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What God's Word Says About Self Defense

 
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What God's Word Says About Self Defense
The underlying argument for gun control seems to be that the availability of guns causes crime. By extension, the availability of any weapon would have to be viewed as a cause of crime. What does the Bible say about such a view? Perhaps we should start at the beginning, or at least very close to the beginning-in Genesis 4.

In this chapter we read about the first murder. Cain had offered an unacceptable sacrifice, and Cain was upset that God insisted that he do the right thing. In other words, Cain was peeved that he could not do his own thing.

Cain decided to kill his brother rather than get right with God. There were no guns available, although there may well have been a knife. Whether it was a knife or a rock, the Bible does not say. The point is, the evil in Cain's heart was the cause of the murder, not the availability of the murder weapon.

God's response was not to ban rocks or knives, or whatever, but to banish the murderer. Later (see Genesis 9:5-6) God instituted capital punishment, but said not a word about banning weapons.

Did Christ Teach Pacifism? Many people, Christians included, assume that Christ taught pacifism. They cite Matthew 5:38-39 for their proof. In this verse Christ said: "You have heard not to resist an evil person. But whoever slaps you on your right cheek, turn the other to him also."

The Sermon on the Mount from which this passage is taken deals with righteous personal conduct. In our passage, Christ is clearing up a confusion that had led people to think that conduct proper for the civil government-that is, taking vengeance-was also proper for an individual.
Even the choice of words used by Christ indicates that He was addressing a confusion, or a distortion, that was commonplace.

Several times in the rest of the Sermon on the Mount Christ used this same "you have heard it said" figure of speech to straighten out misunderstandings or falsehoods being taught by the religious leaders of the times.

Contrast this to Christ's use of the phrase "it is written" when He was appealing to the Scriptures for authority (for example, see Matthew 4 where on three occasions during His temptation by the devil, Christ answered each one of the devil's lies or misquotes from the Scripture with the words: "it is written").

To further underscore the point that Christ was correcting the religious leaders on their teaching that "an eye for an eye" applies to private revenge, consider that in the same Sermon, Christ strongly condemned false teaching: "Whoever therefore breaks one of the commandments, and teaches men so, shall be called least in the kingdom of heaven..."

(Matthew 5:19). Clearly, then, Christ was not teaching something different about self defense than is taught elsewhere in the Bible. Otherwise, He would be contradicting Himself for He would now be teaching men to break one of the commandments.

The Bible distinguishes clearly between the duties of the civil magistrate (the government) and the duties of an individual. Namely, God has delegated to the civil magistrate the administration of justice. Individuals have the responsibility of protecting there lives from attackers.

Christ was referring to this distinction in the Matthew 5 passage. Let us now examine in some detail what the Scriptures say about the roles of government and of individuals. Both the Old and New Testaments teach individual self defense, even if it means taking the assailant's life in certain circumstances.

Self Defense in the Old Testament Exodus 22:2-3 tells us "If the thief is found breaking in, and he is struck so that he dies, there shall be no guilt for his bloodshed. If the sun has risen on him, there shall be guilt for his bloodshed. He should make full restitution; if he has nothing, then he shall be sold for his theft."

One conclusion which can be drawn from this is that a threat to our life is to be met with lethal force. During the day, presumably because we can recognize and later apprehend the thief if he escapes, we are not to kill him in non life-threatening circumstances.

In Proverbs 25:26 we read that "A righteous man who falters before the wicked is like a murky spring and a polluted well." Certainly we would be faltering before the wicked if we chose to be unarmed and unable to resist an assailant who might be threatening our life.

Trusting God Another question asked by Christians is "Doesn't having a gun imply a lack of trust that God will take care of us?" Indeed, God will take care of us. He has also told us that if we love Him, we will keep His commandments. (John 14:15) Those who trust God work for a living, knowing that 1 Timothy 5:8 tells us "But if anyone does not provide for his own, and especially for those of his household, he has denied the faith and is worse that an unbeliever.

" For a man not to work, yet expect to eat because he was "trusting God" would actually be to defy God. King David wrote in Psalm 46:1 that God is our refuge and strength, a very present help in trouble. This did not conflict with praising the God "Who trains my hand for war and my fingers for battle" (Psalm 144:1). The doctrine of Scripture is that we prepare and work, but we trust the outcome to God.

Those who trust God should also make adequate provision for their own defense even as we are instructed in the passages above. For a man to refuse to provide adequately for his and his family's defense would be to defy God. There is an additional concern to taking the position that "I don't need to arm myself. God will protect me."

At one point, when Satan was tempting Jesus in the wilderness, he challenged Jesus to throw himself off the top of the temple. Satan reasoned that God's angels would protect him. Jesus responded: "It is written again, 'You shall not tempt the Lord your God.'" (Matthew 4:7) It may seem pious to say that one is trusting in God for protection, and we all must, but it is tempting God if we do not take the measures that He has laid out for us in the Bible.

Role of Government The Bible records the first murder in Genesis 4 when Cain killed his brother Abel. God's response was not to register rocks or impose a background check on those getting a plough, or whatever it was that Cain used to kill his brother. Instead, God dealt with the criminal. Ever since Noah the penalty for murder has been death.

Nowhere in the Bible does God make any provision for dealing with the instruments of crime. He always focuses on the consequences for an individual of his actions. Heaven and hell only applies to people, not to things. Responsibility only pertains to people, not to things.

Resisting an attack is not to be confused with taking vengeance which is the exclusive domain of God (Romans 12:19). This has been delegated to the civil magistrate, who, as we read in Romans 13:4, "is God's minister to you for good. But if you do evil, be afraid; for he does not bear the sword in vain; for he is God's minister, an avenger to execute wrath on him who practices evil."

Private vengeance means one would stalk down a criminal after one's life is no longer in danger as opposed to defending oneself during an attack. It is this very point that has been confused by Christian pacifists who would take the passage in the Sermon on the Mount about turning the other cheek (which prohibits private vengeance) into a command to falter before the wicked.

Let us consider also that the Sixth Commandment tells us "Thou shall not murder." In the chapters following, God gave to Moses many of the situations which require a death penalty. God clearly has not told us never to kill. He has told us not to murder, which means we are not to take an innocent life. Consider also that the civil magistrate is to be a terror to those who practice evil.

This passage does not in any way imply that the role of law enforcement is to prevent crimes or to protect individuals from criminals. The magistrate is a minister to serve as "an avenger to execute wrath on him who practices evil." (Romans 13:4)

This point is reflected in the legal doctrine of the United States. Repeatedly, courts have held that the government has no responsibility to provide individual security. One case (Bowers v. DeVito) put it this way: "there is no constitutional right to be protected by the state against being murdered."

Self Defense in the New Testament The Christian pacifist may try to argue that God has changed His mind from the time that He gave Moses the Ten Commandments in Exodus 20 or the provision for justifiably killing a thief in Exodus 22. But the writer of Hebrews makes it clear that this cannot be, because "Jesus Christ is the same yesterday, today and forever" (Hebrews 13:. In the Old Testament, the prophet Malachi records God's words this way: "For I am the Lord, I do not change" (Malachi 3:6).

Paul was referring to the unchangeability of God's Word when he wrote to Timothy that "All Scripture is given by inspiration of God, and is profitable for doctrine, for reproof, for correction, for instruction in righteousness, that the man of God may be complete, thoroughly equipped for every good work" (2 Timothy 3:16-17). Clearly, Paul viewed all Scripture, including the Old Testament, as useful for training Christians in every area of life.

We must also consider what Christ told his disciples in his last hours with them: "...But now, he who has a money bag, let him take it, and likewise a sack; and he who has no sword, let him sell his garment and buy one" (Luke 22:36, emphasis added). Keep in mind that the sword was the finest offensive weapon available to and individual soldier - the equivalent then of a military rifle today.

The Christian pacifist will likely object at this point that only a few hours later, Christ rebuked Peter who used a sword to cut off the ear of Malchus, a servant of the high priest in the company of a detachment of troops. Let us read what Christ said to Peter in Matthew 26:52-54: Put your sword in its place, for all who take the sword will perish by the sword.

Or do you think that I cannot now pray to My Father, and He will provide Me with more that twelve legions of angels? How then could the Scriptures be fulfilled, that it must happen thus?

It was not the first time that Christ had to explain to the disciples why He had come to earth. To fulfill the Scriptures, the Son of God had to die for the sin of man since man was incapable of paying for his own sin apart from going to hell.

Christ could have saved His life, but then believers would have lost their lives forever in hell. These things only became clear to the disciples after Christ had died and been raised from the dead and the Spirit had come into the world at Pentecost (see John 14:26).

While Christ told Peter to "put your sword in its place" He clearly did not say get rid of it forever. That would have contradicted what he told the disciples only hours before. Peter's sword was to protect his own mortal life from danger. His sword was not needed to protect the Creator of the universe and the King of kings.

Years after Pentecost, Paul wrote in a letter to Timothy "But if anyone does not provide for his own, and especially for those of his household, he has denied the faith and is worse than an unbeliever" (1 Tim. 5:. This passage applies to our subject because it would be absurd to buy a house, furnish it with food and facilities for one's family, and then refuse to install locks and provide the means to protect the family and the property. Likewise it would be absurd not to take, if necessary, the life of a night-time thief to protect the members of the family (Exodus 22:2-3).

A related, and even broader concept, is found in the parable of the Good Samaritan. Christ had referred to the Old Testament summary of all the laws of the Bible into two great commandments: "'You shall love the Lord your God with all your heart, with all your soul, with all your strength, and with all your mind,' and your neighbor as yourself'" (Luke 10:27).

When asked who was a neighbor, Christ related the parable of the Good Samaritan (Luke 10:30-37). It was the Good Samaritan who took care of the mugging victim who was a neighbor to the victim. The others who walked by and ignored the victim's plight were not acting as neighbors to him.

In the light of all we have seen the Scriptures teach to this point, can we argue that if we were able to save another's life from an attacker by shooting the attacker with our gun that we should "turn the other cheek instead?" The Bible speaks of no such right. It only speaks of our responsibilities in the face of an attack-as individual creatures made by God, as householders or as neighbors.

National Blessings and Cursings The Old Testament also tells us a great deal about the positive relationship between righteousness, which exalts a nation, and self defense. (See footnote a.)

It makes clear that in times of national rebellion against the Lord God, the rulers of the nation will reflect the spiritual degradation of the people and the result is a denial of God's commandments, an arrogance of officialdom, disarmament and oppression.

For example, the people of Israel were oppressed during the time of the rule of the Judges. This occurred every time the people apostatized. Judges 5:8 tells us that, "They chose new gods; then there was war in the gates; not a shield or spear was seen among forty thousand in Israel."
Consider Israel under Saul: The first book of Samuel tells of the turning away of Israel from God.

The people did not want to be governed by God; they wanted to be ruled by a king like the pagan, God-hating nations around them. Samuel warned the people what they were getting into-the curses that would be upon them *p; if they persisted in raising up a king over themselves and their families. Included in those curses was the raising up of a standing, professional army which would take their sons and their daughters for aggressive wars (I Samuel 8:11).

This curse is not unknown in the United States. Saul carried out all the judgements that Samuel had warned the people about. His buildup of a standing army has been repeated in the U.S., and not just in terms of the military, but also the 650,000 full-time police officers from all levels of government. Saul was the king the Israelites wanted and got. He was beautiful in the eyes of the world but a disaster in the eyes of the Lord. Saul did not trust God.

He rebelled against His form of sacrifice unto the Lord. Saul put himself above God. He was impatient. He refused to wait for Samuel because God's way was taking too long. Saul went ahead and performed the sacrifice himself, thus violating God's commandment (and, incidently, also violating the God-ordained separation of duties of church and state!)
Thus was the kingdom lost to Saul.

And, it was under him that the Philistines were able to defeat the Jews and put them into bondage. So great was the bondage exerted by the Philistines that "Now there was no blacksmith to be found throughout all the land of Israel: for the Philistines said, 'Lest the Hebrews make them swords or spears.'

But all the Israelites went down to the Philistines to sharpen each man's plowshare, his mattock, his ax, and his sickle;...So it came about, on the day of battle, that there was neither sword nor spear found in the hand of any of the people who were with Saul and Jonathan..." (1 Samuel 13:19-20; 22-23).

Today, the same goals of the Philistines would be carried out by an oppressor who would ban gunsmiths from the land. The sword of today is the handgun, rifle or shotgun. The sword control of the Philistines is today's gun control of those governments that do not trust their people with guns.

It is important to understand that what happened to the Jews at the time of Saul was not unexpected according to the sanctions spelled out by God in Leviticus 26 and Deuteronomy 28. In the first verses of those chapters, blessing are promised to a nation that keeps God's laws.

In the long second parts of those chapters, the curses are spelled out for a nation that comes under judgement for is rebellion against God. Deuteronomy 28:47- 48 helps us understand the reason for Israel's oppression by the Philistines during Saul's reign:

Because you did not serve the Lord your God with joy and gladness of heart, for the abundance of all things, therefore you shall serve your enemies, whom the Lord will send against you, in hunger, in thirst, in nakedness, and in need of all things; and He will put a yoke of iron on your neck until He has destroyed you.

REST AT LINK: [link to www.lawandliberty.org]
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"If you love wealth more than liberty, the tranquility of servitude better than the animating contest of freedom, depart from us in peace. We ask not your counsel nor your arms. Crouch down and lick the hand that feeds you. May your chains rest lightly upon you and may posterity forget that you were our countrymen."- Samuel Adams

"...It does not require a majority to prevail, but rather an irate, tireless minority keen to set brush fires in people's minds.."
--Samuel Adams

A man may die, nations may rise and fall, but an idea lives on.
--John F. Kennedy

The cost of freedom is always high, but Americans have always paid it. And one path we shall never choose, and that is the path of surrender, or submission.
--John F. Kennedy

Mankind must put an end to war before war puts an end to mankind.
--John F. Kennedy

All religions, arts and sciences are branches of the same tree.
--Albert Einstein
Goofy for God
Do everything with love

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01/11/2013 08:48 PM

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Re: What God's Word Says About Self Defense
I dress with this
The Armor of God

[link to www.acts17-11.com]

yoda
Proverbs 15:1
A soft answer turns away wrath, But a harsh word stirs up anger.
Anonymous Coward
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Re: What God's Word Says About Self Defense
GOD gives us the right to defend outself if we are in danger of our life it says do not fear when 10,0000s surround you because the LORD GOD will be your protection i fear no man i only FEAR GOD
Anonymous Coward
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01/11/2013 09:07 PM
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Re: What God's Word Says About Self Defense
ANY RULE APPLIED TO ISREAL
CANNOT EVER BE EQUATED TO THE NATIONS

BECAUSEISRAEL WAS UNDER GOD'S COMMAND

THE NATIONS ARE A ALW UNTO THEMSLEVES
AS WAS SIREAL
ANDTHAT IS WHY IT WAS JUDGED

BUT THE NEW TESTMANENT IS AIMED AT EVERYONE
INVIDUALLY

AS FOR HUMAN GOVERNMENTS

GOD ALLOWS THEM

AND H IES JUDGE OF THEM
AS HE IS JUDGE OF MAN IN GENERAL
INCLUDING THOSE THAT FORM AND RUN GOVERNMENTS

THE MAERICAN CONSITUTION IS A LIST OF MAN MADE PRINCIPALS

THAT HAVE NOTHING TO DO WITH GOD

BUT SEEING AS GOD ALLOWS HUMAN GOVERNENCE

AND AMERICAS FORM OF GOVERNECE WAS FORMED BY ITS HUMANANLY DESIGNED CONSTITUTION
IT IS A HUMAN LAW RECOGNIZED WITHIN THE UNITED STATES THAT ALL ITS PEOPLE MAY ARM THESMELVES TO THE TEETH TO DEFEND THEMSVLES IF THEY SO WISH
AND TO TRY AND STOP THEM IS TREASON

THE CONSITUTION IS MANS WILL THAT GOD ALLOWS FOR NOW.

BUT IT IS NOT GOD'S WILL FOR MAN
NOR IS IT HOW GOD EXPECTS MEN TO THINK
AS A MEANS TO OBEY HIM FULLY

ONLY IN AS FAR AS THAT PAICE OF PAPAER CANNOT HAVE LAWS THAT CONTRAVENE IT DRAWN UP AGANIST IT
THAT IS THE ONLY THING GOD ALLOWS IN AS FAR AS THE RESPECT FOR HUMAN LAWS
BUT HIS LAWS AS REVEALED THROUGH JESUS CHRIST ARE SUPERIOR IN THE END

SO IT IS A GOOD JOB THE CONSTITION DEOS NOT SAY EVERYONE HAS TO BEAR ARMS
Anonymous Coward
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01/11/2013 09:09 PM
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WORSHIPING THE CONSTITUTION IS NOT REQUIRED
<<TIMEWATCHER>> (OP)

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01/11/2013 09:15 PM
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Re: What God's Word Says About Self Defense
GOD gives us the right to defend outself if we are in danger of our life it says do not fear when 10,0000s surround you because the LORD GOD will be your protection i fear no man i only FEAR GOD
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 18361581


hfhf
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The content of posts on this site, including but not limited to links to other web sites, are the expressed opinion of the original poster and are in no way representative of or endorsed by the owners or administration of this website. The posts on this website are the opinion of the specific author and are not statements of advice, opinion, or factual information on behalf of the owner or administration of GodlikeProductions. This site may contain adult language, if you feel you might be offended by such content, you should log off immediately.

Not all posts on this website are intended as truthful or factual assertion by their authors. Some users of this website are participating in internet role playing, with or without the use of an avatar. NO post on this website should be considered factual information on face value alone.

"If you love wealth more than liberty, the tranquility of servitude better than the animating contest of freedom, depart from us in peace. We ask not your counsel nor your arms. Crouch down and lick the hand that feeds you. May your chains rest lightly upon you and may posterity forget that you were our countrymen."- Samuel Adams

"...It does not require a majority to prevail, but rather an irate, tireless minority keen to set brush fires in people's minds.."
--Samuel Adams

A man may die, nations may rise and fall, but an idea lives on.
--John F. Kennedy

The cost of freedom is always high, but Americans have always paid it. And one path we shall never choose, and that is the path of surrender, or submission.
--John F. Kennedy

Mankind must put an end to war before war puts an end to mankind.
--John F. Kennedy

All religions, arts and sciences are branches of the same tree.
--Albert Einstein
Anonymous Coward
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01/11/2013 09:36 PM
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Re: What God's Word Says About Self Defense
Well done OP.

clappa

All except for the proverbs 25 thing.

But anyway...


clappa
-GLP-Christian-
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01/11/2013 09:38 PM

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Re: What God's Word Says About Self Defense
What we especially have weapons for is so we can protect others lives so we can preach the gospel to them.
The pacifict crowd probably have another Jesus...

Like this article is nice:
God a Man of War

“The Lord is a man of war,” Exodus 15:3

“The God of the armies of Israel,“ 1 Samuel 17:45

“The Lord of Hosts,” Isaiah 47:4
[link to www.learnthebible.org]

Host for those that don't get it is an army.

It's mainly the pacificts fault that so many have died in genocides etc. because they were not able to stop tyrants, they will have some serious explaining to do.

Same as all these gun free zone churches that gets shot up, churches that have loads of armed members never get shot up.

As I said I think many of the pacificts are wolves in sheeps clothing, who else would love to see a Christian unarmed? Why the devil, he tries to steal the word by producing all these modern perversions (like you used for this article, hence he robbed you of the word)
[link to www.av1611.org]
[link to www.av1611.org]

and he tries to rob us of our second weapon: prayer
by having us do all sorts of other stuff.

And he tries to rob us of our protection in this wicked world, an unarmed man is easy to kill.

So these pacifists are most likely some sort of wolves in sheeps clothing disarming people, as I understand they're also often part of the ecumenical one world religion bs.

Last Edited by -GLP-Christian- on 01/11/2013 09:41 PM
<<TIMEWATCHER>> (OP)

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Re: What God's Word Says About Self Defense
What we especially have weapons for is so we can protect others lives so we can preach the gospel to them.
The pacifict crowd probably have another Jesus...

Like this article is nice:
God a Man of War

“The Lord is a man of war,” Exodus 15:3

“The God of the armies of Israel,“ 1 Samuel 17:45

“The Lord of Hosts,” Isaiah 47:4
[link to www.learnthebible.org]

Host for those that don't get it is an army.

It's mainly the pacificts fault that so many have died in genocides etc. because they were not able to stop tyrants, they will have some serious explaining to do.

Same as all these gun free zone churches that gets shot up, churches that have loads of armed members never get shot up.

As I said I think many of the pacificts are wolves in sheeps clothing, who else would love to see a Christian unarmed? Why the devil, he tries to steal the word by producing all these modern perversions (like you used for this article, hence he robbed you of the word)
[link to www.av1611.org]
[link to www.av1611.org]

and he tries to rob us of our second weapon: prayer
by having us do all sorts of other stuff.

And he tries to rob us of our protection in this wicked world, an unarmed man is easy to kill.
 Quoting: -GLP-Christian-


Thanks for the links hf
GLP Disclaimer

DON'T BELIEVE A DAMN WORD YOU READ ON THIS WEBSITE!

The reader is responsible for discerning the validity, factuality or implications of information posted here, be it fictional or based on real events. Moderators on this forum make every effort to review the material posted on this site however, it is not realistically possible for our small staff to manually review each and every one of the more than 20,000 posts GodlikeProductions gets on a daily basis.

The content of posts on this site, including but not limited to links to other web sites, are the expressed opinion of the original poster and are in no way representative of or endorsed by the owners or administration of this website. The posts on this website are the opinion of the specific author and are not statements of advice, opinion, or factual information on behalf of the owner or administration of GodlikeProductions. This site may contain adult language, if you feel you might be offended by such content, you should log off immediately.

Not all posts on this website are intended as truthful or factual assertion by their authors. Some users of this website are participating in internet role playing, with or without the use of an avatar. NO post on this website should be considered factual information on face value alone.

"If you love wealth more than liberty, the tranquility of servitude better than the animating contest of freedom, depart from us in peace. We ask not your counsel nor your arms. Crouch down and lick the hand that feeds you. May your chains rest lightly upon you and may posterity forget that you were our countrymen."- Samuel Adams

"...It does not require a majority to prevail, but rather an irate, tireless minority keen to set brush fires in people's minds.."
--Samuel Adams

A man may die, nations may rise and fall, but an idea lives on.
--John F. Kennedy

The cost of freedom is always high, but Americans have always paid it. And one path we shall never choose, and that is the path of surrender, or submission.
--John F. Kennedy

Mankind must put an end to war before war puts an end to mankind.
--John F. Kennedy

All religions, arts and sciences are branches of the same tree.
--Albert Einstein
Anonymous Coward
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01/11/2013 09:40 PM
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Re: What God's Word Says About Self Defense
An eye for an eye!
-GLP-Christian-
Potential Terrorist Under Svea Banér

User ID: 31988328
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01/11/2013 09:44 PM

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Re: What God's Word Says About Self Defense
What we especially have weapons for is so we can protect others lives so we can preach the gospel to them.
The pacifict crowd probably have another Jesus...

Like this article is nice:
God a Man of War

“The Lord is a man of war,” Exodus 15:3

“The God of the armies of Israel,“ 1 Samuel 17:45

“The Lord of Hosts,” Isaiah 47:4
[link to www.learnthebible.org]

Host for those that don't get it is an army.

It's mainly the pacificts fault that so many have died in genocides etc. because they were not able to stop tyrants, they will have some serious explaining to do.

Same as all these gun free zone churches that gets shot up, churches that have loads of armed members never get shot up.

As I said I think many of the pacificts are wolves in sheeps clothing, who else would love to see a Christian unarmed? Why the devil, he tries to steal the word by producing all these modern perversions (like you used for this article, hence he robbed you of the word)
[link to www.av1611.org]
[link to www.av1611.org]

and he tries to rob us of our second weapon: prayer
by having us do all sorts of other stuff.

And he tries to rob us of our protection in this wicked world, an unarmed man is easy to kill.
 Quoting: -GLP-Christian-


Thanks for the links hf
 Quoting: <<TIMEWATCHER>>


You're welcome.
Here's another:
A Biblical Perspective of Self-Defense
[link to www.foxven.com]

EDIT:
Resisting evil, self defense and war
[link to www.letusreason.org]

Last Edited by -GLP-Christian- on 01/11/2013 09:48 PM
Anonymous Coward
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01/11/2013 09:48 PM
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Re: What God's Word Says About Self Defense
GOD gives us the right to defend outself if we are in danger of our life it says do not fear when 10,0000s surround you because the LORD GOD will be your protection i fear no man i only FEAR GOD
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 18361581


hfhf
 Quoting: <<TIMEWATCHER>>


THAT IS A LIE AND IS DIRECT VIOLATION OF GOD'S COMMANDMENTS.

GOD DOES NOT SAY DEFEND YOURSELF HE SAYS I WILL DEFEND YOU

HE ALSO COMMANDS YOU TO TURN TH OTHER CHEEK WHEN YOU HAVE VIOLENCE DONE TO YOU.

YOUR REFUGE OF LYING AGAINST GOD ARE YOU DOWNFALL
AND NO GUN SHALL SAVE YOU FROM SUCH A DOWNFALL
Anonymous Coward
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01/11/2013 10:05 PM
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Re: What God's Word Says About Self Defense
Self Defense in the New Testament The Christian pacifist may try to argue that God has changed His mind from the time that He gave Moses the Ten Commandments in Exodus 20 or the provision for justifiably killing a thief in Exodus 22. But the writer of Hebrews makes it clear that this cannot be, because "Jesus Christ is the same yesterday, today and forever" (Hebrews 13:. In the Old Testament, the prophet Malachi records God's words this way: "For I am the Lord, I do not change" (Malachi 3:6).
WRONG
Punishment of sin such as theft is God's domain for he is Judge
only he without sin can rightiously aplly such a punishment for a theif threfore only God could do such a thing.

Jesus illustrated this point to the pharissess and teachers of (God's) law
when he was asked about the woman caught in the act of adultery the punishment for which according to the law was stoning the woman to death.
Jesus then made it VERY plain that the Laws of God are set out to highlight things which God hates, namely sin.
Buit then Jesus made it plain that only God is HOLY and RIGHTIOUS ENOUGH To carry out the punishment of the things he hates
and no man was without SIN
except Jesus himself (even though those clamming to be Gods servents didnt believe that.)
So Jesus told them
Let HE WHO IS WITHOUT SIN CAST THE FIRST STONE.
Showing that NO MAN HAD THE RIGHT TO CARRY OUT GOD'S JUSTICE IN REGARD TO GODS LAWS.
Anonymous Coward
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01/11/2013 10:06 PM
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Re: What God's Word Says About Self Defense
Isaiah 45:7
I form the light, and create darkness: I make peace, and create evil: I the LORD do all these things.

"These are Forces, which in effect, are purifiers, you see. These are those, which clear the way for the creation of that which can bring about harmony.

"Here we begin at a point where there are two brothers, so to say: One is the Light and one is the Darkness. These brothers love their Father without limit, beyond reservation or any such. Their love is complete. Both are of pure intent unto God.

"The 'forces of destruction' or the forces of opposition are creations of consciousness in Earth, or in the minds called human or finite. Those minds, which are unlimited or infinite, have no sense of the description of destruction, as you call this. A Force of God cannot de-struct or de-structure that which is created of God. There is naught which can do this."
Anonymous Coward
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01/11/2013 10:09 PM
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Re: What God's Word Says About Self Defense
IF SOMEONE STRIKES YOU ON THE CHEEK

TURN TO HIM THE OTHER CHEEK

IF SOMEONE STEALS YOUR CLOAK
OFFER HIM YOUR TUNIC ASWELL




WHAT TO DO ACCORDING THE LORD JESUS, THE MIGHTY GOD, THE EVERLASTING FATHER THE PRINCE OF PEACE, IN REGARDS TO PROPERTY THEFT AND ACTS OF VIOLENCE AGANIST YOUR PERSON.
Anonymous Coward
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01/11/2013 10:14 PM
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Re: What God's Word Says About Self Defense
GOD gives us the right to defend outself if we are in danger of our life it says do not fear when 10,0000s surround you because the LORD GOD will be your protection i fear no man i only FEAR GOD
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 18361581


hfhf
 Quoting: <<TIMEWATCHER>>


THAT IS A LIE AND IS DIRECT VIOLATION OF GOD'S COMMANDMENTS.

GOD DOES NOT SAY DEFEND YOURSELF HE SAYS I WILL DEFEND YOU

HE ALSO COMMANDS YOU TO TURN TH OTHER CHEEK WHEN YOU HAVE VIOLENCE DONE TO YOU.

YOUR REFUGE OF LYING AGAINST GOD ARE YOU DOWNFALL
AND NO GUN SHALL SAVE YOU FROM SUCH A DOWNFALL
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 31950575


Do not fight physically.
Ephesians 6:
11 Put on the full armor of God, so that you will be able to stand firm against the schemes of the devil. 12 For our struggle is not against flesh and blood, but against the rulers, against the powers, against the world forces of this darkness, against the spiritual forces of wickedness in the heavenly places.
Darth Hitman

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01/11/2013 10:26 PM
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Re: What God's Word Says About Self Defense
I was recently in a debate with a fool telling me I needed to go to church when I mentioned God telling his disciples to obtain a sword [and pointed out a sword then was the equivalent to a gun today] and he told me 1. His preacher would set me str8 on that and 2. By sword he was talking about a Bible. I asked him "Why did they bring two Bibles back and Christ said that would be sufficient and, how did a guy get his ear cut by the bible? Was it a paper cut?
“He who joyfully marches to music in rank and file has already earned my contempt. He has been given a large brain by mistake, since for him the spinal cord would surely suffice.” - Albert Einstein

Truth fears no questions. ~Unknown

“There is no such thing as a minor lapse of integrity” - Tom Peters
Anonymous Coward
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01/11/2013 11:20 PM
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Re: What God's Word Says About Self Defense
I was recently in a debate with a fool telling me I needed to go to church when I mentioned God telling his disciples to obtain a sword [and pointed out a sword then was the equivalent to a gun today] and he told me 1. His preacher would set me str8 on that and 2. By sword he was talking about a Bible. I asked him "Why did they bring two Bibles back and Christ said that would be sufficient and, how did a guy get his ear cut by the bible? Was it a paper cut?
 Quoting: Darth Hitman


Christians of all denominations distort the Bible.
They pick and choose verses that support their personal
manmade religions and discard what contradicts their
beliefs.

They hammer scripture to suit themselves and you wouldn't
want to be in their shoes, when they have to stand
before Christ.

They violate the very Word of God.
For Example:

"Wine that makes you merry" isn't grape juice,
and they didn't accuse Jesus of being a winebibber,
because He guzzled grape juice, and they didn't
accuse the disciples of being full of wine at
Pentecost because they drank grape juice too early
in the day.

The Catholic church ignores half the Bible which
condemns their practices and contradicts their dogma.

It will only get worse from here on out, until
Jesus Christ returns.
Anonymous Coward
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01/11/2013 11:23 PM
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Re: What God's Word Says About Self Defense
thats some spin there op..
Anonymous Coward
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01/11/2013 11:25 PM
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Re: What God's Word Says About Self Defense
I was recently in a debate with a fool telling me I needed to go to church when I mentioned God telling his disciples to obtain a sword [and pointed out a sword then was the equivalent to a gun today] and he told me 1. His preacher would set me str8 on that and 2. By sword he was talking about a Bible. I asked him "Why did they bring two Bibles back and Christ said that would be sufficient and, how did a guy get his ear cut by the bible? Was it a paper cut?
 Quoting: Darth Hitman


And when did they ever use a sword? either Christ or His disciples?
If you read end times revelation you would notice that Babylons fate is sealed. Cursed by God
Now its up to you to figure out who or where is Babylon.
Anonymous Coward
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01/11/2013 11:39 PM
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You really do need to change it to 'what (MY) god says', because not everyone here subscribes to your vision of reality.
That being said, what if that book were to vanish tomorrow?
What you all you people do without your guidance of scripture. I see you look to it in times of need as a backbone. Where would your faith be if that singular book did not exist? With a different god? With no god?
People should really start putting some faith in themselves, and look for ways to deal with situations outside of looking in ancient scribbles.
I personally don't need to look outward for hope when I need it. I must say it is pretty great. Again though, stop with the definitive monotheism. The world today is too diverse for people to try and fit inside their one little box.
Anonymous Coward
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01/11/2013 11:55 PM
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Re: What God's Word Says About Self Defense
What a bunch of made up bullshit. Why not add a whole new book to the Bible about how it is okay to kill people if you think they are bad. No, Jesus said to turn the other cheek....period. Don't try to change His words. If you kill somebody, then you and God can figure out the terms. Don't try to lie and be some deceitful asshole.
7 deadly sins

1.A proud look.
2.A lying tongue.
3.Hands that shed innocent blood.
4.A heart that devises wicked plots.
5.Feet that are swift to run into mischief.
6.A deceitful witness that uttereth lies.
7.Him that soweth discord among brethren.
<<TIMEWATCHER>> (OP)

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01/12/2013 12:30 AM
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Re: What God's Word Says About Self Defense
bump
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"If you love wealth more than liberty, the tranquility of servitude better than the animating contest of freedom, depart from us in peace. We ask not your counsel nor your arms. Crouch down and lick the hand that feeds you. May your chains rest lightly upon you and may posterity forget that you were our countrymen."- Samuel Adams

"...It does not require a majority to prevail, but rather an irate, tireless minority keen to set brush fires in people's minds.."
--Samuel Adams

A man may die, nations may rise and fall, but an idea lives on.
--John F. Kennedy

The cost of freedom is always high, but Americans have always paid it. And one path we shall never choose, and that is the path of surrender, or submission.
--John F. Kennedy

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--John F. Kennedy

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Rising Son
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01/12/2013 12:34 AM

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Excellent thread, OP. You have studied well and I can think of a movie that exemplifies what you are saying here in theatrical form. It is called "Lawless" starring Shia Leboeuf, and it is perhaps one of the finest movies to personify the true difference between vengeance and justice, retribution and redemption. I strongly recommend it for you and everyone else in this thread. Just be cautioned, it does get gory at times and there is some nudity, but the movie as a whole is excellent.
"And God shall wipe away all tears from their eyes; and there shall be no more death, neither sorrow, nor crying, neither shall there be any more pain: for the former things are passed away." - Revelation 21:4

Truth needs no validation because it is self-evident and undeniable. Therefore, anything that requires validation to be realized or justified as truth must contain at least some degree of falsehood.
<<TIMEWATCHER>> (OP)

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01/12/2013 12:44 AM
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Re: What God's Word Says About Self Defense
Excellent thread, OP. You have studied well and I can think of a movie that exemplifies what you are saying here in theatrical form. It is called "Lawless" starring Shia Leboeuf, and it is perhaps one of the finest movies to personify the true difference between vengeance and justice, retribution and redemption. I strongly recommend it for you and everyone else in this thread. Just be cautioned, it does get gory at times and there is some nudity, but the movie as a whole is excellent.
 Quoting: Rising Son


I've watched that movie like 10 times, great movie, Shia leboeuf gets his butt kicks hf and tom does a great good in the movie as forest

Last Edited by <<TIMEWATCHER>> on 01/12/2013 12:44 AM
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The reader is responsible for discerning the validity, factuality or implications of information posted here, be it fictional or based on real events. Moderators on this forum make every effort to review the material posted on this site however, it is not realistically possible for our small staff to manually review each and every one of the more than 20,000 posts GodlikeProductions gets on a daily basis.

The content of posts on this site, including but not limited to links to other web sites, are the expressed opinion of the original poster and are in no way representative of or endorsed by the owners or administration of this website. The posts on this website are the opinion of the specific author and are not statements of advice, opinion, or factual information on behalf of the owner or administration of GodlikeProductions. This site may contain adult language, if you feel you might be offended by such content, you should log off immediately.

Not all posts on this website are intended as truthful or factual assertion by their authors. Some users of this website are participating in internet role playing, with or without the use of an avatar. NO post on this website should be considered factual information on face value alone.

"If you love wealth more than liberty, the tranquility of servitude better than the animating contest of freedom, depart from us in peace. We ask not your counsel nor your arms. Crouch down and lick the hand that feeds you. May your chains rest lightly upon you and may posterity forget that you were our countrymen."- Samuel Adams

"...It does not require a majority to prevail, but rather an irate, tireless minority keen to set brush fires in people's minds.."
--Samuel Adams

A man may die, nations may rise and fall, but an idea lives on.
--John F. Kennedy

The cost of freedom is always high, but Americans have always paid it. And one path we shall never choose, and that is the path of surrender, or submission.
--John F. Kennedy

Mankind must put an end to war before war puts an end to mankind.
--John F. Kennedy

All religions, arts and sciences are branches of the same tree.
--Albert Einstein
-GLP-Christian-
Potential Terrorist Under Svea Banér

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01/12/2013 12:45 AM

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Re: What God's Word Says About Self Defense
And there came the pacifists with their vitriol.
No wonder they don't need no guns seeing the poison they spray from their mouths.

Paul used his sword quite a lot I'd say.

2 Corinthians 11:26 In journeyings often, in perils of waters, in perils of robbers, in perils by mine own countrymen, in perils by the heathen, in perils in the city, in perils in the wilderness, in perils in the sea, in perils among false brethren;

because Paul really just stood there when in perils of robbers... and with the heathen...

yeah sure pacifists sure.
Satan was sending his people to stop the spread of the gospel by force.
I rebuke you all in the name of our Lord Jesus Christ

Last Edited by -GLP-Christian- on 01/12/2013 12:46 AM
Anonymous Coward
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01/12/2013 12:48 AM
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Thank you OP.
Anonymous Coward
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01/12/2013 12:52 AM
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Re: What God's Word Says About Self Defense
I dress with this
The Armor of God

[link to www.acts17-11.com]

yoda
 Quoting: Goofy for God


As you should GFG, when it comes to spiritual warfare.
Anonymous Coward
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01/12/2013 12:56 AM
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...It's mainly the pacificts fault that so many have died in genocides etc. because they were not able to stop tyrants, they will have some serious explaining to do.


...So these pacifists are most likely some sort of wolves in sheeps clothing disarming people, as I understand they're also often part of the ecumenical one world religion bs.
 Quoting: -GLP-Christian-


I've always believed the way you do.

I believe we are told to love each other. However, I believe we are told to stand up to evil and reject it. It's our obligation to defend those who evil would harm both physically and spiritually.
Anonymous Coward
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01/12/2013 01:06 AM
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Re: What God's Word Says About Self Defense
IF SOMEONE STRIKES YOU ON THE CHEEK

TURN TO HIM THE OTHER CHEEK

IF SOMEONE STEALS YOUR CLOAK
OFFER HIM YOUR TUNIC ASWELL




WHAT TO DO ACCORDING THE LORD JESUS, THE MIGHTY GOD, THE EVERLASTING FATHER THE PRINCE OF PEACE, IN REGARDS TO PROPERTY THEFT AND ACTS OF VIOLENCE AGANIST YOUR PERSON.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 31950575


If someone strikes you on the cheek, turn the other cheek = don't seek revenge, for revenge is God's

If someone steals your cloak, offer him your tunic as well = if you feel slighted, or robbed by someone, don't try to slight or rob them in return. This is basically the same as turn the other cheek (don't seek revenge)

In order to grasp the entirety of the message, you have to delve into the linguistics of the original languages. Due to many years, many translations, agendas, and modern language idiosyncrasies, the modern day "pacifist" can pick and choose specific verses to enforce their point of view.

It doesn't make it correct, and it doesn't make it entirely wrong either.

I was fortunate enough to learn Hebrew at a young age, and then Latin/Greek later in life. Older, more original manuscripts of the Bible imply different things when modern day idiosyncrasies are removed from the equation.


Ultimately, what you do, or choose not to do, is between you and God. God didn't make us all the same, and God's will for our lives isn't all the same.
Anonymous Coward
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01/12/2013 01:13 AM
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Re: What God's Word Says About Self Defense
I remember one day after I had bought some weapons and was coating them with a little gun oil before putting them up in the safe. Suddenly I felt the air pressure in the room change and I knew whatever the unseen things were that were always around me were making themselves indelibly apparent. The celing and walls cracked and popped and I knew that they were upset and not happy with my decision to begin collecting fearsome weapons. I looked around, and of course saw nothing with my eyes, but I knew, I knew that He was there. I'm just not a killer. I don't know if I could ever kill another human being, yet I was buying these things because of my fears and...I guess, my lack of faith. I rationalized. Just a hobby, I told myself. I realize though, that if I ever am forced to use these things, I am crossing a boundary. A boundary that has been clearly declared by unseen forces of a spiritual nature....that have made themselves very apparent.

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