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Reincarnation in the Bible

 
Amilius (OP)

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01/29/2013 02:51 PM
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Re: Reincarnation in the Bible
...


Here's PLENTY: [link to www.google.com (secure)]
 Quoting: Amilius


Just give me ONE... just because someone made up the billions of years date does not make it scientific proof. Radio metric dating is very unreliable especially past a couple thousand years. Also the geologic column is simply made up, completely.
 Quoting: Veresanctus


I can't believe the extend of these Christian Bibletards of their willful ignorance. Earth is 4.54 billion years old! That's a scientific FACT!
 Quoting: Amilius


Okay so it appears that you have a Mantra and a belief, "Earth is 4.54 billion years old! That's a scientific FACT!" you say, so why don't you provide some PROOF for your statement?

AGAIN, just saying it's a fact does NOT make it so.
 Quoting: Veresanctus


Because the scientists say so. If they say they have proven it then it is so. They work really hard and find a lot of evidence before they call something proven. Its ridiculous to deny science.
Anonymous Coward
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01/29/2013 02:52 PM
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Re: Reincarnation in the Bible
What does the universe do with eternal beings that choose not to exist?
anonymous
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01/29/2013 02:54 PM
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Re: Reincarnation in the Bible
So obvious to see why Father God states "that the wisdom of man is foolishness to Me..."! Plenty on these pages.
Veresanctus

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01/29/2013 02:55 PM
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Re: Reincarnation in the Bible
...


Just give me ONE... just because someone made up the billions of years date does not make it scientific proof. Radio metric dating is very unreliable especially past a couple thousand years. Also the geologic column is simply made up, completely.
 Quoting: Veresanctus


I can't believe the extend of these Christian Bibletards of their willful ignorance. Earth is 4.54 billion years old! That's a scientific FACT!
 Quoting: Amilius


Okay so it appears that you have a Mantra and a belief, "Earth is 4.54 billion years old! That's a scientific FACT!" you say, so why don't you provide some PROOF for your statement?

AGAIN, just saying it's a fact does NOT make it so.
 Quoting: Veresanctus


Because the scientists say so. If they say they have proven it then it is so. They work really hard and find a lot of evidence before they call something proven. Its ridiculous to deny science.
 Quoting: Amilius


You mean Authority figures? I am not denying SCIENCE I am denying your fictitious claim of science when it's not.

Your faith in the "scientists" will be your downfall because after all they are just men and men fall.

Hundreds of years ago the "Scientists" said it's a scientific fact that the earth is flat but they were proven wrong by those who sailed around the world and proved it was round.
GET SAVED: Thread: Are you SAVED from DAMNATION?

"For all the law is fulfilled in one word, even in this; Thou shalt love thy neighbour as thyself. But if ye bite and devour one another, take heed that ye be not consumed one of another.

This I say then, Walk in the Spirit, and ye shall not fulfil the lust of the flesh. For the flesh lusteth against the Spirit, and the Spirit against the flesh: and these are contrary the one to the other: so that ye cannot do the things that ye would. But if ye be led of the Spirit, ye are not under the law.

Now the works of the flesh are manifest, which are these; Adultery, fornication, uncleanness, lasciviousness, Idolatry, witchcraft, hatred, variance, emulations, wrath, strife, seditions, heresies, Envyings, murders, drunkenness, revellings, and such like: of the which I tell you before, as I have also told you in time past, that they which do such things shall not inherit the kingdom of God. But the fruit of the Spirit is love, joy, peace, longsuffering, gentleness, goodness, faith, Meekness, temperance: against such there is no law. And they that are Christ's have crucified the flesh with the affections and lusts.

If we live in the Spirit, let us also walk in the Spirit. Let us not be desirous of vain glory, provoking one another, envying one another." -- Galatians 5:14-26
Anonymous Coward
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01/29/2013 02:55 PM
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Re: Reincarnation in the Bible
What does the universe do with eternal beings that choose not to exist?
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 33275617


Not possible - no eternal being would wish to not exist...

That is the body talking, not the real you...
Anonymous Coward
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01/29/2013 02:56 PM
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Re: Reincarnation in the Bible
Is the Soul Immortal?

To answer this question, let us turn to the highest authority on the subject—the inspired Word of the Creator. In the very first book of the Bible, Genesis, we learn the accurate meaning of “soul.” Regarding the creation of the first man, Adam, the Bible says: “Jehovah God proceeded to form the man out of dust from the ground and to blow into his nostrils the breath of life, and the man came to be a living soul.” (Genesis 2:7) Clearly, the soul is not what a man has but what he is. The Hebrew word used here for soul is ne′phesh. It occurs some 700 times in the Bible, and it never refers to a separate and ethereal part of a human but always to something tangible and physical.—Job 6:7; Psalm 35:13; 107:9; 119:28.

What happens to the soul at death? Consider what happened to Adam at his death. When he sinned, God told him: “You [will] return to the ground, for out of it you were taken. For dust you are and to dust you will return.” (Genesis 3:19) Think of what that means. Before God created him from the dust, Adam did not exist. After his death, Adam returned to the same state of nonexistence.

Simply stated, the Bible teaches that death is the opposite of life. At Ecclesiastes 9:5, 10, we read: “The living are conscious that they will die; but as for the dead, they are conscious of nothing at all, neither do they anymore have wages, because the remembrance of them has been forgotten. All that your hand finds to do, do with your very power, for there is no work nor devising nor knowledge nor wisdom in Sheol, the place to which you are going.”

This means that the dead are unable to do or feel anything. They no longer have any thoughts, nor do they remember anything. The psalmist states: “Do not put your trust in nobles, nor in the son of earthling man, to whom no salvation belongs. His spirit goes out, he goes back to his ground; in that day his thoughts do perish.”—Psalm 146:3, 4.

The Bible clearly shows that at death the soul does not move on to another body, but it dies. “The soul that is sinning—it itself will die,” the Bible emphatically states. (Ezekiel 18:4, 20; Acts 3:23; Revelation 16:3) Thus, the doctrine of the immortality of the soul—the very foundation of the theory of reincarnation—does not find any support in the Scriptures. Without it, the theory collapses. What, then, explains the suffering we see in the world?
Anonymous Coward
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01/29/2013 02:57 PM
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Re: Reincarnation in the Bible
What does the universe do with eternal beings that choose not to exist?
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 33275617


Not possible - no eternal being would wish to not exist...

That is the body talking, not the real you...
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 25784525

Really? So now only some are eternal. How so?
Amilius (OP)

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01/29/2013 03:00 PM
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Re: Reincarnation in the Bible
...


I can't believe the extend of these Christian Bibletards of their willful ignorance. Earth is 4.54 billion years old! That's a scientific FACT!
 Quoting: Amilius


Okay so it appears that you have a Mantra and a belief, "Earth is 4.54 billion years old! That's a scientific FACT!" you say, so why don't you provide some PROOF for your statement?

AGAIN, just saying it's a fact does NOT make it so.
 Quoting: Veresanctus


Because the scientists say so. If they say they have proven it then it is so. They work really hard and find a lot of evidence before they call something proven. Its ridiculous to deny science.
 Quoting: Amilius


You mean Authority figures? I am not denying SCIENCE I am denying your fictitious claim of science when it's not.

Your faith in the "scientists" will be your downfall because after all they are just men and men fall.

Hundreds of years ago the "Scientists" said it's a scientific fact that the earth is flat but they were proven wrong by those who sailed around the world and proved it was round.
 Quoting: Veresanctus


Its not the same thing as the scientific method. Science must prove something to be true and disprove the opposite before it accepts something. It must be very strict. Its part of science that earth is 4.54 billion years old and anyone with a rational mind accepts that fact.
Anonymous Coward
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01/29/2013 03:03 PM
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Re: Reincarnation in the Bible
...


I can't believe the extend of these Christian Bibletards of their willful ignorance. Earth is 4.54 billion years old! That's a scientific FACT!
 Quoting: Amilius


Okay so it appears that you have a Mantra and a belief, "Earth is 4.54 billion years old! That's a scientific FACT!" you say, so why don't you provide some PROOF for your statement?

AGAIN, just saying it's a fact does NOT make it so.
 Quoting: Veresanctus


Because the scientists say so. If they say they have proven it then it is so. They work really hard and find a lot of evidence before they call something proven. Its ridiculous to deny science.
 Quoting: Amilius


You mean Authority figures? I am not denying SCIENCE I am denying your fictitious claim of science when it's not.

Your faith in the "scientists" will be your downfall because after all they are just men and men fall.

Hundreds of years ago the "Scientists" said it's a scientific fact that the earth is flat but they were proven wrong by those who sailed around the world and proved it was round.
 Quoting: Veresanctus


The scientists at that time were part of the religious control structure...

They preached what they wanted the people to know at that time, as the stage was not set, and ready for the america's to be colonized and a player on the scene...

Columbus did what he did, not based on a discovery mission, but, to move the game to a new level...

History is orchestrated, according to has the printing press, and the means for distribution...

Basically, the history of this planet, and it's indoctrinated beLIEf system are a big lie...
4Q529

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01/29/2013 03:04 PM
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Re: Reincarnation in the Bible
Is the Soul Immortal?

To answer this question, let us turn to the highest authority on the subject—the inspired Word of the Creator. In the very first book of the Bible, Genesis, we learn the accurate meaning of “soul.” Regarding the creation of the first man, Adam, the Bible says: “Jehovah God proceeded to form the man out of dust from the ground and to blow into his nostrils the breath of life, and the man came to be a living soul.” (Genesis 2:7) Clearly, the soul is not what a man has but what he is. The Hebrew word used here for soul is ne′phesh. It occurs some 700 times in the Bible, and it never refers to a separate and ethereal part of a human but always to something tangible and physical.—Job 6:7; Psalm 35:13; 107:9; 119:28.

What happens to the soul at death? Consider what happened to Adam at his death. When he sinned, God told him: “You [will] return to the ground, for out of it you were taken. For dust you are and to dust you will return.” (Genesis 3:19) Think of what that means. Before God created him from the dust, Adam did not exist. After his death, Adam returned to the same state of nonexistence.

Simply stated, the Bible teaches that death is the opposite of life. At Ecclesiastes 9:5, 10, we read: “The living are conscious that they will die; but as for the dead, they are conscious of nothing at all, neither do they anymore have wages, because the remembrance of them has been forgotten. All that your hand finds to do, do with your very power, for there is no work nor devising nor knowledge nor wisdom in Sheol, the place to which you are going.”

This means that the dead are unable to do or feel anything. They no longer have any thoughts, nor do they remember anything. The psalmist states: “Do not put your trust in nobles, nor in the son of earthling man, to whom no salvation belongs. His spirit goes out, he goes back to his ground; in that day his thoughts do perish.”—Psalm 146:3, 4.

The Bible clearly shows that at death the soul does not move on to another body, but it dies. “The soul that is sinning—it itself will die,” the Bible emphatically states. (Ezekiel 18:4, 20; Acts 3:23; Revelation 16:3) Thus, the doctrine of the immortality of the soul—the very foundation of the theory of reincarnation—does not find any support in the Scriptures. Without it, the theory collapses. What, then, explains the suffering we see in the world?
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 32892972


First of all, I agree 100% with the conclusion that there is no such thing as an eternal metaphysical 'soul' which is the foundation of the metaphysical doctrine of 're-incarnation'.

But neither is there any metaphysical 'soul' which can go on to be punished in any metaphysical 'hell' or rewarded in any metaphysical 'heaven'.

The Doctrine of "resurrection" as a Doctrine of 'Rebirth' answers both of these objections:

There is no such thing as an eternal metaphysical 'soul'; but, at the same time, people are 'raised from the dead' to be rewarded or punished in this world for what they have done in their previous lives.

Michael
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Re: Reincarnation in the Bible
What does the universe do with eternal beings that choose not to exist?
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 33275617


Not possible - no eternal being would wish to not exist...

That is the body talking, not the real you...
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 25784525

Really? So now only some are eternal. How so?
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 33275617


Where did I say - only some are eternal???
Mickeyblue
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01/29/2013 03:07 PM
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Re: Reincarnation in the Bible
You extrapolate alot into what you have posted. The bible tells us, clearly, it is for man to live 120years, he is to have one life. The savior has given us two lives, this one and eternal life. One in the oorporal and one in the spirit.
niphtrique

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01/29/2013 03:10 PM

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Re: Reincarnation in the Bible
Its part of science that earth is 4.54 billion years old and anyone with a rational mind accepts that fact.
 Quoting: Amilius


I would not be too sure of that. I will try to explain. In Genesis 1:26 God suggests that we live in a simulation of a real world with the words: "Let us make mankind in our image, in our likeness." On Simulation-argument.com Professor Nick Bostrom argues that at least one of the following must be true:
- The human species is very likely to go extinct before reaching a posthuman stage.
- Any posthuman civilisation is extremely unlikely to run a significant number of simulations of their evolutionary history (or variations thereof).
- We are almost certainly living in a computer simulation.

The assumption that we live in a non-material virtual reality owned by a deity can be supported with the following findings:
- Technology like the holodeck appears to be feasible less than a century from now, while humans are inclined make virtual realities with simulations of humans. Billions of virtual realities like this universe may exist, so it is unlikely that this universe is real.
- Even though there have been thousands of gods and goddesses worshipped in the past, none of them presented himself or herself, except one.
- It is unlikely that by pure chance a religion of a small and often dispersed people survived for more than 1,500 years and then became the basis for three major world religions, while it has been foretold to Abraham that all the peoples will be blessed in him (Gen. 18:17-18).
- The existence of synchronicity and coincidences indicates that there is a script behind all events.
- Only in a non-material virtual reality supernatural and paranormal events are possible.
- Only in a non-material virtual reality miracles are possible.

Based on the argument above, it is likely that the universe is a virtual reality. There have been billions of years in which humanity could have become an advanced civilisation that is able to build virtual realities, so the likelihood of humanity entering this phase in this specific timeframe is small compared to any timeframe in the past.

Last Edited by niphtrique on 01/30/2013 03:42 AM
The usury free economy: [link to www.naturalmoney.org]
The universe is a virtual reality: [link to www.naturalmoney.org]
God is a woman and Jesus was Her husband: [link to www.naturalmoney.org]
Anonymous Coward
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01/29/2013 03:11 PM
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Re: Reincarnation in the Bible
Is the Soul Immortal?

To answer this question, let us turn to the highest authority on the subject—the inspired Word of the Creator. In the very first book of the Bible, Genesis, we learn the accurate meaning of “soul.” Regarding the creation of the first man, Adam, the Bible says: “Jehovah God proceeded to form the man out of dust from the ground and to blow into his nostrils the breath of life, and the man came to be a living soul.” (Genesis 2:7) Clearly, the soul is not what a man has but what he is. The Hebrew word used here for soul is ne′phesh. It occurs some 700 times in the Bible, and it never refers to a separate and ethereal part of a human but always to something tangible and physical.—Job 6:7; Psalm 35:13; 107:9; 119:28.

What happens to the soul at death? Consider what happened to Adam at his death. When he sinned, God told him: “You [will] return to the ground, for out of it you were taken. For dust you are and to dust you will return.” (Genesis 3:19) Think of what that means. Before God created him from the dust, Adam did not exist. After his death, Adam returned to the same state of nonexistence.

Simply stated, the Bible teaches that death is the opposite of life. At Ecclesiastes 9:5, 10, we read: “The living are conscious that they will die; but as for the dead, they are conscious of nothing at all, neither do they anymore have wages, because the remembrance of them has been forgotten. All that your hand finds to do, do with your very power, for there is no work nor devising nor knowledge nor wisdom in Sheol, the place to which you are going.”

This means that the dead are unable to do or feel anything. They no longer have any thoughts, nor do they remember anything. The psalmist states: “Do not put your trust in nobles, nor in the son of earthling man, to whom no salvation belongs. His spirit goes out, he goes back to his ground; in that day his thoughts do perish.”—Psalm 146:3, 4.

The Bible clearly shows that at death the soul does not move on to another body, but it dies. “The soul that is sinning—it itself will die,” the Bible emphatically states. (Ezekiel 18:4, 20; Acts 3:23; Revelation 16:3) Thus, the doctrine of the immortality of the soul—the very foundation of the theory of reincarnation—does not find any support in the Scriptures. Without it, the theory collapses. What, then, explains the suffering we see in the world?
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 32892972


First of all, I agree 100% with the conclusion that there is no such thing as an eternal metaphysical 'soul' which is the foundation of the metaphysical doctrine of 're-incarnation'.

But neither is there any metaphysical 'soul' which can go on to be punished in any metaphysical 'hell' or rewarded in any metaphysical 'heaven'.

The Doctrine of "resurrection" as a Doctrine of 'Rebirth' answers both of these objections:

There is no such thing as an eternal metaphysical 'soul'; but, at the same time, people are 'raised from the dead' to be rewarded or punished in this world for what they have done in their previous lives.

Michael
 Quoting: 4Q529


That is nonsence...

The doctrine of resurrection of the body, is an allegory to something else...

The body does not resserect, it is a one time shot...

The soul however is eternal and will project a spirit stream to animate another born body for continued experiential learning...

Religious dogma, and it's mass of interpretations is so misleading!!!
Anonymous Coward
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01/29/2013 03:13 PM
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Re: Reincarnation in the Bible
Is the Soul Immortal?

To answer this question, let us turn to the highest authority on the subject—the inspired Word of the Creator. In the very first book of the Bible, Genesis, we learn the accurate meaning of “soul.” Regarding the creation of the first man, Adam, the Bible says: “Jehovah God proceeded to form the man out of dust from the ground and to blow into his nostrils the breath of life, and the man came to be a living soul.” (Genesis 2:7) Clearly, the soul is not what a man has but what he is. The Hebrew word used here for soul is nephesh. It occurs some 700 times in the Bible, and it never refers to a separate and ethereal part of a human but always to something tangible and physical.—Job 6:7; Psalm 35:13; 107:9; 119:28.

What happens to the soul at death? Consider what happened to Adam at his death. When he sinned, God told him: “You [will] return to the ground, for out of it you were taken. For dust you are and to dust you will return.” (Genesis 3:19) Think of what that means. Before God created him from the dust, Adam did not exist. After his death, Adam returned to the same state of nonexistence.

Simply stated, the Bible teaches that death is the opposite of life. At Ecclesiastes 9:5, 10, we read: “The living are conscious that they will die; but as for the dead, they are conscious of nothing at all, neither do they anymore have wages, because the remembrance of them has been forgotten. All that your hand finds to do, do with your very power, for there is no work nor devising nor knowledge nor wisdom in Sheol, the place to which you are going.”

This means that the dead are unable to do or feel anything. They no longer have any thoughts, nor do they remember anything. The psalmist states: “Do not put your trust in nobles, nor in the son of earthling man, to whom no salvation belongs. His spirit goes out, he goes back to his ground; in that day his thoughts do perish.”—Psalm 146:3, 4.

The Bible clearly shows that at death the soul does not move on to another body, but it dies. “The soul that is sinning—it itself will die,” the Bible emphatically states. (Ezekiel 18:4, 20; Acts 3:23; Revelation 16:3) Thus, the doctrine of the immortality of the soul—the very foundation of the theory of reincarnation—does not find any support in the Scriptures. Without it, the theory collapses. What, then, explains the suffering we see in the world?
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 32892972


First of all, I agree 100% with the conclusion that there is no such thing as an eternal metaphysical 'soul' which is the foundation of the metaphysical doctrine of 're-incarnation'.

But neither is there any metaphysical 'soul' which can go on to be punished in any metaphysical 'hell' or rewarded in any metaphysical 'heaven'.

The Doctrine of "resurrection" as a Doctrine of 'Rebirth' answers both of these objections:

There is no such thing as an eternal metaphysical 'soul'; but, at the same time, people are 'raised from the dead' to be rewarded or punished in this world for what they have done in their previous lives.

Michael
 Quoting: 4Q529


Many Scholars Agree

Many scholars agree that the Bible does not speak of an immortal soul. The Concise Jewish Encyclopedia states: “The Bible does not state a doctrine of the immortality of the soul, nor does this clearly emerge in early rabbinical literature.” The Jewish Encyclopedia says: “The belief that the soul continues its existence after the dissolution of the body is a matter of philosophical or theological speculation rather than of simple faith, and is accordingly nowhere expressly taught in Holy Scripture.” The Interpreter’s Dictionary of the Bible notes: “The nephesh . . . does not continue to exist independently of the body, but dies with it. . . . No biblical text authorizes the statement that the ‘soul’ is separated from the body at the moment of death.”

Also, the Expository Dictionary of Bible Words says: “‘Soul’ in the O[ld] T[estament], then, does not indicate some immaterial part of human beings that continues after death. [Nephesh] essentially means life as it is uniquely experienced by personal beings. . . . The basic meaning of [psykhe] is established by its O[ld] T[estament] counterpart, rather than its meaning in Greek culture.” And The Eerdmans Bible Dictionary states that in the Bible, the word soul “does not designate a part of a human being, but rather the whole person. . . . In this sense human beings do not have souls—they are souls.”—Italics ours.

Even the New Catholic Encyclopedia acknowledges: “The Biblical words for soul usually mean total person.” It adds: “There is no dichotomy [division] of body and soul in the O[ld] T[estament]. . . . The term [nephesh], though translated by our word soul, never means soul as distinct from the body or the individual person. . . . The term [psykhe] is the N[ew] T[estament] word corresponding with [nephesh]. . . . The notion of the soul surviving after death is not readily discernible in the Bible.” And Georges Auzou, French Catholic Professor of Sacred Scripture, writes in his book La Parole de Dieu (The Word of God): “The concept of ‘soul,’ meaning a purely spiritual, immaterial reality, separate from the ‘body,’ . . . does not exist in the Bible.”

Thus, The Encyclopedia Americana observes: “The Old Testament concept of man is that of a unity, not a union of soul and body. Although the Hebrew word [nephesh] is frequently translated as ‘soul,’ it would be inaccurate to read into it a Greek meaning. . . . [Nephesh] is never conceived of as operating separately from the body. In the New Testament the Greek word [psykhe] is often translated as ‘soul’ but again should not be readily understood to have the meaning the word had for the Greek philosophers. . . . The Bible does not provide a clear description of how a person survives after death.” It adds: “Theologians have had to resort to the discussions of philosophers for an adequate means of describing survival of the individual after death.”
Light to Go

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Re: Reincarnation in the Bible
Trinity of Evil 1) Yaldabaoth, Mephistopheles, and the big one....Melchizedek.

Hebrews (7:3)- Without father, without mother, without descent, having neither beginning of days, nor end of life; but made like unto the Son of God; abideth a priest, continually.

Is he the figure behind the world leaders? How much contol does Mephistopheles (Melchizedek's handler) have over the elites? Has he promised immortality in exchange for humanities suffering?

Not In His Image
John Lamb Lash

Wherever you find the spilling of blood, seems to be the Middle East, you will find Melchizedek, you see, he needs this blood in order to breathe.
Truth Seeker
A Predatory Species of Human Animals Have Created A System That Gives Them Power & Control Over All Others.
"Eugenics is their signature, bureaucracy their cover" - John Lash
"The United States Congress is Israeli occupied territory" Patrick Buchanan

What is your agenda? Here's mine...
END DUPLICITY-Explore the Narrative

Gaia-Sophia's Correction
Gaiaspora.org
Anonymous Coward
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01/29/2013 03:26 PM
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Re: Reincarnation in the Bible
Not the Bible but Philosophy

It is true that theologians adopted the ideas of pagan philosophers to formulate the immortal-soul doctrine. The French Dictionnaire Encyclopédique de la Bible (Encyclopedic Dictionary of the Bible) says: “The concept of immortality is a product of Greek thinking.” The Jewish Encyclopedia affirms: “The belief in the immortality of the soul came to the Jews from contact with Greek thought and chiefly through the philosophy of Plato, its principal exponent,” who lived in the fourth century before Christ. Plato believed: “The soul is immortal and imperishable, and our souls will truly exist in another world!”—The Dialogues of Plato.

When did this pagan philosophy infiltrate Christianity? The New Encyclopædia Britannica says: “From the middle of the 2nd century AD Christians who had some training in Greek philosophy began to feel the need to express their faith in its terms, both for their own intellectual satisfaction and in order to convert educated pagans. The philosophy that suited them best was Platonism.” So, as the Britannica says, “the early Christian philosophers adopted the Greek concept of the soul’s immortality.” Even Pope John Paul II acknowledged that the immortal-soul doctrine incorporates “theories of certain schools of Greek philosophy.” But accepting theories of Greek philosophy meant that Christendom had abandoned the simple truth expressed at Genesis 2:7: “Man came to be a living soul.”

The immortal-soul teaching, however, goes back much further than Plato. In the book The Religion of Babylonia and Assyria, by Morris Jastrow, we read: “The problem of immortality . . . engaged the serious attention of the Babylonian theologians. . . . Death was a passage to another kind of life.” Also, the book Egyptian Religion, by Siegfried Morenz, states: “The early Egyptians regarded life after death simply as a continuation of life on earth.” The Jewish Encyclopedia notes the connection with these ancient religions and Plato when it says that Plato was led to the immortal-soul idea “through Orphic and Eleusinian mysteries in which Babylonian and Egyptian views were strangely blended.”

Thus, the immortal-soul idea is ancient. In fact, its roots go back to the dawn of human history! After Adam was told that he would die if he disobeyed God, an opposite view was expressed to Adam’s wife, Eve. She was told: “You positively will not die.” Here the seeds of the immortal-soul doctrine were sown. And ever since then, one culture after another has adopted the pagan view that ‘you will not really die but will continue to live on.’ This includes Christendom, which took its followers into apostasy in opposition to God’s purposes and will.—Genesis 3:1-5; Matthew 7:15-23; 13:36-43; Acts 20:29, 30; 2 Thessalonians 2:3, 7.

Who was it that led humans to believe that lie? Jesus identified him when he said to the religious leaders of his day: “You are from your father the Devil, and you wish to do the desires of your father. . . . When he speaks the lie, he speaks according to his own disposition, because he is a liar and the father of the lie.” (John 8:44) Yes, it is Satan who developed the immortal-soul idea to turn people away from true worship. So one’s course of life and hope for the future are put on the wrong path by believing doctrines that grew out of the first lie recorded in the Bible, though at that time Eve no doubt understood the serpent to mean merely that she would not die at all in the flesh.

It is important to know the truth about this belief. Jesus said: “Those worshiping [God] must worship with spirit and truth.” (John 4:24) The truth about the human soul is found in God’s Word, the Bible. The inspired Scriptures contain God’s revelation of his purposes, so we can be confident that it tells us the truth. (1 Thessalonians 2:13; 2 Timothy 3:16, 17) Jesus said in prayer to God: “Your word is truth.”—John 17:17.
Frater

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01/29/2013 03:50 PM

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Re: Reincarnation in the Bible
Karma and Reincarnation are facts regardless of what it does or does not say here and their.

One can ignore this and be a slave to it.

Or

One can accept it and strive for good Karma or bad (some lunatics want bad Karma).

Or

One can figure out how to get out of this whole mess!

Do what you will.

Frater
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4Q529

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01/29/2013 03:54 PM
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Re: Reincarnation in the Bible
The soul however is eternal and will project a spirit stream to animate another born body for continued experiential learning...
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 25784525


Sounds like what the serpent said: "You will not die."

Religious dogma, and it's mass of interpretations is so misleading!!!
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 25784525


The only eternally Existent is the Creator.

That is not religious dogma created by theologians.

That is a Revelation.

Michael
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01/29/2013 04:01 PM
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Re: Reincarnation in the Bible
Im surprised nobody on this thread mentions the resurrection of Lazarus .
I think that there was reincarnation but Jesus broke the karmic wheel through his sacrifice. I think the story of st Catherine is interesting-- breaking the wheel symbolically means that you "escape" your karma through enlightenment. Self sacrifice is evidence that a person has achieved "enlightenment". This is the same belief in eastern religions, I think.

Also resurrection is different than reincarnation. Lazarus was a sort of "pre figuration " which showed the power of God over the process of life and death.

Jesus own resurrection shows us what the difference is. There is also the "transfiguration" as an example.

It's interesting that Jesus appeared and disappeared at will after his resurrection. He also ate a piece of fish and Thomas stuck his hands in his wounds.

Also, remember that Elijah never died, he was assumed into heaven, so that is a little different than somebody who dies and comes back. Nobody brought that up yet in this thread either.

Some people interested in this topic might be interested in the
" rainbow body" apparently some very enlightened people are experiencing this phenomenon. You can google it if you are interested.

My personal thoughts on this subject from what I understand about it so far is that there was reincarnation but Jesus sacrifice ended the karmic cycle. I think that you create your own reality. Your acts in this life are "stored up" in heaven ... Jesus says he goes to prepare a place for us. If we are good and kind and perform the acts of mercy ( the beatitudes) in this life, we receive our reward in heaven for these acts.

There is also the concept of the new heaven and the new earth where after the final judgement is the resurrection of the body ( which I think is perfected - like the rainbow body maybe)

I don't think we can fully know or understand exactly what will happen and I don't think there is anything wrong with questioning or wondering or thinking one thing or another. I really don't think God who is love will hold that against anyone. The important thing is to treat each other with love and kindness.
Frater

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01/29/2013 04:02 PM

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Re: Reincarnation in the Bible
"Is God infinite? Then how can anything exist that is not God? Such a thing would exist separately from God, and therefore be something that God is not, and that did not need God to exist. Therefore nothng exists apart from God"



wrong. the creation does exist apart from God. he is the creator and he is not the creation
 Quoting: 714


Well, according to Quabalistic thinking, all that is flows down from God, it's a continuous stream of divine energy that flows down the tree and culminates in very slow or solid energy, the material Multiverse.

God is infinite, limitless, limitless light, more than the entire tree of life but all the tree is part of God.

Best Wishes
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4Q529

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01/29/2013 04:25 PM
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Re: Reincarnation in the Bible
Im surprised nobody on this thread mentions the resurrection of Lazarus .
I think that there was reincarnation but Jesus broke the karmic wheel through his sacrifice. I think the story of st Catherine is interesting-- breaking the wheel symbolically means that you "escape" your karma through enlightenment. Self sacrifice is evidence that a person has achieved "enlightenment". This is the same belief in eastern religions, I think.

Also resurrection is different than reincarnation. Lazarus was a sort of "pre figuration " which showed the power of God over the process of life and death.

Jesus own resurrection shows us what the difference is. There is also the "transfiguration" as an example.

It's interesting that Jesus appeared and disappeared at will after his resurrection. He also ate a piece of fish and Thomas stuck his hands in his wounds.

Also, remember that Elijah never died, he was assumed into heaven, so that is a little different than somebody who dies and comes back. Nobody brought that up yet in this thread either.

Some people interested in this topic might be interested in the
" rainbow body" apparently some very enlightened people are experiencing this phenomenon. You can google it if you are interested.

My personal thoughts on this subject from what I understand about it so far is that there was reincarnation but Jesus sacrifice ended the karmic cycle. I think that you create your own reality. Your acts in this life are "stored up" in heaven ... Jesus says he goes to prepare a place for us. If we are good and kind and perform the acts of mercy ( the beatitudes) in this life, we receive our reward in heaven for these acts.

There is also the concept of the new heaven and the new earth where after the final judgement is the resurrection of the body ( which I think is perfected - like the rainbow body maybe)

I don't think we can fully know or understand exactly what will happen and I don't think there is anything wrong with questioning or wondering or thinking one thing or another. I really don't think God who is love will hold that against anyone. The important thing is to treat each other with love and kindness.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 24703711


Thus demonstrating that you really do not care that Jesus was murdered for teaching the Doctrine of "resurrection" as a Doctrine of 'Rebirth'.

On the contrary, with your belief in a metaphysical 'heaven', you are worshiping the 'god of the dead'; the god that Jesus specifically repudiated in his reply to the Sadducees.

But you don't care.

What difference does it make what Jesus said?

You are a follower of Paul, the Pharisee and metaphysical philosopher and idolator; at least some of the time.

Michael

Last Edited by 4Q529 on 01/29/2013 04:26 PM
Anonymous Coward
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01/29/2013 05:42 PM
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Re: Reincarnation in the Bible
We can witness karma in this world but who judges karma inbetween worlds and i thought good and evil dont exist so why any karma. Yin and yang are opposites. How can the universe have two polarities and be eternal as eternal cannot be defined by walls. Id say the universe is very old where there is a battle of good vs evil outside the universe. None of us are eternal yet. Sorry.
Anonymous Coward
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01/29/2013 05:46 PM
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Re: Reincarnation in the Bible
whatever

chilli con carne por favor.
Anonymous Coward
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01/29/2013 05:55 PM
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Re: Reincarnation in the Bible
In the Bible, the 'reincarnation' described or spoken of is not traditional as far as eastern religions. They believed the 'spirits', as in, the 'personalities' of people would be manifested in others throughout time. This is just a simple fact. The Jews did not believe in any afterlife. They believe[d] that you cease to gain experience and that on the day you die, your thoughts perish and you are no longer a 'soul', or 'living creature'. A brain is required to store and process data, it's as simple as that. The Jews believed in a PHYSICAL resurrection.
Amilius (OP)

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01/29/2013 05:57 PM
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Re: Reincarnation in the Bible
In the Bible, the 'reincarnation' described or spoken of is not traditional as far as eastern religions. They believed the 'spirits', as in, the 'personalities' of people would be manifested in others throughout time. This is just a simple fact. The Jews did not believe in any afterlife. They believe[d] that you cease to gain experience and that on the day you die, your thoughts perish and you are no longer a 'soul', or 'living creature'. A brain is required to store and process data, it's as simple as that. The Jews believed in a PHYSICAL resurrection.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 32561915


Jews believe in the afterlife. I never heard of Jews believing in resurrection. Only the Seducees, an ancient Jewish sect, believed in God but no afterlife. In Kabbalistic Judaism there is reincarnation.
Anonymous Coward
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01/29/2013 06:05 PM
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Re: Reincarnation in the Bible
Kabbalah is only the Jewish interpretation of the Babylonian ideologies that they picked up during their captivity. The Jews were always big time 'pagans', easily influenced by their neighboring nations.
Amilius (OP)

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01/29/2013 06:05 PM
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Re: Reincarnation in the Bible
Kabbalah is only the Jewish interpretation of the Babylonian ideologies that they picked up during their captivity. The Jews were always big time 'pagans', easily influenced by their neighboring nations.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 32561915


I'm not sure if that is true.
4Q529

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01/29/2013 06:10 PM
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Re: Reincarnation in the Bible
In the Bible, the 'reincarnation' described or spoken of is not traditional as far as eastern religions. They believed the 'spirits', as in, the 'personalities' of people would be manifested in others throughout time. This is just a simple fact. The Jews did not believe in any afterlife. They believe[d] that you cease to gain experience and that on the day you die, your thoughts perish and you are no longer a 'soul', or 'living creature'. A brain is required to store and process data, it's as simple as that. The Jews believed in a PHYSICAL resurrection.
 Quoting: Anonymous Coward 32561915


The Jews believed in a PHYSICAL resurrection because they did not understand that Chapter 26:19 of the Book of Isaiah was to be understood as a figurative description of the revelation of the memories of previous lives, as also echoed by Jesus in Chapter 20:34-36 of the Gospel of Luke.

Michael
4Q529

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01/29/2013 06:13 PM
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Re: Reincarnation in the Bible
Jews believe in the afterlife. I never heard of Jews believing in resurrection. Only the Seducees, an ancient Jewish sect, believed in God but no afterlife. In Kabbalistic Judaism there is reincarnation.
 Quoting: Amilius


Because even the Kabbalist Jews did not understand that the Doctrine of "resurrection" is a Doctrine of 'Rebirth'.

As asserted by Maimonides, belief in the "resurrection", although he completely misunderstood what the "resurrection" is, is one of the fundamental doctrines of Judaism.

Michael

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