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The Last True Church Of Jesus Christ On Earth Is One Of The Heart

 
Rising Son
Clear Eyes, Full Hearts

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01/12/2013 09:50 AM

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The Last True Church Of Jesus Christ On Earth Is One Of The Heart
Many have wondered what the last remaining true church of Jesus Christ on earth may be, and have described this church of people as the bride to be, awaiting the return of Jesus Christ as the bridegroom. Our first instinct when searching for this church is to look at organized religion, such as Catholicism, Lutheranism, Mormonism, Judaism (in a way), etc. This endeavor can be tiring, because after all of the little nuances and differentials among these man-made religions, it begins to feel like there may not be the church we seek for here on Earth.

Do not lose hope, those who have sought the church of Jesus Christ in earnest, because it is in fact here on Earth - it exists within your very heart. It's members are those who have read the bible and developed their own conclusions about the life and teaching of Jesus Christ, conclusions that speak to their intuition and spiritual instinct. Differences in this church are not looked at with anger or indignation, but rather an earnest desire for the truth, and comforting love of family that cannot be duplicated.

All man-made religions are as much right as they are wrong, but they are only wrong because they were created by man who is flawed. Every religion is special in it's own way, much like we as people are, and to take what you can get from that religion as it speaks to your heart is more profound than any words you may hear from another human, because what you have taken from it resonated with your heart, and it felt true. Our Father in heaven knows what dwells within each of our hearts, so do not fear nor feel the need to flee the church you currently attend. Simply go with Christ, and let His Spirit lead you :-)

hf
"And God shall wipe away all tears from their eyes; and there shall be no more death, neither sorrow, nor crying, neither shall there be any more pain: for the former things are passed away." - Revelation 21:4

Truth needs no validation because it is self-evident and undeniable. Therefore, anything that requires validation to be realized or justified as truth must contain at least some degree of falsehood.
Anonymous Coward
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01/12/2013 09:52 AM
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Re: The Last True Church Of Jesus Christ On Earth Is One Of The Heart
Only God can save us now.

Repent with a sincere heart.
Rising Son (OP)
Clear Eyes, Full Hearts

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01/12/2013 10:22 AM

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Re: The Last True Church Of Jesus Christ On Earth Is One Of The Heart
Only God can save us now.

Repent with a sincere heart.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 25672410


This is true, it is God's ultimate power that allows us our salvation, and this is only possible with a pure heart. However, each person must make their own decision whether they will rely on God's awesome might to help them, or whether they choose to hold fast to their earthly possessions.
"And God shall wipe away all tears from their eyes; and there shall be no more death, neither sorrow, nor crying, neither shall there be any more pain: for the former things are passed away." - Revelation 21:4

Truth needs no validation because it is self-evident and undeniable. Therefore, anything that requires validation to be realized or justified as truth must contain at least some degree of falsehood.
andreidita

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01/12/2013 10:31 AM
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Re: The Last True Church Of Jesus Christ On Earth Is One Of The Heart
brother, one amendment though.
it is not necessary to read the bible, but to live upon the principles of the heart, which are spelled also by jesus.

the kingdom of the heart is based upon the living book which is the soul itself.

around 1 year ago i've met by 'chance' in the bus an orthodox monk who lives in the forest and who started a conversation with me, to tell me in the end that the reason he talked with me was to tell me that the hard part of the road is over, and christ will soon come to redeem his bride, and to be strong and carry the cross till the end.

and i did not read the bible. but i live true to the name i was given andrew, i accepted to bear the cross etc.

the bible is a dead book, as long as the living word does not rest in one's heart.
and the living word needs no written books to speak clearly through one's heart
1908247

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01/12/2013 10:35 AM
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Re: The Last True Church Of Jesus Christ On Earth Is One Of The Heart
brother, one amendment though.
it is not necessary to read the bible, but to live upon the principles of the heart, which are spelled also by jesus.

the kingdom of the heart is based upon the living book which is the soul itself.

around 1 year ago i've met by 'chance' in the bus an orthodox monk who lives in the forest and who started a conversation with me, to tell me in the end that the reason he talked with me was to tell me that the hard part of the road is over, and christ will soon come to redeem his bride, and to be strong and carry the cross till the end.

and i did not read the bible. but i live true to the name i was given andrew, i accepted to bear the cross etc.

the bible is a dead book, as long as the living word does not rest in one's heart.
and the living word needs no written books to speak clearly through one's heart
 Quoting: andreidita


wise words

I had an excerpt from some scripture saying exactly that, how the work of the Father is in all things.

My mind is tired though, cant remember which one it was

With faith to receive and love to give we can receive lessons from the most various places (:
- ? Nus.

-You Hold Witness I Witness

As if he could, by himself, say:
_Alive, therefore life itself.
andreidita

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01/12/2013 10:37 AM
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Re: The Last True Church Of Jesus Christ On Earth Is One Of The Heart
Only God can save us now.

Repent with a sincere heart.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 25672410


This is true, it is God's ultimate power that allows us our salvation, and this is only possible with a pure heart. However, each person must make their own decision whether they will rely on God's awesome might to help them, or whether they choose to hold fast to their earthly possessions.
 Quoting: Rising Son


and let's be honest.
those who yell about repenting to other souls, over and over again,
do not know the true christ in their heart
because they are fear mongerers through their words
look at the stories with jesus from the bible, nowhere did he tell to poor souls to repent. when a tortured soul prayed to him for help, he ordered the demons to let that soul in peace.

the true in christ always empowers the soul, he never tries to burden him more by emphasing guilt, the original sin and other tools of fear
Goofy for God
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01/12/2013 10:38 AM

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Re: The Last True Church Of Jesus Christ On Earth Is One Of The Heart
Thanks RS, I have noticed all Spirit filled people this week are busy as we should be,
We all are the True Church each that accept Jesus as their Saviour

There is neither Jew nor Greek, there is neither bond nor free, there is neither male nor female: for ye are all one in Christ Jesus.
Galatians 3


also

1 Corinthians 12:12-26
12 The body is a unit, though it is made up of many parts; and though all its parts are many, they form one body. So it is with Christ. 13 For we were all baptized by one Spirit into one body-whether Jews or Greeks, slave or free-and we were all given the one Spirit to drink.14 Now the body is not made up of one part but of many. 15 If the foot should say, "Because I am not a hand, I do not belong to the body," it would not for that reason cease to be part of the body. 16And if the ear should say, "Because I am not an eye, I do not belong to the body," it would not for that reason cease to be part of the body. 17 If the whole body were an eye, where would the sense of hearing be? If the whole body were an ear, where would the sense of smell be? 18 But in fact God has arranged the parts in the body, every one of them, just as he wanted them to be. 19 If they were all one part, where would the body be? 20 As it is, there are many parts, but one body.21 The eye cannot say to the hand, "I don't need you!" And the head cannot say to the feet, "I don't need you!" 22 On the contrary, those parts of the body that seem to be weaker are indispensable, 23 and the parts that we think are less honorable we treat with special honor. And the parts that are unpresentable are treated with special modesty, 24 while our presentable parts need no special treatment. But God has combined the members of the body and has given greater honor to the parts that lacked it, 25 so that there should be no division in the body, but that its parts should have equal concern for each other. 26 If one part suffers, every part suffers with it; if one part is honored, every part rejoices with it.
Proverbs 15:1
A soft answer turns away wrath, But a harsh word stirs up anger.
andreidita

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01/12/2013 10:44 AM
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Re: The Last True Church Of Jesus Christ On Earth Is One Of The Heart
also ponder why jesus referred to himself as the Son of Man.
that is a universal name, not a particular one.
there is no original sin that any given soul is guilty.
each soul is born pure (you can easily see this in children) and has the right to be a Son or a Daughter of Man.
that it has to overcome the karma/sin of blood/matter, this means bearing the cross of matter for redeeming it.
that many angelic souls fall prey to this spiritual battle is one thing.
but the soul is pure and perfect, and not guilty of any sin.
and one who becomes aware of the soul, has to speak the soul's truth
Rising Son (OP)
Clear Eyes, Full Hearts

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01/12/2013 11:04 AM

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Re: The Last True Church Of Jesus Christ On Earth Is One Of The Heart
brother, one amendment though.
it is not necessary to read the bible, but to live upon the principles of the heart, which are spelled also by jesus.

the kingdom of the heart is based upon the living book which is the soul itself.

around 1 year ago i've met by 'chance' in the bus an orthodox monk who lives in the forest and who started a conversation with me, to tell me in the end that the reason he talked with me was to tell me that the hard part of the road is over, and christ will soon come to redeem his bride, and to be strong and carry the cross till the end.

and i did not read the bible. but i live true to the name i was given andrew, i accepted to bear the cross etc.

the bible is a dead book, as long as the living word does not rest in one's heart.
and the living word needs no written books to speak clearly through one's heart
 Quoting: andreidita


I personally have never read the bible from cover to cover, mainly because I never felt the need to. While many chastised me for it, and I still never felt compelled to read it in it's entirety. However, that did not stop me from reading passages from it, studying it, and discussing it with other people of faith. What I have come to realize is this: the bible is a book written by man but authored by God. As man is fallible, so too it stands to reason that the bible may have misinterpretations, generalizations, and contradictions. The bible is like any of us in that way, it is flawed. However, that does not mean that the book is not worthy of our attention and reverence for the many who have come before us to carry on the message of God through Christ.
"And God shall wipe away all tears from their eyes; and there shall be no more death, neither sorrow, nor crying, neither shall there be any more pain: for the former things are passed away." - Revelation 21:4

Truth needs no validation because it is self-evident and undeniable. Therefore, anything that requires validation to be realized or justified as truth must contain at least some degree of falsehood.
Rising Son (OP)
Clear Eyes, Full Hearts

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01/12/2013 11:07 AM

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Re: The Last True Church Of Jesus Christ On Earth Is One Of The Heart
Only God can save us now.

Repent with a sincere heart.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 25672410


This is true, it is God's ultimate power that allows us our salvation, and this is only possible with a pure heart. However, each person must make their own decision whether they will rely on God's awesome might to help them, or whether they choose to hold fast to their earthly possessions.
 Quoting: Rising Son


and let's be honest.
those who yell about repenting to other souls, over and over again,
do not know the true christ in their heart
because they are fear mongerers through their words
look at the stories with jesus from the bible, nowhere did he tell to poor souls to repent. when a tortured soul prayed to him for help, he ordered the demons to let that soul in peace.

the true in christ always empowers the soul, he never tries to burden him more by emphasing guilt, the original sin and other tools of fear
 Quoting: andreidita


Each person approaches God through Christ in their own way, they certainly do not need a translator for the language of the heart. You are correct, those in need of repentance are already well aware of their plight, what they need is a hug, a kiss, and comforting words - they have suffered enough with the consequences of their own sins.
"And God shall wipe away all tears from their eyes; and there shall be no more death, neither sorrow, nor crying, neither shall there be any more pain: for the former things are passed away." - Revelation 21:4

Truth needs no validation because it is self-evident and undeniable. Therefore, anything that requires validation to be realized or justified as truth must contain at least some degree of falsehood.
Rising Son (OP)
Clear Eyes, Full Hearts

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01/12/2013 11:11 AM

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Re: The Last True Church Of Jesus Christ On Earth Is One Of The Heart
Thanks RS, I have noticed all Spirit filled people this week are busy as we should be,
We all are the True Church each that accept Jesus as their Saviour

There is neither Jew nor Greek, there is neither bond nor free, there is neither male nor female: for ye are all one in Christ Jesus.
Galatians 3


also

1 Corinthians 12:12-26
12 The body is a unit, though it is made up of many parts; and though all its parts are many, they form one body. So it is with Christ. 13 For we were all baptized by one Spirit into one body-whether Jews or Greeks, slave or free-and we were all given the one Spirit to drink.14 Now the body is not made up of one part but of many. 15 If the foot should say, "Because I am not a hand, I do not belong to the body," it would not for that reason cease to be part of the body. 16And if the ear should say, "Because I am not an eye, I do not belong to the body," it would not for that reason cease to be part of the body. 17 If the whole body were an eye, where would the sense of hearing be? If the whole body were an ear, where would the sense of smell be? 18 But in fact God has arranged the parts in the body, every one of them, just as he wanted them to be. 19 If they were all one part, where would the body be? 20 As it is, there are many parts, but one body.21 The eye cannot say to the hand, "I don't need you!" And the head cannot say to the feet, "I don't need you!" 22 On the contrary, those parts of the body that seem to be weaker are indispensable, 23 and the parts that we think are less honorable we treat with special honor. And the parts that are unpresentable are treated with special modesty, 24 while our presentable parts need no special treatment. But God has combined the members of the body and has given greater honor to the parts that lacked it, 25 so that there should be no division in the body, but that its parts should have equal concern for each other. 26 If one part suffers, every part suffers with it; if one part is honored, every part rejoices with it.
 Quoting: Goofy for God


Very true words, but what I would ask of you is to speak plainly in your own words. I do not want you to disgrace the bible, but I do want you to speak from the heart with the evidence the bible has given you. That is the best way to reach others now, and I assure you, many will hear you and listen when your heart does the talking ;-)
"And God shall wipe away all tears from their eyes; and there shall be no more death, neither sorrow, nor crying, neither shall there be any more pain: for the former things are passed away." - Revelation 21:4

Truth needs no validation because it is self-evident and undeniable. Therefore, anything that requires validation to be realized or justified as truth must contain at least some degree of falsehood.
Anonymous Coward
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01/12/2013 11:13 AM
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Re: The Last True Church Of Jesus Christ On Earth Is One Of The Heart
While your brothers and sisters been pressecuted by the enemy you must go on to deligate your freedom to spread His message. Dont fear anything Jesus will be there for you stonger is He that is in you as the world. Time is very short Jesus are comng very soon. God bless
Rising Son (OP)
Clear Eyes, Full Hearts

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01/12/2013 11:20 AM

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Re: The Last True Church Of Jesus Christ On Earth Is One Of The Heart
also ponder why jesus referred to himself as the Son of Man.
that is a universal name, not a particular one.
there is no original sin that any given soul is guilty.
each soul is born pure (you can easily see this in children) and has the right to be a Son or a Daughter of Man.
that it has to overcome the karma/sin of blood/matter, this means bearing the cross of matter for redeeming it.
that many angelic souls fall prey to this spiritual battle is one thing.
but the soul is pure and perfect, and not guilty of any sin.
and one who becomes aware of the soul, has to speak the soul's truth
 Quoting: andreidita


I would ask you to consider this: what exactly is a child's pure nature like? They are young and have little experience, yet they boldly love and hate without recompense or empathy. This is not the evidence of a being born without knowledge of sin, as demonstrated by a child's thoughtless actions towards another.

It is the task of every parent and adult to teach this child the ways of God and the penalty of breaking His Laws, so that they may learn that sin has it's consequences.

The next question we must ask is at what age is baptism appropriate? One of the helpful things I learned from the church of LDS was that a child becomes self-aware around the age of 8. It is at this age that they have been given enough guidance in the way of God's Law, and the time for pardoning for their ignorance has ended.
"And God shall wipe away all tears from their eyes; and there shall be no more death, neither sorrow, nor crying, neither shall there be any more pain: for the former things are passed away." - Revelation 21:4

Truth needs no validation because it is self-evident and undeniable. Therefore, anything that requires validation to be realized or justified as truth must contain at least some degree of falsehood.
Rising Son (OP)
Clear Eyes, Full Hearts

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01/12/2013 11:25 AM

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Re: The Last True Church Of Jesus Christ On Earth Is One Of The Heart
While your brothers and sisters been pressecuted by the enemy you must go on to deligate your freedom to spread His message. Dont fear anything Jesus will be there for you stonger is He that is in you as the world. Time is very short Jesus are comng very soon. God bless
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 29472446


You are right, this is a very fearful time for all of us and our children. We see many people suffering judgement right now, and our faith in our heavenly Father is being tested. What you must realize is that what you are witnessing now has been foretold, and it is but the passing away of evil from this world. Be sure not to lend yourselves to the frenzy of the chaos and lose yourselves in the process. Stay strong, and cling to the teachings that Jesus Christ has given us. The wicked will feast upon themselves, for that is their nature, it is not ours.
"And God shall wipe away all tears from their eyes; and there shall be no more death, neither sorrow, nor crying, neither shall there be any more pain: for the former things are passed away." - Revelation 21:4

Truth needs no validation because it is self-evident and undeniable. Therefore, anything that requires validation to be realized or justified as truth must contain at least some degree of falsehood.
dglnomore

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01/12/2013 11:26 AM
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Re: The Last True Church Of Jesus Christ On Earth Is One Of The Heart
Many have wondered what the last remaining true church of Jesus Christ on earth may be, and have described this church of people as the bride to be, awaiting the return of Jesus Christ as the bridegroom. Our first instinct when searching for this church is to look at organized religion, such as Catholicism, Lutheranism, Mormonism, Judaism (in a way), etc. This endeavor can be tiring, because after all of the little nuances and differentials among these man-made religions, it begins to feel like there may not be the church we seek for here on Earth.

Do not lose hope, those who have sought the church of Jesus Christ in earnest, because it is in fact here on Earth - it exists within your very heart. It's members are those who have read the bible and developed their own conclusions about the life and teaching of Jesus Christ, conclusions that speak to their intuition and spiritual instinct. Differences in this church are not looked at with anger or indignation, but rather an earnest desire for the truth, and comforting love of family that cannot be duplicated.

All man-made religions are as much right as they are wrong, but they are only wrong because they were created by man who is flawed. Every religion is special in it's own way, much like we as people are, and to take what you can get from that religion as it speaks to your heart is more profound than any words you may hear from another human, because what you have taken from it resonated with your heart, and it felt true. Our Father in heaven knows what dwells within each of our hearts, so do not fear nor feel the need to flee the church you currently attend. Simply go with Christ, and let His Spirit lead you :-)

hf
 Quoting: Rising Son


I think, to a large degree, you are absolutely correct. But may I suggest an alternate theory based on my experience with the Holy Spirit leading me? In my case, and maybe because I have always yearned for a very spiritual connection with God, and have been drawn to ritual, the answer was within the Catholic church.

Personally, I had some things happen in my life that I just could not reconcile with what the bible teaches and what my, or any other, Protestant denominations taught. I think that, because I could not find a solid answer, I ended up moving farther away from God - into a more New Age spirituality - following what I felt was right in my spirit. While it didn't feel so at the time, this was a disaster, and I finally found myself being drawn back to seeking one Truth. Long story short - I found it in the Catholic church. Having been raised Protestant, I had all kinds of thoughts about Catholics - they are idolators, they don't have a real relationship with Christ, and on and on. This was all false.

Through many moments of God's grace, I was able to see, for the first time, the true message of the Gospel - when Jesus says, 'deny yourself, pick up your cross and follow me.' Once I did that - made a sacrifice of something important to me by giving it up to God's will, in the name of Christ and out of love for another person, that was when God truly came into my life and revealed himself to me and the depth of his love for me and for all mankind. Also, I knew that there were some devout Catholics praying for me, and I was amazed at the things that were happening to me spiritually - all my prayers for guidance being answered, etc. So, out of respect for them, one day when I just happened to find myself in a Catholic bookstore wondering what I could pick up to help me in my Christian journey that 'wasn't Catholic', I decided to pick up a book about explaining the Communion of Saints to non-Catholics. I was absolutely amazed by how I had been misled about the Church and how much Catholic belief lines up with my beliefs about God and spirituality.

I started to read the Catechism, and found myself reading a description of how the Church believes that God calls us and reveals himself to us - which just happened to be EXACTLY what happened to me in my journey. I kept reading, and everything made sense - and lined up with what the bible teaches. As a Protestant, when reading the bible, I had always come across some troubling passages that would make me think, 'Ok, so why does my church teach/believe such and so, when the bible says this?' That did not happen once while reading the Catechism of the Catholic church.

I had read the book of Acts, and had been thinking, 'if only I could find that one true church that Jesus established - the beliefs of the original Apostles.' Guess what - the early Church founders were Catholics.

Now we get really complicated, because the Catholic Church has had a very difficult history, no? Lots of scandal, even corrupt leaders - up to the Pope. But, the Church teaches, and I have come to believe, that, regardless of the human failings of the men who lead the church, God still protects and ensures, through the Holy Spirit working through the magisterium, that its teachings are the Truth. So, in that sense, it is not a 'man-made' religion, but a religion given to us by God.

I would just warn that we can't always rely on our own conclusions about the teachings of Jesus. I had come to certain conclusions before I started exploring the Catholic faith that, after much prayer and consideration, I have found to be completely against the Word of God. As much as I tried to rationalize and argue it with the Lord, the Spirit was insistent, and kept leading me back to a different answer - an answer that is really not socially and politically popular, but is found within the teachings of the Catholic church.

On that note, we must realize that the 'enemy' is very cunning, and can infiltrate our thoughts. But, within the rich, 2000 year-old history of the Catholic church, the writings and teachings of its leaders and the Saints, as well as the sacraments (including Holy Communion which is the actual body and blood of Christ), are all the tools we need to learn how to discern between the true influence of the Holy Spirit and the assaults of the enemy.

That comforting love of family that you speak of - I find that nowhere is that more encouraged and/or valued than within the teaching of Catholicism.

Please don't view this as an attempt to get people to join the Catholic church. I do believe that we have to follow our hearts and souls, and, in my case, I just knew that that was where the Holy Spirit was leading me, and that was where my heart and soul are most fed. I find it to be the fullness of the Christian faith, and the Truth of Christ - a supplement to the wonderful foundation that I received in the Protestant church. I only hope that others might be open to the possibility of finding what I have found.

So, yes, truly, let the Holy Spirit lead you - just make sure that it IS, truly the Holy Spirit!
Judethz
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01/12/2013 11:27 AM

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flo11 BUMP
dglnomore

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01/12/2013 11:35 AM
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Re: The Last True Church Of Jesus Christ On Earth Is One Of The Heart
brother, one amendment though.
it is not necessary to read the bible, but to live upon the principles of the heart, which are spelled also by jesus.

the kingdom of the heart is based upon the living book which is the soul itself.

around 1 year ago i've met by 'chance' in the bus an orthodox monk who lives in the forest and who started a conversation with me, to tell me in the end that the reason he talked with me was to tell me that the hard part of the road is over, and christ will soon come to redeem his bride, and to be strong and carry the cross till the end.

and i did not read the bible. but i live true to the name i was given andrew, i accepted to bear the cross etc.

the bible is a dead book, as long as the living word does not rest in one's heart.
and the living word needs no written books to speak clearly through one's heart
 Quoting: andreidita



Beautiful post, but I disagree that the bible is a dead book. The bible is very much alive and is a wonderful tool with which the Holy Spirit can teach us. The book of John, in particular, I have found to be amazingly alive and versatile. But it becomes alive when we read it in conjunction with the Holy Spirit. I agree, the bible is just one of the tools that God has given us. There are many others - the teachings of the early church, the sacraments of the Catholic church, the lives and writings of the Saints who have come before us and in whom we can find strength and inspiration. God is truly great and loving in the way he cares for us, and uses others to teach us - we just need to seek it out and/or be open to his works.
dglnomore

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01/12/2013 11:37 AM
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Re: The Last True Church Of Jesus Christ On Earth Is One Of The Heart
brother, one amendment though.
it is not necessary to read the bible, but to live upon the principles of the heart, which are spelled also by jesus.

the kingdom of the heart is based upon the living book which is the soul itself.

around 1 year ago i've met by 'chance' in the bus an orthodox monk who lives in the forest and who started a conversation with me, to tell me in the end that the reason he talked with me was to tell me that the hard part of the road is over, and christ will soon come to redeem his bride, and to be strong and carry the cross till the end.

and i did not read the bible. but i live true to the name i was given andrew, i accepted to bear the cross etc.

the bible is a dead book, as long as the living word does not rest in one's heart.
and the living word needs no written books to speak clearly through one's heart
 Quoting: andreidita


wise words

I had an excerpt from some scripture saying exactly that, how the work of the Father is in all things.

My mind is tired though, cant remember which one it was

With faith to receive and love to give we can receive lessons from the most various places (:
 Quoting: 1908247


AMEN!
Rising Son (OP)
Clear Eyes, Full Hearts

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01/12/2013 11:45 AM

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Re: The Last True Church Of Jesus Christ On Earth Is One Of The Heart
Many have wondered what the last remaining true church of Jesus Christ on earth may be, and have described this church of people as the bride to be, awaiting the return of Jesus Christ as the bridegroom. Our first instinct when searching for this church is to look at organized religion, such as Catholicism, Lutheranism, Mormonism, Judaism (in a way), etc. This endeavor can be tiring, because after all of the little nuances and differentials among these man-made religions, it begins to feel like there may not be the church we seek for here on Earth.

Do not lose hope, those who have sought the church of Jesus Christ in earnest, because it is in fact here on Earth - it exists within your very heart. It's members are those who have read the bible and developed their own conclusions about the life and teaching of Jesus Christ, conclusions that speak to their intuition and spiritual instinct. Differences in this church are not looked at with anger or indignation, but rather an earnest desire for the truth, and comforting love of family that cannot be duplicated.

All man-made religions are as much right as they are wrong, but they are only wrong because they were created by man who is flawed. Every religion is special in it's own way, much like we as people are, and to take what you can get from that religion as it speaks to your heart is more profound than any words you may hear from another human, because what you have taken from it resonated with your heart, and it felt true. Our Father in heaven knows what dwells within each of our hearts, so do not fear nor feel the need to flee the church you currently attend. Simply go with Christ, and let His Spirit lead you :-)

hf
 Quoting: Rising Son


I think, to a large degree, you are absolutely correct. But may I suggest an alternate theory based on my experience with the Holy Spirit leading me? In my case, and maybe because I have always yearned for a very spiritual connection with God, and have been drawn to ritual, the answer was within the Catholic church.

Personally, I had some things happen in my life that I just could not reconcile with what the bible teaches and what my, or any other, Protestant denominations taught. I think that, because I could not find a solid answer, I ended up moving farther away from God - into a more New Age spirituality - following what I felt was right in my spirit. While it didn't feel so at the time, this was a disaster, and I finally found myself being drawn back to seeking one Truth. Long story short - I found it in the Catholic church. Having been raised Protestant, I had all kinds of thoughts about Catholics - they are idolators, they don't have a real relationship with Christ, and on and on. This was all false.

Through many moments of God's grace, I was able to see, for the first time, the true message of the Gospel - when Jesus says, 'deny yourself, pick up your cross and follow me.' Once I did that - made a sacrifice of something important to me by giving it up to God's will, in the name of Christ and out of love for another person, that was when God truly came into my life and revealed himself to me and the depth of his love for me and for all mankind. Also, I knew that there were some devout Catholics praying for me, and I was amazed at the things that were happening to me spiritually - all my prayers for guidance being answered, etc. So, out of respect for them, one day when I just happened to find myself in a Catholic bookstore wondering what I could pick up to help me in my Christian journey that 'wasn't Catholic', I decided to pick up a book about explaining the Communion of Saints to non-Catholics. I was absolutely amazed by how I had been misled about the Church and how much Catholic belief lines up with my beliefs about God and spirituality.

I started to read the Catechism, and found myself reading a description of how the Church believes that God calls us and reveals himself to us - which just happened to be EXACTLY what happened to me in my journey. I kept reading, and everything made sense - and lined up with what the bible teaches. As a Protestant, when reading the bible, I had always come across some troubling passages that would make me think, 'Ok, so why does my church teach/believe such and so, when the bible says this?' That did not happen once while reading the Catechism of the Catholic church.

I had read the book of Acts, and had been thinking, 'if only I could find that one true church that Jesus established - the beliefs of the original Apostles.' Guess what - the early Church founders were Catholics.

Now we get really complicated, because the Catholic Church has had a very difficult history, no? Lots of scandal, even corrupt leaders - up to the Pope. But, the Church teaches, and I have come to believe, that, regardless of the human failings of the men who lead the church, God still protects and ensures, through the Holy Spirit working through the magisterium, that its teachings are the Truth. So, in that sense, it is not a 'man-made' religion, but a religion given to us by God.

I would just warn that we can't always rely on our own conclusions about the teachings of Jesus. I had come to certain conclusions before I started exploring the Catholic faith that, after much prayer and consideration, I have found to be completely against the Word of God. As much as I tried to rationalize and argue it with the Lord, the Spirit was insistent, and kept leading me back to a different answer - an answer that is really not socially and politically popular, but is found within the teachings of the Catholic church.

On that note, we must realize that the 'enemy' is very cunning, and can infiltrate our thoughts. But, within the rich, 2000 year-old history of the Catholic church, the writings and teachings of its leaders and the Saints, as well as the sacraments (including Holy Communion which is the actual body and blood of Christ), are all the tools we need to learn how to discern between the true influence of the Holy Spirit and the assaults of the enemy.

That comforting love of family that you speak of - I find that nowhere is that more encouraged and/or valued than within the teaching of Catholicism.

Please don't view this as an attempt to get people to join the Catholic church. I do believe that we have to follow our hearts and souls, and, in my case, I just knew that that was where the Holy Spirit was leading me, and that was where my heart and soul are most fed. I find it to be the fullness of the Christian faith, and the Truth of Christ - a supplement to the wonderful foundation that I received in the Protestant church. I only hope that others might be open to the possibility of finding what I have found.

So, yes, truly, let the Holy Spirit lead you - just make sure that it IS, truly the Holy Spirit!
 Quoting: dglnomore


Thank you for offering your perception with us, you have sought our Father in earnest, and you have found the answers you seek.

I was raised Roman Catholic in upstate NY, I was an altar boy, I attended Catholic elementary and high schools, I participated in passion plays (we called it mystery plays), and I have followed the Catholic faith fervently until a few years ago. I received everything I know from the Catholic faith, and I am extremely grateful.

However, the Catholic religion has been tainted and polluted since the beginning of Christianity, and this was mostly done in the efforts of making it more universal to all people. This is includes the indoctrination of many pagan traditions by the Roman Empire to prolong their reign, the eradication of many gospels at the Council of Nicaea, the Crusades, and leading up to today with the scandals of molestation and opulence that have riddled the church.

The biggest digression from the true church of Christ was the indoctrination of the papacy. To claim that any person or group of believers needs an intercessor or liaison between them and God is contradictory, despite the church's best efforts at maintaining that the pope is only the leader of the church. The first pope Peter was intended to be a guide, a shepherd, but there is only one shepherd of God's flock, and that is Jesus Christ.
"And God shall wipe away all tears from their eyes; and there shall be no more death, neither sorrow, nor crying, neither shall there be any more pain: for the former things are passed away." - Revelation 21:4

Truth needs no validation because it is self-evident and undeniable. Therefore, anything that requires validation to be realized or justified as truth must contain at least some degree of falsehood.
andreidita

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Re: The Last True Church Of Jesus Christ On Earth Is One Of The Heart
brother, one amendment though.
it is not necessary to read the bible, but to live upon the principles of the heart, which are spelled also by jesus.

the kingdom of the heart is based upon the living book which is the soul itself.

around 1 year ago i've met by 'chance' in the bus an orthodox monk who lives in the forest and who started a conversation with me, to tell me in the end that the reason he talked with me was to tell me that the hard part of the road is over, and christ will soon come to redeem his bride, and to be strong and carry the cross till the end.

and i did not read the bible. but i live true to the name i was given andrew, i accepted to bear the cross etc.

the bible is a dead book, as long as the living word does not rest in one's heart.
and the living word needs no written books to speak clearly through one's heart
 Quoting: andreidita



Beautiful post, but I disagree that the bible is a dead book. The bible is very much alive and is a wonderful tool with which the Holy Spirit can teach us. The book of John, in particular, I have found to be amazingly alive and versatile. But it becomes alive when we read it in conjunction with the Holy Spirit. I agree, the bible is just one of the tools that God has given us. There are many others - the teachings of the early church, the sacraments of the Catholic church, the lives and writings of the Saints who have come before us and in whom we can find strength and inspiration. God is truly great and loving in the way he cares for us, and uses others to teach us - we just need to seek it out and/or be open to his works.
 Quoting: dglnomore


it is dead by itself. and this is obvious from the many crimes comitted in the name of the bible, or of christ.

in conjunction with the Holy Spirit indeed it becomes alive, the book of john especially (from my experience).

but let us not forget that the Book of Life is the Universe itself, and those with a pure heart in christ who are able to read the book life hear the message of the spirit through anykind of things from clouds to holy books
Rising Son (OP)
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Re: The Last True Church Of Jesus Christ On Earth Is One Of The Heart
brother, one amendment though.
it is not necessary to read the bible, but to live upon the principles of the heart, which are spelled also by jesus.

the kingdom of the heart is based upon the living book which is the soul itself.

around 1 year ago i've met by 'chance' in the bus an orthodox monk who lives in the forest and who started a conversation with me, to tell me in the end that the reason he talked with me was to tell me that the hard part of the road is over, and christ will soon come to redeem his bride, and to be strong and carry the cross till the end.

and i did not read the bible. but i live true to the name i was given andrew, i accepted to bear the cross etc.

the bible is a dead book, as long as the living word does not rest in one's heart.
and the living word needs no written books to speak clearly through one's heart
 Quoting: andreidita



Beautiful post, but I disagree that the bible is a dead book. The bible is very much alive and is a wonderful tool with which the Holy Spirit can teach us. The book of John, in particular, I have found to be amazingly alive and versatile. But it becomes alive when we read it in conjunction with the Holy Spirit. I agree, the bible is just one of the tools that God has given us. There are many others - the teachings of the early church, the sacraments of the Catholic church, the lives and writings of the Saints who have come before us and in whom we can find strength and inspiration. God is truly great and loving in the way he cares for us, and uses others to teach us - we just need to seek it out and/or be open to his works.
 Quoting: dglnomore


it is dead by itself. and this is obvious from the many crimes comitted in the name of the bible, or of christ.

in conjunction with the Holy Spirit indeed it becomes alive, the book of john especially (from my experience).

but let us not forget that the Book of Life is the Universe itself, and those with a pure heart in christ who are able to read the book life hear the message of the spirit through anykind of things from clouds to holy books
 Quoting: andreidita


You are both right, yet if you notice, you both have more similarities than differences, and the common ground we all share will be the foundation of this church, both literally and figuratively.
"And God shall wipe away all tears from their eyes; and there shall be no more death, neither sorrow, nor crying, neither shall there be any more pain: for the former things are passed away." - Revelation 21:4

Truth needs no validation because it is self-evident and undeniable. Therefore, anything that requires validation to be realized or justified as truth must contain at least some degree of falsehood.
Anonymous Coward
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Re: The Last True Church Of Jesus Christ On Earth Is One Of The Heart
Hey OP, I was in seminary for about 3 years, dropped out because I realized they were manufacturing professionals to "manage" the church. That was not the reason I attended in the first place.

The best book I have read in the past 10 years (including seminary) was Pagan Christianity by Frank Viola. I read this after I dropped out of seminary, it taught me many many things they conveniently left out of their curriculum.

[link to www.amazon.com]

.
Rising Son (OP)
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Re: The Last True Church Of Jesus Christ On Earth Is One Of The Heart
Hey OP, I was in seminary for about 3 years, dropped out because I realized they were manufacturing professionals to "manage" the church. That was not the reason I attended in the first place.

The best book I have read in the past 10 years (including seminary) was Pagan Christianity by Frank Viola. I read this after I dropped out of seminary, it taught me many many things they conveniently left out of their curriculum.

[link to www.amazon.com]

.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 961432


I understand what you are saying, and I appreciate your ardent desire to seek out the Lord God. However, I would suggest that you not let the frailty of men detract from that endeavor, and that you continue to search for God. I would also suggest reading this thread in it's entirety, because I spoke about the pagan origins of Catholicism earlier. As I am sure you would agree, Catholicism and Christianity are not mutually inclusive.
"And God shall wipe away all tears from their eyes; and there shall be no more death, neither sorrow, nor crying, neither shall there be any more pain: for the former things are passed away." - Revelation 21:4

Truth needs no validation because it is self-evident and undeniable. Therefore, anything that requires validation to be realized or justified as truth must contain at least some degree of falsehood.
andreidita

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01/12/2013 12:54 PM
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Re: The Last True Church Of Jesus Christ On Earth Is One Of The Heart
also ponder why jesus referred to himself as the Son of Man.
that is a universal name, not a particular one.
there is no original sin that any given soul is guilty.
each soul is born pure (you can easily see this in children) and has the right to be a Son or a Daughter of Man.
that it has to overcome the karma/sin of blood/matter, this means bearing the cross of matter for redeeming it.
that many angelic souls fall prey to this spiritual battle is one thing.
but the soul is pure and perfect, and not guilty of any sin.
and one who becomes aware of the soul, has to speak the soul's truth
 Quoting: andreidita


I would ask you to consider this: what exactly is a child's pure nature like? They are young and have little experience, yet they boldly love and hate without recompense or empathy. This is not the evidence of a being born without knowledge of sin, as demonstrated by a child's thoughtless actions towards another.

It is the task of every parent and adult to teach this child the ways of God and the penalty of breaking His Laws, so that they may learn that sin has it's consequences.

The next question we must ask is at what age is baptism appropriate? One of the helpful things I learned from the church of LDS was that a child becomes self-aware around the age of 8. It is at this age that they have been given enough guidance in the way of God's Law, and the time for pardoning for their ignorance has ended.
 Quoting: Rising Son


until the age of 7 the child is under the protection of the guardian angel.
i am sure that many times you had the chance to see the angel in the eyes of a child.
this does not mean that this applies for every child born. but this are complicated details.

what do you think jesus referred by saying to be like a child?

a child born is first a soul born in matter, and as such it does not suffer for lack of wisdom, and the protection of the holy spirit applies by default.

after 7 one has the free will to depart from god, not the free will to accept it, because he was born in god's presence in the first place.

to put the question of baptism under the scope of self/awareness and free will is to put it from ego s perspective (the sinner if you wish)

from soul's perspective (the sinless one) baptism takes place at birth through the power of the holy spirit to give one's soul divine protection in the early years so that it may be able to fulfill its mission.

ponder why when one wishes to change faith from a classical strand of christianity (in which baptism is given at birth) to a more modern one, one has first to renounce by its own free will the original baptism he has received, on grounds that it was null.

if it would have been null, there would be no need in the first place to renounce it, because it has no effect.
also, baptism received at birth, when one is not in a position to express free will, precisely because of this can not be the work of the adversary, because he is bound to respect one's free will.
so if it has any effect, it is only the protection of holy spirit.
on the other hand, renouncing by free will one's birth baptism, and choosing by free will another baptism is susceptible to the work of the adversary, because it is done under the scope of free will.

and in such cases the advice to question the nature of a spirit applies.

Last Edited by andreidita on 01/12/2013 12:55 PM
andreidita

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Re: The Last True Church Of Jesus Christ On Earth Is One Of The Heart
You are both right, yet if you notice, you both have more similarities than differences, and the common ground we all share will be the foundation of this church, both literally and figuratively.
 Quoting: Rising Son


yep i am sure that we are both fully aware of the similarities :)
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Re: The Last True Church Of Jesus Christ On Earth Is One Of The Heart
Hey OP, I was in seminary for about 3 years, dropped out because I realized they were manufacturing professionals to "manage" the church. That was not the reason I attended in the first place.

The best book I have read in the past 10 years (including seminary) was Pagan Christianity by Frank Viola. I read this after I dropped out of seminary, it taught me many many things they conveniently left out of their curriculum.

[link to www.amazon.com]

.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 961432


I understand what you are saying, and I appreciate your ardent desire to seek out the Lord God. However, I would suggest that you not let the frailty of men detract from that endeavor, and that you continue to search for God. I would also suggest reading this thread in it's entirety, because I spoke about the pagan origins of Catholicism earlier. As I am sure you would agree, Catholicism and Christianity are not mutually inclusive.
 Quoting: Rising Son


Thanks for the encouragement. However, IMO, there is very little difference between the Catholic Church and the Protestant Church in practice. The differences lie in theology, not practice.

Both attend meetings in "official" buildings. Both have a professional who presents his preferred method of interpretation. Both follow a liturgy. Both induce a separation of church and life, meaning church is the building, once you leave the building you leave the church.

Christianity is life, is practice of the principles every day in your life with others. It is not some dedicated building where people gather for an hour and a half once a week. Modern Christianity is dogma, for lack of a better word. It is religion not faith in practice.

I hope you are open to what I am trying to describe.

.
ROM74

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Re: The Last True Church Of Jesus Christ On Earth Is One Of The Heart
John 5:37-40
You have neither heard the Father's voice nor seen his form.
But you do not have His word abiding in you, because whom He sent, Him you do not believe.
You search the Scriptures, for in them you think you have eternal life; and these are they which testify of Me.
But you are not willing to come to me that you may have life.

Here Jesus makes a clear distinction between the word of God, and the Scriptures.
Jesus speaks of His word abiding in you. The word is near you; it is in your mouth and in your heart. Rom 10:8

Daniel 9:2
in the first year of his reign, I, Daniel, understood from the Scriptures, according to the word of the LORD given to Jeremiah the prophet, that the desolation of Jerusalem would last seventy years.

As seen above, the scriptures and the word of the Lord are different.
The word of God is living and active, Heb 10:12
Jesus said, The words that I speak to you are spirit, and they are life-giving. John 6:63

2 Peter 3:15-17
and consider that the longsuffering of our Lord is salvation—as also our beloved brother Paul, according to the wisdom given to him, has written to you,
as also in all his [Paul's] epistles, speaking in them of these things; in which are some things hard to be understood, which they that are unlearned and unstable wrest, as they do also the other scriptures, unto their own destruction.
You therefore, beloved, since you know this beforehand, beware lest you also fall from your own steadfastness, being led away with the error of the wicked;
(Peter also categorizes Paul's epistles as scriptures.)

Matthew 21:42
Jesus saith unto them, Did you never read in the scriptures, The stone which the builders rejected, the same is become the head of the corner: this is the Lord's doing, and it is marvellous in our eyes?

Matthew 22:29
Jesus answered and said unto them, you do err, not knowing the scriptures, nor the power of God.

Matthew 26:54
But how then would the Scriptures be fulfilled that say it must happen in this way?"

Matthew 26:56
But all this was done, that the scriptures of the prophets might be fulfilled. Then all the disciples forsook him, and fled.

Mark 12:24
And Jesus answering said unto them, Do you not therefore err, because you do know not the scriptures, neither the power of God?

Mark 14:49
I was daily with you in the temple teaching, and you did not arrest me: but the scriptures must be fulfilled.

Luke 24:27
And beginning at Moses and all the prophets, he expounded unto them in all the scriptures the things concerning himself.

Luke 24:32
And they said one to another, Did not our heart burn within us, while he talked with us by the way, and while he opened to us the scriptures?

Luke 24:45
Then opened he their understanding, that they might understand the scriptures.

Acts 17:2
And Paul, as his manner was, went in unto them, and three sabbath days reasoned with them out of the scriptures.

Acts 17:11
These were more noble than those in Thessalonica, in that they received the word with all readiness of mind, and searched the scriptures daily, whether those things were so.

Acts 18:24
And a certain Jew named Apollos, born at Alexandria, an eloquent man, and mighty in the scriptures, came to Ephesus.

Acts 18:28
For he mightily convinced the Jews, and that publicly, shewing by the scriptures that Jesus was Christ.

Romans 1:2
(Which he had promised before by his prophets in the holy scriptures,)

Romans 15:4
For whatsoever things were written aforetime were written for our learning, that we through patience and comfort of the scriptures might have hope.

Romans 16:26
But now is made manifest, and by the scriptures of the prophets, according to the commandment of the everlasting God, made known to all nations for the obedience of faith.

1 Corinthians 15:3
For I delivered unto you first of all that which I also received, how that Christ died for our sins according to the scriptures.

1 Corinthians 15:4
And that he was buried, and that he rose again the third day according to the scriptures.

2 Timothy 3:15
And that from a child thou hast known the holy scriptures, which are able to make thee wise unto salvation through faith which is in Christ Jesus.
ROM74
andreidita

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Re: The Last True Church Of Jesus Christ On Earth Is One Of The Heart
and rising son please do not take my words as some kind of attack. i speak them based on how i perceive you through our conversation.

and i sense in this thread a note in what you say that is a little different, altough the core of the message is the familiar one :)

and if you raise such deep question, it is a good moment for truth
Rising Son (OP)
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Re: The Last True Church Of Jesus Christ On Earth Is One Of The Heart
also ponder why jesus referred to himself as the Son of Man.
that is a universal name, not a particular one.
there is no original sin that any given soul is guilty.
each soul is born pure (you can easily see this in children) and has the right to be a Son or a Daughter of Man.
that it has to overcome the karma/sin of blood/matter, this means bearing the cross of matter for redeeming it.
that many angelic souls fall prey to this spiritual battle is one thing.
but the soul is pure and perfect, and not guilty of any sin.
and one who becomes aware of the soul, has to speak the soul's truth
 Quoting: andreidita


I would ask you to consider this: what exactly is a child's pure nature like? They are young and have little experience, yet they boldly love and hate without recompense or empathy. This is not the evidence of a being born without knowledge of sin, as demonstrated by a child's thoughtless actions towards another.

It is the task of every parent and adult to teach this child the ways of God and the penalty of breaking His Laws, so that they may learn that sin has it's consequences.

The next question we must ask is at what age is baptism appropriate? One of the helpful things I learned from the church of LDS was that a child becomes self-aware around the age of 8. It is at this age that they have been given enough guidance in the way of God's Law, and the time for pardoning for their ignorance has ended.
 Quoting: Rising Son


until the age of 7 the child is under the protection of the guardian angel.
i am sure that many times you had the chance to see the angel in the eyes of a child.
this does not mean that this applies for every child born. but this are complicated details.

what do you think jesus referred by saying to be like a child?

a child born is first a soul born in matter, and as such it does not suffer for lack of wisdom, and the protection of the holy spirit applies by default.

after 7 one has the free will to depart from god, not the free will to accept it, because he was born in god's presence in the first place.

to put the question of baptism under the scope of self/awareness and free will is to put it from ego s perspective (the sinner if you wish)

from soul's perspective (the sinless one) baptism takes place at birth through the power of the holy spirit to give one's soul divine protection in the early years so that it may be able to fulfill its mission.

ponder why when one wishes to change faith from a classical strand of christianity (in which baptism is given at birth) to a more modern one, one has first to renounce by its own free will the original baptism he has received, on grounds that it was null.

if it would have been null, there would be no need in the first place to renounce it, because it has no effect.
also, baptism received at birth, when one is not in a position to express free will, precisely because of this can not be the work of the adversary, because he is bound to respect one's free will.
so if it has any effect, it is only the protection of holy spirit.
on the other hand, renouncing by free will one's birth baptism, and choosing by free will another baptism is susceptible to the work of the adversary, because it is done under the scope of free will.

and in such cases the advice to question the nature of a spirit applies.
 Quoting: andreidita


While I would agree that children are under the protection of guardian angels, I do not see how that necessarily negates their original sin. At this point, we would have to delve into the semantics and specifics of the practice of baptism and what it entails in order to find common ground in it's utility. In order for baptism to be effective, the child must fully understand what it is that they are being cleansed of, and what this means in regards to their accountability for sin from that day forth. This must be powerful enough to drive the point home with them, without causing them any emotional trauma or pain. In other words, it should be a positive reinforcing experience, and not a negative one.
"And God shall wipe away all tears from their eyes; and there shall be no more death, neither sorrow, nor crying, neither shall there be any more pain: for the former things are passed away." - Revelation 21:4

Truth needs no validation because it is self-evident and undeniable. Therefore, anything that requires validation to be realized or justified as truth must contain at least some degree of falsehood.
andreidita

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01/12/2013 01:06 PM
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Re: The Last True Church Of Jesus Christ On Earth Is One Of The Heart
the spirit of love/truth was hijacked in many ways.

the god of the old testament (the jealous one) is not the god of love.

neither is the god speaking in the quran at least in some places.

a god that needs to name itself creator god, master etc is not a god of love/truth

this is evident for anyone who really created something in love/truth spirit. he has no need to pose himself as a creator, to demand respect and recognition.

the act of creation is sufficient in itself. this is the way of love/truth.
andreidita

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Re: The Last True Church Of Jesus Christ On Earth Is One Of The Heart
While I would agree that children are under the protection of guardian angels, I do not see how that necessarily negates their original sin. At this point, we would have to delve into the semantics and specifics of the practice of baptism and what it entails in order to find common ground in it's utility. In order for baptism to be effective, the child must fully understand what it is that they are being cleansed of, and what this means in regards to their accountability for sin from that day forth. This must be powerful enough to drive the point home with them, without causing them any emotional trauma or pain. In other words, it should be a positive reinforcing experience, and not a negative one.
 Quoting: Rising Son


what is then the original sin that you as a soul are guilty of, dear brother?

the soul that indwells me is of the pure nature of universal love.
and it entered my body through the portal opened through the pure love between my parents.
it was fed in the gestation process with pure love.
it is sinless. as any other heveanly soul.

the concept of original sin makes sense only to the karma of blood/matter/generation/animal soul

the Son of Man, or the Heavenly Man, or Human proper knows no Sin because it is made in the image of god.

it only has to overcome the karma of flesh which may be easier or harder depending on case

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