re: Can an American citizen really "Withdraw Consent" from this government?
...


It doesn't matter. They're still going to make you obey the law. You can live lawless but it's not going to be cheap and easy and it isn't for everybody.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 31820284

A freeman lives by common law, you can legally withdraw AND maintain a person at the same time.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 31820656


As long as you are prepared for their response when it suits them... lets not forget the meaning and intent behind "Peine forte et dure"..

The only case in America where "Peine forte et dure" was invoked was the case of Giles Corey in 1692 during the Salem Witch trials, Giles refused to participate in the system, fable has it he asked for more rocks to crush him to death.

The last case in England (while some records depute this) was in my neck of the woods in 1735, one John Weeks at Horsham gaol refused to participate in their system ended up enduring "Peine forte et dure", in the end of piling 350 weight on him, a 16 stone Gaolers laid across the top to put him out of his misery.

They have had hundreds of years to attempt to close any loop holes where we can remove ourselves from their systems of governance.

While we can, the fact they came up with "Peine forte et dure" shows how determined they are to ensure we play along by their rules and jump as and when they change them.

[link to en.wikipedia.org]
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 31808165


Don't forget you in the isles actually have a SOVEREIGN.
unlike us in the colonies (US) we have a corporate government that is fictional entirely.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 4710911


Shhhhh! Don't let too many folks know this. It is why I will retire there, a freeman, no property taxes what so ever. Buy land, get title, build home and live rent free rest of your life.
AwakenedDude

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01/09/2013 04:08 PM
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Re: Can an American citizen really "Withdraw Consent" from this government?
I think GLP hit some kind of record with this thread - there is more disinformation here than anywhere else on the Net, perhaps in the galaxy. As a matter of fact, you shills better be careful, because if you load up anymore crap in once place, you're going to bend enough time and warp enough space to trigger flares from those two huge sunspots facing us right now. Actions have consequences.

For everyone else, calm down. The original Constitution is fully intact - it's just being used. A second Constitution, using almost all of the same-sounding terms, is being used in its place, that applies only to corporations. And you are being presumed to be a corporation by the government. That's why it calls you an "individual" instead of a "natural person." And individual is a person who is being treated as a corporation, under corporate regulations and statutes. A natural person is a person who is living free from corporate presumption or obligation, under common law.

You're not going to understand anything else until you get that basic concept firmly through your head, no ifs, ands or buts. And when you do get it through your head, very little further explanation will be needed. Because the difference betweeen a natural person and a corporation is one of creation - God creates a natural person, whereas the state creates a corporation. And in the "law" as it is currently practiced, creation means ownership. So God owns the natural person, and the state owns... individuals.

And if you've noticed that slaveowners used the same word - own - you're starting to get it.

And don't drag out the 13th Amendment - that addresses private owenership of slaves. it doesn't address government ownership of slaves, er, corporations, er, individuals.

It's not a difficult thing to understand, and it's "hidden in plain sight." But challenging it takes moral courage and... oh, look, a new app...
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 1610534


Word.

Peace.
a student of Protean thought
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01/09/2013 04:08 PM
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Re: Can an American citizen really "Withdraw Consent" from this government?
Hmmm... you have to travel out of the US to renounce citizenship at a diplomatic post.

Then there is a $450.00 fee.

And a 3 to 6 month waiting period.

Nutjob: I wanna renounce my fuckin' citizenship to the fascist evil United States.

Clerk: That will be four hundred and fifty dollars, and your appointment to renounce your citizenship will be scheduled six months from now. Have a nice day.

blink
 Quoting: goodmockingbird

Lawful citizenship is by witnessed oath, so there is no oath to renounce. Show me documentation of my oath...
oh.. so you never were a lawful citizen of The UNITED STATES of AMERICA. Remember LEGALISM is bullshit
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 4710911


bump Now we are cooking with gas. bump

The STATE is the big troller looking for a live one to shuffle in the conga line before the maw of a hungry god.
Don'tBeAfraid

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01/09/2013 04:16 PM
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Re: Can an American citizen really "Withdraw Consent" from this government?
And if so, Then how do you live, in the USA, once the withdraw consent is accepted by the US government? Do you still pay taxes? Can you still reside in the USA? Can you still work in the USA without ID, as you would have to turn in any government issued ID.
 Quoting: El Quisqueyano


All people might offer such declarative statements. There are consequences to making such statements.

One might make such statements and move to another nation.

One might refuse to be a participant within a political system, but then state and federal laws (unconstiutional or not) might be used against you.

Many people do get paid under the table, or barter for goods, or receive presents from relatives and friends each year, and thus do not pay taxes on such things. It strictly isn't legal.

One might seek political asylum in an embassy because you're a political prisoner of a nation because you disagree with a nation's political process.

One could renounce their citizenship, in essence be an alien living within a nation, as many are in the USA, but still they are subject to the local, state, and federal laws of the nation. Whether such individuals have inalienable inherrant guaranteed natural rights is difficult and problematic to define, not because they don't have them, but because they have no political support to maintain and defend them since they abrogated their rights as citizens or refused to become a citizen.

Example: Does an alien person (no jokes please) have the right to own a firearm as protected under the Bill of Rights, Article II?

Answer: it depends. Federal law states that green card holders and immigrants within the process may own a fire arm. Some states may restrict such laws. A good attorney spending a fortune might argue that a state law is superceded by a federal law, and an alien might be able to own a gun.

You might technically lose protection under the law if you become an alien of the USA. It's entirely capricious.

Last Edited by Don'tBeAfraid on 01/09/2013 04:25 PM
s. d. butler

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01/09/2013 04:22 PM
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Re: Can an American citizen really "Withdraw Consent" from this government?
And if so, Then how do you live, in the USA, once the withdraw consent is accepted by the US government? Do you still pay taxes? Can you still reside in the USA? Can you still work in the USA without ID, as you would have to turn in any government issued ID.
 Quoting: El Quisqueyano


Withdrawing consent simply means that you avoid , go around, or ignore anything and everything that fedguv or any guv tries to force on everyone.

It means that you ignore as many malum prohibitum laws as you are comfortable with.

And it also means such things as refusing vaccinations or home schooling, not voting,bartering and dozens of other things.

It isn't, although it could be, confrontational. The risk and exposure level all depends on the individual.

Going Galt is a form of withdrawing consent.

Last Edited by s. d. butler on 01/09/2013 04:25 PM
Anonymous Coward
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01/09/2013 04:32 PM
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Re: Can an American citizen really "Withdraw Consent" from this government?
This is becoming epidemic. From people wondering how to get out of the country, renounce their citizenship, withdraw their consent, or use the declaration to outright abolish the Federal Government and their now present tyranny.

Whatever the tactic the growing consensus is that we've all had it, so much that running out into the wild and living off the land seems more enticing all the time. The only problem, the Government owns all the wilderness, and places to run!

Look, when fight or flight becomes the only two options and flight is taken away, then there is only one way left to go.

Turn and fight.
Anonymous Coward
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01/09/2013 04:32 PM
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Re: Can an American citizen really "Withdraw Consent" from this government?
[link to www.youtube.com]
s. d. butler

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01/09/2013 04:32 PM
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Re: Can an American citizen really "Withdraw Consent" from this government?
Try it and they'll kill you.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 31686426


People do it all the time to varying levels. There are more doing it now than ever.
Anonymous Coward
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01/09/2013 04:35 PM
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Re: Can an American citizen really "Withdraw Consent" from this government?
We are prisoners of war!

My granny told me as a child that this country would be taken without one shot fired.

My granny was a wise women!

born 1893
Anonymous Coward
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01/09/2013 04:36 PM
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Re: Can an American citizen really "Withdraw Consent" from this government?
I think GLP hit some kind of record with this thread - there is more disinformation here than anywhere else on the Net, perhaps in the galaxy. As a matter of fact, you shills better be careful, because if you load up anymore crap in once place, you're going to bend enough time and warp enough space to trigger flares from those two huge sunspots facing us right now. Actions have consequences.

For everyone else, calm down. The original Constitution is fully intact - it's just being used. A second Constitution, using almost all of the same-sounding terms, is being used in its place, that applies only to corporations. And you are being presumed to be a corporation by the government. That's why it calls you an "individual" instead of a "natural person." And individual is a person who is being treated as a corporation, under corporate regulations and statutes. A natural person is a person who is living free from corporate presumption or obligation, under common law.

You're not going to understand anything else until you get that basic concept firmly through your head, no ifs, ands or buts. And when you do get it through your head, very little further explanation will be needed. Because the difference betweeen a natural person and a corporation is one of creation - God creates a natural person, whereas the state creates a corporation. And in the "law" as it is currently practiced, creation means ownership. So God owns the natural person, and the state owns... individuals.

And if you've noticed that slaveowners used the same word - own - you're starting to get it.

And don't drag out the 13th Amendment - that addresses private owenership of slaves. it doesn't address government ownership of slaves, er, corporations, er, individuals.

It's not a difficult thing to understand, and it's "hidden in plain sight." But challenging it takes moral courage and... oh, look, a new app...
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 1610534


I'm always hearing this stuff, and I'm ready to at least listen. Could you explain, or show where this is working for others. I don't want to be a damn fool standing up saying a bunch of shit that is not recognized, only to be locked up anyway.

So where the hell is the manual for this concept? I know millions are now a part of it.
Anonymous Coward
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01/09/2013 04:42 PM
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Re: Can an American citizen really "Withdraw Consent" from this government?
people hypothesizing online about whether or not you can or can't do something? That is like a bunch of college novices sitting around pontificating about whether Hunter S. was just a drunk/druggie nut or if Kerouac was just a slacker. Ultimately, they both produced a body of work instead of just talking about whether it was deemed ok or not for them to produce something or do something.
Anonymous Coward
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01/09/2013 05:02 PM
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Re: Can an American citizen really "Withdraw Consent" from this government?
people hypothesizing online about whether or not you can or can't do something? That is like a bunch of college novices sitting around pontificating about whether Hunter S. was just a drunk/druggie nut or if Kerouac was just a slacker. Ultimately, they both produced a body of work instead of just talking about whether it was deemed ok or not for them to produce something or do something.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 31838186


^
Anonymous Coward
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01/09/2013 05:04 PM
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Re: Can an American citizen really "Withdraw Consent" from this government?
[link to travel.state.gov]
C74R1TY-44

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01/09/2013 05:30 PM
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Re: Can an American citizen really "Withdraw Consent" from this government?
I think the misconception in the US is that the people here seem to think that extra-constitutional acts and statutes apply to everyone when in reality they only apply to government employees and people who receive employee benefits from the government.

The only laws that apply to all the people are the ones in the Bill of Rights. The government doesn't have the authority to make extra-constitutional for all of the people; they can only make extra-constitutional laws for people working for their agencies (like the Social Security Administration), or people receiving employee benefits from them.

Unless you rebut the assumption, it will be a presumption of law that you are a government employee because the people who are claiming to be representatives from "the government" make more money that way.

You will be coerced to testify against yourself and almost anything you say (even your name and birthday but especially your social security number or driver's license number) can be used to re-enforce that assumption unless you are skillful enough with your diction to not incriminate yourself.
The storm is closing in to begin again from the beginning. Never sitting through my waking life oblivious. The ignorance running rampant through the city is indicative of something worse; this picture isn't pretty.
C74R1TY-44

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01/09/2013 05:30 PM
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Re: Can an American citizen really "Withdraw Consent" from this government?
People can't lawfully give the government powers that they don't have themselves. For example: your neighbor doesn't have the right to place electronic spying devices like microphones or cameras in your house without your consent and it would be unlawful for him to do so.

So if your neighbor DID plant electronic spying devices in your home without your knowledge or consent and you later caught him with audio tapes of your phone calls, he could be arrested. He doesn't have the right to invade your privacy. None of your neighbors do. If fifty of your neighbors held a meeting and decided that they wanted to wiretap your home, they would still be acting unlawfully. If instead of fifty neighbors you had 5 million neighbors, it would still be the same thing.
The storm is closing in to begin again from the beginning. Never sitting through my waking life oblivious. The ignorance running rampant through the city is indicative of something worse; this picture isn't pretty.
C74R1TY-44

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01/09/2013 05:31 PM
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Re: Can an American citizen really "Withdraw Consent" from this government?
Replace wiretapping with anything else people don't have the right to do to other people (like murder, forcing them to buy insurance, taking money out of their pay check) and it's still the same thing
The storm is closing in to begin again from the beginning. Never sitting through my waking life oblivious. The ignorance running rampant through the city is indicative of something worse; this picture isn't pretty.
El Quisqueyano  (OP)

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01/09/2013 05:59 PM
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Re: Can an American citizen really "Withdraw Consent" from this government?
You can "do" whatever you want, but they will either ignore you or make your life unbearable.

You have to understand that "America" is no longer under the Constitutional Republic founded in 1776.

America was invaded and overthrown by European bankers who now own and run "America" as the corporate "United States."

So, all of us are really living in an occupied country where the invaders ARE A DICTATORSHIP by proxy who allows us the scant illusion of "freedom and democracy."

It's all bullshit, though.

I wrote a letter to the State Department expressing my wishes and, after some prodding, they sent a reply that I am NOT allows to renounce my citizenship while in the "US" and that I AM A SUBJECT (a subject, mind you.... only kings have subjects) of the "STATE" where I was born. They say I was born in the "U.S." but their definition of "U.S." only includes D.C. and U.S. Territories - NOT the several states - so I am, by their own definition NOT a subject of the U.S.

However, they will operated as if I (and you all) am a SUBJECT, when in fact we are NOT by informed consent...

Hence, we are victims of an invading foreign enemy who simply use the original STRUCTURE of the American government as a proxy.

There is a lot of info out there if you look it up. Most of it is in plain sight in government libraries.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 31826519


This is so true. I just wish more would wake up to this.





GLP