New, approved flu vaccine represents landmark in flu vaccine technology...

And that's my view too.
It's hard enough for anyone to make decisions about having vaccines when people like Mopar post rubbish and claim it's fact.
That's where I'm coming from.
I'm not anti nor pro-vaccine.
I am anti-bullshit though.

You still don't get how things are reported do you?

Once again, an event is reported if it occurs in a certain time-frame post vaccination. These events do not take into account concurrent medications nor the patient's current health.
I.e. the adverse event does not have to be proven to have been caused by the vaccination, just that it happened.

So onto Janny's "evidence".
VAERS tables, as I hinted at earlier, are just a data dump. There is no comparative control group nor is there any way of splitting events from those actually caused by Gardsail to "natural" events. You know, those ones that occur all the time anyway.
Do you see what I'm getting at?

What you NEED to do, to offer REAL proof is to analyse each and every report, checking on any other medications, current health problems, time of onset etc etc etc.
VAERS really cannot be used to prove anything at all.

In fact if you look around you can find plenty of evidence of litigation lawyers manipulating VAERS data and even completing adverse event reports!

Certainly on your part it shows one of two things (probably both though); a complete lack of understanding of how you need to interpret and present data properly and an agenda which you are pushing.

Now the reasons for your agenda could be several;

A bad experience following a vaccine or other medical treatment (whether to yourself or someone else).
You have tried to claim or are in the middle of a litigation claim.
You follow the anti-vax nonsense like a sheep.
You really don't understand what you're doing, you just regurgitate nonsense.

As for doctors NOT reporting events...this shows that you don't understand the medico-legal aspects of reporting either.
A doctor is more likely to be sued if (s)he HASN"T filed a report rather than whether they have. The event reports are there to PROTECT doctors otherwise no doctor in their right mind would even consider filing a report. Ergo, what you find in the real world is that events are always over-reported.
As I mentioned earlier though, it's certainly not just doctors who file reports, non-medical staff file them too.

So to summarise, using VAERS to prove the correlation of vaccines with adverse events is like using sugar sales to prove the incidence of diabetes.
They're not related.

OK Mopar28m, show us.

I searched the VAERS database and found only 100 cases where "death" is listed as a possible symptom.
That is the entire VAERS database including the period from June 8, 2006 to present, which is the life of GARDASIL from approval to present.
100 cases total.
In 6.5+ years.
In VAERS.

Please lead us through your search of the database which gave you 100 deaths per month.
It is obvious you made it up to convince the gullible that GARDASIL kills.
You lied.
You are so determined to see children die from vaccine preventable diseases that you are willing to lie to get your ghoulish thrill.

<tinfoilhat>
It isn't the government that is conspiratorially plotting huge population reduction...
It is you and your anti-vaccine friends who are trying to get the public to commit suicide for your population reduction plans.
Isn't it?
</tinfoilhat>

Prove me wrong.
Show us your "research" and data which backs your outrageous statement.
You won't, will you?
That should show the non-insane readership your lack of sincerity and honesty.


For those interested:
VAERS:
[link to www.medalerts.org]
- Section 1: Leave everything at default except increase events per page to 100
- Section 2: Highlight "Death (10011906) as a symptom keyword on left and make sure it appears in right-hand table
- Section 3: Highlight "HPV4 (Human Papillomavirus Quadrivalent [Gardasil]) on left and make sure it appears in right-hand table
- Sections 4,5,6: Leave at default = nothing selected

Click any of the "Find" buttons on the right of any of the Section headers to start the search.

Note the results table and total results = 100.
That is all reports with "death" reported as a symptom for Gardasil since it was licensed in 2006.

Now tell me Mopar28m is telling the truth above.
Tell me she is a great "vaccine researcher".
Tell me she is a reliable source of information.
Tell me another one.


R.
kOOks lie. Constantly. It's part of the job description.

It appears that there is much death associated with Gardasil forced upon young girls and boys and they are looking to expand this nonsense to women up to 45 years of age. It also appears the risks of Gardasil far outweigh the chance of a young woman decades later contracting cervical cancer.

Judicial Watch Uncovers FDA Records Detailing 16 New Deaths Tied to Gardasil
[link to www.judicialwatch.org]

Gardasil's grim death toll is on the rise
[link to hsionline.com]

Gardasil Side Effects May Be Linked To Blood Clot Lawsuits
[link to www.yourlawyer.com]

Gardasil Vaccine rDNA Introduced at Coroner’s Inquest
[link to vactruth.com]

Gardasil genetic fingerprints found in postmortem samples of girls given vaccine
[link to www.naturalnews.com]

30 stunning facts they don't want you to know about Gardasil and HPV vaccines
[link to www.naturalnews.com]

Gardasil Death & Brain Damage: A National Tragedy
[link to vaccineawakening.blogspot.com]

Thank you Patriot.

At least someone else thinks as I do.

Have any actual evidence for your statement? You know, scientific data and analysis, not anit-life, anti-vaccine propoganda?





Judicialwatch? Bwahahaha. Thely're a real 'scientific' body capable of interpreting the data... NOT!
Read their 'report' you cited. It's more of the same idiocy. They are citing the VAERS data which I provided a link to above from an anti-vaccine site no less.
Read the VAERS data. Read the VAERS disclaimer:
[link to vaers.hhs.gov (secure)]
"When evaluating data from VAERS, it is important to note that for any reported event, no cause-and-effect relationship has been established. Reports of all possible associations between vaccines and adverse events (possible side effects) are filed in VAERS. Therefore, VAERS collects data on any adverse event following vaccination, be it coincidental or truly caused by a vaccine. The report of an adverse event to VAERS is not documentation that a vaccine caused the event."
"VAERS data contains coincidental events and those truly caused by vaccines."
etc, etc.
It appears you and Judicialwatch have reading comprehension problems.

Some of the "deaths" reported in VAERS that Judicalwatch is citing:
VAERS ID: 346674
Submitted: 2009-05-19
"Information has been received from a Registered Nurse (R.N) who heard that a 12 year old female patient, who on an unspecified date was vaccinated with a dose of GARDASIL. It was reported that the patient died on an unspecified date after receiving the vaccine."
A nurse "heard" of a case... that's really firm data. The 'lawyers' at Judicialwatch surely know hearsay evidence when they see it. Snicker.

VAERS ID: 350228
Submitted: 2009-06-25
"Information has been received from a gynaecologist concerning an approximate 14 year old female patient with a history of bronchial asthma,
...
On 12-JUN-2009, the patient experienced an asthmatic attack of which she died. The patient had no long-term medication for the asthma
...
A causal relation to the GARDASIL vaccine was considered unlikely by the vaccinating physician."
She was an asthmatic who had an unmedicated attack and died before she could be resuscitated.
Well, that didn't turn out like the anti-life, anti-vaccine kooks wanted, did it?

VAERS ID: 350967
Submitted: 2009-07-07
"It was reported from an article published on 29-JUN-2009 that there were 27 deaths in 2008 said to be associated with GARDASIL. This is one of several reports received from the same source."
Reported from "an article". Yep, hearsay reports of anonymous reports on the web really present strong evidence.

VAERS ID: 351970
Submitted: 2009-07-20
"Information has been received from an investigator concerning a 37 year old female with HIV and a history of migraine headaches and methamphetamine abuse for 20 years who entered a study
Well, it was obviously the vaccine that caused her death, not HIV or her severely compromised health.

VAERS ID: 361121
Submitted: 2009-10-15
"Information has been received from a nurse practitioners "patient who heard on radio that "HPV vaccine killed someone in the country"."
Bwahahaha. A "nurse practitioner's patient" told her that they heard on the radio that the vaccine "killed someone in the country."
Now who can argue with that? That is the firmest of evidence imagineable.
Judicialwatch must be composed of 10 year-olds playing at lawyer.

VAERS ID: 361629
Submitted: 2009-10-19
"Information has been received from an office manager and a consumer who reported that she had seen reports of deaths following GARDASIL on television. This is one of two cases from the same source."
An office manager 'Heard it on television'. More evidence that is sure to break the back of the eeebil vaccine industry.
Snicker.

VAERS ID: 373314
Submitted: 2009-12-14
"Information has been received from a consumer who saw a report on the internet about a 23 year old patient who was vaccinated with 3 doses of GARDASIL. Subsequently the patient died, ..."
A consumer "saw a report on the internet", and as we all know, there are no liars on the internet. Everything on the 'net is true.
You've got to be kidding me Judicialwatch.

VAERS ID: 373315
Submitted: 2009-12-14
"Information has been received from a consumer who saw a report on the internet concerning two patients (unspecified ages) who were vaccinated with 3 doses of GARDASIL (dates were not reported). Subsequently the patients died, ..."
More of the same idiocy.

VAERS ID: 379570
Submitted: 2010-02-04
"Information has been received from from a physician concerning a 12 year old school going girl of class eight of a village.
...
the female health worker was informed that on 06-SEP-2009, the patient accidentally fell in open well (granite quarry filled with water), drowned and expired."
The deceased "fell in (an) open well ... filled with water ... (and) drowned and expired."
Call out the anti-vaccinationists with their torches and pitchforks. The vaccine pushed this unfortunate girl into a well and drowned her.
Judicialwatch idiocy on display.

etc, etc.
You will also note that a lot of the hearsay reports 'from an article on the internet' are obviously from some dimwit reading an anti-vaccine website and believing the lies and then reporting them as fact.

Most of the reported deaths from Gardasil in VAERS are these type of unsourced, hearsay BS obviously generated from anti-vaccine websites.
As a poster above noted, the VAERS database is known to be corrupted by ambulance chasing lawyers and anti-vaccine kOOks.
That is why VAERS "dumpster diving" by the anti-life, anti-vaccine kOOks is laughed at and dismissed out of hand.
They are too ignorant to recognise what does and doesn't constitute evidence, and scientists do not hold rumour and hearsay as evidence.
Apparently the "lawyers" at Judicialwatch are so ignorant they do accept rumour and hearsay from agenda driven kOOks as evidence.

The rest of your cites are just anti-life, anti-vaccine websites who scientists and anyone rational wouldn't touch with a ten foot pole.

Try again, except bring some real evidence for your claim next time. The lies are getting old.

"Back to the Dark Ages!"


R.
kOOks lie. Constantly. It's part of the job description.

So, are you going to show where you came up with your statement that VAERS showed you 100 girls per month were dying from Gardasil vaccination?

It should be easy enough since you've already done the research. (snicker)

I had to do it spur-of-the-moment and found that since 1990 there were a total of 100 reports that included "death" as a symptom for Gardasil.

Show your stuff. Prove you're not a lying kook with a pro-death agenda.

I won't hold my breath.


R.

Yes, poorly and without any comprehension of what they're talking about.

None of those sites you've linked have any agenda whatsoever do they?

You lot just don't get it do you?

I would be more than happy to take note and possibly change my ideas on this subject if I were presented with incontrovertible evidence. Ideally from a non-biased viewpoint.
But it's the same old web-worn stuff getting touted around again and again.
And it doesn't matter how many times you and the likes of Mopar are proved wrong, you still carry on and on and on. Completely dismissing the facts.
Amazing.

That has to be just stubborn ignorance.
Or some form of psychosis.

How does the old saying go.....
"It is easier to fool someone than to convince them they've been fooled".
How true that is.

Continue with your shilling. Frankly my dear I don't give a damn. If you can't handle the truth then that is your problem.

Vaccines are the biggest hoax that was ever pushed onto our kids.

They are all about money.....period. Nothing else.

Last Edited by mopar28m on 01/19/2013 01:01 PM

Typical response from someone who hasn't the basis of any argument. Keep on ignoring the facts love and pushing whatever misguided agenda you have.

I would suggest you look up the definition of shill, m'dear.
Then take a good look in the mirror.

It's true what you say though about "they are all about the money".
The anti-vax litigation lawyers that is and the parents who think they can make a quick and easy buck out of it.

Vaccine, priority cases only! [link to media.mmgcommunity.topscms.com]

The only who is ignoring facts is you. They've been provided & you ignore them.

I can only guess you are a big pharma shill.

No love.
You've not presented ANY facts whatsoever.
You've stated hearsay and fabrication.
You've been told why you're wrong but you just cannot accept it at all.
I can almost imagine you sitting at home with your hands over your ears as you read this.

You still haven't shown where you came up with the 100 deaths per month either have you?

And on the last point; your guesses are as poor as your knowledge and research dearie. I'm as distanced from "big pharma" as you could possibly get.

Ha. The shill gambit. Here on GLP that is recognized as waving the white flag of defeat by a kook who hasn't any facts to offer.

And of course you "don't give a damn."
You aren't interested in the truth. You are interested in promoting your ignorant and dangerous anti-life agenda.

In all your truthiness, are you going to show where VAERS data supports your '100 girls a month dying' statement that you said it did?

Or are you just going to stand pat with the lie and hope it silently goes away and is forgotten?

It's too bad this isn't your thread isn't it?
You could delete all these posts exposing your ignorance and dishonesty as you are known to do.
I'll bet you still think you're an honest and intellectual 'vaccine researcher' even in the face of all the contrary evidence.

Have fun with your delusion.


R.
kOOks lie. Constantly. It's part of the job description.

Actually I did & you ignored the facts.....again.

VAERS - and only about 10% of those who actually died from the Gardisil shot are reported. It's otherwise contributed to something else & not the vaccine.

Those who follow this stuff know the deep dark secrets of how these programs actually work, if you are pro-vaccine which is obvious along wth "Reality" who can't deal with reality.

You did? Where?
That holyhandgrenade site? Which is a blog written by a woman as delusional as you? Yeah, that really has some credibility.
She's citing VAERS too. What part of 'VAERS doesn't establish causality' do you and she not understand. It is written on the VAERS webpage in GIANT CAPITOL LETTERS, for god's sake.
Did the vaccine cause the poor girl I cited to fall down the well and drown?




sigh. I know this is an effort in futility with someone as dishonest as you, but do you have any evidence for this 10% statement?
Of course you don't. You and the other psychotic made it up out of whole cloth.
This is what you anti-life, anti-vaccine ignoramuses consider evidence. You said it therefore it is true... just because you are a liar doesn't mean the lie isn't true... or something like that. Right?

Which of the reported VAERS incidences show that the vaccine actually caused death?
The correct answer is -- None.
VAERS does not determine causality, as they plainly state. That is for medical professionals to determine during follow-ups, again as they state.

And the 10% is therefore bullshit, but you've just revealed that you have no evidence for your statements since it's all "deep dark secrets" that only you and the other nutbar researchers know about.
It's all a conspiracy so there isn't any evidence... right?
But you've figured it all out, and when asked for the information which you used to 'figure it out' you respond with "Shill!".

It's almost like you make this stuff up in your mentally ill delusion and get very offended if someone doesn't just believe you and asks for evidence.

Well, I don't believe you and I want evidence for what you state is the truth.
If you can't or won't provide it you are a liar.

Cough up the evidence for the '100 girls per month die from the Gardasil vaccine' and "only about 10%" of deaths are reported.

Holyhandgrenade and it's schizophrenic author aren't evidence... they're jokes... as are you.



R.

Defending Gardasil should be a criminal offense.

And I pointed out how you can't prove anything using VAERS.
But it doesn't sink in does it.
It's a data dump. No more and no less.
And if you're as good at research as you say you are you would understand why a data-dump is no good as a research tool for a subject such as this.

Again you're making statements with no proof whatsoever to back them up.
Show what proof you have regarding this missing 90% and I'll listen.
Until then I have no choice other than to believe you're making these numbers up.

Assumptions are just that.
If you can find one post I've ever written anywhere where I've promoted these vaccines I'll concede to your accusation of being pro.
However, as I've said time and time again, I'm anti-bullshit. Therefore I'm anti what you post.

I'll write this slowly as I know you're obviously hard of understanding, an event report in VAERS doesn't mean the event is directly linked to the vaccine.
It's painfully clear why.

Why can't you understand that?

Vaccine
Adverse
Event
Reporting
System

What part of that don't you understand?

You're making yourself look really silly now.

Do I really have to spell it out again (well I obviously do as it's consistently going well over your head).

ANYONE can file a report in VAERS and no one actually verifies the accuracy of the report. That is the main problem with it. No evidence is needed, no direct linkage is needed.

If reporting had to include evidence to prove event correlation with a vaccine then yes, the stats could not lie but since it doesn't the stats don't mean a thing.

The FDA and CDC encourage patients, parents, any healthcare workers and others to report any significant problems experienced after vaccination, even if they don't know whether a vaccine caused them.

VAERS cannot prove that a vaccine either did or did not cause a problem.
It shows numbers. That's it.

For example, someone can get vaccinated and then hit by a bus walking home from the clinic. This can be reported in VAERS. Does this mean the accident was caused by the vaccine?
There's the famous case of someone reporting that he had been turned into the Incredible Hulk after a vaccine. Another case was someone reporting she'd been turned into Wonder Woman. Thankfully these were added to show the frailty of the database and removed by the author's consents but one wonders what is uploaded onto it, by whom and why.

Using VAERS to try and prove something is naive at best. It demonstrates a complete lack of understanding of how to read and understand not only medical information but basic data itself.


Post hoc ergo propter hoc.


If there's anything in there you don't understand please let me know and I'll go through them yet again.

Good god. I understand now.

You are retarded.

I'm very sorry for being so sharp with you in the past as I thought you were merely an arrogant ignoramus.
It now turns out you are really a mental defective with all the brains god gave a crowbar.

It should be obvious even to you that if after '20 years of researching vaccines' you do not even understand the VAERS system that something is drastically wrong.
A newbie researcher would be expected to take maybe an hour to figure out what the VAERS system is all about and how it works... but 20 years?
I'm very, very sorry.

Let me try to explain it to you -

The VAERS system is merely a data trap to try and capture anything and everything that may or may not be related to a vaccine adverse event.
It doesn't try to be objective or accurate since it is merely a collection of reports from the public with no oversight.
That is why people have reported that the flu vaccine turned them into The Incredible Hulk.
That is why girls dying by falling down wells full of water are reported.

The statisticians and epidemiologists, etc., sort through the data and request further details on the reports to determine if there is any link to the vaccine.
The VAERS is just a big list of which most is junk spurious reports.
This is explained on the VAERS webpage which you are unfortunately incapable of understanding you poor disabled girl.

Please accept my apologies as I would never make fun of someone with a real mental handicap such as yourself.


R.

So now I am to believe that the old flu shot was no good but this one is ok?

Riiiiiiiiiiiiiggggghhhht

You truly are an idiot. If a child died after getting a vaccine, they don't want to attribute it to the vaccine even IF SIDS is listed as one of the possible side affects.

It's time you face reality, Gardisil kills, vaccines kill.....period.

You can't expect to inject all those toxins into a person & not have a reaction. You have to go to school for a long time to become that stupid.

From an article about the Gardisil shot.

98 in every 100 adverse drug reactions are known to be under-reported and symptoms of some vaccine adverse reactions do not appear for months or years so the real rate of adverse reactions from the mildest to the most severe could well have been as high as 1 in every 10 girls receiving the vaccine.

[link to childhealthsafety.wordpress.com]


Small sampling of those who have been killed by the Gardisil shot.

[link to truthaboutgardasil.org]

Mopar, you are still dodging the issue of your use of VAERS?
Why's that?
Realised you're wrong in using it?

Again, you're using hysteria as your argument "It's time you face reality, Gardisil kills, vaccines kill.....period."

I'm allergic to one of the most widely used families of drugs in the world, NSAIDs (aspirin, ibuprofen etc). If I have these, I will die. I found this out by accident when after having some aspirin I ended up in resus (the reaction was very quick, 1 hour from ingestion to pre-anaphylaxis).
Now the VAST majority of deaths from vaccines occur due to allergic reactions and these will occur in a matter of hours after the shot. I'm certainly not condoning this but it's virtually impossible to predict.
There are some reports of possible allergic reactions occurring after slightly longer time-periods but they're not conclusive as they could have had other interactions with other substances.
There are reports of clots but the vast majority of these are associated with taking contraceptives.

The only consistent event I can find with it is unexplained syncope. However this amounts to around 2 in 10000 girls (and girls only...).

"You can't expect to inject all those toxins into a person & not have a reaction. You have to go to school for a long time to become that stupid."
The first line's a typical statement from someone who knows nothing about pharma-kinetics and/or biochemistry and human physiology. Sorry.
The second line when taken in your context speaks for itself.


Your quote from the anti-vax "childsafety" site is quite odd.
How do they know that 98% of events aren't reported if they're not reported?
Are they shown as not reported on VAERS or something.....?

On that Truthaboutgardasil site, I'm sorry but I really can't accept the "evidence" on there. Once again just hearsay and supposition.