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Abortion is murder. Period.

 
Don'tBeAfraid

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01/21/2013 10:51 AM

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Re: Abortion is murder. Period.
I remember when the wife first shared with me her suspicions that she was pregnant. She ran out to pick up an at-home test - Positive! We could hardly contain our excitement, and scheduled an appointment with her OB/GYN as quickly as possible. Our suspicions were again confirmed.

I shared this story to get to here; the conscious decision to enter the doors of an abortion facility, to walk beyond the waiting area, enter the assigned room, and don the gown. To acknowledge that you wish to continue with this process. This is a conscious, yet deplorable decision entered into for no other reason than to end a life.

Maybe this person is looking to escape the responsibilities and headaches that accompany parenthood. Maybe they believed the lies that "it's just tissue". Maybe forging ahead in their new career is what's of greater importance, and a child would undoubtedly hamper that progress.

Each of these will one day stand before God and answer, as Christ himself said "...suffer unto Me the little children, for such is the kingdom of God".
 Quoting: ClydeX


God bless you and your wife and family for your witness and commitment to each other and God.
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01/21/2013 10:51 AM
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Re: Abortion is murder. Period.
I remember when the wife first shared with me her suspicions that she was pregnant. She ran out to pick up an at-home test - Positive! We could hardly contain our excitement, and scheduled an appointment with her OB/GYN as quickly as possible. Our suspicions were again confirmed.

As the weeks went on and the ultrasounds became more and more intriguing. Each and every visit we witnessed this life growing until one day we witnessed the little flutter of light - one which resembled a small butterfly flickering on the screen - we were witnessing the beating heart of our child.

We were readying ourselves for this new life. We were readying the house, buying clothes and related items. We were so proud. We were so happy - sharing the coming arrival with most everyone we met.

Until one day - the light, that butterfly flicker on the screen, it was no longer there.

I cannot begin to tell you how devastating this was to both my wife and I. We were completed overwhelmed with a mutual feeling of defeat. We searched and searched ourselves - had we done something wrong? Had we exposed her (the wife) to something that inadvertently had affected this unborn child?

No, we hadn't. We had taken every possible precaution, every step imaginable to ensure the health of both mom and baby.

Ultimately, in a matter of months, she was pregnant again. We relived the same elation, the same overwhelming joy, and began the same precautions, steps of care, doctor visits and the accompanying ultrasounds, and the same preparations.

Sadly, we relived the same tragedy once more. The little butterfly flicker on the screen had gone dark and motionless.

This second event was no less bitter, no less trying and troubling, no less traumatic than the first. We had, again, lost our child before ever holding it.

We again searched ourselves for what we had maybe missed. Ultimately, the wife changed doctors. With this new doctor, we learned there was a chemical issue with the wife that needed to be adjusted.

Fast forward just over a year, and she finds out that, once more, she is pregnant. We again were overjoyed, but this joy was accompanied by a fear that we would again lose another child. We didn't share our news. We didn't tell friends or family. Dealing with the first two deaths were difficult enough, and elected to not plant the seeds with friends and family that, should the terrible events replay once again, would grow into the numerous questions and even accusations surrounding the loss of a child.

We watched the little butterfly flutter once again appear on the ultrasound screen. We watched this child grow. Once we reached the second trimester, we elected to share our great news once more.

We watched the growth and development of our child though the ultrasound technology. We began to see the physical evidence of the child moving and kicking. We were again overjoyed, yet there remained this dark cloud in the back of our minds of the possibilities that could still play out.

We prayed. A lot.

On the last of November 2011, we welcomed a healthy baby boy into this world. No disabilities, no complications, all of his fingers and toes, and a healthy birth weight. As overwhelmed with the myriad of emotions as we were, there were some that held more of our attention than others. First and foremost - we were both thankful and grateful that God had seen fit to bless us with this boy.

We cannot answer why the prior two events happened to us. I can tell you that they were the most difficult times that we as a couple have experienced. At this point, we can only guess; maybe there were things we needed to settle between us. Maybe we had to be forged a bit more together as husband and wife. Maybe it was that my wife's chemistry simply needed to be addressed. At the end of the day, it is not ours to question why, but to remember to give thanks for grace and mercy along with our many, many blessings.

I shared this story to get to here; the conscious decision to enter the doors of an abortion facility, to walk beyond the waiting area, enter the assigned room, and don the gown. To acknowledge that you wish to continue with this process. This is a conscious, yet deplorable decision entered into for no other reason than to end a life.

Maybe this person is looking to escape the responsibilities and headaches that accompany parenthood. Maybe they believed the lies that "it's just tissue". Maybe forging ahead in their new career is what's of greater importance, and a child would undoubtedly hamper that progress.

Regardless the motivation, they are consciously killing their child. The doctors and associated staff performing these procedures know full well they are taking that life.

Each of these will one day stand before God and answer, as Christ himself said "...suffer unto Me the little children, for such is the kingdom of God".
 Quoting: ClydeX


Thank you for your contribution to this thread. And congratulations to you and your wife on the birth of your son.
Don'tBeAfraid

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01/21/2013 10:56 AM

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Re: Abortion is murder. Period.
Thou Shalt Not Kill
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 32725354


You're going to have to do some exegesis of Exodus 20:13 some day. Why not chose today?
[link to bible.cc]
[link to biblos.com]
We've already established that the word is murder.
[link to biblesuite.com]
Anonymous Coward
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01/21/2013 11:03 AM
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Re: Abortion is murder. Period.
Thou Shalt Not Kill
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 32725354


You're going to have to do some exegesis of Exodus 20:13 some day. Why not chose today?
[link to bible.cc]
[link to biblos.com]
We've already established that the word is murder.
[link to biblesuite.com]
 Quoting: Don'tBeAfraid


Is that the royal "we"?
Don'tBeAfraid

User ID: 32113282
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01/21/2013 11:07 AM

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Re: Abortion is murder. Period.
Let's do a mind-shift. I want to challenge any ideas you have about abortion. Suspend your disbelief for a moment.

I don't want to make abortion illegal and end up with women using coat hangers, a common accusal by pro-choice folks, and not without reason. Women did have a terrible time getting abortions, so hacks with no medical training ended up killings women. Hold that thought.

If we executed criminals in the way we terminate life in a fetus, would it be acceptible to you?

Would executing a criminal by tearing them apart without anesthesia be ever allowed?

Would executing a criminal by burning them with a salt solution ever be allowed?

Would executing a criminal by wracking muscular spasms be ever allowed?

Would executing a criminal by stabbing scissors into their skull ever be allowed?

No. Of course not.

Do you value a baby's life more than a criminal's life?

Last Edited by Don'tBeAfraid on 01/21/2013 11:08 AM
Don'tBeAfraid

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01/21/2013 11:10 AM

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Re: Abortion is murder. Period.
Thou Shalt Not Kill
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 32725354


You're going to have to do some exegesis of Exodus 20:13 some day. Why not chose today?
[link to bible.cc]
[link to biblos.com]
We've already established that the word is murder.
[link to biblesuite.com]
 Quoting: Don'tBeAfraid


Is that the royal "we"?
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 32579126


It's definitely not the royal YOU. If you're a Christian, study the Word so you defend it. If you're a Atheist and wish to demolish it, then you sure better be able to read it.

Regardless it doesn't say kill. That word in Hebrew is used exactly twice. Both times for murder.

[link to en.wikipedia.org]
[link to www.tektonics.org]
[link to www.biblestudy.org]

How many sources will finally convince you?

Last Edited by Don'tBeAfraid on 01/21/2013 11:15 AM
Don'tBeAfraid

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01/21/2013 11:21 AM

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Re: Abortion is murder. Period.
Is it easy to kill a fetus because it's small and insignificant?

Some people like to pretend that a fetus is just some cells or tissue and hence not important, incapable of feeling pain, and so it doesn't matter what we do to it?

First, do YOU believe that? I bet you don't

Second, if you don't believe that, then why are you pro-choice?

Third, is it because you're trying to protect women? I understand that one; I am too from a medical standpoint.

Regardless is it still a human being? I bet most of you would say, of course it is. It not another species.

Here's what it looks like. It display characteristics of humans even when small.


Last Edited by Don'tBeAfraid on 01/21/2013 11:22 AM
Anonymous Coward
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01/21/2013 11:21 AM
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Re: Abortion is murder. Period.
I'm against abortion, but there are exceptions.

A neighbor of mine, was pregnant. The unborn child was heavily disabled. She aborted, I know it has been a hard decision for her, but it was the right decision.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 32679658


Doctors are way too eager to abort. Someone very close to me was supposed to be aborted because she was "99.9%" going to be mentally disabled according to docs. Her mom told the doctor know. She turned out perfectly normal, in fact she's a stunning young blond RN now, and the world is definitely a little brighter place when she's around.
Don'tBeAfraid

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01/21/2013 11:28 AM

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Re: Abortion is murder. Period.
90% of abortions happen during the first trimester (3 months)

Since babies are not detected until after the first month, then what do they look like?


Is this a human or something else? Of course it's a human. It's illogical to say it's something else. It's only because the guilt and shame that we rename our babies a fetus and therefore devalue the babies' natural rights.

Last Edited by Don'tBeAfraid on 01/21/2013 11:29 AM
Anonymous Coward
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01/21/2013 11:28 AM
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Re: Abortion is murder. Period.
Is it easy to kill a fetus because it's small and insignificant?

Some people like to pretend that a fetus is just some cells or tissue and hence not important, incapable of feeling pain, and so it doesn't matter what we do to it?

First, do YOU believe that? I bet you don't

 Quoting: Don'tBeAfraid



You "believe" that fetuses in the first few weeks can think and can experience pain?

What evidence do you have for this? There is plenty of evidence against it.

It isn't a matter of "belief" it is a simple matter of "fact".

Also what is your opinion on the morning after pill?
Don'tBeAfraid

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01/21/2013 11:35 AM

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Re: Abortion is murder. Period.
Is it easy to kill a fetus because it's small and insignificant?

Some people like to pretend that a fetus is just some cells or tissue and hence not important, incapable of feeling pain, and so it doesn't matter what we do to it?

First, do YOU believe that? I bet you don't

 Quoting: Don'tBeAfraid



You "believe" that fetuses in the first few weeks can think and can experience pain?

What evidence do you have for this? There is plenty of evidence against it.

It isn't a matter of "belief" it is a simple matter of "fact".

Also what is your opinion on the morning after pill?
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 22089462


Read the whole statement. We don't know if a baby can feel pain or not, because the only good way would be extensive tests that would be so repellent and barbaric that no one could ethically do them. And yet we abort them in horrendous ways. Quite a conundrum, isn't it?

The only sticky part between us is pain sensation. You can't disagree with the first part.

The neural tube, the formation of brain and spinal cord happens very early by 4 weeks.

The potential for pain sensation happens very early.

EDIT: Information from this year asserts that a baby feels pain as early as 20 weeks or 4.6 months.
[link to www.lifenews.com]
[link to judiciary.house.gov]
Dr Mallot testified that:
"There is ample biologic, physiologic, hormonal, and behavioral evidence for fetal and neonatal pain. As early as 8 weeks post- fertilization, face skin receptors appear. At 14 weeks, sensory fibers grow into the spinal cord and connect with the thalamus. At 13-16 weeks, monoamine fibers reach the cerebral cortex, so that by 17-20 weeks the thalamo- cortical relays penetrate the cortex. Many authors have substantiated that pain receptors are present and linked by no later than 20 weeks post-fertilization.
(Myers 2004; Derbyshire 2010; Anand 1987; Vanhalto 2000; Brusseau 2008; VanScheltema 2008)
. In fact, by 20 weeks post-fertilization (22 weeks by LMP), the fetal brain has the full complement of neurons that are present in adulthood (Lagercrantz H et al. Functional development of the brain in fetus and infant. Lakartidningan 1991;88:1880-85)"


All abortion is abhorrent, but I think we need to have safe ways for an abortion to take place. Otherwise terrible herbal ways of creating a miscarriage will take place. Those can cause infertility and death from bleeding out (hemorrhaging).

The only gap in Holy Scripture is about a child in the womb before one month. Read back for a discussion by me about that.

Therefore the safest way today is the morning after pill. No method is good. I dislike it completely as a medical procedure. However we need solutions and compromise.

Last Edited by Don'tBeAfraid on 01/21/2013 11:45 AM
Anonymous Coward (OP)
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01/21/2013 11:46 AM
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Re: Abortion is murder. Period.
Therefore the safest way today is the morning after pill. No method is good. I dislike it completely as a medical procedure. However we need solutions and compromise.
 Quoting: Don'tBeAfraid


What other sins against God and Nature must we find compromise for so that they can be safely committed?
Upheval

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01/21/2013 11:48 AM

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Re: Abortion is murder. Period.
I am not a woman. It is non of my buisness. That is something for them to answer for. We have no right telling poeple what they can or can not do with there own bodies.

If you dont like abortions, then dont get one.
 Quoting: Upheval


It is your right to an opinion because nature didn't give women the ability to abort - science did.
Abortion uses the collective resources of the society to perform them safely. ie. trained doctors, hospitals, medicine.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 32725354



As stated before, this is between them and their god on their judgment day. Its none of our business.

Mind your own business.
Upheval

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01/21/2013 11:52 AM

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Re: Abortion is murder. Period.
I am not a woman. It is non of my buisness. That is something for them to answer for. We have no right telling poeple what they can or can not do with there own bodies.

If you dont like abortions, then dont get one.
 Quoting: Upheval


that is like saying it's okay for Hitler to kill Jews...it's his choice.

like saying "if you don't like jews then dont kill them!"
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 23061107


I guess you missed the point when I said, "It is thier body" the Jews were not Hilter's body.

Nice try though.
 Quoting: Upheval


Your initial point is true. A being shouldn't be told what to do with their body. The reality is a being is told what to do with their body all the time, especially concerning medical ethics.

Example: A person wants to commit suicide.
Example: A person wishes to sell their kidney.
Example: A person wishes to take illegal drugs

As you can see, all of those things are very regulated and often illegal. It doesn't matter that it's the patient's body.

But then, it becomes even more complicated. Will you honestly say that a fetus isn't a human being?
 Quoting: Don'tBeAfraid


So I am guessing you think it is right for people to tell other people what to do with their own body? Dont you people have enough to do with your own lives without trying to regulate someone elses? This is for their maker to judge no any of us.
Don'tBeAfraid

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01/21/2013 11:58 AM

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Re: Abortion is murder. Period.
...


that is like saying it's okay for Hitler to kill Jews...it's his choice.

like saying "if you don't like jews then dont kill them!"
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 23061107


I guess you missed the point when I said, "It is thier body" the Jews were not Hilter's body.

Nice try though.
 Quoting: Upheval


Your initial point is true. A being shouldn't be told what to do with their body. The reality is a being is told what to do with their body all the time, especially concerning medical ethics.

Example: A person wants to commit suicide.
Example: A person wishes to sell their kidney.
Example: A person wishes to take illegal drugs

As you can see, all of those things are very regulated and often illegal. It doesn't matter that it's the patient's body.

But then, it becomes even more complicated. Will you honestly say that a fetus isn't a human being?
 Quoting: Don'tBeAfraid


So I am guessing you think it is right for people to tell other people what to do with their own body? Dont you people have enough to do with your own lives without trying to regulate someone elses? This is for their maker to judge no any of us.
 Quoting: Upheval


No, what I think is not material to what you asked. You asked a question, and I answered in a rational way. The rest is subject to discussion. All I am saying is that our bodies are subject to laws created by communities.
Upheval

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01/21/2013 11:58 AM

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Re: Abortion is murder. Period.
I am not a woman. It is non of my buisness. That is something for them to answer for. We have no right telling poeple what they can or can not do with there own bodies.

If you dont like abortions, then dont get one.
 Quoting: Upheval


If you don't like pedophilia then don't be one. You have no right to tell someone what they can do with their own body.

Doesn't seem to work does it? Why does it only work when it comes to murdering defenseless preborn human beings?
 Quoting: samanthasunflower


Nice try again but your logic doesn't work. So I blasted my load down this chick’s throat last night. I murdered billions of potential children when she swallowed. All those defenseless potential children.
Don'tBeAfraid

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01/21/2013 12:01 PM

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Re: Abortion is murder. Period.
Therefore the safest way today is the morning after pill. No method is good. I dislike it completely as a medical procedure. However we need solutions and compromise.
 Quoting: Don'tBeAfraid


What other sins against God and Nature must we find compromise for so that they can be safely committed?
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 30307430


We break God's law 24/7. The world is not 100% comprised of believers in God's Law. As believers, we could attempt to control unbelievers with our belief system, but we don't have that power anymore. We live in a pluralistic society. As Christians we cannot make nonbeliever do what we want.

We can't because of Free Will.

We can, like any group, affect change of the political process.

We can vote for candidates that are pro-life.

We can't force people to follow the Bible, no matter how hard we try.

Last Edited by Don'tBeAfraid on 01/21/2013 12:01 PM
MHz

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01/21/2013 12:01 PM

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Re: Abortion is murder. Period.
How about you create a world where 25,000 children a day do not die of starvation (and the like) first? To bring a child into a place where they are not given the best is cruelty at it's worst. As far as God is concerned both mother and child and father will be reunited as some point, what He is concerned about is the names being in the book of life and that is done at conception so an abortion has no effect on that aspect of 'morality'. Admitting you cannot do something is less of a crime that trying to raise a child and fucking it up.

Last Edited by MHz on 01/21/2013 12:03 PM
Don'tBeAfraid

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01/21/2013 12:04 PM

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Re: Abortion is murder. Period.
The terrible quandry of abortion for a medical professional

There is a sacred trust between doctor and patient. It's called the Hippocratic Oath. A doctor vows to do no harm. Every time a doctor performs an abortion, it forces the doctor to harm the unborn baby. It certainly has very negative health effects on the mother and so harms the mother.

It's that simple. We like to ignore it in society, and sweep it under the rug because of shame and guilt.

It doesn't matter. It's harming both.
Don'tBeAfraid

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01/21/2013 12:10 PM

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Re: Abortion is murder. Period.
How about you create a world where 25,000 children a day do not die of starvation (and the like) first? To bring a child into a place where they are not given the best is cruelty at it's worst. As far as God is concerned both mother and child and father will be reunited as some point, what He is concerned about is the names being in the book of life and that is done at conception so an abortion has no effect on that aspect of 'morality'. Admitting you cannot do something is less of a crime that trying to raise a child and fucking it up.
 Quoting: MHz


In a perfect world, we could feed all children. We live in a world of nations. Not all people in those nations have self-determination. We can't foist our belief systems on another nation. Christians can't do it because of Free Will. We can only persuade and influence them.

In our nation, in my nation, we should do more about children being hungry. I agree wholeheartedly.

I also think we should care for all children, including the unborn. They are not mutually exclusive goals.

A lot of people will never make good parents. We make laws still to protect children.
Don'tBeAfraid

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01/21/2013 12:15 PM

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Re: Abortion is murder. Period.
I am not a woman. It is non of my buisness. That is something for them to answer for. We have no right telling poeple what they can or can not do with there own bodies.

If you dont like abortions, then dont get one.
 Quoting: Upheval


If you don't like pedophilia then don't be one. You have no right to tell someone what they can do with their own body.

Doesn't seem to work does it? Why does it only work when it comes to murdering defenseless preborn human beings?
 Quoting: samanthasunflower


Nice try again but your logic doesn't work. So I blasted my load down this chick’s throat last night. I murdered billions of potential children when she swallowed. All those defenseless potential children.
 Quoting: Upheval


I know you're intelligent from the way you logically write. Aren't you embarrassed to write that above?

Let's logically look at what you said. You're comparing apples to oranges. Sperm is not potential children. If you know anything about biology, you know that's an impossibility strictly from a lack of genetic material. But you're just being facitious.

A zygote and more complex cellular division of a fetus is an unborn human being though.

You argument is not credible.
Anonymous Coward
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01/21/2013 12:15 PM
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Re: Abortion is murder. Period.
This society has become like Sodom and Gomorrah in my opinion, nothing is sacred anymore.
lullabye for the babies
verysad


 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 32579126


Well hitlers mom wanted an abortion, that baby didn't grow up to be sacred. Even if it seems horrible, you could be preventing millions of more bad people from coming into the world.
Anonymous Coward
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01/21/2013 12:18 PM
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Re: Abortion is murder. Period.
I am not a woman. It is non of my buisness. That is something for them to answer for. We have no right telling poeple what they can or can not do with there own bodies.

If you dont like abortions, then dont get one.
 Quoting: Upheval


If you don't like pedophilia then don't be one. You have no right to tell someone what they can do with their own body.

Doesn't seem to work does it? Why does it only work when it comes to murdering defenseless preborn human beings?
 Quoting: samanthasunflower


Nice try again but your logic doesn't work. So I blasted my load down this chick’s throat last night. I murdered billions of potential children when she swallowed. All those defenseless potential children.
 Quoting: Upheval


I know you're intelligent from the way you logically write. Aren't you embarrassed to write that above?

Let's logically look at what you said. You're comparing apples to oranges. Sperm is not potential children. If you know anything about biology, you know that's an impossibility strictly from a lack of genetic material. But you're just being facitious.

A zygote and more complex cellular division of a fetus is an unborn human being though.

You argument is not credible.
 Quoting: Don'tBeAfraid


So it's a clump of cells probably no bigger than a sperm or egg, the only difference is its diploid. Would hardly call it murder at that stage, though I could understand for later term babies.
Don'tBeAfraid

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01/21/2013 12:20 PM

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Re: Abortion is murder. Period.
This society has become like Sodom and Gomorrah in my opinion, nothing is sacred anymore.
lullabye for the babies
verysad


 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 32579126


Well hitlers mom wanted an abortion, that baby didn't grow up to be sacred. Even if it seems horrible, you could be preventing millions of more bad people from coming into the world.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 32547856


There were 1.2 million abortions in the USA last year. Hitler was one person. Would you kill 1.2 million to ensure that Hitler wasn't born?

Your argument is not logical and is morally repugnant. It's far worse than anything Mao Zedong dreamt up in the purges, and those were far worse than Hitler.

How many wonderful scientists, artists, poets, musicians, etc were not born?

The ugly aspect of those statistics is there a much higher percentage from certain ethnic groups. In a way it's a genocide of those ethnic groups.
[link to www.abort73.com]
A very high percentage of minority children are aborted.
"abortion kills minority children at more than 3 times the rate of non-Hispanic, white children. The rate is even worse for black children"

"...black women make up 12.3% of the female population in America2, but accounted for 36.4% of all U.S. abortions in 20063 – that according to the Centers for Disease Control (CDC). The Guttmacher Institute (AGI) puts the percentage of black abortions at 30% of the U.S. total"

Last Edited by Don'tBeAfraid on 01/21/2013 12:21 PM
Anonymous Coward
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01/21/2013 12:22 PM
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Re: Abortion is murder. Period.
In my opinion it is much worse than murder. A person who was murdered had the chance to experience life. Taking that away from a person to be is maybe the worst thing you can do to another living being.


 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 31456156


Never getting to experience the pain of life isn't worse than murder.
Don'tBeAfraid

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01/21/2013 12:24 PM

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Re: Abortion is murder. Period.
...


If you don't like pedophilia then don't be one. You have no right to tell someone what they can do with their own body.

Doesn't seem to work does it? Why does it only work when it comes to murdering defenseless preborn human beings?
 Quoting: samanthasunflower


Nice try again but your logic doesn't work. So I blasted my load down this chick’s throat last night. I murdered billions of potential children when she swallowed. All those defenseless potential children.
 Quoting: Upheval


I know you're intelligent from the way you logically write. Aren't you embarrassed to write that above?

Let's logically look at what you said. You're comparing apples to oranges. Sperm is not potential children. If you know anything about biology, you know that's an impossibility strictly from a lack of genetic material. But you're just being facitious.

A zygote and more complex cellular division of a fetus is an unborn human being though.

You argument is not credible.
 Quoting: Don'tBeAfraid


So it's a clump of cells probably no bigger than a sperm or egg, the only difference is its diploid. Would hardly call it murder at that stage, though I could understand for later term babies.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 32547856

OK, let's debate that. If something is small, then it has less worth? I've demonstrated the complexity of life in a fetus in the first trimester (3 months). In fact it displays complexity almost immediately but especially by four weeks.

So is a little person or a dwarf worth less than a taller person. Of course not. Those kinds of ideas are repugnant in a moral society.

Look at what a fetus looks like, don't hide from the scientific facts and pretend it's a cluster of cells, because no biologist or medical person would claim that. It's complex even when the size of a seed.

Last Edited by Don'tBeAfraid on 01/21/2013 12:27 PM
Anonymous Coward
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01/21/2013 12:25 PM
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Re: Abortion is murder. Period.
This society has become like Sodom and Gomorrah in my opinion, nothing is sacred anymore.
lullabye for the babies
verysad


 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 32579126


Well hitlers mom wanted an abortion, that baby didn't grow up to be sacred. Even if it seems horrible, you could be preventing millions of more bad people from coming into the world.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 32547856


There were 1.2 million abortions in the USA last year. Hitler was one person. Would you kill 1.2 million to ensure that Hitler wasn't born?

Your argument is not logical and is morally repugnant. It's far worse than anything Mao Zedong dreamt up in the purges, and those were far worse than Hitler.

How many wonderful scientists, artists, poets, musicians, etc were not born?

The ugly aspect of those statistics is there a much higher percentage from certain ethnic groups. In a way it's a genocide of those ethnic groups.
[link to www.abort73.com]
A very high percentage of minority children are aborted.
"abortion kills minority children at more than 3 times the rate of non-Hispanic, white children. The rate is even worse for black children"

"...black women make up 12.3% of the female population in America2, but accounted for 36.4% of all U.S. abortions in 20063 – that according to the Centers for Disease Control (CDC). The Guttmacher Institute (AGI) puts the percentage of black abortions at 30% of the U.S. total"
 Quoting: Don'tBeAfraid


You think being killed in the womb is worse than being tortured later on in life? Well, however it works for you.
Anonymous Coward (OP)
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01/21/2013 12:25 PM
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Re: Abortion is murder. Period.
Well hitlers mom wanted an abortion, that baby didn't grow up to be sacred. Even if it seems horrible, you could be preventing millions of more bad people from coming into the world.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 32547856


One could also be preventing the birth of a child that would have saved millions of lives by discovering the cure for cancer or AIDS. The mother simply isn't in a position to know the path her unborn child's life will take.
Don'tBeAfraid

User ID: 32113282
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01/21/2013 12:28 PM

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Re: Abortion is murder. Period.
This society has become like Sodom and Gomorrah in my opinion, nothing is sacred anymore.
lullabye for the babies
verysad


 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 32579126


Well hitlers mom wanted an abortion, that baby didn't grow up to be sacred. Even if it seems horrible, you could be preventing millions of more bad people from coming into the world.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 32547856


There were 1.2 million abortions in the USA last year. Hitler was one person. Would you kill 1.2 million to ensure that Hitler wasn't born?

Your argument is not logical and is morally repugnant. It's far worse than anything Mao Zedong dreamt up in the purges, and those were far worse than Hitler.

How many wonderful scientists, artists, poets, musicians, etc were not born?

The ugly aspect of those statistics is there a much higher percentage from certain ethnic groups. In a way it's a genocide of those ethnic groups.
[link to www.abort73.com]
A very high percentage of minority children are aborted.
"abortion kills minority children at more than 3 times the rate of non-Hispanic, white children. The rate is even worse for black children"

"...black women make up 12.3% of the female population in America2, but accounted for 36.4% of all U.S. abortions in 20063 – that according to the Centers for Disease Control (CDC). The Guttmacher Institute (AGI) puts the percentage of black abortions at 30% of the U.S. total"
 Quoting: Don'tBeAfraid


You think being killed in the womb is worse than being tortured later on in life? Well, however it works for you.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 32547856

No, that's illogical. Those 1.2 million would not have tortured.
Don'tBeAfraid

User ID: 32113282
United States
01/21/2013 12:38 PM

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Re: Abortion is murder. Period.
So a recap...

Abortion
1) not about killing something that is just a cluster of cells
2) Happens in very high numbers in the USA
3) Is disproportionate among minorities (and probably a result of poverty)
4) Happens when there is nervous development in the fetus even at 4 weeks
5) Human beings have Natural Rights in the USA at birth
6) The Hippocratic Oath forbids doing harm to the patient
7) Both the unborn baby and the mother are harmed by an abortion
8) Abortion is big business in the USA resulting in hundreds of millions to Planned Parenthood alone
9) Abortion seems to be murder from a study of Scripture
10) The methods of abortion are worse than anything we would do to a criminal, and yet it's occuring to a child.
11) Many abortions happen from mutagens(toxins), bad diet, and infection.

What is the real issue? It's not that a fetus is a human.

It's that abortion is a necessary evil to a corrupt society. Abortion has happened as early as the ancient Greeks. We know that from medical accounts.

Abortion will happen whether legal or not. It did throughout history.

As awful as it is, since Christians don't control nations, only influence them, we have to compromise to get the number lower.

Atheists want to have legal means of abortion. This means they will try to create laws to protect it.

Let's not lie to ourselves as intellectuals and think there isn't a cost to us for having that guarantee. Or lie and say it's not a human being.

Last Edited by Don'tBeAfraid on 01/21/2013 12:39 PM

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